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View Full Version : What Is The Deal With Lebanese People????


tennisbum79
Aug 2nd, 2006, 10:58 PM
I came to the decision to post this message very reluctantly.

I am very disturbed by the attitude of certain Lebanese; both those who left at the start of the conflict, and those who remained.

Early on, there were several reports of non-shiite Lebanese wishing Hezbollah to loose

While their country's infrastructure was being destroyed by a foreign power.

While poor civilians with no mean to get out were being killed.

Even, the politicians were issuing mild, subdued condemnation of both Israel and Hezbolla. You would not believe they lead a country whose army just lost nine soldiers in the hand a foreign country.

And what about those who fled the country in the safety of their adopted country?

The majority were just happy to be safe and back home in the US. Which is understandable; but the appalling thing is they rarely expressed any thoughts of sympathy for those they left behind and who are still under the gun. Some of their concerns seem rather shallow and supercial. Many a times the retuning Lebanese lament on loosing their night life by leaving Labanon abruptly.


Even on debates on TV, the moderator always seems to find a Lebanese who is against Hezbollah or just neutral in the conflict.

In most countries of the world, despite religious, ethnic differences, if the country is attacked from abroad, most inhabitants will put their differences aside and unite against a common enemy.

No matter how they feel about Hezbollah, once their country is attacked and its infrastructure destroyed, Lebanese should haved united behind those defending the country at the moment.
They have plenty of time to ague among themselve later.

I must state that I do not agree that Hezbollah kidnapped the 2 Isrealy soldiers, but at the same time I am appaled by the disproportionate reaction from Israel. I can say this for I am not Lebanese.

Martian Willow
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:07 PM
Obviously there are people in Lebanon who have more sense than you. :)

CondiLicious
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:09 PM
I've read this post 3 times and I still can't understand what point you are trying to make.

Martian Willow
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:11 PM
I think hes wondering why some Lebanese people are critical of Hezbollah and blame them for provoking Israel. But I could easily be wrong.

CondiLicious
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:12 PM
I think hes wondering why some Lebanese people are critical of Hezbollah and blame them for provoking Israel.

Oh. Um... :help:

égalité
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:13 PM
Er... well, since you're not Lebanese, I don't think you can tell them who to support and how fervently to support them. Actually if you were Lebanese, I still don't think you could tell them.

Apoleb
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:14 PM
I've read this post 3 times and I still can't understand what point you are trying to make.

:lol:

Damned if they don't support Hezbollah, and damned if they do.

Lots of Lebanese do not condone Hezbollah's ideology or even support what it has done, but also they are not apathetic to their fellow citizens, and everyone is helping everyone now in the crisis.

tennisbum79
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:16 PM
I've read this post 3 times and I still can't understand what point you are trying to make.

I don't think it is that hard to understand.

tennisbum79
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:18 PM
Obviously there are people in Lebanon who have more sense than you. :)

I do not think you understand what a nation is about.

CondiLicious
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:19 PM
I don't think it is that hard to understand.

Oh okay then. I think I was confused by your typos and poor sentence structure.

tennisbum79
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:24 PM
Oh okay then. I think I was confused by your typos and poor sentence structure.

Ok I corrected the typos, now read-read it give me your thoughtful reaction.

CondiLicious
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:31 PM
Ok I corrected the typos, now read-read it give me your thoughtful reaction.

Okay. Well, why wouldn't an intelligent and informed Lebanese person be critical of Hezbollah, whether they are an Lebanese citizen or not? They are nothing more than terrorists. Now, I think the carnage that Israel is inflicting upon Lebanon is disgusting and disturbing to say the least but I in no way, shape or form feel any sympathy for Hezbollah.

tennisbum79
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:41 PM
Okay. Well, why wouldn't an intelligent and informed Lebanese person be critical of Hezbollah, whether they are an Lebanese citizen or not? They are nothing more than terrorists. Now, I think the carnage that Israel is inflicting upon Lebanon is disgusting and disturbing to say the least but I in no way, shape or form feel any sympathy for Hezbollah.

There are well informed and educated people in many countries, but you would not see their citizens behave like this while their country's infrastructure is being destroyed.

Israel has the most number of educated people (with very strong views on everything) in the middle East , but you would never see an Israelis take the side of any country while that country is destryoing Tel-Aviv. Even if Israel had provoked it.

CondiLicious
Aug 2nd, 2006, 11:52 PM
There are well informed and educated people in many countries, but you would not see their citizens behave like this while their country's infrastructure is being destroyed.

Israel has the most number of educated people (with very strong views on everything) in the middle East , but you would never see an Israelis take the side of any country while that country is destryoing Tel-Aviv. Even if Israel had provoked it.

To me it is logical that some Lebanese people would still be critical of Hezbollah. If they hadn't provoked Israel then none of this would have happened. Fact. Nationalism is a complex thing and I think you are oversimplifying it.

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:00 AM
To me it is logical that some Lebanese people would still be critical of Hezbollah. If they hadn't provoked Israel then none of this would have happened. Fact. Nationalism is a complex thing and I think you are oversimplifying it.

I think you are too detached in your assessment to grasp what a nation is.
And I think you are the one oversimplified it.
Some of the Christians were surprised that their quarters were also bombed, and it is only after that they realized it was the country being attacked not just Heazbollah. And these were educated people.

Apoleb
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:15 AM
I think you are too detached in your assessment to grasp what a nation is.
And I think you are the one oversimplified it.
Some of the Christians were surprised that their quarters were also bombed, and it is only after that they realized it was the country being attacked not just Heazbollah. And these were educated people.

No, she's right. Being a part of a nation doesn't mean you have to be blind. The Lebanese should get critical of Hezbollah, cause it acted without their consent. No one asked them to kidnap those 2 soldiers. Plus, I'm not sure what you're refering at. It's not like some Lebanese are watching their fellow citizens being killed and they are laughing. The refugees from the south are being taken care of and helped by all Lebanese.

I'm Lebanese and I despise Hezbollah and I blame them for this mess, and I think they should be disarmed. However, that doesn't mean that I condone the Israeli response or that I am happy to see my fellow citizens being killed, most of them who have nothing to do with it anyway.

CondiLicious
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:22 AM
Exactly. Blind nationalism is a dangerous thing... the last world war proved that.

égalité
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:22 AM
No, she's right. Being a part of a nation doesn't mean you have to be blind. The Lebanese should get critical of Hezbollah, cause it acted without their consent. No one asked them to kidnap those 2 soldiers. Plus, I'm not sure what you're refering at. It's not like some Lebanese are watching their fellow citizens being killed and they are laughing. The refugees from the south are being taken care of and helped by all Lebanese.

I'm Lebanese and I despise Hezbollah and I blame them for this mess, and I think they should be disarmed. However, that doesn't mean that I condone the Israeli response or that I am happy to see my fellow citizens being killed, most of them who have nothing to do with it anyway.


:yeah: :yeah: :yeah:

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:27 AM
I'm Lebanese and I despise Hezbollah and I blame them for this mess, and I think they should be disarmed. However, that doesn't mean that I condone the Israeli response or that I am happy to see my fellow citizens being killed, most of them who have nothing to do with it anyway.

I am watching CNN and other news outlets. The talk is of some part of the city under siege, where food and medecine are rationed.

It's not like some Lebanese are watching their fellow citizens being killed and they are laughing. The refugees from the south are being taken care of and helped by all Lebanese

I am not saying they are laughing, but some seem detatched and removed and do not seem concerned.
In the final analysis, it seems like allegiance to ethnic or religious group trumps everything.

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:32 AM
Exactly. Blind nationalism is a dangerous thing... the last world war proved that.

I do not disagree with this. However that is not the case here.

Also, an over alleagiance to one's ethinic or religious group can be detrimental to national unity and undermine the spirit of a nation.
And it seems to be the case in Lebanon.

Infiniti2001
Aug 3rd, 2006, 12:55 AM
Lebanon is either 50/50 muslim/christian or 48/52 christian/muslim. I'm sure most of those who oppose Hezzbollah are mostly Christian.


I am not saying they are laughing, but some seem detatched and removed and do not seem concerned.
In the final analysis, it seems like allegiance to ethnic or religious group trumps everything.

I'd love to see your reaction if bombs were being dropped in your backyard :rolleyes:

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 01:00 AM
Lebanon is either 50/50 muslim/christian or 48/52. I'm sure most of those who oppose Hezzbollah are mostly Christian.

That should not make a difference when the country is under attack.
There is plenty of time for that.



I'd love to see your reaction if bombs were being dropped in your backyard :rolleyes:

I am not sure what this is responding to. Not certainly my post

SelesFan70
Aug 3rd, 2006, 01:12 AM
Obviously there are people in Lebanon who have more sense than you. :)

I would bet money that at least 75% of WTAWorld.com agrees with the thread starter. :tape: :help:

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 01:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by catherine
Obviously there are people in Lebanon who have more sense than you. :)


I would bet money that at least 75% of WTAWorld.com agrees with the thread starter. :tape: :help:

Some of these posters, especially Catherine, seem to have a very supercifical and naive undertsanding of what hold a nations togther.
You can see in the kind of drive-by and careless posts on a serious issue like this one.

After Syria left, Lebanese claim to be finaly ready to form a nation.
They would bury the differences between Maronite Christian and Muslim, between Suni and Shiites. This show they seem far from that.

Martian Willow
Aug 3rd, 2006, 01:50 AM
I think your understanding of what holds a nation together is peremptory and dogmatic. It doesn't make much sense in the real world.

Wiggly
Aug 3rd, 2006, 02:17 AM
I don't know.

The only Lebeanese I know is crazy. She can't stop talking about Lebannon. it's her origins. But she never went there but off course, it's such a great country. She always bash Canada :o But Canada is not destroys. Sorry :wavey:

Veritas
Aug 3rd, 2006, 03:35 AM
The majority were just happy to be safe and back home in the US. Which is understandable; but the appalling thing is they rarely expressed any thoughts of sympathy for those they left behind and who are still under the gun. Some of their concerns seem rather shallow and supercial. Many a times the retuning Lebanese lament on loosing their night life by leaving Labanon abruptly.

That's going a bit far don't you think? I mean, surely they have a right to be concerned about things they want, no matter how "superficial" other people judge it to be.

Personally, I'm more concerned with what's gonna happen once Israel takes up Hezbollah's promise of returning the captured soldiers within 6 hours. If either side (especially Hezbollah) decide to not honour their part of the deal, then the ramifications could be even more devastating and difficult to resolve.

On the other hand, I care more about how I'm going to sort out my day-to-day existence rather than what's happening half a world away. Is it harsh? Probably, but I tend to see it as being realistic because most people are concerned only with things that directly affect them. And as for the Lebanese you're criticising, that's the attitude I think you have beef with, yet that doesn't necessarily make them bad people, as they're probably concerned with the situation in how it affects them personally.

Even on debates on TV, the moderator always seems to find a Lebanese who is against Hezbollah or just neutral in the conflict.

In most countries of the world, despite religious, ethnic differences, if the country is attacked from abroad, most inhabitants will put their differences aside and unite against a common enemy.

No matter how they feel about Hezbollah, once their country is attacked and its infrastructure destroyed, Lebanese should haved united behind those defending the country at the moment.
They have plenty of time to ague among themselve later.

Well, I'm sorry that people don't see things the way you do.

Anyway, media reports have pretty much shown that the Lebanese are unanimously opposed to Israel itself. And it's not just those in Lebanon - there's been rallies in NSW held by ethnic Lebanese groups protesting Israel's actions.

For the record, I think Israel's gone way overboard, but I can understand the logic behind some of their actions.

RatedR Superstar
Aug 3rd, 2006, 03:48 AM
theres a lot of filipino maids in lebanon, and since theres a war over there, they all wanna come back home, but their lebanese employers wont let them, they treat them as their property, slaves actually..their employers will hold their passports so they cant go back home, and some would even lie to the police and tell them that these filipino workers stole something from them eventhough its not true..

...so i say waste those motherfuckers!!!! :armed:

CondiLicious
Aug 3rd, 2006, 03:49 AM
I think your understanding of what holds a nation together is peremptory and dogmatic. It doesn't make much sense in the real world.

He got it from his Sociology text book.

Infiniti2001
Aug 3rd, 2006, 03:53 AM
He got it from his Sociology text book.

ouch :tape: Meanwhile , it's his habit of over -analyzing everything :rolleyes:

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 05:37 AM
I think your understanding of what holds a nation together is peremptory and dogmatic. It doesn't make much sense in the real world.

I don't know what real word you live in.

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 05:44 AM
ouch :tape: Meanwhile , it's his habit of over -analyzing everything :rolleyes:

For you, no matter the gravity of a situation, an in-depth analyis always amounts to over analysis.
You made the same point when I wrote in the aftermath of Katrina, that blacks, because of economic reasons, would have difficulties returning to New Orleans in the same proportion as pre-Katrina.
The events on the ground have now confirmed what I had written.

tennisbum79
Aug 3rd, 2006, 11:50 PM
bump

Rollo
Aug 4th, 2006, 12:53 AM
Tennisbum- IMO the key lies in your use of the term "nation".

Lebanon isn't a functioning independent nation.

A true nation has the authority to control it's own borders and stop groups like Hezbollah. It's very clear that Lebanon either cannot stop Hezbollah.

Even IF all the Lebanese were united what you asking would be near impossible due to the small size of the population and it's history.

Israel, Syria, and Hezbollah know the Lebanon is a nation in name only, which is why it's a constant playground for those who want an indirect war.

The Lebanese are caught in between, with few options. No wonder many are angry at Hezbollah.

tennisbum79
Aug 4th, 2006, 01:31 AM
Tennisbum- IMO the key lies in your use of the term "nation".

Lebanon isn't a functioning independent nation.

A true nation has the authority to control it's own borders and stop groups like Hezbollah. It's very clear that Lebanon either cannot stop Hezbollah.

Even IF all the Lebanese were united what you asking would be near impossible due to the small size of the population and it's history.

Israel, Syria, and Hezbollah know the Lebanon is a nation in name only, which is why it's a constant playground for those who want an indirect war.

The Lebanese are caught in between, with few options. No wonder many are angry at Hezbollah.

Israel is nation where people came from all corners of the world, with strong differing opinions on everything from politics to religions. But when it comes to their country, they act as one.
They don't ask questions when Palestinians send succide bombers to Israel, even it followed an IDF bombing of palestinianl people they did not agree with.

fufuqifuqishahah
Aug 4th, 2006, 05:47 AM
Thanks for the topic, it's an interesting argument.

There are well informed and educated people in many countries, but you would not see their citizens behave like this while their country's infrastructure is being destroyed.


This is not true. I know so many countries that would behave divisively, especially the United States.


Israel has the most number of educated people (with very strong views on everything) in the middle East , but you would never see an Israelis take the side of any country while that country is destryoing Tel-Aviv. Even if Israel had provoked it.

Israelis are very passionate about what they do and are not very divided. They have been abused for many many many years and are tired of the abuse and want things to change. As a collective entity, they think more with their hearts than their brains when compared to a lot of other nations, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Almost all Israelis have very similiar objectives and ideals when it comes to foreign policy, whereas members of other nations usually do not have that same solidarity in objecties and ideals.


theres a lot of filipino maids in lebanon, and since theres a war over there, they all wanna come back home, but their lebanese employers wont let them, they treat them as their property, slaves actually..their employers will hold their passports so they cant go back home, and some would even lie to the police and tell them that these filipino workers stole something from them eventhough its not true..

...so i say waste those motherfuckers!!!! :armed:
this is how it is all over, not just in lebanon. any ethnic group of housemaids are often abused by affluent families, it's quite sad. but to say "waste those motherfuckers" is kind of mean no? Its not like a majority of lebanese are like that... maybe all nations w/ affluent families who have housemaids should be wasted then?

tennisbum79
Aug 5th, 2006, 12:54 AM
Thanks for the topic, it's an interesting argument.



This is not true. I know so many countries that would behave divisively, especially the United States.?

I beg to differ on the US. Americans may have their disagreement politically, but when the country is under threat, any disagreement is muted or disappear from TV or pages of the major newspapers.

It is true that politicians will often exploit that state of affair by expanding their power beyond what the law allows. Case and point torture and spying on amarican citizens. But that is a discussion for another day and time.
The point is Amercans behave like most nations, if the country is threatened, disgareement disappears.


Israelis are very passionate about what they do and are not very divided. They have been abused for many many many years and are tired of the abuse and want things to change. As a collective entity, they think more with their hearts than their brains when compared to a lot of other nations, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. Almost all Israelis have very similiar objectives and ideals when it comes to foreign policy, whereas members of other nations usually do not have that same solidarity in objecties and ideals.?
Good point, I could not have said better myself.
Few Israelis posters have demonstrated that in other threads. I may disafree with them, but I admire their passion for their country.

wta_zuperfann
Aug 5th, 2006, 01:23 PM
Hezbollah provoked Israel


We've gone over this several times and perhaps it's time to put an end to this myth.

The record clearly shows that it is Israel that crossed the blue line on a daily basis since the 2000 withdrawal and it is this state that caused the provocation:


http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0801/p09s02-coop.html



August 01, 2006

Hizbullah's attacks stem from Israeli incursions into Lebanon

By Anders Strindberg

NEW YORK – As pundits and policymakers scramble to explain events in Lebanon, their conclusions are virtually unanimous: Hizbullah created this crisis. Israel is defending itself. The underlying problem is Arab extremism.

Sadly, this is pure analytical nonsense. Hizbullah's capture of two Israeli soldiers on July 12 was a direct result of Israel's silent but unrelenting aggression against Lebanon, which in turn is part of a six-decades long Arab-Israeli conflict.


Since its withdrawal of occupation forces from southern Lebanon in May 2000, Israel has violated the United Nations-monitored "blue line" on an almost daily basis, according to UN reports. Hizbullah's military doctrine, articulated in the early 1990s, states that it will fire Katyusha rockets into Israel only in response to Israeli attacks on Lebanese civilians or Hizbullah's leadership; this indeed has been the pattern.

In the process of its violations, Israel has terrorized the general population, destroyed private property, and killed numerous civilians. This past February, for instance, 15-year-old shepherd Yusuf Rahil was killed by unprovoked Israeli cross-border fire as he tended his flock in southern Lebanon. Israel has assassinated its enemies in the streets of Lebanese cities and continues to occupy Lebanon's Shebaa Farms area, while refusing to hand over the maps of mine fields that continue to kill and cripple civilians in southern Lebanon more than six years after the war supposedly ended. What peace did Hizbullah shatter?

Hizbullah's capture of the soldiers took place in the context of this ongoing conflict, which in turn is fundamentally shaped by realities in the Palestinian territories. To the vexation of Israel and its allies, Hizbullah - easily the most popular political movement in the Middle East - unflinchingly stands with the Palestinians.

Since June 25, when Palestinian fighters captured one Israeli soldier and demanded a prisoner exchange, Israel has killed more than 140 Palestinians. Like the Lebanese situation, that flare-up was detached from its wider context and was said to be "manufactured" by the enemies of Israel; more nonsense proffered in order to distract from the apparently unthinkable reality that it is the manner in which Israel was created, and the ideological premises that have sustained it for almost 60 years, that are the core of the entire Arab-Israeli conflict.

Once the Arabs had rejected the UN's right to give away their land and to force them to pay the price for European pogroms and the Holocaust, the creation of Israel in 1948 was made possible only by ethnic cleansing and annexation. This is historical fact and has been documented by Israeli historians, such as Benny Morris. Yet Israel continues to contend that it had nothing to do with the Palestinian exodus, and consequently has no moral duty to offer redress.

For six decades the Palestinian refugees have been refused their right to return home because they are of the wrong race. "Israel must remain a Jewish state," is an almost sacral mantra across the Western political spectrum. It means, in practice, that Israel is accorded the right to be an ethnocracy at the expense of the refugees and their descendants, now close to 5 million.

Is it not understandable that Israel's ethnic preoccupation profoundly offends not only Palestinians, but many of their Arab brethren? Yet rather than demanding that Israel acknowledge its foundational wrongs as a first step toward equality and coexistence, the Western world blithely insists that each and all must recognize Israel's right to exist at the Palestinians' expense.

Western discourse seems unable to accommodate a serious, as opposed to cosmetic concern for Palestinians' rights and liberties: The Palestinians are the Indians who refuse to live on the reservation; the Negroes who refuse to sit in the back of the bus.

By what moral right does anyone tell them to be realistic and get over themselves? That it is too much of a hassle to right the wrongs committed against them? That the front of the bus must remain ethnically pure? When they refuse to recognize their occupier and embrace their racial inferiority, when desperation and frustration causes them to turn to violence, and when neighbors and allies come to their aid - some for reasons of power politics, others out of idealism - we are astonished that they are all such fanatics and extremists.

The fundamental obstacle to understanding the Arab-Israeli conflict is that we have given up on asking what is right and wrong, instead asking what is "practical" and "realistic." Yet reality is that Israel is a profoundly racist state, the existence of which is buttressed by a seemingly endless succession of punitive measures, assassinations, and wars against its victims and their allies.

A realistic understanding of the conflict, therefore, is one that recognizes that the crux is not in this or that incident or policy, but in Israel's foundational and per- sistent refusal to recognize the humanity of its Palestinian victims. Neither Hizbullah nor Hamas are driven by a desire to "wipe out Jews," as is so often claimed, but by a fundamental sense of injustice that they will not allow to be forgotten.

These groups will continue to enjoy popular legitimacy because they fulfill the need for someone - anyone - to stand up for Arab rights. Israel cannot destroy this need by bombing power grids or rocket ramps. If Israel, like its former political ally South Africa, has the capacity to come to terms with principles of democracy and human rights and accept egalitarian multiracial coexistence within a single state for Jews and Arabs, then the foundation for resentment and resistance will have been removed. If Israel cannot bring itself to do so, then it will continue to be the vortex of regional violence.

• Anders Strindberg, formerly a visiting professor at Damascus University, Syria, is a consultant on Middle East politics working with European government and law-enforcement agencies. He has also covered Syria, Lebanon, and the Palestinian territories as a journalist since the late 1990s, primarily for European publications.

Pasta-Na
Aug 5th, 2006, 02:16 PM
ok, i will tell u.

they turnt from lebanese to be lesbian :angel:

tennisbum79
Aug 7th, 2006, 11:54 AM
Israel just arresed a high official (a minister) of the Palestinian government.
I wonder if this amount to provocation.

Princess Sarah.
Aug 7th, 2006, 09:50 PM
what the hell is up with u? i didn't understand a word of ur pointless post...just another wta shit stirrer!

tennisbum79
Aug 8th, 2006, 12:06 AM
what the hell is up with u? i didn't understand a word of ur pointless post...just another wta shit stirrer!

Sorry it is over your head.
No reason to hysterical, just go onto other threads your can understand.

RVD
Aug 8th, 2006, 01:28 AM
Finally, an explanation that sounds much more feasible, and in line with what I’ve come to understand from conversations with friends. Especially this quote: Once the Arabs had rejected the UN's right to give away their land and to force them to pay the price for European pogroms and the Holocaust, the creation of Israel in 1948 was made possible only by ethnic cleansing and annexation. This is historical fact and has been documented by Israeli historians, such as Benny Morris. Yet Israel continues to contend that it had nothing to do with the Palestinian exodus, and consequently has no moral duty to offer redress.This, in fact, sounds exactly like the position that the U.S. has stubbornly taken in reference to Slavery. “It’s not our fault.” “We don’t have any responsibilities to towards those people, so we won’t apologize for what our ancestors did to them.” :rolleyes:

I’ve also heard this, but never seen it in writing until now. For six decades the Palestinian refugees have been refused their right to return home because they are of the wrong race. "Israel must remain a Jewish state," is an almost sacral mantra across the Western political spectrum. It means, in practice, that Israel is accorded the right to be an ethnocracy at the expense of the refugees and their descendants, now close to 5 million.If true, that is despicable!

I suppose this line of reasoning is why I have empathy for the Palestinians, and am less of a fan of the Israelis. It sounds too much like home: By what moral right does anyone tell them to be realistic and get over themselves? That it is too much of a hassle to right the wrongs committed against them? That the front of the bus must remain ethnically pure? When they refuse to recognize their occupier and embrace their racial inferiority, when desperation and frustration causes them to turn to violence, and when neighbors and allies come to their aid - some for reasons of power politics, others out of idealism - we are astonished that they are all such fanatics and extremists.

And finally, this says it all for me.A realistic understanding of the conflict, therefore, is one that recognizes that the crux is not in this or that incident or policy, but in Israel's foundational and persistent refusal to recognize the humanity of its Palestinian victims. Neither Hizbullah nor Hamas are driven by a desire to "wipe out Jews," as is so often claimed, but by a fundamental sense of injustice that they will not allow to be forgotten.:worship:

Thanks for the very interesting article!!! :wavey:
It's important to hear the argument on both sides and to allow people to conclude for themselves what the truth is. Or at least, a semblance of what's true, rather than what's force-feed to you. ;)

Also, I’ll have to give this guy, Anders Strindberg, his props because this sounds closer to the truth than what is being propagandized by the West. :yeah: :yeah:

Crazy Canuck
Aug 8th, 2006, 01:34 AM
theres a lot of filipino maids in lebanon, and since theres a war over there, they all wanna come back home, but their lebanese employers wont let them, they treat them as their property, slaves actually..their employers will hold their passports so they cant go back home, and some would even lie to the police and tell them that these filipino workers stole something from them eventhough its not true..

...so i say waste those motherfuckers!!!! :armed:

Well aren't you charming.

Crazy Canuck
Aug 8th, 2006, 01:37 AM
Hezbollah provoked Israel


We've gone over this several times and perhaps it's time to put an end to this myth.

The record clearly shows that it is Israel that crossed the blue line on a daily basis since the 2000 withdrawal and it is this state that caused the provocation:


http://www.csmonitor.com/2006/0801/p09s02-coop.html


...

Well if the Christian Science Monitor prints it, it must be the final word.

tennisbum79
Aug 17th, 2006, 12:41 AM
Lebanese general drinking tea witth IDF after his country has been detroyed by Israel.
That is onse of the thing wrong with The Lebanese people

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1154525887756&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull