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View Full Version : So its bad for the tour if a player makes the semis by holding her nerve,


Ferg
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:15 PM
unlike the top players? So the tour should just be the top players winning even if they play shockingly bad and the other player doesnt? k.

Pops Maellard
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:16 PM
Simple solution, the top players should play better.

Basically these scrubs (except Vera who's at least been #5 before) are waiting to get their ass kicked by Serena because they're totally out of their depth that far in a slam.

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:17 PM
no, its bad if the semifinalist dont play well to get there...... Vera is a good player. former top 5, my problem with her is that theres is a 80% chance she is gonna choke in that Semifinal and Pironkova will make a slam final who lets face it, just put the ball in play today. and can probably do that against Vera... and one player putting the ball in play and the other hitting the net spraying balls well wide is not good for the tour.

RenaSlam.
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:18 PM
I mean, it's not great. Look at Franny after her FO win. 2 losses in a row :help:

Most of these cinderella runs never turn into anything after they end, anyway.

tennnisfannn
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:18 PM
Good thread, it is one of those things i ddon't get, people root against top players then whine that the tour need saving when the under dog wins.

Pops Maellard
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:19 PM
I mean, it's not great. Look at Franny after her FO win. 2 losses in a row :help:

Most of these cinderella runs never turn into anything after they end, anyway.
This. I mean, look at Oudin, Jie etc. now. They're not doing shit. :tape:

These upsets wouldn't be so bad if they actually lead to something but they never do.

mure
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:20 PM
Flameon was bitching the other day because there were no upsets in the first week :lol:

tennnisfannn
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:20 PM
I mean, it's not great. Look at Franny after her FO win. 2 losses in a row :help:

Most of these cinderella runs never turn into anything after they end, anyway.
Consider serena, her last 4 titles have been 3 slams and a YEC, she also fizzles out after the slams- bad example I know but it makes a point.

miffedmax
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:24 PM
You can't take anything from Pironkova's performance today.

But given her history, you just can't argue that she's an elite player on a consistent level. As I've said countless times before, I believe a WTA where anyone can be #1 would soon be a WTA where anyone could win a slam.

The emergence of a new star is always good. The occasional fluke run makes things interesting. But when the sport starts to turn into a series of flukey runs--and it hasn't yet, but it's showing signs it might--then it is bad for the tour.

You can't just view today in isolation.

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:26 PM
You can't take anything from Pironkova's performance today.

But given her history, you just can't argue that she's an elite player on a consistent level. As I've said countless times before, I believe a WTA where anyone can be #1 would soon be a WTA where anyone could win a slam.

The emergence of a new star is always good. The occasional fluke run makes things interesting. But when the sport starts to turn into a series of flukey runs--and it hasn't yet, but it's showing signs it might--then it is bad for the tour.

You can't just view today in isolation.

anyone could have beaten Venus today.....

serenus_2k8
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:29 PM
People want the biggest players and teams at the biggest events. Its what sports is all about.

Y'all are idiots if you think any of the SF ticket holders will be in any way pleased about watching Pironkova v Zvonareva instead of Venus v Kim. Sort it out ye?

Gregorio87
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:29 PM
I have no problem with Kvitova, Pironkova, Kanepi etc. reaching the QF in a slam, but when Kvitova plays with Kanepi in the QF and Pironkova will play with Zvonareva in the semis, the the only thing I can say is: :help:

Hian
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:31 PM
I have no problem with Kvitova, Pironkova, Kanepi etc. reaching the QF in a slam, but when Kvitova plays with Kanepi in the QF and Pironkova will play with Zvonareva in the semis, the the only thing I can say is: :help:

This.
I'm happy for Tsveti and Vera, but a semi between these two girls is too much.
I think pushers should be out of top 10 :angel:

Reptilia
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:35 PM
Big girls really need to sort their shit out!
Serena ftw plz

cellophane
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:35 PM
unlike the top players? So the tour should just be the top players winning even if they play shockingly bad and the other player doesnt? k.

It's bad for the tour when the top players play like shit.

mure
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:37 PM
People want the biggest players and teams at the biggest events. Its what sports is all about.




ok that's the shitiest definition of sports i've ever read.Unless you're talking about WWF...Sports is about anyone competing having a fair chance for the win..Matches are played and won on the courts not on papers!

Jakeev
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:39 PM
People want the biggest players and teams at the biggest events. Its what sports is all about.

Y'all are idiots if you think any of the SF ticket holders will be in any way pleased about watching Pironkova v Zvonareva instead of Venus v Kim. Sort it out ye?
With that being said, why wasn't the crowd trying to get Venus going then?

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:39 PM
thank you, people are acting like these players played well to get there... The truth is the top players sucked it up. That is never good for the game.

tennnisfannn
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:40 PM
Ths is the month of upsets, ask France and Italy about their world cup campaign!

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:40 PM
With that being said, why wasn't the crowd trying to get Venus going then?

They were, but Venus was just playing too bad to get behind what she was doing out there.. There were loud cheers when Venus actually did something good... You know those 5 points....

scheele
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:41 PM
Flameon was bitching the other day because there were no upsets in the first week :lol:

:haha:

canuckfan
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:41 PM
It's bad for the tour when the top players play like shit.

Exactly. I'd rather see a fluke run by a scrub playing well than a top player bullshitting her way to the final.

Pops Maellard
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:43 PM
Flameon was bitching the other day because there were no upsets in the first week :lol:
Um no I wasn't. :scratch:

serenus_2k8
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:44 PM
ok that's the shitiest definition of sports i've ever read.Unless you're talking about WWF...Sports is about anyone competing having a fair chance for the win..Matches are played and won on the courts not on papers!

:tape:

People tune into big matches because thats what they love to see, e.g. Spain v Portugal tonight. Far less people will care about matches like Paraguay v Japan and its thanks to those big matches that the sport survives, so as nice as your little definition is it wouldnt sell tickets in the long term, I assure you :wavey:

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:47 PM
no, its bad if the semifinalist dont play well to get there...... Vera is a good player. former top 5, my problem with her is that theres is a 80% chance she is gonna choke in that Semifinal and Pironkova will make a slam final who lets face it, just put the ball in play today. and can probably do that against Vera... and one player putting the ball in play and the other hitting the net spraying balls well wide is not good for the tour.

Pironkova is number 4 in the ace department, number 3 in serve speed, and number one in first serve returns won.(leads with over 12 points).

http://www.wimbledon.org/en_GB/scores/extrastats/f_srv_ret_won_ws.html

She hit 42 winners yesterday against Bartoli, which was alot more winners than both Serena, Venus and Kim(twice as many as Kim in a three set match) made.

Some people obviously have no idea what they are talking about, Pironkova deserves to be here. She has still to lose a set.

M.P
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:49 PM
you guys get a life
Vera is a former top 5
what the hell you guys talking about

Pops Maellard
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:51 PM
Pironkova is number 4 in the ace department, number 3 in serve speed, and number one in first serve returns won.(leads with over 12 points).

http://www.wimbledon.org/en_GB/scores/extrastats/f_srv_ret_won_ws.html

She hit 42 winners yesterday against Bartoli, which was alot more winners than both Serena, Venus and Kim(twice as many as Kim in a three set match) made.

Some people obviously have no idea what they are talking about, Pironkova deserves to be here. She has still to lose a set.
Bartoli's slow.

Anyway IF Tsveti can justify this result then we'll look back and think it wasn't so bad but until then it's just another fluke run in the WTA's ever-growing collection. ;)

Sally Todd
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:52 PM
Exactly. I'd rather see a fluke run by a scrub playing well than a top player bullshitting her way to the final.

Exactly. This is tennis or sport -- not a beauty or popularity contest.

It's an insult to the players who win to claim their wins are bad for the WTA. So condescending and entitled, too.

Pironkova has proven herself against Venus. This is twice now she's beaten Vee at a major. Credit to her.

Venus is my favorite player on the tour. But the WTA doesn't need rescuing because she isn't in the mix at Wimbledon.

Change and variety and new players and new stories can be good. If anything the dominance of the old guard is getting stale.

I do hope Venus wins at least one or two more majors though. I realize the odds are getting worse.

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:53 PM
Bartoli's slow.

Anyway IF Tsveti can justify this result then we'll look back and think it wasn't so bad but until then it's just another fluke run in the WTA's ever-growing collection. ;)

Well she is 22 so plenty of time.:wavey:

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:53 PM
Pironkova is number 4 in the ace department, number 3 in serve speed, and number one in first serve returns won.(leads with over 12 points).

http://www.wimbledon.org/en_GB/scores/extrastats/f_srv_ret_won_ws.html

She hit 42 winners yesterday against Bartoli, which was alot more winners than both Serena, Venus and Kim(twice as many as Kim in a three set match) made.

Some people obviously have no idea what they are talking about, Pironkova deserves to be here. She has still to lose a set.

I clearly said today....... where she just put the ball in play.....

RenaSlam.
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:54 PM
Bartoli's slow.

Anyway IF Tsveti can justify this result then we'll look back and think it wasn't so bad but until then it's just another fluke run in the WTA's ever-growing collection. ;)

DIS.

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:54 PM
Bartoli's slow.


Did you watch the match:rolleyes::confused:

Pops Maellard
Jun 29th, 2010, 02:57 PM
Did you watch the match:rolleyes::confused:
No, but everyone knows Bartoli's a rather poor defender. :)

Don't get me wrong, it's not so much I'm mad at Tsveti I'm more mad at the top players who aren't playing better. :(

Mixal
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:00 PM
:tape:

People tune into big matches because thats what they love to see, e.g. Spain v Portugal tonight. Far less people will care about matches like Paraguay v Japan and its thanks to those big matches that the sport survives, so as nice as your little definition is it wouldnt sell tickets in the long term, I assure you :wavey:

People who tune in big matches are obviously not REAL fans of this sport. I like football, but I'm only going to see the "big" match today. But that also means I might be missing a very good match and end up watching some bore. Get it?

If you're Serena fan, I think it would be normal to watch Kvitova Kanepi as one of the are possibly her next opponents.

People who care about tennis (and not just about 2-3 players) will watch these matches.

Look, we were so looking forward to Kim vs Justine, and it was terrible.

Just my 2 cents...

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:01 PM
I clearly said today....... where she just put the ball in play.....

Umm than I am sorry mate but you do not understand tennis. Tennis is not just about who makes the most winners or who hits the hardest. Its also about playing intelligently, ask any professional tennis player and they will tell you that Tzveti won because she executed her game plan well, she used her head and mixed things up with slices, change of pace, shot selection. She knew that she could not beat Venus by outhitting her. She gave Venus no rhytmn on her shots and Venus's confidence went out the window, that is why she started missing so much of those balls.

Venus did not play good tennis today but she was not expecting Pironkova to play like this and she got frustrated, her game fell apart, its as simple as that.

There is more to tennis than outhitting your opponents.

Venus was not prepared today.

Sean.
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:01 PM
This.
I'm happy for Tsveti and Vera, but a semi between these two girls is too much.
I think pushers should be out of top 10 :angel:

You think Bepa & Tsveti are pushers? :smash:

BuTtErFrEnA
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:01 PM
Consider serena, her last 4 titles have been 3 slams and a YEC, she also fizzles out after the slams- bad example I know but it makes a point.

how does that make a point?? she shows up at slams and has 12

BuTtErFrEnA
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:03 PM
it's not that the lower ranked players are winning...it's more how top players are losing


but it's a double standard on the wta anyways so this won't go anywhere

nevetssllim
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:04 PM
I mean, it's not great. Look at Franny after her FO win. 2 losses in a row :help:

Most of these cinderella runs never turn into anything after they end, anyway.

I'd give Francesca a bit more time but I agree. It's all well and good when someone has a breakthrough but it's a bit disappointing and frustrating when they are unable to back it up and play as well as they did to win that big tournament.

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:07 PM
it's not that the lower ranked players are winning...it's more how top players are losing


but it's a double standard on the wta anyways so this won't go anywhere

Its not a double standard.... please believe that is my biggest problem with the men's tour. I have a problem when the scrubs choke and the top players (Federere/Roddick/Nadal/etc...) are praised for "raising" their game.....

BuTtErFrEnA
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:09 PM
Its not a double standard.... please believe that is my biggest problem with the men's tour. I have a problem when the scrubs choke and the top players (Federere/Roddick/Nadal/etc...) are praised for "raising" their game.....


it's a double standard because you hear about the depth of the atp

just because YOU individually don't think so, it doesn't mean the vast majority of the tennis world thinks so...which is the issue

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:11 PM
Umm than I am sorry mate but you do not understand tennis. Tennis is not just about who makes the most winners or who hits the hardest. Its also about playing intelligently, ask any professional tennis player and they will tell you that Tzveti won because she executed her game plan well, she used her head and mixed things up with slices, change of pace, shot selection. She knew that she could not beat Venus by outhitting her. She gave Venus no rhytmn on her shots and Venus's confidence went out the window, that is why she started missing so much of those balls.

Venus did not play good tennis today but she was not expecting Pironkova to play like this and she got frustrated, her game fell apart, its as simple as that.

There is more to tennis than outhitting your opponents.

Venus was not prepared today.

She started off missing balls.... You dont know what you are talking about. The double faults 2 in a row when on serve..... The volley's dead into the net or well wide. Sorry you have no clue what you are talking about. Slice/ spin/ change of pace doesnt play into the serve and volley game. This isnt the first time this year Venus has just not shown up on court.

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:14 PM
Simple solution, the top players should play better.

Basically these scrubs (except Vera who's at least been #5 before) are waiting to get their ass kicked by Serena because they're totally out of their depth that far in a slam.
"Scrubs" don't make it to the main draw of any WTA event, much less the semifinals of Wimbledon.

The Dawntreader
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:15 PM
If you had listened to Zvonareva's pre-match interview on the BBC, it was impressive to see how determined she was to beat elite opposition.

People should be thankful for players overcoming their mental frailities and actually discovering a great level of tennis on the biggest of stages.

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:16 PM
"Scrubs" don't make it to the main draw of any WTA event, much less the semifinals of Wimbledon.

oh yes they do. I can name some.... Stevenson...Chavetdazki....Vaidsiova...

Rome
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:17 PM
With that being said, why wasn't the crowd trying to get Venus going then?

They tried to help Kim lol

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:18 PM
If you had listened to Zvonareva's pre-match interview on the BBC, it was impressive to see how determined she was to beat elite opposition.

People should be thankful for players overcoming their mental frailities and actually discovering a great level of tennis on the biggest of stages.

I repeat I like Bepa, she was playing great tennis the last couple year before she got injured, BUT I have this feeling she is gonna choke in the semi's... :sobbing:

twight6
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:18 PM
I have no problem with Kvitova, Pironkova, Kanepi etc. reaching the QF in a slam, but when Kvitova plays with Kanepi in the QF and Pironkova will play with Zvonareva in the semis, the the only thing I can say is: :help:

PERFECT post :yeah:

Surprising runs by players are good for the game. If it were ALWAYS the top players, there'd be no hope for anyone else. It's good for the game when lower ranked players put together a good, surprising run. HOWEVER, when top players completely collapse, or there aren't even enough "good" players to fill out the draw (:help: ), and an entire half of the draw opens up, so you get Kvitova v. Kanepi and Pironkova v. Zvonareva... :smash:

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:18 PM
She started off missing balls.... You dont know what you are talking about. The double faults 2 in a row when on serve..... The volley's dead into the net or well wide. Sorry you have no clue what you are talking about. Slice/ spin/ change of pace doesnt play into the serve and volley game. This isnt the first time this year Venus has just not shown up on court.

Actually Venus started of well and even had an oppertunity to lead 3-1 in that first serve. Its all mentality, when things are not going your way and when you do not have a plan B, than often times your game completely falls apart. You lose confidence and start making more errors, start making double faults. A lot of tennis is in the head, when you do not have a plan B and you start getting frustrated than your game emplodes. Especially if you are a 30+ year old champion who has an enormous amount of pressure to win against a player ranked in the 80's.

mboyle
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:19 PM
It's bad for the tour when the top players play like shit.
This. I'm so embarrassed. Sharapova should have been a finalist, the way she was playing.

sammy01
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:20 PM
it's a double standard because you hear about the depth of the atp

just because YOU individually don't think so, it doesn't mean the vast majority of the tennis world thinks so...which is the issue

but come on, did venus play anywhere near as well as roddick? did venus put up anywhere near as much fight?

the WTA gets critisised because very rarely do top players get upset playing well or decently. i mean the CSN vs venus match is always talked about with praise as CSN earned that upset and played some damn good tennis to win it.

if federer or nadal lose before the final it will be because someone plays a great match against them, they aren't going to give away matches against themselves in slams.

Patrick345
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:21 PM
Flameon was bitching the other day because there were no upsets in the first week :lol:

Because Ana failed to deliver the upset against Peer. :p

twight6
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:24 PM
oh yes they do. I can name some.... Stevenson...Chavetdazki....Vaidsiova...

Oh dear lord :help: One of the dumbest posts I've ever read :smash:

At least spell their names right if you're going to insult them :weirdo:

mure
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:24 PM
Federer played a great game against the mighty Falla..what else are we gonna read here

TZVETI83
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:25 PM
Oh dear lord :help: One of the dumbest posts I've ever read :smash:

At least spell their names right if you're going to insult them :weirdo:

I second this. :worship:

The comment by that poster was just borderline retarded.

Patrick345
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:25 PM
Pironkova has beaten an in-form Kulikova, a former finalist in Bartoli and a five time champion in Venus. Zvonareva´s whole draw has gone according to plan and she whooped them all. Wickmayer, Jankovic and Clijsters. Either girl earned that final. It´s not like they Wozniacki´d into the final.:devil:

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:26 PM
oh yes they do. I can name some.... Stevenson...Chavetdazki....Vaidsiova...
If that's what you truly think, then you should not be taken seriously as a tennis fan. It takes an ENORMOUS amount of talent and dedication to make it to that level.

Wiggly
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:26 PM
The emergence of a new star is always good. The occasional fluke run makes things interesting. But when the sport starts to turn into a series of flukey runs--and it hasn't yet, but it's showing signs it might--then it is bad for the tour.

Spot on.
It's good if these girls become elite players.
But these days, each girl has one huuge tournament per year and is barely playing top 50 tennis for the other 25 tourneys shey plays.

So it's BAD!
It's not attractive to fans if each time they turn the TV on, it's a different girl every week that you won't see again for five months.

And fix the draws if possible, it's always the same good players facing each others in the early rounds, leaving huge holes in others parts.

sammy01
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:31 PM
Federer played a great game against the mighty Falla..what else are we gonna read here

playd better than venus or kim thats for sure, anything else to say?

sandv1
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:31 PM
unlike the top players? So the tour should just be the top players winning even if they play shockingly bad and the other player doesn't? k.

No, not at all. As others have said, au contraire, those who go deep in a non-MM tourney should have fairly _complete_ games. Yeah, Tsveti has _a game_, but it's not very rich.

For crying out loud she was using a glorified squash shot ....as a weapon! :o
Maybe she should be able to get away with that against someone outside of the top 100 ...really it shouldn't work against the top 200 actually, but today, Venus was rather stunned or at least confused.

Hell, I don't remember seeing Agi even slice FH that much. It's just absurd and rather sad.

...but this situation does seem to dovetail with the whole "save the tour" rhetoric. The top 10 should _not_ be that vulnerable to a vanilla game!

Wiggly
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:34 PM
No, not at all. As others have said, au contraire, those who go deep in a non-MM tourney should have fairly _complete_ games. Yeah, Tsveti has _a game_, but it's not very rich.

For crying out loud she was using a glorified squash shot ....as a weapon! :o
Maybe she should be able to get away with that against someone outside of the top 100 ...really it shouldn't work against the top 200 actually, but today, Venus was rather stunned or at least confused.

Hell, I don't remember seeing Agi even slice FH that much. It's just absurd and rather sad.

...but this situation does seem to dovetail with the whole "save the tour" rhetoric. The top 10 should _not_ be that vulnerable to a vanilla game!

These days you have to be REALLY powerfull or to hit plenty of junkballs.
There's no in between.

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:36 PM
Spot on.
It's good if these girls become elite players.
But these days, each girl has one huuge tournament per year and is barely playing top 50 tennis for the other 25 tourneys shey plays.

So it's BAD!
It's not attractive to fans if each time they turn the TV on, it's a different girl every week that you won't see again for five months.

And fix the draws if possible, it's always the same good players facing each others in the early rounds, leaving huge holes in others parts.
If you're earning your living from tournament prize money, then you're an elite player. Period.

pla
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:39 PM
I didn't come lately on this forum much and I seem to have forgotten how some people think..

Now, can SOMEONE here explain me one simple thing. How can popularizing the sport is bad? Do you guys (those saying it's bad) understand how MANY little girls and little boys will pick up the racket in Italy, Bulgaria, Estonia and so on? Do you guys say that in a country like Bulgaria, where tennis is not a big sport, it's bad because little kids will start dreaming of playing at Wimbledon?

Do you know how often tennis makes first pages of newspapers in such countries? Almost NEVER! Tomorrow, it will be first page everywhere. I can't believe that you guys will say that it's bad! Hige stars of this sport won a lot, and they will continue to win- the sport won't change. But today, maybe somewhere the life of someone changed because he/she started DREAMING.

And what is this logic that an upset must be followed by a win, especially at a SF? Every match is different and those women fighting out there deserve more respect from us in our comfortable chairs at home.

Dominic
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:43 PM
Good thread, it is one of those things i ddon't get, people root against top players then whine that the tour need saving when the under dog wins.

Who roots against top players, when theyre playing nobodies?

twight6
Jun 29th, 2010, 03:46 PM
Who roots against top players, when theyre playing nobodies?

This really has three sets of people:

1) Non-tennis fans watching the match (everyone likes a sports upset :shrug: )
2) Haters
3) People who need the PAW points, like me. :D

starin
Jun 29th, 2010, 04:02 PM
This. I mean, look at Oudin, Jie etc. now. They're not doing shit. :tape:

These upsets wouldn't be so bad if they actually lead to something but they never do.

:worship: Exactly. Let's face facts here. These are journeywomen level players who got lucky with top players playing shite. These big results never lead anywhere. If the top players don't step it up or new young players come up to replace them we'll keep getting random scrubs winning slams until no on gives two shites about the WTA. I'm already starting to not care.

DOUBLEFIST
Jun 29th, 2010, 04:07 PM
Simple solution, the top players should play better.

Basically these scrubs (except Vera who's at least been #5 before) are waiting to get their ass kicked by Serena because they're totally out of their depth that far in a slam.
There is a first time for everyone in everything.

In other words: the only way the players BECOME a part of that "depth" is by having EXPERIENCES there. This is part of that process.

Hell, if the other "established" players - INCLUDING Venus - can't/don't step up, it speaks more about their "ability" (or the lack of it) than the other players being "out of their depth." Depth, in or out, is either EARNED or DESERVED.

Dave.
Jun 29th, 2010, 04:16 PM
ok that's the shitiest definition of sports i've ever read.Unless you're talking about WWF...Sports is about anyone competing having a fair chance for the win..Matches are played and won on the courts not on papers!


If you had listened to Zvonareva's pre-match interview on the BBC, it was impressive to see how determined she was to beat elite opposition.

People should be thankful for players overcoming their mental frailities and actually discovering a great level of tennis on the biggest of stages.


These. :p

Mixal
Jun 29th, 2010, 04:58 PM
There is a first time for everyone in everything.

In other words: the only way the players BECOME a part of that "depth" is by having EXPERIENCES there. This is part of that process.

Hell, if the other "established" players - INCLUDING Venus - can't/don't step up, it speaks more about their "ability" (or the lack of it) than the other players being "out of their depth." Depth, in or out, is either EARNED or DESERVED.

:worship:

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 05:15 PM
I didn't come lately on this forum much and I seem to have forgotten how some people think..

Now, can SOMEONE here explain me one simple thing. How can popularizing the sport is bad? Do you guys (those saying it's bad) understand how MANY little girls and little boys will pick up the racket in Italy, Bulgaria, Estonia and so on? Do you guys say that in a country like Bulgaria, where tennis is not a big sport, it's bad because little kids will start dreaming of playing at Wimbledon?

Do you know how often tennis makes first pages of newspapers in such countries? Almost NEVER! Tomorrow, it will be first page everywhere. I can't believe that you guys will say that it's bad! Hige stars of this sport won a lot, and they will continue to win- the sport won't change. But today, maybe somewhere the life of someone changed because he/she started DREAMING.

And what is this logic that an upset must be followed by a win, especially at a SF? Every match is different and those women fighting out there deserve more respect from us in our comfortable chairs at home.

Heres the problem. The casual tennis fan tunes in to see the matches and sees the top players and scrubs cause lets not kid ourselves half the time the lower players are spraying shots left and right also, look aweful. The game looses respect. Especially the womens game. They already are looked down on and the casual or worse ATP tennis fan sees shit tennis. It makes the woman lose even more respect for what they do. And its partly justified.... Don't kid yourself. Results like Wimbleodn 2010 are not good for the game.

miffedmax
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:16 PM
I'd give Francesca a bit more time but I agree. It's all well and good when someone has a breakthrough but it's a bit disappointing and frustrating when they are unable to back it up and play as well as they did to win that big tournament.

She's 29. How much more time are you going to give her?

manu32
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:27 PM
:tape:

People tune into big matches because thats what they love to see, e.g. Spain v Portugal tonight. Far less people will care about matches like Paraguay v Japan and its thanks to those big matches that the sport survives, so as nice as your little definition is it wouldnt sell tickets in the long term, I assure you :wavey:
of course but opportunism and new "love" is the mark of people never attending GS matches in the Crowd...how many posters in this board were?? 5 % ?? no,fantasy is a personal thing but keep it secret...

keithb1961
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:30 PM
People want the biggest players and teams at the biggest events. Its what sports is all about.

Y'all are idiots if you think any of the SF ticket holders will be in any way pleased about watching Pironkova v Zvonareva instead of Venus v Kim. Sort it out ye?

Then the top players need to actually win....or should we just have the top players playing each other like an exhibition?
How much fun would that be?

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:30 PM
There is a first time for everyone in everything.

In other words: the only way the players BECOME a part of that "depth" is by having EXPERIENCES there. This is part of that process.

Hell, if the other "established" players - INCLUDING Venus - can't/don't step up, it speaks more about their "ability" (or the lack of it) than the other players being "out of their depth." Depth, in or out, is either EARNED or DESERVED.
There you go making sense again. STOP IT! :mad:

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:32 PM
People want the biggest players and teams at the biggest events. Its what sports is all about.

Y'all are idiots if you think any of the SF ticket holders will be in any way pleased about watching Pironkova v Zvonareva instead of Venus v Kim. Sort it out ye?
They're pleased about having tickets for the semifinals of Wimbledon. It wouldn't matter to them if you and I were playing each other.

Tennisstar86
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:47 PM
They're pleased about having tickets for the semifinals of Wimbledon. It wouldn't matter to them if you and I were playing each other.

.....dont lie to yourself....

Ferg
Jun 29th, 2010, 06:48 PM
Yeah, the players themselves dont give a fuck about the people watching them. They just want to win. So stop holding it against them just because the so called 'top players' played shit.

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 07:24 PM
.....dont lie to yourself....
I'm not. The people who have tickets to Thursday's semifinals bought them several months in advance, not knowing who would even be in the draw, much less in the semis. Very few of them will give them up just because Serena is the only top-10 player still in the tournament. If you think otherwise, you're the one lying to yourself.

serenus_2k8
Jun 29th, 2010, 07:28 PM
I'm not. The people who have tickets to Thursday's semifinals bought them several months in advance, not knowing who would even be in the draw, much less in the semis. Very few of them will give them up just because Serena is the only top-10 player still in the tournament. If you think otherwise, you're the one lying to yourself.

Lol I always have a good laugh at some of your bs. I bet they bought the tickets dreaming of a Kvitova Zvonareva face off :rolleyes:

Of course they are gonna be disappointed theyve paid so much and miss out on seeing a Venus or Clijsters. Are you actually saying they will be equally happy never having heard of the players they have paid so much to see? Too much :rolls: :haha:

pla
Jun 29th, 2010, 07:56 PM
Heres the problem. The casual tennis fan tunes in to see the matches and sees the top players and scrubs cause lets not kid ourselves half the time the lower players are spraying shots left and right also, look aweful. The game looses respect. Especially the womens game. They already are looked down on and the casual or worse ATP tennis fan sees shit tennis. It makes the woman lose even more respect for what they do. And its partly justified.... Don't kid yourself. Results like Wimbleodn 2010 are not good for the game.

And half of the time the top players also play badly, so what? The game also looses credibility, but you won't scream against this. How many horror fest we saw between top players? Tons. Players should be respected, that's all I can say. Don't kid yourself that the ATP lovers will start respecting the women game if the final was different. We had finals with huge top players, wta is not respected, we had "no-names"- no respect. So this is a wrong argument!

darrinbaker00
Jun 29th, 2010, 08:05 PM
Lol I always have a good laugh at some of your bs. I bet they bought the tickets dreaming of a Kvitova Zvonareva face off :rolleyes:

Of course they are gonna be disappointed theyve paid so much and miss out on seeing a Venus or Clijsters. Are you actually saying they will be equally happy never having heard of the players they have paid so much to see? Too much :rolls: :haha:
Yes, because they bought tickets to see THE WIMBLEDON SEMIFINALS, not necessarily to see any certain player or players. Heck, most of next year's tickets have already been sold. Of course having Venus Williams and/or Kim Clijsters would have made it sweeter, but it's still a big event.

edificio
Jun 29th, 2010, 10:13 PM
anyone could have beaten Venus today.....

Yep.

It would be nice if players played to their ranking or above. But someone's gotta play below their ranking if things are to advance. If the top seeds always beat the lower-ranked seed things would get a little boring.

I don't think it was necessarily good for Dinara's psyche to lose in so many finals, but she still can say she's been in some. The Cinderella who makes it to the final may lose badly, but she may win too (think Sharapova).

DOUBLEFIST
Jun 30th, 2010, 08:12 PM
There you go making sense again. STOP IT! :mad:
:shrug: I figured I had to get my once a year quota in. ;)

toxina90
Jun 30th, 2010, 08:24 PM
This. I mean, look at Oudin, Jie etc. now. They're not doing shit. :tape:

These upsets wouldn't be so bad if they actually lead to something but they never do.

Jie reached another GS semi, despite slumping for the rest :p

bbjpa
Jun 30th, 2010, 08:35 PM
Then the top players need to actually win....or should we just have the top players playing each other like an exhibition?
How much fun would that be?

Yep, I hate Doha championships and never watch it.

_