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getright
May 20th, 2005, 11:19 PM
Serena Withdraws From French Open


05/20/2005

Serena Williams started the season with a spirited sense of closure. Digging down deep to summon the competitive character she showed in dominating tennis, Williams fought back from deep deficits in the semifinals and final to claim her seventh career Grand Slam championship at the Australian Open. Since that stirring triumph, the former No. 1 has struggled to finish what she starts.


Now, the woman who has created so many compelling championship climaxes won't be around to begin the season's second Grand Slam. The fourth-ranked Williams withdrew from Roland Garros today citing the sprained left ankle she sustained in the Amelia Island quarterfinal against Silvia Farina Elia on April 8th. Since retiring from that match, Williams has played once — suffering a 7-6(2), 6-1 loss to Francesca Schiavone in Rome last week in a defeat she declared was her "worst loss."

"I just guess I had a really bad day today," Williams said after the match. "Just one of those days that just wasn't going to work. I made too many errors maybe, and I just didn't feel anything today. I mean, nothing came from my legs, or from my arms."

If Williams' body felt numbed by Novocain her will to win appeared euthanized by expectations. The most surprising development in Williams' season since she stretched her Melbourne winning streak to 14 matches is not the lack of a title, it's the fact that the woman who was once tennis' fiercest fighter has been so willing to toss in the towel.

Serena has played 13 matches since claiming the Australian Open crown and has either retired or conceded a walkover in three of those encounters.

The inferno of intensity that once burned within, sometimes seems flicker like the flame of a match-head in Serena, who seems to struggle to find motivation in non-majors lately.

The 2002 Roland Garros champion owns a 25-5 record on the red clay and has been both triumphant and tearful in Paris. In her victory over Venus in the 2002 final, Serena spoke a few words in French in her victory speech prompting a receptive roar from the crowd. The following year, six points separated Williams from her fifth consecutive Grand Slam as the defending Roland Garros champion stepped up to serve holding a 4-2 lead in the third set of her compelling clash with Justine Henin-Hardenne, a singles semifinal showdown suddenly got very crowded.

Jeering Williams' correct questioning of inaccurate line calls and cheering her errors, some French fans forced their collective will on the match and Williams could not stand up to a stadium. Unnerved by the hostile howls echoing in her ears, Williams concentration cracked, her level of play dipped and she bowed 6-2, 4-6, 7-5 to eventual-champion Henin-Hardenne.

Tournament play has not always been a prerequisite for success for Williams.

Serena has shown up at the Australian Open — this year — and at Wimbledon in her two title triumphs without playing a single warm-up event and still went on to win those majors. The problem is crafting clay-court success demands more than desire, grit and guts — qualities Serena exuded as easily as perspiration pouring from her pores Down Under — it takes a willingness to work and grind through points, rallies and matches and with only four clay-court matches to her credit this year Serena has to know she's simply not prepared to make any push in Paris even if her ankle was not an issue.

Her strength of spirit as become a parachute Williams has relied on to bail herself out of tight spots, but some observers believe it's time to cut that cord and commit herself to the off-court work necessary to fuel her full flight in tournament play.

"I guess what I'm worried about is she's grown too reliant upon that (fighting spirit)," ESPN tennis analyst Mary Carillo said in a conference call with the media earlier this week. "All right, 'If I want it enough, that should do it!" I think you can only go to that well so many times. That well runs dry on you. You cannot fake the funk on clay — you just can't. It's gotten to the point with the Williams sisters where I listen to what they say and then watch what they do."

When she's fit and fully focused, the 23-year-old Williams brings more than championship credentials to the game, she brings one of the most explosive and entertaining styles to the sport, she brings athleticism and she brings an abundance of attitude. At her best, Serena competes with the ruthlessness of a hard-core competitor shooting for a shutout. Clearly, she hasn't been at her best this year. She didn't play her top tennis in Australia, but she fought harder than everyone she faced.

Since then, Serena seems to be fighting herself more than the opposition.

The three-time Key Biscayne champion arrived at the Nasdaq-100 Open seeking to add seventh Key Biscayne crown to the Williams sisters collection, but instead looked distracted, unsettled and unfocused in yelling at herself and tossing her racquet around before falling to Venus for the first time since the since the 2001 U.S. Open final.

Since that March match, Serena's played only four times. Despite her Roland Garros withdrawal, Serena will retain her top 10 ranking following the French fortnight. She insists tennis is still her top priority, she just doesn't play enough to prove it.

"Back in the day when Richard Williams was first introducing his daughters to us all he was always talking about how they were going to be rich and famous and they were gonna be No. 1," Carillo said. "He never talked about them being great. He talked about the money a lot. Maybe those two have reached all their dreams. Maybe I'm looking for something that maybe they're (not). That's fine. I've gotta deal with it. Maybe my expectations and desires is different from what they hold on to."

The fact that both Venus and Serena have been willing to sacrifice parts of their tennis seasons to pursue college educations and careers in fashion and acting is admirable. In a day when many aspiring junior players drop out of high school to attend tennis academies and pound the court for hours at a time, the Williams sisters have always been smart enough to see that there's much more to life than batting a ball over a net. It's quite possible that like Andre Agassi — who was notorious for taking every other year off from top-level tennis early in his career — the Williams sisters' interests outside of tennis may actually prevent burnout prolong their careers in the long run.

They've always played tennis on their terms, and while they were once ahead of the curve the Williams sisters are no longer first to the finish. The challenge Venus and Serena face now is that it's becoming increasingly more difficult to write your name on title trophies when you can't even make a mark in tournament draws.

To be fair, if should Serena regain her health, conditioning and sustain a consistent schedule, will still be one of the top contenders for Wimbledon and the U.S. Open this year. But playing part-time tennis no longer translates to full-time success on the tour and a sport which was once a two-player game with Serena and Venus facing off in six of eight Grand Slam finals in a period from the 2001 U.S. Open to the 2003 Wimbledon, the game has gotten more crowded and the sisters are struggling to survive the squeeze.

"They were divvying up the spoils all by themselves and that was only a couple of years ago. And now we're wondering..." Carillo said. "Serena keeps telling us tennis is her No. 1 priority and then they kind of sound like their father these days. Richard was always talking about how he wanted them out of the game in their 20s. I still think that they should dominate and that they can dominate. The big question mark is is that what are they thinking? I think at a certain point you've gotta decide do you pull up your socks or go home? I'd love to see them decide that's what they want more than anything else and do all the requisite work to get back there."

Serena often characterizes herself as an entertainer rather than an athlete. In the past, she's been able to turn it on like a star stepping onto the stage and shining beneath a bright spotlight. Now, you have to begin to wonder if she's getting sick of the show.

spartanfan
May 20th, 2005, 11:50 PM
So where is the lenghty tennis article on Lleyton Hewint and Taylor Dent withdrawing from the FO? Or is it that only Serena gets scrutinized for withdrawing?

starr
May 20th, 2005, 11:51 PM
Interesting article. Thanks for posting it.

Diesel
May 21st, 2005, 12:11 AM
"Back in the day when Richard Williams was first introducing his daughters to us all he was always talking about how they were going to be rich and famous and they were gonna be No. 1," Carillo said. "He never talked about them being great. He talked about the money a lot. Maybe those two have reached all their dreams. Maybe I'm looking for something that maybe they're (not). That's fine. I've gotta deal with it. Maybe my expectations and desires is different from what they hold on to."


How disrespectful, but I didn't expect anything less. Definitely, Carillo needs to deal with it because what she's looking for is based on her own wishes that even if Serena reached them, wouldn't be good enough.

Regardless, missing this tournament can only have Serena be more hungry and motivated to recapture another slam and the place she feels is rightfully hers and that's the top.

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 12:12 AM
Carillo is such a bitch in this article. I really was enjoying the article until I read her part. It would of been alright without her dumb a#@ commentary. She basically calls the sisters liars, and claim they are only about money.

I wish I could slap that silly ho!:lol:

icequeen
May 21st, 2005, 12:17 AM
So where is the lenghty tennis article on Lleyton Hewint and Taylor Dent withdrawing from the FO? Or is it that only Serena gets scrutinized for withdrawing?

Thank you. We all know that Serena is a big crowd draw and she makes every tournament she plays in very exciting. Without her in a tournament it is as boring as hell. Any way your post is on target...like stinking shitrillo gives a damn about serena. She's a two-faced bitch...The way she talked about Serena at the AO she should never form her lips to mention Serena's name ever again. I have that old hag.

icequeen
May 21st, 2005, 12:20 AM
Who the hell cares about shitrillo expectations certainly not Venus or Serena. How dear she talk about her expectations of them she can't stand their guts neither can she stand Richard....she should think about her son and her own expectations for him and leave V&S to hell alone. Does she realized that they do not pay her any attention..why would one keep harping on two young ladies who does not give a damn whether she lives or dies. That woman is truly an idiot.

icequeen
May 21st, 2005, 12:22 AM
Carillo is such a bitch in this article. I really was enjoying the article until I read her part. It would of been alright without her dumb a#@ commentary. She basically calls the sisters liars, and claim they are only about money.

I wish I could slap that silly ho!:lol:


She's not even worth that slap harloo.

icequeen
May 21st, 2005, 12:25 AM
Carillo is such a bitch in this article. I really was enjoying the article until I read her part. It would of been alright without her dumb a#@ commentary. She basically calls the sisters liars, and claim they are only about money.

I wish I could slap that silly ho!:lol:

If they were only about money they would be playing in a tournament every week. The woman is nothing but a dick.

No Name Face
May 21st, 2005, 12:51 AM
Carillo's a bitch...she's just pissed off that Serena can still beat Sharapova through her fighting spirit alone. Forgive the girls for wanting to be more than just tennis players. They've proved their greatness, which is more than can be said for the rest of the active WTA. When someone surpasses the amount of GS titles Venus has, then Carillo has the right to say about half of the stuff she said.

mykarma
May 21st, 2005, 01:02 AM
Carillo is such a bitch in this article. I really was enjoying the article until I read her part. It would of been alright without her dumb a#@ commentary. She basically calls the sisters liars, and claim they are only about money.

I wish I could slap that silly ho!:lol: Don't we all work for the money. I don't think her sorry azz is traveling all over the world for free.

tennnisfannn
May 21st, 2005, 01:03 AM
isn't she the same one who was quoted as saying that you can only win the FO if you understand the game, serena has already done that. So now she doesn't get it?
Serena is a seven time grand slam winner which makes her a real champion, she also understand you don't have to risk further injury at every single tourny. Look what myskina is enduring, is that bravery, playing alot of tennis with that shoulder and going nowhere, rather than resting it up so she can play the beautiful tennis we know she can.
If venus and serena were only after money and not greatness, they would be in every tourny singles and doubles, they would be having the kim sort of 2003 schedule.

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 01:14 AM
If they were only about money they would be playing in a tournament every week. The woman is nothing but a dick.
Any moderately intellegent person knows that the tournament prize money is peanuts compared to endorsement money from big houses like Adidas or Nike.So your arfgument actually sinks on its own weight and it actually corroborates what the great Maryu Carillo says.
Cris Senior

RenaSlam.
May 21st, 2005, 01:15 AM
Fuck you Carillo. What a bitch she was in this article!

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 01:18 AM
Any moderately intellegent person knows that the tournament prize money is peanuts compared to endorsement money from big houses like Adidas or Nike.So your arfgument actually sinks on its own weight and it actually corroborates what the great Maryu Carillo says.
Cris Senior

Even though endorsement money far outweighs tournament prize money, who are you are Mary Carillo to make a false accusation based on a gut feeling? You or Carillo have no proof.:lol:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 01:27 AM
"The fact that both Venus and Serena have been willing to sacrifice parts of their tennis seasons to pursue college educations and careers in fashion and acting is admirable",says then article.
It makes you wonder what moron wrote this article.Unbelievable.First,what College have the sisters attended (not to speak of even High School)? Second,it is the other way round:they are abandoning the sacrifices and challenges a pro tennis career demands of necessity, for the blandness and spoiled comforts of fashion and acting.Now,they have their right to do so,but to call it "admirable" is outright cynical.
Finally,I remember their father Richard is on record saying that Venus is a talented business woman but Serena is in danger of becoming the dumbest athlete in the history of sports,"
Cris Senior

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 01:34 AM
"The fact that both Venus and Serena have been willing to sacrifice parts of their tennis seasons to pursue college educations and careers in fashion and acting is admirable",says then article.
It makes you wonder what moron wrote this article.Unbelievable.First,what College have the sisters attended (not to speak of even High School)? Second,it is the other way round:they are abandoning the sacrifices and challenges a pro tennis career demands of necessity, for the blandness and spoiled comforts of fashion and acting.Now,they have their right to do so,but to call it "admirable" is outright cynical.
Finally,I remember their father Richard is on record saying that Venus is a talented business woman but Serena is in danger of becoming the dumbest athlete in the history of sports,"
Cris Senior

It's admirable to many people, just not haters such as yourself.:tape: :lol:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 01:38 AM
Even though endorsement money far outweighs tournament prize money, who are you are Mary Carillo to make a false accusation based on a gut feeling? You or Carillo have no proof.:lol:
You are contradicting yourself. You just stated that 'endorsement money far outweights prize money".Now ,if you have a minimal education,you understand that this is a quantitative statement,i.e.,a matter of fact not a "gut feeling" .It is not a false accusation either because she is directly quoting Richard who is on the record stating this about their daughters.If it is not true then it is their father who is making the "false accusations".
Cris Senior

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 01:39 AM
Any moderately intellegent person knows that the tournament prize money is peanuts compared to endorsement money from big houses like Adidas or Nike.So your arfgument actually sinks on its own weight and it actually corroborates what the great Maryu Carillo says.
Cris Senior

You think Nike loves it that Serena withdraws from tournaments?? Sure they pay her through the endorsement contracts/money but if she doesn't play tournaments and have great tournament records they wouldn't even pick her in the first place. By playing tournaments (and especially slams) she not only gets tournament prize money (as well as endorsement money), but would make her endoresement companies happy as well. Now if Serena was REALLY after the money she would play tournaments left and right and be greedy for prize money and trying to make her companies happy (and if she wins a lot, would increase their pay).

So your argument doesn't really work either. :wavey:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 01:45 AM
It's admirable to many people, just not haters such as yourself.:tape: :lol:
Harloo keep the bimbo stuff to the privacy of your bedroom.No need to be obscene about your deficiencies.
Just because someone comments coherently and critically on human affairs does not mean they are "haters".Only celebrity enslaved,clueless people think like this!
Cris Senior

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 01:47 AM
You are contradicting yourself. You just stated that 'endorsement money far outweights prize money".Now ,if you have a minimal education,you understand that this is a quantitative statement,i.e.,a matter of fact not a "gut feeling" .It is not a false accusation either because she is directly quoting Richard who is on the record stating this about their daughters.If it is not true then it is their father who is making the "false accusations".
Cris Senior

Richard does not make all the decisions for Venus and Serena. Half of what comes out of his mouth is his own opinion and that's past and present. For Mary to use Richard's comments in the past to prove her flawed logic about the sisters today is unprofessional and nothing but speculation.

If you had a minimal education, you would realize that Richard is no longer responsible for the sisters decisions on the tennis court, therefore his comments from years ago have nothing to do with the state of the sister's game today.:rolleyes:

PhoenixStorm
May 21st, 2005, 01:48 AM
Mary Carillo is a sanctimonious bitch and she proves it in this article. Her desires? Her expectations? Who the hell is she? What did she achieve?

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 01:50 AM
Harloo keep the bimbo stuff to the privacy of your bedroom.No need to be obscene about your deficiencies.
Just because someone comments coherently and critically on human affairs does not mean they are "haters".Only celebrity enslaved,clueless people think like this!
Cris Senior

You call your flawed logic coherent when it's based on an assumption? Um....whatever.

And please don't worry about what I do in the bedroom, go find something else to wank off too.;) :lol:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 01:56 AM
You think Nike loves it that Serena withdraws from tournaments?? Sure they pay her through the endorsement contracts/money but if she doesn't play tournaments and have great tournament records they wouldn't even pick her in the first place. By playing tournaments (and especially slams) she not only gets tournament prize money (as well as endorsement money), but would make her endoresement companies happy as well. Now if Serena was REALLY after the money she would play tournaments left and right and be greedy for prize money and trying to make her companies happy (and if she wins a lot, would increase their pay).

So your argument doesn't really work either. :wavey:
What you say is logically contradictory,on one hand.On the other hand,you don't understand that they have already built enough "image, symbol and icon capital" for the the next ten years,at least.The endorsers are pretty satisfied with this.So the Sisters do not need to win any more tournaments for their endorsement deals, which are already locked in multiyear contracts.The sisters know this through their lawyers which explains their lackadaisical attitude of late.In vulgar terms,so you understand
it:They Already Made It! Get it? When you get an educations in Culture and Economics we can discuss it further.Right now,you are parading yourself as an ignoramous in this matter.Go and study something! I guarantee you nobody would hire you in a marketing,PR or advertising company.
CrisSenior

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 02:14 AM
You call your flawed logic coherent when it's based on an assumption? Um....whatever.

And please don't worry about what I do in the bedroom, go find something else to wank off too.;) :lol:
Jesus,what's wrong with your brain!It is not based on assumptions.It is based on facts :1-Their endorsement earnings are quantitatively enormous.Again when you speak of quantities you are not speaking of "gut feelings or assumptions" but on the record facts.2-See my previous reply on acrued image capital the sisters already have accumulated.3-Carrillo's statements are based on Richard's statements,not on "assumptions" 4-The sisters are on the record about their preferences for other "career opportunities".
Finally,nobody is attacking or "hating" the sisters.One is simply analytically looking at a cultural situation.If you had a clear mind,you'd realize much of this is actually complementary to the sisters.The problem is that obssesed,crazed fanatics like you become paranoid about anything said about their "idealized hero-objects" which clouds their minds.
I am not worried about what you do in your bed room just that you bring it out in public.
Cris Senior

vettipooh
May 21st, 2005, 02:29 AM
Carillo ain't shit...don't know shit...and only talks shit. And you know where she can shove all that shit? Right up....that's right. You guessed it!!:lol:

Rocketta
May 21st, 2005, 02:46 AM
I wonder what about Venus and Serena makes Mary C....think they owe her anything? :confused:

I think someone got cussed out off camera because somebody has a bug up their ass lately. :lol:

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 02:57 AM
What you say is logically contradictory,on one hand.On the other hand,you don't understand that they have already built enough "image, symbol and icon capital" for the the next ten years,at least.The endorsers are pretty satisfied with this.So the Sisters do not need to win any more tournaments for their endorsement deals, which are already locked in multiyear contracts.The sisters know this through their lawyers which explains their lackadaisical attitude of late.In vulgar terms,so you understand
it:They Already Made It! Get it? When you get an educations in Culture and Economics we can discuss it further.Right now,you are parading yourself as an ignoramous in this matter.Go and study something! I guarantee you nobody would hire you in a marketing,PR or advertising company.
CrisSenior

First of all, I don't appreciate your condescending tone towards me. I only pointed out what I thought was flawed in your statement and wasn't condescending towards you. Second of all, I am not planning on doing anything in marketing, PR or advertizing thank you very much. I guarantee you that you are no Mr./Ms. "nice cultured and well-mannered" either. But do you honestly care? Because I don't. :)

You haven't addressed a crucial part of what I had originally said, which was about Serena winning and winning. If she does that, perhaps even better offers are up in the air for her. And if she really was after $$$, then she would still play tournaments to get that extra money.

And even if my post is totally wrong, there is no need to reply like how you did previously. I'm actually very much educated and my field may be different from yours but there is no need to be condescending.

Rory81
May 21st, 2005, 03:03 AM
What you say is logically contradictory,on one hand.On the other hand,you don't understand that they have already built enough "image, symbol and icon capital" for the the next ten years,at least.The endorsers are pretty satisfied with this.So the Sisters do not need to win any more tournaments for their endorsement deals, which are already locked in multiyear contracts.The sisters know this through their lawyers which explains their lackadaisical attitude of late.In vulgar terms,so you understand
it:They Already Made It! Get it? When you get an educations in Culture and Economics we can discuss it further.Right now,you are parading yourself as an ignoramous in this matter.Go and study something! I guarantee you nobody would hire you in a marketing,PR or advertising company.

Yeah, yeah, we know they've made it, but it is assumption to say the're ionly in it for the money. It's very likely they're having a mid-career slump (Venus in particular). Serena has always been this way, Up (think 1999), then down( think 2000-9001), Up (2002-2003, Down (Now). AK was in it for the money, that's how you behave when you only care about money. The Williamses are in it to win.

Rory81
May 21st, 2005, 03:15 AM
And even if my post is totally wrong

You're not. If Mary is right and that they were only in it for the money, they'd have retired (a la AK) with their earnings by now. As he's stated in an earlier post, they've got enough name recognition to satisfy the sponsors for a good ten years.

there is no need to reply like how you did previously. I'm actually very much educated and my field may be different from yours but there is no need to be condescending.

It's the old Trailor Park mentality...Whites founded this country, I'm white & you're not. From an Advertising pov uch and such is true; I know a bit about Advertising, and you don't, so I'm smarter.

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 21st, 2005, 03:34 AM
I'm so sick of Mary Carillo. I don't get how someone who has accomplished LITTLE if anything in the game of tennis can have so much to say about TWO women who have accomplished more in a week than her.

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 04:02 AM
You're not. If Mary is right and that they were only in it for the money, they'd have retired (a la AK) with their earnings by now. As he's stated in an earlier post, they've got enough name recognition to satisfy the sponsors for a good ten years.



It's the old Trailor Park mentality...Whites founded this country, I'm white & you're not. From an Advertising pov uch and such is true; I know a bit about Advertising, and you don't, so I'm smarter.

It would have been fine and dandy if he/she said "I know a bit about advertizing and this is the truth...", or even "I believe I have more knowledge than you in this area" instead of "Go and study something!" :)

Julia1968
May 21st, 2005, 04:19 AM
Serena Withdraws From French Open


05/20/2005

Serena Williams started the season with a spirited sense of closure. Digging down deep to summon the competitive character she showed in dominating tennis, Williams fought back from deep deficits in the semifinals and final to claim her seventh career Grand Slam championship at the Australian Open. Since that stirring triumph, the former No. 1 has struggled to finish what she starts.


Now, the woman who has created so many compelling championship climaxes won't be around to begin the season's second Grand Slam. The fourth-ranked Williams withdrew from Roland Garros today citing the sprained left ankle she sustained in the Amelia Island quarterfinal against Silvia Farina Elia on April 8th. Since retiring from that match, Williams has played once — suffering a 7-6(2), 6-1 loss to Francesca Schiavone in Rome last week in a defeat she declared was her "worst loss."

"I just guess I had a really bad day today," Williams said after the match. "Just one of those days that just wasn't going to work. I made too many errors maybe, and I just didn't feel anything today. I mean, nothing came from my legs, or from my arms."

If Williams' body felt numbed by Novocain her will to win appeared euthanized by expectations. The most surprising development in Williams' season since she stretched her Melbourne winning streak to 14 matches is not the lack of a title, it's the fact that the woman who was once tennis' fiercest fighter has been so willing to toss in the towel.

Serena has played 13 matches since claiming the Australian Open crown and has either retired or conceded a walkover in three of those encounters.

The inferno of intensity that once burned within, sometimes seems flicker like the flame of a match-head in Serena, who seems to struggle to find motivation in non-majors lately.

The 2002 Roland Garros champion owns a 25-5 record on the red clay and has been both triumphant and tearful in Paris. In her victory over Venus in the 2002 final, Serena spoke a few words in French in her victory speech prompting a receptive roar from the crowd. The following year, six points separated Williams from her fifth consecutive Grand Slam as the defending Roland Garros champion stepped up to serve holding a 4-2 lead in the third set of her compelling clash with Justine Henin-Hardenne, a singles semifinal showdown suddenly got very crowded.

Jeering Williams' correct questioning of inaccurate line calls and cheering her errors, some French fans forced their collective will on the match and Williams could not stand up to a stadium. Unnerved by the hostile howls echoing in her ears, Williams concentration cracked, her level of play dipped and she bowed 6-2, 4-6, 7-5 to eventual-champion Henin-Hardenne.

Tournament play has not always been a prerequisite for success for Williams.

Serena has shown up at the Australian Open — this year — and at Wimbledon in her two title triumphs without playing a single warm-up event and still went on to win those majors. The problem is crafting clay-court success demands more than desire, grit and guts — qualities Serena exuded as easily as perspiration pouring from her pores Down Under — it takes a willingness to work and grind through points, rallies and matches and with only four clay-court matches to her credit this year Serena has to know she's simply not prepared to make any push in Paris even if her ankle was not an issue.

Her strength of spirit as become a parachute Williams has relied on to bail herself out of tight spots, but some observers believe it's time to cut that cord and commit herself to the off-court work necessary to fuel her full flight in tournament play.

"I guess what I'm worried about is she's grown too reliant upon that (fighting spirit)," ESPN tennis analyst Mary Carillo said in a conference call with the media earlier this week. "All right, 'If I want it enough, that should do it!" I think you can only go to that well so many times. That well runs dry on you. You cannot fake the funk on clay — you just can't. It's gotten to the point with the Williams sisters where I listen to what they say and then watch what they do."

When she's fit and fully focused, the 23-year-old Williams brings more than championship credentials to the game, she brings one of the most explosive and entertaining styles to the sport, she brings athleticism and she brings an abundance of attitude. At her best, Serena competes with the ruthlessness of a hard-core competitor shooting for a shutout. Clearly, she hasn't been at her best this year. She didn't play her top tennis in Australia, but she fought harder than everyone she faced.

Since then, Serena seems to be fighting herself more than the opposition.

The three-time Key Biscayne champion arrived at the Nasdaq-100 Open seeking to add seventh Key Biscayne crown to the Williams sisters collection, but instead looked distracted, unsettled and unfocused in yelling at herself and tossing her racquet around before falling to Venus for the first time since the since the 2001 U.S. Open final.

Since that March match, Serena's played only four times. Despite her Roland Garros withdrawal, Serena will retain her top 10 ranking following the French fortnight. She insists tennis is still her top priority, she just doesn't play enough to prove it.

"Back in the day when Richard Williams was first introducing his daughters to us all he was always talking about how they were going to be rich and famous and they were gonna be No. 1," Carillo said. "He never talked about them being great. He talked about the money a lot. Maybe those two have reached all their dreams. Maybe I'm looking for something that maybe they're (not). That's fine. I've gotta deal with it. Maybe my expectations and desires is different from what they hold on to."

The fact that both Venus and Serena have been willing to sacrifice parts of their tennis seasons to pursue college educations and careers in fashion and acting is admirable. In a day when many aspiring junior players drop out of high school to attend tennis academies and pound the court for hours at a time, the Williams sisters have always been smart enough to see that there's much more to life than batting a ball over a net. It's quite possible that like Andre Agassi — who was notorious for taking every other year off from top-level tennis early in his career — the Williams sisters' interests outside of tennis may actually prevent burnout prolong their careers in the long run.

They've always played tennis on their terms, and while they were once ahead of the curve the Williams sisters are no longer first to the finish. The challenge Venus and Serena face now is that it's becoming increasingly more difficult to write your name on title trophies when you can't even make a mark in tournament draws.

To be fair, if should Serena regain her health, conditioning and sustain a consistent schedule, will still be one of the top contenders for Wimbledon and the U.S. Open this year. But playing part-time tennis no longer translates to full-time success on the tour and a sport which was once a two-player game with Serena and Venus facing off in six of eight Grand Slam finals in a period from the 2001 U.S. Open to the 2003 Wimbledon, the game has gotten more crowded and the sisters are struggling to survive the squeeze."They were divvying up the spoils all by themselves and that was only a couple of years ago. And now we're wondering..." Carillo said. "Serena keeps telling us tennis is her No. 1 priority and then they kind of sound like their father these days. Richard was always talking about how he wanted them out of the game in their 20s. I still think that they should dominate and that they can dominate. The big question mark is is that what are they thinking? I think at a certain point you've gotta decide do you pull up your socks or go home? I'd love to see them decide that's what they want more than anything else and do all the requisite work to get back there."
Serena often characterizes herself as an entertainer rather than an athlete. In the past, she's been able to turn it on like a star stepping onto the stage and shining beneath a bright spotlight. Now, you have to begin to wonder if she's getting sick of the show.

The truth.

Carillo is 100% correct. Actions speak louder than words.

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 21st, 2005, 04:22 AM
The truth.

Carillo is 100% correct. Actions speak louder than words.

:bounce: The ban champion strikes again :bounce:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 04:27 AM
1Jackson says "You haven't addressed a crucial part of what I had originally said, which was about SerenYa winning and winning. If she does that, perhaps even better offers are up in the air for her. And if she really was after $$$, then she would still play tournaments to get that extra money."
Oh man,you are stubborn! Of course,I addresed to that.I explained that given their accumulated "image-symbol-icon capital they DO NOT NEED to play tournaments "To get that extra money".They already got and it is locked in tight, in long term contracts.(five to ten years).So any "extra" tournaments won't matter.The deals are sealed already).Got it ?Agents and endorsers hire economists who on the basis of something
called the Human Capital Model,estimate mathematically the number of years an "image-player" would have an impact on the public on the basis of what they have already acomplished.
You shouldn't call anyone condescendant just because they are trying to enlighten you .If you can't get it,you can't get it.
Then Rory 81,claims,repeatedly that Carillo said the sisters are "in it only for the money".Mary never said that.She attributed it to Richard's attitude.All she wishes is for the sisters to play more often because we all enjoy to see them playing often and they are not doing it..
As I said before the problem of discussing objectively any player's activities is that their raving,crazed ,paranoid fans take offense at anything that they perceive and distort as beign in disagreement with the fantasized,idealized images of their taken for hostage heroes.
The Williams sisters are great players and their "image" is not owed by any of you two.
Cris

Julia1968
May 21st, 2005, 04:30 AM
Xxxx you Carillo. What a xxxxx she was in this article!

Please clean up the gutter talk, people.

There are impressionable teenagers participating here.

AkademiQ
May 21st, 2005, 04:45 AM
Please clean up the gutter talk, people.

There are impressionable teenagers participating here.

You keep on outing yourself :tape:

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 04:45 AM
1Jackson says "You haven't addressed a crucial part of what I had originally said, which was about SerenYa winning and winning. If she does that, perhaps even better offers are up in the air for her. And if she really was after $$$, then she would still play tournaments to get that extra money."
Oh man,you are stubborn! Of course,I addresed to that.I explained that given their accumulated "image-symbol-icon capital they DO NOT NEED to play tournaments "To get that extra money".They already got and it is locked in tight, in long term contracts.(five to ten years).So any "extra" tournaments won't matter.The deals are sealed already).Got it ?Agents and endorsers hire economists who on the basis of something
called the Human Capital Model,estimate mathematically the number of years an "image-player" would have an impact on the public on the basis of what they have already acomplished.
You shouldn't call anyone condescendant just because they are trying to enlighten you .If you can't get it,you can't get it.
Then Rory 81,claims,repeatedly that Carillo said the sisters are "in it only for the money".Mary never said that.She attributed it to Richard's attitude.All she wishes is for the sisters to play more often because we all enjoy to see them playing often and they are not doing it..
As I said before the problem of discussing objectively any player's activities is that their raving,crazed ,paranoid fans take offense at anything that they perceive and distort as beign in disagreement with the fantasized,idealized images of their taken for hostage heroes.
The Williams sisters are great players and their "image" is not owed by any of you two.
Cris

You can "enlighten" easily without sounding condescending. I've been "enlightened" before and I'm fine with that, but they don't use your tone of voice.

Notice what I said in this post :)

It would have been fine and dandy if he/she said "I know a bit about advertizing and this is the truth...", or even "I believe I have more knowledge than you in this area" instead of "Go and study something!"

^^ You could have been a lot nicer and tried to impart your knowledge in that fashion. Instead of saying stuff like "Go study something!" "Got it?"
That is basically talking down to someone. If you can't get that, then YOU are stubborn.

----

Now your quote: "As I said before the problem of discussing objectively any player's activities is that their raving,crazed ,paranoid fans take offense at anything that they perceive and distort as beign in disagreement with the fantasized,idealized images of their taken for hostage heroes."

Where have I been raving and paranoid? Please do find one post of mine that has been crazy and paranoid. I have said nothing to that effect. It could be about any player and I'd still be debating with you if I find something I don't agree with (which is about the endorsement deals v. tournament prize money). If you are hallucinating so badly that you are seeing words that are not there and putting words in my mouth then I might understand why you're like this.

@m@nd@
May 21st, 2005, 05:01 AM
thanks for the article :)

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 06:11 AM
3-Carrillo's statements are based on Richard's statements.

I find it odd that when Richards bizarre comments suits certain people's needs it's ok to quote him. He has his own opinion, and his opinions from 5 years ago have nothing to do with the tennis interest level of the sisters. He has stated many times that he allows them to make their own decisions regarding tennis. So Carrillo's statements are indeed assumptions.


Finally,nobody is attacking or "hating" the sisters.One is simply analytically looking at a cultural situation.If you had a clear mind,you'd realize much of this is actually complementary to the sisters.The problem is that obssesed,crazed fanatics like you become paranoid about anything said about their "idealized hero-objects" which clouds their minds.
I am not worried about what you do in your bed room just that you bring it out in public.
Cris Senior

You have really got to be one of the most desperate posters I've encountered here. To consistently claim you are educationally superior to anyone that opposes your opinion simply undermines your statements.

And yes, I would classify you as a "hater".;)

Julia1968
May 21st, 2005, 07:52 AM
I think all this "trash-talking" about Mary Carillo is very juvenile.

It appears there is a lot of misdirected anger towards Carillo for doing HER job.

Serena is the one that withdrew from the French Open. No one twisted her ankle and made her make that decision. Mary Carillo didn't force her to do that. Its not Mary Carillo's fault that Serena hasn't played well since the Australian Open. Its not Mary Carillo's fault that Serena hasn't been in top form physically. Its not Mary Carillo's fault that Serena's ranking will drop after the French Open.

Stop HATING on any person in the tennis establishment that points towards what the irrationally exuberant attempt to bury their heads from hearing and seeing.

The one thing that Carillo failed to mention was the daunting task of Serena attempting to usurp Open tennis history by returning to her prior form after being off after a lengthy lay-off. Its been over a year since Serena's "comeback", and other than a win at Miami 2004 with a weak draw and a speck of brilliance at the Australian Open, her results have been mediocre, comparatively speaking.

There always seemed to be her irrationally exuberant fans who thought both Venus and Serena would comeback to dominate the WTA. As though the sisters were somehow immune to tennis history and the difficulties/hurdles of which to regain their form. As though they were robots.

Well, HELLO, and welcome to the real world of tennis. Serena is human. Tennis is a mental sport. And Mary Carillo isn't a dragon lady.

Don't blame Mary Carillo for Serena Williams' shortcomings.

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 08:30 AM
1jackson states: "You can "enlighten" easily without sounding condescending. I've been "enlightened" before and I'm fine with that, but they don't use your tone of voice"
I wasn't really being "condescending". I was being ironic because you conveniently forget or ignore now that in your previous posts on the valuation of player's image-contracts,you were pontificating and lecturing with self-assured academic knowledge about how their remunerations were formed while evidently you have an insufficient knowledge of this process.This stroke me as very pedantic.Had you been more methodically doubtful,curious and open to discussion,I'd been certainly more gracious.
Your angry complaining responses to my posts,show that you feel offended and attacked,which confirms my thesis that recalcitrant ,die-hard fans tend to exhibit paranoia and see attacks when there are none.THis is also confirmed by HARLOO who has the nerve to make idiotic statements like:
"And yes, I would classify you as a "hater".>only a pathologically crazed,ravid fan would project her out of control rage into others like this.Tocall "haters" those who disagree with you is to demonize them which is a very evil thing to do,It is the kind of thing the Bushies do to those they dislike :they call them "terrorists". Sad.Hope you get professional help soon.In the meantime,please stay away,you are evilly spooky.
However,it is refreshing to see that there are sane,rational posters like the previous one,Julia1968,whose post is rather illuminating.
CS

Brian Stewart
May 21st, 2005, 08:47 AM
An interesting bit here:

"Back in the day when Richard Williams was first introducing his daughters to us all he was always talking about how they were going to be rich and famous and they were gonna be No. 1," Carillo said. "He never talked about them being great....

Um, isn't saying that they're going to be #1 suggesting that they're going to be great? Even the players who were criticized for their stints at #1 achieved a level of greatness, however brief, to get there.

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 08:54 AM
An interesting bit here:



Um, isn't saying that they're going to be #1 suggesting that they're going to be great? Even the players who were criticized for their stints at #1 achieved a level of greatness, however brief, to get there.
You are totally right.Not a felicitous turn of phrase by Mary here.
Cris

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 09:09 AM
1jackson states: "You can "enlighten" easily without sounding condescending. I've been "enlightened" before and I'm fine with that, but they don't use your tone of voice"
I wasn't really being "condescending". I was being ironic because you conveniently forget or ignore now that in your previous posts on the valuation of player's image-contracts,you were pontificating and lecturing with self-assured academic knowledge about how their remunerations were formed while evidently you have an insufficient knowledge of this process.This stroke me as very pedantic.Had you been more methodically doubtful,curious and open to discussion,I'd been certainly more gracious.
Your angry complaining responses to my posts,show that you feel offended and attacked,which confirms my thesis that recalcitrant ,die-hard fans tend to exhibit paranoia and see attacks when there are none.THis is also confirmed by HARLOO who has the nerve to make idiotic statements like:
"And yes, I would classify you as a "hater".>only a pathologically crazed,ravid fan would project her out of control rage into others like this.Sad.Hope you get professional help soon.In the meantime,please stay away,you are evilly spooky.
However,it is refreshing to see that there are sane,rational posters like the previous one,Julia1968,whose post is rather illuminating.
CS

Notice my use of smilies such as: :)
My posts were merely tongue-in-cheek as I used :wavey: as well. I was not attempting to be pedantic. I thought I was correct and I can stand to be corrected. And if you actually conducted some bit of smart research you would know I am far from being a "die-hard fan" of Serena. :) I don't defend and have not defended Serena in this thread at all. I have only defended myself when I see that you were being condescending towards me. I'm not even angry but you seem to think I am. I have fun when I'm posting and "bantering" with you is part of my amusement when I have time to waste.

1jackson2001
May 21st, 2005, 09:10 AM
And for the record I have never attacked Mary Carillo or am angry with her. She in fact is my fave ESPN commentator. :cool:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 10:42 AM
Notice my use of smilies such as: :)
My posts were merely tongue-in-cheek as I used :wavey: as well. I was not attempting to be pedantic. I thought I was correct and I can stand to be corrected. And if you actually conducted some bit of smart research you would know I am far from being a "die-hard fan" of Serena. :) I don't defend and have not defended Serena in this thread at all. I have only defended myself when I see that you were being condescending towards me. I'm not even angry but you seem to think I am. I have fun when I'm posting and "bantering" with you is part of my amusement when I have time to waste.
Glad to hear you saying that.No problem,However,try using more humour so the bantering is more clear.
CS

Rocketta
May 21st, 2005, 02:32 PM
However,it is refreshing to see that there are sane,rational posters like the previous one,Julia1968,whose post is rather illuminating.
CS

:haha: :haha: :haha:

How is someone suppose to take you as intelligent when

1. you make said statement ...... and

2. you can't seem to figure out how to use the quote function and paragraph spacing? :tape:

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 21st, 2005, 02:41 PM
Its not Mary Carillo's fault that Serena's ranking will drop after the French Open.



Actually you couldn't be more wrong here. The only way Serena's ranking can drop is if Dementieva wins the French. Serena will most likely be the #4 seed going in to Wimbledon. Know your facts before you run your mouth.

Rocketta
May 21st, 2005, 02:44 PM
Actually you couldn't be more wrong here. The only way Serena's ranking can drop is if Dementieva wins the French. Serena will most likely be the #4 seed going in to Wimbledon. Know your facts before you run your mouth.

eh, that's just too much to ask! :tape:

spartanfan
May 21st, 2005, 02:47 PM
I agree with the poster who has pointed out the fact for Mary C to has such an undistinguished tennis career, she sure is full advice for Venus and Serena, who have accomplished more in one tournament that she has in her ENTIRE career. Where was all of Mary's insightful wisdom while she was playing tennis and if she's so fucking knowledgable then why isn't she out there coaching some young teenager? Or a coach for Fed Cup? It's a whole lot easier to be critical from the sidelines with a microphone in ones hand than to actually be out there being successful, making it to number 1 and winning multiple Grand Slams. Mary really needs to shut the fuck up.

Julia1968
May 21st, 2005, 04:25 PM
An interesting bit here:



Um, isn't saying that they're going to be #1 suggesting that they're going to be great? Even the players who were criticized for their stints at #1 achieved a level of greatness, however brief, to get there.

Comparatively speaking, no.

The type of greatness Carillo eludes to would be multiple grand slam singles titles, dominating women's tennis > 100 weeks, or at least achieving half of what the previous generation of champions achieved in terms of "greatness".

Julia1968
May 21st, 2005, 04:27 PM
:haha: :haha: :haha:

How is someone suppose to take you as intelligent when

1. you make said statement ...... and

2. you can't seem to figure out how to use the quote function and paragraph spacing? :tape:

Injecting ad hominem is an ignorant form of debate. Any other speck of brilliance you might want to share today?

spartanfan
May 21st, 2005, 06:12 PM
and because Mary Carillo gets to decide who is and who isn't a great tennis player. Serena has already won all four GS titles and held them all at the same time, a feat that only a handful of women or men have ever accomplished. I think that qualifies as great. And Venus has won 4 GS singles and 6, I think, GS double titles, plus Olympic Gold in singles and doubles. Now how many other women have that on their resume? Carillo sure doesn't. Once again, like I said, Carillo needs to really temper her comments about Venus and Serena, or better yet just SHUT THE FUCK up.

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 10:41 PM
:haha: :haha: :haha:

How is someone suppose to take you as intelligent when

1. you make said statement ...... and

2. you can't seem to figure out how to use the quote function and paragraph spacing? :tape:
There they go again!!!These crazed,rabid Williams Sisters fans.They can't wait to throw venom at those they perceive as slighting their idealized hero-worship objects.They are not really tennis fans,they are celebrity hounds in need of someone to fantasize,worship and serve.In their minds,the Williams have assigned them the role of protectors of Williamdon and they launch attack after attack as soon as their feverished brains perceive one coming, which is more often than not.Sad cases these poor souls .I really hope they get good therapy before it is too late and they become totally schizo.In the meantime it is impossible to have a rational discussion about any aspect of the sport with these creepy people because they don't really care about tennis but about their celebrity fusion fantasies.
By the way,who says I am "intelligent"?And just because I use the quote function in a particular way I like it doesn't mean I don't know how to use it.
Stayaway and get help
CS

Diesel
May 21st, 2005, 10:47 PM
By the way,who says I am "intelligent"?
Stayaway and get help
CS

Hopefully no one person is stating you are intelligent because "ravid" isn't found in the dictionary :wavey: Try using words that are actually at your level :lol:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 11:08 PM
Hopefully no one person is stating you are intelligent because "ravid" isn't found in the dictionary :wavey: Try using words that are actually at your level :lol:
Is this the best you can do? Don't youi know how easy it is to make typos in this kind of quick response discussion lists.I see myriads of typos all over but I always give the benefit of the doubt to the posters.But this is not the case with the rabid/"ravid" ferocious self-appointed defenders of the Williams faith for whom the crime of a typo! is another chance to smear the infidels.Yes,let's goand get them!!There goes another one!!Cathch her!
Who told your minor mind that typing, which is a mechanical skill, is a sign of high intelligence?
Go and rest,
CS

Diesel
May 21st, 2005, 11:09 PM
Is the best you can do?

Nope - it was the best you could do :haha:

Rocketta
May 21st, 2005, 11:13 PM
Nope - it was the best you could do :haha:

:haha:

I hope he doesn't think anyone's really taking the time to read everything in those jumbled posts. I know I don't. :lol:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 11:15 PM
Nope - it was the best you could do :haha:
Nope,wrong again,the best I can do is to stay away from idiotic morons like you who can't rationally argue about tennis and whose only purpose in these lists, is to demonize the members whom they perceive as attacking their celebrity idols and whose best mode of reasoning is to moronically point out at typos!,.Stay away,grow up and get help.
CS

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 11:22 PM
However,it is refreshing to see that there are sane,rational posters like the previous one,Julia1968,whose post is rather illuminating.
:tape: :tape: :tape: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

You've lost the little bitty credibility you had left with the statement above. Julia is a Williams Troll.

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 11:38 PM
HARLOO :I don't care about having any credibility specially with deranged fans like you who are not interested in tennis but whose minds are taking in by celebriticism,I like the Williams myself and I don't have any problems with rational fans like Julia.Good if she is one .I wish then there were more like her and less irrational crazed ones like you.Compare your own posts with hers.She always have somthing of interest and relevant to tennis to say.You don't.You either cheerlead or get into personal attacks.
CS

harloo
May 21st, 2005, 11:57 PM
HARLOO :I don't care about having any credibility specially with deranged fans like you who are not interested in tennis but whose minds are taking in by celebriticism,I like the Williams myself and I don't have any problems with rational fans like Julia.Good if she is one .I wish then there were more like her and less irrational crazed ones like you.
CS


Now ,now did it have to take all those posts for you to reveal yourself? Don't worry everyone knew your mojo because it's already been done before here. ROTF!!!:lol:

You have outed yourself and all your talk of rationality is laughable. Maybe you and Jules can unite now. Peace, Cris.:haha: :haha:

Cris Senior
May 21st, 2005, 11:59 PM
:haha:

I hope he doesn't think anyone's really taking the time to read everything in those jumbled posts. I know I don't. :lol:
I was going to ignore this one but it is so hilariously self-contradictory that I couldn't help to replyto it :Rocketta coquetta,if you don't read the posts how can you say then that they are "jumbled"?. And I bet that for you anything that is not at the comic book level is seen as "jumbled".Lol!!!
CS

Cris Senior
May 22nd, 2005, 12:55 AM
Now ,now did it have to take all those posts for you to reveal yourself? Don't worry everyone knew your mojo because it's already been done before here. ROTF!!!:lol:

You have outed yourself and all your talk of rationality is laughable. Maybe you and Jules can unite now. Peace, Cris.:haha: :haha:
Are you OK? What you wrote is totally incomprehensible mumbojumbo to me and I bet to any normal person.Please stop hallucinating .You are starting to sound like a serious clinical case.Also folow Julia's advice to Rocketta above and stop reasoning ad hominen,if you know what that means.(i have my doubts).
CS

harloo
May 22nd, 2005, 01:21 AM
Are you OK? What you wrote is totally incomprehensible mumbojumbo to me and I bet to any normal person.Please stop hallucinating .You are starting to sound like a serious clinical case.Also folow Julia's advice to Rocketta above and stop reasoning ad hominen,if you know what that means.(i have my doubts).
CS

:haha: :haha: Cris Senior=OWNED :tape: :lol:

Rocketta
May 22nd, 2005, 01:22 AM
:haha: :haha: Cris Senior=OWNED :tape: :lol:

I don't know how y'all decipher that jumbled mess? :confused:

harloo
May 22nd, 2005, 01:27 AM
I don't know how y'all decipher that jumbled mess? :confused:

:lol:

Cris Senior
May 22nd, 2005, 03:09 AM
I don't know how y'all decipher that jumbled mess? :confused:
Come on,keep to your own level Read comic books!!!
All members of the forum should know that ROKETTA,HARLOO and DIESEL are nothing but a childish lynch mob who instead of engaging in discussions by reasoning ,try to intimidate those they perceive as "enemies of the cause".You don't intimidate me because among other things you quickly make a fool out your own ignorant selves.
CS

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 22nd, 2005, 03:19 AM
Come on,keep to your own level Read comic books!!!
All members of the forum should know that ROKETTA,HARLOO and DIESEL are nothing but a childish lynch mob who instead of engaging in discussions by reasoning ,try to intimidate those they perceive as "enemies of the cause".You don't intimidate me because among other things you quickly make a fool out your own ignorant selves.
CS

Interesting that you're suggesting he/she read comic books, when your grammar and spelling level matches that of a 3rd grader.

Julia1968
May 22nd, 2005, 03:25 AM
Nope,wrong again,the best I can do is to stay away from idiotic morons like you who can't rationally argue about tennis and whose only purpose in these lists, is to demonize the members whom they perceive as attacking their celebrity idols and whose best mode of reasoning is to moronically point out at typos!,.Stay away,grow up and get help.
CS

:bounce: :lick:

Julia1968
May 22nd, 2005, 03:29 AM
Now ,now did it have to take all those posts for you to reveal yourself? Don't worry everyone knew your mojo because it's already been done before here. ROTF!!!:lol:

You have outed yourself and all your talk of rationality is laughable. Maybe you and Jules can unite now. Peace, Cris.:haha: :haha:

How odd.

The mentality that others "join" as a gang for the sake of discussions in this discussion forum. THAT is the difference betweens tennis fans in here and The Royal Court. WE don't have to become a gang to voice our individual opinion. Its called thinking for ourselves.

Julia1968
May 22nd, 2005, 03:32 AM
However,it is refreshing to see that there are sane,rational posters like the previous one,Julia1968,whose post is rather illuminating.
:tape: :tape: :tape: :haha: :haha: :haha: :haha:

You've lost the little bitty credibility you had left with the statement above. Julia is a Williams Troll.




Sorry your Queen is too busy partying to play tennis, but take it out on her, instead of harrassing real fans of tennis.

Rocketta
May 22nd, 2005, 03:49 AM
Interesting that you're suggesting he/she read comic books, when your grammar and spelling level matches that of a 3rd grader.

Actually I love comic books! :yeah:

Uncanny X-Men is my favorite series! :bounce:

Only problem they really are expensive. :mad:

Stamp Paid
May 22nd, 2005, 03:55 AM
Come on,keep to your own level Read comic books!!!
All members of the forum should know that ROKETTA,HARLOO and DIESEL are nothing but a childish lynch mob who instead of engaging in discussions by reasoning ,try to intimidate those they perceive as "enemies of the cause".You don't intimidate me because among other things you quickly make a fool out your own ignorant selves.
CS

lol! what a tool...:o

Cris Senior
May 22nd, 2005, 11:17 PM
Interesting that you're suggesting he/she read comic books, when your grammar and spelling level matches that of a 3rd grader.
Interesting that you don't show/prove that my grammar is wrong.What you call spelling are simply typos.I'd correct them before posting ,but whyn bother to do so to satisfy an ignorant popinjay like you who didn't even go to remedial school.
CS

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 23rd, 2005, 12:28 AM
Interesting that you don't show/prove that my grammar is wrong.What you call spelling are simply typos.I'd correct them before posting ,but whyn bother to do so to satisfy an ignorant popinjay like you who didn't even go to remedial school.
CS

Interesting that you say that, considering I'm a college student with a 3.7 gpa. And you're obviously the ignorant one, who doesn't know to put a space after a period at the end of a sentence. Obviously NOT typos, because the mistakes are in EVERY ONE of your posts. Get a grip loser.

vogus
May 23rd, 2005, 12:45 AM
Interesting that you say that, considering I'm a college student with a 3.7 gpa. And you're obviously the ignorant one, who doesn't know to put a space after a period at the end of a sentence. Obviously NOT typos, because the mistakes are in EVERY ONE of your posts. Get a grip loser.



Content is more important than punctuation. A person can post with perfect grammar but their posts may not be worth reading, if they have nothing interesting to say. Meanwhile, many of the world's greatest writers had sloppy grammar and punctuation. Shakespeare broke every rule in the book. It's all about what you bring to the table.

Cris Senior
May 23rd, 2005, 01:08 AM
Interesting that you say that, considering I'm a college student with a 3.7 gpa. And you're obviously the ignorant one, who doesn't know to put a space after a period at the end of a sentence. Obviously NOT typos, because the mistakes are in EVERY ONE of your posts. Get a grip loser.
Again,it goes to show that all you are interested, is in showing off your minor league level of viciousness by pointing out at typos .I already told you that,in this thread,I wouldn't bother to edit.On the other hand,a truly intelligent person would consider other possibilities such as a damage in my keyboard i.e. that some keys ,like the spacer, don't register.
Apart from the high valuation it places on triviality,like typing skills,your kind of reasoning :If A then B and only B,it is not a sign of intelligence.To reason as in:If A then B,or C,or D,etc,is sign of some depth.
Hard to believe you go to any college,because one of the first manifestations of culture and education is that of respect for others' opinions and the facts of the world .You,instead,reason by derision and the cheap mockery of those you dislike because they are not in consonance with your idealizations of your fantasized heroes.JUlia 1968 already pointed out in a previous post,how you guys in the lynch mob keep arguing ad hominen. (Did you finally find out what does it mean?). This college of yours, must be some backwater kind, west of Cheekeesaw! LOl!!!
By the way,you haven't pointed out to me where my "grammar errors"are (Not typos,if you can tell the difference).I'll make a deal with you :I'll pay you $10 for every one you point out, so you can go out and buy your little vials around the corner and share them with your vicious ,mean-spirited,lynch mob
of popinjay friends,the self-appointed defenders of the sacrosanct order of the Williams Knights.
CS

faste5683
May 23rd, 2005, 02:13 AM
Content is more important than punctuation. A person can post with perfect grammar but their posts may not be worth reading, if they have nothing interesting to say. Meanwhile, many of the world's greatest writers had sloppy grammar and punctuation. Shakespeare broke every rule in the book. It's all about what you bring to the table.

Then again, some posters (like myself) have the dubious distinction of combining both horrible grammer with completely meaningless commentary: it may seem easy, but it takes more work than you might think.
:wavey:

Cris Senior
May 23rd, 2005, 02:34 AM
Then again, some posters (like myself) have the dubious distinction of combining both horrible grammer with completely meaningless commentary: it may seem easy, but it takes more work than you might think.
:wavey:
LOL!! You are right But not this one,anyway. IT was clever and funny.
CS

Cris Senior
May 23rd, 2005, 02:37 AM
Then again, some posters (like myself) have the dubious distinction of combining both horrible grammer with completely meaningless commentary: it may seem easy, but it takes more work than you might think.
:wavey:
LOL!! But not this one,anyway. It was clever and funny.
CS

Experimentee
May 24th, 2005, 01:45 PM
Its only when Serena is injured that ppl doubt her, when anyone else is injured, likes like 'poor ___, hope they get well soon'.
Oh the double standards.

Cybelle Darkholme
May 24th, 2005, 03:01 PM
Wow what a crazy article. And here I thought Serena williams was the austrailian champion this year and the only active player besides monica with seven grand slams. Silly me.

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 24th, 2005, 03:08 PM
Again,it goes to show that all you are interested, is in showing off your minor league level of viciousness by pointing out at typos .I already told you that,in this thread,I wouldn't bother to edit.On the other hand,a truly intelligent person would consider other possibilities such as a damage in my keyboard i.e. that some keys ,like the spacer, don't register.
Apart from the high valuation it places on triviality,like typing skills,your kind of reasoning :If A then B and only B,it is not a sign of intelligence.To reason as in:If A then B,or C,or D,etc,is sign of some depth.
Hard to believe you go to any college,because one of the first manifestations of culture and education is that of respect for others' opinions and the facts of the world .You,instead,reason by derision and the cheap mockery of those you dislike because they are not in consonance with your idealizations of your fantasized heroes.JUlia 1968 already pointed out in a previous post,how you guys in the lynch mob keep arguing ad hominen. (Did you finally find out what does it mean?). This college of yours, must be some backwater kind, west of Cheekeesaw! LOl!!!
By the way,you haven't pointed out to me where my "grammar errors"are (Not typos,if you can tell the difference).I'll make a deal with you :I'll pay you $10 for every one you point out, so you can go out and buy your little vials around the corner and share them with your vicious ,mean-spirited,lynch mob
of popinjay friends,the self-appointed defenders of the sacrosanct order of the Williams Knights.
CS

Interesting. You're suggesting that I lack a decent education or that I attend a "backwater" college because I disagree with your vicious attacks of the Williams sisters? How does that show intelligence of any kind? You appear to be nothing but a desperate hypocrite who enjoys negative attention. And yes, your errors are more than typos. Your sentence structure is horrid at best, and you really look like an idiot. Have a nice day :wavey:

Cybelle Darkholme
May 24th, 2005, 03:17 PM
Its funny how no one talks about all the other injured players who failed to enter or withdrew from the french.

The fact remains that serena is not treated like the other players. She comes back from injury to find Talk about how her game is declining and she is on her way to retirement. She wins the austrailian open and its "only due to her intense desire". whatever. if thats all it took everyone on the tour would have won an austrailian open title.

The questions stop for a week and then they are back when Serena faces injury and poor showings. Well guess what? She is the only grand slam winner this year and she can lose every match for the rest of the year and still have a phenomenal year. How many players ever win one slam let alone seven?

These people do not care about serena. They would have her on the court with a twisted ankle just so they can see their precious Serena vs Maria clash. Its funny how when other players retire from matches or get injured no big stink is made. Why is that?

I think that Julia's comment that "serena is only human" is a bit telling. You see Serena's fans know she's only human but people like Julia think of her as some unstoppable muscular amazon who cannot possibly get sick or injured so she must be faking it all. Its so transparent its almost laughable.

They talk about how Serena Williams is not Tennis and then do nothing but talk about Serena ALL THE TIME. Even with the fresh faced Sharapova they still cannot stop talking about Serena. Even with the return of JHH who poses just as much threat to Maria as Serena, its still all about Serena. Funny how no one talks about the great intense rivalry between maria and justine. Why is that? I mean isnt' tennis more than Serena vs The WTA?

:tape:

icequeen
May 24th, 2005, 03:18 PM
Why is it that people are so obsess with the Williams Sisters? Every little thing they do or place they go we get a tread with 8 or 10 pages.

harloo
May 24th, 2005, 03:22 PM
Its funny how no one talks about all the other injured players who failed to enter or withdrew from the french.

The fact remains that serena is not treated like the other players. She comes back from injury to find Talk about how her game is declining and she is on her way to retirement. She wins the austrailian open and its "only due to her intense desire". whatever. if thats all it took everyone on the tour would have won an austrailian open title.

The questions stop for a week and then they are back when Serena faces injury and poor showings. Well guess what? She is the only grand slam winner this year and she can lose every match for the rest of the year and still have a phenomenal year. How many players ever win one slam let alone seven?

These people do not care about serena. They would have her on the court with a twisted ankle just so they can see their precious Serena vs Maria clash. Its funny how when other players retire from matches or get injured no big stink is made. Why is that?

I think that Julia's comment that "serena is only human" is a bit telling. You see Serena's fans know she's only human but people like Julia think of her as some unstoppable muscular amazon who cannot possibly get sick or injured so she must be faking it all. Its so transparent its almost laughable.

They talk about how Serena Williams is not Tennis and then do nothing but talk about Serena ALL THE TIME. Even with the fresh faced Sharapova they still cannot stop talking about Serena. Even with the return of JHH who poses just as much threat to Maria as Serena, its still all about Serena. Funny how no one talks about the great intense rivalry between maria and justine. Why is that? I mean isnt' tennis more than Serena vs The WTA?

:tape:

:lol: :worship:

icequeen
May 24th, 2005, 03:23 PM
Its funny how no one talks about all the other injured players who failed to enter or withdrew from the french.

The fact remains that serena is not treated like the other players. She comes back from injury to find Talk about how her game is declining and she is on her way to retirement. She wins the austrailian open and its "only due to her intense desire". whatever. if thats all it took everyone on the tour would have won an austrailian open title.

The questions stop for a week and then they are back when Serena faces injury and poor showings. Well guess what? She is the only grand slam winner this year and she can lose every match for the rest of the year and still have a phenomenal year. How many players ever win one slam let alone seven?

These people do not care about serena. They would have her on the court with a twisted ankle just so they can see their precious Serena vs Maria clash. Its funny how when other players retire from matches or get injured no big stink is made. Why is that?

I think that Julia's comment that "serena is only human" is a bit telling. You see Serena's fans know she's only human but people like Julia think of her as some unstoppable muscular amazon who cannot possibly get sick or injured so she must be faking it all. Its so transparent its almost laughable.

They talk about how Serena Williams is not Tennis and then do nothing but talk about Serena ALL THE TIME. Even with the fresh faced Sharapova they still cannot stop talking about Serena. Even with the return of JHH who poses just as much threat to Maria as Serena, its still all about Serena. Funny how no one talks about the great intense rivalry between maria and justine. Why is that? I mean isnt' tennis more than Serena vs The WTA?

:tape:


:worship: :worship: :worship:
Great post.

VeeReeDavJCap81
May 24th, 2005, 03:28 PM
Its funny how no one talks about all the other injured players who failed to enter or withdrew from the french.

The fact remains that serena is not treated like the other players. She comes back from injury to find Talk about how her game is declining and she is on her way to retirement. She wins the austrailian open and its "only due to her intense desire". whatever. if thats all it took everyone on the tour would have won an austrailian open title.

The questions stop for a week and then they are back when Serena faces injury and poor showings. Well guess what? She is the only grand slam winner this year and she can lose every match for the rest of the year and still have a phenomenal year. How many players ever win one slam let alone seven?

These people do not care about serena. They would have her on the court with a twisted ankle just so they can see their precious Serena vs Maria clash. Its funny how when other players retire from matches or get injured no big stink is made. Why is that?

I think that Julia's comment that "serena is only human" is a bit telling. You see Serena's fans know she's only human but people like Julia think of her as some unstoppable muscular amazon who cannot possibly get sick or injured so she must be faking it all. Its so transparent its almost laughable.

They talk about how Serena Williams is not Tennis and then do nothing but talk about Serena ALL THE TIME. Even with the fresh faced Sharapova they still cannot stop talking about Serena. Even with the return of JHH who poses just as much threat to Maria as Serena, its still all about Serena. Funny how no one talks about the great intense rivalry between maria and justine. Why is that? I mean isnt' tennis more than Serena vs The WTA?

:tape:

No one wants to admit it, but Serena IS the face of women's tennis. She is the star. That's why every thing, literally every move she makes is criticized. All eyes are on her.

Andy T
May 24th, 2005, 03:56 PM
If I were Serena Williams and I'm facing two majors in 6 weeks, one on clay and one on grass, with a dodgy ankle, no match practice and coming off a crap result/performance, I'd probably have made the same decision. Why jeopardise your chances at Wimbledon by taking a big risk playing in Paris when your whole preparartion has been blown out of the water and you stand little (relatively - for Serena) chance of winning?

mykarma
May 25th, 2005, 01:57 AM
Its funny how no one talks about all the other injured players who failed to enter or withdrew from the french.

The fact remains that serena is not treated like the other players. She comes back from injury to find Talk about how her game is declining and she is on her way to retirement. She wins the austrailian open and its "only due to her intense desire". whatever. if thats all it took everyone on the tour would have won an austrailian open title.

The questions stop for a week and then they are back when Serena faces injury and poor showings. Well guess what? She is the only grand slam winner this year and she can lose every match for the rest of the year and still have a phenomenal year. How many players ever win one slam let alone seven?

These people do not care about serena. They would have her on the court with a twisted ankle just so they can see their precious Serena vs Maria clash. Its funny how when other players retire from matches or get injured no big stink is made. Why is that?

I think that Julia's comment that "serena is only human" is a bit telling. You see Serena's fans know she's only human but people like Julia think of her as some unstoppable muscular amazon who cannot possibly get sick or injured so she must be faking it all. Its so transparent its almost laughable.

They talk about how Serena Williams is not Tennis and then do nothing but talk about Serena ALL THE TIME. Even with the fresh faced Sharapova they still cannot stop talking about Serena. Even with the return of JHH who poses just as much threat to Maria as Serena, its still all about Serena. Funny how no one talks about the great intense rivalry between maria and justine. Why is that? I mean isnt' tennis more than Serena vs The WTA?

:tape:Excellent post!

Cris Senior
May 25th, 2005, 09:00 AM
Interesting. You're suggesting that I lack a decent education or that I attend a "backwater" college because I disagree with your vicious attacks of the Williams sisters? How does that show intelligence of any kind? You appear to be nothing but a desperate hypocrite who enjoys negative attention. And yes, your errors are more than typos. Your sentence structure is horrid at best, and you really look like an idiot. Have a nice day :wavey:
Number one :I said that your educational level,if it is true,doesn't show in what you write because you exhibit a tremedous amount of bad logical reasoning over and over again. It is not because you "disagree with my vicious attacks on the Williams". I haven't attacked them once!. Which leads to number two:In addtition,the cultural level you claim to have doesn't show because you have the pathetic habit of launching accusations against your perceived Williams enemies" but never ,not once, you show proof of your innuendos and false charges; prove where are my errors? Show to me that my sentence structure is horrid.Offer evidence that I am a "hypocrite". I even offered to pay you if you came up with evidence. By launchig invective after invective, by dwelling in infantile name calling and avoiding reasoning fy facts and tight logic,you are revealing yourself to be a vicious, uneducated, uncivilized, mean spirited little freak.
And if you really are in College (show proof,otherwise I won'tbelieve you!) why are you wasting your time imagining that the Willisms appointed you as their sacrosanct defender.Go get help before you become totally schizo.
And ddon't forget : show me where didd I ever attack your idols?
CS