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View Full Version : How easy is it to get a positive test, and still be completely innocent?


tennisbear7
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:34 AM
I found this while I was browsing through Martina Navratilova's website, and needless to say it was really interesting.

From: http://www.martinanavratilova.com/hingis.html

DID SHE OR DIDN'T SHE??

November 2, 2007

When I saw the headline about Martina Hingis having tested positive for cocaine, my first reaction was no way- - -let me tell you why:
Every time you play singles at a Grand Slam event, win or lose, you get tested. You give a urine sample and after a last match of any kind, sometimes you give blood as well. You know you will be tested.
You would either have to be really thick or very cocky to think you would not get busted if you were to do a line or smoke a little weed at a party. Mind you the penalty is the same for recreational use of drugs like cocaine and marijuana as it is for performance enhancing drugs like human growth hormones or blood doping(EPO). The penalty is the same for one puff of grass as it is for long term usage of steroids. Whether this is fair or not is another column.
There are two kinds of players: The first kind is those who don't take any drugs---they are completely clean with a clear conscience yet still petrified that somehow your sample will test positive.
The other kind is the cheater. They wonder if this time they will get away with it again or if they will be caught. The innocent players can never be 100% sure there is nothing in their bloodstream. I will give you a couple of examples from my own career:
Example #1- A few years ago, while on a practice court at the Australian Open, I mistakenly picked up someone else's bottle of what I thought was water and realized, after taking a couple of big gulps, that it had a sweet taste. I panicked-what is in this bottle? I took it to the doping control people, explained what happened, and they said there is nothing they could do. I kept a sample for a few months in case my A sample tested positive. I figured I could take the bottle and tell them whatever I tested for-it is in here.
Example #2- I was in Holland for a tournament the week before Wimbledon and walked into a juice bar to order my favorite juice and realized this was no ordinary juice bar-there ae several people smoking pot-as it is legal in Holland. I left immediately but wondered if there is any way I could test positive for a trace of marijuana in my system as it was quite smoky in there.
Example #3- I was at my mom's in the Czech Republic a couple of weeks before the Athens Olympics and since I had just arrived from the US, pretty jetlagged I wanted to get a good night's sleep. My mom gives me a sleeping pill. I take a 1/4 of it, sleep like a baby. In the morning I realized-oh no- I have no idea what was in that pill. I wrote down the name of it and duly reported it at the signing in in Athens. As it turned out, we did not medal and were not tested and there was no problem. But I sure did worry. Of course the stupidity was mine for taking the pill in the first place. Still, it would have been a steep price to pay for that transgression. The point is you can get busted and be completely innocent.
Another way of testing positive is to have someone slip something in your food or drink. It would be easy to do an angry rival or crazed parent slips a "mickey" into your food or drink; this has happened with poison in fact. Or, someone gets paid off at the player cafeteria and again puts something in your food-very simple. Or, as I suspect might have been the case with Martina Hingis, she is at a party, maybe there are some drugs around, of course she says no. When she goes to the bathroom and someone thinks they are being cute, they drop a bit of the white stuff into her drink.
I have no idea if the urine sample could have been someone else's as I have no knowledge of what the chain of events is once the urine sample gets tested. Hingis and her lawyers sure seem to think that is a definite possibility. But how do you fight that and how can you prove that?
Or it might have been the right urine, but Martina H. never knowingly ingested coke. Again-how do you prove that?
It is easy to be cynical about athletes' denials. I, along with millions of fans, am completely disappointed and disgusted with Marion Jones. But let us remember that taking cocaine a few days before a match is not the same as a performance enhancing drug-at-but it is still against the rules. It would have been less damaging for Martina H. to come clean (so to speak) and own up to the fact that she used the drug at a party. But of course that would make sense only if she is truly guilty.
Despite her excellent tennis career, no matter what Hingis did or did not do, when you google her name, Hingis and cocaine are now tied together. This is not a way to end a career. And if Martina H. really did not take the stuff, that is the true shame of it all.

I'd never really thought of the possibilities, but it's quite frightening.

spiceboy
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:42 AM
Former top 100 player Laura Pous Tió is actually banned for taking a medicine prescribed by her doctor that actually contained some illegal stuff that would not enhance her performance at all :weirdo:

This is her sentence by the ITF commitee:

http://www.itftennis.com/shared/medialibrary/pdf/original/IO_30857_original.PDF

Direwolf
Jan 6th, 2009, 03:48 AM
are human growth hormones illegal??

i mean...
dont they give them to kids to make them taller?

So Disrespectful
Jan 6th, 2009, 04:31 AM
are human growth hormones illegal??

i mean...
dont they give them to kids to make them taller?

Yes, but they also increase muscle mass, so of course are not permitted in sport.

DutchieGirl
Jan 6th, 2009, 05:05 AM
The whole area is very tricky and there are lots of possibilities and outcomes that can happen.

DutchieGirl
Jan 6th, 2009, 05:07 AM
The whole area is very tricky and there are lots of possibilities and outcomes that can happen.

#1SteffiGraf#1
Jan 6th, 2009, 06:03 AM
The only thing Hingis fans can go on is that Martina didnt fight as hard as we wanted her to. Maybe its just her personality, maybe her lawyer advised her not.

We only wish it would be resolved somehow

irinska
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:40 AM
You can't fight such allegations!
As Roger Federer said:
".......Sometimes you hit a dead end, they say you test positive you say you didn't...ultimately science will always win, Martina said she can't go through the lengthy legal system of trying to clear her name...so maybe if we found a better appeal system that takes out the laywers and expensive law court expenses than maybe player's can pursue that ."

blamoh
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:55 AM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

-Sonic-
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:59 AM
Thats a really interesting article, thanks :)

HRHoliviasmith
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:01 PM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

interesting thought.

-Sonic-
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:07 PM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

Don't be ridiculous. You "know" nothing.

RND
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:13 PM
Nice article. Thanks for the link. This makes me somehow feel better with Martina.

ElusiveChanteuse
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:20 PM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

If she really took it, she should have retired for good after that foot or whtever injury she had and never make a comeback.:shrug:

Shvedbarilescu
Jan 6th, 2009, 02:36 PM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

Dumbest post of 2009 so far. Congratulations. :rolleyes:

blamoh
Jan 6th, 2009, 05:37 PM
I do not know why I received so many reactions to my response
to this thread-- some called it interesting, others named it the
dumbest post of 2009.
If you are a tennis fan and know what tennis is about,exciting
time of tennis, then just reflect your mind back to 1997-2002.
The rivalry between the williamses and Martina Hingis has never
been seen in tennis history. And that kind of competition means
money to WTA and surely it made money during those years.
And who dares to tarnish the reputation of Martina Hingis or
even the Williamses those years.
So it is possible that she used it and WTA decided to expose her
because she is not the Martina who was the darling of the WTA.

hablo
Jan 6th, 2009, 05:43 PM
If you are right regardles of legal whatever process may involve
you have to fight it to clear the name as in the case of Martina.
What I know she took it and got caught in the process. Who
knows maybe over the years she was THeE NUMBER ONE, she
was using the drug but to keep WTA tour good name, she was
left alone.

It's plausible. This has happened in other sports.

HRHoliviasmith
Jan 6th, 2009, 05:48 PM
It's plausible. This has happened in other sports.

i was just getting ready to type that. :lol:

but yeah i know of a few situations in pro football (as an example)where certain (star) players have been protected. i'm not saying this is the case with hingis though.

irinska
Jan 6th, 2009, 08:02 PM
That's why the best tennis player of all times Roger Federer and people like Navratilova and B.King HAVE DEFENDED Martina Hingis. They know nothng about her, obviously the nuts from the net know more about the personal life of the players, lol!

.

Shvedbarilescu
Jan 6th, 2009, 08:20 PM
It's plausible. This has happened in other sports.

i was just getting ready to type that. :lol:

but yeah i know of a few situations in pro football (as an example)where certain (star) players have been protected. i'm not saying this is the case with hingis though.

People, try to use some common sense. Regular use of cocaine would not only not be performance enhancing, it would be highly demotivating and detrimental to a professional athelete. There is no way Hingis could have gotten to number one using cocaine. Additionally the risks involved in the occasional use of cocaine, i.e. getting caught, would so out outweight any postives that no professional tennis player of Hingis's status would ever consider using it. Why would Hingis risk her career for a bit of cocaine? It doesn't add up. Common sense people. Try it some day.

HRHoliviasmith
Jan 6th, 2009, 08:30 PM
People, try to use some common sense. Regular use of cocaine would not only not be performance enhancing, it would be highly demotivating and detrimental to a professional athelete. There is no way Hingis could have gotten to number one using cocaine. Additionally the risks involved in the occasional use of cocaine, i.e. getting caught, would so out outweight any postives that no professional tennis player of Hingis's status would ever consider using it. Why would Hingis risk her career for a bit of cocaine? It doesn't add up. Common sense people. Try it some day.

and I said I"M NOT SAYING THIS IS THE CASE WITH HINGIS but the protection of athletes is not such a far-fetched idea becasue it happens.

whatever.

spencercarlos
Jan 6th, 2009, 09:31 PM
Easier to assume that Hingis is a COKE addict, and has taken it before even when being number one :lol:, than it is to assume that probably the sample test is not hers and that she was involved in an evil conspiration against her?

^bibi^
Jan 6th, 2009, 09:48 PM
Martina and her bottle story... I think i've heard her tell it 100 times :lol: But She's definitely right, great article btw...

Martina :sad: :hug:

Shvedbarilescu
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:00 PM
Easier to assume that Hingis is a COKE addict, and has taken it before even when being number one :lol:, than it is to assume that probably the sample test is not hers and that she was involved in an evil conspiration against her?

Who said anything about a conspiracy? It would be easy for anyone to plant anything on another player as Martina N. makes plain in the opening post. It doesn't require a group of plotters.

And you would find it easier to believe Martina was a coke addict? If she was a coke addict we would know about it and not from this drug test. If you are a public figure living in 2008/9 you are not going to be able to hide a coke habit from the media. Not in a million years.

spencercarlos
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:37 PM
Who said anything about a conspiracy? It would be easy for anyone to plant anything on another player as Martina N. makes plain in the opening post. It doesn't require a group of plotters.

And you would find it easier to believe Martina was a coke addict? If she was a coke addict we would know about it and not from this drug test. If you are a public figure living in 2008/9 you are not going to be able to hide a coke habit from the media. Not in a million years.
Coke-addict some people here suggest that probably she was doing Coke while being number one :lol: but was protected by the whole WTA :tape:

I support Hingis 100% here. Still im not sure if she could prove that she took it or not, if it was her sample in fact or not, or why she did not made the effort to fight for it. Still watching the Spaniard Pouis Tio case you can find that no matter what you get the two year suspension.. that is stupid especially when we consider neither case Hingis and Tio is an enhancer.

Shvedbarilescu
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:53 PM
Coke-addict some people here suggest that probably she was doing Coke while being number one :lol: but was protected by the whole WTA :tape:

I support Hingis 100% here. Still im not sure if she could prove that she took it or not, if it was her sample in fact or not, or why she did not made the effort to fight for it. Still watching the Spaniard Pouis Tio case you can find that no matter what you get the two year suspension.. that is stupid especially when we consider neither case Hingis and Tio is an enhancer.

Ok. I agree 100% with you here. Absolutely. There needs to be different levels of penalties. Being found to have a trace of pot or coke in your system and being found to have steroids in your body are two very different things and the penalties should reflect that. But yeah, the other sad thing is in a lot of these cases it only ever turns out to be one persons word against a test tube, and neither can be trusted beyond a shadow of a doubt.

fufuqifuqishahah
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:56 PM
if Hingis really wanted to enhance her performance, she probably would have actually tried building more muscle first before doing something like cocaine of all things.

Cakeisgood
Jan 6th, 2009, 10:58 PM
Better Serve > Coke

Fact.

markdelaney
Jan 6th, 2009, 11:00 PM
It is impossible to get a positive test for cocaine from a blood or urine sample of a person that has not ingested cocaine.

DutchieGirl
Jan 6th, 2009, 11:12 PM
It is impossible to get a positive test for cocaine from a blood or urine sample of a person that has not ingested cocaine.
The point was more about whether she knowingly took it or if it was slipped to her by someone.

Miss Atomic Bomb
Jan 6th, 2009, 11:21 PM
Hingis Before and after- you can tell the difference yourself of the changes she has under gone -

Before-

http://i42.tinypic.com/22xqt.jpg

After-
http://i44.tinypic.com/vigz1g.jpg

theDreamer
Jan 7th, 2009, 01:10 AM
Hingis Before and after- you can tell the difference yourself of the changes she has under gone -

Before-

http://i42.tinypic.com/22xqt.jpg

After-
http://i44.tinypic.com/vigz1g.jpg


:lol::lol:
:tape:sorry to say this but the thought that came to my
mind after seeing your post was that your username seems
a very appropriate description of you.:tape:

I imagine you were just joking, though, in which case,
I'm sorry for taking it seriously. (I'm like that:o)