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View Full Version : Which Top Players Are Average on Clay? Which Lesser Players GOAT on Clay?


SAISAI-GOAT
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:27 PM
since it is raining in Miami :umbrella: we can look forward to the clay season that is starting next week ... I am always curious at the top ranked players that are not so good on clay, either because they did not grow up on the surface (Americans, Chinese) and / or their power game is not as effective since the opponents have more time to chase down the balls that would be winners on faster court ... then there are the lower ranked players that are really good on clay and can make a living on it since half the WTA season is on the surface ... so lets identify these players :lick:

Top Players that Are Average on Clay
1) Sharapova - yes she did reach RG SF but people say she moves like cow on ice right :confused:
2) Li - she reached Estoril MM final and Warsaw Premier SF, but does not have enough patience to finish off points properly on the surface :tape:
3) V Williams - reached the final when she was at her peak and won Premiers like Berlin / Rome but really is not a threat, especially now
4) S Williams - she does not really try on the surface anymore outside of RG :sad:
5) Clijsters - same as Serena but she does not even care about RG :spit:
6) Azarenka - should have grown up on the surface but I don't remember any big results from her on it except RG QF :shrug:
7) Bartoli - same as Azarenka :shrug:

Lesser Players that Are GOAT on Clay1) Dulgheru - :worship: her variety drives opponents nuts ... WARSAW-GOAT
2) Dominguez Lino - :crazy: moonballs ... BOGOTA-GOAT
3) Martinez Sanchez - her titles: Rome, Bastad, Bogota

TheItalianStyle
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:38 PM
You didn't mention Wozniacki: she did nothing special on that surface so far

L'Enfant Sauvage
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:40 PM
I don't think Venus belongs on that list. RG =/= Clay as a whole. She's one of the players with the most clay titles on tour, though she always underperformed at Roland Garros in particular.

EDIT: Besides, she's got a Rome win, Warsaw win, Hamburg, Amelia Island, Charleston and Acapulco x2 wins, plus RG Final(And another Rome/Madrid F) which equals/surpasses all those lesser ranked Clay-"GOATs," plus everyone else mentioned but Serena(Due to the RG win I guess)

madmax
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:44 PM
I don't believe Sharapova dislikes clay anymore - she pretty much played her best tennis last year on clay and lately slow courts seem to be comfortable for her game.

goldenlox
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:45 PM
Wozniacki was in the Madrid final in 2009.
Safina probably likes it. Zvonareva has lousy results on clay, but should like it.
Stosur and Schiavone like it, I dont think Petkovic will like it.

ElusiveChanteuse
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:48 PM
since it is raining in Miami :umbrella: we can look forward to the clay season that is starting next week ... I am always curious at the top ranked players that are not so good on clay, either because they did not grow up on the surface (Americans, Chinese) and / or their power game is not as effective since the opponents have more time to chase down the balls that would be winners on faster court ... then there are the lower ranked players that are really good on clay and can make a living on it since half the WTA season is on the surface ... so lets identify these players :lick:

Top Players that Are Average on Clay
1) Sharapova - yes she did reach RG SF but people say she moves like cow on ice right :confused:
2) Li - she reached Estoril MM final and Warsaw Premier SF, but does not have enough patience to finish off points properly on the surface :tape:
3) V Williams - reached the final when she was at her peak and won Premiers like Berlin / Rome but really is not a threat, especially now
4) S Williams - she does not really try on the surface anymore outside of RG :sad:
5) Clijsters - same as Serena but she does not even care about RG :spit:
6) Azarenka - should have grown up on the surface but I don't remember any big results from her on it except RG QF :shrug:
7) Bartoli - same as Azarenka :shrug:

Lesser Players that Are GOAT on Clay1) Dulgheru - :worship: her variety drives opponents nuts ... WARSAW-GOAT
2) Dominguez Lino - :crazy: moonballs ... BOGOTA-GOAT
3) Martinez Sanchez - her titles: Rome, Bastad, Bogota

How about top players that are GOAT on clay?
1. Jankovic
2. Stosur

Break My Rapture
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:51 PM
since it is raining in Miami :umbrella: we can look forward to the clay season that is starting next week ... I am always curious at the top ranked players that are not so good on clay, either because they did not grow up on the surface (Americans, Chinese) and / or their power game is not as effective since the opponents have more time to chase down the balls that would be winners on faster court ... then there are the lower ranked players that are really good on clay and can make a living on it since half the WTA season is on the surface ... so lets identify these players :lick:

Top Players that Are Average on Clay
1) Sharapova - yes she did reach RG SF but people say she moves like cow on ice right :confused:
2) Li - she reached Estoril MM final and Warsaw Premier SF, but does not have enough patience to finish off points properly on the surface :tape:
3) V Williams - reached the final when she was at her peak and won Premiers like Berlin / Rome but really is not a threat, especially now
4) S Williams - she does not really try on the surface anymore outside of RG :sad:
5) Clijsters - same as Serena but she does not even care about RG :spit:
6) Azarenka - should have grown up on the surface but I don't remember any big results from her on it except RG QF :shrug:
7) Bartoli - same as Azarenka :shrug:

Lesser Players that Are GOAT on Clay1) Dulgheru - :worship: her variety drives opponents nuts ... WARSAW-GOAT
2) Dominguez Lino - :crazy: moonballs ... BOGOTA-GOAT
3) Martinez Sanchez - her titles: Rome, Bastad, Bogota
Rome '09 SF and Berlin '08 SF too.

Petkorazzi
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:56 PM
Azarenka may not be the best on clay, but I sure as hell have seen her play some stunning matches on it. The surface neutralizes her weak serve a little bit, and she uses her (great) dropshots a lot more on clay.

C. Drone
Mar 29th, 2011, 09:59 PM
Wozniacki was in the Madrid final in 2009.
Safina probably likes it. Zvonareva has lousy results on clay, but should like it.
Stosur and Schiavone like it, I dont think Petkovic will like it.

Caro reached final then w/o playing seeded player. :p

yeah, "probably" she likes it. :rolls: 2008-09 had 32-3 record.

goldenlox
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:05 PM
I dont know if Safina will like it now. She has to get serves in, or it will be the same as hard court.

Tripp
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:09 PM
I don't believe Sharapova dislikes clay anymore - she pretty much played her best tennis last year on clay and lately slow courts seem to be comfortable for her game.

She did win a big title on clay, can't remember which or when, but I do remember it was green clay, so maybe Charleston? But she also said that it felt like playing on a hard court with clay sprinkled all over it. I believe that she still has a lot of learning to do. Playing on clay is all about footwork and patience, and big hitters like Maria tend to get frustrated on the red stuff.

Wozniacki, on the other hand...I don't really know why hasn't she peaked on clay. Her game seems to be perfectly suited for it, maybe she's just not used to it. I mean, look at Stosur: she used to hate clay and now she managed to get to the SF and the final of RG in consecutive years.

Petkorazzi
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:14 PM
And Safina, when in form, is a pure joy to watch on clay.

Mattographer
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:16 PM
Venus, just like Amelie, played great outside RG :lol:

ptkten
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:21 PM
Venus, just like Amelie, played great outside RG :lol:

Exactly, she probably has the best active claycourt resume with 9 career clay titles including tier 1 wins at Rome and Charleston and several other tier two titles. Just shows how poor the current generation is on clay :o

stangtennis
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:23 PM
Wozniacki, on the other hand...I don't really know why hasn't she peaked on clay. Her game seems to be perfectly suited for it, maybe she's just not used to it.
She should be used to it growing up. I think 90% of the outdoor courts in Denmark are red clay. There's only few outdoor hardcourts and not a single grass court in Denmark.
Caro is not good at sliding and starts sliding too late if at all, so she is slow at changing direction on clay.

IIRC Scandinavian red clay is usually deeper and slower than Southern European red clay from what I have heard from a Eurosport commentator who used to play on the ATP tour.

goldenlox
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:26 PM
I dont expect much from Sharapova. She's not as good as she used to be, and clay was always her worst surface.

Craig.
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:28 PM
I dont expect much from Sharapova. She's not as good as she used to be, and clay was always her worst surface.

ClayGOAT Wozniacki to win Charleston, Stuttgart, Rome, Madrid and Roland Garros!!!!!!!!!!!1!111111111111111111

madmax
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:31 PM
ClayGOAT Wozniacki to win Charleston, Stuttgart, Rome, Madrid and Roland Garros!!!!!!!!!!!1!111111111111111111

how dare you make fun of Future 10+ slam winner and Hingis of current generation? Goldenlox and tea will provide a lecture for you about true tennis;)

L'Enfant Sauvage
Mar 29th, 2011, 10:32 PM
ClayGOAT Wozniacki to win Charleston, Stuttgart, Rome, Madrid and Roland Garros!!!!!!!!!!!1!111111111111111111

Well she HAS reached the semis in 10 of the last 12 events she entered. Also, won 5 of the last 6 tier 1s :worship:

Vikapower
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:00 PM
She did win a big title on clay, can't remember which or when, but I do remember it was green clay, so maybe Charleston? But she also said that it felt like playing on a hard court with clay sprinkled all over it. I believe that she still has a lot of learning to do. Playing on clay is all about footwork and patience, and big hitters like Maria tend to get frustrated on the red stuff.

Maria won Amélia Island vs. Cibulkova in 2007... As it goes weirdly Maria has much chances of winning RG than a second Wimbledon... seems like the footwork on clay is much more clement for shots than on grass...

I also think the lack of depth from the girls on clay too is also an advantage for her so with her great mental skills and willingness... eventually luck she can definitively get to her first final there...

Shvedbarilescu
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:08 PM
Rezai and Cibulkova are both at their best on clay.

Ryusuke Tenma
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:16 PM
You didn't mention Wozniacki: she did nothing special on that surface so far
She wasn't playing well in general last year and the year before that she wasn't a top player yet (and still reached a final).
She's doesn't have any problems with the surface.

Dulgheru, Cibulkova, Rezai, Pennetta and Martinez-Sanchez are players that play their best on clay.

Stosur and Schiavone (top players though) play their best on clay too (RG finalist/winner).

In The Zone
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:20 PM
I do not believe Venus is "just average" on clay. Her statistics on the surface show that she has game and can play. We just have those horrendous RG showings burned into our minds.

I believe Clijsters thinks of herself as average on the surface but if she wasn't such a mental case, RG 2011 would be hers on a dinner plate -- just waiting for her to take it.

KapitalL
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:23 PM
Not a word about Kuznetsova :confused:
Petrova also, very good on clay, possibly her best surface and wasn't mentioned here I think

goldenlox
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:44 PM
Sveta can win or lose on any surface. Petrova is another who is not as good as she used to be

tennisforadults
Mar 29th, 2011, 11:46 PM
Top players (top 20) great on clay:
Schiavone (W)
Stosur (F, SF)
Jankovic (3 SF)
Venus Williams (F and 4 QF)
Kuznetsova (W, F, SF, QF)
Ivanovic (W, F, QF)
Petrova (SF, SF, QF)

"Lesser" players great on clay:
Rezai (Madrid)
Cibulkova (SF)
Dulgheru (Warsaw :lol:)
Martinez Sanchez (Rome)
Safina (F, F, Madrid, Rome)

The 2nd Law
Mar 30th, 2011, 01:07 AM
safina will have a big clay season. Ana was going to, but then today happened.

Matt01
Mar 30th, 2011, 01:20 AM
ClayGOAT Wozniacki to win Charleston, Stuttgart, Rome, Madrid and Roland Garros!!!!!!!!!!!1!111111111111111111


Very childish out of line comment here. And not funny, either. :rolleyes:

goldenlox
Mar 30th, 2011, 01:40 AM
Sharapova fans think I'm kidding. Maria is not who she used to be.
On clay, everyone can return more balls & wait for the errors.
Dulgheru won the 1st set playing a clay style game.

Pasta-Na
Mar 30th, 2011, 01:49 AM
miami :o ... roger federer said its like hes saying on red clay. :oh:

tea
Mar 30th, 2011, 06:00 AM
how dare you make fun of Future 10+ slam winner and Hingis of current generation? Goldenlox and tea will provide a lecture for you about true tennis;)
But lectures does have effect, read below one of our best students:
Well she HAS reached the semis in 10 of the last 12 events she entered. Also, won 5 of the last 6 tier 1s :worship:
:worship:

Craig.
Mar 30th, 2011, 06:13 AM
Very childish out of line comment here. And not funny, either. :rolleyes:

I don't post to please you of all people so :shrug:

Betten
Mar 30th, 2011, 06:25 AM
I can see the clay courts benefiting someone like Sharapova. Sure, her movement on the surface is somewhat suspect, but the slow courts will give her more time to set up her big shots; if she is patient enough she can really do some damage.

rimon
Mar 30th, 2011, 08:16 AM
since it is raining in Miami :umbrella: we can look forward to the clay season that is starting next week ... I am always curious at the top ranked players that are not so good on clay, either because they did not grow up on the surface (Americans, Chinese) and / or their power game is not as effective since the opponents have more time to chase down the balls that would be winners on faster court ... then there are the lower ranked players that are really good on clay and can make a living on it since half the WTA season is on the surface ... so lets identify these players :lick:

Top Players that Are Average on Clay
1) Sharapova - yes she did reach RG SF but people say she moves like cow on ice right :confused:
2) Li - she reached Estoril MM final and Warsaw Premier SF, but does not have enough patience to finish off points properly on the surface :tape:
3) V Williams - reached the final when she was at her peak and won Premiers like Berlin / Rome but really is not a threat, especially now
4) S Williams - she does not really try on the surface anymore outside of RG :sad:
5) Clijsters - same as Serena but she does not even care about RG :spit:
6) Azarenka - should have grown up on the surface but I don't remember any big results from her on it except RG QF :shrug:
7) Bartoli - same as Azarenka :shrug:

Lesser Players that Are GOAT on Clay1) Dulgheru - :worship: her variety drives opponents nuts ... WARSAW-GOAT
2) Dominguez Lino - :crazy: moonballs ... BOGOTA-GOAT
3) Martinez Sanchez - her titles: Rome, Bastad, Bogota
:rolleyes:
How is Kim average? Is reaching the semi finals 3/6 that you play, and the final 2/6 average?

rimon
Mar 30th, 2011, 08:20 AM
Top players (top 20) great on clay:
Schiavone (W)
Stosur (F, SF)
Jankovic (3 SF)
Venus Williams (F and 4 QF)
Kuznetsova (W, F, SF, QF)
Ivanovic (W, F, QF)
Petrova (SF, SF, QF)

"Lesser" players great on clay:
Rezai (Madrid)
Cibulkova (SF)
Dulgheru (Warsaw :lol:)
Martinez Sanchez (Rome)
Safina (F, F, Madrid, Rome)

Clijsters (2 F, 3 SF)

Maria Croft
Mar 30th, 2011, 08:28 AM
Sharapova fans think I'm kidding. Maria is not who she used to be.
On clay, everyone can return more balls & wait for the errors.
Dulgheru won the 1st set playing a clay style game.

Maria is not what she used to be, really now? We fans had no idea :eek: :rolleyes:

At least she's still out there playing, fighting and trying to improve. She might never get back to what she used to be, but she's not just going to fade away, so that's just wishful thinking on your part.

The slower surface has actually worked in Maria's advantage the last couple of years since it gives her more time to set up her shots, and there is less pressure on landing her first serve.

Fantasy Hero
Mar 30th, 2011, 08:29 AM
She wasn't playing well in general last year and the year before that she wasn't a top player yet (and still reached a final).
She's doesn't have any problems with the surface.

Dulgheru, Cibulkova, Rezai, Pennetta and Martinez-Sanchez are players that play their best on clay.

Stosur and Schiavone (top players though) play their best on clay too (RG finalist/winner).

Flavia's game is pretty avarage on clay :shrug: she won a lot because she played a lot of crappy MM tournaments, if you see her results she has more big names on her list on HC :shrug: and she has never won anything important on clay too...still i hope she proves me wrong :angel:

Beat
Mar 30th, 2011, 08:48 AM
Top Players that Are Average on Clay
1) Sharapova - yes she did reach RG SF but people say she moves like cow on ice right :confused:
2) Li - she reached Estoril MM final and Warsaw Premier SF, but does not have enough patience to finish off points properly on the surface :tape:
3) V Williams - reached the final when she was at her peak and won Premiers like Berlin / Rome but really is not a threat, especially now
4) S Williams - she does not really try on the surface anymore outside of RG :sad:
5) Clijsters - same as Serena but she does not even care about RG :spit:
6) Azarenka - should have grown up on the surface but I don't remember any big results from her on it except RG QF :shrug:
7) Bartoli - same as Azarenka :shrug:

Lesser Players that Are GOAT on Clay1) Dulgheru - :worship: her variety drives opponents nuts ... WARSAW-GOAT
2) Dominguez Lino - :crazy: moonballs ... BOGOTA-GOAT
3) Martinez Sanchez - her titles: Rome, Bastad, Bogota

so according to that list, there are no top players who are good on clay apart from last year's RG finalists? that's just silly. how can you say that schiavone and stosur's clay career has been better than serena williams' or kim clijsters'?

KapitalL
Mar 30th, 2011, 10:23 AM
http://www.imageupload.org/thumb/thumb_9880.jpg (http://www.imageupload.org/?d=4D9303201)

This is how top 30 would look like now if only clay points count :p