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View Full Version : Sorry guys, but what happened today...


Alenyaa
Jun 27th, 2005, 10:39 PM
... was really unacceptable.

Guys... I have to say some of your reactions considering Elenaís loss really surprised me. What happened to the "Lena's already reached the fourth round on her least favourite surface" and "a loss vs Nastya won't mean the end of the world"? I'm kind of disappointed in you guys for reacting like this...

Yes, I know Lena should have won this in two sets with the MP's in the tiebreak, but the way some of you reacted was rather appalling to me and certainly to others here as well. Not to mention unacceptable. To be a fan of someone means you stick with him or her no matter what the circumstances are, and that is not what you did. I can really understand that you guys are upset and disappointed by this result, but this is not the way to express your frustration. Being a fan of Elena means you support her every time no matter what. No matter whether she wins or loses, no matter whether she serves well or double faults, no matter whether she lives up to your expectations or fails to meet them. You stand by her NO MATTER WHAT! That's what being a true fan is about. After RG I thought everybody here got that, but apparently I was mistaken...
And if you think you cannot handle that, then maybe you should reconsider your presence here...

And now think about what this means to our reputation on the board here. Any other member that comes down here will now think we are a bunch of very, VERY bad losers. Because it aren't my or Evin's or Northa's posts they'll remember, but it will be the bad posts some of you posted here that will be remembered and which will be talked about.
Being a decent fan of someone means you express your frustration in a mild manner, not in the way some of you did today.

I myself also find it too bad she lost, certainly given the possibilities she had, but thatís life! I know I shouldnít be saying t o much because I myself too made kind of a bad post after her loss against Kim at Indian Wells or Amelia Island (The one where she lost in the semis), but at least I learn from my mistakes and certainly you could have learned from mine as well.

This is the first time since my joining here that you disappoint me, guys. Donít make that happen again.

(Please bear in mind that I am not visualising anyone here, this is just a general point I'm making here.)

hablo
Jun 27th, 2005, 10:50 PM
"To be a fan of someone means you stick with him or her no matter what the circumstances are, and that is not what you did. "

:worship:

I wouldn't worry about reputation (of Lena fans) on this board though :shrug:

there are always some bad apples ;)

Alenyaa
Jun 27th, 2005, 11:06 PM
Well Hablovah, maybe I shouldn't, but this is not helping to put across a good image of Dementieva-fans anyway...

Dementinator
Jun 27th, 2005, 11:21 PM
well I agree with ya Alenyaa 100% ,unfortunately things got a little out of hand ,I may have been one of the worst offenders ,but was provoked my Hant ,no excuse ,but I agreee ,that of course we always stick with Lena 100% which is why sometimes people get annoyed ,we care so much about her ,looking back at her match today I see lots of posatives (hell I sound like Tim Henman now!!) she served pretty good only got 3 dfs and was the better player until the very last game!

The nature of the defeat kinda made it hard to swallow ,Lena had MPs but there we go thats tennis!

Alenyaa
Jun 27th, 2005, 11:27 PM
well I agree with ya Alenyaa 100% ,unfortunately things got a little out of hand ,I may have been one of the worst offenders ,but was provoked my Hant ,no excuse ,but I agreee ,that of course we always stick with Lena 100% which is why sometimes people get annoyed ,we care so much about her ,looking back at her match today I see lots of posatives (hell I sound like Tim Henman now!!) she served pretty good only got 3 dfs and was the better player until the very last game!

The nature of the defeat kinda made it hard to swallow ,Lena had MPs but there we go thats tennis!
I know you got provoqued, but as said I did not visualise anyone in particular. :)

evinrude15
Jun 27th, 2005, 11:36 PM
Alenyaa what you say you know that I behind you ;)

Alenyaa
Jun 27th, 2005, 11:57 PM
Yeah, your post inspired me to create this thread :)

Fearful Jesuit
Jun 28th, 2005, 12:41 AM
oh, I only posted like something out of a priest :angel:

Alenyaa
Jun 28th, 2005, 12:53 AM
? What you mean?

Fearful Jesuit
Jun 28th, 2005, 01:04 AM
just read what I write after the match :angel:

Alenyaa
Jun 28th, 2005, 01:33 AM
I see, sorry I forgot ya!

selyoink
Jun 28th, 2005, 03:49 AM
Excellent post Alyenaa. I agree with your sentiments 100%

Lena has great fans and this was just a bad day for many of them. I don't anticipate it happening again.

Alenyaa
Jun 28th, 2005, 03:54 AM
Neither do I. They're all good guys here. :)

lovlenad
Jun 28th, 2005, 04:35 AM
Excellent post Alyenaa. I agree with your sentiments 100%

Lena has great fans and this was just a bad day for many of them. I don't anticipate it happening again.
just read your posts before the match i dont think you are a REAL Lena fan!!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Alenyaa
Jun 28th, 2005, 05:06 AM
LOL, who's Lana? :p

lovlenad
Jun 28th, 2005, 05:08 AM
sorry...OUR LENA...

Alenyaa
Jun 28th, 2005, 05:16 AM
Hehe :p

Dementinator
Jun 28th, 2005, 09:13 AM
just read your posts before the match i dont think you are a REAL Lena fan!!! :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


Nikto is a Nastya fan first and a Lena second ,so hes more than entitled to obviously support Nastya,hes welcome here and an honorary memeber ,I am sure he would have prefered they coulda both won that match but alas someone had to lose ,Lena only really lost on the last game ,until then she was the better player ,but Nastya has been due a big win really and if it makes her mother happy then good,Lena will have her chances .

Nastyafan dont worry we aint pissed at NAstya all she did was win ,its annoying she seems to have a hold over a player who I genuinely believe can play better tennis,but things are not always as cut and dried ,we are fond of Nasty too ,at least when shes not playing the golden goddess!

selyoink
Jun 28th, 2005, 12:52 PM
Captain is right. Myskina is my favorite player followed by Lena D. I was very upset that they had to play each other especially so early in the draw. I wanted Nastya to win of course but I was still gutted for Lena D.

So I am a Lena D. fan.

Dementinator
Jun 28th, 2005, 01:04 PM
we know you are!

~Dementievaitis~
Jun 28th, 2005, 01:41 PM
Since RG, many have discussed what TRUE FAN is. But how can we 'define' it into 1 definition? We all have different definitions on the words 'true fan'. Iim not sure if I like ppl trying to define and use the word TRUE FAN. It only provokes agrument and seems to seperate all of us ---- all of us who are supposed to believers of Elena. I guess everyone here is what so-called 'TRUE FAN' of Elena.

The word 'disappoint', moreover, is a too heavy, strong and negative word. Everyone has the right to express its own opinions. How can we have the superior aythority to dissapoint and desprise someone's opinion, judging someine's post is bad post. I think words like gd pt but ... is far more comfortable, and with respect. No matter if u are talikng about me and someone else or just for this post, I guess the tone and words used give me a feeling of disrespect. WE are on the same GROUP.

THEY may understand or even define us as bad losers. However, do WE need THEM to judge and define whether Elena's fans are bad losers or not? WE know WE aren't bad losers!

I'm not trying to provoke a debate and plx don't turn into one. I love everyone who supports Elena no matter what you like to express, all dear buddies :)

Dementinator
Jun 28th, 2005, 02:28 PM
yes ,agreed ,I like to think Lenas fans are like the girl herself !

miffedmax
Jun 28th, 2005, 02:52 PM
Guys, you can be angry, frustrated, and disappointed in a person or a team and still love them, i.e. be a fan.

In fact, you have to be a fan to have any kind of emotional response at all. I find it a little worrisome that for the 3rd time in a row Lena has put the sweet in the Sweet 16, only to crash out after being very well-positioned to move into the quarterfinals with draws that actually looked good for her. Yes, making the Rnd of 16 is a great accomplishment and better than falling in the first round. But it's not as good as being a finalist.

The people expressing negative emotions are simply being honest, and if they didn't have a passion for Lena and the sport of tennis they wouldn't be here (aside from a few obvious trolls who show up more in GM than here). Unlike my prez, I don't think "you're either for us or against us." One can be "for" Lena and be worried about her service problems, apparent mental fragility, the relationship with Mommy Vera, the relationship with Olga, the one with Maxim and how any or all of them is affecting her play. If you can't vent with your fellow fans, who can you vent with?

The bottom line is we all know Lena is the best and we want her to prove it.

JC Federer
Jun 28th, 2005, 04:43 PM
Do you have to be blind to be a "true" fan? I love her with all my heart, but it's simple and understandable: Appauling reactions to an appauling loss.

I'm not sure if you saw the match or not, but if you did, I think you'd understand.

That doesn't mean I'm no longer a fan, or that I'll stop supporting her, but things like this happen. You can take positives out of something bad, but some things you just can't unless you're a blind fan. This match against Myskina, and the French Open final against her are examples. Being beaten by a better player is one thing, and should be taken positively, without shame and credit given where due (like that US Open loss to Sveta), but beating yourself is hard to excuse. Even worse so when you should have won. Myskina played poorly and should not have won the match. But she sensed weakness, and took advantage of it. The serve definately got worse as the match went on, and the way Myskina was able to punish it on match point is evidence of weakness on the big points. When you are up 6-1 3-0 double break, and your opponent has hit over 40 errors at that point, you would expect the match to be in the bag. Any other result is unthinkable.

It was a battle of nerves like always, and I feel she has a ways to go before she can master those nerves and win the big matches. I would have been happy if Myskina was too good and just thrashed her, but that wasn't the case.

Still a fan, but a critical one.

P.S. Another similarly dubious match that happened recently was Sveta's loss to JHH at RG. I wasn't here at the time to see the reactions, but if I was a Sveta fan, I would similarly have been unimpressed. Same goes for Sveta's loss to Myskina last year at RG. And Myskina's loss to JHH in Athens. Do they teach Mental Toughness 101 in Russia I wonder? :confused: JHH seems to have it in spades.

Lollipop
Jun 28th, 2005, 05:25 PM
hmmm, nice thread. i agree.

TennisNick
Jun 29th, 2005, 02:55 AM
I don't normally post here, but I figured I would stop lurking and give my thoughts. I am a more recent fan of Lena than most - I did not start to really admire her until last year, starting around the time she took apart Mauresmo at RG. Although I had known about her since she started on tour, I don't think I had paid attention during enough of her matches to appreciate her game before last year.

In any case, aside from having arguably the best and most consistent groundstrokes when she is on her game, I believe Lena IS in fact very mentally strong in her matches - it's one of the reasons I enjoy rooting for her so much. Was she so nervous she could not play in the RG final? Absolutely... but this to me is not a sign of some ongoing mental weakness, it's expected that you will be nervous in your first major final, especially when playing against a close friend! Name me a player that was not nervous in his or her first final. Some found a way to deal with it, some didn't. Just because you didn't deal well the first time doesn't mean you won't figure it out the next time.
Do they teach Mental Toughness 101 in Russia I wonder? :confused: JHH seems to have it in spades.

But as recently as a few years ago JHH was labeled a "choker", and routinely lost matches when she was far ahead. She turned that around. Every player has matches they blew or choked for no great reason - Serena, Venus, Davenport, Sharapova, every single one of them. That does not make them mentally weak unless they do it all the time.

Take last year's US Open quarters against Mauresmo. Lena pulled out an incredibly tough match 7-6 in the third. Semifinals against Capriati? Same thing. How many times was she down in those matches? How many times did she double fault, lose serve, or miss huge chances? She was able to overcome all of that, and only a flawless match by Kuznetsova kept her from being USO champion. I think she learned from her RG experience and was much less nervous the next time around, which is a good sign. And those matches are not isolated examples, Lena always fights extremely hard until the last point no matter what the score. She is not Marat Safin, who just calls it a day if he is not in the right mood - that to me is mental weakness.

Yes, Lena was up a set and a break, but we all know breaks mean nothing when Lena and Nastya play each other. And it's not like she blew a 5-0 40-0 lead is it? I did not get to watch the match but I'm guessing it got close and Nastya played better on the key points. It happens. It's probably tough for them to play each other, so you would expect shifts in momentum like that. It's not like Lena went down 0-6 0-6 to some random nobody. Besides, I doubt even Lena expected to win Wimbledon while still trying to work on a new serve.

Certainly, I am disappointed she lost. But I don't think this is a bad sign in any way for the future. I'm sure she'll rebound and do well during the hardcourt season.

Dementinator
Jun 29th, 2005, 09:59 AM
Welcome abaord! tennis nick! a good post indeed and full of truths ,this thread as really brought out some great replies ,all of them carry weight ,I tend to think Lenas problem is not a lack of mental toughness but simply she loses focus sometimes and away goes the set ,match ,game etc a lot of players do ,they ARE only human.

The myski match was incredibly close indeed ,really the last game was the thing ,Lena strung a few errors together and that was that. Hardly anything between them.

A good example of just how tough Lena CAN be was fed cup with Schiavone ,now I know people are gonna say she shouldnt have struggled ,but on red caly in home territory ,Schiavone was always gonna be tough ,shes a damn good clay player,Serena knows that ,Lena down a set and 1-4 I believe ,she fights her way to take second set then blows Schiavone out of the water in third ,THAT is toughness.

Its a fact that Lena sometimes struggles against certain players and Myskina is def one of them ,the sad thing really was watching Momo beat Myski ,I really felt that Lena coulda won that match ,Lena would attack Momos moonballs and slow backhand returns ,Myski did not.

Well lets try sum things up ,this year ,been some dissapointments BUT Lena has only gone out in one tourny in Round One ,Otherwise shes got pretty far ,Last year was first round loss after loss until RG and she bombed out at wimb too ,so there is def some improvements.

jacky90104
Jun 29th, 2005, 12:55 PM
Lenas :fiery: :fiery: :fiery:

Ronaldo777
Jun 29th, 2005, 03:01 PM
i agree on this thread.i hate when people get angry with elena after a loss.the way people talk its as if elena had lossed on purpose.i love a trier and if lena gives her best who are we to criticise.she feels worse than all of us

Dementinator
Jun 29th, 2005, 04:18 PM
dead right Ronaldo .easy for us to sit on our asses saying how Lena shoulda played ,have any of us performed on the major courts? got to world number 4? won millions of dollars? nope , and I can only imagine what the pressures must be like ,the main thing is Lena gives her all sometimes it goes right ,sometimes is does not ,but she never gives less than 100% and we canr really criticise her until we have reached levels like she has ,which aint happening!!heheheh but I guess its normal to analyse matches etc ,hindsight is a great thing!

Ronaldo777
Jun 29th, 2005, 04:36 PM
yeah it is capt.imagine this,hundreds of us sitting on our couches eating crisps and drinking coke and screaming advice at the best athletes in the world saying that serve needs a bit more on it or why did she play a drop shot there.its crazy lol.we get the benefit of replays etc.
sometimes you can overanalyse things.with a bit of luck,a net cord or something lena could have won.
but i say remember this.i think it was the second rd when lena won 8-6 in the 3rd set.she could have ;lost there so everything beyond that is a bonus.how quickly we forget things like that.
and plus how many thought getting to a qf was likely at the start.none.then why are people so angry.it was a good if not great effort to get this far and she lost to a top 10 player for gods sake not some hobo

Dementinator
Jun 29th, 2005, 04:43 PM
right again ,ya making a habit of this aint ya Ronaldo! "The Sage"