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HRHoliviasmith
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:22 PM
^^ :haha: :haha: :haha:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:24 PM
I don't know any Australian kickers but I know a South African punter. Way to show your ass...

...I went to high school with 3 guys who eventually played pro football. I've actually stood on the sidelines with the Baltimore Ravens in a pre-season match with the New Orleans Saints and as most posters who have half a brain already know...

...My Passport is from the USA, Driver's License is issued by the State of California, I was born in Atlanta, GA...I think that makes me American!!!




:o:o:o Poor LDV *SMH* :lol:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:25 PM
A physical address would be best. No one pays attention to the online comments.

Well, I was thinking of emailing the letter, not just making an online comment.

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:26 PM
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af19/rudeboy77/Gifs/Wigsnatch2.gif

:spit: :lol:

jdtennisusa
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:36 PM
Pam was wrong. Mary was right.

The NFL players who were fined for contact with an official were fined for incidental contact with an official in an attempt to make their case for and/or against a penalty. They were not fined for verbally- and/or physically-threatening an official. Only a person who has never watched an actual NFL game would think that.

NFL players are suspended on the spot (from games) for unprovoked or flagrant/intentional hits on another player. Yet, Pam wants you fools to think that if a player did anything like this this to an NFL official they would just be fined $25,000.

If an NFL player had verbally- and/or physically-threatened an NFL official like Serena threatened that lineswoman, that player would not just be fined $25,000. At the very least, the player would be looking at a multi-game suspension without pay, anger-management counseling, and the player would only be allowed to play again at the discretion of the commissioner and his office. Mary was right. Roger Goodell (the NFL commissioner) would never stand for such behavior.

What is INCIDENTAL contact? Pam Shriver pointed to two instances of actual contact which, according to her, resulted in a fine which was less than the one assessed against Serena. How is actual contact less offensive than an empty, verbal threat uttered during an intense match?

By the way, I don't have the link, but there was a thread that circulated on this forum the other day which showed John McEnroe saying something to the effect of shoving a ball. I think it was a Youtube clip about anger management candidates.

LadyLil
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:40 PM
To contact ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?page=contact/espntv

You may also contact them at (860) 766-2236 by leaving a message any time of day or speaking to them directly Monday-Friday, 12:00 p.m.-5:30 p.m. EST.

Rocketta
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:46 PM
oh thank goodness i was sleeping last night. :spit:

Bahia
Jan 21st, 2010, 05:56 PM
http://i989.photobucket.com/albums/af19/rudeboy77/Gifs/Wigsnatch2.gif

:sad::sad::sad:

Mrs. Peel
Jan 21st, 2010, 08:06 PM
:rolleyes: Oh no they don’t. They shit on her just like they do with everyone else. Then again people tend to focus on comments they disagree with as opposed to comments they agree with… so I’d guess you wouldn’t notice any criticism Maria receives.

But in reality they’ve been pretty harsh with Maria over the years too. The incident at Miami was when Mary attacked her character essentially said she was cold, heartless, etc. etc.. She went on and on… And everyone seems to think Ted Robinson loves Maria, but he’s always attacked her for not being a “real Russian”, that "she's as American as he is" and she’s stealing from America by not changing her citizenship. He does it when he’s calling her matches on tv and even more so when he’s a guest host on local sports talk radio. He consistently complains about her grunting being annoying. Yadda, yadda, yadda. But for some reason non-fans continue to perceive him as biased in favor of Maria. :confused: Pam is always relentlessly negative about her and PMac is worse than all of them combined; he straight up hates her. But I'm not sure counts, he just hates women in general. :shrug:

So with the exception of Kim every top player gets shit on by ESPN announcers. But after half listening to the match tonight I’m starting to think that Mary should ask Serena out on a date. Such passion. :lol:


lol I respectfully disagree. Did you watch the Maria/Maria match? All Shrapnel had to do was just keep the ball in court and they were oooing and ahhhhing. Dick Enberg had a hard on the whole time. You would have thought she was the second coming Again. When she started losing, it was all about how Kirilenko she couldn't possibly keep up the pace. "How good is Kirilenko's fitness?!!?" When we all know that Shrapnel is usually the one to physically wilt first.

Pam did mention it was disgraceful that she only did HK for prep but Mary Carillo had her big jaw shut most of the time even when Maria would make dreadful volleys into the net. Mary Jo sounded like she was on Shrapnel's PR junket. It was disgusting. They talked like she was winning the match the whole time.

Galsen
Jan 21st, 2010, 08:39 PM
Mary with her typical Serena didnt get a harsh enough punishment, she thinks shes above the sport blah blah blah. Pam with some great points that were STFU worthy, but Mary being Mary wouldnt shut up. I seriously hope one of these days Serena just calls her out on her bullshit. She's talking so much shit on Serena when she commentates but then whenever she interviews her, she tries to act like BFFs.

this is exactly why I can't stand that stranger bitch

ghost world
Jan 21st, 2010, 09:48 PM
My biggest complaint (which I'm sure has already been discussed) is the overall lack of tennis coverage. Way too much time is spent with the commentators who beat a dead horse with the same crappy discussions.
How I miss the days of actually seeing bits and pieces of various matches being played instead of anticipating one freaking match with highlights of Andy Roddick filling most of the air time. :rolleyes:

Yes, their coverage is totally ridiculous.

pokey camp
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:12 PM
lol I respectfully disagree.
There's nothing to disagree with. :shrug: All the examples I gave were true.

Pointing out times when she's been praised doesn't make them less so. And tellingly you didn't even attempt deny any of the examples I listed. :lol:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:14 PM
Thanks for your "concern" darrin, but I will be fine. :wavey:

Do you seriuosly not get how terribly ironic you are being right now? You're telling me to see a therapist for posting my thoughts and views on the situation for which the thread was created and you're not only complaining about my complaints, but taking umbridge with the fact that I don't see things the way you do in the situation. That if the commentary bothers me that much I should turn my TV off or switch the channel. Mind you, I'm a tennis fan and we are talking about changing the channel from watching a GS while my fave is playing to watching some other programming. :weirdo: That somehow I'm obligated to explain myself and my reasonings to you and that because you don't understand those reasons, I'm supposed to see a therapist. Does that sound like someone who should be suggesting for someone else to see a therapist? :unsure:
Yes.
You have to understand that your feelings on the matter are irrelevant and your suggestions are just as ridiculous as they are irrelevant. You're entitled to have your opinion on the matter. You're entitled to have your opinion about other poster's opinions, but in doing so, you must understand that your opinion is irrelevant.
You keep responding, so my opinion is obviously relevant to you. I still love you, though. ;)

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:14 PM
Yes.

You keep responding, so my opinion is obviously relevant to you. I still love you, though. ;)

I'm just being polite. :wavey:

Golovinjured.
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:16 PM
Calling someone's suggestions ridiculous and irrelevent isn't being polite. :wavey:

Njay16
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:16 PM
I'm just being polite. :wavey:

We missed you in the SS forum last night :wavey:

In The Zone
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:16 PM
Put the damn mute button on or watch a livestream.

I like the ESPN commentators. Especially Pam. I am so grateful she posts here!

G1Player2
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:19 PM
Put the damn mute button on or watch a livestream.

I like the ESPN commentators. Especially Pam. I am so grateful she posts here!


ITZ :rolleyes:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:19 PM
I'm just being polite. :wavey:
:eek: :eek: :eek:

There truly is a first time for everything. :hehehe:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:19 PM
Calling someone's suggestions ridiculous and irrelevent isn't being polite. :wavey:

Subtlety obviously eludes you. :)

Golovinjured.
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:20 PM
Delusion doesn't get past you though. :wavey:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:21 PM
We missed you in the SS forum last night :wavey:

It was too late and I had to get up and go to work this morning. :lol: As it is, I'm wiped out today.

LDVTennis
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:21 PM
Of course it's in the rule book. I acknowledged that in my previous post, but it's not readily enforced - another point I made in my previous post. Of course you've chosen to ignore that - or maybe just didn't comprehend that :shrug: :lol:

Do you know any REAL PLAYERS who can tell you that PLAYERS talk trash all time and tell you about their REAL EXPERIENCE in the league and not some football fan boys wondering how it really goes down and havin' to read about it in a rule book to claim they know the game.


This is becoming tedious.

Your original post made no mention of such a rule. Instead, you even suggested that it would be ridiculous if there were such a rule because "taunting" happens on every play.

To hedge your bets in that first post, you did say that the officials will call a penalty from time to time for excessive taunting. But, that's par for the course with you. You are a coward. Not being sure of anything, you always hedge.

For your information, given the discretion officials have to determine what is taunting on the field, players have been readily penalized for language and actions that to you would not appear excessive. Perhaps you missed the Broncos/Patriots game this season --- http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2009/10/royal_talks_tau.html.

What kept you from watching the game? Was that the day you were snubbed by Venus in a Beverly Hills parking lot? --- :lol::lol::lol:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:21 PM
:eek: :eek: :eek:

There truly is a first time for everything. :hehehe:

:lol:

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:22 PM
ITZ :rolleyes:

:spit:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:22 PM
Calling someone's suggestions ridiculous and irrelevent isn't being polite. :wavey:
You've never read any of Denise's posts before, have you? ;)

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:23 PM
Delusion doesn't get past you though. :wavey:

Yeah, okay whatever that means. :rolleyes:

Don't you have some homework or something to do like eating a snack or something? :(

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:24 PM
You've never read any of Denise's posts before, have you? ;)

No, he has. One reason he's defending you, because he thinks you are against me. :lol:

Golovinjured.
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:25 PM
You've never read any of Denise's posts before, have you? ;)

I usually get about half way through, by then my IQ is shot and I lose the ability to interpret words.

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:25 PM
I usually get about half way through, by then my IQ is shot and I lose the ability to interpret words.

:lol: Like that's any different than normal.

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:26 PM
This is becoming tedious.

Your original post made no mention of such a rule. Instead, you even suggested that it would be ridiculous if there were such a rule because "taunting" happens on every play.

To hedge your bets in that first post, you did say that the officials will call a penalty from time to time for excessive taunting. But, that's par for the course for you. You are a coward. Not being sure of anything, you always hedge.

For your information, given the discretion officials have to determine what is taunting on the field, players have been penalized for language and actions that to you would not appear excessive. Perhaps you missed the Broncos/Patriots game this season --- http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2009/10/royal_talks_tau.html.

What kept you from watching the game? Was that the day you were snubbed by Venus in a Beverly Hills parking lot? --- :lol::lol::lol:
Dude, it is WAY too important to you to be "right" on an Internet message board. If you need money to help you get laid, just let me know where to send it.

Denise4925
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:27 PM
Dude, it is WAY too important to you be "right" on an Internet message board. If you need money to help you get laid, just let me know where to send it.

:spit: :lol:

Olórin
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:27 PM
Dude, it is WAY too important to you be "right" on an Internet message board. If you need money to help you get laid, just let me know where to send it.

Yeah - when LDV said "this is becoming tedious" Im pretty sure he's talking about his celibacy.

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:31 PM
No, he has. One reason he's defending you, because he thinks you are against me. :lol:
De, anyone who's read even one of my posts knows full well that I'm against EVERYBODY. ;)

G1Player2
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:36 PM
They are re-airing Serena's match and showed Mary's segment and tirade against Serena again. :fiery:

Golovinjured.
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:38 PM
Yeah - when LDV said "this is becoming tedious" Im pretty sure he's talking about his celibacy.

:spit:

LDVTennis
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:40 PM
Yeah - when LDV said "this is becoming tedious" Im pretty sure he's talking about his celibacy.

Ohh, personal attacks from a person on a message board, who probably lives with his parents, has no car, probably doesn't even have $1000 dollars to his name, thinks he's doing something with his life by going to a no-name college, and always seems to think other people are masturbating, how can I possibly react to that?

--- :lol::lol::lol:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:45 PM
Ohh, personal attacks from a person on a message board, who probably lives with his parents, has no car, probably doesn't even have $1000 dollars to his name, thinks he's doing something with his life by going to a no-name college, and always seems to think other people are masturbating, how can I possibly react to that?

--- :lol::lol::lol:
Not very well, apparently. :shrug:

ghost world
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:45 PM
They are re-airing Serena's match and showed Mary's segment and tirade against Serena again. :fiery:

Am I crazy or does Mary C really say Serena got away with threatening murder? :eek: :help: :o

LDVTennis
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:50 PM
I don't know any Australian kickers but I know a South African punter.

...I went to high school with 3 guys who eventually played pro football. I've actually stood on the sidelines with the Baltimore Ravens in a pre-season match with the New Orleans Saints and as most posters who have half a brain already know.

[/B][/COLOR]

Matt McBriar of the Cowboys. There is one other.

As to the rest, clearly having stood on the sidelines of the Ravens game taught you nothing about the game since you were the first to suggest that the NFL allows players to taunt each other.

So, I'm not sure what you have proven.

But, thanks for the interest. We'll get back to you. :wavey:

mykarma
Jan 21st, 2010, 10:55 PM
UGH I LOVED IT!! :drool: The whole match was Kim this, Kim that, then BABOOM. Serena shut those bitches up. :lol:
:lol::lol::lol:

Olórin
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:01 PM
Ohh, personal attacks from a person on a message board, who probably lives with his parents, has no car, probably doesn't even have $1000 dollars to his name, thinks he's doing something with his life by going to a no-name college, and always seems to think other people are masturbating, how can I possibly react to that?

--- :lol::lol::lol:

See, you have no skill - you tried far too hard to be convincing.
Im merely inferring from what you give ;) You don't need to react - just take it like a good boy.

serenafann
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:05 PM
To contact ESPN:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/news/story?page=contact/espntv

You may also contact them at (860) 766-2236 by leaving a message any time of day or speaking to them directly Monday-Friday, 12:00 p.m.-5:30 p.m. EST.

Thanks for this.I just called and left a complaint,concerning the rotten and vile Mary Carillo. :fiery: :(

DOUBLEFIST
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:08 PM
This is becoming tedious.

Your original post made no mention of such a rule. Instead, you even suggested that it would be ridiculous if there were such a rule because "taunting" happens on every play.

To hedge your bets in that first post, you did say that the officials will call a penalty from time to time for excessive taunting. But, that's par for the course with you. You are a coward. Not being sure of anything, you always hedge.

For your information, given the discretion officials have to determine what is taunting on the field, players have been readily penalized for language and actions that to you would not appear excessive. Perhaps you missed the Broncos/Patriots game this season --- http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/extra_points/2009/10/royal_talks_tau.html.

What kept you from watching the game? Was that the day you were snubbed by Venus in a Beverly Hills parking lot? --- :lol::lol::lol:

You're laughable.

Every time you're on the ass losing end of an argument (which you are) you run back to that ol' yarn as if it bothered me. :rolleyes: As if I would have posted it here if it did. But I"m sure you would have been crying and shaking in you're boots, having flashbacks to that "mean ol' black man" who scared you so much in Manhattan Beach. :lol: :lol: :lol: :help:

As for what my first post said..., here it is... READ FOOl!

:spit: I had to stop reading right there because OBVIOUSLY you've never seen, heard, been to a professional football game. :lol: :lol:

Taunting and trash talking happens on EVERY PLAY in the NFL. EVERY. PLAY. If you can't see that, you're blind. I know this from players AND from watching. It's obvious. Official only call the MOST egregious cases. You MUST be blind. I challenge you to watch a playoff game this weekend (if in fact you do watch football) and come back and tell me all the taunting got called. :lol:

You know nothing of the game.

Obviously, if I say "officials only call the MOST egregious cases" the fact is that a rule against taunting is acknowledged in my statement. But it would have taken a little common sense on your part to realize that so, I should have realized you wouldn't have realized it.

As for taunting ,you must have never played the game to not realize what's going on when a couple of opposing players start wolfin' in each others faces after a big hit. What do you think? They're exchanging phone numbers. No. They're talkin' trash, TAUNTING each other.

My what an dense tool you are. :haha:

What do you think a defensive player is doing when he stands, straddling over the top of someone he's just tackled, lingering to the point where the player shoves him out of the way? TAUNTING. In fact, it's hella insulting if your the offensive player, kinda like sayin' "you're my bitch" (like I'm doing you right now), but you would have to have played at least a little bit (oh say Pop Warner, at least) to know that. What do you think a defensive player is doing when, after having made a tackle, he stands up still hanging on to the legs while the offensive player lies on the ground? TAUNTING, but again you would have to know a little bit about the game and playing it to understand that.

:lol: As I said you know nothing. So why not just go back and blog with your boys and read about the game in the rule book. :spit:

So, now it's time for you to go back in the closet and collect the dust that most of the suckas I OWN are collecting. :wavey:

mykarma
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:08 PM
That's better than me - I'll be using the 'power off' button :tape:.
Kart, you're so cold. :lol: I put their ass on mute while hashing over the U.S. Open incident. Mary was ecstatic while showing the vid. I guess it hurt her feelings that Serena was kicking ass like she was having a practice session. She even said that the people of Australia wasn't buying Serena's story and neither was she. :rolleyes:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:11 PM
Am I crazy or does Mary C really say Serena got away with threatening murder? :eek: :help: :o
Yes on both counts. ;)

LDVTennis
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:26 PM
It pissed me off when Mary first tried to turn Serena's match into her pulpit to worship at the alter in the Holy Church of Justine. But, what literally took my mind and my eyes off of Serena's match was when Mary ripped Serena to shreds:timebomb: for a period of 20 minutes straight or what seemed like a very long time. She was foaming at the mouth with hate and vengence, and tears were running down my face because I was so mad :fiery: wanted to jump in the TV and shove that fucking microphone down her fucking throat. :sobbing:

Can I see a show of hands of how many people will be joining me in writing a letter of complaint to ESPN about tonight's coverage of Venus and Serena's matches, and most especially Mary Carillo's slanderous and vicious accusation about Serena?


Write all you want. No one at ESPN is going to care.

First of all, because based on what I've observed of your thinking here, you're just going to end up implying that everyone at ESPN is a hater or racist. That kind of thinking may work here, but it just makes you look like a loon in the real world.

Second, because Mary Carillo isn't going anywhere. She's been there and at CBS for years. Her producers like her. She's a great colleague and despite my own reservations about her at the time she's done well. Some over-emotional, accusatory letter from some woman in the southwest isn't going to change any of that.

Indeed, it will do just the opposite. The fact that Mary can get you so fired up will only solidify her position at ESPN. Some intern will read your letter and log it. I know I interned at ESPN the summer of my sophomore year at Yale. It is what they put the interns from UConn to do. If it is rhetorically noteworthy, it may make the rounds, but not in the way you want. Some letters become bulletin board fodder for the sheer amusement of the production staff.

Beyond that, it will just contribute to the impression that this or that broadcaster is having an effect on the audience. It doesn't matter what the valence of the effect is, since it is not Rush Limbaugh or Jimmy the Greek were are talking about here. It is Mary Carillo whom no one honestly thinks is a racist. In Mary's case, your letter won't lead to her dismissal, it will just entrench her even more.

By the way, can we see those hands. Yes, raise those hands... :lol::lol::lol:

RVD
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:38 PM
This is why for the last year and a half, I've only watched highlights. :(

It's sad because I really liked watching the matches and armchair-analyzing each player's game. But when all I hear is disgraceful comments about my fave (Serena), and near-orgasmic and gushing comments of non-American players when my faves are playing then or not, and how these non-American players are the best thing since sliced bread and nacho cheese, I just refuse to LISTEN and watch any longer.
It's unfortunate for one other reason as well. And that is that we may never ever again see another dynamic duo (Venus & Serena) for another hundred years. And these American nimrod commentators are just ruining the such a uniquely rare experience. :sad:

As for Kim...
I REALLY like her!
I mean, not as much as Serena, but she's damn likable.

BUT....not WORTH all the gushing she receives from these biased, over-the-top, and unprofessional American commentators. UGH!!

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:40 PM
Write all you want. No one at ESPN is going to care.

First of all, because based on what I've observed of your thinking here, you're just going to end up implying that everyone at ESPN is a hater or racist. That kind of thinking may work here, but it just makes you look like a loon in the real world.

Second, because Mary Carillo isn't going anywhere. She's been there and at CBS for years. Her producers like her. She's a great colleague and despite my own reservations about her at the time she's done well. Some over-emotional, accusatory letter from some woman in the southwest isn't going to change any of that.

Indeed, it will do just the opposite. The fact that Mary can get you so fired up will only solidify her position at ESPN. Some intern will read your letter and log it. I know I interned at ESPN the summer of my sophomore year at Yale. It is what they put the interns from UConn to do. If it is rhetorically noteworthy, it may make the rounds, but not in the way you want. Some letters become bulletin board fodder for the sheer amusement of the production staff.

Beyond that, it will just contribute to the impression that this or that broadcaster is having an effect on the audience. It doesn't matter what the valence of the effect is, since it is not Rush Limbaugh or Jimmy the Greek were are talking about here. It is Mary Carillo whom no one honestly thinks is a racist. In Mary's case, your letter won't lead to her dismissal, it will just entrench her even more.

By the way, can we see those hands. Yes, raise those hands... :lol::lol::lol:

After further review, Denise, I have decided to reverse my original position on this matter. If LDVTennis thinks it's a bad idea, then you MUST be on to something. Write away. :yeah:

darrinbaker00
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:43 PM
This is why for the last year and a half, I've only watched highlights. :(

It's sad because I really liked watching the matches and armchair-analyzing each player's game. But when all I hear is disgraceful comments about my fave (Serena), and near-orgasmic and gushing comments of non-American players when my faves are playing then or not, and how these non-American players are the best thing since sliced bread and nacho cheese, I just refuse to LISTEN and watch any longer.
It's unfortunate for one other reason as well. And that is that we may never ever again see another dynamic duo (Venus & Serena) for another hundred years. And these American nimrod commentators are just ruining the such a uniquely rare experience. :sad:

As for Kim...
I REALLY like her!
I mean, not as much as Serena, but she's damn likable.

BUT....not WORTH all the gushing she receives from these biased, over-the-top, and unprofessional American commentators. UGH!!
They can only ruin it for you if you let them, RVD. Don't let them.

LDVTennis
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:47 PM
You're laughable.

Every time you're on the ass losing end of an argument (which you are) you run back to that ol' yarn as if it bothered me. :rolleyes: As if I would have posted it here if it did. But I"m sure you would have been crying and shaking in you're boots, having flashbacks to that "mean ol' black man" who scared you so much in Manhattan Beach. :lol: :lol: :lol: :help:

As for what my first post said..., here it is... READ FOOl!

What do you think a defensive player is doing when he stands, straddling over the top of someone he's just tackled, lingering to the point where the player shoves him out of the way? TAUNTING. In fact, it's hella insulting if your the offensive player, but you would have to have played at least a little bit (oh say Pop Warner) to know that. What do you think a defensive player is doing when, after having made a tackle, he stands up still hanging on to the legs while the offensive player lies on the ground? TAUNTING, but again you would have to know a little bit about the game and playing it to understand that.



Misrepresenting the facts as always. That black man who told my buddy to shut up didn't scare anyone; rather, he was scared by the butch, power lesbians who got in his face and told him we could cheer for whomever we wanted. Now, there's a look that still makes me laugh. But, wait, there's something more I remember now. Those lesbians got Venus' autograph that week. Guess Venus is not afraid of lesbians, just you. --- :lol::lol::lol:

As to the rest, the story I linked speaks for itself. No one who saw the game, not even Royal, the player taunted, thought it was excessive taunting and worthy of a penalty. The incident looked like what you claimed happens all the time without penalty. And, that stuff does happen, no one is denying that. But, in this case, Brandon was penalized, the crew stood with the penalty, and even the NFL HOF backed the call when he was asked to explain it during his segment on the NFL network.

Well, it's been fun firing up all you Serena fans. And, to think, Mary gets paid to do this and to watch Nadal and Justine play live. That's so unfair. --- :lol::lol::lol:

Donny
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:51 PM
^I imagine LDV to look and sound like Monty Burns, but with far less money. Anyone else get that sort of visual?

I bet he's cackling as I type.

DOUBLEFIST
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:55 PM
After further review, Denise, I have decided to reverse my original position on this matter. If LDVTennis thinks it's a bad idea, then you MUST be on to something. Write away. :yeah:
:spit:

Classic

Thkmra
Jan 21st, 2010, 11:58 PM
Yeah - when LDV said "this is becoming tedious" Im pretty sure he's talking about his celibacy.

:spit::lol::lol::help: TO THE KORNA!!!!:lol:

darrinbaker00
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:02 AM
^I imagine LDV to look and sound like Monty Burns, but with far less money. Anyone else get that sort of visual?

I bet he's cackling as I type.
I was thinking more Jon Heder in "Napoleon Dynamite" or Jason Biggs in the first "American Pie" movie.

Midnight_Robber
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:12 AM
Uh, anyway - Denise?

You might want to read this comments thread that is on the official AO site:

http://www.australianopen.com/en_AU/yoursay/index.html

Guests are free to post.

ETA: I know, I know on-line comments but it's funny that ESPN is getting criticism on the Slam's official site no less.

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:14 AM
Not very well, apparently. :shrug:

:rolls: :rolls: :rolls:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:19 AM
You're laughable.

Every time you're on the ass losing end of an argument (which you are) you run back to that ol' yarn as if it bothered me. :rolleyes: As if I would have posted it here if it did. But I"m sure you would have been crying and shaking in you're boots, having flashbacks to that "mean ol' black man" who scared you so much in Manhattan Beach. :lol: :lol: :lol: :help:

As for what my first post said..., here it is... READ FOOl!



Obviously, if I say "officials only call the MOST egregious cases" the fact is that a rule against taunting is acknowledged in my statement. But it would have taken a little common sense on your part to realize that so, I should have realized you wouldn't have realized it.

As for taunting ,you must have never played the game to not realize what's going on when a couple of opposing players start wolfin' in each others faces after a big hit. What do you think? They're exchanging phone numbers. No. They're talkin' trash, TAUNTING each other.

My what an dense tool you are. :haha:

What do you think a defensive player is doing when he stands, straddling over the top of someone he's just tackled, lingering to the point where the player shoves him out of the way? TAUNTING. In fact, it's hella insulting if your the offensive player, kinda like sayin' "you're my bitch" (like I'm doing you right now), but you would have to have played at least a little bit (oh say Pop Warner, at least) to know that. What do you think a defensive player is doing when, after having made a tackle, he stands up still hanging on to the legs while the offensive player lies on the ground? TAUNTING, but again you would have to know a little bit about the game and playing it to understand that.

:lol: As I said you know nothing. So why not just go back and blog with your boys and read about the game in the rule book. :spit:

So, now it's time for you to go back in the closet and collect the dust that most of the suckas I OWN are collecting. :wavey:

:lol::worship::worship::worship:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:28 AM
Write all you want. No one at ESPN is going to care.

First of all, because based on what I've observed of your thinking here, you're just going to end up implying that everyone at ESPN is a hater or racist. That kind of thinking may work here, but it just makes you look like a loon in the real world.

Second, because Mary Carillo isn't going anywhere. She's been there and at CBS for years. Her producers like her. She's a great colleague and despite my own reservations about her at the time she's done well. Some over-emotional, accusatory letter from some woman in the southwest isn't going to change any of that.

Indeed, it will do just the opposite. The fact that Mary can get you so fired up will only solidify her position at ESPN. Some intern will read your letter and log it. I know I interned at ESPN the summer of my sophomore year at Yale. It is what they put the interns from UConn to do. If it is rhetorically noteworthy, it may make the rounds, but not in the way you want. Some letters become bulletin board fodder for the sheer amusement of the production staff.

Beyond that, it will just contribute to the impression that this or that broadcaster is having an effect on the audience. It doesn't matter what the valence of the effect is, since it is not Rush Limbaugh or Jimmy the Greek were are talking about here. It is Mary Carillo whom no one honestly thinks is a racist. In Mary's case, your letter won't lead to her dismissal, it will just entrench her even more.

By the way, can we see those hands. Yes, raise those hands... :lol::lol::lol:

First of all, you've made an erroneous pressumption about me, which is the basis of the rest of the drivel you've posted. So, no need to even address it. Second, do you honestly think that if I didn't take darrin's (someone for whom I have a modicum of respect for) suggestion that they won't listen, I will take yours? :haha:

And, LOL at you interning at ESPN during your sophmore year at Yale. :haha: How convenient. :lol:

By the way, we can see your ass that everyone is handing to you in this thread. Yes, that ass. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:31 AM
^I imagine LDV to look and sound like Monty Burns, but with far less money. Anyone else get that sort of visual?

I bet he's cackling as I type.

Yes. :lol:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:31 AM
After further review, Denise, I have decided to reverse my original position on this matter. If LDVTennis thinks it's a bad idea, then you MUST be on to something. Write away. :yeah:

See, I told you I was right. :yeah:

Thanks LDV. :wavey: :lol:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:35 AM
Uh, anyway - Denise?

You might want to read this comments thread that is on the official AO site:

http://www.australianopen.com/en_AU/yoursay/index.html

Guests are free to post.

ETA: I know, I know on-line comments but it's funny that ESPN is getting criticism on the Slam's official site no less.

Thanks, but for whatever reason, I can't even see the comments. It's just blank.

darrinbaker00
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:38 AM
First of all, you've made an erroneous pressumption about me, which is the basis of the rest of the drivel you've posted. So, no need to even address it. Second, do you honestly think that if I didn't take darrin's (someone for whom I have a modicum of respect for) suggestion that they won't listen, I will take yours? :haha:

And, LOL at you interning at ESPN during your sophmore year at Yale. :haha: How convenient. :lol:

By the way, we can see your ass that everyone is handing to you in this thread. Yes, that ass. :lol: :lol: :lol:
That's exactly one modicum more than my wife has for me. Thanks, De. :bounce:

V's a star
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:41 AM
And yet you don't explain it to me, wise one... ;):rolleyes: Look, Mary Jo seems to want to say that Venus needs to be solid but she misses the point. The intent to move forward will make her footwork better and put fear in the opponent... Just rallying a la Rafa is not the deal for her. Just my 2 cents.But she has the physical capability do both. Extremely well to i might add. To me its just her willingness to change and not be so stubborn about her game. She did this very well from Zurich 08-Acapulco 09. She was rallying more using her movement to tire opponents and force errors, being very consistent. But then after the Billie Jean Cup where she picked up that left knee problem i felt that "agenda" was left behind along with her knee for the rest of the year. She reverted back to what she knows best all out tennis.

Now that shes back healthy i hope shes worked on these things again. looks like she has so far from her AO matches

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:41 AM
That's exactly one modicum more than my wife has for me. Thanks, De. :bounce:

I was trying to be nice. ;)

darrinbaker00
Jan 22nd, 2010, 12:46 AM
I was trying to be nice. ;)
Twice in one thread? Someone's hacked into Denise's account, mods. :eek:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 01:02 AM
Twice in one thread? Someone's hacked into Denise's account, mods. :eek:

:lol: Shut up. :lol:

BlameSerena
Jan 22nd, 2010, 01:19 AM
Uh, anyway - Denise?

You might want to read this comments thread that is on the official AO site:

http://www.australianopen.com/en_AU/yoursay/index.html

Guests are free to post.

ETA: I know, I know on-line comments but it's funny that ESPN is getting criticism on the Slam's official site no less.

:lol: Damn. They're that bad.

pokey camp
Jan 22nd, 2010, 01:31 AM
Since this is now the general ESPN complaint thread:

Goddamn I hate the announcers calling the Henin/ Kleybs match on ESPN 360.

I don’t want to hear about men’s tennis every five seconds as if it’s the standard by which women’s tennis must be judged. And I don’t want every thing that happens on the court compared to how men would do it or a particular male player. Why do so many male announcers to this?

ETA:
You know what. In fairness, they’ve toned it down since the start of the match. Yes, they insist on calling Kleybanova “The Russian.” And yes, they wrongly attributed the quote “The coldest winter I ever spent was a summer in SF” to Hemingway of all people. :o :confused: (It’s usually wrongly attributed to Twain.) But outside of those complaints, they’re actually talking about the match, none of that super personal, gossipy, human interest story crap that so many ESPN announcers rely on. So overall: Mixed, but mainly positive.

cartmancop
Jan 22nd, 2010, 01:53 AM
ESPN's intro to Andy Roddick making a joke out of his hissy fits and profanity was hilarious. All of the commentators are like "Oh there goes Andy again, cursing and verbally abusing officials, what entertainment!!!" I feel it will only stir up what has been a lengthy debate on this board :lol:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 01:55 AM
There are so many complaints on the web about Mary Carillo's diatribe on Serena last night. ESPN comments are still coming in.

Golovinjured.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:00 AM
Any publicity is good publicity. She's getting her name out there. :hearts:

cartmancop
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:02 AM
I do hate the fact that any other interesting matches, ATP or WTA, are cast aside while we watch Roddick...though it's certainly not a new complaint re: ESPN.

Mssauve
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:35 AM
PLEASE JUST SHUT UP. I can't take her any longer!!!!!! UGHHH. Ok I feel better now.

WowWow
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:37 AM
:haha:

Serenita
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:38 AM
i hate when they talk during the rallies

jefrilibra
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:40 AM
Let's stone her!

BlameSerena
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:42 AM
:spit:

Golovinjured.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:45 AM
Original thread...

Martian KC
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:48 AM
I will never understand the hate for this woman.

Donny
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:49 AM
I will never understand the hate for this woman.

Theodicy.

Tennisstar86
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:50 AM
I love how she was saying "these girls had 2 years and accomplished nothing in that time... Dementieva had a real shot to win something worth something and she failed" She won the olympics bitch. shut it!

KoOlMaNsEaN
Jan 22nd, 2010, 02:58 AM
Let's stone her!

Exactly what I was thinking

kiwifan
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:02 AM
Make a list of who won slams the last 2 years...everyone else Mary is calling you out...as looooooooosers

harloo
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:04 AM
Let's stone her!

I'll gladly agree to throw the first stone right at her mouth.:)

Natalicious
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:05 AM
I'll gladly agree to throw the first stone right at her mouth.:)

please take a big one to make sure she's not talking again :)

Potato
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:08 AM
She's a bitch, but at least she's really passionate about the game :D

Infiniti2001
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:09 AM
Somebody really needs to shove a ball down her throat :fiery:

Matt.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:10 AM
Mary Carillo: "Give me the balls!" & "Shes gonna have to bang it!"

duhcity
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:28 AM
Mary Carillo is so far up Henin's ass that Henin won't ever have to retire from stomach pains ever again

The Witch-king
Jan 22nd, 2010, 03:31 AM
I love how she was saying "these girls had 2 years and accomplished nothing in that time... Dementieva had a real shot to win something worth something and she failed" She won the olympics bitch. shut it!

alienating EVERY fanbase now :lol:

DimaDinosaur
Jan 22nd, 2010, 04:53 AM
mary may sound like a stupid b, but at least she is hilarious!!! :worship: keep talking, i haven't laugh this hard since I saw J.lo's record sales for her last 3 albums!

dabossK
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:13 AM
Omg she wants to be lesbians with Justine. She kisses her ass soooooooo much.

dinhd82
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:18 AM
She's in love with Justine, that's for sure. She had an orgasm when Juju was talking.

DemWilliamsGulls
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:27 AM
All that man talks about is Henin...and tries to secretly smudge Serena every chance she gets....thats why Pam Shriver shut her ass down the other night..lol I cant stand that manly winch.

espride
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:29 AM
:help:

dinhd82
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:49 AM
ESPN is in love with Roddick, after watching is entire match, they let him sit in and commentate and we have to watch and listen and be more exposed to Roddick.

wildemu
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:55 AM
ESPN is in love with Roddick, after watching is entire match, they let him sit in and commentate and we have to watch and listen and be more exposed to Roddick.

Probably because once he retires, we wont have an american player reach the second week of a slam without sheer luck.

dinhd82
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:58 AM
Roddick's matches are predominately boring unless he starts losing IMO!

CrossCourt~Rally
Jan 22nd, 2010, 06:04 AM
Probably because once he retires, we wont have an american player reach the second week of a slam without sheer luck.


Maybe you need to watch whats going on out on Court arena atm :wavey:

ghost world
Jan 22nd, 2010, 07:12 AM
Mary Carillo is so far up Henin's ass that Henin won't ever have to retire from stomach pains ever again

Yeah, the gulf between Henin and phantom Henin is pretty crazy.

Bijoux0021
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:10 AM
...are the U.S./ESPN commentators going to die now?

Mary Carillo, Mary Joe and company must be crying their eyes out. :lol:

dinhd82
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:11 AM
Carillo still has Juju, so he/she will be just fine!!!

friendsita
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:12 AM
lol

jefrilibra
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:13 AM
:rolls:

Speaking of which, the Belgian commentators were also speechless for once!

RYNJ
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:29 AM
:rolls:

Speaking of which, the Belgian commentators were also speechless for once!

OMG I KNOW!!!!!!!!!!! I remember when Nadia hit a backhand winner, they were silent for at least 5-6 seconds OMG! :lol: Im taking about Mary/Pam.

Kunal
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:50 AM
ahahahaha

BournemouthBoy
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:52 AM
you should be happy you have coverage, in UK its on eurosport which most homs don't get, and the commentary teams im sure are randoms dragged of Barnet high street the monring of play

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 05:55 PM
OMG I KNOW!!!!!!!!!!! I remember when Nadia hit a backhand winner, they were silent for at least 5-6 seconds OMG! :lol: Im taking about Mary/Pam.

omg I love when that happens.. :lol:

unfortunately, I missed this match. :sad:

soomaal
Jan 22nd, 2010, 06:05 PM
you should be happy you have coverage, in UK its on eurosport which most homs don't get, and the commentary teams im sure are randoms dragged of Barnet high street the monring of play

What's wrong with Barnet high street randomers?:fiery:

wildemu
Jan 22nd, 2010, 07:59 PM
Maybe you need to watch whats going on out on Court arena atm :wavey:


John Isner is not going to be the savior of American tennis. Not even close.

harloo
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:01 PM
Carillo still has Juju, so he/she will be just fine!!!

:haha::haha:
R.I.P 01/22/10

ce
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:04 PM
Carillo still has Juju, so he/she will be just fine!!!

:sobbing:

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:05 PM
oh i can't wait for them to come on air tonight...they usually start with a re cap of the tournament...last year they were all happy to announce every day that venus got knocked out...this year they announce that maria is knocked out...wonder what the tournament recap will be like tonight :lol:

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:05 PM
Carillo still has Juju, so he/she will be just fine!!!

oh gary! :hysteric:

HRHoliviasmith
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:06 PM
Carillo still has Juju, so he/she will be just fine!!!

:hysteric: :sobbing:

Dave.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:06 PM
What's wrong with Barnet high street randomers?:fiery:

LOL that was the most random thing I've ever read on here. :haha: :haha:
Didn't even think anyone here would know where Barnet is, lol.

Do you live in Barnet? :)

supergrunt
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:31 PM
the commentators are way too negative.. i couldn't even watch the match because it was upsetting me- i had to turn to the ao mix channel that directtv offers... it was like day and night

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:42 PM
:haha::haha:
R.I.P 01/22/10

what did I miss? :confused:

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 08:59 PM
You can turn the sound back on now when you watch the tennis Rocketta :D.

I know! :bounce:


Sorry Kim fans... :hug:

but I only wish I could've experienced the silence which I know happened in that match. :tape:

Oh I responded to your email... :wavey:

LeRoy.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:02 PM
I can't believe all the he/she jokes on Mary from TF members, several of who may be gay themselves. :weirdo:

Stereotyping is fun as long as you are not one on the recieving end, i suppose.

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:07 PM
Yeah I read it. It's not very helpful if you don't know where you're going to be :p. We probably need to speak on the phone but I'm on-call this weekend. I'll try to call you in the week.

well I mean, wherever I am making the connection from NYC will be easy and can be done later on.. ;)

ok on the call...

Golovinjured.
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:13 PM
I can't believe all the he/she jokes on Mary from TF members, several of who may be gay themselves. :weirdo:

Stereotyping is fun as long as you are not one on the recieving end, i suppose.

Yeah, and let's not forget Mary is a former player.

Two posters just got banned for making he/she jokes at Wickmayer.

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:16 PM
Oh that's ok then. It sounded a bit like you were going to be on some kind of journey - I thought it might be a pilgrimage to Mecca or something :tape:.

hey hey stop courting on tf :p

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:19 PM
Oh that's ok then. It sounded a bit like you were going to be on some kind of journey - I thought it might be a pilgrimage to Mecca or something :tape:.

Haha, but if I was you would follow me there too! :p

no, I just meant I don't know if I'm still going to be here in Richmond, which then we would just drive to NYC or if I'll be back in NC (hopefully) which then I'll know which airport to tell you. :)

Rocketta
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:20 PM
hey hey stop courting on tf :p

He doesn't have to flirt.... he had me at "Hello"! :o :o :o

ok that was lame. :lol:

DOUBLEFIST
Jan 22nd, 2010, 09:21 PM
the commentators are way too negative.. i couldn't even watch the match because it was upsetting me- i had to turn to the ao mix channel that directtv offers... it was like day and night
That's what I've been saying. The ESPN commentators are the out-lyers. They're anything but journalist.

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 10:04 PM
I love how she was saying "these girls had 2 years and accomplished nothing in that time... Dementieva had a real shot to win something worth something and she failed" She won the olympics bitch. shut it!

How could she win anything, she had to face the people who actually won the tournaments, Venus, Serena and Kutznetsova. :shrug:

Denise4925
Jan 22nd, 2010, 10:08 PM
the commentators are way too negative.. i couldn't even watch the match because it was upsetting me- i had to turn to the ao mix channel that directtv offers... it was like day and night

Yeah, that's what my sister who has DirectTV tells me. She keeps bugging me to get DirectTV and I'm tempted, but there are features on cable I have to have that DirectTV doesn't have. But, I do miss not having it during GS's because you get every single match on its on channel.

PlayByPlay
Jan 22nd, 2010, 10:20 PM
I must agree too some objectivity is definitely needed. ESPN commentators need to work on that.:(

vejh
Jan 22nd, 2010, 10:25 PM
American commentators (the majority of the cast of the ESPN AO commentator box) needs a lesson in the job they are professing. They've done poorly for years.

Fowler HAS to go...He MUST leave.

Oh, and the WTA also gets the short end of the stick.

*It's a man's world.....*

Bahia
Jan 22nd, 2010, 11:15 PM
He doesn't have to flirt.... he had me at "Hello"! :o :o :o

ok that was lame. :lol:

No it wasn't!

just whear black,,,

:hearts::hearts::hearts:

Szavay #1
Jan 22nd, 2010, 11:18 PM
American commentators (the majority of the cast of the ESPN AO commentator box) needs a lesson in the job they are professing. They've done poorly for years.

Fowler HAS to go...He MUST leave.

Oh, and the WTA also gets the short end of the stick.

*It's a man's world.....*

i don't think chris fowler likes women's tennis. he's always so negative and sarcastic. :(

mykarma
Jan 23rd, 2010, 12:53 AM
I just don't watch Murray matches any more because John Lloyd has multiple orgasms every time Andy wins a point. It is not pretty.

Darrin, I refuse to believe, R-E-F-U-S-E to believe that you really think I give a rat's ass what you believe. :)

WTF?

Carillo and Enberg are popping off about the '09 US Open incident during match play.

Ridiculous!

please take a big one to make sure she's not talking again :)
:lol::lol::lol:

mykarma
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:02 AM
Somebody really needs to shove a ball down her throat :fiery:
you all are on a :roll:

Oh that's ok then. It sounded a bit like you were going to be on some kind of journey - I thought it might be a pilgrimage to Mecca or something :tape:.
:help:

mykarma
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:04 AM
He doesn't have to flirt.... he had me at "Hello"! :o :o :o

ok that was lame. :lol:
I think I'm going to throw up.

Szavay #1
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:22 AM
i also don't like these 2 guys doug and jeff. they talk about the atp way too much during a WTA match. :(

Denise4925
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:22 AM
I fucking hate ESPN. :fiery: They are showing Fed's match and we are missing Serena. I hate when the two of them play at the same time. We all know who and what gender ESPN prefers to show. :rolleyes:

WtaTour4Ever
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:24 AM
OK so when coverage started at 9 they SAID Serena Williams was the feature match....why then are we still watching Federer???? He's not serving out a set or even a match...seriously. I'm so annoyed how the coverage errs towards the men 80% of the time. I'm not anti Federer by any means, but come on. Is Serena the feature match or the side story, cause I didn't need to rush home for THIS

Golovinjured.
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:33 AM
RogerGOAT >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> RenaGOTE

WtaTour4Ever
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:34 AM
Yeah but the mens match will go three, womens 2..they can show him after....f'n ridiculous. Serena's half way over now.

Golovinjured.
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:36 AM
Atleast Montanes is making the mens match somewhat competitive.

WtaTour4Ever
Jan 23rd, 2010, 01:44 AM
Well I can't compare b/c I didn't see Serena's first 5 games, but either way my point is don't claim its a feature and then not show it...had they said Roger was the feature I wouldn't be complaining.

pokey camp
Jan 23rd, 2010, 02:26 AM
i also don't like these 2 guys doug and jeff. they talk about the atp way too much during a WTA match. :(
Oy. Yes. Those must be the guys who were doing the Justine/Alisa match yesterday. It's soo damn annoying. If I wanted to hear about penis tennis I'd be watching it. Though once they stopped with the ATP talk, I ended up liking them overall because they focused on the match.

But I think for a lot of male announcers calling a WTA match is like working JV. Their real goal is to work ATP only... and it shows. :tape:

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:20 AM
Mary is an idiot!!! "Casey is ranked #980 in the world, I didn't know they ranked that many players" :rolleyes:

WtaTour4Ever
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:23 AM
Mary is an idiot!!! "Casey is ranked #980 in the world, I didn't know they ranked that many players" :rolleyes:
LOL - ...I was kinda thinking the same thing...well..regarding the # of people ranked.

saul1333
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:23 AM
Mary has used that line so many time :o

Golovinjured.
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:25 AM
:spit: Mary :inlove:

DOUBLEFIST
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:55 AM
I'm confused.

Could somebody tell me...

HOW many slam singles does Mary, Darrin Cahill and Pam have between them?

20..., no?

11..., no?

7..., no?

1..., no?

Hmmmm? :confused:

:shrug: I thought they had at least a few listening to them talk about Venus' game. :scratch:

darrinbaker00
Jan 23rd, 2010, 03:58 AM
I'm confused.

Could somebody tell me...

HOW many slam singles does Mary, Darrin Cahill and Pam have between them?

20..., no?

11..., no?

7..., no?

1..., no?

Hmmmm? :confused:

:shrug: I thought they had at least a few listening to them talk about Venus' game. :scratch:
That makes a difference because.....?

Golovinjured.
Jan 23rd, 2010, 04:00 AM
I'm confused.

Could somebody tell me...

HOW many slam singles does Mary, Darrin Cahill and Pam have between them?

20..., no?

11..., no?

7..., no?

1..., no?

Hmmmm? :confused:

:shrug: I thought they had at least a few listening to them talk about Venus' game. :scratch:

How many matches have you professionally commentated on?

20..., no?

11..., no?

7..., no?

1..., no?

Hmmmm? :confused:

:shrug: I thought you had at least once or twice listening to you talk about their commentating. :scratch:

DOUBLEFIST
Jan 23rd, 2010, 04:06 AM
How many matches have you professionally commentated on?

20..., no?

11..., no?

7..., no?

1..., no?

Hmmmm? :confused:

:shrug: I thought you had at least once or twice listening to you talk about their commentating. :scratch:

:lol: clever.

But, really I don't talk about the commentators too much.

The fact is, you and I a free to debate ANYTHING that I say. It's not a one way conversation. Another fact is, ANYONE can and does comment on matches around here. Just follow a live score thread. It's childs play. Which why I'm astounded how the mess it up so often.

But hey, I like your response.

Golovinjured.
Jan 23rd, 2010, 04:21 AM
Hey, I'm right, you're wrong and this is how we get along. :)

The Witch-king
Jan 23rd, 2010, 04:40 AM
Mary is an idiot!!! "Casey is ranked #980 in the world, I didn't know they ranked that many players" :rolleyes:

wasn't her peak ranking lower than that

saul1333
Jan 23rd, 2010, 04:50 AM
You can always hear their cell phones interfering with the mic as well :lol:

Szavay #1
Jan 23rd, 2010, 12:30 PM
You can always hear their cell phones interfering with the mic as well :lol:

i know! those damn text tones. :lol:

infinitusone
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:12 PM
The grading of tennis analysts.

This is according to Tennis magazine January/February 2010

Mary Carillo (ESPN,NBC,CBS) A

Jimmy Connors (Tennis Channel) B+

Dick Enberg (ESPN, CBS) C-

Justin Gimelstob (Tennis channel) B

Robbie Koenig (Tennis Channel) A-

John McEnroe (ESPN,NBC,CBS,Tennis Channel) B

Pam shriver (ESPN) C+

saul1333
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:24 PM
The grading of tennis analysts.

This is according to Tennis magazine January/February 2010

Mary Carillo (ESPN,NBC,CBS) A

Jimmy Connors (Tennis Channel) B+

Dick Enberg (ESPN, CBS) C-

Justin Gimelstob (Tennis channel) B

Robbie Koenig (Tennis Channel) A-

John McEnroe (ESPN,NBC,CBS,Tennis Channel) B

Pam shriver (ESPN) C+

Dick Enberg: Yes, he has a legendary set of velvety pipes. But he doesnt need to use them to fill up every spare moment of air time :haha:

Ryan
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:28 PM
I would probably reverse their ridiculous rankings.


Pam - A: Candid, funny, and thoughtful analysis.

Killer Cahill's pretty great too.

aaggjg
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:30 PM
Dick Enberg: Yes, he has a legendary set of velvety pipes. But he doesnt need to use them to fill up every spare moment of air time :haha:

Yes he does!!! Did you hear him the other night explaining what all the signage was ?? "Kia is a car company and Jacob's Creek is a vineyard I think.... I just thought you would all like to know what these things stand for....."
How about just not talking??? There's an idea.

aaggjg
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:31 PM
The grading of tennis analysts.

This is according to Tennis magazine January/February 2010

Mary Carillo (ESPN,NBC,CBS) A

Jimmy Connors (Tennis Channel) B+

Dick Enberg (ESPN, CBS) C-

Justin Gimelstob (Tennis channel) B

Robbie Koenig (Tennis Channel) A-

John McEnroe (ESPN,NBC,CBS,Tennis Channel) B

Pam shriver (ESPN) C+


What are they smoking??? Gimbelstob a B??? He is THE WORST!!!

mpmg
Jan 23rd, 2010, 08:57 PM
Pam used to be good. Ever since she got Hradecka and Hlavackova mixed up at the french open and kept pointing to Hlavackova and saying how much fitter and better in singles she was than Hradecka I hate her. I mean those two aren't world class names but fuck...at least know who's who on the court.

Carillo-idiot!

That guy Jeff on ESPN 360. That's Jeff Tarango a former player who was a complete lunatic. I was suprised that he wes coherent enough to call the match between Giseloo Doluko and Vera Zvonarevo as he called them a few times. But actually he focused on the match and the play and did relatively well.

Rocketta
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:38 AM
You had me at 'yuck this gaviscon tastes gross.' :angel:

I would follow it's true. Perhaps Allah would guide me.

On topic, that's reassuring, I'll ring you next week.

ok well you know we will be here. :)

tennisbum79
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:13 AM
She started about similarities in Justine and Yanina background and would not stop for 2 minutes

A Magicman
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:14 AM
She started about similarities in Justine and Yanina background and would not stop for 2 minutes

So? The German commentator @ Eurosport just did the same and it lasted over 2 minutes.

Justin SW
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:14 AM
I think the Belgian subforum would enjoy answering in your thread :ras:

young_gunner913
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:18 AM
She started about similarities in Justine and Yanina background and would not stop for 2 minutes

thank goodness they went back to Cilic-JMDP match or else Carillo would've climaxed everyhwere.

Uranium
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:18 AM
I think the Belgian subforum would enjoy answering in your thread :ras:

Like you should be saying anything about where threads belong when you created a thread in GM and spammed in threads asking for help with a PAL converter.:rolleyes:

Edinboro
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:19 AM
Why don't you like that?

In fact I think it's great. It's a nice way for viewers that don't know about Wickmayer to get a feel for her. Kudos Mary!

tennisbum79
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:21 AM
I think the Belgian subforum would enjoy answering in your thread :ras:
Luckily, this is not the Belgian subforum

I don't mind personal stories, but when Mary Carillo tells them, the same stories are guaranted to be repeated throughout the match... at nauseaum

Martian KC
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:22 AM
They'll find anything to bitch at Mary about. BTW, add this to the coverage complaint threads.

tennisbum79
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:25 AM
Why don't you like that?

In fact I think it's great. It's a nice way for viewers that don't know about Wickmayer to get a feel for her. Kudos Mary!
I have no objection to personal stories per se,
I have strong objection to MC's obsession once she goes that route.
She will repeat the same thing over and over again

Edinboro
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:25 AM
They'll find anything to bitch at Mary about. BTW, add this to the coverage complaint threads.


I was gonna say the same thing. :lol: I'll never understand the Mary hate. I think she's great. :worship:

tennisbum79
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:28 AM
I was gonna say the same thing. :lol: I'll never understand the Mary hate. I think she's great. :worship:
Before I break uo your love fest, please read carefully.
There are nuances in my posts

ptkten
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:29 AM
Lol I wanted to make this thread. I almost vomited when Mary started with her crap again. She has no idea what she's talking about, Yanina is much closer to Kim than Justine. Regardless, she should stick to tennis rather than personal stuff about the players.

pierce85
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:45 AM
british eurosport commentator jerking over yanina wickmayer."What a nice name yanina is,she just oozes positive energy,that's my girl" STOP ALREADY

Jeff
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:51 AM
On another note, ESPN is scrolling that Alona Bondarenko def. Jie Zheng 7:6, 6:4 :o:rolleyes:

pierce85
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:52 AM
just noticed that this thread is about espn not eurosport. my bad

edificio
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:54 AM
Pam used to be good. Ever since she got Hradecka and Hlavackova mixed up at the french open and kept pointing to Hlavackova and saying how much fitter and better in singles she was than Hradecka I hate her. I mean those two aren't world class names but fuck...at least know who's who on the court.

That bugged me too, but I thought for sure it was Carillo who did that.

Anyway, as for that Tennis magazine ranking... :help:

None of the current American commentators get an A. Maybe Shriver gets a B+ for making me laugh on occasion.

I'm watching Eurosport, though. They, at least, let us watch the match in silence for longish stretches.

Golovinjured.
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:54 AM
I really like Robbie Koenig, but no one beats Pam. :inlove:

edificio
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:56 AM
british eurosport commentator jerking over yanina wickmayer."What a nice name yanina is,she just oozes positive energy,that's my girl" STOP ALREADY

That was hilarious. I'm not sure how it oozes that, though. Ewwwwww. but...now he's going on about how great it is that they are both going for the match and not waiting for the other to miss. Okay.

Sylvester
Jan 24th, 2010, 07:59 AM
So? The German commentator @ Eurosport just did the same and it lasted over 2 minutes.

Same with Portuguese Eurosport.

The commentators have mentioned that both Henin's and Wickmayer's mothers have passed away when Henin and Wickmayer were very young like 10 times in 15 minutes! :help:


Also do we have to be told every single time that Henin plays a match that Carlos Rodriguez is like a second father to her?

spice_of_life
Jan 24th, 2010, 08:52 AM
Stupid ESPN not showing the start of the 3rd set of Justine's match. Showing some puff piece on Andy Roddick instead. :rolleyes:

Marilyn Monheaux
Jan 24th, 2010, 09:36 AM
I know this is about ESPN, but ES is pissing me off right now! Instead of showing actual LIVE MATCHES on ES International, they're showing Game, Set & Mats:weirdo: and I'm stuck with a crappy livestream!:bigcry:

barboza
Jan 24th, 2010, 09:58 AM
I really hate the new commentator and how they showed Roddick's prologue during the Yanina-Henin match.. seriously ESPN.

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 24th, 2010, 11:35 AM
people here think serena fans don't know what they are talking about when it comes to ESPN:

watching the roddick match they sound absolutely devasted that gonzo broke roddick to love and served out the set...not nearly the same excitement they show when serena or venus are getting pushed by other players, and sounds exactly like how they sound when jh or kim are losing...

Bijoux0021
Jan 24th, 2010, 11:42 AM
On another note, ESPN is scrolling that Alona Bondarenko def. Jie Zheng 7:6, 6:4 :o:rolleyes:
Yes, I saw that. :o

Bahia
Jan 24th, 2010, 11:45 AM
I wish I had ESPN. Patrick McEnroe must be distraught.

Car Key Boi
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:31 PM
ESPN and all the other sports channels should offer its viewers the option of a 'commentator mute button" so that the only sound you get is from the courtside mics. That would be the ultimate viewing experience imo. I think in time such an option would become very popular with audiences much to the chagrin of Patrick McEnroe and co

Oneofakind0490
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:38 PM
Ultimate hypocrisy right now from ESPN. Roddick was robbed the other day for the same thing. Same thing gives Roddick the set and Gonzo is totally wrong.

mckyle.
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:39 PM
Patrick trying to justify that call was :help: He should just admit he's wrong; it's not like they can do anything about it now anyways...

ghost world
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:49 PM
No warning for breaking rackets, then?

Hmm...

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:54 PM
thank goodness they went back to Cilic-JMDP match or else Carillo would've climaxed everyhwere.
:eek:

Patrick trying to justify that call was :help: He should just admit he's wrong; it's not like they can do anything about it now anyways...
I think Patrick was right on this call. Gonza let the ball go without attempting to hit it before it was called out. No playover in that case.

Pureracket
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:58 PM
I'm sitting here watching Andy Roddick in a pissing contest with Gonzo and listening to Chris Fowler, Patty Mc, and Brad Gilbert. They are not even trying to make it a secret that they are rooting for the American. Justin Gimelstob, I'm pretty sure, had a set of pom poms during the Isner match.

Why, oh why don't the American commentators do this whenever Serena and Venus are playing? Carillo has called for them to be banned from the sport, and Navratilova coaches all of their opponents from the booth.

Fowler approaches their matches as if he's in amazement that women even play sports, and Patty Mc hates them both and rags on them @ every turn.

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 24th, 2010, 12:59 PM
yes but patrick was arguing for roddick when it was the same call...same chair ump i think said roddick couldn't get a play over cause he didn't make a play on the ball and patrick was livid and came with all sorts of reasons why roddick should have been able to replay the point

mckyle.
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:10 PM
I believe it's because they are black.

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:11 PM
yes but patrick was arguing for roddick when it was the same call...same chair ump i think said roddick couldn't get a play over cause he didn't make a play on the ball and patrick was livid and came with all sorts of reasons why roddick should have been able to replay the point

I didn't see that one but it doesn't change the fact that Patrick was correct with this play.

That being said, it was really funny how quiet they became when Gonza was kicking Roddick's ass.

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:17 PM
it's not about whether he's right or wrong...it's that he argues about how wrong the chair ump was in that 2nd rd mp when he made the same call against roddick, but now tonight he's all about how right the call is now that the call is for roddick...bet if the call goes against roddick in another match, then he'll change his tune again...

same old patrick mac...

Andrew Laeddis
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:17 PM
I really like Robbie Koenig, but no one beats Pam. :inlove:

He's terrible. He jizzes in his pants whenever he commentates a Nadull match. Not to mention he is completely in love with the phrase "When The Chip Are Down". Doug Adkler is even worse. Those two covering matches together is just :help::tape::o

thegreendestiny
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:18 PM
Yep, because they're black. So much for multi-cultural America. If they had been Moldovan-Americans, they might get very high level of support but they're not.:shrug:

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:22 PM
yes but patrick was arguing for roddick when it was the same call...same chair ump i think said roddick couldn't get a play over cause he didn't make a play on the ball and patrick was livid and came with all sorts of reasons why roddick should have been able to replay the point
:lol: OK but what does that have to do with the post I was responding to? :shrug:

jefrilibra
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:23 PM
I noticed that too and frankly I dont know why. And skin color is too simplistic a reason for that.

Anyway Im shocked Andy won a 5-setter! I thought he was gone after trailing 1-2 in sets! He has a great chance against Cilic in the QF!

BuTtErFrEnA
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:27 PM
cause you said patrick was right :shrug: when it's not really about right or wrong..it's about the obvious bias they show when commentating

SharapovaFTW
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:28 PM
I believe it's because they are black.

:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?

miffedmax
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:29 PM
I think that may be part of it, but look at how they go all dewy eyed and weak-kneed over James Blake.
As you pointed out, Fowler acts like he's being exiled to Siberia (no offence, TOB) every time he has to cover ANY women. And a lot of these folks are really tied into the USTA establishment, which Richard (in particular) has enjoyed :nerner: at since Day One.

I honestly think that if the Williams sisters would put on their matching blue pinafores and show up at every tournament and gush breathlessly about how tennis is their whole life and not design their own fashion lines and act and do all the other things that make them the WS, SOME of the palpable dislike from the US tennis establishment (including the ESPN announcers) would go away.

I'm not going to accuse Blake of being a sellout, because every person is different and can go his or her own way. But he's been more willing to be part of the tennis establishment at every level. The WS haven't. That wouldn't get rid of everything, as there's still sexism and racism out there. But I think some of it is due to the WS. Actually, though, frustrating as it is, isn't that part of what makes you a fan?

Bijoux0021
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:36 PM
I think that may be part of it, but look at how they go all dewy eyed and weak-kneed over James Blake.
As you pointed out, Fowler acts like he's being exiled to Siberia (no offence, TOB) every time he has to cover ANY women. And a lot of these folks are really tied into the USTA establishment, which Richard (in particular) has enjoyed :nerner: at since Day One.

I honestly think that if the Williams sisters would put on their matching blue pinafores and show up at every tournament and gush breathlessly about how tennis is their whole life and not design their own fashion lines and act and do all the other things that make them the WS, SOME of the palpable dislike from the US tennis establishment (including the ESPN announcers) would go away.
Yeah right! :rolleyes: How come they don't see anything wrong with Kim, Sharapova and anyone else having outside interests? :confused:

And James Blake is not a threat to their tennis establishment, so they feel very secure with him.

Andrew Laeddis
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:38 PM
:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?

Really. :eek: I was just about to go out and pick some cotton.

To The OP:
Its just a matter of preference. Im black but not a fan of the Williams. I am however a fan of Roddick. I dont think their feelings about V&S are based on race. They do love James Blake. Not everything is about race. There are far more reasons to like/dislike someone other than race.

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:44 PM
:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?
yessa oh grand massa, anything you say suh. :rolleyes:

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:55 PM
:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?


And this is your serious response ..? everybody knows that we are in a free country and that people can like or dislike whoever they want ... very deep ..:rolleyes:

The OP wants an analysis of the dislike of almost the entire american commentators towards the Williams wereas they seem to root for the other american players , there is some deepest explanation to this behavior rather than "everybody makes what he wants" ;

I think the Williams are very different from the other American players . 1st , they are Black , 2nd they are black american winners which is the big difference with James Blake . I dont think James Blake would have been liked as he is today if he was a multiple GS champion.

Noctis
Jan 24th, 2010, 01:56 PM
Racist Americans

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:03 PM
Really. :eek: I was just about to go out and pick some cotton.

To The OP:
Its just a matter of preference. Im black but not a fan of the Williams. I am however a fan of Roddick. I dont think their feelings about V&S are based on race. They do love James Blake. Not everything is about race. There are far more reasons to like/dislike someone other than race.


Yeah but this time it seems it is an obvious fact that it is about Race , because FACT is they root for ALL the American players except the Williams Sisters although they are american , how do you explain that ..?
I dont see a difference between the Williams sisters and the other american players apart from their race and aschievement , i dont see other reasons..

miffedmax
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:13 PM
Yeah right! :rolleyes: How come they don't see anything wrong with Kim, Sharapova and anyone else having outside interests? :confused:

And James Blake is not a threat to their tennis establishment, so they feel very secure with him.

Both your points reiterate my points, so I don't see why you're giving me this :eyeroll:.

I never said race wasn't a factor, only that there were other factors in the Williams' treatment. Which you yourself have confirmed by pointing out that Blake has succeeded in ingratiating himself with the establishment.

SharapovaFTW
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:14 PM
[/I][/B]


Yeah but this time it seems it is an obvious fact that it is about Race , because FACT is they root for ALL the American players except the Williams Sisters although they are american , how do you explain that ..?
I dont see a difference between the Williams sisters and the other american players apart from their race and aschievement , i dont see other reasons..

It's about race when you said yourself they support Blake? O wait, wait Blake isn't successful and if he was then yea they wouldn't support him as much. You just going to make assumptions like that? How about this... you're full of shit. Quit pulling the race card. It really is tired and so last decade. If blacks aren't being treated the way they like, they always think it has something to do with race. Maybe it's just because they don't straight up like the Williams sisters like I said. They don't have to, and don't need to explain to you why they don't.

To sum it up Blake is black, the Williams sisters are black.
Blake isn't a Grand Slam Champion, the Williams are Grand Slam champions.
Yet people are saying it has EVERYTHING to do with race? :confused:
They'll root for black Blake, but not a black Williams.
O wait, wait it must be because he is a man, yea that is it.
Now they are just hating on females.

:rolleyes:

Sounds like to me you guys have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Another fine example of whining just to whine, because you don't have anything better to do with your lives and let it bother you what another person thinks about your favorite tennis player.

thegreendestiny
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:19 PM
You might as well add sexism in mix. Not only are they black and successful but also because they're women. Black women dominating a white man's sport was unheard of until they emerged.

mckyle.
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:20 PM
:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?

I'm not black.

Bijoux0021
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:21 PM
Both your points reiterate my points, so I don't see why you're giving me this :eyeroll:.

I never said race wasn't a factor, only that there were other factors in the Williams' treatment. Which you yourself have confirmed by pointing out that Blake has succeeded in ingratiating himself with the establishment.
My point was James Blake is not a threat to win Slams, so the tennis establishment feel comfortable with him and his accomplishments.

miffedmax
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:27 PM
[/I][/B]


Yeah but this time it seems it is an obvious fact that it is about Race , because FACT is they root for ALL the American players except the Williams Sisters although they are american , how do you explain that ..?
I dont see a difference between the Williams sisters and the other american players apart from their race and aschievement , i dont see other reasons..

Richard has been outspoken about his issues with the USTA and racism in the sport. Blake and a number of other players haven't been as confrontational. That has made some powerful people angry with him and his daughters.

I'll be the first to say there have been times I've thought Richard was full of it. Other times, I think his remarks have been 100% accurate and justified.

So it's not just a case of Blake being a lovable loser. I think people who say that about a man who's been in the Top 10 and struggled against some life-threatening injuries and horrible personal losses are doing him a grave disservice.

But he's definitely chosen a different approach to dealing with some of the institutional racism he's encountered.

miffedmax
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:31 PM
My point was James Blake is not a threat to win Slams, so the tennis establishment feel comfortable with him and his accomplishments.

And I think it goes beyond just whether or not he's a threat to win slams.

Indian Wells is a great example of the WS aggravating the tennis establishment in a way that Blake wouldn't.

(For the record, I support the WS 100% on their boycott).

Like I said in my first post, I don't think playing nicey-nice would eliminate all of ESPN's bias, but it would eliminate some of it.

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:33 PM
cause you said patrick was right :shrug: when it's not really about right or wrong..it's about the obvious bias they show when commentating
I said Patrick was right about that call from that particular post not about whether he is obviously bias in general. Anyhow, my last comment on that post because we agree on the ESPN commentators.

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:34 PM
It's about race when you said yourself they support Blake? O wait, wait Blake isn't successful and if he was then yea they wouldn't support him as much. You just going to make assumptions like that? How about this... you're full of shit. Quit pulling the race card. It really is tired and so last decade. If blacks aren't being treated the way they like, they always think it has something to do with race. Maybe it's just because they don't straight up like the Williams sisters like I said. They don't have to, and don't need to explain to you why they don't.

To sum it up Blake is black, the Williams sisters are black.
Blake isn't a Grand Slam Champion, the Williams are Grand Slam champions.
Yet people are saying it has EVERYTHING to do with race? :confused:
They'll root for black Blake, but not a black Williams.
O wait, wait it must be because he is a man, yea that is it.
Now they are just hating on females.

:rolleyes:

Sounds like to me you guys have no idea what the hell you are talking about. Another fine example of whining just to whine, because you don't have anything better to do with your lives and let it bother you what another person thinks about your favorite tennis player.


Still with your same "everybody makes what he wants " .

The question is what is for you the reason the Williams sisters have this treatment compared to the other american Players , you havent given any response yet .. .

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:38 PM
I'm not black.
:spit:

kwilliams
Jan 24th, 2010, 02:38 PM
If you're going to support American players. Why not support the ones who actually win grand slam titles!? They're the ones bringing glory to the country, they're the ones who help keep Americans interested in tennis and they're the ones who most young girls must look up to. I'm sure they may indirectly be helping USTA funding as well. Their must be a huge number of young girls and even some young boys ;) who are paying USTA coaches or paying to use USTA facilities who got into tennis because of the sisters, who train all the time thinking "I want to be like Venus and Serena".

It's no secret that the sisters aren't the biggest fans of the USTA but they have the class and composure to be civil about things and about people in public. They don't dredge up old issues with the press - the press do that instead. These commentators associated with the USTA are catty at times and they do dredge up old issues a lot. They do not behave as respectably as the Williams Sisters do. And to SharapovaFTW - You think they can say what they want because they are fans!? Most of them are sports writers, too. You know, journalists? They're supposed to be unbiased. I much prefer British commentators to American commentators because they are unbiased, they're not as catty and they don't rant about problems from the past as much.

Yeah, maybe some posters play the race card a lot but not everybody does. Venus and Serena don't. Despite the fact that they have obviously faced some prejudice and sexism, especially when they first came on the scene. I don't think they've faced much, if any, racism in the USTA but then again I wouldn't know for sure. I do think they've faced prejudice. The discrimination they have faced is the obvious and justifiable reason why they are kissing ass within the USTA. They've accomplished so much for America and have directly or indirectly helped the USTA but they haven't been given much thanks for it and they haven't had quite as much support to help them accomplish these things. Despite all that, they at least have the decency to smile and be civil even though others will rag on them while lauding lesser players in the name of "team" spirit and patriotism.

The sisters truly are a cut above anyone in the commentary box.

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 03:01 PM
As Jesus says : "No man is a prophet in his own country" .

BlameSerena
Jan 24th, 2010, 03:11 PM
Ultimate hypocrisy right now from ESPN. Roddick was robbed the other day for the same thing. Same thing gives Roddick the set and Gonzo is totally wrong.

Yup, and it was wrong BOTH times. Now they try to justify the same call b/c it went in Roddick's favor. It's becoming a joke imo. The commentators should just shut up about that stuff.

And I guess no big deal about Gonzo throwing paper and breaking his racket cause he didn't even get a warning.

kiwifan
Jan 24th, 2010, 03:39 PM
If Chad OchoCinco was a Grand Slam winning tennis player the tennis media would hate on him...any black person who is successful and takes full credit for his or her own success will be resented by the USTA, especially if it is true, because it shines a light on the true character of their organization.
Like most of America's institutions it is a big bureaucracy that doesn't give a flying fuck about Black people beyond doing what ever they can to not appear racist...does this make them racist? Not in my definition; but it doesn't make them a positive for black tennis players, either. Any black tennis champion that emerges via USTA discovery and development will be a happy accident...and they will happily crown him or her as long as they can take the praise.

As a black person who thrives in white society, I've always been aware of "the game" that goes along with that ability to thrive. I won't give away everything (it is bookworthy) because you literally have to dodge mine fields of people who to varying degrees not only hate you for your skin color but will undermine you if you dare acknowledge the possibility that anyone in the entire world who doesn't wear a white hood and burn a cross on your desk might feel that way (the person who's been whining about the race card probably fits that description judging them soley by their current hostility to the topic).

However there are others who will straight up disrespect you if you try to get by without race as a factor; we've all heard something along the lines of, "you don't know that song/dance/movie? Damn, I'm blacker than you!" Said with pride by those high fiving/fist bumping hipster wannabe dudes in the office. Especially on the East Coast there is Irish Pride, Italian Pride, Puerto Rican Pride, Ukranian Pride, etc...so "you better represent", or there's something wrong with you, "are you an Oreo or something?"

So you've got the old "Catch 22"

In the workplace regardless of race there are those unwritten rules that you only get to learn via being there...but no one tells you how to learn them, you almost just realize that you've learned them in hindsight...HOWEVER when you're the only black person on the scene and it seems like everyone can get away with these thing (unwritten rules) but you can't...why on Earth wouldn't you think it is race based? Especially when the unwritten rules are as silly as: not calling shots that are out, "out"; apologizing for winning points on netcords; or for hitting your opponent at the net when everyone knows you meant to and would do it again and pretending that your opponent did a great job when you've just beaten them bagel and breadstick and then turning around and having to pretend you played your best when that same opponent takes you out in a tiebreaker when the winning shot came off the frame of their racket. Especially when these rules only seem to have become 'sacred' when the little black girls started beating all the other girls. ;) :p :devil:

In my small college sports teams used to throw most of the parties on campus and it was understood that if the soccer team threw a party, soccer players could cut to the front of the line to fill pitchers or get beer for themselves...well a Black freshman attended his first party in the middle of the year and when the young white guys blatantly cut in front of him; he thought it was them disrespecting him because of his race and I was lucky enough to catch the situation early enough to take the kid aside and explain what was really going on...feeling were still hurt all around (jock entitlement and race tension floating in the air and my being both a jock and black...what a buzz kill)...but everyone has to "see" the other's perspective or nothing can be accomplished.

Now if your perspective is shut up about race, then perhaps you should just stay out of racial conversations all together...that black slaves were freed has nothing to do with the Ku Klux Klan and Jim Crow laws and "gentlemen's agreements" which all whites have benefitted from to some extent to the detriment of our society as a whole right up into the 1990s...
...as some posters have noted before our whole GI Bill based suburban middle class was built upon Jim Crow laws that allowed whites to shift to and overpopulate the suburbs and our universities in the post WWII/Cold War era. This is when the unwritten rules of modern business were developed and blacks were specifically excluded from this more often than not...so when Black people percieve racism in the face of benign neglect, they aren't necessarily wrong...and when those White people in the office scratch their heads and claim they don't have a racist bone in their body, they aren't necessarily lying...and yet we still have institutional bias.

So I site the USTA guilty of institutional bias; the American tennis establishment with few exceptions doesn't have much love for the Williams Sisters. For Christ's sake they were two little Black kids...children...when they came on the scene and what do they get? Attacked for not playing juniors, commentator constantly hinting that they were stupid tennis players; and the nit picking mentioned above. They are dimissed as ball bashers and yet the USTA just loves Lindsay and J Cap. They are attacked for arrogance and yet the USTA just loves Martina Hingis and Anna Kounikova; so what are people to think?

Carillo's hate for them is clearly personal, might not be racial, but there should be no forum for Carillo's over the top attacks every fucking slam year after year after year...yet there is so why wouldn't Blacks percieve some racism? I don't personally, I see a personal bias..."but I understand" and I think any rational poster would also "understand". :cool:

thrust
Jan 24th, 2010, 03:54 PM
I really hate the new commentator and how they showed Roddick's prologue during the Yanina-Henin match.. seriously ESPN.

ME TOO!

Jolene
Jan 24th, 2010, 03:57 PM
Race may be part of it, but I think it's also that there is something more fundamentally nonconformist about Venus and Serena then the other people you mentioned, like Kim or Maria. It's not just the outside interests; it's something more - they are able to excel without giving the impression that tennis is their entire life, and for other people who have made tennis their entire life, that will make them resentful. Surely, Kim and Justine both retired, but their returns only reiterate the importance of tennis - that they couldn't live without it. And Maria is also interested in fashion and Holly wood and whatever, but somehow it comes across as more commercial/conventional, whereas with Venus/Serena it comes across as doing whatever they want. I think it can always seem like a mystery why people in power/authority seem to be irrationally nettled by certain personalities, but I've seen it in schools with teachers and students, and I'm sure other people have seen it in the workplace - there is something about authority that recognizes a person who just doesn't abide by it, who doesn't even rebel against it, but almost just doesn't acknowledge its existence, and those who place a lot of their self-validation in the legitimacy of that authority will always be unable to deal with that. I tend to agree with miffedmax that for those who like the Williams sisters, it should almost be a compliment to them that some people are so bothered by them, because I think in a backhanded way it is an acknowledgment of their truly free spirits.

matty
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:01 PM
Probably because they are black and people are jealous of their success and millions.
It also could be a little about their faith. Jehovah witnesses aren't as main stream as other christian faiths.

KournikovaFan91
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:06 PM
If you're going to support American players. Why not support the ones who actually win grand slam titles!?.

There are other reason not to support players even if they are from your own country. For example I am not a fan of any of those rugby players we have, and I really don't care what they win. I am also not a fan of Soresen and I am of Niland and I don't care that Sorensen won a match a AO.

sakya23
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:15 PM
directv is the way to go, any of the six courts you want to see.

Uranium
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:16 PM
directv is the way to go, any of the six courts you want to see.

It stops tonight though:sobbing:

mykarma
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:21 PM
If Chad OchoCinco was a Grand Slam winning tennis player the tennis media would hate on him...any black person who is successful and takes full credit for his or her own success will be resented by the USTA, especially if it is true, because it shines a light on the true character of their organization.
Like most of America's institutions it is a big bureaucracy that doesn't give a flying fuck about Black people beyond doing what ever they can to not appear racist...does this make them racist? Not in my definition; but it doesn't make them a positive for black tennis players, either. Any black tennis champion that emerges via USTA discovery and development will be a happy accident...and they will happily crown him or her as long as they can take the praise.

As a black person who thrives in white society, I've always been aware of "the game" that goes along with that ability to thrive. I won't give away everything (it is bookworthy) because you literally have to dodge mine fields of people who to varying degrees not only hate you for your skin color but will undermine you if you dare acknowledge the possibility that anyone in the entire world who doesn't wear a white hood and burn a cross on your desk might feel that way (the person who's been whining about the race card probably fits that description judging them soley by their current hostility to the topic).

However there are others who will straight up disrespect you if you try to get by without race as a factor; we've all heard something along the lines of, "you don't know that song/dance/movie? Damn, I'm blacker than you!" Said with pride by those high fiving/fist bumping hipster wannabe dudes in the office. Especially on the East Coast there is Irish Pride, Italian Pride, Puerto Rican Pride, Ukranian Pride, etc...so "you better represent", or there's something wrong with you, "are you an Oreo or something?"

So you've got the old "Catch 22"

In the workplace regardless of race there are those unwritten rules that you only get to learn via being there...but no one tells you how to learn them, you almost just realize that you've learned them in hindsight...HOWEVER when you're the only black person on the scene and it seems like everyone can get away with these thing (unwritten rules) but you can't...why on Earth wouldn't you think it is race based? Especially when the unwritten rules are as silly as: not calling shots that are out, "out"; apologizing for winning points on netcords; or for hitting your opponent at the net when everyone knows you meant to and would do it again and pretending that your opponent did a great job when you've just beaten them bagel and breadstick and then turning around and having to pretend you played your best when that same opponent takes you out in a tiebreaker when the winning shot came off the frame of their racket. Especially when these rules only seem to have become 'sacred' when the little black girls started beating all the other girls. ;) :p :devil:

In my small college sports teams used to throw most of the parties on campus and it was understood that if the soccer team threw a party, soccer players could cut to the front of the line to fill pitchers or get beer for themselves...well a Black freshman attended his first party in the middle of the year and when the young white guys blatantly cut in front of him; he thought it was them disrespecting him because of his race and I was lucky enough to catch the situation early enough to take the kid aside and explain what was really going on...feeling were still hurt all around (jock entitlement and race tension floating in the air and my being both a jock and black...what a buzz kill)...but everyone has to "see" the other's perspective or nothing can be accomplished.

Now if your perspective is shut up about race, then perhaps you should just stay out of racial conversations all together...that black slaves were freed has nothing to do with the Ku Klux Klan and Jim Crow laws and "gentlemen's agreements" which all whites have benefitted from to some extent to the detriment of our society as a whole right up into the 1990s...
...as some posters have noted before our whole GI Bill based suburban middle class was built upon Jim Crow laws that allowed whites to shift to and overpopulate the suburbs and our universities in the post WWII/Cold War era. This is when the unwritten rules of modern business were developed and blacks were specifically excluded from this more often than not...so when Black people percieve racism in the face of benign neglect, they aren't necessarily wrong...and when those White people in the office scratch their heads and claim they don't have a racist bone in their body, they aren't necessarily lying...and yet we still have institutional bias.

So I site the USTA guilty of institutional bias; the American tennis establishment with few exceptions doesn't have much love for the Williams Sisters. For Christ's sake they were two little Black kids...children...when they came on the scene and what do they get? Attacked for not playing juniors, commentator constantly hinting that they were stupid tennis players; and the nit picking mentioned above. They are dimissed as ball bashers and yet the USTA just loves Lindsay and J Cap. They are attacked for arrogance and yet the USTA just loves Martina Hingis and Anna Kounikova; so what are people to think?

Carillo's hate for them is clearly personal, might not be racial, but there should be no forum for Carillo's over the top attacks every fucking slam year after year after year...yet there is so why wouldn't Blacks percieve some racism? I don't personally, I see a personal bias..."but I understand" and I think any rational poster would also "understand". :cool:
DAMN!!! :worship::worship::worship:

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:22 PM
Race may be part of it, but I think it's also that there is something more fundamentally nonconformist about Venus and Serena then the other people you mentioned, like Kim or Maria. It's not just the outside interests; it's something more - they are able to excel without giving the impression that tennis is their entire life, and for other people who have made tennis their entire life, that will make them resentful. Surely, Kim and Justine both retired, but their returns only reiterate the importance of tennis - that they couldn't live without it. And Maria is also interested in fashion and Holly wood and whatever, but somehow it comes across as more commercial/conventional, whereas with Venus/Serena it comes across as doing whatever they want. I think it can always seem like a mystery why people in power/authority seem to be irrationally nettled by certain personalities, but I've seen it in schools with teachers and students, and I'm sure other people have seen it in the workplace - there is something about authority that recognizes a person who just doesn't abide by it, who doesn't even rebel against it, but almost just doesn't acknowledge its existence, and those who place a lot of their self-validation in the legitimacy of that authority will always be unable to deal with that. I tend to agree with miffedmax that for those who like the Williams sisters, it should almost be a compliment to them that some people are so bothered by them, because I think in a backhanded way it is an acknowledgment of their truly free spirits.

Great post !

Pureracket
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:30 PM
Race may be part of it, but I think it's also that there is something more fundamentally nonconformist about Venus and Serena then the other people you mentioned, like Kim or Maria. It's not just the outside interests; it's something more - they are able to excel without giving the impression that tennis is their entire life, and for other people who have made tennis their entire life, that will make them resentful. Surely, Kim and Justine both retired, but their returns only reiterate the importance of tennis - that they couldn't live without it. And Maria is also interested in fashion and Holly wood and whatever, but somehow it comes across as more commercial/conventional, whereas with Venus/Serena it comes across as doing whatever they want. I think it can always seem like a mystery why people in power/authority seem to be irrationally nettled by certain personalities, but I've seen it in schools with teachers and students, and I'm sure other people have seen it in the workplace - there is something about authority that recognizes a person who just doesn't abide by it, who doesn't even rebel against it, but almost just doesn't acknowledge its existence, and those who place a lot of their self-validation in the legitimacy of that authority will always be unable to deal with that. I tend to agree with miffedmax that for those who like the Williams sisters, it should almost be a compliment to them that some people are so bothered by them, because I think in a backhanded way it is an acknowledgment of their truly free spirits.I think you and max are right(@ least I would agree with you which doesn't always mean you're right....LOL). However, it seems to go a little deeper than Americans players who are supportive of the USTA establishment. Agassi, who is adored, was not the darling of the USTA nor was Lindsay Davenport. Sampras was barely willing to play Davis Cup. We won't even go back as far as Connors and McEnroe because their disrespect of the American tennis establishment is even worse.

kwilliams
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:34 PM
There are other reason not to support players even if they are from your own country. For example I am not a fan of any of those rugby players we have, and I really don't care what they win. I am also not a fan of Soresen and I am of Niland and I don't care that Sorensen won a match a AO.


I also don't really care that Sorensen won a match but I am happy for him and think he deserves credit for it. I'm saying that if you support players from your country partially because they are good for your country's tennis association and good for your country as a whole then you should give full credit to all players from your country who do the same or more.

The OP made the point that some commentators love some players partially because they were good for American, Americans sports and the USTA. As commentators they should be unbiased, so if they're going to laud Roddick or Oudin so generously or sycophantically they should be grovelling before the WS in supplication because they simply are American tennis right now. No one comes near their accomplishments in singles or doubles. There is a nice healthy gap between them and the rest of the American pack.

Pureracket
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:36 PM
:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

Serious response though just like us the commentators have their favorites and their not so favorites. Just because it is their job to talk in the booth doesn't mean they aren't fans as well. Just because they seem to be supportive of some Americans and not supportive of some other Americans isn't really that big of a deal IMO. They all know these players much more than any of us and have I'm pretty sure conversed with them on numerous occasions. They are free to root for and not root for whoever they damn well please. That is their right as a fan, just as is it any of our rights as fans.

And to top if off, who the hell says just because you are American you have to root for ALL American players?You do know that this pre-meditated rant of yours does not even address the issue, right? Nobody says that it isn't an Americans right to root for the competitor of his/her choice. Maybe you should cut & paste this rant the next time something about the African American race and racism come up on this board.

sweetpeas
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:37 PM
Blake mother is white...Williams sisters parents are both black!!Don"t tell me it don't make a different..I know..Not because i have black friends!

Galsen
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:37 PM
Race may be part of it, but I think it's also that there is something more fundamentally nonconformist about Venus and Serena then the other people you mentioned, like Kim or Maria. It's not just the outside interests; it's something more - they are able to excel without giving the impression that tennis is their entire life, and for other people who have made tennis their entire life, that will make them resentful. Surely, Kim and Justine both retired, but their returns only reiterate the importance of tennis - that they couldn't live without it. And Maria is also interested in fashion and Holly wood and whatever, but somehow it comes across as more commercial/conventional, whereas with Venus/Serena it comes across as doing whatever they want. I think it can always seem like a mystery why people in power/authority seem to be irrationally nettled by certain personalities, but I've seen it in schools with teachers and students, and I'm sure other people have seen it in the workplace - there is something about authority that recognizes a person who just doesn't abide by it, who doesn't even rebel against it, but almost just doesn't acknowledge its existence, and those who place a lot of their self-validation in the legitimacy of that authority will always be unable to deal with that. I tend to agree with miffedmax that for those who like the Williams sisters, it should almost be a compliment to them that some people are so bothered by them, because I think in a backhanded way it is an acknowledgment of their truly free spirits.

this is so true :worship:

bandabou
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:44 PM
:lol: And it don't matter. F*ck the reporters. Who cares about them anyway?

At the end of the day, it's a Serena or Venus who are collecting the trophies...while Blake, Andy (like him actually, but still), and the rest are reduced to being chearleaders for Roger and Rafa. It's all good.

V's a star
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:47 PM
I'm not black.

:haha:

Craigy
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:49 PM
I believe it's because they are black.

:rolleyes: do black people ever get tired of pulling the racism card? You aren't slaves anymore, move on. No one owes you anything.

I'm not black.

LOL. :lol: Silly SharapovaFan16 SharapovaFTW.

AlwaysGraf
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:53 PM
It's because they just aren't likeable. It's got nothing to do with race. They think they are above tennis, Serena especially. I for one can't wait to they retire!

sweetpeas
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:55 PM
Thanks

Kwilliams

Kiwifan

The k are doing a good job,as always!!!!!!!!Thanks so much.:wavey::kiss::bounce::worship:

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 04:59 PM
It's because they just aren't likeable. It's got nothing to do with race. They think they are above tennis, Serena especially. I for one can't wait to they retire!

How does the fact that "they think theyare above tennis" makes them not likeable..?

Here is what Jolene was talkin about , beyond the race , people (like always graf )just dont like anti-conformism , free minds , strong people because those people Highlight their own weakness .

bandabou
Jan 24th, 2010, 05:12 PM
And suddenly when either sister wins, those hypocrites of commentators, wanna talk about American tennis...what? Suddenly they are americans, now?

JadeFox
Jan 24th, 2010, 05:24 PM
To be fair, Andy Roddick has gotten a lot of shit from the American Press for his on court behavior in the past. And until last year's Wimbledon final, many people were ready to write him off in ever getting to another Slam final. The commentators may root for Roddick but I think American sports press in general is disappointed that he hasn't had Pete Sampras career.

I think with the Williams Sisters some of it is race based. Some people will never be happy that two black women are successful as they are in a lily white sport, no matter what. It's best to just ignore those people as no amount of arguing will change their minds. However there are people who just aren't a fan of their game or personalities and it has nothing to do with race. Personally I've always liked Venus over Serena mostly because of her attitude(and I'm also a big sister) but I do love her grass game. When she's on on grass she's great to watch. :hearts:

I don't think they're that nonconforming though. I don't see how having millions of dollars, sponsorship deals, and attending parties with celebrities as some wild deviation from a sport that is obsessed with being seen as glamorous. Maybe if they were hairy legged hippies who wore the same outfit at every tournament that argument would make more sense. Venus and Serena have done their share of WTA promo events and have fought for equal prize money so it's not like they ignore the tour entirely.

My main beef with the commentators and ESPN in general is the lack of love for non Americans. The best example of this in their doubles coverage. If the Williams Sisters and the Bryan Bros. weren't playing doubles, it would never get coverage at all. And while it's expected on a certain level that Americans would get the most coverage on an American Network, for American tennis fans who like non American players who aren't already superstars it sucks. Tennis has never been dominated solely by Americans. It's ALWAYS been an international sport. So note to ESPN: If a hardcore tennis fan is willing to wake up at 3:00 in the morning to watch a match, chances are they don't just only like American players.

wayitis
Jan 24th, 2010, 05:25 PM
The OP wants an analysis of the dislike of almost the entire american commentators towards the Williams wereas they seem to root for the other american players , there is some deepest explanation to this behavior rather than "everybody makes what he wants" ;



It's hard to say, but we can use your particular case to illustrate that not every person conveys his/her preferences based on nationalism... you seem to be French (and my apologies if you are really American)and still seem to hate a fellow Belgian Francophone player, has hardly demonstrated any sympathy for any French player, if ever, and has only American players/singers disclosed as idols... :shrug:

You are a regular fan and person and then entitled to your preferences and biases of course, but in today's environment, I hardly think that the Media is looking for too many unbiased commentators anyway... bland people are not that marketable, that is why casual expectators and fans will react more to Mary Carillo than to the extremely technical and mostly neutral (and in my opinion, outstanding) Darren Cahill...

kiwifan
Jan 24th, 2010, 06:02 PM
Thanks

Kwilliams

Kiwifan

The k are doing a good job,as always!!!!!!!!Thanks so much.:wavey::kiss::bounce::worship:

Making a black man blush. :o

Not during the NFL Playoffs!!!

Time for my mean face!!! :armed:

Human Nature
Jan 24th, 2010, 06:04 PM
It's hard to say, but we can use your particular case to illustrate that not every person conveys his/her preferences based on nationalism... you seem to be French (and my apologies if you are really American)and still seem to hate a fellow Belgian Francophone player, has hardly demonstrated any sympathy for any French player, if ever, and has only American players/singers disclosed as idols... :shrug:

You are a regular fan and person and then entitled to your preferences and biases of course, but in today's environment, I hardly think that the Media is looking for too many unbiased commentators anyway... bland people are not that marketable, that is why casual expectators and fans will react more to Mary Carillo than to the extremely technical and mostly neutral (and in my opinion, outstanding) Darren Cahill...

(sorry for my english)

I live in France but i am not french at all if you want to know , so obviously i dont have any natural love-feeling for french athletes , tennis , footbal or whatever ... , but it doesnt mean i dont like any of them (Marion Bartoli especialy ).

I am from a very small country from where there is no player and no love for this sport . But , hey ..how i would be happy and proud if a young player from my country would break into the scene of tennis , of course it is a natural feeling .

As for the singer , i dont think it is same issue because we are talking about Art and there is not realy a competition in this field except for people who care about figures . But i would defend my culture (music , art , cook etc..) first because it represents all my identity and i am proud of my idntity ..i think its a natural feeling : you always love more the people or things which look like you the most .

Nicolás89
Jan 24th, 2010, 06:05 PM
Seriously, Gonzalez should have won.