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vwfan
Jun 14th, 2006, 10:46 PM
Each of the top ten has performed well at at least one slam. Six out of ten have won a slam. But only Justine has repeated at a slam and is the only one to defend her Grand Slam title. Not one really stands out other than Justine for future slam success. Odds are Kim or Maria.

Who else will break out with slam win?

Amelié (F, W Aus Open)
Clijsters (F, W U. S. Open)
Justine (3x champ, W RG)
Maria (W, SF Wimbledon)
Petrova (2x SF RG)
Kuznetsova (W U.S. Open)
Davenport (W, 2 Fs, Wimbledon)
Pierce (W, 2Fs, RG)
Dementieva (F, SF, U.S. Open)
Schynder (SF, 2QF, Aus Open)

I say the stage is set for a Williams sister comeback in 2007. Since 2000, they have won more GS titles than the entire top ten combined: 11 vs. 10!

*JR*
Jun 14th, 2006, 10:59 PM
Justine also won in Oz and NYC, though those were during the W/S nightmare that began after Wimby '03. And Mareee also has an Oz trophy. ;) Plus Demented was also a bridesmaid @ the USO in '04 besides RG. :o (Of course Mrs. Leach from Newport Beach has 3 Slams total... though none since '00). :scratch:

darrinbaker00
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:03 PM
I say the stage is set for a Williams sister comeback in 2007. Since 2000, they have won more GS titles than the entire top ten combined: 11 vs. 10!
Some of us have said the same thing about 2004, 2005 and 2006. At this point, I'd much rather see it than talk about it.

faboozadoo15
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:14 PM
I say the stage is set for a Williams sister comeback in 2007. Since 2000, they have won more GS titles than the entire top ten combined: 11 vs. 10!
how are these two things related?

DragonFlame
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:19 PM
ugh, great look at the top10. why did i expect this thread to get into a williams sisters will dominate again thread when i read your name under the title...
nothing ever changes here, same topics in a different shell over and over again.

vwfan
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:21 PM
ugh, great look at the top10. why did i expect this thread to get into a williams sisters will dominate again thread when i read your name under the title...
nothing ever changes here, same topics in a different shell over and over again.you draw your conclusions, I draw mine. ok?

You could, I guess, being a Justine fan conclude that she will dominate for the next few years since no one in the top ten is really much of a threat, except perhaps Maria on grass.

DragonFlame
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:29 PM
You could, I guess, being a Justine fan conclude that she will dominate for the next few years since no one in the top ten is really much of a threat, except perhaps Maria on grass.

but i'm not, cause i think it's all big talk and a load of crap with nothing hinting in that way untill now.
I do think she has been the best player untill now this year(by best results) but that doesn't mean 'her stage is set' for dominating.

what other arguments then the williams sisters won the most grandslams since 2000 do you have that actually make a hint at them dominating?

i'm asking this in a friendly way, if you're trying to get in a good discussion :)

sfselesfan
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:34 PM
untill...untill...grandslams...good discussion :)

Let's wait "until" you separate "grand" from "slam" before we get into a "good discussion..."

SF

vwfan
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:36 PM
but i'm not, cause i think it's all big talk and a load of crap with nothing hinting in that way untill now.
I do think she has been the best player untill now this year(by best results) but that doesn't mean 'her stage is set' for dominating.

what other arguments then the williams sisters won the most grandslams since 2000 do you have that actually make a hint at them dominating?

i'm asking this in a friendly way, if you're trying to get in a good discussion :)
The williams haven't dominated since they both left the tour after Wimbledon 2003 with career threatening injuries.

I don't have any arguments for their domination. I just know that there is no one in the top ten who I think they can't beat consistently if they were able to return to their pre-injury form.

Will they? I don't know.

Lenafan
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:38 PM
Providing she keeps her head and with a little more experience, I think stage is set for Kuznetsova to be a perennial Grand Slam contender on all surfaces. Even in French, she had match point against Henin last year and had a solid shot this year. Last year, Henin said she knew Kuznetsova would choke. I would guess with more experience she will be able to pull out the tight matches like she did this year in the French. She froze like most people would do against Henin in the French, but her confidence is growing, she's young, and that's scary for the other women out there. Not saying she's going to win a ton of GS' but I see her going deep into many Grand Slams. And just to clarify, I am not a fan of hers at all.

DragonFlame
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:45 PM
The williams haven't dominated since they both left the tour after Wimbledon 2003 with career threatening injuries.

I don't have any arguments for their domination. I just know that there is no one in the top ten who I think they can't beat consistently if they were able to return to their pre-injury form.

Will they? I don't know.

ok, there is nothing to discuss then...

manu32
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:50 PM
why pierce and dementieva in the top ten???

sfselesfan
Jun 14th, 2006, 11:52 PM
why pierce and dementieva in the top ten???

Pierce made it to the finals of the US Open and the YEC.

SF

Justine Fan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:12 AM
Each of the top ten has performed well at at least one slam. Six out of ten have won a slam. But only Justine has repeated at a slam and is the only one to defend her Grand Slam title. Not one really stands out other than Justine for future slam success. Odds are Kim or Maria.

Who else will break out with slam win?

Amelia (F, W Aus Open)
Clijsters (F, W U. S. Open)
Justine (3x champ RG)
Maria (W, SF Wimbledon)
Petrova (2x SF RG)
Kutznetsova (W U.S. Open)
Davenport (W, 2 Fs, Wimbledon)
Pierce (W, F, RG)
Dementieva (F, SF, U.S. Open)
Schynder (SF, 2QF, Aus Open)

I say the stage is set for a Williams sister comeback in 2007. Since 2000, they have won more GS titles than the entire top ten combined: 11 vs. 10!

Either my maths are incorrect or yours are:

Amelie = 1 slam
Kim = 1 slam
Justine = 5 slams
Kuzzy = 1 slam
Maria = 1 slam
Davenport = 3 slams
Pierce = 2 slams
Total: 15

Where did you get your figures from? So how come mine are different from yours? :confused:

DragonFlame
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:15 AM
Where did you get your figures from? So how come mine are different from yours? :confused:

since 2000 ;) he's wrong though, it's 11-11 :p

justine-5
kim-1
lindsay-1
mary-1
maria-1
svetlana-1
amelie-1

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:26 AM
since 2000 ;) he's wrong though, it's 11-11 :p

justine-5
kim-1
lindsay-1
mary-1
maria-1
svetlana-1
amelie-1

you're right. I forgot Lindsay's Aus Open in 2000. It's 11=11

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:27 AM
Some of us have said the same thing about 2004, 2005 and 2006. At this point, I'd much rather see it than talk about it.fair enough.

sfselesfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:28 AM
Where did you get your figures from? So how come mine are different from yours? :confused:

Since 2000! The numbers are off by one, but he clearly prefaced "since 2000."

Personally, I don't think it's an important stat.

I think the most important thing it demonstrates is how diverse the women's field has become.

SF

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:32 AM
ok, there is nothing to discuss then...well, there's plenty to discuss. i know you're not saying williams domination or not is the only topic worthy of discussion. for example,

will sharapova get another slam, she's been in the SF of three of the four.

dementieva consistently underperforms at slams, except interestingly at the U.S. Open, where she has a F, and 2 SF.

can mauremso hold on to her title, if not whose the biggest threat.

will venus or hingis knock someone out of the top ten by bagging another slam?

can petrova get to a final, let alone win one?

will davenport get back in the hunt? best chance, i'd say is probably australian open.

Justine Fan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:42 AM
since 2000 ;) he's wrong though, it's 11-11 :p

justine-5
kim-1
lindsay-1
mary-1
maria-1
svetlana-1
amelie-1

That's why I was :confused: ... I knew it was either even or ahead. I forgot about the 2000.

Lenafan
Jun 15th, 2006, 12:44 AM
The Sharapova question is an interesting one. Last year, she lost to all 4 potential champions which is impressive. Still she has one GS and while young after her tough loss to Serena in AO, she was outplayed badly by Clijsters, Henin, and Venus in her losses.

If Vaidisova had played like she did in 2004, she might have had her first GS at 17 and already get the huge endorsement opportunities she will get one day.

Furthermore and I hate getting into who is the best Russian debates since there is so much career left for so many of the players involved in the conversation, but facts are that Kuznetsova has one major and one final. Sharapova has one GS. Things fell very good for both Kuznetsova and Sharapova in the GS's they won. Lindsay got hurt and Lena had nothing to give in the US Open final.

Similarly, Sharapova was the benificiary of a lengthy rain delay against Lindsay and while she played brilliantly in the final, Serena was coming off a knee injury. Stars aligned for both and Sharapova's GS' performance have descended since. She also won the 2004 YEC and she lost in semis last year. Credit to both for taking advantage of situation when they could. The Wimbledon victory did 2 things.

1) Give Sharapova ridiculous endorsement deals
2) Create unrealistic expectations for her

Sharapova will only get better in the fitness department and movement and seems to understand her weaknesses and work on them. It's an important tournament for Sharapova and she knows it. In her interviews, she seems to understand that her best tennis is in the future. And Yuri may be a nut job, but there seems to be a purpose in her practice sessions before her matches unlike a lot of players.

Still, she has won a very high percentage of her matches on grass and it seems Wimbledon is her favorite tournament so the pressure is definitely on her, not as much as it was on Kim to win US last year, but still quite a bit of pressure for someone who will have plenty of chances to win Wimbledon. Fair or not, she will take the kind of criticism Kim is currently getting if she doesn't win Wimbledon especially if she loses to someone like Petrova. Remember Kim has one the US and lost to the eventual champion in her next 2 tournaments and is being written off by some "experts". Will be interesting to see what happens.

DragonFlame
Jun 15th, 2006, 01:08 AM
well, there's plenty to discuss. i know you're saying williams domination or not is the only topic worthy of discussion. for example,

will sharapova get another slam, she's been in the SF of three of the four.

dementieva consistently underperforms at slams, except interestingly at the U.S. Open, where she has a F, and 2 SF.

can mauremso hold on to her title, if not whose the biggest threat.

will venus or hingis knock someone out of the top ten but bagging another slam?

can petrova get to a final, let alone win one?

will davenport get back in the hunt? best chance, i'd say is probably australian open.

owh you're more leaning to that idea of this thread :) and no i don't think williamsdomination is the only worthy topic :p even if it may seemed that way ugh :o

hmm ok, a short review

wimbledon- favourites
obviously the main favourites are venus and maria.(linday if she is healthy and plays as well). Their best surface is grass and it suits their games really well. It will be interesting how quick svetlana's and justine's games will adapt to the grass courts and how far they will get. They both have the stuff to do well at grass.
Yes i think justine is a candidate for the title, not only because i'm a fan. Justine is mentally really strong and always grows in a tournament, when she gets into the second week she's a dangerous opponent. She has good volleyskills and can chip-and-charge really well. Her serve has been improving a lot and is a lot better then last year because she doesn't have any minor injury's. Her serve helped her a lot at RG this year and this should have even a greater effect on grass courts.

Kim can always get far in draws and can play great on grass, lets see what will happen.
Right now i don't now what to think of amelie, i don't know how she will do. She had great results at wimbledon but i doubt it if she can pull it off in the end.

Other then these i don't see anyone else winning wimbledon. I want to know how nicole will do though, she's an interesting spice into the mix.

Rest of the Year:

hopefully ElenaD can finally get away of that barrier and serve at least half decent to get that slamwin. I want her to take it badly but i'm doubting she ever will :o :sad:
I think Lindsay will retire sometime this year.
I'm doubting if serena will return... i hope she does though, it's always more fond having the biggest players up against eachother. I'm so looking forward seeing matches between serena, venus, justine, kim and a few others.

Usopen:

It's really open here, don't know what to think. anyone can take it now.
Kuznetsova, henin, williamssisters, clijsters, dementieva(she's stronger at the open somehow), Lindsay

YEC i expect some people to not show up justine and venus maybe.. although i want justine to win that YEC title eventually too though.

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 02:28 AM
well, let's talk about the two other champions lingering outside the top ten.

First, Venus:

if Venus hits her stride by getting into the second week of Wimbledon and
if Venus can manage not to get injured/ill during the hardcourt season as she has been every year since 2003 and get some hardcourt tournaments in

. . .then she could go into the U.S. Open a favorite.

I'd like her to end the year inside the top ten and play the YEC. She'll have to play in the fall, a part of the year she generally avoids.

Please Venus stay injury free for the rest of the year!

and well Hingis:

if Hingis can get a decent showing at Wimbledon (I don't expect her to be in contention) and
if she can go into the hardcourt season, play a few Tier 2s and maybe one Tier one, she could get another title. I don't expect her to get past the QF at either Wimbledon or U.S. Open, but playing fairly consistent tennis (as she normally does),

. . .then I expect her to re-enter the top ten by the end of the year.

If both enter the top ten, two will leave. My votes: Dementieva and Mary.

spencercarlos
Jun 15th, 2006, 02:56 AM
you draw your conclusions, I draw mine. ok?

You could, I guess, being a Justine fan conclude that she will dominate for the next few years since no one in the top ten is really much of a threat, except perhaps Maria on grass.
Again ridiculous, wishful and out of sorts of conclusions, especially when we know that the domination of the WS are years behind already.

And yet another ridiculous threaD, especially when you look at the list of the top ten and see that Henin already caught on Venusīs slam winning count, and have REAL chances to get more than a injured player and a player that has 0 titles for the year, and 1 GS win in the last 4 and a half years. :lol: enough said.

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:08 AM
Again ridiculous, wishful and out of sorts of conclusions, especially when we know that the domination of the WS are years behind already.

And yet another ridiculous threat, especially when you look at the list of the top ten and see that Henin already caught on Venusīs slam winning count, and have REAL chances to get more than a injured player and a player that has 0 titles for the year, and 1 GS win in the last 4 and a half years. :lol: enough said.what are you talking about? oh yeah, nothing.

and by the way, there is an option if you think this is a ridiculous threa(d), ignore.

now, back to the discussion.

here is my best guestimate of the rest of the year results for the top ten.

Mauresmo (Wimbledon SF, Open QF)
Clijsters (Wimbedon QF, Open SF)
Justine (Wimbledon 4th round, Open 4th round)
Maria (Wimbledon F, Open SF)
Petrova (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)
Mary (Wimbledon DNP, Open 4th round)
Davenport (Wimbledon DNP/SF, Open F)
Kutzie (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)
Patty (Wimbledon 3rd round, Open 4th round)
Dementieva (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)

spencercarlos
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:18 AM
what are you talking about? oh yeah, nothing.

and by the way, there is an option if you think this is a ridiculous threa(d), ignore.

now, back to the discussion.

here is my best guestimate of the rest of the year results for the top ten.

Mauresmo (Wimbledon SF, Open QF)
Clijsters (Wimbedon QF, Open SF)
Justine (Wimbledon 4th round, Open 4th round)
Maria (Wimbledon F, Open SF)
Petrova (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)
Mary (Wimbledon DNP, Open 4th round)
Davenport (Wimbledon DNP/SF, Open F)
Kutzie (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)
Patty (Wimbledon 3rd round, Open 4th round)
Dementieva (Wimbledon 4th round, Open QF)
I will add another notable and impossible to lose result for the rest of the year slams:

Venus (Wimbledon WIN, Usopen WIN)
Hingis (Wimbledon 1R, Usopen 1R)

:lol:
:wavey:

MistyGrey
Jun 15th, 2006, 04:05 AM
Mary's RG record should be (W 2xF). She was a runnerup twice.

spencercarlos
Jun 15th, 2006, 04:45 AM
Mary's RG record should be (W 2xF). She was a runnerup twice.
No it does not count, because you have to make Lindsay look greater in order to make Venusīs win bigger. Had Lindsay faced another oponnent in the GS finals she would have 10 by now remmember?
Lord "i know Venus will win everything because of past results" VWFAN knows better than everybody else. :lol:
:wavey:

Aaron.
Jun 15th, 2006, 05:14 AM
No it does not count, because you have to make Lindsay look greater in order to make Venusīs win bigger. Had Lindsay faced another oponnent in the GS finals she would have 10 by now remmember?
Lord "i know Venus will win everything because of past results" VWFAN knows better than everybody else. :lol:
:wavey:you lot still going at it :rolleyes:

faboozadoo15
Jun 15th, 2006, 06:38 AM
she was outplayed badly by Clijsters, Henin, and Venus in her losses.

she lost 6-3 in the third against clijsters and 6-4 in the third against henin. both were majors where she was coming in off an injury.
venus is the only one who "outplayed her badly" if you would call it that.

In The Zone
Jun 15th, 2006, 06:57 AM
she lost 6-3 in the third against clijsters and 6-4 in the third against henin. both were majors where she was coming in off an injury.
venus is the only one who "outplayed her badly" if you would call it that.

The French Open quarterfinal against Henin-Hardenne was in straights, not 6-4 in the third.

All this talk and few conclusions.

One conclusion is that no one doubts Venus' validity on the grass at Wimbledon.
Let's face it. Unless Venus gets healthy, she will not be a threat anywhere else but Wimbledon.

As for Justine. No one can discredit her for defeating a weak field or draw. She shows up, plays hard and finds ways to win when playing 45% [ at the French, she probably played 30% at best. Disgusting Grand slam in my opinion. ]

Hopefully Wimbledon can bring some great matches. Maria, Kim -- fight Venus and Justine please. :]

pigam
Jun 15th, 2006, 08:35 AM
The French Open quarterfinal against Henin-Hardenne was in straights, not 6-4 in the third.

All this talk and few conclusions.

One conclusion is that no one doubts Venus' validity on the grass at Wimbledon.
Let's face it. Unless Venus gets healthy, she will not be a threat anywhere else but Wimbledon.

As for Justine. No one can discredit her for defeating a weak field or draw. She shows up, plays hard and finds ways to win when playing 45% [ at the French, she probably played 30% at best. Disgusting Grand slam in my opinion. ]

Hopefully Wimbledon can bring some great matches. Maria, Kim -- fight Venus and Justine please. :]

well yeah, but for all those people talking about Justine's weak draw, what will they say if their fav wins a GS? that the competition was fierce, proabbly!

Justine beat Masha, Lindsay, Kim, Petrova, Serena, Myskina, Kuznetsova, Pierce, Capriati, Schnyder, ... for her GS titles!! Who else COULD she have beaten! Are they suck weak players? Why still watch women's tennis then? :shrug:

This isn't intended at you personnaly.

just a general observation. getting a bit sick and tired of all those "weak field" blabla whenever your fav doesn't win!!

xin_hui
Jun 15th, 2006, 08:46 AM
she lost 6-3 in the third against clijsters and 6-4 in the third against henin. both were majors where she was coming in off an injury.
venus is the only one who "outplayed her badly" if you would call it that.

sharapova? 6-4 in the 3rd against JHH? :confused: it was 4-6 2-6 against JHH at RG2005. nowhere did it go to a 3rd set ;) she was never in contention in that match. and frankly, she was never quite in contention in the USO semis as well. she had a glimmer of hope after she won the 2nd set, but all went bust once kim stormed to a 4-0 lead in the 3rd

*i realise you are talking about AO2006. but lenafan was referring to RG2005 ;)

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 02:56 PM
Mary's RG record should be (W 2xF). She was a runnerup twice.ok. sorry, I've made the change.

vwfan
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:00 PM
you lot still going at it :rolleyes:nope! i'm bored with him now.

LUIS9
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:14 PM
well, there's plenty to discuss. i know you're saying williams domination or not is the only topic worthy of discussion. for example,

will sharapova get another slam, she's been in the SF of three of the four.

dementieva consistently underperforms at slams, except interestingly at the U.S. Open, where she has a F, and 2 SF.

can mauremso hold on to her title, if not whose the biggest threat.

will venus or hingis knock someone out of the top ten but bagging another slam?

can petrova get to a final, let alone win one?

will davenport get back in the hunt? best chance, i'd say is probably australian open.

Dementieva is a special case. She's sort of like Safin very unpredictable. She fights but I still think she can't deal with the pressure at the slams with her weak second serve and all those double faults.

Yeah Davenport and Pierce too are still in the top ten because of their great seasons in 2005. Both are currently MIO but I am sure if both were even semi- healthy they would still produce better results than Schnyder's erratic season. They'd probably be more consistent than Dementieva too.

madame_maria
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:47 PM
well while i think it's alright and perhaps quite fun to do the predictions and everything, evaluating the players based on their histories and everything. i don't really think it matters. i'd like to believe that ultimately these players want to view their respective careers as successful.

i wouldn't be surprise if any of the Williams sisters, or Lindsay, or Pierce hang up their racquets now and say "Alright, I'm retiring." think about it, they've had illustrious careers, successful ones WITHOUT a doubt. they've won perhaps a lot more than they'd ever lose. at some point in time, they'd probably won a slam, completed a grand slam, beat the world no.1 or did something they didn't think they'd do. you've got to hand it to them and not consistently asking and wondering if they'd come back and they'd dominate. cause there's really no point in doing so.

the "relatively" younger players (in terms of their careers) right now, perhaps yes they have something to prove and something to live up to. when Serena won her very very first title, did anyone think she'd own the Serena Slam like she did? how respectable is that. Maria, Svetlana and perhaps even Kim and Amelie. they've done relatively a lot in their careers and you wouldn't expect every players career to last as long as perhaps, Mary Pierce. you just can't.

why is there this constant need to compare and measure greatness? there isn't a need to say oh _____ is greater than _____ because she won more slams, won more matches etc. they've all accomplished something in their careers. some perhaps MORE than others. they've all had successful careers. SMILE :) and let's be happy for them.

eugreene2
Jun 15th, 2006, 03:59 PM
Two Words - SERENA WILLIAMS!!!

Er'body & their mamas know she is still the best - That's why Navratilova, Evert, Bud, Carillo, Mary Joe, etc. etc. etc. keep talking about her.

AND WHEN SHE COMES BACK ... LAWD JESUS!

Justine Fan
Jun 15th, 2006, 07:15 PM
nope! i'm bored with him now.

I'd say it was the other way around .... SC is bored with you.

You're like a broken record ... you go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on!

Get it? Good!

vwfan
Jun 16th, 2006, 01:38 AM
I'd say it was the other way around .... SC is bored with you.

You're like a broken record ... you go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on!

Get it? Good!ok. teddie bear! :lol:

sfselesfan
Jun 16th, 2006, 01:43 AM
you go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on!

Get it? Good!

Now if that ain't the pot callin' the kettle black!

SF

Hingiswinsthis
Jun 16th, 2006, 01:56 AM
Congrats to Justine, a clear stand out in the top 10 ;-)

I think why people get pissed off at Justine's success is because they rarely see her in the early rounds of the majors and shows up on tv only in the semis and finals and wins them! Then people turn off their tv's and say "where the hell did she come from?" She's not here to make "movies" as she says (lol Justine...hilarious) she's here to end other player's dreams of stealing any of her potential grand slams ;-)

Any who...

Venus will win Wimbledon. RG set the stage for her. She is hungry once again, she just needs to watch out for those darn teeny bopper pretenders lurking in her draw.

For Hingis, I laugh at those who say she will win a major this year. As much as I am loving her comeback, I believe in 2007 she will...by then she had already dissected everyone's game on tour, save Serena and Capriati. She'll be sharper next year.

These two will bump out 2 undeserving top tenners within the next couple of months...