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View Full Version : I don't think Martina Hingis is coming back


Sam L
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:07 AM
I've seen pictures of her following Sergio Garcio around the links but don't see her practising. I don't think her heart is in the sport anymore. I think this "injury" could become a permanent one if you know what I mean, I had my suspicions. These latest withdrawals from the US hardcourt season sort of confirmed my suspicions.

Also it's becoming quite obvious that she can't compete with the top players anymore. The longer she stays away from the sport the harder it will be.

Hingis was never a fighter, I've been watching her since like 96-97, if she's not at the top I don't think she'll stick around for too long. I remember she did an interview in 97 and she said she only intended to play tennis until around the age of 24. Well she's turning 22 soon.

Whatever she decides to do, all the best to her :wavey:

Shania
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:18 AM
yeh i dont think shes coming back either...i thought she'd retired anyway..i heard that a while ago...

Williams Rulez
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:30 AM
I don't think so... Martina will be back, I think she wants to prove that she can stay at the top.

Alley
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:31 AM
I agree. I think Hingis is done, she peaked at a very young age and it has been downhill ever since. Even if she came back I don't think there is any way she could avoid getting destroyed by the williams girls over and over again

Williams Rulez
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:34 AM
But I must add that one of the commentators that commentated during Wimbledon, did mention that news from the locker room is that Martina is retiring. But I don't believe her.

Alan
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:35 AM
just because you can't beat other top ten players that often means you can't beat the hundreds of other players on tour and hingis is certainly capable of that, and doesn't mean that she has lost her form what hasty generalizations!

Dawn Marie
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:36 AM
Well I think she'll be coming back unless her only goal in life is to make babies and be somebody's wife. Personally though with all this time off, I would imho learn some valuable skills in case her career is over. I am not so sure following Sergio around is the answer at the moment, but hey who really knows what she is thinking at the moment. She could be working on herself and maturing into a confident person.

Sam L
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:47 AM
Originally posted by Dawn Marie
Well I think she'll be coming back unless her only goal in life is to make babies and be somebody's wife. Personally though with all this time off, I would imho learn some valuable skills in case her career is over. I am not so sure following Sergio around is the answer at the moment, but hey who really knows what she is thinking at the moment.

LOL Dawn I'm not trying to start a war against the feminists by suggesting THAT! But i'm saying that's what she IS doing right now, following Sergio.

Look I don't know how rich she is but I don't think she needs to work again, but who knows.

Alan I didnt' say she should retire BECAUSE she can't beat top players, I'm saying she won't want to play because of that. I don't know if you saw her in 97-98 but if she still has that personality, trust me she wouldn't want to stick around.

WR, like I said I'm not sure she wants to prove that she can stay at the top. Aside from the fact i don't think she can.

Dawn Marie
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:56 AM
SAM L, Oh I know that sweetie, I am replying from my own personal viewpoint. Though just because one has loads of money doesn't mean a person should stop growing. Personally I think it good to stimulate the mind and continue on a creative path.

I do think her injury is SERIOUS, if you read up on her condition, you know maybe explore futher on the net just excatly what her problem is, then her withdrawal is not suprising at all. In fact imho she is not out of the woods yet when it comes to retirement. Personally I wouldn't be surprised if she stays away until next season.

Experimentee
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:03 AM
I think she might consider retiring if she comes back and isnt able to play at the same level as she's used to. She'd also be worried about injuring her foot further. But really i dont think theres anything wrong with following Sergio around if thats what makes her happy. She cant really practise because shes injured so she can do what she wants with her spare time.

TeeRexx
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:16 AM
Hingis never seemed to strike me as an academian and she has never mentioned the last book that she read or indicated any skills, whatsoever, outside of tennis.

If her relationship develops with Sergio to the point that they get engaged in the next 4-6 months, then you can kiss Marti goodbye from the tour.

I believe that she is eager to have the type of family that she never had herself. She has won slams and other titles along with millions of dollars so I do not believe that it will take a lot of proding to get her out of the rar race of tennis.

smygelfh
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:34 AM
I think Martina showed quite clearly that she could compete with the best when healthy. After all, she was only a mental collapse away from the AO title!

As for interest though, I'm prepared to agree that she might not have what it takes... she's been around for a long time, that will make it less fun... and of course if you've been the best and isn't anymore, it will be less fun... and of course, many millions on the bank and a new love...

Martina also has the heel problems that wouldn't be solved by the surgery, so even if that injury heals, she might never be fully fit again, and that's also a reason to quit.

In conclusion, I don't believe Martina will quit without another attempt to come back, though I wouldn't rule it out. If she comes back, gets injured again, and still has a lover, I wouldn't be surprised at all if she quit.

lrg bllt
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:45 AM
"I want to set myself to no time frameworks for my comeback, thereby pressurize myself", said the US open 1997 champion. "Surely there is the possibility that I will play in New York. Nevertheless I have still over five weeks time for preparation. And up to now the therapy ran well."

this is what Martina had to say in her latest interview with a swiss publication.

among other things it says she's practicing out on the courts 2 times a day and doing other things...
now if she is 'retiring and never coming back' then why is she staying in florida and training instead of following Sergio round at the British Open? and wouldn't she rule out the possiblity of even considering playing at the US Open if she isn't coming back instead of saying there is a possibility..

babsi
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:02 PM
Do you think all of her sponsors would let her retire early? She has signed many contracts for a period of time and she will have to fulfill this obligation.

I think she is taking a extended break from the game, a little like what Venus did in 2000.

lrg bllt
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:12 PM
babsi, I think that if she really wanted to retire her sponsors wouldn't have a very big say in it, they'd have to go with her decision...but I kinda agree with you about her taking an extended break along with recovering from her injury.

babsi
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:14 PM
so_tred, you think if she signed a contract with adidas for 5 years that they would let her retire?

Sponsors have a lot of say, they even determine on who plays doubles match with who (along with management agencies).

lrg bllt
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:19 PM
well they wouldn't want her if she came back but didn't put her all into it and was bringing disgrace to their brand either...i think its ultimately her decision if she retires.

ajayares
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:30 PM
Originally posted by Sam L
I've seen pictures of her following Sergio Garcio around the links but don't see her practising. I don't think her heart is in the sport anymore.

Don't you think there might be a little difference between walking and on the tennis court in full training???

I have no doubt that she will be back, she is just being cautious with her injury, what is the point in rushing back is you are not feeling 100%...

Nimi
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:31 PM
than u are wrong. she signed contracts, she cannot retire without fullifiling her contract. obviously they can let her go if she will be seriously injured & really cant compete, but i think its the same reason Pete Sampras has yet to retire, contracts.

Zamboni
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:41 PM
I don't think Marti will retire without coming back. She will want to come back, get as fit as possible, and then see what she can do, and how her feet react. If the injury keeps bothering her, she will quit I think. Marti loves tennis, but she's not the person to do her body any damage just to play.

First she'll come back, and then we'll see what happens.

conchita
Jul 14th, 2002, 12:52 PM
I agree. I think Hingis is done, she peaked at a very young age and it has been downhill ever since. Even if she came back I don't think there is any way she could avoid getting destroyed by the williams girls over and over again

Hello? She has one a couple of titles already this year, including at least one tier1 event so i don't know what thats about! and she is not constantly getting destoryed by the williams', it was 6-4 in the third in scottsdale and although the nasdaq score was 6-4 6-0, she was starting to get injured there anyway PLUS she had played 3 and a half weeks in a row so she was probably burnt out!

HINGIS WILL DEFINATELY BE BACK-whether you like it or not!

:)

CC
Jul 14th, 2002, 01:23 PM
Remember Agassi, remember Agassi......

It's mainly about rededication. And good health in her case.

DD
Jul 14th, 2002, 01:34 PM
conchita

Dont start making escuses for Hingis. Okey what is your escuse for the us open demolishing. she only took serena coming back from injury to 3 sets

come on

venusfan
Jul 14th, 2002, 02:58 PM
Doesn't she have a long term agreement with Adidas.. They cant just get up and retire like that

TeeRexx
Jul 14th, 2002, 03:12 PM
A player may retire at anytime if they so choose, but their sponsors will not continue payment on their endorsements upon termination of the contract by the athlete.

Hingis may attempt the comeback for 12 or 18 months, but i do not believe that marti will enjoy being a number 15 or 20 player after being the #1 for so long.

Volcana
Jul 14th, 2002, 03:29 PM
Let's make sense. If Martina lost a leg would her sponsors 'refuse' to 'let' her retire?

The older elite players, Lindsay, Jenn, Monica, Mary if you want to be generous, will age out of Martina's. Three years from now, Martina will be ranked ahead of them whether she gets better or not. However there are quite a few good players around Martina's age. (Player in bold beat Martina the last time they played.)

04-13-79 Shaughnessy
07-05-79 Mauresmo
06-17-80 Williams, V
12-15-80 Stevenson
06-07-81 Kournikova
07-08-81 Myskina
09-17-81 Williams, S
10-15-81 Dementieva
01-07-82 Tulyaganova
06-01-82 Henin
09-19-82 Danilidou
03-09-83 Bedanova
04-12-83 Dokic
04-23-83 Hantuchova
06-08-83 Clijsters

That group of players will be around the rest of Martina's career. To be successful, she'll have to beat them. They won't go away.

Kart
Jul 14th, 2002, 03:45 PM
Well I don't know if she is coming back or not, but I still think it is far too early to tell.

I don't know why she didn't withdraw from those tournaments earlier - from what I understand she had a pretty serious injury, remember these problems are not just in her foot but her knee and hip as well. Realistically for her to return to top level tennis in just four months was optimistic to say the least.

The road to recovery will be a lot longer than I think a lot of people have imagined.

The most important thing if she does come back is to come back fit and healthy and not too soon to avoid risking further injury. She may well be completely lacking in motivation or not planning to return at all but at the moment I still think it is far too early to tell ...

TS
Jul 14th, 2002, 04:00 PM
Martina isnt going anywhere. She was born for this sport. She'll be back!

disposablehero
Jul 14th, 2002, 04:22 PM
What a thoroughly ugly, if not entirely surprising thread.

carot
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:18 PM
Also heartwarming to see all those non-hingis fans worry about her carreer hehe *cough*

RockSteady
Jul 14th, 2002, 07:43 PM
VOLCANA, Martina beat Hantuchova the last time they met (it was 7-5 6-4, on clay, before Hingis lost to Venus).

Anyone who think Martina is retiring is clearly hoping she won't come back healthy and strong, like she showed at the beginning of this year.

Considering that Martina was the #1 player in the world before injury, I can see why many of you don't want her back.

She's young, she's talented, and she enjoys tennis. She has never been a fighter, but that is not to say she doesn't love the sport she played. And Dawn, I take offense to what you said about Martina not being smart, she is very intelligent and can speak four different languages. That's more than you could say for...oh, forget it.

Cybelle Darkholme
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:07 PM
Why is it that whenever someone questions Martina's intelligence they bring up "she can speak four languages..". Okay I respect that and think its fantastic that she can speak four languages. Does that automatically mean she will score of the chart on an IQ test?

I mean really, did she even complete secondary school or undergrad or grand or doctoral work? I think I am solid in saying that Laura Granville a stanford student is more intelligent than martina hingis despite not speaking four languages.

iluvtennis
Jul 14th, 2002, 08:54 PM
So now you measure the degree of intelligence with the number of diplomas someone has!!:confused: Well let me tell you something...go out a little and meet peolple!! You'll see that this is not necessarily true!:rolleyes:

RockSteady
Jul 14th, 2002, 09:28 PM
That's the American way of thinking, as far as diploma's go. But there are also 200 or so other countries that exist, and don't measure success or intelligence the same way. If someone has the capacity to speak four different languages, they must be somewhat intelligent (even if they aren't a rocket science). Ironic that a fan of "what's a dictionary" Serena Williams would be the one to bash Hingis' intelligence.

treufreund
Jul 14th, 2002, 09:36 PM
cybelle, Martina at 17 or 18 sometimes stumbled with English which was understandable but if you think she is not highly intelligent then she was really has you fooled. The girl might be as KNOWLEDGEABLE as someone who has experienced more in life but Hingis is very, very smart. Martina picked up one of those brainteaser games at Cracker Barrel when she first became number one in the world. Within ten minutes she had solved it. most people NEVER solve it.

disposablehero
Jul 14th, 2002, 09:48 PM
Originally posted by cybelledarkholmexx
I think I am solid in saying that Laura Granville a stanford student is more intelligent than martina hingis despite not speaking four languages.

Perhaps you need to study up on the difference between "intelligent" and "educated". No question that Laura is more educated than Martina. I doubt you have any concrete knowledge about the actual intelligence of either.

Fingon
Jul 14th, 2002, 10:10 PM
Originally posted by cybelledarkholmexx
Why is it that whenever someone questions Martina's intelligence they bring up "she can speak four languages..". Okay I respect that and think its fantastic that she can speak four languages. Does that automatically mean she will score of the chart on an IQ test?

I mean really, did she even complete secondary school or undergrad or grand or doctoral work? I think I am solid in saying that Laura Granville a stanford student is more intelligent than martina hingis despite not speaking four languages.

Cybelle, I really think you have no clue what you are talking about :p

First, the ability to learn or speak several languages is one of the way to measure intelligence, not the only way, there are several type of intelligence, you can be more creative, more rational, etc. Musical talent is considered a part of intelligence.

Educational levels are not related to intelligence, even if you say that normally someone with a degree is intelligent that's not always the case, some times it's only a matter of hardwork and persistence.

Did you know that Albert Einstein was a pretty bad studend?

RockSteady
Jul 14th, 2002, 11:12 PM
For what it's werth, Werthless put Hingis in his top 5 list for known WTA 'smart' players (making a comment that the top tennis players are smarter than the top players of other sports). But then again, this IS Werthless we're talking about...

"Fererro will end the year #1 on the men's side"
"Venus Williams to win the 2001 French Open"
"Hingis should retire and become a doubles specialist"
"Seles beating Venus at the AO? Glitter has a better chance of winning an Oscar"

Lisbeth
Jul 14th, 2002, 11:36 PM
I think she'll come back. I hope so too.

It's true she didn't finish high school (which may be a pity, although many sports people do go back later) but I'm sure I have heard her talking about reading to pass time at tournaments. Maybe she doesn't mention her latest book because she doesn't think the English speaking journos are up on the latest European literature ;)

Toineefa
Jul 14th, 2002, 11:39 PM
Pffft :rolleyes:

BrianII
Jul 15th, 2002, 02:58 AM
Speaking 4 languages is not a measure of intelligence ..that is ridiculous ...put any child in any environment and they will pick up the language of the enviornment............. your dealing with a player who moves fron czech republic after the speaking age, to switzerland where at least three languages are spoken and onto the professional tour where english is the predominant language (3 of 4 slams). A lot of europeans speak a few languages....... in my university days in england two of my housemates were danish girls they spoke german, dutch, danish and english ..its very common lots of african speaks many languages as well doesn't make either europeans or africans more or less inteligent compared to a japanesse person or russian who speaks only that language.

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 03:32 AM
DD-

i am sorry but that was a reasonable excuse-hingis playing 3 weeks straight opposed to williams 1 and half including the tournament itself says it all! And when they stated "when we are not entertaining the crowd nemore, we don't play", then you shouldn't be playing tennis period!

secondly, hingis probably gets distracted from those AWFUL grunting noises that serena makes-it is easy not to do it Serena but you choose to in order to emphasise hom much you want the match. hingis, on the other side, just smiles and hits it back with skill and brilliance, something that Serena will never learn!

And i am not even going to respond to the US OPEN match coz if you look at the lead up tournaments, you will understand why Serena won!

:)

Dawn Marie
Jul 15th, 2002, 03:44 AM
Rocksteady where did I say Hingis was not intelligent? Not that I think she is a smart cookie, but I didn't say she was NOT intelligent. So if you are taking offense then sorry about your luck.


Although if she is so smart then why hasn't she won any slams or changed her game?

selesfan
Jul 15th, 2002, 03:51 AM
No excuses Conchita, Martina lost because Serena is a better player.

RockSteady
Jul 15th, 2002, 03:52 AM
Her brains won't make her legs longer.

And about that match against Serena, Martina's comment was basically she should have won the first set, she was winning all the points Serena didn't win on the first serve or return, but played a bad last game. In the second set she just gave up. I don't think the grunting bothered her, although it would bother me.

harloo
Jul 15th, 2002, 03:59 AM
I think Martina is a pretty smart tennis player. That's about it. Her level of intellegience came into question when she said,"the reason Venus and Serena gets endorsements is because they are black". I'm sorry, but when that came out of her mouth I summed her up as not being too bright.

I would hope she returns to the tour soon. However, if she retires it's her choice. You never know, because if she can get to the level she was at U.S Open 2000, she may have a chance. At this point, I don't see her staying in the game for more 2 years if she returns.

selesfan
Jul 15th, 2002, 04:07 AM
Her brains won't make her legs longer.

Justine Henin is shorter than Martina and she doesn't seem to have a problem with the power players. Martina just needs to spruce up her 2nd serve.

Couver
Jul 15th, 2002, 04:26 AM
Well to answer the original question. I think she will come back, I don't see that she has lost her love for the sport. She's injured right now so she's resting. Didn't she have surgery like 3-4 weeks ago? I don't think you can get back on court so soon. I hope she comes back, Martina is a great foil for several of the girls on the WTA.

LOL Conchita are you serious? When a player looses a match, they lost end of story. Hingis didn't make up any excuses for her looses why are you?

Give me a second I'm thinking up all the excuses I can make for Serena's looses to Martina (sarcasm). Hey after all if we want, none of the players we like will actually loose a match. We'll just make up excuses for them LMAO!

Buitenzorg
Jul 15th, 2002, 05:48 AM
I hope this isn't true, But I agree, maybe very hard for her to compete and stay on the Top (as you all know, many a talented players is coming up)...Best Good Luck for her!

I :hearts: Martina HINGIS

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:00 AM
why did this discussion turn into how intelligent she is from the topic of is she returning or not? :rolleyes:

disposablehero
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:43 AM
Originally posted by so_tred
why did this discussion turn into how intelligent she is from the topic of is she returning or not? :rolleyes:

Because when the first thinly veiled attack on an injured player ran its course, a different one was tried.

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:52 AM
lol..so the first one wasn't sticking so they try another form...

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 07:05 AM
in your dreams Selesfan! :)

Raisin
Jul 15th, 2002, 07:42 AM
Originally posted by selesfan
Her brains won't make her legs longer.

Justine Henin is shorter than Martina and she doesn't seem to have a problem with the power players. Martina just needs to spruce up her 2nd serve.

LMAO, so true Selesfan:wavey:

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by selesfan
Her brains won't make her legs longer.

Justine Henin is shorter than Martina and she doesn't seem to have a problem with the power players. Martina just needs to spruce up her 2nd serve.

oh please...:rolleyes: Justine isn't having a good time with the power players either..

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 07:54 AM
and also Selesfan-even Hingis wouldn't be stretched by a 31 year old qualifier 7-6 7-6 (EG. Els Callens)-no offence though coz i really like Els now that she nearly did beat Serena

:)

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 07:57 AM
lol

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:13 AM
hey so_tred- r u @ uni or school?

:)

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:19 AM
hi conchita :wavey: I'm at high school, you?

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:21 AM
yeh me too-what year?

I need to change my name though coz i think her style of play is heaps funny but ppl keep on thinking im a girl coz of the name so.......lol

:)

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:28 AM
lol :) im in yr 10, you?

conchita
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:30 AM
the dreaded yr 12 :(

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 08:31 AM
oh..that sucks, hehe..lucky im yr 10 :p :angel:

Miranda
Jul 15th, 2002, 10:22 AM
OMG, she is just 21, how could she not been able to come back, Jennifer won her first slam at alost 25!

lrg bllt
Jul 15th, 2002, 10:27 AM
Miranda, that is such a good point!! :D

smygelfh
Jul 15th, 2002, 10:44 AM
I think Martina is a pretty smart tennis player. That's about it. Her level of intellegience came into question when she said,"the reason Venus and Serena gets endorsements is because they are black". I'm sorry, but when that came out of her mouth I summed her up as not being too bright.

This shows how unintelligent and hateful you are Harloo, since you try to cause trouble with incorrect quotes.

What she said was that being black HELPED them get endorsement, not that it was THE REASON.

And, you're fooling yourself denying that it's true. Would two white sisters without their background get as much attention and money? Hardly. And, it's not like Richard and the media was afraid to talk about the 'black sisters' rather than the 'tennis sisters' either, alltough it has been better the last year. That wouldn't have happened if they were white.

The only unintelligent thing about that 'quote' from Martina was not realising how many children there are out there who's looking for excuses to make the world a worse place, with more hatred.

smygelfh
Jul 15th, 2002, 10:46 AM
Oh, and this thread should be locked. It started degenerating rather quickly, and I sure didn't help it there ;)

Sam L
Jul 15th, 2002, 12:59 PM
I was just stating my opinion about how I DON'T think she will come back. This isn't from generalisations or whatever, just from years of watching her in her matches. I was also saying that there may be more to her injuries now then just "injuries".

All this stuff about intelligence and endorsements, I have no idea how they got started but I'm not interested and they certainly do not belong in this thread.

Anyway no one's even mentioned anything about what Martina said about how she planned to retire around 24, I don't know if she's changed her mind, but she definitely said that before.

Somebody mentioned Andre Agassi, very different situations. Andre underachieved when he was young, he played little tennis. Martina overachieved and she's played A LOT of tennis. It was anticipated that Andre will dedicate more to the game and fulfil his expectations, I'm not sure about Martina.

Volcana
Jul 15th, 2002, 01:28 PM
There are scenarios in which she'd retire, but they don't seem likely.

Re-injurying the ankle training.

The ankle never really recovers, and she can't run without pain.

Everything's fine on the surface, but players outside the top 30 are beating her.

None of those things seem likely based on current info.

There's also ego, of course. Will Martine retire if she beleives she'll never be #1 again?

selesfan
Jul 15th, 2002, 02:40 PM
oh please... Justine isn't having a good time with the power players either

Hmm! I seem to recall Justine beating Serena in Berlin, or was I just dreaming of that.;)

harloo
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:20 PM
Originally posted by smygelfh


This shows how unintelligent and hateful you are Harloo, since you try to cause trouble with incorrect quotes.

What she said was that being black HELPED them get endorsement, not that it was THE REASON.

And, you're fooling yourself denying that it's true. Would two white sisters without their background get as much attention and money? Hardly. And, it's not like Richard and the media was afraid to talk about the 'black sisters' rather than the 'tennis sisters' either, alltough it has been better the last year. That wouldn't have happened if they were white.

The only unintelligent thing about that 'quote' from Martina was not realising how many children there are out there who's looking for excuses to make the world a worse place, with more hatred.


Please smygelfh, you can flip it up, try to make it sound like she wasn't ignorant for making that statement but either way it you look at it, she sounds foolish.

Anyone knows that winning is what get's endorsements, while marketablity is secondary. Apparently Martina wasn't intellegent enough to realize this when she made that statement.

Smygelfh, what country are you from? The reality of things is if two "white sisters" were two top players and winning almost everything here in America they would out earn and be more popular than the Williams. If you are not wise enough to realize this, then maybe you are naive.

smygelfh
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:24 PM
Anyone knows that winning is what get's endorsements, while marketablity is secondary. Apparently Martina wasn't intellegent enough to realize this when she made that statement.

Good point, Anna.

treufreund
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:29 PM
Harloo,

The sisters were being HYPED like crazy like Andy roddick is. WELL before they ever played well. LONG LONG BEFORE they were dominating. RACE DID PLAY A ROLE IN THEIR BEING HYPED. Martina later clarified herself and we all know what she meant and that was SPOT ON!!!!!

Daniel
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:32 PM
pffffff @ this thread


:fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery:


Go Martina!!!!!!!

:) :) :) :) :)

treufreund
Jul 15th, 2002, 06:40 PM
This thread was started in a very ugly spirit but what I am saying about RACE and the advantages it brings in marketability and early hyping and recognition is a valid point. That does not mean that talent and winning don't count or that race is the only factor by any means. Obviously beauty like Kournikova or talent and personality like Roddick or Kuerten play a role. Also it must be added that RACE can also bring disadvantages and discrimination.

lrg bllt
Jul 16th, 2002, 07:18 AM
Originally posted by selesfan
oh please... Justine isn't having a good time with the power players either

Hmm! I seem to recall Justine beating Serena in Berlin, or was I just dreaming of that.;)

do I also recall her getting slammed by venus at wimbeldon...

heidi2
Jul 17th, 2002, 02:14 AM
@ Daniel I agree with you mate all the way!

:fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery: :fiery:

MARTI RULES THE WAY !