PDA

View Full Version : Mike Tyson Talks Tennis: Navratilova Better than Serena


tennislover
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:14 PM
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/mike-tyson-talks-tennis-navratilova-better-than-serena

Mike Tyson Talks Tennis: Navratilova Better than SerenaOpinion by Boxing Insider
(May 19, 2010) in Sports
by Scoop Malinowski

As we stood there in the parking lot of Mario’s Ringside Lounge just off Route 1 & 9 in Jersey City, N.J. on a sunny April afternoon, I made a random comment to Mike Tyson, to initiate some small talk. “Mike, you’re looking in great shape, how did you do it? Been playing any tennis?”
Suddenly, the former Heavyweight champion in the world looked at me and began hitting shadow forehand and backhand strokes, while saying, “I hit with Martina Navratilova when she stayed at my house in New Jersey (Bernardsville). I played with her. She was the greatest.”
My mind was stunned to hear such a revelation, it was like getting caught on the chin by a surprise punch. Wow! Mike Tyson could play tennis? Mike Tyson appreciates how great Martina Navratilova was? He explained it was back in the 1980’s when he was married to Robin Givens, who had a sister who was an aspiring WTA pro. They were friends with Lori McNeil, Navratilova and that crowd.
The first thing I thought of was to engage in a friendly debate with the man who won the World Heavyweight title on November 22, 1986 at the age of 20. So I said to Mike something to the effect that Martina was great in her time but Serena Williams today would beat her, just totally overwhelm her with her intensity, powerful baseline game and those heavy, 120 mile-per-hour serves.
Mike not only disagreed, he disagreed vehemently. He spoke with firm conviction in his voice and used his hands for emphasis. “It’s not about intensity and power. It’s about calm and self control.”
I tried to keep up the argument. “In one match, both at their best, Serena takes her out, she’s just too strong.”
Again Mike would not agree. He was adamant, and spoke with a strong, authoritative voice. There was not an iota of doubt in his words. “It’s not about one match. It’s about consistency, longevity, doing it over and over. If you say Serena is the best, then why can’t she break Martina’s record?”
Boom! He froze me again with a powerful point which put me on the defensive. After a pause, I offered, “Yeah, that’s true. But Serena has other interests outside of tennis (acting, designing, writing, etc.) Martina was all about tennis, all about winning.”
My counter was totally ineffective. In fact, it only seemed to make Tyson stronger. And he went for the knockout. “That’s why she’s the best. That’s what a champion does – they keep doing it over and over and over.”
Mike Tyson would know a lot better than me what makes a world champion. With blank silence, I defered to Mike Tyson. He was absolutely right.
That night I looked it up: Martina Navratilova has won 18 grand slam singles titles, 31 in doubles and 10 in mixed, compared to 12/11/2 for Serena.
Then Tyson added another point, maybe because he enjoyed the back and forth, which lasted less than two minutes. “I remember Kid Gavilan told me – we were talking about Roberto Duran…”
Duran was my favorite boxer of all time, the first boxer I really loved as a kid. “He’s mine too,” added Tyson. “Kid Gavilan said if he fought Duran ten times, he would lose one. Kid Gavilan was only knocked down twice in 135 fights, can you imagine that?”
But then they had to go. The producers had to take Mike over to Brooklyn – they were filming his forthcoming Animal Planet reality show, to be called “Taking On Tyson” which will be about his interest in pigeons and competitive pigeon racing.
Hopefully, I will have the chance to talk more about tennis with Mike Tyson in the near future, as it’s obviously a sport he has appreciation for.
Maybe I’ll ask him what he thinks about Steffi Graf’s 22 grand slam singles titles. Or Federer vs. Nadal. Of if any tennis champions remind him of himself…

brickhousesupporter
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:18 PM
.....spell Navratilova Mike. :rolleyes:

Human Nature
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:26 PM
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/mike-tyson-talks-tennis-navratilova-better-than-serena

Mike Tyson Talks Tennis: Navratilova Better than SerenaOpinion by Boxing Insider
(May 19, 2010) in Sports
by Scoop Malinowski

As we stood there in the parking lot of Mario’s Ringside Lounge just off Route 1 & 9 in Jersey City, N.J. on a sunny April afternoon, I made a random comment to Mike Tyson, to initiate some small talk. “Mike, you’re looking in great shape, how did you do it? Been playing any tennis?”
Suddenly, the former Heavyweight champion in the world looked at me and began hitting shadow forehand and backhand strokes, while saying, “I hit with Martina Navratilova when she stayed at my house in New Jersey (Bernardsville). I played with her. She was the greatest.”
My mind was stunned to hear such a revelation, it was like getting caught on the chin by a surprise punch. Wow! Mike Tyson could play tennis? Mike Tyson appreciates how great Martina Navratilova was? He explained it was back in the 1980’s when he was married to Robin Givens, who had a sister who was an aspiring WTA pro. They were friends with Lori McNeil, Navratilova and that crowd.
The first thing I thought of was to engage in a friendly debate with the man who won the World Heavyweight title on November 22, 1986 at the age of 20. So I said to Mike something to the effect that Martina was great in her time but Serena Williams today would beat her, just totally overwhelm her with her intensity, powerful baseline game and those heavy, 120 mile-per-hour serves.
Mike not only disagreed, he disagreed vehemently. He spoke with firm conviction in his voice and used his hands for emphasis. “It’s not about intensity and power. It’s about calm and self control.”
I tried to keep up the argument. “In one match, both at their best, Serena takes her out, she’s just too strong.”
Again Mike would not agree. He was adamant, and spoke with a strong, authoritative voice. There was not an iota of doubt in his words. “It’s not about one match. It’s about consistency, longevity, doing it over and over. If you say Serena is the best, then why can’t she break Martina’s record?”
Boom! He froze me again with a powerful point which put me on the defensive. After a pause, I offered, “Yeah, that’s true. But Serena has other interests outside of tennis (acting, designing, writing, etc.) Martina was all about tennis, all about winning.”
My counter was totally ineffective. In fact, it only seemed to make Tyson stronger. And he went for the knockout. “That’s why she’s the best. That’s what a champion does – they keep doing it over and over and over.”
Mike Tyson would know a lot better than me what makes a world champion. With blank silence, I defered to Mike Tyson. He was absolutely right.
That night I looked it up: Martina Navratilova has won 18 grand slam singles titles, 31 in doubles and 10 in mixed, compared to 12/11/2 for Serena.
Then Tyson added another point, maybe because he enjoyed the back and forth, which lasted less than two minutes. “I remember Kid Gavilan told me – we were talking about Roberto Duran…”
Duran was my favorite boxer of all time, the first boxer I really loved as a kid. “He’s mine too,” added Tyson. “Kid Gavilan said if he fought Duran ten times, he would lose one. Kid Gavilan was only knocked down twice in 135 fights, can you imagine that?”
But then they had to go. The producers had to take Mike over to Brooklyn – they were filming his forthcoming Animal Planet reality show, to be called “Taking On Tyson” which will be about his interest in pigeons and competitive pigeon racing.
Hopefully, I will have the chance to talk more about tennis with Mike Tyson in the near future, as it’s obviously a sport he has appreciation for.
Maybe I’ll ask him what he thinks about Steffi Graf’s 22 grand slam singles titles. Or Federer vs. Nadal. Of if any tennis champions remind him of himself…


Of course , how could he say otherwise ..?:rolleyes:

Sammo
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:37 PM
Mike Tyson: Navratilova better than Serena, omg thanks for letting us all know that you aren't insane by thinking the contrary

homogenius
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:38 PM
racist :ras:

serenus_2k8
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:40 PM
Too many punches to the head Im afraid :sobbing:

Serenita
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:43 PM
racist :ras:
http://i788.photobucket.com/albums/yy167/mythirdhouse/9395.gif

serenafan08
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:44 PM
.....spell Navratilova Mike. :rolleyes:

:haha: :rolls: :lol: Okay, now that's just evil! ROFL

Serenita
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:44 PM
Too many punches to the head Im afraid :sobbing:

He's confused :shrug:

Bruno71
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:46 PM
Clearly he's allergic to the truth.

winone23
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:48 PM
Too many punches to the head Im afraid :sobbing:

:lol::lol: I was thinking the same thing.

Serenita
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:50 PM
Clearly he's allergic to the truth.


:spit:

Marcell
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:51 PM
Mike Tyson???????????

Mynarco
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:52 PM
at least we can't accuse him of being racist.

serenus_2k8
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:54 PM
at least we can't accuse him of being racist.

Nah, just thick as pig sh*t :tape:

Serenita
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:56 PM
at least we can't accuse him of being racist.
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4395/beysaidsittt0.png

swim4life227
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:58 PM
He asks why can't Serena break her record? It's because her career isn't close to being over with, Martina won a singles slam at the age of like 37? She's only 5 off, and she's at the peak of her career and can still get damn close to Martina's #, if not pass it.

Salve
Jul 15th, 2010, 08:58 PM
First of all, the person who wrote this article is slightly illiterate and does not know how to argue effectively :o Serena has not stopped playing tennis yet, so Mike asking "why can't Serena beat Navratilova's record" is a very stupid point that the writer seems to exalt for no apparent reason. In addition, what Tyson's definition of greatest ever seems to be a description of most accomplished ever. No one is arguing who has accomplished more. Numbers alone tell the story. But if you could put those two (Serena and Navratilova) on a neutral surface, Serena would win if both were to play their best. As the writer rightfully mentions, Serena is too fast, too intense, too strong, too determined to lose to Navratilova. If you want to spark a debate about consistency, that can also be done. I am fairly certain that Serena has a winning H2H against her biggest rivals.

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:10 PM
Tyson has valid points, but I think in all reality Serena denied him some ass :shrug:

volta
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:14 PM
.....spell Navratilova Mike. :rolleyes:

:haha:

faboozadoo15
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:24 PM
Who honestly thinks Serena is even close to being a great as Navratilova? Seriously.

supergrunt
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:39 PM
http://tennisworld.typepad.com/thewrap/

On the same topic- another one of Steve Tignor's biased-fueled rants

supergrunt
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:43 PM
.....spell Navratilova Mike. :rolleyes:

:lol:

Ferg
Jul 15th, 2010, 09:47 PM
Mike :cheer:

People can mock him all they want, Serena wont even come close to Navratilova's records.

Avid Merrion
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:12 PM
Does it really matter when he has such excellent taste in football teams? :D

The Dawntreader
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:15 PM
Who cares about what Mike Tyson says?

I bet that Tatoo only went on his face, because he doesn't know to say 'arm'.

2Black
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:23 PM
Mike, are u still biting off ears

MaBaker
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:31 PM
Well, if Tyson says..

saint2
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:36 PM
Well, Navratilova never played in era of Jankovic (finnishing season as #1), Schiavone (winning RG), or Wozniacki (being #2), so crowning Serena is way to premature.

Steffica Greles
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:38 PM
Mike Tyson isn't paid to sit in a commentary box and promote the current game so people don't switch channel. That's the difference here.

Anybody with an ounce of knowledge and impartiality knows Martina Navratilova was greater than Serena Williams. It's really that simple.

toxina90
Jul 15th, 2010, 10:40 PM
Anybody with an ounce of knowledge and impartiality knows Martina Navratilova was greater than Serena Williams. It's really that simple.

:worship:

swim4life227
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:28 PM
Well, Navratilova never played in era of Jankovic (finnishing season as #1), Schiavone (winning RG), or Wozniacki (being #2), so crowning Serena is way to premature.

Serena dominated an era where people like Venus, Hingis, Capriati, Davenport, Henin, Clijsters, and sometimes even Seles/Graf were in the draw. All those girls are very accomplished players.

However, there is no question now that she doesn't have anywhere close to those type of opponents.

Miss Atomic Bomb
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:30 PM
Maybe Martina got worried with Werthiem's article and asked her buddy to say something for her (not like she needs to, she has achieved more than Serena, on a tennis court).We all know how obssessed she is with records and legacy.

Serena on the other hand, is not that bothered with records and lists anymore (her goal was to get Billie). She would rather use this as a platform to help and motivate others.:worship: :worship:

swim4life227
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:34 PM
Also if we're talking singles slams, Graf has 4 more slams than her (although would have arguably had less if Seles didn't get taken out).

friendsita
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:38 PM
lol

makirilenko
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:42 PM
He spoke with firm conviction in his voice and used his hands for emphasis. “It’s not about intensity and power. It’s about calm and self control.”

Coming from Mike, I had to lol.

Nicolás89
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:47 PM
18>13

Marty-Dom
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:51 PM
He spoke with firm conviction in his voice and used his hands for emphasis. “It’s not about intensity and power. It’s about calm and self control.”

Actually Mike is showing how little he knows about Martina. Martina for a large part of her career was a headcase. She got frustrated and choked on many occasions. She was very much like Amelie Mauresmo- very fit, very strong, attacking the net, but it took her quite a few years before she started winning on regular basis. I think that had she played in the last decade, her record against Serena would be similar to that of Amelie.

mykarma
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:53 PM
Mike Tyson: Navratilova better than Serena, omg thanks for letting us all know that you aren't insane by thinking the contrary
You do know you're talking about Mike Tyson. :lol:

mykarma
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:55 PM
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4395/beysaidsittt0.png
:haha:

brickhousesupporter
Jul 15th, 2010, 11:55 PM
Mike Tyson isn't paid to sit in a commentary box and promote the current game so people don't switch channel. That's the difference here.

Anybody with an ounce of knowledge and impartiality knows Martina Navratilova was greater than Serena Williams. It's really that simple.
.....yes because these are word I would use to decribe Mike Tyson.

Donny
Jul 16th, 2010, 12:01 AM
at least we can't accuse him of being racist.

Individuals can be racist against their own race. See Clarence Thomas, Michelle Malkin, et al.

brickhousesupporter
Jul 16th, 2010, 12:06 AM
Individuals can be racist against their own race. See Clarence Thomas, Michelle Malkin, et al.
or Uncle Ruckus.

Dodoboy.
Jul 16th, 2010, 12:06 AM
at least we can't accuse him of being racist.

http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab351/Jbelle221/GIFs/dont-play-this-trick1.gif

Stamp Paid
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:05 AM
.....spell Navratilova Mike. :rolleyes:LMAO. That reminded me of A Low Down Dirty Shame :haha:

Shame: Mike Tyson better than Muhammad Ali?
Peaches: Thats right
Shame: Mike Tyson can't even spell Muhammad Ali!
Peaches: Now wait a minute Shame, Hold up. Muhammad Ali cant even spell Muhammad Ali.
http://i25.tinypic.com/5obfph.gif

Stamp Paid
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:09 AM
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4395/beysaidsittt0.png
Put him right in his place! :)

Sp!ffy
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:12 AM
How much did she pay him to say that?

danieln1
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:44 AM
This guys also says Martina is the best ever

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/blog/busted_racquet/post/Ranking-the-top-10-women-s-tennis-players-of-all;_ylt=ArlJ37hb32wPjQwX3WnrbJc4v7YF?urn=ten,2562 42

How much is she paying them to stir this shit up?

Baselinebasher
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:34 AM
Too many punches to the head Im afraid :sobbing:

Show some respect. The man is one of the greatest boxers of all time. By the way, he's right. Navratilova >>> Serena by miles.

darrinbaker00
Jul 16th, 2010, 05:33 AM
Coming from Mike, I had to lol.
Why? Mike Tyson is fully aware of the fact that if he had shown more calm and self-control in and out of the ring, his life would be a whole lot different than it is now.

Whitehead's Boy
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:08 AM
"But if you could put those two (Serena and Navratilova) on a neutral surface, Serena would win if both were to play their best."

If they were both to play their best, the first point would never end.

Salve
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:09 AM
"But if you could put those two (Serena and Navratilova) on a neutral surface, Serena would win if both were to play their best."

If they were both to play their best, the first point would never end.

:o Right...

harloo
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:10 AM
If Serena starts veering close to Martina and Chrissy in the slam count then she will be in the conversation. However, I think some people are obsessed with this GOAT talk. Serena is just a great player and her name will be mentioned amongst the greats regardless of what she does from here on out. It's a shame that some people are consumed on proving she isn't worthy but then again Serena doesn't care about this stupid GOAT argument anyways.:lol:

tenn_ace
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:19 AM
I'm no fan of this guy, but Williams fans reaction in this thread is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO predictable. God, has anyone of you who attacked him (brave one, aren't you?) ever thought that he has a right to a different opinion, which he supports with an argument???

Stamp Paid
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:21 AM
Think about it, if Serena wins the US Open this year
she really can get 18 slams...its closer than even I thought it was. As long as she plays until 2012.

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:24 AM
If Serena starts veering close to Martina and Chrissy in the slam count then she will be in the conversation. However, I think some people are obsessed with this GOAT talk. Serena is just a great player and her name will be mentioned amongst the greats regardless of what she does from here on out. It's a shame that some people are consumed on proving she isn't worthy but then again Serena doesn't care about this stupid GOAT argument anyways.:lol:

Precisely! im getting sick of this GOAT bs. Im sure Serena isnt sitting in Florida going ' I need to be GOAT'. I think she justs wants to keep winning and playing well. Its OTHER people (not even her own fans) who are hell bent on getting every damn statistic under the sun to show she isnt 'worthy'. GTFO

tenn_ace
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:27 AM
Think about it, if Serena wins the US Open this year
she really can get 18 slams...its closer than even I thought it was. As long as she plays until 2012.

Well she has not yet... If she does end up winning more Slams than Navratilova and he still argues for Navrtailova, then I'd understand Williams fans reaction, but for now, at best they should have a well supported argument, not a name calling. His opinion definitely has a merit.

spiritedenergy
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:35 AM
i wonder how different were the non slam events in the past (Navratilova time).. how many rounds, i read some tournaments had 2 rounds??? Also how many professional players... the sport was still developing to being fully professional...

supergrunt
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:41 AM
how can martina be the best when she clearly has less slams than steffi and court... i mean clearly the number is all that matters so she's third best in my book because I'm going to be ignorant just for the sake of it and pretend like the numbers are the only things that matter when I know in my heart that I'm just a hater

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:33 AM
Serena dominated an era where people like Venus, Hingis, Capriati, Davenport, Henin, Clijsters, and sometimes even Seles/Graf were in the draw. All those girls are very accomplished players.

What 'era'? Do you mean March 2002 to July 2003?

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:38 AM
i wonder how different were the non slam events in the past (Navratilova time).. how many rounds, i read some tournaments had 2 rounds??? Also how many professional players... the sport was still developing to being fully professional...
Numbers are not the only thing that matters, I agree.

But when you have 40 odd titles (13 slam) to 160 odd titles (18 slam), then they start to become more significant. When you have 9 Wimbledon titles to 4, again. When you have 300+ weeks at number one to 100+...

And let us not forget that if there was ever a time when numbers of slams weren't everything, it was in Martina's day. The Australian Open often wasn't played (in 1986 it wasn't even held!), and for 3 years in Martina's early 20s the French Open was skipped by the top players.

So that again puts Martina's 18 slams, as against Serena's 13, into context.

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:43 AM
Individuals can be racist against their own race. See Clarence Thomas, Michelle Malkin, et al.

Good point. There's plenty of gay homophobes.

I think in this case, even if Mike Tyson was a member of the Klu Klux Klan it would not take away from him just being plain 'right' though.

Renaissance
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:47 AM
BIG JOKE.

SERENA would destroy Navratilova easily.

Navratilova belongs to the past, at that time tennis was far from being competitive, lots of players were still amateurs and the game was slow.At each slams there were only two or three serious contenders for the title.
I respect Navratilova as a champion but please even Graf wouldn't beat Serena.

Pat Bateman
Jul 16th, 2010, 10:05 AM
^^^Please,not more of this horseshit :rolleyes:

Patrick345
Jul 16th, 2010, 10:50 AM
Maybe Martina got worried with Werthiem's article and asked her buddy to say something for her (not like she needs to, she has achieved more than Serena, on a tennis court).We all know how obssessed she is with records and legacy.

I can´t think of better re-assurance than being on the other side of Wertheim´s arguments.

Ferg
Jul 16th, 2010, 10:56 AM
I'm no fan of this guy, but Williams fans reaction in this thread is SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO predictable. God, has anyone of you who attacked him (brave one, aren't you?) ever thought that he has a right to a different opinion, which he supports with an argument???

IKR? If they arent able to counter someones arguments its all just insults. As you said, very predictable.

Sharapowerr
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:45 PM
Imo, Martina was really good, but when she played, you had like a few top players and the rest was average, now it's so much harder to win a GS, the women's tennis, is so much populair at this moment, there are maybe 10 times more young girls that play tennis, than in her time, so the competition is much tougher right now, look at Hingis, ofcourse she was great, she won a lot of GS, but if the same Hingis, would play let's say between 2003 and 2010, she wouldn't have won that amount of GS, and as for the Tyson comment, i think he just says something, i bet he doesn't watch that much tennis..

Sharapowerr
Jul 16th, 2010, 01:47 PM
BIG JOKE.

SERENA would destroy Navratilova easily.

Navratilova belongs to the past, at that time tennis was far from being competitive, lots of players were still amateurs and the game was slow.At each slams there were only two or three serious contenders for the title.
I respect Navratilova as a champion but please even Graf wouldn't beat Serena.

That's what i mean, i do agree a 100%:)

Whitehead's Boy
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:05 PM
For the comparison to be fair, you would have to assume how would Navratilova play if she was born the same year as Serena. If you watch videos from the 80s, they were not playing the same sport back then. That "Serena at her best would beat Navratilova at her best" is meaningless. of course she would. So what?

Brena
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:06 PM
Serena should bite off his ear for this. :(

narutos
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:13 PM
Martina never had to deal with big serves or big return I mean really big serves or return I'm nit even sure she can return Serena's serve:lol:

Donny
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:19 PM
What 'era'? Do you mean March 2002 to July 2003?

Serena's won 12 of the 33 majors played since RG 02. Pretty dominant if you ask me.

The Witch-king
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:24 PM
Well if Mike Tyson said it must be true :shrug:

mykarma
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:31 PM
http://i879.photobucket.com/albums/ab351/Jbelle221/GIFs/dont-play-this-trick1.gif
That gif says it all.

Baselinebasher
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:36 PM
Serena should bite off his ear for this. :(

Or threaten to shove tennis ball down his throat.

homogenius
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:42 PM
Serena's won 12 of the 33 majors played since RG 02. Pretty dominant if you ask me.

12 of 34 I think :unsure:(if you include RG02) and she missed 5 of them (12/29 played).

In the same time, Henin won 7 of the 30 slams played since RG03 but she didn't play in 10 of them (7/20).Not bad as well.

darrinbaker00
Jul 16th, 2010, 02:42 PM
Serena's won 12 of the 33 majors played since RG 02. Pretty dominant if you ask me.
Serena's dominance at the majors shouldn't be questioned, Donny, but those aren't the only four tournaments played during the year. Chris Evert wouldn't have won 90 percent of her matches if she didn't try to win 100 percent of them. Martina Navratilova wouldn't have won 167 singles titles and 177 doubles titles if she only concentrated on winning majors and not winning, period. In my opinion, the true greats of the game "bring it" whenever they step on the court, not just when the big money is on the line.

harloo
Jul 16th, 2010, 03:13 PM
He spoke with firm conviction in his voice and used his hands for emphasis. “It’s not about intensity and power. It’s about calm and self control.”

Actually Mike is showing how little he knows about Martina. Martina for a large part of her career was a headcase. She got frustrated and choked on many occasions. She was very much like Amelie Mauresmo- very fit, very strong, attacking the net, but it took her quite a few years before she started winning on regular basis. I think that had she played in the last decade, her record against Serena would be similar to that of Amelie.

:haha::haha:That part of the article had me scratching my head. How are you going to claim"it's about calm and self control" as it pertains to a Martina vs. Serena matchup when history shows us that Martina was a head case early in her career? Serena won her first singles slam at the age of 17, became a headcase for a while, and then won four straight at age 22. On the other hand Martina won her first at the age of 21 and two more by 25. So it took her a while to stop choking and get her game under control to start winning on a consistent basis. The sad fact is Mike Tyson (by his own admission) is a friend of Martina who has a personal bias for her. Their is nothing wrong with that at all but at least don't make it so obvious.:lol:

Then all of the sudden it's not about one match but longevity."“It’s not about one match. It’s about consistency, longevity, doing it over and over. If you say Serena is the best, then why can’t she break Martina’s record?” He never considers the fact that Serena has won the AO 5 times, Wimbledon 4 times, the US Open 3 times, and the FO once and she's 28. That shows consistency, doing it over and over. Martina only had three single slams at the age of 25 and really started to peak late in her career. If Serena stays healthy and focused their is no reason she can't add to her slam count, possibly match Martina and Chrissy, or even surpass them. ;):wavey:

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:28 PM
BIG JOKE.

SERENA would destroy Navratilova easily.

Navratilova belongs to the past, at that time tennis was far from being competitive, lots of players were still amateurs and the game was slow.At each slams there were only two or three serious contenders for the title.
I respect Navratilova as a champion but please even Graf wouldn't beat Serena.

Graf and Navratilova would only struggle against Serena's serve, as players do today.

From the baseline Graf would make Serena look like a hippopotamus. Serena has terrible footwork, weight transference and even technique. She's saved by a fairly crisp connection. With wooden rackets, Serena of NOW would have been an average player with a great serve. Never has there been a champion with such elementary weaknesses as Serena.


Navratilova at the net would have left Serena just standing still.

Sharapowerr
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:32 PM
Serena hasn't got terrible footwork..

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:33 PM
Serena's won 12 of the 33 majors played since RG 02. Pretty dominant if you ask me.

That's roughly 1 in 3.


If I get 1 in 3 right in an exam, does that mean I was predominantly right? It's impressive, but not dominant. More slams than not are won by other players. Almost double the amount Serena wins are won by other players, in fact.


She's only won 3 slams in a year once for heaven's sake - 8 years ago!

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:36 PM
Serena hasn't got terrible footwork..

By the standards of all the other greats, it's awful. That's the one thing all great players had in common - until Serena, with her bulging biceps and over-sized sweet spot.

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:39 PM
Now Serena's footwork is just god awful right?? GMAFB.
Sidebar: Im so glad that we are using Mike Tyson as the pillar of which we get all tennis questions answered.

AnywhereButHome
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:41 PM
Graf and Navratilova would only struggle against Serena's serve, as players do today.

From the baseline Graf would make Serena look like a hippopotamus. Serena has terrible footwork, weight transference and even technique. She's saved by a fairly crisp connection. With wooden rackets, Serena of NOW would have been an average player with a great serve. Never has there been a champion with such elementary weaknesses as Serena.


Navratilova at the net would have left Serena just standing still.

:bigcry::haha::haha:

AnywhereButHome
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:42 PM
BIG JOKE.

SERENA would destroy Navratilova easily.

Navratilova belongs to the past, at that time tennis was far from being competitive, lots of players were still amateurs and the game was slow.At each slams there were only two or three serious contenders for the title.
I respect Navratilova as a champion but please even Graf wouldn't beat Serena.

:yeah:

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:43 PM
If Serena stays healthy and focused their is no reason she can't add to her slam count, possibly match Martina and Chrissy, or even surpass them. ;):wavey:

I agree on that.

Although, I think of Serena's career in two parts. Pre-2007 and 2007 onwards.

Since January 2007, Serena has picked up 6 slams out of 15.

If she continues at that rate, she'll be on 19 by Roland Garros of 2014. However, she'll be pushing 33 by then. Injuries might come along.


The only reason I think she'll do it is because there's no competition. All these girls coming up are average, Venus is slowly declining, while Clijsters and Henin are fading themselves and won't be playing in 2014. Serena just has to keep serving.

brickhousesupporter
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:43 PM
That's roughly 1 in 3.


If I get 1 in 3 right in an exam, does that mean I was predominantly right? It's impressive, but not dominant. More slams than not are won by other players. Almost double the amount Serena wins are won by other players, in fact.


She's only won 3 slams in a year once for heaven's sake - 8 years ago!
You know I could go and look up Martinas Slams won/slams played and apply it to the same completely ridiculous example you provided, but that would make me look more ridiculous than you.

Baselinebasher
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:44 PM
:bigcry::haha::haha:

He's right though, Graf OR Seles in their prime would annihilate Serena from baseline.

DefyingGravity
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:46 PM
Well...Martina still has more Grand Slams than Serena....and more weeks at number one....and more tournament wins....and was a part of one of the greatest rivalries in sport....and played till she was 50...and won a grand slam title of some sort in the 70's AND in the 2000's.....I mean...he's not lying....

Matt01
Jul 16th, 2010, 04:48 PM
Mike Tyson is right, I don't know what there is still to discuss :shrug:


Serena's dominance at the majors shouldn't be questioned, Donny, but those aren't the only four tournaments played during the year. Chris Evert wouldn't have won 90 percent of her matches if she didn't try to win 100 percent of them. Martina Navratilova wouldn't have won 167 singles titles and 177 doubles titles if she only concentrated on winning majors and not winning, period. In my opinion, the true greats of the game "bring it" whenever they step on the court, not just when the big money is on the line.


Good post except for the bolded part. Serena only cares about the Slams because that is the easiest way to became more famous and recognized, not because she can win the "big money" there.

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 05:02 PM
You know I could go and look up Martinas Slams won/slams played and apply it to the same completely ridiculous example you provided, but that would make me look more ridiculous than you.

You'd look ridiculous even trying to compare Serena's figures with Martina's.

You'd find more grandslam finals and semi-finals, and you'd also find that from the Australian Open of 1981- the US Open of 1987*, Navratilova won 15 out of 24 slams. That's almost 2 in 3.

(*1986 Australian Open not held; lost to Shriver in 82 US Open QF; to also ran in 83 French R3; to Sukova in 84 Australia SF; to Evert in 1985 French Open F; to Mandlikova in 85 US Open F; to Evert in 1986 French Open F; to Graf in 1987 French Open F)


She also won 8 YEC in her career - Martina, that is. Serena of course has only won 3.

calou
Jul 16th, 2010, 05:20 PM
This guys also says Martina is the best ever

http://sports.yahoo.com/tennis/blog/busted_racquet/post/Ranking-the-top-10-women-s-tennis-players-of-all;_ylt=ArlJ37hb32wPjQwX3WnrbJc4v7YF?urn=ten,2562 42

How much is she paying them to stir this shit up?

Nothing :devil:this guy understand the tennis's game :)

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:30 PM
Nothing :devil:this guy understand the tennis's game :)

No he does not. He's another idiot.


Lenglen, Wills Moody, Connolly and King must all be placed above Henin, Venus and probably even Seles or Goolagong for the exercise to have any credibility whatsover.

Henin, Venus and Hingis are with the likes of Marble, Bueno, Gibson, etc.

sipnsurfMurph
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:42 PM
I'd pay good money just to hear Mike say "Navratilova".

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:45 PM
so many hits to his head and he's still very smart, first the quality cameo in Hangover and then this comment:yeah: even better he didn't let the fact that he's black getting in the way when picking between those two, guy with a sound mind:yeah:

brickhousesupporter
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:52 PM
so many hits to his head and he's still very smart, first the quality cameo in Hangover and then this comment:yeah: even better he didn't let the fact that he's black getting in the way when picking between those two, guy with a sound mind:yeah:


I have no words right now.
http://i50.tinypic.com/2zzj0qe.jpg

mykarma
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:55 PM
I have no words right now.
http://i50.tinypic.com/2zzj0qe.jpg
:lol: this

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:56 PM
no intention to be racist

just a simple example:
ask all American NBA players to pick between Serena and Navratilova
then ask all American NHL players the same

you can't deny the difference will be massive;)

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:56 PM
I have no words right now.
http://i50.tinypic.com/2zzj0qe.jpg

:spit::spit:
That gif explains it all.
Wendy Williams! How YOU doin?

mykarma
Jul 16th, 2010, 06:59 PM
no intention to be racist

just a simple example:
ask all American NBA players to pick between Serena and Navratilova
then ask all American NHL players the same

you can't deny the difference will be massive;)
yeah right

Serenita
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:06 PM
I have no words right now.
http://i50.tinypic.com/2zzj0qe.jpg

exactly.

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:13 PM
Saying racism is not only existent, but very present, is a realistic point of view. I've participated in uncountable demonstrations against right extreme parties here, so I know what I'm talking about.

If you deny this, you're simply naive.

Steffica Greles
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:16 PM
Serena's dominance at the majors shouldn't be questioned

Yes it should. 12 slams in 33 (or 13 in 39 since her first) is not 'dominance' by any stretch of the imagination (*and those figures don't include those she's been forced to miss)


It's impressive, yes. But dominance is when a player takes the lion's share, or at least half to even have a case. Serena has taken only a third.

Salve
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:21 PM
no intention to be racist

just a simple example:
ask all American NBA players to pick between Serena and Navratilova
then ask all American NHL players the same

you can't deny the difference will be massive;)

Why would there be such a massive difference? I am confused.

AcesHigh
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:28 PM
Yes it should. 12 slams in 33 (or 13 in 39 since her first) is not 'dominance' by any stretch of the imagination (*and those figures don't include those she's been forced to miss)


It's impressive, yes. But dominance is when a player takes the lion's share, or at least half to even have a case. Serena has taken only a third.

From her first to her last... Martina won about 18 out of 42... i guess that's not dominance either?

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:29 PM
What does race have anything to do with it?

brickhousesupporter
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:30 PM
From her first to her last... Martina won about 18 out of 42... i guess that's not dominance either?

That's roughly 1 in 3.


If I get 1 in 3 right in an exam, does that mean I was predominantly right? It's impressive, but not dominant. More slams than not are won by other players. Almost double the amount Serena wins are won by other players, in fact.


She's only won 3 slams in a year once for heaven's sake - 8 years ago!

You know I could go and look up Martinas Slams won/slams played and apply it to the same completely ridiculous example you provided, but that would make me look more ridiculous than you.

Leave it alone Aceshigh.........don't stoop to his level.

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:31 PM
It should not. But it does.

Calypso
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:33 PM
I'd pay good money just to hear Mike say "Navratilova".

:lol:

Stats - Navratilova
PeakRena vs Peak-vratilova - Serena most of the time imo.

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:35 PM
It should not. But it does.

But what does it have to do with THIS argument?

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:35 PM
Why would there be such a massive difference? I am confused.

never mind, i'll give you an easier example

what do you think among all Williams supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Davenport supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Capriati supporters is the percentage of Blacks?

now compare these 3 numbers and explain to me the skin colour doesn't play a role

Serenita
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:40 PM
:o

Gdsimmons
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:45 PM
never mind, i'll give you an easier example

what do you think among all Williams supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Davenport supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Capriati supporters is the percentage of Blacks?

now compare these 3 numbers and explain to me the skin colour doesn't play a role

Wow. You are REALLY grasping!

mykarma
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:53 PM
never mind, i'll give you an easier example

what do you think among all Williams supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Davenport supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Capriati supporters is the percentage of Blacks?

now compare these 3 numbers and explain to me the skin colour doesn't play a role
Damn this is ridiculous. I've never heard anyone ask what percentage of whites support anyone white. This thread needs to be closed. I'm outta here. :bolt:

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:55 PM
Stop whining, folks. I'm just realistic.:shrug: And your reactions clearly show you answered these questions the way I thought you would.

The Witch-king
Jul 16th, 2010, 07:55 PM
What does race have anything to do with it?

Remember black people think everything that happens to them has to do with race and when they point it out, sensible white-folk can't take them seriously because they are so darn one-dimensional!:kiss:

Donny
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:09 PM
so many hits to his head and he's still very smart, first the quality cameo in Hangover and then this comment:yeah: even better he didn't let the fact that he's black getting in the way when picking between those two, guy with a sound mind:yeah:

no intention to be racist

just a simple example:
ask all American NBA players to pick between Serena and Navratilova
then ask all American NHL players the same

you can't deny the difference will be massive;)

Saying racism is not only existent, but very present, is a realistic point of view. I've participated in uncountable demonstrations against right extreme parties here, so I know what I'm talking about.

If you deny this, you're simply naive.

WHere's the outrage for "pulling the race card"? Or did every non Serena fan on here go blind?

Serenita
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:12 PM
WHere's the outrage for "pulling the race card"? Or did every non Serena fan on here go blind?

I know right ...HYPOCRITES!!!!!!!...but whats new :shrug:

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:12 PM
ok, a brief summary:
I think Navratilova is better.
People asked me to elaborate.
Referring to the post I did before, his origin would make him more likely to support Serena. (If you think I'm racist due to writing that, feel free to do so. But that's simply the truth.)
On the other hand, the fact that he played Navratilova, makes him not so neutral anymore.
I still think he's right.

If anybody feels offended by what I wrote, I apologize as it was not my intention. I know I can be pretty harsh sometimes. But that's how it is. And as I wrote before, I'm engaged in several forms of anti-discrimination (including race) activities and programs where I live, which might give me a somehow different approach to the whole thing than most others.:wavey:

Matt01
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:15 PM
I agree with Deck :lol:

dsanders06
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:16 PM
Fyi, the vast majority of Serena "haters" don't think like this idiot Deck does.

VishaalMaria
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:25 PM
I agree with Deck :lol:

That's not something to advertise.

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:34 PM
one final word:
you guys shouting "racism" when there's really nothing to shout out about is the biggest obstacle to equality in our society:o

Salve
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:39 PM
one final word:
you guys shouting "racism" when there's really nothing to shout out about is the biggest obstacle to equality in our society:o

People like you are the biggest threat to "equality in or society." :o

It doesn't matter what you post in this thread, though, because at the end of the day, I know that I am better than you and my opinion matters more than yours.

The end. Have a wonderful life filled with bigotry and apathy.

brickhousesupporter
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:40 PM
so many hits to his head and he's still very smart, first the quality cameo in Hangover and then this comment:yeah: even better he didn't let the fact that he's black getting in the way when picking between those two, guy with a sound mind:yeah:

never mind, i'll give you an easier example

what do you think among all Williams supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Davenport supporters is the percentage of Blacks?
what do you think among all Capriati supporters is the percentage of Blacks?

now compare these 3 numbers and explain to me the skin colour doesn't play a role

one final word:
you guys shouting "racism" when there's really nothing to shout out about is the biggest obstacle to equality in our society:o


Right, and you thinking that a black man has to go outside of his normal self to be objective when it comes to choosing between a white and black athlete is helping the cause. Get the fuck out of here!

http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af19/rudeboy77/Gifs/29yph91.gif

HRHoliviasmith
Jul 16th, 2010, 08:48 PM
I agree with Deck :lol:

well this is a bombshell if I've ever heard one. you should start a thread.

thrust
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:12 PM
Martina, playing with todays equipment would be as strong as Serena. She, so far, has superior achievements than Serena while having to compete against two of the greatest players of all time, Evert and Graf. Today, Serena is competing mainly against 2nd tier players. She lost to Kim at the USO, was taken to 3 sets by a player just back from nearly a 2 year absence in this years AO, beat noone to win Wimbledon, lost in the quarters at the French. Last year the only great player she beat was her sister, who is just past her prime. In 07, she lost to Henin in 3 Slams. In 08 she lost to Venus in the Wimby final and beat Jelena, hardly an all-time great in the USO finals. Competition does count.

Deck
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:21 PM
Right, and you thinking that a black man has to go outside of his normal self to be objective when it comes to choosing between a white and black athlete is helping the cause. Get the fuck out of here!


I would never refer to a single person as everybody has his own motivations for supporting a player.

But referring to a group, that's how it is. And I'm not saying a random black person supporting Chanda Rubin is racist because he does so even if the skin color could have caused a (very likely subconscious) attraction. Imagine the 13-year-old girl, daughter of African immigrants, living under very poor circumstances in the US watching Serena Williams winning the Australian Open this year. 20 years later she is a successful attorney with a nice house and a wonderful family. Asked for the most inspirational moment of her life she mentions Serena's win. Now is she racist because she didn't say Clijsters US Open 2009? Of course not. People should finally see that preference (not only in tennis) is race-based on so many occasions and that it will always be like that. But that doesn't make it racist.

Wimbledon9
Jul 16th, 2010, 09:25 PM
First this article is weeks older than you think, it is from before Wimbledon and all the goat bullshit. Mike Tyson is entitled to have this opinion after all he played against Martina. Now the thing about the number of grandslams it is so important all of a sudden not in the old days Martina and Chris skipped a couple of Australian Opens because it was mostly at the end of the year they got payed badly and they could not care about the women. Billy Jean King with her stupid world teamtennis is at fault for skipping the French Open by Chris and Martina. You do not realize enough that Chris and Martina played in the same time one a little earlier (Chris) the other a little later (Martina)Is it not a nice thought that they have the same number of single grandslams (doubles is a different story). So together 36 and I know that if only one had been around the other one would not have 36 but lots more. They played small tournaments because the people in Chicago, Oakland, Filderstad and Brighton did want to see the best players. Not like Serena who played four or five tournaments in the first half of the year she is always injured bit never miracelously during a grandslam tournament. The serve was originally to start the game of tennis otherwise we would not have instruction books with forehands, backhands, smashes, volleys, dropvolleys, dropshots and lobs to name a few. Now the players of good technical schools like the Czech school.(Navratilova, Mandlikova, Novotna and even the new girl Petra Kvitova know all these strokes, but I doubt very much that Serena knows them all otherwise you want to show them. To call the serve the best stroke is a joke a couple of aces is nice but not constantly. The way a person plays is very important to me and I can say I prefer the Czech school.

Pat Bateman
Jul 17th, 2010, 12:26 AM
so many hits to his head and he's still very smart, first the quality cameo in Hangover and then this comment:yeah: even better he didn't let the fact that he's black getting in the way when picking between those two, guy with a sound mind:yeah:)

I agree. Tyson made a very bold and brave (and correct) statement:worship: Bet he gets a lot of grief for it. Of course, I'm sure WS-tards wouldn't have the stones to say anything to Mike's face.