PDA

View Full Version : Tennis Tipping General Rules 2015 | Changes in Red


Pages : [1] 2

Michael!
Dec 25th, 2010, 07:55 PM
What is Tennis Tipping?


In the game, participants pick the winners of all main draw matches and are placed in a knock-out system. That means each participant plays a different participant and whoever predicted the winner of most matches correctly, moves on to the next round. The same applies for doubles, but you're in a team format and your scores are combined.

In case of a tie, new SR/TB rules will decide who moves on to the next round.

Retirements:

In case a player (i.e. the actual WTA Player) retires in a match, the match WILL count in TT, as long as the first point has been played, but they do NOT COUNT for SRs, ISR (giving a set to a winner) or for TB Points decisions but they do count for TBs in which players or teams picked different winners.

If players are replaced by a lucky loser after the start of Tennis Tipping, these matches will be cancelled.

Draw Sizes:

Tournaments should have a draw which has the same size as the real one. Qualifying draws should have room for 16 players in weeks with 4 TT tournaments.
PM and P5 tournaments obviously have bigger draws, specific rules should be decided by the board members.

2-days QF: For tournaments with a 32 Player MD Field and 7 MD days (Monday-Sunday) we will have 2 days of QF.
So if there is a Sunday final, Qualies starts Saturday and MD starts Monday.
If day one has less than four matches in total or no main draw matches, round 1 becomes a 2-day round.

Tournament Managers:

Managers should start their "managing career" with managing challengers
Only high-profiled managers will run slams and bigger tournaments
Managers/User who post the OOP should post a link of the responsible personīs username

Example: All players send picks to Michael! (http://www.tennisforum.com/private.php?do=newpm&u=52665)

Rankings System:

Best of 20. This means that your best 20 results throughout the year will be counted for your ranking. When two or more players have the same number of ranking points, the tie for the ranking position will be decided according to the following priorities:


a) The player with the most total points from all tournaments
b) The player with the fewest number of tournaments
c) The highest number of points from one single tournament, then if needed, the second highest and so on
d) name (for singles; doubles players stay tied)

Wild Cards: Not used in the 2015 season

Determining Lucky Losers: In the end of the final qualifying round, managers should post a list of the losers who had the highest scores in that round (If the score is the same you should use the TB/SR system to order the players). Those are the first players to be called in case someone doesn’t send his/her picks.
Players who had a BYE in 1st round and didnīt send for FQR will be at the end of the LL List only (behind those who sent and lost in 1st q-round)! The order of those in the LL list will be decided by ranking then.

Deadline for Picks: The deadline for accepting picks is the time at which the matches are scheduled to start. NO PICKS will be accepted if they are sent after that point. Managers are allowed to make the deadline earlier if they are not able to post the differences at the time when the play starts. However, all picks which are sent between "manager's deadline" and real start of play have to be counted. When the differences are posted, you can't change your picks anymore.

Example:

Manager sets the deadline to 10am because (s)he needs to post differences earlier but the play (the first match) starts at 11am. All picks received between 10am-11am have to be counted.

If a manager put a "wrong" deadline and play already started before manager deadline is over, then all picks which are sent between the real deadline and the manager deadline will count as well but matches which already started wonīt be counted.
Note that Tournament countback is not always useable in this case.
This rule wonīt affect matches in which both players already sent their picks before the real deadline has passed, in this case all matches will count.
If the start of play is not defined exactly then deadline to send picks should be the time when the first match of the event starts.

Challengers:

Top 30 singles players and top 30 doubles players are now considered to be "late entrants" for all challenger/futures tt tournaments. the order of LE priority which they gain will be dependent on their reverse rankings (ie world #30 has first LE priority, world #1 has last)
Top 30 Late Entries and are not able to be seeded (Qualifying or Main Draw)
If there arenīt enough players in the draw and Top 30 Late Entries have to be seeded then they should be seeded in reversed order.
Players with a Protected Ranking of 30 or better in singles or doubles wonīt be considered as LE if they enter a Challenger tournament with their Protected Ranking.

Protected rankings: In order to be eligible for a Protected Ranking, one must have been out of competition a minimum of six months and a maximum of two years. The eligible player must apply for a PR in the „Protected Ranking“ thread before re-entering TT competition.

A player has one year from the date he/she returns to competition to use the Protected Ranking and may enter a maximum of 2 Grand Slams and 2 Premier Mandatories as part of his/her eight Protected Ranking Tournaments.

Number of commitments: Minimal number of commitments for a tournament to run is 16 players/8 teams.

Fed Cup: Players who play Fed Cup are allowed to play a Challenger or WTA tournament in the same week.

TB/SR Rules:

SR RULE: Every match on the OOP will be a SR match

You CAN’T send a SR in your TB different from the SR you decided to send first. If you send a SR different from your TB (Example: 2-0 6-3 4-6 7-6) that pick will be counted but the SR/TB won’t.

CB/”Looking Forward”: In Case everything is tied after the use of the TB’s use tournament Countback (CB) as a manner of untying things. If, after the use of CB everything is still tied the players will send for R2 of their current tournament AND for the next day's OOP of whichever other tournament is selected.

Where two players play each other and both fail to send picks in singles, then countback is used to split them and determine a winner (except for first round of Q or MD, of course).

If you have a bye at any stage of the tournament, you should still send picks because if you do not, this will go against you in case of countback later on in the tournament.

Number of Events Per Week: One can only play one event per week which includes (giving) walkovers or being replaced by an ALT.

It is not allowed to play another tournament during the same week, after being accepted into the draw of any of the tournaments. That includes withdrawing after the draw is made and not sending picks.
Alternates are allowed to send picks and (in case they don't get in) play another tournament that week.

Sending picks for someone else: Not allowed

Commitments:

Entries will be based on ranking (rankings from two weeks before the start of the tournament)
Tournament thread posted not later than Sunday (two weeks before start of the tournament)
Players have at least 8 days (from Sunday till Sunday) to commit to the tournament and this will be done by ranking.

First entry deadline for Singles is always Sunday 6 pm current time in Europe (CET or CEST).
The day before TT qualifying begins is the 2nd deadline for changes (the exact time is up to the tournament manager) and the draws are made after that.
Doubles players have ca. two weeks (from the Sunday when the thread is opened until the 2nd and final deadline) to commit to the tournament.
There aren’t Late Entries in doubles anymore (except for the Top30 LEs in challengers obviously), everyone who commits after the 2nd deadline for doubles will be considered as ALT.
A single entry post by one of the members of a doubles team is enough to commit the whole team to the doubles competition.
The post of the commitment must be clear and made by one of the player of the team.

Example for Antwerp (Quali starts 7th and MD starts 9th February):

Manager opens thread for Antwerp on Sunday, 25th January
First deadline for Singles: Sunday, 2nd February (6pm CET)
Final deadline for Singles and Deadline for Doubles: Friday, 6th February
Draws will be made straight after the Final Deadline
EL and Seeds will be based on rankings from 26th January

Late Entries: Everyone who commits after the first entry deadline in singles will be considered as Late Entry.
LEs, who commit after the 1st deadline but before draws are made will go to the bottom of the Entry List, behind the Top 30 entries which are automatically counted as LEs as well.
Late entries should be sorted according to the commitment order.
Everyone who commits after the draws are made will be ALTs.
Normal Late Entries (not top 30 LEs) can be seeded!

Example for 32 MD:

- for example 26,30 or 34 entries on Sunday after 1st deadline is over
- Manager should fill up to 44 players (28 direct MD entries + 16 QD) with late entrants (if LEs available obviously)
- 45th entry and/or all those who commit after the draws are made will be ALTs

Managers can extend deadline only if there are still spots available in the Main Draw after the second deadline, the first deadline is always Sunday 6 PM CET/CEST!

If I have less than 32 players at the latest possible commitment deadline then highest ranked players on the Entry List will receive a BYE (example: 20 entrants in a 32 draw size 1st round => The 8 seeds + players ranked 9-12 (Top 30 LEs are always at the bottom of that List) get a BYE

Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
After the 1st deadline players have 24 hours time to withdraw from events of their choice
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the Withdrawal Deadline (Monday, 6pm CET/CEST) is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

If the double commitment is not noticed by anyone before the draws are made, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered and the player will be replaced with ALTs/LLs (only possible if the player didnīt win a round already in that tournament)

Challengers in 2nd week of Grand Slams:

Everyone can commit to a challenger in the 2nd week of a slam but those who are still in the GS draw (singles or doubles) once the final deadline is over will be taken off of the Entry List of that challenger.

Missing Someone's Commitment: In the case that you miss someone's commitment while managing a tournament he/she will be topping the ALT or LL lists.

Commit in someone else: You can't commit in someone else. You can always commit in only yourself in singles and your doubles team. Difference is in doubles where you commit in your team and your partner doesn't have to confirm it.

Alternates/Lucky Losers:

If someone's opponent doesn't send his/her picks, the opponent gets a BYE.
If there's ALT/LL available, then this ALT/LL replaces the opponent who didn't send his/her picks.
LL1/ALT1 replaces opponent of the lowest placed player of the Entry List in the draw.
LL4/ALT4 ( if there are 4 people on the list, for example) replaces opponent of the highest placed player of the Entry List in the draw.

Example (with 3 LL):

(1) AdeyC (GBR) vs. LL3
(5) DJDVD (NED) vs. LL2
Adrian. (GER) vs. LL1

Matches where neither send should be replaced first:

ALT#1/LL#1 vs ALT#2/LL#2

LL#1 vs LL#4 and LL#2 vs LL#3 if there are two such matches etc.
And then rest of the LL are placed against the players who did send (but opponents did not)
If more spots than ALTs/LLs available, then place ALTs/LLs in ranking order.
That means that the highest player of the Entry List, whose opponent didn't send, get a BYE.

Where there is a 1st round match in which BOTH players/teams do not send picks, the following will happen:

1) 2 LLs or 2 ALTs will replace the players
2) where only 1 LL/ALT is available, that LL replaces one of the players, the No.1 seed's opponent replaces the other player, and the No.1 seed receives a BYE
3) where no LL/ALT is available, the opponents of both the No.1 and No.2 seeds move to that part of the draw and both No.1 and No.2 seeds receive BYES
4) If the No.1 or No.2 seeds didnīt send picks then the opponents of No.3, No.4 or No.5 seeds etc. will move to that part of the draw and No.3/No.4/No.5 seeds will receive a BYE
5) If more matches are in the same circumstances, the opponents of the lower seeded or highest placed unseeded players of the Entry List will fill in the draw in the appropriate order

Example:

Original Draw (Non Senders in RED)

00:00 | (1) garyyoung/xieergai (CHN/CHN) vs. MikBs/Med.Nico (ITA/SUI)
00:00 | Allez-Alejo/Tuckii (USA/FRA) vs. (3) DJDVD/Freak3yman84 (NED/USA)
00:00 | (2) histery/diego36arg (ROU/ARG) vs. Xiu ZhiFu/Fantasy Hero (CHN/ITA)
00:00 | saarsngg/Ekin (SIN/CHN) vs. (4) Meelis/SodaPop (EST/SIN)

2 ALTs available

2 ALTs replace Allez-Alejo/Tuckii and DJDVD/Freak3yman84
Opponents of 1st seeds and opponents of 2nd seeds move to the other part of the draw where both teams did not send picks and 1st and 2nd seeds will receive a BYE.

New Draw

00:00 | (1) garyyoung/xieergai (CHN/CHN) vs. BYE
00:00 | ALT1 vs. ALT2
00:00 | (2) histery/diego36arg (ROU/ARG) vs. BYE
00:00 | MikBs/Med.Nico (ITA/SUI) vs. Xiu ZhiFu/Fantasy Hero (CHN/ITA)

Further examples can be found here: http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=51987802&postcount=122

In Doubles Draws teams already get replaced if one player of a team did not send picks, if there arenīt LLs/ALTs available then the opponents receive a walkover.

Opponents of players/teams who did not send picks will receive a walkover in all 1 Day Round matches (incl. Non-1st round matches)
Teams/Players can only get replaced on a 1st day of a two days 1st round
Teams/Players who did not send picks are allowed to stay in the draw (and still have a chance to win) whenever there is a two days round (in non 1st round matches)

Matches (not 1st round) in which only one player of each team sent picks will be played as one vs. one
In Matches (not 1st round) in which only one of four players sent, the one who send picks will receive a walkover

Sending Picks:

You MUST send picks to the manager in order for them to count. If for some reason you cannot send to the manager, then send to the emergency TT board email address (ttboard@hotmail.co.uk). In this case that you have to send your picks to the emergency email, please aware the manager of the tournament and at least one board member. If you attempt to send picks to the manager and the PM fails, then your picks will count as long as you can provide evidence that the picks were sent in time. If you cannot, then such picks will not count. If you send to your doubles partner, but forget to send to the manager, these picks will NOT count.
Note that sending picks in an incorrect format can lead to point penalties, you can find more information about this on Page 3 of the Rules Thread.
Where a player sends picks to the person who posts the OOP, then even when it is clearly marked who the PM should be sent to, if the player sends his picks to the person who posted the OOP or any other understandable person (eg the regular assistant manager) then picks have to be accepted for play as long as they are forwarded to the rightful recipient (ie the manager) before the deadline for picks to be in (please note that this excludes doubles partners).

Picks canīt be accepted where a player attempts to send picks to the manager but spells the name wrongly in cases where the manager has posted the OOP.

Example:

Michael! posts the OOP and clearly states that picks have to be sent to him.
Chris 84 sends picks to Michael. instead, such picks will NOT be counted.

Michael!
Dec 25th, 2010, 07:59 PM
Round Robin (RR) Events:

Qualifying for YEC:

Highest ranked players/teams determined by a ranking composed by the best 20 results that the players/teams have done throughout the year. Top 8 players and Top 8 teams shall qualify.
The format will be two groups (4 players in each group) for singles and two groups (4 teams in each group) for doubles

Qualifying for WET (WTA Elite Trophy):

12 players (from 9th to 20th place of the 2015 TT race) round robin singles format (four groups of three players, then single-elimination semifinals and final), and 6 double pairs from 9th to 15th place of 2015 TT Race (two groups of three pair, then single-elimination semifinals and final)
YEC ALTs who didnīt get in are obviously allowed to play this event as well

Qualifying for Challenger YEC:

Exact date of the Challenger YEC will be announced during the year, it will probably take place in the week after the WET and will feature the Top 8 challenger players and Top 16 challenger doubles players of the year.
WTA 125 tournaments will count for the Challenger race as well.
Doubles players will qualify as individuals and not as teams. People who play in the YEC or WET are INELIGIBLE for this event.
They can play singles of one and doubles of the other, but not singles in both, etc.
The format will be two groups (4 players in each group) for singles and two groups (4 teams in each group) for doubles.

General Rules of the RR Events:

Qualifiers and ALTs will have to confirm their participation in the respective threads, Commitment deadline will be Sunday, 3pm local time before the event starts.
Tournament managers should inform players about their possible participation as soon as it is sure that they qualified for the event.

The situation with ALTs will remain the same. If you wish to be an ALT for YEC, WET or Challenger YEC then you canīt play in a challenger in the same week.
Maximal number of ALTs for the RR events is 4 (4 ALTs for Singles and 4 ALTs for Doubles)

Players or Teams (one player per team is enough) who fail to send picks during the RR rounds of the tournament will be permanently replaced by alternates.
Players or Teams who got replaced during the RR rounds still have the chance to qualify for the next stage if they scored more points than her RR opponents.
Players or Teams are allowed to stay in the draw when there are no ALTs available and still have a theoretical chance to win the match.

If somebody does not send for the semifinal then they will be replaced by the 3rd/2nd place finisher from their group.
If somebody does not send for the final then they will be replaced by the player/team they defeated in the semifinal.

If doubles partners are drawn to the same singles group then they have to play against each other in the first first round (RR1)

The TB rules remain the same as for the regular tournaments.

The winner and the runner-up of each group will be determined by the following tie-breaker:

1) Greatest number of wins
2) Head-to-head results if only two (2) players are tied
3) If three (3) players are tied, then:
a) Number of correct picks.
b) If (a) produces one (1) superior player (first place), or one (1) inferior player (third place), and the two (2) remaining players are tied, the tie between those two (2) players shall be broken by head-to-head record.
c) Number of correct SRs.
d) Number of correct ISRs



Special Exempts (SEs 2015)

From 2015 on every International tournament will have space for 4 Special Exempts ( 2 for Singles and 2 for Doubles)
Challenger Race Standings from certain periods will determine the holders of the Spots

The SE spot goes over to the next person/team in the ranking if a SE spot isnīt needed by one player/team
All managers of International Tournaments should have space for 2 SEs for Singles and Doubles and owners of a SE have time until 2nd deadline to commit to a tournament
A SE spot will be cleared if it isnīt used once the 2nd deadline of a tournament is over

In case of a tie between players/teams the order will be determined by this:

1. The highest number of points from one single challenger tournament during the period, then if needed, the second highest and so on
2. Number of challengers played during the period
3. Challenger points earned during the year
4. Number of challengers played during the year
5. TT ranking (for Doubles combined ranking)

January (old rule from 2014)

Auckland/Shenzhen

M.P, rvugt, Jose., Idemo
Haimar/HenryMag., Ivanovic_Fan/TazWarrior, Nightcrawl3r/Palin6o, Chilenaitor/Szymon

Hobart

Axel323, ZEUS77
Spencer./Haimar, ZEUS77/ESimp

February

9th Pattaya
16th Rio de Janeiro
23th Acapulco

Challenger Race Standings from 26th January 2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 1-4) will determine holders of the SE spots
Top 6 in Singles and Top 6 Teams in Doubles get a SE spot for the International tournaments in February
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first (in this case Pattaya)
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last (in this case Acapulco)
The Singles Race ranking will decide about the event, whenever a player qualified for singles and doubles
The Singles Race ranking of the player with the better race ranking will decide about the event, whenever both players of a team qualified for singles and doubles

March

2nd Monterrey
2nd Kuala Lumpur

Challenger Race Standings from 16.02.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 5-7) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 4 in Singles and Top 4 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in March.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

April

6th Katowice
13th Bogota
27th Marrakech
2th TBD

Challenger Race Standings from 23.03.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 8-12) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 8 in Singles and Top 8 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in April.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

May

18th Strasbourg
18th TBD

Challenger Race Standings from 04.05.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 13-18) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 4 in Singles and Top 4 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in May.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

June

8th Nottingham
8th s-Hertogenbosch

Challenger Race Standings from 25.05.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 19-21) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 4 in Singles and Top 4 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in June.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

July

13th Bucharest
13th Bastad
20th Istanbul
20th Bad Gastein
27th Baku
27th Florianapolis

Challenger Race Standings from 29.06.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 22-26) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 12 in Singles and Top 12 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in July.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

August

3rd Washington
24th TBD

Challenger Race Standings from 20.07.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 27-29) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 4 in Singles and Top 4 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in August.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

September

14th Quebec
14th Osaka
21st Seoul
21st Guangzhou
28nd Tashkent

Challenger Race Standings from 31.08.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week 30-35) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 10 in Singles and Top 10 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in September.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

October

12th Linz
12th Hong Kong
12th Tianjin
19th Luxembourg

Challenger Race Standings from 28.09.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week (36-39) will determine the holders of the SE spots
Top 8 in Singles and Top 8 Doubles Teams get a SE spot for the International tournaments in September.
The highest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place first
The lowest ranked persons/teams get the two spots for the event which takes place last

January 2016

Challenger Race Standings from 21.12.2015 (incl. the ITF tournaments from Week (40-51) will determine the holders of the SE spots

Michael!
Dec 25th, 2010, 08:37 PM
Quick Links


Standard First Page: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=425108

TB/SR Rules 2015: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=425109

Protected Ranking Thread: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=772578

Special Exempts Thread: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=450183

Challenger Race: (Basis for SE and Challenger YEC) http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=660401

Tournament Points for 2015: http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=36292841&postcount=85

What can happen if I send my picks in an incorrect format? Penalty Rules:
http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=35971153&postcount=58

How to become a TT Tournament Manager? (incl. AdeyCīs "Idiot's Guide for TT Management": http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=810898

Hall of Fame: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=489306

More Questions? Ask here: http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=425154

Uranus
Dec 25th, 2010, 09:52 PM
What does the LL thing mean?

Oh and I suggested something for the rankings in the other threads (do it like the WTA does and not just count the 17 best results regardless of whether the tournament is mandatory or not), wouldn't it be possible?

And I hope the standard 1st page comes out soon, we have tournaments beginning within a small week and I don't want players to blame me for posting a non-updated 1st page with wrong rules :p.

Sexysova
Dec 25th, 2010, 10:56 PM
What does the LL thing mean?

Oh and I suggested something for the rankings in the other threads (do it like the WTA does and not just count the 17 best results regardless of whether the tournament is mandatory or not), wouldn't it be possible?

And I hope the standard 1st page comes out soon, we have tournaments beginning within a small week and I don't want players to blame me for posting a non-updated 1st page with wrong rules :p.

what do you mean?

we have the system best of 16 tournaments, I guess it's not possible to change it now.

I will do it tomorrow :)

Uranus
Dec 26th, 2010, 10:04 AM
what do you mean?

we have the system best of 16 tournaments, I guess it's not possible to change it now.
Forget about it, I got the LL rule.

Why isn't it possible? Well, just a suggestion to, IMO, improve the game.

joe87
Dec 26th, 2010, 10:41 AM
Ondrej, I think you should also include the Tiebreak-rules in this thread, to have all rules in one thread. ;)

Sexysova
Dec 26th, 2010, 11:43 AM
Ondrej, I think you should also include the Tiebreak-rules in this thread, to have all rules in one thread. ;)

I wanted it to be separated, I hope it's okay, I will link to this thread though.

joe87
Dec 26th, 2010, 06:35 PM
I wanted it to be separated, I hope it's okay, I will link to this thread though.

I didn't see the other thread. If it gets sticky, it's ok how it is. ;)

Richie's
Dec 26th, 2010, 10:11 PM
I have a big question about the Q draws. So, if a Q Draw can have max. 32 players that means;

1. Two rounds for the 1st day of the tournament or
2. The tournament should start one day earlier or
3. Final q round should be the same day as 1st round

I need some advice here....

joe87
Dec 27th, 2010, 07:55 AM
I have a big question about the Q draws. So, if a Q Draw can have max. 32 players that means;

1. Two rounds for the 1st day of the tournament or
2. The tournament should start one day earlier or
3. Final q round should be the same day as 1st round

I need some advice here....

Your auckland tourny is a 16 q-draw ;)

joe87
Jan 4th, 2011, 10:29 AM
Ondrej, can you add the rule with 2 days OF's?

For WTA-tournaments with a 32 Player-MD-Field and 7 MD-days we use to have 2 days of OF. So if there is a Sunday final, Qualies starts Saturday and MD starts Monday.

Sexysova
Jan 4th, 2011, 11:00 AM
updated :)

Sexysova
Jan 7th, 2011, 07:18 PM
like this? ;)

Use of Alternates/Lucky Losers: If more spots than alternates, highest ranked players receive byes. Place in ranking order.

Where both players fail to send picks for a 1st round match and there are no LLs or ALTs to take their places, the highest-ranked players in that round will receive byes to rd2, and their previous opponents will play each other in the "problem match"

Andiyan
Jan 7th, 2011, 09:06 PM
Yeah. Great :)
In addition, the line "place in ranking order" is a bit vague. The first ALT for QD/MD faces the lowest ranked player wihout opponent, and so on, right?

Sexysova
Jan 7th, 2011, 10:15 PM
yes :)

mik loves dani
Jan 9th, 2011, 11:28 AM
Do you have to have 100 posts to play any challenger, international OR grandslam?

Andiyan
Jan 9th, 2011, 01:49 PM
Yes.

heart
Feb 4th, 2011, 05:40 PM
doha is a 28 player field. so do the top 4 tt players receive a bye? according to the website: DRAW SIZE: 28 Main Draw/32 Qualies/16 Doubles

joe87
Feb 5th, 2011, 10:57 AM
doha is a 28 player field. so do the top 4 tt players receive a bye? according to the website: DRAW SIZE: 28 Main Draw/32 Qualies/16 Doubles

No, we'll have a full draw. 32 MD / 16 Q / 16 D / 8 DQ

heart
Feb 5th, 2011, 11:21 AM
No, we'll have a full draw. 32 MD / 16 Q / 16 D / 8 DQ

thanks!:)

ALYOUNA
Feb 9th, 2011, 09:54 AM
Hi,Ondrej, I think Ranking Rules should be included .

Sexysova
Feb 9th, 2011, 10:12 AM
Hi,Ondrej, I think Ranking Rules should be included .

what exactly? :)

ALYOUNA
Feb 9th, 2011, 10:52 AM
[QUOTE=Sexysova;19126803]what exactly? :)[/QUOTE:]:devil:ranking points count 16 best tournaments,please add it because newcomers may not know it.

ALYOUNA
Feb 9th, 2011, 10:54 AM
what exactly? :):devil:ranking points count 16 best tournaments,please add it because newcomers may not know it.

Sexysova
Feb 9th, 2011, 11:18 AM
updated :)

Rankings System: Best of 16. This means that your best 16 results throughout the year will be counted for your ranking.

Willam
Feb 10th, 2011, 04:38 AM
Is there a PR for players who have been out for more than 6 months?

I stopped playing and I was like #3. :tape:

Sexysova
Feb 10th, 2011, 06:58 PM
Is there a PR for players who have been out for more than 6 months?

I stopped playing and I was like #3. :tape:

no.

HawkAussie
Mar 26th, 2011, 07:31 AM
Can I please play this year

Sexysova
Mar 26th, 2011, 11:40 AM
Can I please play this year

yes, but you need to have 100 posts and be a member for three months.

Sexysova
Nov 22nd, 2011, 06:46 AM
This thread was updated for 2012! New rules for 2012 are in blue. Older changes are in red. :)

Andiyan
Nov 22nd, 2011, 04:16 PM
Great job Ondrej. There's quite a lot of rules now in the FP. Maybe some way you can order them by subject?

Sexysova
Dec 1st, 2011, 08:12 AM
some things were added to CB/”Looking Forwards” rule, all TT players should check it :)

sfar
Oct 23rd, 2012, 08:49 PM
3 Month + 100 posts Rule: One can only play this game if he has created an account in this forum at least 3 months ago AND has at least 100 posts.

Really don't understand this rule.
:confused::confused::confused:

AdeyC
Oct 23rd, 2012, 08:53 PM
Really don't understand this rule.
:confused::confused::confused:

Couldn't agree more - they did it because it supposedly stops double accounts...and it also makes people lose interest and not bother :rolleyes:

sfar
Oct 23rd, 2012, 09:07 PM
Couldn't agree more - they did it because it supposedly stops double accounts...and it also makes people lose interest and not bother :rolleyes:

Double accounts can be checked by IP and other computerized ways... :rolleyes:

So that just forces me to spam around in the forum to get to the 100 posts. Hope I don't forget about logging in in 3 months time. :shrug:

Sexysova
Nov 7th, 2012, 05:47 PM
3 Month + 100 posts Rule: One can only play this game if he has created an account in this forum at least 3 months ago AND has at least 100 posts. An exception is made for veteran MTF players (if you have played TT for 3 months or longer on MTF, then you can play TT on TF immediately.

Vincey!
Nov 7th, 2012, 05:57 PM
Double accounts can be checked by IP and other computerized ways... :rolleyes:

So that just forces me to spam around in the forum to get to the 100 posts. Hope I don't forget about logging in in 3 months time. :shrug:

Are you aware that there is a way to change your IP on purpose so you can have a different one every day if you want? Also MODS don't check IP of EVERY new users systematically. The 3 months and 100 post rule was helping to filter the possible double accounts so Mods could check their IP etc...

Anyway the new rules is more flexible for MTF player now so you should stop trolling around.

sfar
Nov 7th, 2012, 10:02 PM
3 Month + 100 posts Rule: One can only play this game if he has created an account in this forum at least 3 months ago AND has at least 100 posts. An exception is made for veteran MTF players (if you have played TT for 3 months or longer on MTF, then you can play TT on TF immediately.

Great news!!!

goOudinUSA
Nov 7th, 2012, 10:54 PM
is there an exception for on MTF too?

Chris 84
Nov 7th, 2012, 10:57 PM
is there an exception for on MTF too?

anybody can play tt on mtf. they don't have restrictions.

goOudinUSA
Nov 7th, 2012, 11:03 PM
cool! thanks!

Sexysova
Dec 29th, 2012, 04:04 PM
new changes on first page, they're:

3 Month + 100 posts Rule: One can only play this game if he has created an account in this forum at least 3 months ago AND has at least 100 posts. An exception to the this rule is to be made for MTF TT players. If an MTF'er who has been a member there for at least 3 months and has over 100 posts there wishes to play tennis tipping on TF, he is now allowed to do so. However, such player must declare himself to the TT manager of that particular tournament and will have to be verified as an MTF member.

2-days QF: For tournaments with a 32 Player-MD-Field and 7 MD-days we use to have 2 days of QF. So if there is a Sunday final, Qualies starts Saturday and MD starts Monday. Unless day one has less than four matches in total or no main draw matches. In that case, round 1 becomes a 2-day round instead of QF.

Challengers: Top 30 singles players and top 30 doubles players are now considered to be "late entrants" for all challenger/futures tt tournaments. the order of LE priority which they gain will be dependent on their reverse rankings (ie world #30 has first LE priority, world #1 has last)

NEW SR RULE: every match will now be a SR match. We used to have max 15 SR matches but from now we will have all matches SR

Chris 84
Feb 13th, 2013, 10:33 PM
New Rule Regarding Picks Sent to the Wrong Person

- where a player sends picks to the person who posts the OOP, then even when it is clearly marked who the PM should be sent to, if the player sends his picks to the person who posted the OOP or any other understandable person (eg the regular assistant manager) then picks CAN be accepted for play as long as they are forwarded to the rightful recipient (ie the manager) before the deadline for picks to be in.
(please note that this excludes doubles partners, so if i sent my picks to slokid and not the manager, the picks will not be counted even if slokid forwards them.)

example of the rule in practice:

joe87 is the tournament manager. meelis posts the OOP for joe. chris 84 then sends his picks to meelis, having misread the instructions. if meelis forwards the picks to joe87 before the deadline, then the picks will count. if not, they will not count. meelis is not forced to forward the picks, and chris 84 cannot complain if he doesn't, because essentially it is all chris's fault for not reading the instructions.

Chris 84
Feb 14th, 2013, 04:29 PM
New Rule Regarding sending picks to the wrong:

picks now CANNOT be accepted where a player attempts to send picks to the manager but spells the name wrongly in cases where the manager has posted the OOP.

eg Michael! posts the OOP and clearly states that picks have to be sent to him. chris 84 sends picks to Michael. instead. such picks will NOT now be counted.

Michael!
Feb 27th, 2013, 10:39 PM
So as a summary (for 32 MD):
- If I have less than 32 players at commitment deadline then I can fill up till 32 players with late entrants, and next after the 32th is Alt. If there arenīt any LEs available then highest ranked players on the Entry List will receive a BYE (example: 20 entrants in a 32 draw size 1st round => The 8 seeds + players ranked 9-12 get BYE)
- If I have 33-35 players then I can fill up to 36 players, 37th is an alt.
- If I have 37-43 players then I can fill up to 44 players, next is Alt. (Obviously if there is time)

Red part has been added to the rules, possible BYEs always go to the highest ranked players/teams on the Entry List and donīt get placed randomly!

DollyRose
Oct 20th, 2013, 08:29 PM
Oh gee I hope the game is easier than the rules :scared:

Frederik
Oct 20th, 2013, 08:51 PM
You don't have to know all these rules. Actually most of the players don't :p

JustPetko
Oct 20th, 2013, 10:11 PM
You don't have to know all these rules. Actually most of the players don't :p

So true :lol:

Frederik
Oct 21st, 2013, 01:20 AM
Oh gee I hope the game is easier than the rules :scared:

and the REAL rules are here (http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=425109) :oh: :lol:

Michael!
Nov 9th, 2013, 02:56 PM
- Where there is a 1st round match in which BOTH players do not send picks, the following will happen:
1) 2 LLs or ALTs will replace the players
2) where only 1 LL/ALT is available, that LL replaces one of the players, the No.1 seed's opponent replaces the other player, and the No.1 seed receives a bye.
3) where no LL/ALT is available, the opponents of both the No.1 and No.2 seeds move to that part of the draw and both No.1 and No.2 seeds receive byes.
If the No.1 or No.2 seeds didnīt send picks then the opponents of No.3, No.4 or No.5 seeds etc. will move to that part of the draw and No.3/No.4/No.5 seeds will receive a BYE.
4) if more matches are in the same circumstances, the opponents of the lower seeded or highest ranked unseeded players will fill in the draw in the appropriate order.

In doubles teams already get replaced if one player of a team did not send picks.

Example: Team A vs. Team B and only one player of each team sent picks
1) 2 LLs or ALTs will replace both teams
2) where only 1 LL/ALT etc. (same rule as for singles/see above)

Blue part has been added to the rules, nothing new here, just an example for doubles to make it clearer that it is already enough to get replaced in doubles if one person of a team doesnīt send picks! :p

Javi.
Nov 9th, 2013, 03:00 PM
Blue part has been added to the rules, nothing new here, just an example for doubles to make it clearer that it is already enough to get replaced in doubles if one person of a team doesnīt send picks! :p

What happens if only one of them sends in both teams? Both are replaced? Or match is played as a singles one?

Michael!
Nov 9th, 2013, 03:01 PM
What happens if only one of them sends in both teams? Both are replaced? Or match is played as a singles one?

Example: Team A vs. Team B and only one player of each team sent picks
1) 2 LLs or ALTs will replace both teams

not clear? :p :lol:

Javi.
Nov 9th, 2013, 03:04 PM
not clear? :p :lol:

:facepalm: :silly:


Sorry

Michael!
Nov 11th, 2013, 08:41 PM
Determining Lucky Losers: In the end of the final qualifying round, managers should post a list of the losers who had the highest scores in that round (If the score is the same you should use the TB/SR system to order the players). Those are the first players to be called in case someone doesn’t send his/her picks.
Players who had a BYE in 1st round and didnīt send for FQR will be at the end of the LL List only (behind those who sent and lost in 1st q-round)! The order of those in the LL list will be decided by ranking then.

New rule, which already will become effective now! :p
Change here is that those who had BYE in 1st round of Q and forgot to send for FQR will be behind those in the LL List from now on who sent and lost in 1st q round! :)

Cooper96
Nov 11th, 2013, 10:10 PM
Yay that was my suggestion. Glad it got changed :yeah:

Michael!
Dec 2nd, 2013, 08:42 PM
I will start adding new rules for 2014 now, at least those who are already clear! :)
Those rules which I will add already now will become effective from next week on, so please check the first page of the rules thread and the TB thread for possible changes (but I will post all new rules here in an extra post as well anyway! :angel:

Michael!
Dec 2nd, 2013, 08:43 PM
Sending picks incorrectly:

a) If someone sends before OOP is posted => no punishment
b) First time => a warning (manager should PM the player back)
c) Second time => a SR point penalty
d) Third time => a point penalty

Sending picks in incorrect format wonīt lead to a disqualification but will always lead to further point penalties during the tournament.

Examples:

a) sending full name instead of last name only:

Maria SHARAPOVA 2-0
Petra KVITOVA 2-0
Angelique KERBER 2-0

b) sending with country

Sharapova (RUS) 2-0
Kvitova (CZE) 2-0
Kerber (GER) 2-0

c) sending with wrong SR/TB format

Sharapova 3
Kvitova 2
Kerber 3

d) random order of picks/ridiculous format/multiples mistakes

Scharapowwa 2-0
Quitowa 20 Kerbear 2-0
Willyams 2-0 Errahni 2-0

e) Players who repeatedly send only one part of a double name (Suarez, Brito, Medina, Lucic)

Individual spelling or copy/paste mistakes can always happen and wonīt be punished.

We felt that it was necessary to introduce this because of the amount of complaints we've had from managers, and the failure of players to send in the correct format. Naturally, managers do not have to punish players who send in the wrong format, but if they wish to, they now have a list of procedures by which they can take action.

Inger67
Dec 2nd, 2013, 08:56 PM
Where it says: "Here are some examples of what does and what does not constitute sending picks in the incorrect format" it doesn't specify which did or did not constitute as sending in the wrong format, just listed off 5 examples.

Michael!
Dec 2nd, 2013, 09:01 PM
Where it says: "Here are some examples of what does and what does not constitute sending picks in the incorrect format" it doesn't specify which did or did not constitute as sending in the wrong format, just listed off 5 examples.


OK, I changed it a bit, should be clearer now! :p

Michael!
Dec 2nd, 2013, 09:09 PM
That rule should be clear also, no SEs for Top30 players!

Special Exempts: Anyone who wins a challenger tournament gets direct entry into an international tournament a fortnight following their win. If you win a challenger in week 1 of the new season, you gain direct entry into the MD of the international tournament of your choice in week 3, and so on. If there are no international tournaments that week, then your "special exempt" status rolls over to the week after, and so on. Challengers which take place in the last 2 weeks of the season and afterwards do NOT count regarding this new rule. To make use of this rule, a challenger winner should enter the international tournament of his choosing and tell the tournament manager that he has SE status. This rule applies for both singles and doubles. In doubles you have to enter MD of international tournament as special exempt with the partner you won the challenger with.
LE top-30-ranked players will NOT gain an SE for winning a challenger tournament. If they win an event, the SE will "roll over" to the next week. The runners-up will NOT gain the top 30 player's SE.

Michael!
Dec 2nd, 2013, 09:13 PM
we will also increase the time between posting EL and draw, Chris posted that already, right now we are just sorting discussing last details of that rule, will add it then to the new rules as well! :p

2014 we will also have different points system (just like WTA has), will wait here until WTA has confirmed that new system! :angel:

Michael!
Dec 7th, 2013, 01:40 PM
New rules for 2014 regarding commitments!
1st entry deadline will always be Sunday,6pm CET from now on, all those who commit after will be LEs!
There will be one deadline for singles and doubles!!!

All 2013 tournaments will have "old" deadline, new commitment rules will become effective for Brisbane/Shenzhen/Auckland 2014.


COMMITMENTS (NEW RULE):

Entries will be based on ranking (rankings from two weeks before the start of the tournament)
Tournament thread posted not later than Sunday (two weeks before start of the tournament) - Players have at least 8 days (from Sunday till Sunday) to commit to the tournament and this will be done by ranking.
First entry deadline for singles AND doubles is always Sunday 6 pm current time in Europe (CET or CEST).
The day before TT qualifying begins is the 2nd deadline for changes (the exact time is up to the tournament manager) and the draws are made after that.

Example for Paris/indoors (Quali starts 25th and MD starts 27th February):

Manager opens thread for Paris on Sunday, 12th February
First deadline for singles and doubles: Sunday, 19th February (6pm CET)
Draws are made: Friday, 24th February
EL and Seeds will be based on rankings from 13th February

Late Entries: Everyone who commits after the first entry deadline will be considered as Late Entry.
LEs, who commit after the 1st deadline but before draws are made will go to the bottom of the Entry List.

Late entries should be sorted according to the commitment order.

Everyone who commits after draws are made will be ALT.

Example for 32 MD:

- for example 26,30 or 34 entries on Sunday after 1st deadline is over.
- Manager should fill up to 44 players (28 direct MD entries + 16 QD) with late entrants (if LEs available obviously)
- 45th entry and/or all those who commit after the draws are made will be ALTs.
LE can be seeded.

Managers can extend deadline only if there are still spots available in the Main Draw after the second deadline, the first deadline is always Sunday 6 PM CET/CEST!

If I have less than 32 players at the latest possible commitment deadline then highest ranked players on the Entry List will receive a BYE (example: 20 entrants in a 32 draw size 1st round => The 8 seeds + players ranked 9-12 get BYE)

Missing Someone's Commitment: In the case that you miss someone's commitment while managing a tournament he/she will be topping the Alt or LL lists.

Mynarco
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:01 PM
:eek: so we are using the MTF rules as well. It's getting a bit complicated.

Michael!
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:04 PM
:eek: so we are using the MTF rules as well. It's getting a bit complicated.

wouldnīt say complicated, people just have to get used to the early deadline! :p

Mynarco
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:07 PM
wouldnīt say complicated, people just have to get used to the early deadline! :p

And managers to set up thread earlier :oh:

It's gonna be a gamble for the lower ranked players on what tournaments to go to. Wrong decision and you are an LE.

Michael!
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:11 PM
And managers to set up thread earlier :oh:

It's gonna be a gamble for the lower ranked players on what tournaments to go to. Wrong decision and you are an LE.

yeah, I expect more last minute commitments, just like on MTF where they basically have same rule but it works fine there and it also should work fine here!

Mynarco
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:14 PM
yeah, I expect more last minute commitments, just like on MTF where they basically have same rule but it works fine there and it also should work fine here!

Hopefully the managers and the players are aware of these changes:)

Michael!
Dec 7th, 2013, 02:19 PM
Hopefully the managers and the players are aware of these changes:)


thatīs why we will send PMs, post links etc. :oh:

valac222
Dec 7th, 2013, 03:09 PM
Would you confirm just to make it clear.

26 players at first deadline: Next 2 LE ( according to thecommitment order) get MD place, all other LEs get QD places. (So LEs not sorted by ranking order even in this case)
30 players at first deadline: 28 best ranked get MD place, 2 lowest ranked get QD place as well as all LEs.

valac222
Dec 7th, 2013, 03:16 PM
Missing Someone's Commitment: In the case that you miss someone's commitment while managing a tournament he/she will be topping the Alt or LL lists.


1, LL if the player had been in MD, Alt if the player had been in QD
2, What if if the manager miss a LE commitment from a high ranked player?

valac222
Dec 7th, 2013, 04:02 PM
Just one more comment. There is an obvious overlapping between MTT and WTT players and first commitment deadlines are now the same. It would be a polite step towards players if first commitment deadline would be 5PM or 7PM instead of 6PM

joe87
Dec 7th, 2013, 04:04 PM
Would you confirm just to make it clear.

26 players at first deadline: Next 2 LE ( according to thecommitment order) get MD place, all other LEs get QD places. (So LEs not sorted by ranking order even in this case)
30 players at first deadline: 28 best ranked get MD place, 2 lowest ranked get QD place as well as all LEs.

correct ;)

Missing Someone's Commitment: In the case that you miss someone's commitment while managing a tournament he/she will be topping the Alt or LL lists.


1, LL if the player had been in MD, Alt if the player had been in QD
2, What if if the manager miss a LE commitment from a high ranked player?

1) yes, like we always did it
2) Being high ranked doesn't change anything here as LEs are sorted by commitment order. He will be ALT for Q then. ;)

goOudinUSA
Dec 7th, 2013, 04:04 PM
It's gonna be a gamble for the lower ranked players on what tournaments to go to. Wrong decision and you are an LE.

We know all to well about this on MTF. ;)

joe87
Dec 7th, 2013, 04:10 PM
We know all to well about this on MTF. ;)

I think it wont be that bad. Everyone who ends up in Q or as ALT still can go to ITF which usually has free MD places here in WTA. ;)

goOudinUSA
Dec 7th, 2013, 04:21 PM
I think it wont be that bad. Everyone who ends up in Q or as ALT still can go to ITF which usually has free MD places here in WTA. ;)

Oh, I'm not saying its going to be bad; I was stating that Chrono and I sometimes had some trouble figuring out which tournaments we would play (if we could get in or not)...and many times took a gamble. ;)

M.P
Dec 7th, 2013, 06:34 PM
So the first entry is like a week earlier?


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

Michael!
Dec 7th, 2013, 11:48 PM
So the first entry is like a week earlier?


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)


yep :p

Example for Paris/indoors (Quali starts 25th and MD starts 27th February):

Manager opens thread for Paris on Sunday, 12th February
First deadline for singles and doubles: Sunday, 19th February (6pm CET)
Draws are made: Friday, 24th February
EL and Seeds will be based on rankings from 13th February

valac222
Dec 9th, 2013, 03:43 PM
This rule has a major element at MTT: no multiple commitment allowed during first week. Is that also the case here?

Michael!
Dec 9th, 2013, 07:03 PM
This rule has a major element at MTT: no multiple commitment allowed during first week. Is that also the case here?

before the first deadline on Sunday players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.

Only the first commitment is valid if a player is still on two different Entry Lists once first deadline is over.

Michael!
Dec 11th, 2013, 12:17 PM
before the first deadline on Sunday players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.

Only the first commitment is valid if a player is still on two different Entry Lists once first deadline is over.

I formed a rule out of my own comment and added it on first page as well, to make it clear for the future!!

Mynarco
Dec 11th, 2013, 04:39 PM
So managers have to crosscheck the ELs of other tournaments held in the same week to avoid double commitments

Michael!
Dec 11th, 2013, 05:32 PM
So managers have to crosscheck the ELs of other tournaments held in the same week to avoid double commitments

First of all players should withdraw from one tournament before they enter another one but yeah, managers should also check EL of other tournaments to avoid double commitments but that isnīt sth new! :p

SAISAI-GOAT
Dec 11th, 2013, 06:41 PM
:eek:

feel so many players will miss the deadline now :rolls:

Michael!
Dec 17th, 2013, 10:37 PM
Tournament Points for 2015:

Grand Slams:
Winner: 2000
Final: 1300
Semifinal: 780
Quarterfinal: 430
R16: 240
R32: 130
R64: 70
R128: 10
Q: 40
QFR: 30
Q2: 20
Q1: 2

Premier Mandatory (R128):
Winner: 1000
Final: 650
Semifinal: 390
Quarterfinal: 215
R16: 120
R32: 65
R64: 35
R128: 10
Qualifier: 30
QFR: 20
Q1: 2

Premier Mandatory (R64):
Winner: 1000
Final: 650
Semifinal: 390
Quarterfinal: 215
R16: 120
R32: 65
R64: 10
Qualifier: 30
QFR: 20
Q1: 2

Premier 5 (R64):
Winner: 900
Final: 585
Semifinal: 350
Quarterfinal: 190
R16: 105
R32: 60
R64: 1
Qualifier: 30
QFR: 20
Q1: 1


Premier 7 (R64):
Winner: 470
Final: 305
Semifinal: 185
Quarterfinal: 100
R16: 55
R32: 30
R64: 1
Qualifier: 25
QFR: 18
Q1: 1

Premier 7 (R32):
Winner: 470
Final: 305
Semifinal: 185
Quarterfinal: 100
R16: 55
R32: 1
Qualifier: 25
QFR: 18
Q1: 1

International (R32):
Winner: 280
Final: 180
Semifinal: 110
Quarterfinal: 60
R16: 30
R32: 1
Qualifier: 18
QFR: 14
Q1: 1

WTA125 (R32):
Winner: 160
Final: 95
Semifinal: 57
Quarterfinal: 29
R16: 15
R32: 1
Qualifier: 6
QFR: 4
Q1: 1

Challengers (R64):
Winner: 150
Final: 90
Semifinal: 55
Quarterfinal: 28
R16: 14
R32: 7
R64: 1
Qualifier: 6
QFR: 4
Q1: 1

Challengers (R32):
Winner: 150
Final: 90
Semifinal: 55
Quarterfinal: 28
R16: 14
R32: 1
Qualifier: 6
QFR: 4
Q1: 1

YEC:
Round Robin Match Loss – 70 points
Round Robin Match Win – 230 points
Semifinal Win – 360 points
Final Win – 450 points
Undefeated Champion – 1500 points

Challenger YEC:
Round Robin Match Loss – 5 points
Round Robin Match Win – 38 points
Semifinal Win – 56 points
Final Win – 80 points
Undefeated Champion – 250 points

Mynarco
Dec 17th, 2013, 10:46 PM
Michi :kiss:

Lord Sneeze
Dec 18th, 2013, 01:45 AM
Michi :kiss:

This :worship:

colemohrlee
Dec 19th, 2013, 01:50 AM
new points

Inger67
Dec 19th, 2013, 02:19 PM
Are these the point distributions that are being used on the WTA tour then?

Michael!
Dec 19th, 2013, 03:29 PM
Are these the point distributions that are being used on the WTA tour then?

Yes, Sir! :p

Erranifighting
Dec 26th, 2013, 08:06 AM
a good game

Erranifighting
Dec 26th, 2013, 08:07 AM
wait for 3 months

^bibi^
Dec 26th, 2013, 11:29 AM
Hello,

About the protected Ranking System, I can't find the protected ranking thread...

I was ranked 148 back in April 2010 when I left this board, can I use that PR now that I'm back ?

Michael!
Dec 26th, 2013, 11:36 AM
Hello,

About the protected Ranking System, I can't find the protected ranking thread...

I was ranked 148 back in April 2010 when I left this board, can I use that PR now that I'm back ?

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=448810

Post in this thread if you wish to be considered for a protected ranking. You may be eligible if you have not played tt for a period of 6 months, but have played within the last 2 years, or if you know that you will be absent for a period of time in the coming season, then you can post in here prior to your absence.

sorry :hug:

^bibi^
Dec 26th, 2013, 12:43 PM
OK thanx :) it's not like it would have made a huge difference anyway :p

Michael!
Feb 18th, 2014, 10:06 AM
Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
Only the first commitment is valid if a player is still on two different Entry Lists once second deadline is over for one of these tournaments.
If the double commitment is not noticed by the managers, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered.

Updated commitment rules!
Basically just added what Joe already said in the Ask the board thread, only first commitment is valid if a player is still on EL after 2nd deadline and points gained by the player wonīt be considered if the double commitment isnīt noticed!

valac222
Feb 18th, 2014, 10:42 AM
Should the player be removed from the draw and replaced by an LL (if it is still possible)?

joe87
Feb 18th, 2014, 11:55 AM
Should the player be removed from the draw and replaced by an LL (if it is still possible)?


I would say yes, if it is discovered in time and a LL sent picks.

joe87
Feb 18th, 2014, 11:56 AM
So, we can commit to several tournaments, but we will have to withdraw from one of them before the second deadline?


Yes.

joe87
Feb 18th, 2014, 12:11 PM
Yes, no changes here.

We just wanted to make sure that the players are the ones who have to take care of their commitments and not the managers, as it happened that someone ended up on multiple entrylists after 2nd deadline.

Michael!
Feb 27th, 2014, 02:41 PM
3 Month + 100 posts Rule: One can only play this game if he has created an account in this forum at least 3 months ago AND has at least 100 posts. An exception to the this rule is to be made for MTF TT players. If an MTF'er who has been a member there for at least 3 months and has over 100 posts there wishes to play tennis tipping on TF, he is now allowed to do so. However, such player must declare himself to the TT manager of that particular tournament and will have to be verified as an MTF member.

That rule doesnīt exist anymore!
Everyone who wants to play TT on TF is allowed to do that immediately from now on, 100 posts arenīt needed as well anymore!

Javi.
Feb 27th, 2014, 04:01 PM
That rule doesnīt exist anymore!
Everyone who wants to play TT on TF is allowed to do that immediately from now on, 100 posts arenīt needed as well anymore!

Good riddance! :bigclap:

Davidspell
Feb 27th, 2014, 04:34 PM
That rule doesnīt exist anymore!
Everyone who wants to play TT on TF is allowed to do that immediately from now on, 100 posts arenīt needed as well anymore!

Good decision!

Igorche
Feb 27th, 2014, 05:05 PM
That rule doesnīt exist anymore!
Everyone who wants to play TT on TF is allowed to do that immediately from now on, 100 posts arenīt needed as well anymore!

:eek:

BMT360
Feb 27th, 2014, 08:02 PM
That rule doesnīt exist anymore!
Everyone who wants to play TT on TF is allowed to do that immediately from now on, 100 posts arenīt needed as well anymore!

Thank you!!!!!!!!!

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

valac222
Feb 28th, 2014, 09:07 AM
Definately a good and brave decision. :worship:

Michael!
Oct 23rd, 2014, 07:56 AM
Alternates for TOC 2014

- Any player/team that won a International tournament in 2014 can enter the event as alternate, and will be ordered according to the Singles Rankings/Doubles Race Standings.
- Alternates are not allowed to play challengers in the week the TOC is played.
- Players who fail to send picks for the first RR round of the tournament will be permanently replaced by alternates. No replacements will happen after the first RR round.

This is the rule when it comes to ALTs for Sofia next week, this will be the last TOC anyway and we will discuss about new rules for YEC during the off season.

The winner and the runner-up of each group will be determined by the following tie-breaker:

a. Greatest number of wins.
b. Head-to-head results if only two (2) players are tied.
c. If three (3) players are tied, then:
i) Number of correct picks.
ii) If (i) produces one (1) superior player (first place), or one (1) inferior player (third place), and the two (2) remaining players are tied, the tie between those two (2) players shall be broken by head-to-head record.
iii) Number of correct SRs.
iii) Number of correct ISRs

Michael!
Nov 13th, 2014, 05:01 PM
http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=51543642&postcount=373

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 13th, 2014, 06:35 PM
when are rankings switched to best of 20 and will this make Adey the new #1 :oh:

Igorche
Nov 13th, 2014, 06:53 PM
I'm not sure what's new :confused:
Old
Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the 2nd deadline is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

If the double commitment is not noticed by anyone before the draws are made, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered and the player will be replaced with ALTs/LLs (only possible if the player didnīt win a round already in that tournament)
New
Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the first deadline is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

If the double commitment is not noticed by anyone before the draws are made, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered and the player will be replaced with ALTs/LLs (only possible if the player didnīt win a round already in that tournament)

Michael!
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:39 PM
when are rankings switched to best of 20 and will this make Adey the new #1 :oh:

Best of 20 from 2015 on :angel:
No clue about your 2nd question, ask Adey :D :lol:

for more details, ask Adey/Frederik, the experts of Rankings :D :lol:

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:40 PM
Best of 20 from 2015 on :angel:
No clue about your 2nd question, ask Adey :D :lol:

for more details, ask Adey/Frederik, the experts of Rankings :D :lol:

but what if the #1 switches hands, just because of that rule :scared:

I assume Adey or Inger would launch a protest :oh:

Javi.
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:41 PM
Best of 20 from 2015 on :angel:
No clue about your 2nd question, ask Adey :D :lol:

for more details, ask Adey/Frederik, the experts of Rankings :D :lol:

So this will be changed after #20 in of 2015 or only at the end of 2015 when only 2015 results are computed for ranking? :scratch:
Sorry it may sound stupid but I'm not sure what this means :p

Michael!
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:41 PM
but what if the #1 switches hands, just because of that rule :scared:

I assume Adey or Inger would launch a protest :oh:

then we all blame jrm as she suggested that change :angel: :lol:

Michael!
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:44 PM
So this will be changed after #20 in of 2015? :scratch:

Best 20 results will count for the Race in 2015 instead of 16, but as I said, I am not an expert of the rankings, Meelis/Frederik/Adey are surely able to tell you how it works exactly.

Michael!
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:45 PM
so we can no longer wait for the 1st deadline lists to come out to choose where to play?

No, just same as on MTF, just that on TF you are allowed to commit to multiple tournaments before the 1st deadline without being LE!

Meelis
Nov 13th, 2014, 07:53 PM
will this make Adey the new #1 :oh:

Probably not. Right now it's Inger 5295, Adey 5280. Best 20 would be Inger 5530, Adey 5510.

Counting top 20 does not make much difference. Only few players will have their ranking go up or down by more than couple places.

Meelis
Nov 13th, 2014, 08:37 PM
So this will be changed after #20 in of 2015 or only at the end of 2015 when only 2015 results are computed for ranking? :scratch:

Best 16 results will count for the last rankings of 2014.
Best 20 results will count for the first rankings of 2015.

Lord Sneeze
Nov 14th, 2014, 12:15 AM
Can i please confirm that SE will be the for only the 3-4 week period of that month, not overall Challenger ranking, be majorly flawed if it is that.
For example March would take into account only weeks 4-7 points, not weeks 1-7.

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 14th, 2014, 01:15 AM
Can i please confirm that SE will be the for only the 3-4 week period of that month, not overall Challenger ranking, be majorly flawed if it is that.
For example March would take into account only weeks 4-7 points, not weeks 1-7.

I think it is the overall Challenger ranking :oh:

Adrian. was complaining that the "scrubs" that play the ITF tour don't have chances to play XWTA tournaments and I think this is supposed to address Adrian.'s concern by letting the best ITF players keep playing XWTA :angel:

ivanxie
Nov 14th, 2014, 03:28 AM
No, just same as on MTF, just that on TF you are allowed to commit to multiple tournaments before the 1st deadline without being LE!

Damn, that's annoying. I always wait until the entry list is officially out before withdrawing to not have to play qualifying. Oh well.

Suit Up!
Nov 14th, 2014, 06:41 AM
So if the manager does not post a preliminary entry list - which is more often than not what we have - we won't know where we are. Well done, #boardmadeoftoprankedplayerswhodontstrugglewithsch edule

:worship: :worship: :worship: :worship: :worship:

Sorry but this rule is utter crap. What is the point of a first deadline in the first place then?

Yes, a board is selected to make decisions but this type of decision is affects lower ranked players MUCH MORE than top ranked players. The board IS NOT AN ACCURATE CROSSSECTION of the TT playing family and these rules should require a poll. 99% of all players do not have multiple commitments come the time of second deadline, so I do not in any way see why this rule was changed and what benefit will be derived from it. It will NOT be easier for managers. There will be more people double committed come first deadline, increasing the workload of managers. If a preliminary entry list a bit before first deadline is made, players will know where to play. I do not want to name any names but some managers, so have been managing for a while are just not up to scratch and I know that even with manager rules, prelim entry lists will not be made. I'm sorry for ranting but this rule seems to have no thought put into it what so ever :help: most of the board IS NOT as effected by this time rule as everyone else.

Igorche
Nov 14th, 2014, 07:21 AM
Can i please confirm that SE will be the for only the 3-4 week period of that month, not overall Challenger ranking, be majorly flawed if it is that.
For example March would take into account only weeks 4-7 points, not weeks 1-7.

Yes (that is how I understood)

ivanxie
Nov 14th, 2014, 07:51 AM
:worship: :worship: :worship: :worship: :worship:

Sorry but this rule is utter crap. What is the point of a first deadline in the first place then?

Yes, a board is selected to make decisions but this type of decision is affects lower ranked players MUCH MORE than top ranked players. The board IS NOT AN ACCURATE CROSSSECTION of the TT playing family and these rules should require a poll. 99% of all players do not have multiple commitments come the time of second deadline, so I do not in any way see why this rule was changed and what benefit will be derived from it. It will NOT be easier for managers. There will be more people double committed come first deadline, increasing the workload of managers. If a preliminary entry list a bit before first deadline is made, players will know where to play. I do not want to name any names but some managers, so have been managing for a while are just not up to scratch and I know that even with manager rules, prelim entry lists will not be made. I'm sorry for ranting but this rule seems to have no thought put into it what so ever :help: most of the board IS NOT as effected by this time rule as everyone else.

Agreed. I hope I will never be one of those managers in the first place :oh:
All hail AdeyC Manager-GOAT.

Michael!
Nov 14th, 2014, 08:30 AM
So if the manager does not post a preliminary entry list - which is more often than not what we have - we won't know where we are. Well done, #boardmadeoftoprankedplayerswhodontstrugglewithsch edule

Glad that you like our decision :)
Anyway, as I said before, managers will have to post updated Entry Lists before the 1st deadline, thatīs obvious, if they regularly fail to do that they wonīt get the chance to manage anymore, itīs simple.

Yes (that is how I understood)

Yes, you understood right.
For February it is 1-3 week, for March only 4-7, not 1-7...

We are just about to add some rules for SEs in case of ties between players etc.
Thanks to Laszlo, he noticed it, better to think about such cases now during the off season and not when it happenend already...

rvugt
Nov 14th, 2014, 08:51 AM
Wow, some really strange changes. I don't agree with some of them.
About the commitment, I think the same rule for doubles is much too strong. How about one person in a doubles team will not make the singles cut. Changing a team will make you LE.

And next to that, is the 20 tournaments rule one that is also done in real life? I didn't hear anything about that, but it sounds surprising to me that you change that rule.

And just as a general thing, did I miss the places where we can vote what we think about these rules?

And why is it possible to play 2 tournaments as one, isn't FEDcup important anymore? The best thing would be to give points for the FED cup, that would solve the problem in a better way!

Igorche
Nov 14th, 2014, 08:56 AM
Wow, some really strange changes. I don't agree with some of them.
About the commitment, I think the same rule for doubles is much too strong. How about one person in a doubles team will not make the singles cut. Changing a team will make you LE.


No, that was case with old rule. With new rule there is only one deadline, last deadline.

rvugt
Nov 14th, 2014, 08:59 AM
No, that was case with old rule. With new rule there is only one deadline, last deadline.

Ok, indeed missed that part! That is better!

valac222
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:09 AM
For the double commitment rule there is an intermediate solution:

First ELs should be crosschecked on Monday at/not before 6 PM CET. That would give 24 hours to make decision.

valac222
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:12 AM
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the first deadline is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

What I say is that it should not be noticed before Monday :D

Michael!
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:16 AM
Wow, some really strange changes. I don't agree with some of them.
About the commitment, I think the same rule for doubles is much too strong. How about one person in a doubles team will not make the singles cut. Changing a team will make you LE.

And next to that, is the 20 tournaments rule one that is also done in real life? I didn't hear anything about that, but it sounds surprising to me that you change that rule.

And just as a general thing, did I miss the places where we can vote what we think about these rules?

And why is it possible to play 2 tournaments as one, isn't FEDcup important anymore? The best thing would be to give points for the FED cup, that would solve the problem in a better way!

16 or 20 doesnīt make a big difference but as most of the TT players play every week it seems a bit fairer to count Best 20 Tournaments, not just 16.

Fed Cup, we discussed 2 options, giving pts for FedCup or allowing players to play tournaments in the same week, majority voted for the Option we have now and this is a rule which favours all players, so no need to have a poll about that IMO

Suit Up!
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:20 AM
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the first deadline is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

What I say is that it should not be noticed before Monday :D

Still sometimes ELs are not posted. So I think the best thing would still be enforcement of prelim entry lists

Michael!
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:25 AM
Still sometimes ELs are not posted. So I think the best thing would still be enforcement of prelim entry lists

I will post in the Managers Thread that managers should post at least one updated EL before the 1st deadline, thatīs clear and as I said, managers should be aware of it now that it is important to update EL regularly and to be honest, with EL maker it is really no big deal to post an updated EL...

Igorche
Nov 14th, 2014, 09:28 AM
Still sometimes ELs are not posted. So I think the best thing would still be enforcement of prelim entry lists

I will post in the Managers Thread that managers should post at least one updated EL before the 1st deadline, thatīs clear and as I said, managers should be aware of it now that it is important to update EL regularly and to be honest, with EL maker it is really no big deal to post an updated EL...

And with EL maker it is very easy for players to check where they are on EL.

In The Zone
Nov 14th, 2014, 11:41 PM
16 or 20 doesnīt make a big difference but as most of the TT players play every week it seems a bit fairer to count Best 20 Tournaments, not just 16.

Fed Cup, we discussed 2 options, giving pts for FedCup or allowing players to play tournaments in the same week, majority voted for the Option we have now and this is a rule which favours all players, so no need to have a poll about that IMO

Best of 20 favors the top of the game - again. The rich continue to get richer. Why 20? What a random #? Why wouldn't this be voted upon by the entire game? Why only a select few change such an important rule?

We try to mirror the game at every turn. Now all of a sudden we don't. Convenient.

The Walking Bye
Nov 15th, 2014, 01:05 AM
For the double commitment rule there is an intermediate solution:

First ELs should be crosschecked on Monday at/not before 6 PM CET. That would give 24 hours to make decision.

Ok, I was thinking the same thing, and 24 hours accounts for all timezones.

Doubles rule should be changed though, What if you are in singles QD but way out of doubles QD, alt 4, and in another tournament you are Alt 2 for singles, and in the Q draw comfortably. A difficult choice to make, which to WD from, Option A you wouldn't play Dubs, second option you could play both or neither.

Michael!
Nov 15th, 2014, 07:38 AM
what about one of the dear board members to be responsible for entry list updates during the whole week-end prior to the Sunday deadline?

seriously, you can switch back to the former doubles rule. the whole point was to have multiple commitment + doubles deadline pushed, there is no point at all doing the one or the other

The managers are obviously responsible for that in first place! ;)
But yeah, if there is no updated EL available then I can post one, I donīt have a problem with that, thatīs one of the tasks we board members have for sure, I agree here ;)


Best of 20 favors the top of the game - again. The rich continue to get richer. Why 20? What a random #? Why wouldn't this be voted upon by the entire game? Why only a select few change such an important rule?

We try to mirror the game at every turn. Now all of a sudden we don't. Convenient.

as I said before, itīs not a big change but we thought that best of 20 would be a bit fairer as most of the players play weekly anyway and I disagree, the rich continue to get richer is just wrong IMO
The SEs, the Top 30 LEs rule, more challengers/tournaments during the off season, Challenger YEC...we didnīt have that all a few years ago, so yeah, I just disagree with what you said, sorry.

Michael!
Nov 15th, 2014, 05:10 PM
Protected rankings: If people want a protected ranking, they should post it in protected rankings thread either before, or within 6 months of their lay-off and as long as they don't play TT for a period of 6 months, they are eligible for a protected ranking.
A PR is valid for one year and 8 tournaments (including maximum 2 Grand Slams and 2 premier mandatory tournaments)

WTA changed the rule here and allows to enter 2 Grand Slams with a Protected Ranking, so we changed that rule as well! :p

Mynarco
Nov 15th, 2014, 05:12 PM
:oh:

Freddy shall be pleased

joe87
Nov 15th, 2014, 05:39 PM
:oh:

Freddy shall be pleased


How many did he use yet? Should be at least 6 or 7 :shrug:

Michael!
Nov 16th, 2014, 10:59 AM
Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
After the 1st deadline players have 24 hours time to withdraw from events of their choice
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the Withdrawal Deadline (Monday, 6pm CET/CEST) is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

If the double commitment is not noticed by anyone before the draws are made, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered and the player will be replaced with ALTs/LLs (only possible if the player didnīt win a round already in that tournament)

We added the red part to the rules to give players 24 hours time to withdraw from events of their choice.
I hope that satisfies most of you! :p

The Walking Bye
Nov 16th, 2014, 11:04 AM
^Thank you, it's not perfect but you are not punished if you forget, or if your timezone is horrible you can out after the cool down period before infractions are noticed.

Still, the double commit rule:tape:

Michael!
Nov 16th, 2014, 11:12 AM
Opponents of players/teams who did not send picks will receive a walkover in all 1 Day Round matches (incl. Non-1st round matches)
Teams/Players can only get replaced on a 1st day of a two days 1st round
Teams/Players who did not send picks are allowed to stay in the draw (and still have a chance to win) whenever there is a two days round (in non 1st round matches)

I added the red part, we usually donīt have two days 1st rounds but it happened in the past here and there, just wanted to make sure that we have a written rule for it...:angel:

Frederik
Nov 16th, 2014, 02:15 PM
How many did he use yet? Should be at least 6 or 7 :shrug:

Only have a few left. 2 in singles and 3 in doubles ;)

Michael!
Nov 16th, 2014, 06:36 PM
what about making everyting a 1-day round except the finals?
so QF 1-day round, so that final becomes a 3-day round, with a lot more matches in it, to avoid ridiculous finals

well, we just had the Poll about changing the schedule and majority of the players wants to keep the current schedule, if there are users who support your idea then we will think about having a poll about it for sure for 2016!

rvugt
Nov 16th, 2014, 11:08 PM
16 or 20 doesnīt make a big difference but as most of the TT players play every week it seems a bit fairer to count Best 20 Tournaments, not just 16.

Fed Cup, we discussed 2 options, giving pts for FedCup or allowing players to play tournaments in the same week, majority voted for the Option we have now and this is a rule which favours all players, so no need to have a poll about that IMO

Okay, players who don't play Fed cup get stronger tournaments in the week of the Fed cup. So, why does this favour anybody. It would be nice if we don't grow into a dictatorship and get a vote in every decision in the off season. Of course some things are logical, but as you mention here, there was a discussion with different options in the board. Why not ask us?

Best of 20 favors the top of the game - again. The rich continue to get richer. Why 20? What a random #? Why wouldn't this be voted upon by the entire game? Why only a select few change such an important rule?

Here the same. I am seeing a dictatorship growing.

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:41 AM
Okay, players who don't play Fed cup get stronger tournaments in the week of the Fed cup. So, why does this favour anybody. It would be nice if we don't grow into a dictatorship and get a vote in every decision in the off season. Of course some things are logical, but as you mention here, there was a discussion with different options in the board. Why not ask us?



Here the same. I am seeing a dictatorship growing.

all this.

The veterans but also the newbies see this, but you as the BOARD are always ignoring it.

Top 20 tournaments for the ranks favors the Top Players more than the lower ones.
YEC Challenger is only for the ones, who are already in top 100 or better, anyway.
(1st seed singles: #51, 2nd: #55, 3rd: #58, 1st seed doubles: #70, 2nd: #79, 3rd: #80)
don't see how this makes things better...:lol:
The commitment rule is a joke, too. I think it was fine like it was before.
And I won't say a thing about the new SE System...:tape:

DONT LIKE IT AT ALL!!!

And sorry, but I have to disagree with you, MICHI!

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 24th, 2014, 02:59 AM
And sorry, but I have to disagree with you, MICHI!

that is like all you ever do, complain about everything :oh:

like I already said in the other thread, a few weeks ago you came in here and complained to the board that it is "so hard" for the scrubs of TT like you to get good results in ITFs because of Top 30 players vulturing them :rolleyes:

you caused a ruckus and even got some changes passed through, such as not letting top 30 LE be SEED :o

now in Minsk, you win the tournament even though the top 2 players in the world tried to vulture there, and then you don't say a word :shrug: oh yeah, so much for the top 30 coming in an taking your points :facepalm:

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 03:06 AM
that is like all you ever do, complain about everything :oh:

like I already said in the other thread, a few weeks ago you came in here and complained to the board that it is "so hard" for the scrubs of TT like you to get good results in ITFs because of Top 30 players vulturing them :rolleyes:

you caused a ruckus and even got some changes passed through, such as not letting top 30 LE be SEED :o

now in Minsk, you win the tournament even though the top 2 players in the world tried to vulture there, and then you don't say a word :shrug: oh yeah, so much for the top 30 coming in an taking your points :facepalm:

What is your problem? are you already scared that you will get your Chinese ass out of top 30 soon? :spit:

I did not have to beat #1 or #2 but I beat #13 and it was the toughest match of the week, so yeah, my opinion stays the same.
Furthermore, I never argued about them being unbeatable, so stop putting words into my mouth or prove it :bigwave:

the big fat :facepalm: is you and your current form...I will be happy when all your fluke results put you back into ITFs :kiss:

and no, none of my wishes or changes passed through, so I can't be happy about anything.

Only like that the BOARD polls went the way they went...

Suit Up!
Nov 24th, 2014, 04:32 AM
What is your problem? are you already scared that you will get your Chinese ass out of top 30 soon? :spit:

I did not have to beat #1 or #2 but I beat #13 and it was the toughest match of the week, so yeah, my opinion stays the same.
Furthermore, I never argued about them being unbeatable, so stop putting words into my mouth or prove it :bigwave:

the big fat :facepalm: is you and your current form...I will be happy when all your fluke results put you back into ITFs :kiss:

and no, none of my wishes or changes passed through, so I can't be happy about anything.

Only like that the BOARD polls went the way they went...

That's borderline racist......why bring someones nationality into it? Does it have any relevance. No.

The Walking Bye
Nov 24th, 2014, 04:53 AM
I asked about WC, and even though 2014 hasn't ended yet, without a poll or even letting people know about the idea, I got "oh well, maybe for 2016". Um, no, the 2014 season hasn't finished yet, and you could at least ask around.

Fed cup rule is stupid, the few times top TT players don't play every week is then, which means other players have better chances of scooping titles or points. Yet now the top players can enjoy playing playing FC while getting the opportunity to get extra points as well, very fair...

Some ideas are always pushed out saying the WTA don't do it, but TT is so un-parallel it hardly matters tbh

Michael!
Nov 24th, 2014, 10:29 AM
as I said before, we canīt satisfy everyone unfortunately but we try our best, even if some donīt believe it!
and I agree with SAISAI here, it is good in general to have TT players who think about the rules, who criticize when they donīt agree but in Adrianīs case it feels like a general complaint about almost everything we do but we will have more polls at the end of next season although the poll results are predictable most of the time...again about WC, that would lead to too many discussions, we canīt introduce them unless we have a solid basis for it (just as for defending champions, tournament winners etc) and as I said before, we will consider that.

Furthermore, we should stop attacking each other, thatīs lame, further questions or suggestions via PM please unless you really have something new and urgent to say.

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 11:58 AM
That's borderline racist......why bring someones nationality into it? Does it have any relevance. No.

Racist? :spit: you know what racist means? :unsure: If I called him yellow, asian, black, nigga, nazi, etc. that's racist.
If he wrights Polish Adrian, is this racist, too? :rolleyes:
Honestly...

as I said before, we canīt satisfy everyone unfortunately but we try our best, even if some donīt believe it!
and I agree with SAISAI here, it is good in general to have TT players who think about the rules, who criticize when they donīt agree but in Adrianīs case it feels like a general complaint about almost everything we do but we will have more polls at the end of next season although the poll results are predictable most of the time...

Well, my dear friend, I see a lot of others how complain, too. Jean, Ruben, Paul, the Aussies (hope it's not racist :rolleyes:), others and me. Only that I comment most of it, doesn't mean, I'm the only one who doesn't like many of your actions. (see Paul's and Ruben's post). Why don't you reply to these posts?
Why don't you reply to my post about Challenger YEC, and so on.
Du pickst dir nur die Rosinen raus und das wars dann...anyway, you will get a PM soon from me :bounce:

AdeyC
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:13 PM
Considering that there's 300 players - it's actually a very small number.

Suit Up!
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:29 PM
Racist? :spit: you know what racist means? :unsure: If I called him yellow, asian, black, nigga, nazi, etc. that's racist.
If he wrights Polish Adrian, is this racist, too? :rolleyes:
Honestly...



Well, my dear friend, I see a lot of others how complain, too. Jean, Ruben, Paul, the Aussies (hope it's not racist :rolleyes:), others and me. Only that I comment most of it, doesn't mean, I'm the only one who doesn't like many of your actions. (see Paul's and Ruben's post). Why don't you reply to these posts?
Why don't you reply to my post about Challenger YEC, and so on.
Du pickst dir nur die Rosinen raus und das wars dann...anyway, you will get a PM soon from me :bounce:

Firstly, fine if it wasn't racist. But why bring someones race into the equation when it was ZERO relevance and that too in a negative connotation?

Secondly, yes people complain but mostly they do it too one rule and they make their arguements and accept the final ruling. You on the other hand, do criticise every single action the board makes. I agreement with you in the sense that critics and offering improvements are a good thing but the delivery is every important, it should be constructive but blatant rudeness which is the case in the majority of your posts. Please note that I have nothing against you but this is how it comes across to a third party

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:45 PM
R16 R20
xieergai................. 63 68 -5
PAVANILAI................ 86 91 -5
Monzanator............... 117 122 -5
LefandePatty............. 134 139 -5
LCS...................... 34 38 -4
jasonchou................ 42 46 -4
Elwin.................... 52 56 -4
iPatty................... 62 66 -4
Sasja.................... 91 95 -4
killerqueen.............. 115 119 -4
Phil=)................... 123 127 -4
Alycia................... 136 140 -4
randy72391............... 22 25 -3
pedropt.................. 30 33 -3
Felipe Abe............... 76 79 -3
ViceUltramontain......... 81 84 -3
Elzy Gano................ 83 86 -3
Cheda 16.17.............. 132 135 -3
feifei................... 16 18 -2
petey_pan................ 29 31 -2
chenhw................... 32 34 -2
Heinann.................. 35 37 -2
Milan.................... 39 41 -2
valac222................. 40 42 -2
Joaquin.................. 57 59 -2
hessie................... 61 63 -2
Sabinator................ 88 90 -2
Idemo.................... 116 118 -2
Vefci Y.................. 118 120 -2
flareon.................. 119 121 -2
The Walking Bye.......... 124 126 -2
Effy..................... 127 129 -2
simonsaystennis.......... 130 132 -2
Gu-niao.................. 135 137 -2
WhoAmI?.................. 140 142 -2
sfar..................... 146 148 -2
garyyoung................ 21 22 -1
safinfans629............. 44 45 -1
andyroddlick............. 46 47 -1
Buitenzorg............... 48 49 -1
MikBs.................... 53 54 -1
Hapsara.................. 56 57 -1
shuai.P.................. 59 60 -1
coolfish1103............. 66 67 -1
ESimp.................... 77 78 -1
sd3300123................ 95 96 -1
Broseghini............... 96 97 -1
Chilenaitor.............. 99 100 -1
Royals................... 103 104 -1
Curcubeu................. 104 105 -1
matthias................. 111 112 -1
catgamer................. 112 113 -1
Connect_HR............... 113 114 -1
BlackPanther............. 129 130 -1
Martn7................... 142 143 -1
Swanny006................ 143 144 -1
diego36arg............... 148 149 -1
CibulkaNa................ 155 156 -1
Spencer.................. 161 162 -1
a1canada................. 171 172 -1
prima donna.............. 172 173 -1
peanuts.................. 173 174 -1
Vaxey.................... 185 186 -1
FedererForever........... 189 190 -1
jankimfan................ 208 209 -1
Chris93.................. 213 214 -1
Inger67.................. 1 1 0
AdeyC.................... 2 2 0
Freak3yman84............. 3 3 0
mateusz2904.............. 4 4 0
ALYOUNA.................. 5 5 0
Christork17.............. 6 6 0
Jaco·He.................. 7 7 0
Freshi................... 8 8 0
Derevko.................. 9 9 0
1987518LPF............... 10 10 0
Kirilenko-Fan............ 11 11 0
F4CU..................... 12 12 0
Blackeagle............... 13 13 0
Cooper96................. 14 14 0
traddles................. 15 15 0
New_balls_please......... 19 19 0
Drake1980................ 20 20 0
Chris 84................. 23 23 0
kfh_9118................. 26 26 0
kondrashov............... 27 27 0
Andreas ................. 28 28 0
Mynarco.................. 50 50 0
Jose..................... 51 51 0
Barktra.................. 69 69 0
ZEUS77................... 70 70 0
rvugt.................... 71 71 0
Javi..................... 72 72 0
tennisbuddy12............ 73 73 0
M.P...................... 74 74 0
Crux Squall.............. 75 75 0
Taz Warrior.............. 80 80 0
Med.Nico................. 92 92 0
zigga.................... 98 98 0
In The Zone.............. 101 101 0
Szymon................... 102 102 0
come on lena............. 106 106 0
Tennisfan26.............. 107 107 0
colemohrlee.............. 108 108 0
Wanderer................. 109 109 0
Rawb..................... 110 110 0
Daszmarelli.............. 131 131 0
rewan.................... 138 138 0
Mike..................... 145 145 0
Frenchtouch.............. 150 150 0
Rui...................... 151 151 0
smokovec................. 152 152 0
lucian_iasi.............. 153 153 0
charmedRic............... 154 154 0
Deumex................... 157 157 0
Sander................... 158 158 0
vladekCRO................ 159 159 0
Tennisfan06.............. 160 160 0
mcb...................... 163 163 0
Nando_L.................. 164 164 0
MichaelN................. 165 165 0
tim83.................... 166 166 0
Litotes.................. 167 167 0
JustPetko................ 168 168 0
tennismaster8820......... 169 169 0
LHF...................... 170 170 0
luppy55.................. 175 175 0
Aniusia.................. 176 176 0
NatP..................... 177 177 0
Bummel................... 178 178 0
GOATdin0931.............. 179 179 0
Edy...................... 180 180 0
Matts del Neri........... 181 181 0
Axel323.................. 182 182 0
salmon pants............. 183 183 0
wtatourfan............... 184 184 0
Hele..................... 187 187 0
ivanxie.................. 188 188 0
MarkNL................... 191 191 0
KittyTennis.............. 192 192 0
RiskeFan................. 193 193 0
Kev4000.................. 194 194 0
crazylace01.............. 195 195 0
Smitten.................. 196 196 0
Xiu ZhiFu................ 197 197 0
Tuckii................... 198 198 0
StarLuk.................. 199 199 0
Frederik................. 200 200 0
Uncle Jason.............. 201 201 0
Allen• .................. 202 202 0
Superior1................ 203 203 0
Cloud Nine............... 204 204 0
Flavio_Sverige........... 205 205 0
paladin.................. 206 206 0
Chrissi_like............. 207 207 0
supertec................. 210 210 0
tenisboss................ 211 211 0
lolada_4................. 212 212 0
SilverSlam............... 215 215 0
gio123................... 216 216 0
dogwonder24.............. 217 217 0
Indytennis............... 218 218 0
SodaPop.................. 219 219 0
BMT360................... 220 220 0
abollo................... 221 221 0
Zin...................... 222 222 0
Martao................... 223 223 0
Spive.................... 224 224 0
kyk710................... 225 225 0
Uranus................... 226 226 0
Ekin..................... 17 16 1
histery.................. 18 17 1
Kəv...................... 25 24 1
Extremaduratenis......... 31 30 1
Meelis................... 49 48 1
luvwilliams.............. 65 64 1
TheJoh................... 82 81 1
PinkTape................. 89 88 1
Dementieva_Dude.......... 90 89 1
Zenith................... 94 93 1
Southend Aussies......... 100 99 1
Suit Up!................. 125 124 1
Ivanovic_fan............. 126 125 1
Adrian................... 137 136 1
Sam...................... 147 146 1
MH0861................... 156 155 1
Kylger................... 162 161 1
rnwerner................. 186 185 1
Haimar................... 190 189 1
rbfilipe................. 209 208 1
cornet224................ 214 213 1
Michael!................. 37 35 2
wikuch................... 38 36 2
sdtoot................... 41 39 2
gumoll................... 45 43 2
Kevin.................... 54 52 2
^bibi^................... 55 53 2
saarsngg................. 60 58 2
FORZA SARITA............. 67 65 2
Shaddad.................. 78 76 2
DJDVD.................... 79 77 2
Vincey!.................. 84 82 2
HAOCHEN-GOAT............. 85 83 2
*Jean*................... 87 85 2
joeh37................... 105 103 2
Lord Sneeze.............. 149 147 2
SAISAI-GOAT.............. 24 21 3
buji..................... 43 40 3
Emrys.................... 47 44 3
DennisNL................. 58 55 3
Fantasy Hero............. 64 61 3
igralec33................ 97 94 3
Vitor BM................. 114 111 3
HenryMag................. 144 141 3
Mr Show.................. 174 171 3
joe87.................... 33 29 4
digor.................... 36 32 4
jrm...................... 120 115 5
mariusz_pol.............. 121 116 5
Palin6o.................. 122 117 5
martin90................. 128 123 5
goOudinUSA............... 133 128 5
Igorche.................. 68 62 6
Nightcrawl3r............. 93 87 6
tauparticle.............. 139 133 6
Allez-Alejo.............. 141 134 7

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:47 PM
You are pretty good at complaning guys. Changing from 16 to 20 technically does not mean anything and on the top of that there is no pattern which can tell who benefits from it.

(On the other hand this should have been done in advance and a lot of trolling could have been avoided)

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:55 PM
On the commitment rule, SE system and dictatorship. I definately agree, we should go back to the systems which went through on poll voting. (So lets be back to no SE at all and the one deadline (friday before Q) commitment system.)

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 12:57 PM
On WCs. I have only one question. How many WC+SE do you think it would be good for a normal International.

26 DE + 2 SE/WC + 4 Q ? (the current system)
24 DE + 4 SE/WC + 4 Q ?
0 DE + 28 SE + 4 Q ?

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:00 PM
About the new SE system. If you have time to think it through between two trolling, then you will realize that there is practically no change. 95% of the SE will go to tourney winners.

valac222
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:03 PM
Challenger YEC:

What a surprise, it goes to the best challenger players. (Who are forced to played challengers through the year)

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:20 PM
Considering that there's 300 players - it's actually a very small number.

:haha: you always say the same, only it doesn't mean that when 280 aren't posting/saying anything at all they all agree with you :haha:
It's like in politics, people who doesn't vote aren't people who support the actions of the leaders, you should know this...

You are pretty good at complaning guys. Changing from 16 to 20 technically does not mean anything and on the top of that there is no pattern which can tell who benefits from it.

(On the other hand this should have been done in advance and a lot of trolling could have been avoided)

well, I see that 33% of top 100 are gaining spots, whereas only ~ 20% of top 100-200 would gain spots. Furthermore, you as maths expert should know that a player on WTA Tour, so mostly Top 70-80, have better points as their #17, #18, #19 and #20 result than the others, who get much less for a 2nd R at an ITF as for getting in a 2nd R at a WTA.
You maybe should do a chart with total points and how much they are increasing and not ranking positions, maybe then you would understand the statement: "the richer get richer..."

On the commitment rule, SE system and dictatorship. I definately agree, we should go back to the systems which went through on poll voting. (So lets be back to no SE at all and the one deadline (friday before Q) commitment system.)

Why shouldn't there be an open decision making for something like the SE System. There were a lot of ways to make it better/more attractive/fairer, the Board still could decide in the end, but with an open disscusion there would be much less complaining.

On WCs. I have only one question. How many WC+SE do you think it would be good for a normal International.

26 DE + 2 SE/WC + 4 Q ? (the current system)
24 DE + 4 SE/WC + 4 Q ?
0 DE + 28 SE + 4 Q ?

25(26) DE + 2 SE (+WC) + 4 Q
Not so hard, I guess.
In the real tournaments, there are 3(4)WCs, and 4Qs, so it would be the same...

About the new SE system. If you have time to think it through between two trolling, then you will realize that there is practically no change. 95% of the SE will go to tourney winners

there were better ideas (IMO) but I can live with that one, too...

AdeyC
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:28 PM
:haha: you always say the same, only it doesn't mean that when 280 aren't posting/saying anything at all they all agree with you :haha:
It's like in politics, people who doesn't vote aren't people who support the actions of the leaders, you should know this...



Indeed - and it doesn't mean they agree with you either.

tim83
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:33 PM
Could somebody explain to me what's wrong with the new commitment and SE rule and why it would favour the higher ranked players?

I don't see it at all..

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:48 PM
Could somebody explain to me what's wrong with the new commitment and SE rule and why it would favour the higher ranked players?

I don't see it at all..

Huh? :confused:
New commitment rule favors the higher ranked in this way that they don't have to care whether they are in or not, and can make they schedule as they want (which is totally fine, because they earned that by being on top of the game)
the problem with the new rule is that it harms lower ranked players. I can only speak for myself, but I commited to more than one tournament per week, as I was always on verge on getting into Q. Furthermore I was also on verge on getting into Q/MD in doubles. With commiting to more tournaments, I could decide last minute (one or two days) prior to the final and last deadline where I want to play, as till then, most of the players already decided to withdraw/change the tournament.
Now this isn't possible anymore and I have to commit to a tournament with the danger that I can end in ALTs, or just play ITFs all season long, till my rank is in the 50ies (what is nearly impossible) to be safe in the MDs of some INT. Even than, it's not safe at all. That's why the new rule harms the lower ranked players, especially the ones between 80-120 and lower.

the new SE is okay, I think it's more about how it was done than about the system. But I didn't hear that someone said that SE favors higher ranked players? :unsure:

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:49 PM
Indeed - and it doesn't mean they agree with you either.

:spit: y r u so prssd?

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:51 PM
and for all who say that I can make ELs on my own:

That's not my job as player, this is the manager's job!

AdeyC
Nov 24th, 2014, 01:55 PM
:spit: y r u so prssd?

What is prssd?

Michael!
Nov 24th, 2014, 02:12 PM
Well, my dear friend, I see a lot of others how complain, too. Jean, Ruben, Paul, the Aussies (hope it's not racist :rolleyes:), others and me. Only that I comment most of it, doesn't mean, I'm the only one who doesn't like many of your actions. (see Paul's and Ruben's post). Why don't you reply to these posts?
Why don't you reply to my post about Challenger YEC, and so on.
Du pickst dir nur die Rosinen raus und das wars dann...anyway, you will get a PM soon from me :bounce:


About the Challenger YEC, I replied to that before, Laszlo replied to it as well, but all you can do is complain further, donīt get me wrong, it is your right to complain but we got your opinion already, there is no need to complain over and over again about the same things.

Adrian.
Nov 24th, 2014, 02:40 PM
About the Challenger YEC, I replied to that before, Laszlo replied to it as well, but all you can do is complain further, donīt get me wrong, it is your right to complain but we got your opinion already, there is no need to complain over and over again about the same things.

where is your statement about mine, pointing out that challenger YEC is for players who are already way in top 100, even top 60, which makes the event IMO useless.
and no, I'm not against everything and everyone, like you said, I'm stating my opinion, more than others maybe, but I don't see a problem in that. do you? :hug:

Michael!
Nov 24th, 2014, 02:49 PM
where is your statement about mine, pointing out that challenger YEC is for players who are already way in top 100, even top 60, which makes the event IMO useless.
and no, I'm not against everything and everyone, like you said, I'm stating my opinion, more than others maybe, but I don't see a problem in that. do you? :hug:

Challenger YEC is for players who play challengers throughout the whole year, for lower ranked players, who started the year with a low ranking or maybe no ranking at all, then slowly improve with good challenger results and then get the chance to play the YEC as a final highlight of a good season, so I do think that this is a good thing for lower ranked players, beside that we have the SE system, so everyone who won a title or had 2-3 good weeks in a row gets a SE for an International tournament, even if that person just started playing and has no ranking at all and if the SE is not needed because the ranking of a player is good enough to get into an International without it, then the SE goes over to the next person of the race ranking, so I do think that both (Challenger YEC and SEs) are good things for lower ranked players, Challenger players or even newbies, yes!
Beside that we have the LE Top 30 rules, with the new rule that those even wonīt be able to be seeded anymore in QD and MD and we some years ago we added many tournaments during the Off Season to have weekly TT play throughout the whole year and we give out 150 points for every Challenger, doesnīt matter if 10k or 100k..and about the deadlines, before we had only one deadline one day before Q started, so that wasnīt better for lower ranked players for sure. so I stated my opinoon, you stated yours, rules for 2015 are clear, no need to reply anymore to this statement, thank you!

Meelis
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:18 PM
challenger YEC is for players who are already way in top 100, even top 60, which makes the event IMO useless

It's inevitable. Best challengers players will have a decent rankings thanks to their performances during the year. It's same irl. The following players played ATP Challenger Tour Finals last week: #60 Bolelli, #77 Schwartzman, #80 Estrella, #86 Rola etc.

Meelis
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:30 PM
You maybe should do a chart with total points and how much they are increasing and not ranking positions, maybe then you would understand the statement: "the richer get richer..."

Results 17-20 compared to 1-16...


CR 1-16 17-20 % increase
1 36 digor 1731 205 11,84
2 93 Nightcrawl3r 890 104 11,69
3 33 joe87 1775 193 10,87
4 141 Allez-Alejo 517 56 10,83
5 24 SAISAI-GOAT 1990 205 10,30
6 54 Kevin. 1437 148 10,30
7 133 goOudinUSA 561 56 9,98
8 128 martin90 600 56 9,33
9 122 Palin6o 640 56 8,75
10 121 mariusz_pol 644 56 8,70
11 78 Shaddad 1077 93 8,64
12 97 igralec33 874 74 8,47
13 51 Jose. 1480 120 8,11
14 68 Igorche 1308 105 8,03
15 120 jrm 649 52 8,01
16 58 DennisNL 1407 112 7,96
17 49 Meelis 1510 120 7,95
18 94 Zenith. 890 68 7,64
19 110 Rawb 736 56 7,61
20 109 Wanderer 738 56 7,59
21 108 colemohrlee 743 56 7,54
22 50 Mynarco 1508 113 7,49
23 100 Southend Aussies 855 64 7,49
24 107 Tennisfan26 751 56 7,46
25 101 In The Zone 849 62 7,30
26 55 ^bibi^ 1429 104 7,28
27 79 DJDVD 1076 78 7,25
28 126 Ivanovic_fan 608 44 7,24
29 43 buji 1655 119 7,19
30 106 come on lena 781 56 7,17
31 41 sdtoot 1660 118 7,11
32 87 *Jean* 963 68 7,06
33 144 HenryMag. 510 36 7,06
34 64 Fantasy Hero 1337 94 7,03
35 60 saarsngg 1367 96 7,02
36 48 Buitenzorg 1520 104 6,84
37 84 Vincey! 1009 69 6,84
38 47 Emrys 1565 106 6,77
39 38 wikuch 1714 116 6,77
40 37 Michael! 1726 116 6,72
41 26 kfh_9118 1945 130 6,68
42 139 tauparticle 540 36 6,67
43 105 joeh37 843 56 6,64
44 102 Szymon 846 56 6,62
45 99 Chilenaitor 857 56 6,53
46 85 HAOCHEN-GOAT 1001 65 6,49
47 74 M.P 1171 76 6,49
48 98 zigga 869 56 6,44
49 31 Extremaduratenis 1835 118 6,43
50 95 sd3300123 879 56 6,37
51 96 Broseghini 879 56 6,37
52 67 FORZA SARITA 1311 83 6,33
53 12 F4CU 2782 175 6,29
54 92 Med.Nico 909 56 6,16
55 25 Kəv. 1968 120 6,10
56 90 Dementieva_Dude 922 56 6,07
57 89 PinkTape 925 56 6,05
58 152 smokovec 447 27 6,04
59 156 MH0861 404 24 5,94
60 65 luvwilliams 1333 79 5,93
61 82 TheJoh 1028 60 5,84
62 40 valac222 1665 96 5,77
63 4 mateusz2904 4254 245 5,76
64 39 Milan. 1674 96 5,73
65 114 Vitor BM 710 38 5,35
66 75 Crux Squall 1145 61 5,33
67 80 Taz Warrior 1062 56 5,27
68 18 histery 2248 118 5,25
69 69 Barktra 1220 64 5,25
70 23 Chris 84 2010 98 4,88
71 71 rvugt 1204 58 4,82
72 77 ESimp 1089 52 4,78
73 17 Ekin 2305 110 4,77
74 131 Daszmarelli 568 27 4,75
75 103 Royals. 844 40 4,74
76 73 tennisbuddy12 1194 56 4,69
77 72 Javi. 1199 56 4,67
78 70 ZEUS77 1215 56 4,61
79 53 MikBs 1458 66 4,53
80 1 Inger67 5295 235 4,44
81 2 AdeyC 5280 230 4,36
82 45 gumoll 1633 69 4,23
83 116 Idemo 668 28 4,19
84 11 Kirilenko-Fan 2896 120 4,14
85 61 hessie 1357 56 4,13
86 137 Adrian. 546 22 4,03
87 237 HawkAussie 50 2 4,00
88 56 Hapsara 1422 56 3,94
89 3 Freak3yman84 4613 180 3,90
90 14 Cooper96 2530 98 3,87
91 28 Andreas 1918 72 3,75
92 125 Suit Up! 629 23 3,66
93 216 gio123 110 4 3,64
94 19 New_balls_please 2168 76 3,51
95 5 ALYOUNA 4169 145 3,48
96 59 shuai.P 1384 48 3,47
97 35 Heinann 1768 60 3,39
98 213 Chris93 118 4 3,39
99 214 cornet224 118 4 3,39
100 91 Sasja 915 31 3,39
101 6 Christork17 3695 125 3,38
102 118 Vefci Y 663 22 3,32
103 88 Sabinator. 939 31 3,30
104 27 kondrashov 1940 64 3,30
105 138 rewan 541 17 3,14
106 46 andyroddlick 1594 50 3,14
107 112 catgamer 721 22 3,05
108 62 iPatty 1350 41 3,04
109 66 coolfish1103 1320 40 3,03
110 210 supertec 132 4 3,03
111 52 Elwin. 1470 44 2,99
112 151 Rui. 463 13 2,81
113 205 Flavio_Sverige 143 4 2,80
114 32 chenhw 1827 48 2,63
115 186 rnwerner 233 6 2,58
116 15 traddles 2495 64 2,57
117 149 Lord Sneeze 475 12 2,53
118 111 matthias 730 18 2,47
119 119 flareon 659 16 2,43
120 13 Blackeagle 2604 62 2,38
121 30 pedropt 1883 44 2,34
122 150 Frenchtouch 471 11 2,34
123 195 crazylace01 178 4 2,25
124 162 Kylger 362 8 2,21
125 20 Drake1980 2167 45 2,08
126 174 Mr Show 301 6 1,99
127 22 randy72391 2040 40 1,96
128 163 mcb 359 7 1,95
129 154 charmedRic 432 8 1,85
130 135 Gu-niao 550 10 1,82
131 29 petey_pan 1904 34 1,79
132 160 Tennisfan06 393 7 1,78
133 194 Kev4000 187 3 1,60
134 130 simonsaystennis 573 9 1,57
135 57 Joaquin 1415 22 1,55
136 157 Deumex 404 6 1,49
137 147 Sam. 484 7 1,45
138 124 The Walking Bye 632 9 1,42
139 190 Haimar 220 3 1,36
140 175 luppy55 297 4 1,35
141 44 safinfans629 1642 22 1,34
142 10 1987518LPF 3084 40 1,30
143 170 LHF 323 4 1,24
144 169 tennismaster8820 326 4 1,23
145 199 StarLuk 164 2 1,22
146 168 JustPetko 341 4 1,17
147 127 Effy 606 7 1,16
148 165 MichaelN 354 4 1,13
149 153 lucian_iasi 446 5 1,12
150 161 Spencer. 363 4 1,10
151 115 killerqueen 679 7 1,03
152 158 Sander. 403 4 0,99
153 155 CibulkaNa. 413 4 0,97
154 16 feifei 2309 22 0,95
155 7 Jaco·He 3478 31 0,89
156 148 diego36arg 479 4 0,84
157 145 Mike. 488 4 0,82
158 143 Swanny006 514 4 0,78
159 142 Martn7 515 4 0,78
160 181 Matts del Neri 259 2 0,77
161 140 WhoAmI? 540 4 0,74
162 136 Alycia. 548 4 0,73
163 132 Cheda 16.17 564 4 0,71
164 129 BlackPanther. 597 4 0,67
165 123 Phil=) 636 4 0,63
166 117 Monzanator 667 4 0,60
167 166 tim83 352 2 0,57
168 113 Connect_HR 715 4 0,56
169 104 Curcubeu 844 4 0,47
170 191 MarkNL 214 1 0,47
171 86 PAVANILAI 966 4 0,41
172 34 LCS 1775 7 0,39
173 83 Elzy Gano 1021 4 0,39
174 81 ViceUltramontain 1041 4 0,38
175 76 Felipe Abe 1115 4 0,36
176 171 a1canada 304 1 0,33
177 63 xieergai 1339 4 0,30
178 42 jasonchou 1658 4 0,24
179 9 Derevko 3119 6 0,19
180 21 garyyoung 2139 4 0,19
181 8 Freshi 3175 4 0,13
182 134 LefandePatty 552 0 0,00
183 146 sfar 485 0 0,00
184 159 vladekCRO 402 0 0,00
185 164 Nando_L 359 0 0,00
186 167 Litotes 352 0 0,00
187 172 prima donna 303 0 0,00
188 173 peanuts 303 0 0,00
189 176 Aniusia 289 0 0,00
190 177 NatP 286 0 0,00
191 178 Bummel 278 0 0,00
192 179 GOATdin0931 276 0 0,00
193 180 Edy. 266 0 0,00
194 182 Axel323 254 0 0,00
195 183 salmon pants. 245 0 0,00
196 184 wtatourfan 242 0 0,00
197 185 Vaxey 234 0 0,00
198 187 Hele. 229 0 0,00
199 188 ivanxie 226 0 0,00
200 189 FedererForever 223 0 0,00
201 192 KittyTennis 208 0 0,00
202 193 RiskeFan 195 0 0,00
203 196 Smitten 178 0 0,00
204 197 Xiu ZhiFu 177 0 0,00
205 198 Tuckii 170 0 0,00
206 200 Frederik 164 0 0,00
207 201 Uncle Jason 159 0 0,00
208 202 Allen• 154 0 0,00
209 203 Superior1 152 0 0,00
210 204 Cloud Nine 149 0 0,00
211 206 paladin 140 0 0,00
212 207 Chrissi_like 138 0 0,00
213 208 jankimfan 137 0 0,00
214 209 rbfilipe 137 0 0,00
215 211 tenisboss 131 0 0,00
216 212 lolada_4 129 0 0,00
217 215 SilverSlam 114 0 0,00
218 217 dogwonder24 108 0 0,00
219 218 Indytennis 106 0 0,00
220 219 SodaPop 102 0 0,00
221 220 BMT360 90 0 0,00
222 221 abollo 83 0 0,00
223 222 Zin 82 0 0,00
224 223 Martao 80 0 0,00
225 224 Spive 78 0 0,00
226 225 kyk710 76 0 0,00
227 226 Uranus 74 0 0,00
228 227 Medina 73 0 0,00
229 228 Nicolas 71 0 0,00
230 229 njnetswill 70 0 0,00
231 230 AlissonValerio 70 0 0,00
232 231 Hedwig 64 0 0,00
233 232 TheDevMiester 62 0 0,00
234 233 infinite 62 0 0,00
235 234 Capriati Rules 60 0 0,00
236 235 winnermax 51 0 0,00
237 236 Aiden 51 0 0,00
238 238 Leif 50 0 0,00
239 239 Alexmonteiro 49 0 0,00
240 240 bry17may 48 0 0,00
241 241 databol 45 0 0,00
242 242 vanM1 42 0 0,00
243 243 SVK 40 0 0,00
244 244 alex_k 40 0 0,00
245 245 Slutiana 38 0 0,00
246 246 eDonkey 35 0 0,00
247 247 Don_Corleone 34 0 0,00
248 248 xoxRJ 32 0 0,00
249 249 Bino 31 0 0,00
250 250 Zumzzet 30 0 0,00
251 251 wubenzhimu 29 0 0,00
252 252 Chaosm21 28 0 0,00
253 253 MaSharp 27 0 0,00
254 254 .Andrew. 25 0 0,00
255 255 vexxx 24 0 0,00
256 256 Marcus1979 23 0 0,00
257 257 Endru. 22 0 0,00
258 258 Petkorazzi 22 0 0,00
259 259 ViennaCalling 22 0 0,00
260 260 Arnauddr 22 0 0,00
261 261 Ballbasher 20 0 0,00
262 262 Juanes 20 0 0,00
263 263 Miracle Worker 20 0 0,00
264 264 Pisces0304 20 0 0,00
265 265 Rik. 20 0 0,00
266 266 Daniela-Is-Mine 18 0 0,00
267 267 Slazorin 16 0 0,00
268 268 Merxes 12 0 0,00
269 269 Poldo 12 0 0,00
270 270 Uranium 11 0 0,00
271 271 slavasays 8 0 0,00
272 272 jezhead 7 0 0,00
273 273 RedKop 7 0 0,00
274 274 chowdahead 6 0 0,00
275 275 wujianwei 6 0 0,00
276 276 Ianto_Jones 5 0 0,00
277 277 JustinSW 5 0 0,00
278 278 Banditoo 4 0 0,00
279 279 VamosArgentina 4 0 0,00
280 280 Hugues Daniel 4 0 0,00
281 281 danyal123 3 0 0,00
282 282 delicatecutter 2 0 0,00
283 283 Jarl_02 2 0 0,00
284 284 Kingpova 2 0 0,00
285 285 Setsuna. 2 0 0,00
286 286 Gaoxing 2 0 0,00
287 287 Mikl 2 0 0,00
288 288 PatsyStone 2 0 0,00
289 289 Queen Vika 2 0 0,00
290 290 tennisbetter 2 0 0,00
291 291 ĪCharlDaĪ 1 0 0,00
292 292 Aussieadz 1 0 0,00
293 293 Bencicco 1 0 0,00
294 294 fgab 1 0 0,00
295 295 GoofyDuck 1 0 0,00
296 296 goroos1994 1 0 0,00
297 297 heart 1 0 0,00
298 298 rlopen 1 0 0,00

Meelis
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:43 PM
And this is how many points everyone gains with best 20 instead of best 16

1 4 mateusz2904 245
2 1 Inger67 235
3 2 AdeyC 230
4 36 digor 205
5 24 SAISAI-GOAT 205
6 33 joe87 193
7 3 Freak3yman84 180
8 12 F4CU 175
9 54 Kevin. 148
10 5 ALYOUNA 145
11 26 kfh_9118 130
12 6 Christork17 125
13 51 Jose. 120
14 49 Meelis 120
15 25 Kəv. 120
16 11 Kirilenko-Fan 120
17 43 buji 119
18 41 sdtoot 118
19 31 Extremaduratenis 118
20 18 histery 118
21 38 wikuch 116
22 37 Michael! 116
23 50 Mynarco 113
24 58 DennisNL 112
25 17 Ekin 110
26 47 Emrys 106
27 68 Igorche 105
28 93 Nightcrawl3r 104
29 55 ^bibi^ 104
30 48 Buitenzorg 104
31 23 Chris 84 98
32 14 Cooper96 98
33 60 saarsngg 96
34 40 valac222 96
35 39 Milan. 96
36 64 Fantasy Hero 94
37 78 Shaddad 93
38 67 FORZA SARITA 83
39 65 luvwilliams 79
40 79 DJDVD 78
41 74 M.P 76
42 19 New_balls_please 76
43 97 igralec33 74
44 28 Andreas 72
45 84 Vincey! 69
46 45 gumoll 69
47 94 Zenith. 68
48 87 *Jean* 68
49 53 MikBs 66
50 85 HAOCHEN-GOAT 65
51 100 Southend Aussies 64
52 69 Barktra 64
53 27 kondrashov 64
54 15 traddles 64
55 101 In The Zone 62
56 13 Blackeagle 62
57 75 Crux Squall 61
58 82 TheJoh 60
59 35 Heinann 60
60 71 rvugt 58
61 141 Allez-Alejo 56
62 133 goOudinUSA 56
63 128 martin90 56
64 122 Palin6o 56
65 121 mariusz_pol 56
66 110 Rawb 56
67 109 Wanderer 56
68 108 colemohrlee 56
69 107 Tennisfan26 56
70 106 come on lena 56
71 105 joeh37 56
72 102 Szymon 56
73 99 Chilenaitor 56
74 98 zigga 56
75 95 sd3300123 56
76 96 Broseghini 56
77 92 Med.Nico 56
78 90 Dementieva_Dude 56
79 89 PinkTape 56
80 80 Taz Warrior 56
81 73 tennisbuddy12 56
82 72 Javi. 56
83 70 ZEUS77 56
84 61 hessie 56
85 56 Hapsara 56
86 120 jrm 52
87 77 ESimp 52
88 46 andyroddlick 50
89 59 shuai.P 48
90 32 chenhw 48
91 20 Drake1980 45
92 126 Ivanovic_fan 44
93 52 Elwin. 44
94 30 pedropt 44
95 62 iPatty 41
96 103 Royals. 40
97 66 coolfish1103 40
98 22 randy72391 40
99 10 1987518LPF 40
100 114 Vitor BM 38
101 144 HenryMag. 36
102 139 tauparticle 36
103 29 petey_pan 34
104 91 Sasja 31
105 88 Sabinator. 31
106 7 Jaco·He 31
107 116 Idemo 28
108 152 smokovec 27
109 131 Daszmarelli 27
110 156 MH0861 24
111 125 Suit Up! 23
112 137 Adrian. 22
113 118 Vefci Y 22
114 112 catgamer 22
115 57 Joaquin 22
116 44 safinfans629 22
117 16 feifei 22
118 111 matthias 18
119 138 rewan 17
120 119 flareon 16
121 151 Rui. 13
122 149 Lord Sneeze 12
123 150 Frenchtouch 11
124 135 Gu-niao 10
125 130 simonsaystennis 9
126 124 The Walking Bye 9
127 162 Kylger 8
128 154 charmedRic 8
129 163 mcb 7
130 160 Tennisfan06 7
131 147 Sam. 7
132 127 Effy 7
133 115 killerqueen 7
134 34 LCS 7
135 186 rnwerner 6
136 174 Mr Show 6
137 157 Deumex 6
138 9 Derevko 6
139 153 lucian_iasi 5
140 216 gio123 4
141 213 Chris93 4
142 214 cornet224 4
143 210 supertec 4
144 205 Flavio_Sverige 4
145 195 crazylace01 4
146 175 luppy55 4
147 170 LHF 4
148 169 tennismaster8820 4
149 168 JustPetko 4
150 165 MichaelN 4
151 161 Spencer. 4
152 158 Sander. 4
153 155 CibulkaNa. 4
154 148 diego36arg 4
155 145 Mike. 4
156 143 Swanny006 4
157 142 Martn7 4
158 140 WhoAmI? 4
159 136 Alycia. 4
160 132 Cheda 16.17 4
161 129 BlackPanther. 4
162 123 Phil=) 4
163 117 Monzanator 4
164 113 Connect_HR 4
165 104 Curcubeu 4
166 86 PAVANILAI 4
167 83 Elzy Gano 4
168 81 ViceUltramontain 4
169 76 Felipe Abe 4
170 63 xieergai 4
171 42 jasonchou 4
172 21 garyyoung 4
173 8 Freshi 4
174 194 Kev4000 3
175 190 Haimar 3
176 237 HawkAussie 2
177 199 StarLuk 2
178 181 Matts del Neri 2
179 166 tim83 2
180 191 MarkNL 1
181 171 a1canada 1

Michael!
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:44 PM
1 36 digor 1731 205 11,84
2 93 Nightcrawl3r 890 104 11,69
3 33 joe87 1775 193 10,87
4 141 Allez-Alejo 517 56 10,83
5 24 SAISAI-GOAT 1990 205 10,30
6 54 Kevin. 1437 148 10,30
7 133 goOudinUSA 561 56 9,98
8 128 martin90 600 56 9,33
9 122 Palin6o 640 56 8,75
10 121 mariusz_pol 644 56 8,70

Not even one top 20 player in the top 10 here but 5 players who arenīt even top 100, thanks Meelis :yeah:

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:52 PM
And this is how many points everyone gains with best 20 instead of best 16

1 4 mateusz2904 245
2 1 Inger67 235
3 2 AdeyC 230
4 36 digor 205
5 24 SAISAI-GOAT 205
6 33 joe87 193
7 3 Freak3yman84 180
8 12 F4CU 175
9 54 Kevin. 148
10 5 ALYOUNA 145
11 26 kfh_9118 130
12 6 Christork17 125
13 51 Jose. 120
14 49 Meelis 120
15 25 Kəv. 120
16 11 Kirilenko-Fan 120
17 43 buji 119
18 41 sdtoot 118
19 31 Extremaduratenis 118
20 18 histery 118
21 38 wikuch 116
22 37 Michael! 116
23 50 Mynarco 113
24 58 DennisNL 112
25 17 Ekin 110
26 47 Emrys 106
27 68 Igorche 105
28 93 Nightcrawl3r 104
29 55 ^bibi^ 104
30 48 Buitenzorg 104
31 23 Chris 84 98
32 14 Cooper96 98
33 60 saarsngg 96
34 40 valac222 96
35 39 Milan. 96
36 64 Fantasy Hero 94
37 78 Shaddad 93
38 67 FORZA SARITA 83
39 65 luvwilliams 79
40 79 DJDVD 78
41 74 M.P 76
42 19 New_balls_please 76
43 97 igralec33 74
44 28 Andreas 72
45 84 Vincey! 69
46 45 gumoll 69
47 94 Zenith. 68
48 87 *Jean* 68
49 53 MikBs 66
50 85 HAOCHEN-GOAT 65
51 100 Southend Aussies 64
52 69 Barktra 64
53 27 kondrashov 64
54 15 traddles 64
55 101 In The Zone 62
56 13 Blackeagle 62
57 75 Crux Squall 61
58 82 TheJoh 60
59 35 Heinann 60
60 71 rvugt 58
61 141 Allez-Alejo 56
62 133 goOudinUSA 56
63 128 martin90 56
64 122 Palin6o 56
65 121 mariusz_pol 56
66 110 Rawb 56
67 109 Wanderer 56
68 108 colemohrlee 56
69 107 Tennisfan26 56
70 106 come on lena 56
71 105 joeh37 56
72 102 Szymon 56
73 99 Chilenaitor 56
74 98 zigga 56
75 95 sd3300123 56
76 96 Broseghini 56
77 92 Med.Nico 56
78 90 Dementieva_Dude 56
79 89 PinkTape 56
80 80 Taz Warrior 56
81 73 tennisbuddy12 56
82 72 Javi. 56
83 70 ZEUS77 56
84 61 hessie 56
85 56 Hapsara 56
86 120 jrm 52
87 77 ESimp 52
88 46 andyroddlick 50
89 59 shuai.P 48
90 32 chenhw 48
91 20 Drake1980 45
92 126 Ivanovic_fan 44
93 52 Elwin. 44
94 30 pedropt 44
95 62 iPatty 41
96 103 Royals. 40
97 66 coolfish1103 40
98 22 randy72391 40
99 10 1987518LPF 40
100 114 Vitor BM 38
101 144 HenryMag. 36
102 139 tauparticle 36
103 29 petey_pan 34
104 91 Sasja 31
105 88 Sabinator. 31
106 7 Jaco·He 31
107 116 Idemo 28
108 152 smokovec 27
109 131 Daszmarelli 27
110 156 MH0861 24
111 125 Suit Up! 23
112 137 Adrian. 22
113 118 Vefci Y 22
114 112 catgamer 22
115 57 Joaquin 22
116 44 safinfans629 22
117 16 feifei 22
118 111 matthias 18
119 138 rewan 17
120 119 flareon 16
121 151 Rui. 13
122 149 Lord Sneeze 12
123 150 Frenchtouch 11
124 135 Gu-niao 10
125 130 simonsaystennis 9
126 124 The Walking Bye 9
127 162 Kylger 8
128 154 charmedRic 8
129 163 mcb 7
130 160 Tennisfan06 7
131 147 Sam. 7
132 127 Effy 7
133 115 killerqueen 7
134 34 LCS 7
135 186 rnwerner 6
136 174 Mr Show 6
137 157 Deumex 6
138 9 Derevko 6
139 153 lucian_iasi 5
140 216 gio123 4
141 213 Chris93 4
142 214 cornet224 4
143 210 supertec 4
144 205 Flavio_Sverige 4
145 195 crazylace01 4
146 175 luppy55 4
147 170 LHF 4
148 169 tennismaster8820 4
149 168 JustPetko 4
150 165 MichaelN 4
151 161 Spencer. 4
152 158 Sander. 4
153 155 CibulkaNa. 4
154 148 diego36arg 4
155 145 Mike. 4
156 143 Swanny006 4
157 142 Martn7 4
158 140 WhoAmI? 4
159 136 Alycia. 4
160 132 Cheda 16.17 4
161 129 BlackPanther. 4
162 123 Phil=) 4
163 117 Monzanator 4
164 113 Connect_HR 4
165 104 Curcubeu 4
166 86 PAVANILAI 4
167 83 Elzy Gano 4
168 81 ViceUltramontain 4
169 76 Felipe Abe 4
170 63 xieergai 4
171 42 jasonchou 4
172 21 garyyoung 4
173 8 Freshi 4
174 194 Kev4000 3
175 190 Haimar 3
176 237 HawkAussie 2
177 199 StarLuk 2
178 181 Matts del Neri 2
179 166 tim83 2
180 191 MarkNL 1
181 171 a1canada 1



so when is the top 20 taking effect again :confused: :p

in next week's liveranking Adey leads Inger by 5 points so this could make a difference in the #1 ranking :eek: :tape:

Meelis
Nov 24th, 2014, 05:55 PM
so when is the top 20 taking effect again :confused: :p

First rankings of 2015.

kfh_9118
Nov 25th, 2014, 08:41 AM
One thing I disagree with the board's decision is to allow players who played Fed Cup to earn points by playing other tournaments in the same week.

What's the purpose/reason for this actually?
To keep Fed Cup more attractive to players or what?

Just feel a bit unrealistic that someone can play two tournaments on the same week.

The Walking Bye
Nov 25th, 2014, 08:52 AM
I have to agree, I only complain when I think it's unfair, but despite not being a board member, Adrian easily dominates this thread with his posts. Some are arguable, but a lot are just moaning for the sake of moaning, and despite a few not-well-thought-our rules they do their job well.

FORZA SARITA
Nov 25th, 2014, 02:06 PM
One thing I disagree with the board's decision is to allow players who played Fed Cup to earn points by playing other tournaments in the same week.

What's the purpose/reason for this actually?
To keep Fed Cup more attractive to players or what?

Just feel a bit unrealistic that someone can play two tournaments on the same week.

this! i don't even remember people discussed about playing FC and a tournament in the same week so where it came from this rule :confused: it was really not necessary...

Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

valac222
Nov 25th, 2014, 02:20 PM
this! i don't even remember people discussed about playing FC and a tournament in the same week so where it came from this rule :confused: it was really not necessary...



The only thing which was discussed (requested) was that players wanted to gain ranking points for playing FEDCUP (like it is the case for DAVIS CUP). So the board decided not to give ranking points for FED CUP, but does not want to punish FEDCUP players therefore allowed 2 tournament on those weeks.

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 02:38 PM
Not even one top 20 player in the top 10 here but 5 players who arenīt even top 100, thanks Meelis :yeah:

% doesn't mean anything :spit:

Just let me look at this post and say the following:

And this is how many points everyone gains with best 20 instead of best 16

1 4 mateusz2904 245
2 1 Inger67 235
3 2 AdeyC 230
4 36 digor 205
5 24 SAISAI-GOAT 205
6 33 joe87 193
7 3 Freak3yman84 180
8 12 F4CU 175
9 54 Kevin. 148
10 5 ALYOUNA 145
11 26 kfh_9118 130
12 6 Christork17 125
13 51 Jose. 120
14 49 Meelis 120
15 25 Kəv. 120
16 11 Kirilenko-Fan 120
17 43 buji 119
18 41 sdtoot 118
19 31 Extremaduratenis 118
20 18 histery 118
21 38 wikuch 116
22 37 Michael! 116
23 50 Mynarco 113
24 58 DennisNL 112
25 17 Ekin 110
26 47 Emrys 106
27 68 Igorche 105
28 93 Nightcrawl3r 104
29 55 ^bibi^ 104
30 48 Buitenzorg 104
31 23 Chris 84 98
32 14 Cooper96 98
33 60 saarsngg 96
34 40 valac222 96
35 39 Milan. 96
36 64 Fantasy Hero 94
37 78 Shaddad 93
38 67 FORZA SARITA 83
39 65 luvwilliams 79
40 79 DJDVD 78
41 74 M.P 76
42 19 New_balls_please 76
43 97 igralec33 74
44 28 Andreas 72
45 84 Vincey! 69
46 45 gumoll 69
47 94 Zenith. 68
48 87 *Jean* 68
49 53 MikBs 66
50 85 HAOCHEN-GOAT 65
51 100 Southend Aussies 64
52 69 Barktra 64
53 27 kondrashov 64
54 15 traddles 64
55 101 In The Zone 62
56 13 Blackeagle 62
57 75 Crux Squall 61
58 82 TheJoh 60
59 35 Heinann 60
60 71 rvugt 58
61 141 Allez-Alejo 56
62 133 goOudinUSA 56
63 128 martin90 56
64 122 Palin6o 56
65 121 mariusz_pol 56
66 110 Rawb 56
67 109 Wanderer 56
68 108 colemohrlee 56
69 107 Tennisfan26 56
70 106 come on lena 56
71 105 joeh37 56
72 102 Szymon 56
73 99 Chilenaitor 56
74 98 zigga 56
75 95 sd3300123 56
76 96 Broseghini 56
77 92 Med.Nico 56
78 90 Dementieva_Dude 56
79 89 PinkTape 56
80 80 Taz Warrior 56
81 73 tennisbuddy12 56
82 72 Javi. 56
83 70 ZEUS77 56
84 61 hessie 56
85 56 Hapsara 56
86 120 jrm 52
87 77 ESimp 52
88 46 andyroddlick 50
89 59 shuai.P 48
90 32 chenhw 48
91 20 Drake1980 45
92 126 Ivanovic_fan 44
93 52 Elwin. 44
94 30 pedropt 44
95 62 iPatty 41
96 103 Royals. 40
97 66 coolfish1103 40
98 22 randy72391 40
99 10 1987518LPF 40
100 114 Vitor BM 38
101 144 HenryMag. 36
102 139 tauparticle 36
103 29 petey_pan 34
104 91 Sasja 31
105 88 Sabinator. 31
106 7 Jaco·He 31
107 116 Idemo 28
108 152 smokovec 27
109 131 Daszmarelli 27
110 156 MH0861 24
111 125 Suit Up! 23
112 137 Adrian. 22
113 118 Vefci Y 22
114 112 catgamer 22
115 57 Joaquin 22
116 44 safinfans629 22
117 16 feifei 22
118 111 matthias 18
119 138 rewan 17
120 119 flareon 16
121 151 Rui. 13
122 149 Lord Sneeze 12
123 150 Frenchtouch 11
124 135 Gu-niao 10
125 130 simonsaystennis 9
126 124 The Walking Bye 9
127 162 Kylger 8
128 154 charmedRic 8
129 163 mcb 7
130 160 Tennisfan06 7
131 147 Sam. 7
132 127 Effy 7
133 115 killerqueen 7
134 34 LCS 7
135 186 rnwerner 6
136 174 Mr Show 6
137 157 Deumex 6
138 9 Derevko 6
139 153 lucian_iasi 5
140 216 gio123 4
141 213 Chris93 4
142 214 cornet224 4
143 210 supertec 4
144 205 Flavio_Sverige 4
145 195 crazylace01 4
146 175 luppy55 4
147 170 LHF 4
148 169 tennismaster8820 4
149 168 JustPetko 4
150 165 MichaelN 4
151 161 Spencer. 4
152 158 Sander. 4
153 155 CibulkaNa. 4
154 148 diego36arg 4
155 145 Mike. 4
156 143 Swanny006 4
157 142 Martn7 4
158 140 WhoAmI? 4
159 136 Alycia. 4
160 132 Cheda 16.17 4
161 129 BlackPanther. 4
162 123 Phil=) 4
163 117 Monzanator 4
164 113 Connect_HR 4
165 104 Curcubeu 4
166 86 PAVANILAI 4
167 83 Elzy Gano 4
168 81 ViceUltramontain 4
169 76 Felipe Abe 4
170 63 xieergai 4
171 42 jasonchou 4
172 21 garyyoung 4
173 8 Freshi 4
174 194 Kev4000 3
175 190 Haimar 3
176 237 HawkAussie 2
177 199 StarLuk 2
178 181 Matts del Neri 2
179 166 tim83 2
180 191 MarkNL 1
181 171 a1canada 1



#1 Inger has now 5295 points + 235 = 5530
#30 pedropt has now 1883 points + 44 = 1927
#60 saarsngg has now 1367 points + 96 = 1463
#100 Southend Aussies has now 855 + 64 = 919
#120 jrm has now 649 + 52 = 701
#150 Frenchtouch has now 471 + 11 = 482
#200 Frederik has now 164 + 0 = 164

Differences:

Best of 16:

#1 <- #30 = 3412 points
#1 <- #60 = 3928 points
#1 <- #100 = 4440 points
#1 <- #120 = 4646 points
#1 <- #150 = 4824 points
#1 <- #200 = 5131 points

---

#30 <- #60 = 516 points
#60 <- #100 = 512 points
#100 <- #120 = 206 points
#120 <- #150 = 178 points
#150 <- #200 = 307 points
#60 <- #150 = 896 points
#100 <- #150 = 384 points
#100 <- #200 = 691 points


Best of 20:

#1 <- #30 = 3603 points (+191)
#1 <- #60 = 4067 points (+139)
#1 <- #100 = 4611 points (+171)
#1 <- #120 = 4829 points (+183)
#1 <- #150 = 5048 points (+224)
#1 <- #200 = 5366 points (+235)

---

#30 <- #60 = 464 points (-52)
#60 <- #100 = 544 points (+32)
#100 <- #120 = 218 points (+12)
#120 <- #150 = 219 points (+41)
#150 <- #200 = 318 points (+11)
#60 <- #150 = 981 points (+85)
#100 <- #150 = 437 points (+53)
#100 <- #200 = 755 points (+64)

No matter which rank you are, you are losing POINTS to the higher ranked player. Of course, more to the top players (1-20) than to #131, but as you can see, even among lower ranked players, the difference is quite big.

So now tell me that Best of 20 doesn't favor the higher ranked more...:wavey:

Crux Squall
Nov 25th, 2014, 03:55 PM
% doesn't mean anything :spit:

Just let me look at this post and say the following:



#1 Inger has now 5295 points + 235 = 5530
#30 pedropt has now 1883 points + 44 = 1927
#60 saarsngg has now 1367 points + 96 = 1463
#100 Southend Aussies has now 855 + 64 = 919
#120 jrm has now 649 + 52 = 701
#150 Frenchtouch has now 471 + 11 = 482
#200 Frederik has now 164 + 0 = 164

Differences:

Best of 16:

#1 <- #30 = 3412 points
#1 <- #60 = 3928 points
#1 <- #100 = 4440 points
#1 <- #120 = 4646 points
#1 <- #150 = 4824 points
#1 <- #200 = 5131 points

---

#30 <- #60 = 516 points
#60 <- #100 = 512 points
#100 <- #120 = 206 points
#120 <- #150 = 178 points
#150 <- #200 = 307 points
#60 <- #150 = 896 points
#100 <- #150 = 384 points
#100 <- #200 = 691 points


Best of 20:

#1 <- #30 = 3603 points (+191)
#1 <- #60 = 4067 points (+139)
#1 <- #100 = 4611 points (+171)
#1 <- #120 = 4829 points (+183)
#1 <- #150 = 5048 points (+224)
#1 <- #200 = 5366 points (+235)

---

#30 <- #60 = 464 points (-52)
#60 <- #100 = 544 points (+32)
#100 <- #120 = 218 points (+12)
#120 <- #150 = 219 points (+41)
#150 <- #200 = 318 points (+11)
#60 <- #150 = 981 points (+85)
#100 <- #150 = 437 points (+53)
#100 <- #200 = 755 points (+64)

No matter which rank you are, you are losing POINTS to the higher ranked player. Of course, more to the top players (1-20) than to #131, but as you can see, even among lower ranked players, the difference is quite big.

So now tell me that Best of 20 doesn't favor the higher ranked more...:wavey:

Top player plays big tournament, so It's gain more points, It's not something weird. That's why they are Top player. They work hard (hard work brings luck), so they deserved it.
And If you plays well, Best of 20 give you more chances to surpass the higher player but not play well (don't look at those top 10-30 player and want to surpass them, Let's try to surpass those player close to you 1st). And if you don't play well, don't blame on anyone.

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 05:46 PM
I don't blame anyone and I stated already somewhere that of course Top players deserve their ranking and easy scheduling and so on, but in this case some people try us to believe, that best of 20 is better for...well, whom? Of course top players and the ones ranked higher :shrug:
So, that's why 1) I don't understand why we have now best of 20, why not best of 23, or best of 31... 2) why this has been decided without a vote and 3) why we now have it although this isn't happening on real tour, too?

I have no problem with higher ranked players (like you and others) to get more points out of this rule, the problem is that there are false statements about it and most of this stuff just happens and nearly no one says anything....but when you followed this and other threads, at least some of the old TT players see what I and they see, too. (no offend to you)

tim83
Nov 25th, 2014, 06:27 PM
I don't blame anyone and I stated already somewhere that of course Top players deserve their ranking and easy scheduling and so on, but in this case some people try us to believe, that best of 20 is better for...well, whom? Of course top players and the ones ranked higher :shrug:
So, that's why 1) I don't understand why we have now best of 20, why not best of 23, or best of 31... 2) why this has been decided without a vote and 3) why we now have it although this isn't happening on real tour, too?

I have no problem with higher ranked players (like you and others) to get more points out of this rule, the problem is that there are false statements about it and most of this stuff just happens and nearly no one says anything....but when you followed this and other threads, at least some of the old TT players see what I and they see, too. (no offend to you)

Players on the real tour do not play 40-50 tournaments throughout a year (unless they are called Julia Cohen), so it makes sense somehow.

Igorche
Nov 25th, 2014, 06:59 PM
We should change that rule, best of 10 is enough.

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 07:14 PM
We should change that rule, best of 10 is enough.

yeah, or best of 1 :cheer:

SAISAI-GOAT
Nov 25th, 2014, 07:22 PM
yeah, or best of 1 :cheer:

even if it was best of 1, you would still only have 150 points and be ranked outside the Top 80 :lol: :tape: :happy:

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 07:34 PM
even if it was best of 1, you would still only have 150 points and be ranked outside the Top 80 :lol: :tape: :happy:

It would solve so many problems:

- No slamless #1s
- No more Top 20 players vulturing challengers
- Players would play FC without having to whore up a challenger, too.
- and and and...

seriously, there are no mature comments to my post? or everyone is okay with that? (actually, can't be the later one...)

Michael!
Nov 25th, 2014, 07:57 PM
It would solve so many problems:

- No slamless #1s
- No more Top 20 players vulturing challengers
- Players would play FC without having to whore up a challenger, too.
- and and and...

seriously, there are no mature comments to my post? or everyone is okay with that? (actually, can't be the later one...)

whatīs the problem with slamless #1s? they earned the points even without winning a slam , so they deserve it as much as everyone else, whatīs the problem with top 20 players vulturing challengers? they are LEs anyway, so they donīt take away the place from others, whatīs the problem with FC players play WTA/challengers as well? FC here is some kind of exhibition anyway, some even wanted to cancel it in the past, so we try to keep it alive at least..

and why 20? why not? TT players play mostly every week, so why not counting 20 instead of 16, makes sense and as you can see in the examples, of course, top 10 players have more points, so there 17th result is usually better than the 17th result of the No. 120 but it favours every player, not just no1 or 2 but also no.50 or 60...

and yes, we will have polls and yes, we can change rules again or adjust them, so I donīt see a problem for now and as I said many times before, we canīt satisfy everyone unfortunately but you can vote for a change as soon as we will have polls about it again, which wonīt be now obviously.

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 08:01 PM
whatīs the problem with slamless #1s? they earned the points even without winning a slam , so they deserve it as much as everyone else, whatīs the problem with top 20 players vulturing challengers? they are LEs anyway, so they donīt take away the place from others, whatīs the problem with FC players play WTA/challengers as well? FC here is some kind of exhibition anyway, some even wanted to cancel it in the past, so we try to keep it alive at least..

and why 20? why not? TT players play mostly every week, so why not counting 20 instead of 16, makes sense and as you can see in the examples, of course, top 10 players have more points, so there 17th result is usually better than the 17th result of the No. 120 but it favours every player, not just no1 or 2 but also no.50 or 60...

and yes, we will have polls and yes, we can change rules again or adjust them, so I donīt see a problem for now and as I said many times before, we canīt satisfy everyone unfortunately but you can vote for a change as soon as we will have polls about it again, which wonīt be now obviously.

yeah, best of 40 would also favor everyone...don't get me wrong, I get your message, but it least you could admit, that higher ranked players profit MORE from this rule than lower ranked ones, and I'm ok.

:hatoff:

Lord Sneeze
Nov 25th, 2014, 09:58 PM
The only thing which was discussed (requested) was that players wanted to gain ranking points for playing FEDCUP (like it is the case for DAVIS CUP). So the board decided not to give ranking points for FED CUP, but does not want to punish FEDCUP players therefore allowed 2 tournament on those weeks.

You dont need to play Fed Cup, that is completely the choice of the players. If a higher ranked players prefered to play for points they would and then the option goes to the next highest ranked player for that country.
By doing this it is pretty much whoring all the higher ranked players into their country and meaning lower ranked players are again disadvantaged.

Adrian.
Nov 25th, 2014, 10:00 PM
You dont need to play Fed Cup, that is completely the choice of the players. If a higher ranked players prefered to play for points they would and then the option goes to the next highest ranked player for that country.
By doing this it is pretty much whoring all the higher ranked players into their country and meaning lower ranked players are again disadvantaged.

:worship:

Javi.
Nov 25th, 2014, 10:10 PM
Fed Cup is an exhibition tournament (No points).
Last time I checked all exhibitions that are played allow to play another tournament same week so this change makes a lot of sense.
I don't know why Fed Cup should be an exception to the rules regarding TT exhibitions.

Lord Sneeze
Nov 25th, 2014, 10:21 PM
Fed Cup is an exhibition tournament (No points).
Last time I checked all exhibitions that are played allow to play another tournament same week so this change makes a lot of sense.
I don't know why Fed Cup should be an exception to the rules regarding TT exhibitions.

The way it was previosuly wouldn't have caused an issue as teams did not fill up. By making it so people can play in both it may require a look at the structure so all players can play for the team they want.

With more players playing players for the big countries outside the top 100 will likely not have the option to play for their chosen country.

valac222
Nov 26th, 2014, 06:39 AM
The way it was previosuly wouldn't have caused an issue as teams did not fill up. By making it so people can play in both it may require a look at the structure so all players can play for the team they want.

With more players playing players for the big countries outside the top 100 will likely not have the option to play for their chosen country.


They always have the chance to play for e.g. Senegal, Mongolia etc. You are free to choose your FEDCUP country, this rule only reinforce an exhibition and hopefully gives more chance to lower ranked players to play 2 tourneys a week. Until now lower ranked players could not play in FEDCUP as they rather went for ranking points and skipped it.

rvugt
Nov 26th, 2014, 05:00 PM
Are you guys now degrading FedCup to an exhibition tournament? It is not! Even on TF is suppose it is an honour to play for your country and it should be standard procedure for high-ranked players.

But seriously, why do we discuss this this much, as the board didn't think it was worth to ask the players what they want on this point. I don't like tat way and completely disagree with the decision. If it would have been a democratic decision, i would not have complained at all!
Sorry, but in this case the board is the same as the FIFA! I will open a thread with a poll later tonight, to decide what the players want. The board can do with the results what they want!


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

Javi.
Nov 26th, 2014, 07:13 PM
Seriously it's baffling all this fuss for the Fed Cup decission.
Other years there weren't enough teams other than World Group and World Group I :facepalm:
I personally think it's good idea but even If it wasn't changed I don't know why people cares so much suddenly about it. I mean, some people who complain didn't even commit to Fed Cup this year :rolleyes:


Also there is too much complain about TT rules everywhere. I don't know what's going on here. Does TT really work that bad?
Maybe we should open a thread with complaints about TT.

Javi.
Nov 26th, 2014, 07:28 PM
Fed Cup finalist this year were only 2 people and in some round in World Group or WG2 a team didn't sent. Also I remember SVK didn't have an alternate either. I remember cause they won a round in spite one of them non sending on Sunday.

So few people cared about Fed Cup TT this year

Adrian.
Nov 26th, 2014, 07:49 PM
I would have loved to play for Germany, but I'm obviously ranked too low and now willing to play for Palau or Kambodscha or Gibraltar, so I think person who didn't play still have the right to "complain" or like I like to say: "state their opinion"

:wavey:

Michael!
Nov 26th, 2014, 07:59 PM
I would have loved to play for Germany, but I'm obviously ranked too low and now willing to play for Palau or Kambodscha or Gibraltar, so I think person who didn't play still have the right to "complain" or like I like to say: "state their opinion"

:wavey:

but that has nothing to do with the rule change, Germany has many TT players, your ranking wouldnīt be good enough anyway, players like Jens, Matthias or me always played FedCup in the past anyway.

And in 2015 we will have 4 ITFs + FedCup, so we will have enough space, Top 30 Players will be LEs for ITFs, so no disadvantage here for lower ranked players but lower ranked players who had to decide between ITF and FC this year have the chance to play both..so I donīt see anything negative here..sure, some might not be able to play FC but FC is just for the higher ranked players, they were the best of their country and so they have the right to represent it, they wonīt get any points for it anyway so that is not a real disdvantage for lower ranked players as well..

Adrian.
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:09 PM
but that has nothing to do with the rule change, Germany has many TT players, your ranking wouldnīt be good enough anyway, players like Jens, Matthias or me always played FedCup in the past anyway.

And in 2015 we will have 4 ITFs + FedCup, so we will have enough space, Top 30 Players will be LEs for ITFs, so no disadvantage here for lower ranked players but lower ranked players who had to decide between ITF and FC this year have the chance to play both..so I donīt see anything negative here..sure, some might not be able to play FC but FC is just for the higher ranked players, they were the best of their country and so they have the right to represent it, they wonīt get any points for it anyway so that is not a real disdvantage for lower ranked players as well..

I played it before, too :rolleyes:
and it has, someone ranked in the 60ies or even 50ies, in combination of the best of 20 rule, might now play both, FC and ITF. Whereas this year, he had to chose between ITF and FC. :shrug:
Players from 31 on will enter ITFs directly, take away spaces from scrubs AND be able to play the FC, too, taking away the chance from lower ranked players again.
So yes, I see a disadvantage here, sorry for that...

Michael!
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:16 PM
I played it before, too :rolleyes:
and it has, someone ranked in the 60ies or even 50ies, in combination of the best of 20 rule, might now play both, FC and ITF. Whereas this year, he had to chose between ITF and FC. :shrug:
Players from 31 on will enter ITFs directly, take away spaces from scrubs AND be able to play the FC, too, taking away the chance from lower ranked players again.
So yes, I see a disadvantage here, sorry for that...

you played it before when u were top 10 but u not playing has nothing to do with the new rule, your ranking just is not good enough, no one to blame for that.
and I do think that there will be enough space for everyone when we have 4 tournaments, no disadvantage here IMO

Adrian.
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:18 PM
you played it before when u were top 10 but u not playing has nothing to do with the new rule, your ranking just is not good enough, no one to blame for that.
and I do think that there will be enough space for everyone when we have 4 tournaments, no disadvantage here IMO

since when is my ranking relevant? since when am I blaming anyone for it? :weirdo:
and the problem is the end of your post: "IMO"

It's not always about your opinion or mine, but the one of all in here, and before making changes, they should first be discussed by everyone in here and then by you (Board).

IMO

Michael!
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:21 PM
since when is my ranking relevant? since when am I blaming anyone for it? :weirdo:
and the problem is the end of your post: "IMO"


http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=51837650&postcount=200. :scratch:

anyway, enough of that all, we exchanged our opinions more than enough , this should come to an end, if people are really totally dissatisfifed with our work then we will notice it anyway but those discussions are getting nowhere.

Adrian.
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:25 PM
http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=51837650&postcount=200. :scratch:

anyway, enough of that all, we exchanged our opinions more than enough , this should come to an end, if people are really totally dissatisfifed with our work then we will notice it anyway but those discussions are getting nowhere.

then maybe quote the previous posts, too and not just mine

I was referring to the posts of Javi. and valac, who said you could play for which country you want and that FC would be an EXO and that people don't care about it anyway, because SVK has no ALT or sth. like that.

And that was my answer, that I want to play only for Germany but am ranked too low to do so (what is ok). But does this mean I can't care about FC?

Javi.
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:29 PM
Ok Adrian maybe you care about Fed Cup but Reuben said he would open a poll to ask players so that's why I wondered, Is this change really THAT important? People cares that much about Fed Cup TT?
Once again there were lots of spaces available last year. Maybe is different for players of big countries as USA, Germany, etc but still.

As there will be 1 more ITF in FC weeks (confirmed by Michi) why and how this rule is bad for lower ranked players??

Michael!
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:30 PM
then maybe quote the previous posts, too and not just mine

I was referring to the posts of Javi. and valac, who said you could play for which country you want and that FC would be an EXO and that people don't care about it anyway, because SVK has no ALT or sth. like that.

And that was my answer, that I want to play only for Germany but am ranked too low to do so (what is ok). But does this mean I can't care about FC?

yes, of course, u have the right to complain, but I just wanted to say that the rule change is no further disdvantage for lower ranked players IMO, weīll see how it works, if more people complain then we will have a poll again, and then maybe in 2016 it will be different again, itīs not a big thing IMO anyway, so I donīt understan the drama about it.

Adrian.
Nov 26th, 2014, 08:32 PM
Ok Adrian maybe you care about Fed Cup but Reuben said he would open a poll to ask players so that's why I wondered, Is this change really THAT important? People cares that much about Fed Cup TT?
Once again there were lots of spaces available last year. Maybe is different for players of big countries as USA, Germany, etc but still.

Thank you for at least understanding my POV without attacking me :)

rvugt
Nov 26th, 2014, 11:29 PM
Haha, completely forgot i would do something here. Poll will be up somewhere tomorrow.

And asking the question is maybe already the answer, but i think it is a pity that fedcup doesn't mean that much! And in my opinion this rule will even make it less important!

And about blocking the discussion, the board should have avoided the discussion and put the issue to a vote before changing it! So, my last words about this are not spoken yet, even if people tell me the discussion is going nowhere!


Sent from Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

valac222
Nov 27th, 2014, 08:29 AM
The board should resign and recandidate again. That would show if TT community in general are satisfied or not. Unfortunately that would not stop the trolling of the loud minority.

The Walking Bye
Nov 27th, 2014, 08:51 AM
Stop being a bloody drama queen, I am, and I assume the people questioning rules, are fine with the board members, they take time out to make this game, and keep it going.

We are offering contrary opinions to the rules, and while I can understand the board's reasons for some things, I wish they would put every major rule change in a poll if someone expresses discontent in the thread.

If you are going to act like that every time someone questions something...

Michael!
Nov 27th, 2014, 08:57 AM
The board should resign and recandidate again. That would show if TT community in general are satisfied or not. Unfortunately that would not stop the trolling of the loud minority.

I am playing this game since 2008, for 6 years, and for 4 years I wasnīt a board member and in those years it worked exactly same as it does now.
I made suggestions as well, to some the board immediately said no, then I made the suggestion again a year later and when I was lucky there was a poll about it as some others supported my idea as well, in other cases the board made some changes without having a poll about it and then later made changes to the rule or whatever.
The suggestions thread was open since July, so people obviously had the right to complain about the current way the board decides about rules but no one did, no one said that we should add more polls or always ask people about everything but now when the rules discussions are over and some people arenīt satisfied with some results they come up with how unfair it is and that the TT turns into a dictatorship etc. and that is the the most annoying thing IMO.
We got it, there will be some polls about different things next year but I do not think that our current rules system or changes for 2015 are that bad that there has to be a general discussions about everything .

and maybe I am out of touch with reality but I still think that most TT players are satisfied with the game right now and the rules and if people do not want to have a public discussion about everything here, feel free to PM/rep me or whatever and tell me your opinion, if people really are so dissatisfied with everything then I have to take the approciate action.

kfh_9118
Nov 27th, 2014, 10:44 AM
This game is better than ever.

And that's thanks to you all board members (ex and current) as well as the managers.
Without you all, this game will not survive, so THANK YOU ALL.

Most of us expressing our opinion are simply wanting to improve this game, nothing against the board members nor the indication of our dissatisfaction towards your work.

valac222
Nov 27th, 2014, 11:14 AM
This game is better than ever.

And that's thanks to you all board members (ex and current) as well as the managers.
Without you all, this game will not survive, so THANK YOU ALL.

Most of us expressing our opinion are simply wanting to improve this game, nothing against the board members nor the indication of our dissatisfaction towards your work.



I definately agree, the board doing fine and I agree the way they operate. And I also agree that most of us expressing opinions to improve the game.


All I am just saying, that some are continuously crying about the dictatorship of the board. A reelection of this board (I have no doubt they would be) might make them a bit less noisy.


( All I just could not understand that what is the reason that nobody complained about dictatorship, when SE were introduced or eg. last year commitment rule change whitout poll. The board always made decisions whitout polls and put polls where they could not find the solution. It is simply not realistic to have polls on everything)

Michael!
Nov 27th, 2014, 11:31 AM
All I am just saying, that some are continuously crying about the dictatorship of the board. A reelection of this board (I have no doubt they would be) might make them a bit less noisy.


David and Frederik got voted in just a few months ago
Adey joined the board a year ago and does a perfect job with the rankings
Meelis is about to leave and a new member will join in a few days
I am soon the longest serving board member and got voted in just about two years ago

I think we had enough changes recently and those who moan about everything wouldnīt stop anyway :p

Effy
Nov 27th, 2014, 12:29 PM
i think we have the hottest board ever :D

please stop moaning about everything, we all have had enough time to voice our suggestions and whatnot :D

Idemo
Nov 27th, 2014, 12:42 PM
Yeah, I think there's been more than enough discussion about all this sort of stuff for the moment. Our board members do a fantastic job, and without them the game wouldn't be where it's at today. :hatoff: :bowdown:

rvugt
Nov 28th, 2014, 09:32 AM
I won't think the board should resign and be reelected. It is clear what they have to do, and I did it for them this time. Here is the poll, please let us know what you think!

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=814714

Javi.
Nov 28th, 2014, 10:29 AM
What's next?
Are we going to open a poll for every change already aproved and written in rules for 2015? Why Fed Cup and no others like the best of 20 tournaments instead of 16, to say something??

Anyway, I voted

rvugt
Nov 28th, 2014, 10:50 AM
What's next?
Are we going to open a poll for every change already aproved and written in rules for 2015? Why Fed Cup and no others like the best of 20 tournaments instead of 16, to say something??

Anyway, I voted

To be honest, I think a poll about the best 20 tournaments should be opened as well. Why not open a poll for all changes before the board decides. In that way we have no way to complain, as it is our voice that is put into the rules! So, that is why I opened this poll and maybe will look at all the decisions that are made without asking the players and open a poll about those! It is a democracy, isn't it?

Michael!
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:18 AM
as I said before, players hat several months time to make suggestions, incl. suggestions about the way we make our rules, it is already clear that there will be some polls next season (and not about the same old questions again for sure) but why complaining now about it all?
It took some time to collect all the suggestions, work out new rules and we didnīt do anything different than in previous years and now that we have that FedCup Poll I hope and think that we finally can end those endless discussions.

AdeyC
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:23 AM
as I said before, players hat several months time to make suggestions, incl. suggestions about the way we make our rules, it is already clear that there will be some polls next season (and not about the same old questions again for sure) but why complaining now about it all?
It took some time to collect all the suggestions, work out new rules and we didnīt do anything different than in previous years and now that we have that FedCup Poll I hope and think that we finally can end those endless discussions.

+1

Javi.
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:24 AM
To be honest, I think a poll about the best 20 tournaments should be opened as well. Why not open a poll for all changes before the board decides. In that way we have no way to complain, as it is our voice that is put into the rules! So, that is why I opened this poll and maybe will look at all the decisions that are made without asking the players and open a poll about those! It is a democracy, isn't it?

I mean, If we are doing this, opening polls for rules already changed, the 20 tournaments is WAY more relevant and important than Fed Cup, right?

But I also agree with Michael that discussions about 2015 rules has to end at some point.

rvugt
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:29 AM
as I said before, players hat several months time to make suggestions, incl. suggestions about the way we make our rules, it is already clear that there will be some polls next season (and not about the same old questions again for sure) but why complaining now about it all?
It took some time to collect all the suggestions, work out new rules and we didnīt do anything different than in previous years and now that we have that FedCup Poll I hope and think that we finally can end those endless discussions.

Agreed! That is why I opened the poll! If it is a close call or clear decision for your option, this discussion can be closed.

rvugt
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:33 AM
I mean, If we are doing this, opening polls for rules already changed, the 20 tournaments is WAY more relevant and important than Fed Cup, right?

But I also agree with Michael that discussions about 2015 rules has to end at some point.

If you think so, let's stop that discussion as well! Vote here:

http://www.tennisforum.com/showthread.php?t=814730

valac222
Nov 28th, 2014, 11:47 AM
As Ruben is so nice to put polls on everything I go and collect all suggestions where there were no voting.

valac222
Nov 28th, 2014, 12:16 PM
There should be a poll about destructive players :D

Adrian.
Nov 28th, 2014, 12:17 PM
Or about mods who delete posts :)

valac222
Nov 28th, 2014, 12:19 PM
Anyhow there should be a thread about complaints (and the last 10 pages should be moved there) to keep the rules thread clean.

Michael!
Nov 28th, 2014, 12:25 PM
we have the ATB threads for complaints, if there are any but yes, we have the polls thread now and the ATB thread, no need to discuss further here.

AdeyC
Nov 28th, 2014, 12:27 PM
Any further irrelevant posts in this thread will be deleted.

rvugt
Nov 28th, 2014, 04:54 PM
Just informing: Currently the polls are favouring the board's decisions. If the board would have bothered to ask our opinions, the same decision were made, but the board would not have to defend themselves, but blame all the other players!

Javi.
Nov 28th, 2014, 05:43 PM
^ But to be fair, both changes came from other players. Board members just decided after hearing our suggestions. So they actually bothered to ask for suggestions and made some changes accordingly

Adrian.
Nov 28th, 2014, 08:19 PM
Well the FC is pretty tied, the points one has a slight advantage for BO20

sdtoot
Nov 28th, 2014, 09:14 PM
Isn't that what the TT Board exists for - to agree any changes to the TT rules following suggestions from players? The Board have now made their decisions on the rule changes so can we just draw a line under this and move on.

Michael!
Nov 28th, 2014, 09:26 PM
Well the FC is pretty tied, the points one has a slight advantage for BO20

if you want to continue the FC discussion then...

1) if none of the options gets more than 50% then there has to be a 2nd poll between the two options with the most votes, in this case it is already clear that it would be between "FC with points but no other tournament in same week" or "FC without points but you are allowed to play another tournament in the same week" and then it would be a simple poll, so that the option with more votes would win

But once again, those polls are no official polls and I do not really see the point in having another poll if it is foreseeable that most players will vote for the same option which the board already introduced anyway but either way I am satisied as players made a clear vote in favour for a new rule when it comes to FedCup

I totally agree with sdtoot as well but seems like we will have polls about everything in future just because some players canīt accept some reasonable decisions (which were based on suggestions from the players anyway)

rvugt
Nov 29th, 2014, 02:37 PM
if you want to continue the FC discussion then...

1) if none of the options gets more than 50% then there has to be a 2nd poll between the two options with the most votes, in this case it is already clear that it would be between "FC with points but no other tournament in same week" or "FC without points but you are allowed to play another tournament in the same week" and then it would be a simple poll, so that the option with more votes would win

But once again, those polls are no official polls and I do not really see the point in having another poll if it is foreseeable that most players will vote for the same option which the board already introduced anyway but either way I am satisied as players made a clear vote in favour for a new rule when it comes to FedCup

I totally agree with sdtoot as well but seems like we will have polls about everything in future just because some players canīt accept some reasonable decisions (which were based on suggestions from the players anyway)

Michael, I really liked your apology in the Fed Cup thread. That meant to me that you saw why we needed a poll and that you understood that there were different ways to change rules. But this post completely ruins that meaning. Now you suddenly are telling us that we have nothing to say.

Just short: One or maybe a couple of players make a suggestion. The 5 members of the board like the suggestion. There is a rule! How is this democracy when around 7 players decide that a rule should change! There are more than 100 TT players at the moment!
I understand that you do something this way if a quick decision is necessary, but for this kind of changes isn't that what the off-season is about, having the discussion! And letting us all decide together on important issues. And with important issues I mean issues that at least some players find important!
So unless the board and Michael in particular don't understand that, I will indeed become a fan of having a new board election. Just to let everybody know that we are in this game together, so not few people will decide for all of us!

And about the polls, I will leave them open, but to me it sounds that the board was right on what the players wanted. So I will stop the discussion on the Fed Cup and amount of tournaments issues.

Michael!
Nov 29th, 2014, 02:57 PM
Michael, I really liked your apology in the Fed Cup thread. That meant to me that you saw why we needed a poll and that you understood that there were different ways to change rules. But this post completely ruins that meaning. Now you suddenly are telling us that we have nothing to say.

Just short: One or maybe a couple of players make a suggestion. The 5 members of the board like the suggestion. There is a rule! How is this democracy when around 7 players decide that a rule should change! There are more than 100 TT players at the moment!
I understand that you do something this way if a quick decision is necessary, but for this kind of changes isn't that what the off-season is about, having the discussion! And letting us all decide together on important issues. And with important issues I mean issues that at least some players find important!
So unless the board and Michael in particular don't understand that, I will indeed become a fan of having a new board election. Just to let everybody know that we are in this game together, so not few people will decide for all of us!

And about the polls, I will leave them open, but to me it sounds that the board was right on what the players wanted. So I will stop the discussion on the Fed Cup and amount of tournaments issues.

Ruben, just answer me one question.
The board, all of us, never did anything different than former board members did in previous years, the board always created rules, some with polls but many without polls as well and there were always some who liked the rules and some who did not like the rules but players never felt the need to create polls when they werenīt satisfied.
Since July we had the suggestions thread open, not one single post there in which a player complained about the way the board creates new rules but now when the board just decided about new rules you come up with that TT became a
dictatorship and that we should have polls for everything.
As we said many times before, we will find ways in 2015 to include all the players when it comes to create new rules but once again, we did not do anything different than in the 8 years before, so why you suddenly feel the need to complain now?
Donīt get me wrong, itīs your right to complain but now that you havenīt done it for years you cant expect us to change all the decisions we just made and which are supported by the majority of TT anyway.

Adrian.
Nov 30th, 2014, 01:26 PM
One thing worrying is that not even 50 people voted so far :awww:

rvugt
Nov 30th, 2014, 02:08 PM
Ruben, just answer me one question.
The board, all of us, never did anything different than former board members did in previous years, the board always created rules, some with polls but many without polls as well and there were always some who liked the rules and some who did not like the rules but players never felt the need to create polls when they werenīt satisfied.
Since July we had the suggestions thread open, not one single post there in which a player complained about the way the board creates new rules but now when the board just decided about new rules you come up with that TT became a
dictatorship and that we should have polls for everything.
As we said many times before, we will find ways in 2015 to include all the players when it comes to create new rules but once again, we did not do anything different than in the 8 years before, so why you suddenly feel the need to complain now?
Donīt get me wrong, itīs your right to complain but now that you havenīt done it for years you cant expect us to change all the decisions we just made and which are supported by the majority of TT anyway.

I can answer you that question: I never realized it happened like this. Maybe also due to the fact that there was not that much discussion about rule changes. And of course, it is a little bit because I don't agree with the current rule changes.

And you say that you said many times before that you will find ways in 2015 to include all the players, I really like that. But it is the first time I hear it. I hear the board (you) mainly complain about us not agreeing with you. No problem there, but that means I believe the board doesn't listen to the voice of the players.

So, as the pollls point in the right direction and the board will look for ways to change, for me the discussion and the points are over! Looking forward to a new nice TT year!

Michael!
Nov 30th, 2014, 02:36 PM
I can answer you that question: I never realized it happened like this. Maybe also due to the fact that there was not that much discussion about rule changes. And of course, it is a little bit because I don't agree with the current rule changes.

And you say that you said many times before that you will find ways in 2015 to include all the players, I really like that. But it is the first time I hear it. I hear the board (you) mainly complain about us not agreeing with you. No problem there, but that means I believe the board doesn't listen to the voice of the players.

So, as the pollls point in the right direction and the board will look for ways to change, for me the discussion and the points are over! Looking forward to a new nice TT year!

well, I and we did say it before that we will have more polls in 2015 for the 2016 rules, that we will try to find ways to include players more into decisions (although we already do that anyway as ALL of our decisions are already based on suggestins from the PLAYERS).
We mostly complained about the fact only that you suddenly felt the need to create polls, complain about the rules system just now, straight after we posted the new rules instead of accepting our current rules and decisions and wait for the end of 2015 to see some changes about that.

And as you see, the board went our (the boardīs) way and that should actually satisfy you as well, as Board Members should be people who make decisions in favour for most players, who can empathize with players and as you see, thatīs working fine. I am happy anyway that for you the discussions are over and I wish you and all of us a nice new TT year as well ;)

Frederik
Dec 3rd, 2014, 10:22 PM
updated rule

Protected rankings: In order to be eligible for a Protected Ranking, one must have been out of competition a minimum of six months and a maximum of two years. The eligible player must apply for a PR in the „Protected Ranking“ thread before re-entering TT competition.

A player has one year from the date he/she returns to competition to use the Protected Ranking and may enter a maximum of 2 Grand Slams and 2 Premier Mandatories as part of his/her eight Protected Ranking Tournaments.

gumoll
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:12 AM
for current tournaments we use old rules or new?

Igorche
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:34 AM
for current tournaments we use old rules or new?

We use new rules except this:

8) I think LE for doubles should be cancelled (like on MTF). I mean, player should be able to wait first deadline to see where he will play and then to find a partner (will become effective from 2015 on, 1a Hong Kong)


First entry deadline for Singles is always Sunday 6 pm current time in Europe (CET or CEST).
The day before TT qualifying begins is the 2nd deadline for changes (the exact time is up to the tournament manager) and the draws are made after that.
Doubles players have ca. two weeks (from the Sunday when the thread is opened until the 2nd and final deadline) to commit to the tournament.
There aren’t Late Entries in doubles (except for the Top30 LEs in challengers obviously), everyone who commits after the 2nd deadline for doubles will be considered as ALT.

12) mulitple commitments? before 1st deadline only? no multiple commitments at all?
(will become effective from 2015 on, 1a Hong Kong)


Double commitment (player commits to two different tournaments in the same week):

Before the 1st deadline on Sunday, 6pm CET players can commit to one tournament, withdraw from there and commit to another tournament without being a LE.
If the player is still on two different Entry Lists once the first deadline is over and the infraction is noticed before the tournaments start, only the first commitment will be valid and no punishment is applied.

If the double commitment is not noticed by anyone before the draws are made, points gained by the player in any of the two tournaments will not be considered and the player will be replaced with ALTs/LLs (only possible if the player didnīt win a round already in that tournament)

18) Best of 20 tournaments counīt for ranking, not only 16 as it was in the past (2015)

gumoll
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:40 AM
OK, so in doubles the deadlines are same like in singles if I understand correctly :lol:

or better just check my Ankara tournament if I made the deadlines correctly, because for some reason I feel really confused with the deadline things :lol: :cuckoo:

http://www.tennisforum.com/showpost.php?p=51924578&postcount=2

Igorche
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:47 AM
Yes, we have two deadlines for doubles, and those who commit for doubles after 1st deadline will be LE.

If QR1 begins on Sunday 2nd deadline should be Saturday.

Adrian.
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:52 AM
Yes, we have two deadlines for doubles, and those who commit for doubles after 1st deadline will be LE.

If QR1 begins on Sunday 2nd deadline should be Saturday.

I thought this rule was changed :unsure:

Igorche
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:53 AM
But Ankara have Saturday Final (according to ITF (http://www.itftennis.com/procircuit/tournaments/women%27s-tournament/info.aspx?tournamentid=1100033343)), so you should move all rounds 1 day earlier.

Michael!
Dec 4th, 2014, 10:53 AM
as Igor just posted above, old rule counts till the end of 2014, new rule is effective from 1a Hong Kong ^^ :p