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View Full Version : Hingis will be overpowered in madrid by the other 7


radwanska
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:44 AM
The others are all huge hitters.I know that she will possibley beat elena,kuznetsova,nadia,amelie.But is just maria,kim and justine[providing she plays]who i cant see her beating........

Lindsay Martina
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:49 AM
The others are all huge hitters

This explains why she has beaten Kuznetsova and Sharapova, both in straight sets this year. She can beat those two, Mauresmo, Dementieva and Petrova. I'm not sure about the belgians, but I think she can beat Justine. It's Kim IMO who she'll have the most trouble against.

new-york
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:51 AM
Hingis is always censed to be overpowered.

Martian Jeza
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:56 AM
Thx for this very informative topic :yeah:

lynch79
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:03 AM
I don't think so. I think Martina is prepared for the YEC. I really hope she'll go for the serve and volley route. Does anyone else remember Filderstadt 2000? She played and won her 4 matches (63 30 ret vs Henin, 62 61 to Van Roost, 61 60 vs Sanchez-Vicario, 60 63 vs Clijsters) with an AMAZING net play. She served and volleyed all the time, even on second serve. Ok, this was a different Martina, and Henin and Clijsters are different players now, they're champions, BUT do you think she could produce once again a perfomance like that? Is it wishful thinking from me?

Dawn Marie
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:11 AM
If the Hingis who played thei first half of the year comes out and plays she has a shot at winning the entire tourney. If the second half plays she will win some rounds and lose some rounds. I think Justine and Momo will give her the most trouble.

Derek.
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:17 AM
She can do well, but I doubt she'll win the whole tournament.

She will get overpowered by Sharapova, Henin-Hardenne, etc.

Mase
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:27 AM
WHo cares if she does anyway. Kudos to her for getting back there her FIRST year back!

Impressive Martina!! ;)

Buitenzorg
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:27 AM
They've got the POWER!

HINGIS has got the BRAIN, and GAME CRAFT!

You can always speculate, but the truth is still to be released!

Veritas
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:28 AM
Hingis not playing like she did earlier this year is only part of the problem :( The others either suit up well against her game, or they've managed to figure her game out (e.g. Sharapova).

It's too much to expect Martina to play like she did before the semi-retirement so the best I'm hoping for is a good performance and some wins. It'll give her confidence a bit of a boost going into the Aussie Open :)

Buitenzorg
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:29 AM
WHo cares if she does anyway. Kudos to her for getting back there her FIRST year back!

Impressive Martina!! ;)

Yup, good onya Martina :hearts: :kiss:

Tennis is not all about power! :lol:

plantman
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:30 AM
They've got the POWER!

HINGIS has got the BRAIN, and GAME CRAFT!

You can always speculate, but the truth is still to be released!

Nicely said........:D

Veritas
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:36 AM
They've got the POWER!

HINGIS has got the BRAIN, and GAME CRAFT!

You can always speculate, but the truth is still to be released!

The others have "game craft". The only difference between Martina and them is that she's a defensive player and has to rely on it. The others are all aggressive baseliners and because of the power they don't need to do more to construct a point.

Chewie
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:38 AM
I don't think so. I think Martina is prepared for the YEC. I really hope she'll go for the serve and volley route. Does anyone else remember Filderstadt 2000? She played and won her 4 matches (63 30 ret vs Henin, 62 61 to Van Roost, 61 60 vs Sanchez-Vicario, 60 63 vs Clijsters) with an AMAZING net play. She served and volleyed all the time, even on second serve. Ok, this was a different Martina, and Henin and Clijsters are different players now, they're champions, BUT do you think she could produce once again a perfomance like that? Is it wishful thinking from me?

Exactly. She's the best volleyer in the game. And her serve is now better than then, She definitely will kick some if she SV's.
Unfortunately she hasn't done that often enough nowadays.

morningglory
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:40 AM
Exactly. She's the best volleyer in the game. And her serve is now better than then, She definitely will kick some if she SV's.
Unfortunately she hasn't done that often enough nowadays.

Even if ur the best volleyer in the game... it wouldn't matter if you get overpowered and never get to go up to the net... :o

Chewie
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:42 AM
Hingis not playing like she did earlier this year is only part of the problem :( The others either suit up well against her game, or they've managed to figure her game out (e.g. Sharapova).

Sharapova has figured out nothing, she plays the same game every and each time.
Most of the players are power players nowadays, so nothing new here. If she plays aggressive and accurate she will succeed. Now come on and serve+volley Martina! ...That's how Mauresmo won her Wimbledon title.

Steffica Greles
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:45 AM
I do get tired of hearing "Hingis may not hit with power, but she has all the brains she needs".

If Hingis really had brains, would she not recognise that she needs to take more risks, looser swings, and leather a few balls?

And before people say that Hingis is not built for power tennis, I can think of dozens of players of her size who hit with far great aggression.

True, such tactics would lose her more matches - but she'd still be in with a greater chance of winning majors.

Tenis Srbija
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:45 AM
I think that Martina could defeat Dementieva and Kuznetsova.

Petrova, Henin, Sharapova adn Clijsters - NO WAY!

Veritas
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:52 AM
Sharapova has figured out nothing, she plays the same game every and each time.

"Figuring" something out doesn't mean Sharapova has to change her entire game. She just had to make sure she was more careful with her errors.

Did you watch the Pan Pacific SF? Sharapova looked lost and didn't know what to do when Hingis - out of nowhere - hit those very aggressive top spins. Sharapova before could handle aggressive flat shots, but not top spins that go fast and skid towards the baseline. She basically had to try and hit all her shots out of her comfort zone (below the knees or near the shoulders). A lot of the points Martina won were because Maria was hitting tons of errors. Sharapova managed to beat Martina at Dubai and Indian Wells because she learnt from that match at Tokyo and didn't make the same mistakes.

RenaSlam.
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:53 AM
No shit :lol:

lynch79
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:56 AM
"Figuring" something out doesn't mean Sharapova has to change her entire game. She just had to make sure she was more careful with her errors.

Did you watch the Pan Pacific SF? Sharapova looked lost and didn't know what to do when Hingis - out of nowhere - hit those very aggressive top spins. Sharapova before could handle aggressive flat shots, but not top spins that go fast and skid towards the baseline. She basically had to try and hit all her shots out of her comfort zone (below the knees or near the shoulders). A lot of the points Martina won were because Maria was hitting tons of errors. Sharapova managed to beat Martina at Dubai and Indian Wells because she learnt from that match at Tokyo and didn't make the same mistakes.

That's true. Maria made less errors. But Martina also didn't play that well in those two matches. Her serve was weak, especially.

lynch79
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:57 AM
I do get tired of hearing "Hingis may not hit with power, but she has all the brains she needs".

If Hingis really had brains, would she not recognise that she needs to take more risks, looser swings, and leather a few balls?

And before people say that Hingis is not built for power tennis, I can think of dozens of players of her size who hit with far great aggression.

True, such tactics would lose her more matches - but she'd still be in with a greater chance of winning majors.

So, what are you trying to say? That Martina Hingis is stupid? Or just stubborn?

Steffica Greles
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:03 AM
So, what are you trying to say? That Martina Hingis is stupid? Or just stubborn?

"Stupid" would be going a bit far. But I think her intelligence is overrated.

She is intelligent within her comfort zone, yet has failed to recognise in countless matches lost that her comfort zone was actually quite comfortable for her opponents.

lynch79
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:11 AM
"Stupid" would be going a bit far. But I think her intelligence is overrated.

She is intelligent within her comfort zone, yet has failed to recognise in countless matches lost that her comfort zone was actually quite comfortable for her opponents.

But if this was true, Martina should have lost those countless matches..I don't know...16 26, or 26 26, etc...She has lost a lot of matches against power hitters (intelligent or not), but most of the time she lost in 3 tight sets. So, why? If she's not so smart, nor powerful, how did she manage to push those matches to a third set? Luck? I mean, if those players were comfortable with her play, why did they let her go to a third set? For fun?

Hingie
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:14 AM
"Figuring" something out doesn't mean Sharapova has to change her entire game. She just had to make sure she was more careful with her errors.

Did you watch the Pan Pacific SF? Sharapova looked lost and didn't know what to do when Hingis - out of nowhere - hit those very aggressive top spins. Sharapova before could handle aggressive flat shots, but not top spins that go fast and skid towards the baseline. She basically had to try and hit all her shots out of her comfort zone (below the knees or near the shoulders). A lot of the points Martina won were because Maria was hitting tons of errors. Sharapova managed to beat Martina at Dubai and Indian Wells because she learnt from that match at Tokyo and didn't make the same mistakes.

Wow - did you even see that match - Marti was playing very aggressive and forcing many errors - she certainly didn't play like that in Doha and Indian Wells!

I'm sick of all the idiots on this board that make out like Marti can do nothing to influence the outcome of a match - that she is just a bystander who has to rely on the errors of others. She can force the play - she just doesn't do it as often as she should.

And what a surprise to see Steffica Greles in a thread about Marti. :tape:

Sally Struthers
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:15 AM
yawn... she has been "overpowered" since 1998 and still has had a hall of fame career. She might not be as powerful as some of these girls but she has a knack of finding ways to win.

crazyroberto6767
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:22 AM
I do get tired of hearing "Hingis may not hit with power, but she has all the brains she needs".

If Hingis really had brains, would she not recognise that she needs to take more risks, looser swings, and leather a few balls?

And before people say that Hingis is not built for power tennis, I can think of dozens of players of her size who hit with far great aggression.

True, such tactics would lose her more matches - but she'd still be in with a greater chance of winning majors.
No, because a Hingis trying to muscle the ball/compete with big hitters from the baseline, is a Hingis that loses on a much more consistent basis. This is what happened in parts of 2001 and pretty much all of 2002. Granted she's not always going to have the time to mix it up, but she shouldn't try to outhit power players either. When Hingis is in free-flow, she's dictating by taking the ball early (within reason), and with angles/different paced balls, not power. She's moving the bigger hitters around and anticipating where they're going to go. The Hingis that has been losing this year (especially in the 2nd part of the season) has been horribly impatient. That's never going to work. But like I said, she can't always do that because she's basically a lesser version of herself lately & when power players are on they have a good chance of blowing her off the court. But I think most Martina fans have come to grips with that.

The one thing that has been Martina's biggest problem in (close) matches this year is her mental side. She tenses up @ big moments (or sometimes, just in general) especially when someone is getting all her shots back. This is when she turns into 100% defensive Martina, which is no good either. Once (probably, if) she develops more confidence in her game like she had once before, she'll be able to at least play her game at all moments- not purely offense, or purely defense, but a perfect blend. This doesn't guarantee a win, but it's better than now.

lynch79
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:36 AM
The one thing that has been Martina's biggest problem in (close) matches this year is her mental side. She tenses up @ big moments (or sometimes, just in general) especially when someone is getting all her shots back.

So true. I noticed that, especially against Mauresmo and Clijsters this year. I think and (as a Hingis fan) hope that she'll handle them better next year (and hopefully at the YEC next week).

vogus
Oct 29th, 2006, 02:53 AM
Hingis has not been anywhere close to a Top 10 player in the 2nd half of the season. The only decent win she's had since the FO was beating Danni in Montreal, and even that is nothing to boast about.

Mark for Martina
Oct 29th, 2006, 03:18 AM
Being in the top 8 says a lot about Martina.

Someone tell me how Martina got there without the ability of "overpowering" her opponents? I sense a bit of intelligence there.

Williams Rulez
Oct 29th, 2006, 03:22 AM
well, martina has never had the power to match the others, even before she had her semi retirement.. so i dun really see what's the big deal abt it.. she knows what she has to do.

thomas.chung
Oct 29th, 2006, 03:23 AM
Granted a well prepared and motivated Hingis, this girl can muscle the ball just as well with the other top players as their top 10 counterparts. Like she said, there was nothing she didn't see from playing Serena and Venus. In fact, she can absorb the power very well. But she must be very quick and remember to stay closer to the baseline, because most of the time she looses to a power player, she was pinned to like 5 ft behind the baseline. I think she's got to stay aggressive in the rally and sneak in to close out the point when possible. Yes, she will get passed a few times, but each time she gain success at the net, she gain more confidence.

mboyle
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:09 AM
Indoors, Martina has a shot against most people--even Sharapova.

barmaid
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:18 AM
One of the most impressive matches she lost this year was to Venus at the BP tournament..Hingis won the 1st set and then the next 2 were very close with Venus making a fantastic shot at the end after Martina led the 3rd set 3-0..I watched the video and it was fantastic shot-making by both gals..Martina turned the tables on Venus in Rome where she won her title but didn't see a video clip of that match...but their:worship: first encounter was a doozy!:bounce:

barmaid:bounce:

spencercarlos
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:29 AM
Hingis has not been anywhere close to a Top 10 player in the 2nd half of the season. The only decent win she's had since the FO was beating Danni in Montreal, and even that is nothing to boast about.
You have nothing that support this, in the second half of the season Hingis has:
1 Tier I Final
2 Tier I QF
1 Tier III title

Name 10 players with better results for the second half of the season.

hingisGOAT
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:36 AM
One of the most impressive matches she lost this year was to Venus at the BP tournament..Hingis won the 1st set and then the next 2 were very close with Venus making a fantastic shot at the end after Martina led the 3rd set 3-0..I watched the video and it was fantastic shot-making by both gals..Martina turned the tables on Venus in Rome where she won her title but didn't see a video clip of that match...but their:worship: first encounter was a doozy!:bounce:

barmaid:bounce:

well you would just love the rome match, much higher standard of play, longer rallies, more winners, less errors

Nicolás89
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:40 AM
i think martina will be in the semifinal of the yec im sure of that just if she plays a litle bit like in AO and pan pacific:tape: :) and rome

hwanmig
Oct 29th, 2006, 06:16 AM
People who think Hingis can't hit hard should watch the Tokyo SF. Hingis was hitting the ball just as hard as Sharapoa

azmad_88
Oct 29th, 2006, 06:48 AM
Hingis has not been anywhere close to a Top 10 player in the 2nd half of the season. The only decent win she's had since the FO was beating Danni in Montreal, and even that is nothing to boast about.

She also defeated Kuznetsova at Montreal...Kuznetsova is a top 10 player

LUIS9
Oct 29th, 2006, 07:00 AM
People who think Hingis can't hit hard should watch the Tokyo SF. Hingis was hitting the ball just as hard as Sharapoa

This is quite unlikely, it seemed like Hingis was hitting the ball just as hard as Maria but in fact she was just redirecting Sharpie's power with her early returns and taking the ball well in the rise. Yes Hingis can pepper it up sometimes when she's confident and knows she has to but thats not the norm especially during the latter part of this 2006 season.

pooh14
Oct 29th, 2006, 07:18 AM
oh gosh, another thread again on hingis getting overpowered. isn't there any other new statements to make on her?

i do not know how many of you'll read kuzzie's statement before playing hingis in zurich. she said she must be careful not to overpower hingis cause hingis uses well against her.
you cannot beat hingis by overpowering her. you need to play more then that.
yes, i agree hingis 2nd half of season wasnt great, but come on, give this girl a break. she still had a creditable second half, and her performance in zurich was good. the match against kuzzie was pretty close, if not for one mistake in her service game she might have won.

the sad thing when hingis made statment on comeback, most of you'll barely gave her chance to even finish the season, then top50 mediocore player, then top 30, then top20, when she broke into top10, it is still not enough.

how many players had a better comeback then her. when i mean comeback, i do not mean comeback after half a year or one year...i mean a long comeback.

Ben.
Oct 29th, 2006, 07:27 AM
i mean sure martina has struggled against some of the power hitters of today's game but she's had her moments. i mean she's won over maria, elena, lindsay, venus & sveta twice which isn't completely shit.

but the one's she seems 2 have the trouble most r kim & justine, if she wins against them then maybe we can stop talking bout her issues with big hitters. i think it's more the mental aspect that is playin a part of losses 2 power hitters than the physical & technical aspect i must say.

look she's in the Top 10 for god sake & did she get there by fluke. no, she did not, she had 2 work hard & by doing that she had 2 beat some of the power hitters. she has the brains & the anticipation 2 beat several top players & i mean she can take inspiration from amelie, as amelie isn't a power hitter herself & can win alot of matches of power hitters.

so there's a few people in here that r underestimating martina.

fufuqifuqishahah
Oct 29th, 2006, 07:55 AM
ok.... this is interesting cuz these girls dont hit ALL that hard, except a few

Hardest Hitters: Sharapova
Consistent Power but not super powerful: Clijsters, Dementieva
Not always so powerful, but can hit it hard: Henin, Petrova
Not always so powerful, but can kind of hit it hard: Martina, Amelie
Just plain ass wild: Kuznetsova

So.... I think Martina is fine because she is in a category with Amelie who is still #1. She'll get abused by Sharapova... and she may get abused by the rest of them as well. lol. BUT.. we know she can always work her way, strategize, and use more intelligence like Amelie, Henin do. Unfortunately, Martina hasn't shown the fight and spin prowess like Amelie and Henin have this year, so thats what I think it all depends on...

Lunatiq
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:00 AM
I think she has her chances...But we will see how she is going to play;)

Ben.
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:00 AM
as i said this b4, martina is most likely 2 struggle more against either kim or justine. the others i reckon she can handle.

Lindsay Martina
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:45 AM
Actually if you think about it, 4 are powrful, aggresive baseliners. All the Russians are, but I would never think of Mauresmo, Clijsters and Henin as aggressive baseliners. Mauresmo is a point constructer, who likes going to net a lot, Clijsters likes to set points up with well placed and depp shot, whilst not being totally powerful, and Henin likes to mix offense with defense.

fufuqifuqishahah
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:56 AM
Well.. i thought I should do this cuz it'd be useful.

Here are her H2H against the top 10 players (all YEC players) for the year 2006.

Hingis' ranking/seeding is first and opponent's ranking is on the other end.
Red is the worst
Orange is bad but showed a substantial amount of fight
Olive is good but 'twas close
Green good all the way

Mauresmo leads 2-0
44 / -- Doha Carpet (O) S A. MAURESMO 6-2 6-2 2 / 1
23 / -- Berlin Open Clay (O) Q A. MAURESMO 4-6 6-4 6-4 1 / 1
Overall YEC analysis: Red with a tinge of Orange

Henin-Hardenne leads 1-0
-- / -- Sydney Hard (O) R32 J. HENIN-HARDENNE 6-3 6-3 8 / 5
Overall YEC analysis: Red

Sharapova leads 2-1
117 / -- Tokyo Carpet (I) S M. HINGIS 6-3 6-1 4 / 1
50 / -- Dubai Carpet (O) Q M. SHARAPOVA 6-3 6-4 4 / 3
32 / 19 Indian Wells Hard (O) S M. SHARAPOVA 6-3 6-3 5 / 3
Overall YEC Analysis: Orange with some red

Kuznetsova ties Hingis 2-2
44 / -- Doha Carpet (O) Q M. HINGIS 7-6(7) 6-2 14 / 6
26 / 24 MIAMI Hard (O) R32 S. KUZNETSOVA 3-6 6-1 7-6(9) 14 / 12
12 / 7 Montreal Hard (O) Q M. HINGIS 7-6(4) 6-3 7 / 4
9 / 5 Zurich Hard (I) Q S. KUZNETSOVA 6-1 1-6 6-3 4 / 3
Overall YEC Analysis: Orange & Olive mixture leaning towards Orange

Petrova ties Hingis 0-0
Overall Analysis: Nobody knows... dun dun DUN

Dementieva ties Hingis 1-1
117 / -- Tokyo Carpet (I) F E. DEMENTIEVA 6-2 6-0 9 / 2
23 / -- Berlin Open Clay (O) R16 M. HINGIS 6-3 6-2 8 / 5
Overall YEC Analysis: Hard to tell...

Clijsters leads Hingis 3-0
349 / -- AUSTRALIAN OPEN HARD (O) Q K. CLIJSTERS 6-3 2-6 6-4 2 / 2
15 / 12 FRENCH OPEN Clay (O) Q K. CLIJSTERS 7-6(5) 6-1 2 / 2
13 / 8 San Diego Hard (O) Q K. CLIJSTERS 7-5 6-2 2 / 1
Overall YEC Analysis: Mostly red, but a sizeable amount of orange thrown in

And just in case...
Schnyder ties Hingis 0-0

Safina trails Hingis 0-2
32 / 19 Indian Wells Hard (O) Q M. HINGIS 6-3 6-4 21 / 10
21 / -- Rome Clay (O) F M. HINGIS 6-2 7-5 19 / 16


Interesting Stats
---
Three-set Record against above players: 0-4
Tiebreak Record: 2-2
Against Former #1s: 1-8
On Carpet: 2-3
On Hard (excluding Safina): 1-6
====

My Overall Analysis:
Round Robin Analysis
Hingis should be happy she will most likely not have to play Clijsters in the Round Robin. She will most likely lose against either Mauresmo/Henin/Sharapova.If she gets two of Mauresmo/Henin/Sharapova in her group she is in big trouble, and there is a 50/50 chance of this occuring (at the moment). If she doesn't have two of those three, then she'll have Kuznetsova in place, whom she has had close encounters with, though she lost their previous meeting.She could potentially win against either Dementieva or Petrova. So if she gets Kuznetsova in her grouping, and if she plays very well, she'll most likely have a 2-1 record (beating Kuzentsova & Dementieva/Petrova, but losing to Mauresmo/Henin/Sharapova). A 2-1 record is good enough to make the Semis, assuming there aren't 3 individuals in the group with 2-1 records (which has happened in the past i think)

Semifinal/Final Analysis
So if she makes it to the Semis, she'll probably be the lower ranked individual, and will thus have to play Mauresmo/Henin/Sharapova.  She'll have to play really really really really well if she wants to get into the Final.

Best grouping for Hingis (assuming Schnyder and Safina dont make it)
Mauresmo
Kuznetsova
Dementieva/Petrova (can't really tell)

Worst grouping for hingis
Henin
Sharapova
Dementieva/Petrova

But really.. the worst grouping for hingis isn't that much worse than the best grouping....
---

At the moment, chances are she will have a 1-2 record in the round robin group and will not make it to the Semifinals.

Chewie
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:06 AM
Very nice performance analysis.

Notice though that with some bad luck Clijsters can be in same group, if she gets enough points pre YEC...

But, we can not tell what Clijsters's form is, she might be spraying them all over. Henin might be netting every other chance. Then again, they usually are in good form at big events, miraculously healed from their injuries and playing well..
;)

Hopefully Martina takes some good scalps there!

Ben.
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:11 AM
i think they determine the groupings by the WTA rankings not by race rankings. so there4 martina might get kim in her group.

if hingis really wants 2 make an impact in this YEC, she's gonna have 2 play above her level & hope 4 a bit of luck (luck as in kim, justine & amelie aren't gonna play at their best level due 2 injury layoffs).

Hingie
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:48 AM
i think they determine the groupings by the WTA rankings not by race rankings. so there4 martina might get kim in her group.

if hingis really wants 2 make an impact in this YEC, she's gonna have 2 play above her level & hope 4 a bit of luck (luck as in kim, justine & amelie aren't gonna play at their best level due 2 injury layoffs).

Yes she will have to play above her current level. If she can find form which will allow her to play the way we all know she can, she will be fine.

As some other posters have mentioned, not all of the top 8 are about completely overpowering opponents - the fact is they all overpower each other at some stage. Maria certainly overpowered Juju at the US Open. So why is Marti different? Just because her game is different and it isn't always about brute force... on her day she can do just as much damage as any of them.

radwanska
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:49 AM
"Figuring" something out doesn't mean Sharapova has to change her entire game. She just had to make sure she was more careful with her errors.

Did you watch the Pan Pacific SF? Sharapova looked lost and didn't know what to do when Hingis - out of nowhere - hit those very aggressive top spins. Sharapova before could handle aggressive flat shots, but not top spins that go fast and skid towards the baseline. She basically had to try and hit all her shots out of her comfort zone (below the knees or near the shoulders). A lot of the points Martina won were because Maria was hitting tons of errors. Sharapova managed to beat Martina at Dubai and Indian Wells because she learnt from that match at Tokyo and didn't make the same mistakes.

yes but then what happened in dubai?

jamesuk
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:50 AM
[QUOTE=Steffica Greles;9368056]I do get tired of hearing "Hingis may not hit with power, but she has all the brains she needs".

If Hingis really had brains, would she not recognise that she needs to take more risks, looser swings, and leather a few balls?

And before people say that Hingis is not built for power tennis, I can think of dozens of players of her size who hit with far great aggression.


This is true, but at the moment, those "dozens" are, for the most part, behind her in the rankings. In the game of tennis 2006, after 3 years without playing, there are only 7 players ranked ahead of her. SOmething about her game must be working.

Of course, improvements should be made. Of what little I have seen of her this year, my complaint would be of the forehand, she has got to do more with it instead of using it just as a rallying tool

moby
Oct 29th, 2006, 10:02 AM
I'll start to worry if being overpowered prevents Martina from winning any matches. Right now, it's just a noticeable liability. She still has a shot at the semis with the help of the draw gods.

KimC&MariaSNo1's
Oct 29th, 2006, 11:44 AM
i doubt she will get over-powered too much she sticks it to players all the time

Carsten
Oct 29th, 2006, 11:50 AM
I don't see Mauresmo as a "big hitter"...

Viktymise
Oct 29th, 2006, 12:03 PM
The fact that its indoors is not in her favour, yes she likes fast courts but so do the rest of the field, i cant see her getting past the round robin stage, the problem for her is if a top player comes out playing really well on a fast surface like this she's gone and there's just too many of them to play for her to have a viable shot at it

Mauresmo Fan
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:17 PM
do plp actaully think hingis can beat amelie,not a chance, amelie's top spin makes hingis look so weak

Marcus1979
Oct 29th, 2006, 01:20 PM
The others are all huge hitters.I know that she will possibley beat elena,kuznetsova,nadia,amelie.But is just maria,kim and justine[providing she plays]who i cant see her beating........

wouldn't it depend on surface

similar surfaces can vary

i.e look how fast US OPen is to other US Hardcourt events.

if the surface is like how LA has been in recent years she may not be overpowered. as that surface was pretty slow

mike/topgun
Oct 29th, 2006, 03:28 PM
unfortunately the 2nd part of the year was not so good from Martina...so she's got not that much chance at wining this thing....then she could beat say Dementieva anyday imho;)

barryproudfoot
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:00 PM
another thread started by a hater who can't accept that Hingis is going to the YECs :rolleyes:

Beny
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:02 PM
She can/will beat anyone except Belgians(and not because they might not be there)..hopefully they will ;) These two are too strong for Martina

terjw
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:15 PM
i think they determine the groupings by the WTA rankings not by race rankings. so there4 martina might get kim in her group.


Yes - and I'm pretty sure it's based on the rankings now - or rather that will be published on Monday. So it doesn't make any difference whatever happens at Hasselt. She won't be in the same group as Elena. But she could be in the same group as Kim.

égalité
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:19 PM
OK, we all know that she'll beat Dementieva, because EVERYONE beats dementieva at the YEC.

And she can certainly beat Kuznetsova and Mauresmo.

Craigy
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:22 PM
We'll see...

barryproudfoot
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:24 PM
exactly

Beny
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:25 PM
OK, we all know that she'll beat Dementieva, because EVERYONE beats dementieva at the YEC.

And she can certainly beat Kuznetsova and Mauresmo.

:fiery: :mad: :( :mad: :fiery:

Anyway...I stay positive...and take only a semi-final..at least;)

Mauresmo Fan
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:26 PM
OK, we all know that she'll beat Dementieva, because EVERYONE beats dementieva at the YEC.

And she can certainly beat Kuznetsova and Mauresmo.
she wont win a set against momo

LDF
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:31 PM
she wont win a set against momo

If Amelie was fully fit then I'd expect her to win, but considering the shoulder injury Martina has a good chance...

égalité
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:32 PM
she wont win a set against momo

She already has won a set against Momo this year ;)

Mauresmo Fan
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:33 PM
If Amelie was fully fit then I'd expect her to win, but considering the shoulder injury Martina has a good chance...

even injured id expect momo to win

barryproudfoot
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:34 PM
even injured id expect momo to win

well because you're biased. you probably expect Mauresmo to win every single tournament next year

barryproudfoot
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:35 PM
she wont win a set against momo

wanna wager on that? :p

terjw
Oct 29th, 2006, 04:43 PM
OK, we all know that she'll beat Dementieva, because EVERYONE beats dementieva at the YEC.

But as I explained :rolleyes: - she definitely won't be in the same group as Dementieva unless someone who has qualified withdraws. So the only other way those two can play each other is that they both make it to the semis and one of them qualifies at the top of their group - or if one of them isn't top of their group - they play in the finals.

Sally Struthers
Oct 29th, 2006, 05:39 PM
Hingis has more problems with fast players than the power alone. So I think Kim if she is healthy will be her biggest problem.

goldenlox
Oct 29th, 2006, 06:29 PM
I think Martina got tired as the year wore on
But next January, she'll beat some big name or 2

UDACHi
Oct 29th, 2006, 06:59 PM
you contradict yourself by saying she will be overpowered by the other 7 in your thread title, but then stating that you could see her defeating 4 of them.

Beny
Oct 29th, 2006, 07:08 PM
I love your signature UDACHi.....

anlavalle
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:07 PM
Against a Healthy Justin, Kim or Amelie i think she has no chance

Mauresmo Fan
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:10 PM
Against a Healthy Justin, Kim or Amelie i think she has no chance

very true

OZTENNIS
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:50 PM
who really gives a f*#%!! martina has proved that she can mix it with the best this year after heaps of people practically condemned her for coming back! she proved that she can reach the top 10, win tournaments and perform well at grand slams. who cares if she never wins another gs. shes back doing what she loves and has a real blast doing it. leave her alone and stop creating these stupid threads. we should be applauding her on an outstanding year!!!!

Hawn
Oct 29th, 2006, 08:57 PM
The others have "game craft". The only difference between Martina and them is that she's a defensive player and has to rely on it. The others are all aggressive baseliners and because of the power they don't need to do more to construct a point.

I don't think that's the only difference. Better volleys, anticipation, feel, etc. Hingis is special because she does not have the power but has a natural tennis playing gift. There are many players that do not have the power nor the craft to make it to the top, and it's very rare to make it with primarily the craft that Hingis possesses.

She's not really defensive player either. I would note Sugiyama and Coetzer more in that category.

égalité
Oct 29th, 2006, 09:07 PM
The others have "game craft". The only difference between Martina and them is that she's a defensive player and has to rely on it. The others are all aggressive baseliners and because of the power they don't need to do more to construct a point.

She's not a defensive player. She comes to net more than anyone else in the Top 10. And she's better at that than anyone else in the game.

JackWalker
Oct 29th, 2006, 11:03 PM
no she won't

Billabong
Oct 29th, 2006, 11:12 PM
very true

Well Martina was very close to beat Mauresmo in Berlin this year (choked away a 4-2 lead in the third set) and gave Kim a real fight in AO. In RG, Martina had food poisoning so was far from 100% and in San Diego, Martina just tried to outhit Clijsters, which is not her game and which led to ordinary results after RG. If she uses her best weapons (net play, controlling the rallies and using her variety) she can beat anyone, but unfortunately she hasn't been playing that way since RG (except against Kuznetsova twice and Hantuchova)... She left Zurich playing one of her best matches in a long time, so hopefully she'll have positive vibes for Madrid:)

mdsc8
Oct 30th, 2006, 05:06 AM
I wish Martina all the 'mental toughness' in this world for her matches in YEC! GO MARTINA!!!

LH2HBH
Oct 30th, 2006, 05:26 AM
Yeah everybody thought she would be overpowered by the whole field since her comeback but here she is at the YEC. Also - she has beaten a lot of the other girls this season already. :rolleyes:

Marcus1979
Oct 30th, 2006, 05:28 AM
remember in her first 4 events

she played a competitive matches against Justine and Kim
and beat Sharapova

Jakeev
Oct 30th, 2006, 08:24 AM
[quote=Lindsay Martina;9367862]This explains why she has beaten Kuznetsova and Sharapova, both in straight sets this year. quote]

So? She has also lost to both these players too. Means nothing.

tennis-master83
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:20 AM
remember in her first 4 events

she played a competitive matches against Justine and Kim
and beat Sharapova

She Beat Maria in their first meeting like Dementieva,Myskina,Hantuchova,Serena.....
Right now i think she is affraid of Maria's power shots and mental.:lol: :lol: :lol:

I find Martina a very interesting person but not a top 5 player again.

hingis2002cn
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:22 AM
so many haters here, espacially Mauresmo Fan.

barryproudfoot
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:23 AM
She Beat Maria in their first meeting like Dementieva,Myskina,Hantuchova,Serena.....
Right now i think she is affraid of Maria's power shots and mental.:lol: :lol: :lol:

I find Martina a very interesting person but not a top 5 player again.

:lol: @ you

why would she be afraid of anyone? :weirdo: she's got nothing to lose, and everything to gain :p
still the haters can't except, or get over the fact, that Hingis is in the top ten, and is going to the YECs :banana:

Who do you see as a top five player then? Dementieva, Petrova, Schnyder?

barryproudfoot
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:25 AM
so many haters here, espacially Mauresmo Fan.

they are still crying over that comment made nearly 8 years ago, despite the fact that Mauresmo accepted an apology (yes she did apologise during the victory speech), and got over it :p

hingis2002cn
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:27 AM
Against a Healthy Justin, Kim or Amelie i think she has no chance

what a fan. ..
you know nothing about tennis.

PLP
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:28 AM
Interesting as I think Martina has a great chance to be a top 5 player again very soon, she is just outside of that now and will probably finish the year at #7 (at least), even with an average (for her) 2nd half of the year :shrug:

hingis2002cn
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:30 AM
they are still crying over that comment made nearly 8 years ago, despite the fact that Mauresmo accepted an apology (yes she did apologise during the victory speech), and got over it :p

through these talks, I think Mauresmo has many many foolish supporters. It is very interesting .:lol: :lol:

tennis-master83
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:45 AM
:lol: @ you

why would she be afraid of anyone? :weirdo: she's got nothing to lose, and everything to gain :p
still the haters can't except, or get over the fact, that Hingis is in the top ten, and is going to the YECs :banana:

Who do you see as a top five player then? Dementieva, Petrova, Schnyder?

I'm not an Hingis Hater, she deserves to play to the YEC but i'm gonna be very surprise if she is gonna win more than 1 match .

Kunal
Oct 30th, 2006, 11:05 AM
unfortunately that might be true....but she has to get more power in her game...i would think that she knows that by now

Hawn
Oct 30th, 2006, 10:18 PM
[quote=Lindsay Martina;9367862]This explains why she has beaten Kuznetsova and Sharapova, both in straight sets this year. quote]

So? She has also lost to both these players too. Means nothing.

It means nothing? No, it means she can challenge and beat the top of the game.

morningglory
Oct 30th, 2006, 11:19 PM
time will tell...
So regardless of the result someone's in this thread will get a chance to gloat the next 2 weeks :lol:
I think Martina will win at least a match if she gets an easy group btw
Martina's not on-form right now

star
Oct 30th, 2006, 11:24 PM
I don't think she'll win it or anything, but she won't be totally overpowered. Especially because I don't think the rest of the players will be at their best either.

Barlos
Oct 30th, 2006, 11:48 PM
Both Sharapova and Kuznetsova are in good form at the moment and would be very difficult for Martina. As for the others, Martina would be favourite against Dementieva and possibly Petrova. Justine, Kim and Amelie are all returning from recent injuries so they're unlikely to be in top form. Martina has a good chance to make the semis at least.

Even elena could win a match this year...

Ntour
Oct 31st, 2006, 12:57 AM
I don't think so. I think Martina is prepared for the YEC. I really hope she'll go for the serve and volley route. Does anyone else remember Filderstadt 2000? She played and won her 4 matches (63 30 ret vs Henin, 62 61 to Van Roost, 61 60 vs Sanchez-Vicario, 60 63 vs Clijsters) with an AMAZING net play. She served and volleyed all the time, even on second serve. Ok, this was a different Martina, and Henin and Clijsters are different players now, they're champions, BUT do you think she could produce once again a perfomance like that? Is it wishful thinking from me?

yeah but now compared to the level of returns martinas serve isn't strong enough they would blast passing shot winners off her serve now

Ntour
Oct 31st, 2006, 01:03 AM
I wish Martina all the 'mental toughness' in this world for her matches in YEC! GO MARTINA!!!


I don't think mental toughness will be enough she needs some toughness on her groundies and serve

P_Fer
Oct 31st, 2006, 01:13 AM
You cannot say for sure that she will be overpowered. Sure, there's a chance it could happen, but she's beaten the players that can overpower her. To say she will get overpowered as a matter of fact is wrong.

Ryan
Oct 31st, 2006, 01:30 AM
Of course she'll be over-powered. But since when does that mean she'll lose? Hingis has been over-powered since 1997 against Graf, Seles, and Davenport. It's nothing new. I'd favor her against Dementieva, Mauresmo, and possibly Justine and Kim depending on their post-injury form. Sharapova, Kuznetsova and Petrova are the hottest players coming in to Madrid, so it should be interesting all around.

Dawn Marie
Oct 31st, 2006, 02:09 AM
I do get tired of hearing "Hingis may not hit with power, but she has all the brains she needs".

If Hingis really had brains, would she not recognise that she needs to take more risks, looser swings, and leather a few balls?

And before people say that Hingis is not built for power tennis, I can think of dozens of players of her size who hit with far great aggression.

True, such tactics would lose her more matches - but she'd still be in with a greater chance of winning majors.


I agree with some of this statement.


Truth is Hings had ALOT of time to get her serve to become more of a weapon. Justine did this. She's tiny.

Hingis just never had the effort to improve while the others players were improving as well. If Hingis iproved that serve she would imho be higher than what she is now.

anlavalle
Oct 31st, 2006, 02:25 AM
what a fan. ..
you know nothing about tennis.

wait and see

hingis2002cn
Nov 1st, 2006, 02:55 AM
wait and see

yes.:tape: :worship:

mdsc8
Nov 1st, 2006, 12:22 PM
oh this thread.. :tape: :lol:

spencercarlos
Nov 10th, 2006, 04:46 AM
she wont win a set against momo
One of the many asses proved wrong in this thread.

PLP
Nov 10th, 2006, 04:47 AM
:haha: :haha: :haha:

moby
Nov 10th, 2006, 05:06 AM
One of the many asses proved wrong in this thread.Hopefully, now Justine will perform the coup de grace to send Martina into the semis over Amelie. :)