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Wigglytuff
Mar 8th, 2005, 09:58 PM
Brother of Jackson Accuser Admits Lying

1 hour, 17 minutes ago


By TIM MOLLOY, Associated Press Writer

SANTA MARIA, Calif. - A 14-year-old boy who testified that Michael Jackson (news) molested his brother acknowledged under cross-examination Tuesday that the pop star didn't show him a sex magazine that the prosecution had introduced into evidence. The witness also said he lied under oath in a separate civil lawsuit.

The teenager, who visited Jackson's Neverland ranch for the last time in March 2003, became confused after Jackson attorney Thomas Mesereau showed him a copy of Barely Legal magazine dated August 2003. The boy had testified on Monday that the magazine was one of those that Jackson had showed to him and his brother.

Confronted with the conflicting dates, the boy said: "I never said it was exactly that one. That's not exactly the one he showed us."

He said he had looked at the magazine with District Attorney Tom Sneddon before it was presented as evidence.

Under further questioning by Mesereau, the boy also said he lied under oath in another case when he swore that his mother and father never fought and that his father never hit him.

"When you were asked if your dad ever hit you, you said 'never,'" said Mesereau. "Were you telling the truth?"

"No," said the boy, who is the only trial witness so far to testify that the molestation occurred.

Jackson's attorney also referred to a civil suit the boys' mother filed against a department store company over an encounter with security guards. The mother claimed she was sexually assaulted and the family was beaten by the store guards. The defense contends the suit shows the family has a history of filing false claims to get money.

"Did someone tell you to lie in the J.C. Penney case?" Mesereau asked.

"I don't remember," the boy said.

When Mesereau asked him to tell the jury why he lied under oath, the boy said: "I don't remember. It was five years ago. I don't remember nothing."

Jackson, 46, is accused of molesting a 13-year-old boy cancer survivor at his Neverland estate in 2003 and giving him alcohol. He also is accused of conspiring to hold the boy's family captive to get them to rebut a damaging documentary in which Jackson said he allowed children to sleep in his bedroom.

The 14-year-old boy became a crucial prosecution witness Monday when he testified to actually seeing molestation, saying he twice walked into Jackson's bedroom and saw Jackson masturbating with one hand while the other was in his sleeping brother's underwear.

Mesereau asked the boy Tuesday about an alarm system in Jackson's house that alerts the singer when anyone is in the hall outside his bedroom.

"So the two times you claim you saw Michael Jackson touching your brother in bed, that alarm went off?" asked Mesereau.

"Yes," said the boy.

When the boy testified about the alleged molestation on Monday he did not mention any bell or alarm system and said his brother slept through both incidents, snoring at one point.

Bacardi
Mar 8th, 2005, 09:59 PM
I take it the family got their huge checks from MJ in the mail and they didn't bounce, thus the trial has been bought out again by the good money from MJ. He'll be free in no time, right back at it again :yeah:

harloo
Mar 8th, 2005, 10:02 PM
I take it the family got their huge checks from MJ in the mail and they didn't bounce, thus the trial has been bought out again by the good money from MJ. He'll be free in no time, right back at it again :yeah:

Throw the mama in the slammer. I can't believe she would make her children lie about something so serious.:eek:

Bacardi
Mar 8th, 2005, 10:04 PM
Throw the mama in the slammer. I can't believe she would make her children lie about something so serious.:eek:

Lesson #1 to Parents: Never, Never, NEVER ever trust a child to lie. It's impossible for them to lie, unless of course it's something they actually done, then they will lie and say they didn't. But I can't believe that woman didn't know her kids would change stories like switch hitters on a baseball team. :rolleyes:

Crazy Canuck
Mar 8th, 2005, 10:06 PM
This:

Under further questioning by Mesereau, the boy also said he lied under oath in another case when he swore that his mother and father never fought and that his father never hit him.

Doesn't surprise me all that much. I did something similar when I was younger, so I can sympathetize.

However, I can't understand or sympathetize with the accusations against MJ that were fabricated. That's just disgusting. I don't entirely blame the child for that as much as I do the parent, because the kid had to get the ideas from somewhere.

Rocketta
Mar 8th, 2005, 10:23 PM
So Michael's lawyer got the sister to admit he lied and now he got the brother...ayaiya what a mess. :rolleyes:

It's starting to look like more and more the prosecution didn't bother to investigate this case but was just gung ho to get Michael or he did a piss poor job preparing the witnesses for cross examinations. :shrug:

whitecamero
Mar 8th, 2005, 10:32 PM
I just don't get people. Why lie to get money? You can't take it with you when you die anyway. So why ruin your lives to just get a few bucks that aren't even yours?! :rolleyes:

Denise4925
Mar 8th, 2005, 11:08 PM
This:



Doesn't surprise me all that much. I did something similar when I was younger, so I can sympathetize.

However, I can't understand or sympathetize with the accusations against MJ that were fabricated. That's just disgusting. I don't entirely blame the child for that as much as I do the parent, because the kid had to get the ideas from somewhere.
Exactly. It's abhorent. She teaches the children that it's okay to lie for money and destroy a person's life in the process. :sad: That's just sad.

le bon vivant
Mar 8th, 2005, 11:14 PM
I dont understand - he didnt lie about the molestation, just the magazine that Michael Jackson showed him, right?

Denise4925
Mar 8th, 2005, 11:17 PM
I dont understand - he didnt lie about the molestation, just the magazine that Michael Jackson showed him, right?
It's not about that Justin, it's about his whole testimony. If he lied about one or two things, he could be lying about everything. His testimony is incredible. In other words, the Prosecution's star witnesses testimony is crap.

le bon vivant
Mar 9th, 2005, 01:49 AM
It's not about that Justin, it's about his whole testimony. If he lied about one or two things, he could be lying about everything. His testimony is incredible. In other words, the Prosecution's star witnesses testimony is crap.

I know, but at best, that simply pokes holes in the kid's testimony, and then not even in the most important parts of the testimony (the actual molestation), but the showing of pornography.

Rocketta
Mar 9th, 2005, 01:52 AM
I know, but at best, that simply pokes holes in the kid's testimony, and then not even in the most important parts of the testimony (the actual molestation), but the showing of pornography.

actually they did poke holes in his molestation testimony. When he didn't mention the alarms going off when he walked into Michael's bedroom. Also the fact that there were alarms when anyone walked into Michael's bedroom would also kind of poke holes into the theory that he "caught" Michael molesting his little brother. He would've had to say Michael knew he was entering the bedroom and continued to molest his little brother which is not what he was saying he implied that he "caught" Michael.

in other words that poor kids testimony is shot to hell full of holes. :tape:

RVD
Mar 9th, 2005, 02:10 AM
I said it before, I'll say it again....

This case should NEVER have gone to trial.
This is the second or third time that a child has lied (and received coaching from his parents) to swindle money from MJ. People are truly pathetic.
Moreover, as I've again stated in a previous thread, this particular DA has been after MJ for over a decade. Yet we had people on here, just a few scant days ago, damning MJ to hell.
When will people learn?

le bon vivant
Mar 9th, 2005, 04:59 AM
I just dont know about all this... :unsure:

I'm just gonna wait for all the facts to come out before I decide.

Wigglytuff
Mar 9th, 2005, 05:10 AM
I just dont know about all this... :unsure:

I'm just gonna wait for all the facts to come out before I decide.

i am taking the same attitude. though i have to say, i dont trust the boys mother to be honest about much. so let see what happens with this.

Cybelle Darkholme
Mar 9th, 2005, 02:51 PM
Haven't you all realized by now that MJ will be found innocent and then he will be taken to civil court and fournd guilty so that those greedy people can get what they really want $$$$$.

The same thing happened in the Kobe case. That woman knows she was not raped she just wanted the $$$$. and she got what she wanted didnt she?


MJ needs to wake up and realize that whether he's innocent or not people will still take him to court just so they can win the civil trial or at the very least settle out of court.

The man is a fool.

kiwifan
Mar 9th, 2005, 03:03 PM
Haven't you all realized by now that MJ will be found innocent and then he will be taken to civil court and fournd guilty so that those greedy people can get what they really want $$$$$.

The same thing happened in the Kobe case. That woman knows she was not raped she just wanted the $$$$. and she got what she wanted didnt she?

MJ needs to wake up and realize that whether he's innocent or not people will still take him to court just so they can win the civil trial or at the very least settle out of court.

The man is a fool.

Troof. :yeah:

victory1
Mar 9th, 2005, 03:25 PM
Troof. :yeah:

Not only is he a FOOL, he's also STUPID!!:lol:

harloo
Mar 9th, 2005, 03:50 PM
Haven't you all realized by now that MJ will be found innocent and then he will be taken to civil court and fournd guilty so that those greedy people can get what they really want $$$$$.

The same thing happened in the Kobe case. That woman knows she was not raped she just wanted the $$$$. and she got what she wanted didnt she?


MJ needs to wake up and realize that whether he's innocent or not people will still take him to court just so they can win the civil trial or at the very least settle out of court.

The man is a fool.


Exactly. Don't you get the feeling that even if Michael is let off the hook this time he will still have little boys over sleeping in his room? :rolleyes: :eek:

I really think he would be better off serving some time in the slammer. Of course he will not be sent to the pen, so maybe he can get some counseling.

I believe if he reverse his skin to it's original color, and get a shrink he may be able to revive his career. You think?:lol:

Dawn Marie
Mar 9th, 2005, 06:26 PM
What makes Michael look like a DUMB ass fool is the fact that he is in bed sleeping with little white boys and he is 46!!

Now in my opinion MJ is a pediphile, did he molest this particluar child I don't know. But the parents of the children and MJ need some HELP!

MJ continues to sleep in bed with little children so HELL HE DESERVES everything he has gotten so far.

DUMB ASS!

victory1
Mar 9th, 2005, 06:44 PM
What makes Michael look like a DUMB ass fool is the fact that he is in bed sleeping with little white boys and he is 46!!

Now in my opinion MJ is a pediphile, did he loest this particluar child I don't know. But parents of children and MJ need some HELP!

MJ continues to sleep in bed with little children so HELL HE DESRVES everything he has gotten so far.

DUMB ASS!

EXACTLY!!

Josh B.
Mar 9th, 2005, 06:57 PM
Looks like MJ is pretty innocent to me!

jenny161185
Mar 9th, 2005, 09:19 PM
I believe he's innocent - Go Michael!

Mrs. Peel
Mar 9th, 2005, 09:59 PM
Things get more and more bizarre............................

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7139678/

Jackson accuser takes the stand
Testimony starts after his brother admits more lies

SANTA MARIA, Calif. - Michael Jackson's accuser was called to the witness stand Wednesday afternoon, facing his alleged molester for the first time since he left the singer's Neverland ranch over two years ago and accused Jackson of fondling him.

The boy, now 15, began what could be some of the most dramatic moments of the pop star's trial on child molestation charges.

Looking trim in a blue shirt, he was called to the stand by District Attorney Tom Sneddon and asked if he recognized the defendant. The boy said yes, with an expression that appeared to be verging on a sneer.

The 15-year-old accuser, who was a cancer patient when he met Jackson, talked about attending a Los Angeles comedy camp hosted by Jamie Masada, the comedy club owner who would eventually bring him and Jackson together.

The boy said his favorite comedian was "Tonight Show" host Jay Leno and that he often asked Masada if Leno would attend the camp, but Leno never did. The defense contends Leno is one of several comedians the boy's family tried to bilk out of money.

The boy said his coach at the comedy camp was comedian George Lopez and that he began attending the camp after his mother found a flier advertising it.

"She always thought I was kind of funny," he said.

Jackson's accuser also testified about his father hitting him, his sister and mother, and talked about what it was like to have cancer.

"I felt like there was a knife in my stomach," he said, adding that he would hold a pillow to his stomach as he slept to quell the pain.

Earlier in the day, under tough cross-examination, the accuser's brother acknowledged that he lied his way through a video interview made by the singer's associates.

The so-called "rebuttal" interview was recorded after a 2003 documentary was broadcast in which the pop star said he sleeps with young boys in his bed. In the taped interview, the accuser and his family are seen offering effusive praise for Jackson.
But during Wednesday's testimony, Jackson defense lawyer Thomas Mesereau Jr. replayed the interview. Several times, Mesereau asked if what the brother had just said on video was true and the boy said it was not true.

"I just said whatever came into my head," the brother said.

"So basically, every statement you made was a lie?" Mesereau asked.

"Yes," the boy said. "I was tired and I wanted to get out of there."

The brother faced a withering cross-examination. Earlier Wednesday, he said key points in his testimony contradicted an earlier account because “I was nervous when I did the interview.”

The 14-year-old boy testified this week that he twice saw his sleeping brother being molested by Jackson, both times by walking upstairs into Jackson’s bedroom at the singer’s Neverland ranch.

Mesereau produced an interview the boy gave to sheriff’s deputies in which he said he was lying on a couch pretending to be asleep when he witnessed the second molestation.

“I was pretending like I was sleeping. I was in his couch, the little couch,” Mesereau quoted from a transcript.

Mesereau also asked him about what exactly Jackson was doing to his brother in the second incident and how he was touching him.

“I was nervous when I did the interview,” the boy said.

“So because you were nervous you didn’t get the facts right,” the attorney asked.

“Yes,” the boy said.

On Tuesday, Mesereau produced a transcript of grand jury testimony by a psychologist who interviewed the 14-year-old boy and reported yet another description of the second molestation with fundamentally different physical details.

Prisoners at Neverland?
Mesereau on Wednesday also challenged prosecutors’ claims that the boys’ family was held against their will at Neverland for nearly a month, getting the boy to acknowledge that the family left three times.

“How many times do you think your family escaped from Neverland and then went back so they could escape again?” Mesereau asked.
“I don’t get the question,” the boy said.

The boy later said he only considered the third departure from Neverland to be an escape.

The witness also gave an account of how his sister received alcohol from Jackson that differed from the version the sister gave in her own testimony.

The sister testified earlier that she drank wine with Jackson and her brothers in a wine cellar. But the boy told Mesereau his sister received alcohol from Jackson in his kitchen and it was vodka.

“It wasn’t in the wine cellar?” Mesereau asked.

The boy said no.

The cross-examination of the accuser’s brother began on Tuesday, when Mesereau got the boy to acknowledge that Jackson had not really shown him or his brother a particular sex magazine.

Mrs. Peel
Mar 9th, 2005, 10:00 PM
omg..that was my 3000th post ^^:lol: :lol:

Denise4925
Mar 9th, 2005, 10:20 PM
It's so obvious these people are lying. At least in the transcripts. I don't know how they are coming across to the jury.

:shrug:

Denise4925
Mar 9th, 2005, 10:20 PM
omg..that was my 3000th post ^^:lol: :lol:

Congrats Mrs. Peel. :hug:

kiwifan
Mar 9th, 2005, 10:42 PM
Prisoners at Neverland?
Mesereau on Wednesday also challenged prosecutors’ claims that the boys’ family was held against their will at Neverland for nearly a month, getting the boy to acknowledge that the family left three times.

“How many times do you think your family escaped from Neverland and then went back so they could escape again?” Mesereau asked.

:haha: I like this guy!!! :haha:

Cybelle Darkholme
Mar 9th, 2005, 11:23 PM
Even if MJ is innocent of sexual molestation he is still guilty of bad judgement and questionable values. What grown ass man as Dawn so eloquently put it sleeps with six year old white boys that are not his sons? None that I know.

He needs serious therapy at best. I cant belive I used to dance my ass off to Off the Wall and Thriller. I need to wash my soul now.

Dawn Marie
Mar 9th, 2005, 11:42 PM
I am witrh you Cybel.

just because MJ is an icon will not let me turn my eyes and head away from the facts.

Fact is MJ is in need of some serious therapy and people should not ignore his sickness just because he is MJ!! I am a child advocate before I am a fan of Micheal Jackson.

And this is from one of his old die hard fans.. I had all his albums danced to all his music and had the glove the thriller jacket and the books. I watched all the shows and all his videos.

Damn him for being so good in the music world but then making an ass out of himself in the real world!!!!

kiwifan
Mar 10th, 2005, 12:25 AM
He needs serious therapy at best. I cant belive I used to dance my ass off to Off the Wall and Thriller. I need to wash my soul now.

Oh cut that bullshit out, you know damn well when P.Y.T. comes on you'll be on the floor.

You can't help it, I can't help it...

[1st Verse]
Where Did You Come From Lady
And Ooh Won't You Take Me There
Right Away Won't You Baby
Tendoroni You've Got To Be
Spark My Nature
Sugar Fly With Me
Don't You Know Now
Is The Perfect Time
We Can Make It Right
Hit The City Lights
Then Tonight Ease The Lovin' Pain
Let Me Take You To The Max

[Chorus]
I Want To Love You (P.Y.T.)
Pretty Young Thing
You Need Some Lovin' (T.L.C.)
Tender Lovin' Care
And I'll Take You There
I Want To Love You (P.Y.T.)
Pretty Young Thing
You Need Some Lovin' (T.L.C.)
Tender Lovin' Care
I'll Shake You There

[Background]
Anywhere You Wanna Go

[2nd Verse]
Nothin' Can Stop This Burnin'
Desire To Be With You
Gotta Get To You Baby
Won't You Come, It's Emergency
Cool My Fire Yearnin'
Honey, Come Set Me Free
Don't You Know Now Is The Perfect Time
We Can Dim The Lights
Just To Make It Right
In The Night
Hit The Lovin' Spot
I'll Give You All That I've Got

[Chorus]
I Want To Love You (P.Y.T.)
Pretty Young Thing
You Need Some Lovin' (T.L.C.)
Tender Lovin' Care
And I'll Take You There
I Want To Love You (P.Y.T.)
Pretty Young Thing
You Need Some Lovin' (T.L.C.)
Tender Lovin' Care
I'll Take You There

Breakdown
Pretty Young Things, Repeat After Me
[Michael] I Said Na Na Na
[P.Y.T.'S] Na Na Na
[Michael] Na Na Na Na
[P.Y.T.'S] Na Na Na Na
[Michael] Na Na Na
[P.Y.T.'S] Na Na Na
[Michael] I Said Na Na Na Na Na
[P.Y.T.'S] Na Na Na Na Na
[Michael] I'll Take You There

...hell, I'm at work sitting at my computer (watching Seton Hall v. Georgetown on the tube) and I feel like dancing right now just thinking about P.Y.T.

:topic: for those of you who don't know the PYT background singers were Janet and LaToya - its the best song either of them ever sang. :devil:

Rocketta
Mar 10th, 2005, 12:33 AM
There are many many people in this world in need of therapy and help doesn't mean they should be subject to false allegations if these allegations are false.

I mean I totally agree that if he hadn't put himself in a position to be accused of something wrong he wouldn't be but I don't think the reason he put himself in that position was based on a mean spirit or a want to do wrong, ala Kobe Bryant.

Now if he did it hopefully it will come out. I think if he did it he was smart enough to pick a family of liars and to bring out those lies because it's quite hard to believe a word out of these people's mouths.

VeeDaQueen
Mar 10th, 2005, 12:36 AM
the boys accusing him isn't white. he is spanish :lol:

Bacardi
Mar 10th, 2005, 02:07 AM
http://forums.filefront.com/images/smilies/jackson.gif

Wigglytuff
Mar 10th, 2005, 02:21 AM
the boys accusing him isn't white. he is spanish :lol:

well see that changes everything for me. as far as iknow mike only likes WHITE boys. :lol: :tape:

seriously, though i dont trust this family to be very honest. i frankly think that they are a family of liars and its impossible to believe thier stories.

Mrs. Peel
Mar 10th, 2005, 02:28 AM
What an interesting trial so far. After all of the build up and the so called iron clad case, I wonder if these plot holes were anticipated? Witnesses with such shaky credibility...I am shocked that this is what the prosecution has to offer. I was expecting something else.


Oh well....more to come....just waiting for the facts..........

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 03:59 AM
There are many many people in this world in need of therapy and help doesn't mean they should be subject to false allegations if these allegations are false.

I mean I totally agree that if he hadn't put himself in a position to be accused of something wrong he wouldn't be but I don't think the reason he put himself in that position was based on a mean spirit or a want to do wrong, ala Kobe Bryant.

Now if he did it hopefully it will come out. I think if he did it he was smart enough to pick a family of liars and to bring out those lies because it's quite hard to believe a word out of these people's mouths.

I totally agree. I don't think anyone with bad judgment should be accused, let alone convicted of a crime they didn't commit. However, if he did it, which I doubt right now, I hope it comes out and he receives what he deserves. But, I agree with someone else who said earlier, that I believe he will do it again because no one can tell him anything that he is doing is bad. I also don't think, unless he's mandated to do so, he will ever get any psychological help, which he so desperately needs.

RVD
Mar 10th, 2005, 06:08 AM
I don't now if this has been posted yet, but here goes...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7067347/#050308a

March 8, 2005 | 2:58 p.m. ET

Jackson camp preparing victory tour (Stacy Brown, MSNBC contributor and Jackson family friend)

Is Michael Jackson creating his own version of Dewey defeats Truman?

After a week of testimony, most court watchers would agree that defense attorneys are winning, and the King of Pop is reportedly already preparing for a victory celebration concert tour that would include a half-time performance at the World Cup.

According to the UK's Times Online, each morning while preparing for court and as an aide fixes his tie, Jackson is on his gem-encrusted cell phone speaking with business manager Charles Koppelman. The two are planning a world tour, which they've already nicknamed “The Michael Jackson Celebration Tour.”

The tour would include stops in Japan, the UK and Asia, and feature Jackson performing live at the World Cup, where the audience is second only to the Super Bowl in sports. Koppelman is also working in the background to disentangle Michael Jackson's finances and vet offers on the long mooted sale of the now tainted Neverland Ranch, according to the Times.

Winner of this round?
Even after Monday's devastating testimony from the brother of Jackson's accuser, the Jackson camp seemed to exude confidence, even a sense of victory.

On the way out of court Monday, Joseph Jackson, Michael Jackson's father, triumphantly grabbed his embattled son's hand and raised it above his head, like a handler would lift a victorious boxer's arm following a win.

And today, when the Jacksons exited their chauffer-driven SUV, Jermaine Jackson threw his hands in the air and pumped his fist at the handful of supporters outside the courthouse.

The strange thing is that before opening statements, Jackson had reportedly been somewhat glum and nervous, almost like a man preparing to walk his last mile. However, with the unexpected backing of the news media, the singer seems reinvigorated.

Fox and friends
So confident that Jackson will walk, newsman Geraldo Rivera has bet his mustache— and whatever reputation he enjoys— on Jackson's innocence. In fact, the Fox News Channel appears to be backing Rivera.

The network, apparently believing that Jackson is innocent, is currently the only American-based news organization to have abandoned the “John Doe” and “Jane Doe” pseudonyms for the accuser and his family, and routinely refers to the family by their real names.

Even James Brown got into the act this week. The legendary godfather of soul said that Michael was being “set up” in his child molestation trial and that Jackson should be touring tsunami-hit Asia rather than defending himself in court.

“We need Michael,” Brown said. “We need Michael out here entertaining. Michael could have been great [in Indonesia] performing. His talent is very appealing and people know him. “

Jackson himself told Rivera that he and his brothers had been working on a tsunami relief record although it is unclear if the work had been completed or whether Jackson plans to reunite with the Jackson Five if he is acquitted.

Pre-mature confidence?
But talk of an acquittal definitely appears premature since we've just begun the second week of what is projected to be a six-month trial.

Perhaps Jackson, who grew up only minutes from Chicago, never learned about what happened during the 1948 presidential election. Weeks before it, many leading editorial writers and political columnists relied on early Gallup Polls, which predicted Thomas E. Dewey's win over incumbent Harry S. Truman.

Truman's strategy was to bypass the press by taking his case to the people in what he called a whistle-stop campaign. An issue of the early edition of the Chicago Daily Tribune was handed to Truman after the election. The headline declared “Dewey Defeats Truman.”

Truman upset Dewey despite having the support of only 15 percent of the nation's daily newspapers.

Premature celebrations and continued media pronouncements of his pending acquittal could have Michael Jackson's sworn enemy, District Attorney Thomas Sneddon, looking a lot like Harry Truman after the trial is over.

E-mail us at Sidebar@MSNBC.com
_________________________

:lol: :lol: OH LAWD! What a circus!!
Like someone stated earlier, this will probably go to civil court with a $$Million payoff AGAIN! :rolleyes:

RVD
Mar 10th, 2005, 07:20 AM
District Attorney Tom Sneddon is as bad as this dumb family. :rolleyes:
This case is O V E R !
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7139678/

I swear, if they make a movie about this, it'll be HUGE! :lol:

le bon vivant
Mar 10th, 2005, 09:05 AM
Guilty or not, Michael Jackson still has an unhealthy, slf-destructive obsession with young preadolescent males of non-African descent.

(Well, we're ALL of African descent, but you know what I mean...) ;)

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 10th, 2005, 10:16 AM
Stop whining everyone. If he's innocent, he's innocent. I don't care how weird he is, or how odd his habits are. Innocent is innocent is innocent.

For the record, I always said that he was probably innocent ... and I always thought that the prosecution case would go off the rails. This family looks like a bunch of lying gold-diggers. They have no credibility at all. Wasn't it obvious from the start?

Okay, it's too early to celebrate. Maybe the prosecution team still have some better evidence than this. Let's wait and see. If not, the whole prosecution should be withdrawn.

Wigglytuff
Mar 10th, 2005, 11:23 AM
Stop whining everyone.

:fiery: :fiery: :fiery:

whine Audio pronunciation of "whining" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (hwn, wn)
v. whined, whin·ing, whines
v. intr.

1. To utter a plaintive, high-pitched, protracted sound, as in pain, fear, supplication, or complaint.
2. To complain or protest in a childish fashion.
3. To produce a sustained noise of relatively high pitch: jet engines whining.


becuase you didnt look it up before you posted. i dare you to show me how and where "everyone" complained or protested in a childish fashion?
see, just because you dont agree with or like peoples OPINIONS doesnt mean you have a right to belittle them.

o·pin·ion Audio pronunciation of "opinion" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-pnyn)
n.

1. A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof: “The world is not run by thought, nor by imagination, but by opinion” (Elizabeth Drew).
2. A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert: a medical opinion.
3. A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing: has a low opinion of braggarts.
4. The prevailing view: public opinion.
5. Law. A formal statement by a court or other adjudicative body of the legal reasons and principles for the conclusions of the court.


see now you too know the difference between opinions and whining.

just so you know, this was the first word that popped into my head when i read your post
ar·ro·gant Audio pronunciation of "arrogant" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (r-gnt)
adj.

1. Having or displaying a sense of overbearing self-worth or self-importance.
2. Marked by or arising from a feeling or assumption of one's superiority toward others.

harloo
Mar 10th, 2005, 02:48 PM
I am convinced that Michael will still go to jail even if evidence proves that he is innocent of the charges. The prosecution picked the perfect jury to send Michael to the slammer. As as much as I hate to say this Michael was given a chance to get his life together after the first accusation, and he did not and I don't feel it will work this time.

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 03:38 PM
Stop whining everyone. If he's innocent, he's innocent. I don't care how weird he is, or how odd his habits are. Innocent is innocent is innocent.

For the record, I always said that he was probably innocent ... and I always thought that the prosecution case would go off the rails. This family looks like a bunch of lying gold-diggers. They have no credibility at all. Wasn't it obvious from the start?

Okay, it's too early to celebrate. Maybe the prosecution team still have some better evidence than this. Let's wait and see. If not, the whole prosecution should be withdrawn.
We've always been on the same page here. It is, however, too early to celebrate, because we don't know how the witnesses are coming across to the jury. Juries are very unpredictable.

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 03:43 PM
kiwi, you silly:D
I can't help but be of the mind that he should go to jail for being stupid:smash: I am actually refusing to watch any coverage of this trial. Whatever way you want to chalk it up, there is something sick going on with Mikey and everyone around him, should also be sent up the river for , what's the criminal term- collusion??

Harloo, damn- I thought I was bad but you are one distrustful negro when it comes to the United States of Amerikka's criminal justice shitstem:lol:

sidebar- I'm always amazed that when they show the kids' trips to Neverland, the majority of the kids are black, and a good amount are girls but somehow the ones getting special treatment are white boys. You know what would put Mikey in the slammer- seal the deal, (and I'm still waiting for it to happen one day-perhaps in an autobiography) is that either Corey Feldman, Macauley Culkin, or Aaron Carter come out and say that mikey did the do with them... As you can tell from my post, I do not emphathize with Mikey:shrug:

Regardless of whether you empathize or agree or disagree with his weird behavior, do you really want to see an innocent man going to jail for being stupid? :confused: Somehow, I don't see you as being that kind of person joie. Especially from the amazingly thoughtful and analytical posts I've read from you on this board.

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 04:34 PM
Denise- take it down a thousand;) Honestly, do you really think I want Mikey to go to jail for being a dumb ass...or if these people are lying?? But honestly, the first time I had some sympathy, now I have none. I can honestly say though, i really don't feel bad for him.
No baby, I wasn't upset. I think it's hard to convey seriousness in writing without sounding like your having a kniption(sp? :p) fit. :lol:

Whew, I didn't think so. ;) I was about to say, what's up with that girlfriend ;) ? :lol:

nygirl
Mar 10th, 2005, 05:48 PM
The guy is a fucking idiot!! I can not believe that he actually showed up in freaking pajama botoms and slippers! He looks like a zombie and can someone please explain to me how you can develop "serious back problems" overnight??

What happened, did he go home last night and decided to rearrange furniture or something??? At one point he was acting as if he could barely walk but when he was waving to his asshat fans he was vigorous as hell. He honestly thinks he can act however he wants and get away with it. The upsetting part?? He does keep getting away with all the crazy.

harloo
Mar 10th, 2005, 06:18 PM
Harloo, damn- I thought I was bad but you are one distrustful negro when it comes to the United States of Amerikka's criminal justice shitstem:lol:

sidebar- I'm always amazed that when they show the kids' trips to Neverland, the majority of the kids are black, and a good amount are girls but somehow the ones getting special treatment are white boys. You know what would put Mikey in the slammer- seal the deal, (and I'm still waiting for it to happen one day-perhaps in an autobiography) is that either Corey Feldman, Macauley Culkin, or Aaron Carter come out and say that mikey did the do with them... As you can tell from my post, I do not emphathize with Mikey:shrug:

Distrustful Negro? :lol: I have never been called that one before, but I have seen injustices in the court system first hand. Even though Michael has the luxury of expensive lawyers, I still believe that even if the evidence points to his innocence he will still go to jail.

I believe a person can only be given so many chances, and considering the severity of the accusations leveled against him I am predicting he will end up in the slammer. It's a sad state, and the public will make a spectacle of Michael when he is locked up.

Corey Feldman has all of the sudden come out the woodworks to claim some innapropriate behaviour was going on at Neverland, but he is less credible considering he claimed nothing ever happened in many interviews before. Considering the fact that he had a falling out with Mike a few years ago over something trivial, I would say his words have no merit. Who would continue to befriend someone who has sexually abused them as a child? It doesn't make sense.

Also for the record, Emanuel Lewis, MCauley Culkin, and Alfonso Riveria have all made public statements that nothing ever happened to them during their stay at Neverland Ranch. Mcauley did say he slept on Michael's bed also.

:eek:

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 06:37 PM
The guy is a fucking idiot!! I can not believe that he actually showed up in freaking pajama botoms and slippers! He looks like a zombie and can someone please explain to me how you can develop "serious back problems" overnight??

Live long enough, and you'll find out. :lol:

What happened, did he go home last night and decided to rearrange furniture or something??? At one point he was acting as if he could barely walk but when he was waving to his asshat fans he was vigorous as hell. He honestly thinks he can act however he wants and get away with it. The upsetting part?? He does keep getting away with all the crazy.

He may be crazy, but that doesn't mean he committed a crime.

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 06:40 PM
Corey Feldman has all of the sudden come out the woodworks to claim some innapropriate behaviour was going on at Neverland, but he is less credible considering he claimed nothing ever happened in many interviews before. Considering the fact that he had a falling out with Mike a few years ago over something trivial, I would say his words have no merit. Who would continue to befriend someone who has sexually abused them as a child? It doesn't make sense.



:lol: Corey is trying to revive his career. That was obvious from that interview they did with him before the trial. He's incredible.

PaulieM
Mar 10th, 2005, 07:52 PM
I don't know if he did it, but it's not looking like he did. but frankly he needs some SERIOUS HELP. He's a musical genius and i'm a huge fan of his and it makes me sad to see his reputation getting ruined. i don't care what his reasons are, nowhere in the world is it okay for a man to sleep with strangers' children. i guess it's ok to have little tea parties if he really needs to, or to raise money for charity, but slumber parties are a NO NO. i don't know what the hell is wrong with him for wanting to help children to turn into molestation scandals, for being stupid enough to do the shit he does he deserves the embarassment, but all the people that make up shit and try to get him sent to prison just for some money are messed up too. the parents that tell their kids to lie about stuff like this are horrible people. anyway i hope to God that michael can get some help and stop ruining his life, and he seriously needs to think about what this stuff is going to do to his own kids.

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 10th, 2005, 09:29 PM
:fiery: :fiery: :fiery:

whine Audio pronunciation of "whining" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (hwn, wn)
v. whined, whin·ing, whines
v. intr.

1. To utter a plaintive, high-pitched, protracted sound, as in pain, fear, supplication, or complaint.
2. To complain or protest in a childish fashion.
3. To produce a sustained noise of relatively high pitch: jet engines whining.


becuase you didnt look it up before you posted. i dare you to show me how and where "everyone" complained or protested in a childish fashion?
see, just because you dont agree with or like peoples OPINIONS doesnt mean you have a right to belittle them.

o·pin·ion Audio pronunciation of "opinion" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-pnyn)
n.

1. A belief or conclusion held with confidence but not substantiated by positive knowledge or proof: “The world is not run by thought, nor by imagination, but by opinion” (Elizabeth Drew).
2. A judgment based on special knowledge and given by an expert: a medical opinion.
3. A judgment or estimation of the merit of a person or thing: has a low opinion of braggarts.
4. The prevailing view: public opinion.
5. Law. A formal statement by a court or other adjudicative body of the legal reasons and principles for the conclusions of the court.


see now you too know the difference between opinions and whining.

just so you know, this was the first word that popped into my head when i read your post
ar·ro·gant Audio pronunciation of "arrogant" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (r-gnt)
adj.

1. Having or displaying a sense of overbearing self-worth or self-importance.
2. Marked by or arising from a feeling or assumption of one's superiority toward others.

Good lord, jiggly, you certainly took my post literally if you think it was directed at you or literally at every poster on the thread. I thought it was obvious which posters on this thread are whining. It's the people who just can't accept that MJ has rights and might be innocent.

As for me being arrogant, lots of people say that. But nah, I'm like Serena Williams. I'm just confident and a bit nutty. :angel:

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 10th, 2005, 09:32 PM
Nice posts, Denise.

Denise4925
Mar 10th, 2005, 09:44 PM
Nice posts, Denise.
:) Thanks Leopard.

Wigglytuff
Mar 11th, 2005, 03:59 AM
Good lord, jiggly, you certainly took my post literally if you think it was directed at you or literally at every poster on the thread. I thought it was obvious which posters on this thread are whining. It's the people who just can't accept that MJ has rights and might be innocent.

As for me being arrogant, lots of people say that. But nah, I'm like Serena Williams. I'm just confident and a bit nutty. :angel:

see when you said

Stop whining everyone.

its more than reasonable to think you meant:

Stop whining everyone.

:wavey: :wavey:

while you attempt to backtrack was amusing. its clear you lack both the sense to not be a dick and the brains to mean what you say and say what you mean.

:lol: :lol:

:bounce: :bounce: :bounce: :wavey: :wavey:

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 11th, 2005, 09:42 PM
Whatever.

Anyway, what's the latest on this? My news is probably a day behind?

Denise4925
Mar 11th, 2005, 09:50 PM
Whatever.

Anyway, what's the latest on this? My news is probably a day behind?
I'm sure you heard about the warrant issued for MJ's arrest for showing up late for court and when he did, he did so in his PJ bottoms. :rolleyes:

Mrs. Peel
Mar 11th, 2005, 09:52 PM
Was court in session today? No bombshells?

Denise4925
Mar 11th, 2005, 09:52 PM
Was court in session today? No bombshells?
Haven't heard anything today. I'm sure yesterday was enough. :lol:

Wigglytuff
Mar 11th, 2005, 11:26 PM
Whatever.

Anyway, what's the latest on this? My news is probably a day behind?

1. schooled
to get taught a lesson (the hard way), to lose humiliating
2. schooled
to get defeated miserably

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 12th, 2005, 01:40 AM
That's all very interesting, jiggly, I'm glad to see you have such lexicographical skills among your other many talents. But I think that other posters can make up their own minds who has been made to look foolish, or has been "schooled", on this thread. Hint: it's certainly not me.

By the way, the more rational and considered posters on the board will be able to work out what my original post was about, its context in this thread and others, and who it was aimed at. It wasn't aimed at you, but take it how you like.

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 12th, 2005, 01:41 AM
Now please answer my question, which was a genuine one. What is the latest news? The last I heard MJ had turned up in his PJs. What happened after that? Has the alleged victim been cross-examined yet? If you don't know the answers, that's fine. Someone will provide them sooner or later.

Crazy Canuck
Mar 12th, 2005, 01:43 AM
I am convinced that Michael will still go to jail even if evidence proves that he is innocent of the charges. The prosecution picked the perfect jury to send Michael to the slammer. As as much as I hate to say this Michael was given a chance to get his life together after the first accusation, and he did not and I don't feel it will work this time.

Yes, those whities will send him to prison, even if he has a stone cold alibi and some white guy stands up in court and says "okay guys, I admit it. It was me who molested those children".

Because this is what whities do.

harloo
Mar 12th, 2005, 01:57 AM
Yes, those whities will send him to prison, even if he has a stone cold alibi and some white guy stands up in court and says "okay guys, I admit it. It was me who molested those children".

Because this is what whities do.

As always Becca you simply don't get it.LOL. Who said anything about Whities?

You are really showing your ignorance.:rolleyes:

Denise4925
Mar 12th, 2005, 04:31 AM
Now please answer my question, which was a genuine one. What is the latest news? The last I heard MJ had turned up in his PJs. What happened after that? Has the alleged victim been cross-examined yet? If you don't know the answers, that's fine. Someone will provide them sooner or later.
Actually Leopard, I don't know if you have the E! channel where you are, but they have a show called the Michael Jackson Trial, which I saw for the first time tonight. A panel of four lawyers discuss the trial, two prosecutors and two defense attorneys. It's a very good analysis of what's going on and they all try to stay pretty objective. Anyway, they discussed the state's case with a reenacted account of the alledged victim on the stand. They say that the prosecutor is not doing a very good job telling the story. It's hard to follow where his questions are going and he made a mistake because he allowed the defense to start his cross before the court was recessed for the weekend. They said the defense was doing a very good job of cross on the alledged victim and that should have left an impression on the jury's mind over the weekend. However, they didn't go into detail, leaving that for their show next week. So, I'm curious to hear about what happened on cross.

Crazy Canuck
Mar 12th, 2005, 05:14 AM
As always Becca you simply don't get it.LOL. Who said anything about Whities?

You are really showing your ignorance.:rolleyes:
Oh. You must have been commenting on the occupations of the jury members. My mistake.

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 12th, 2005, 05:37 AM
Actually Leopard, I don't know if you have the E! channel where you are, but they have a show called the Michael Jackson Trial, which I saw for the first time tonight.

I don't have access to that show, but I'll look forward to further reviews from you. :wavey:

Veritas
Mar 12th, 2005, 05:38 AM
I don't believe Michael is sick enough, or even retarded enough, to go and do things such as fondling dicks and walking around nude in front of underaged kids.

I just find it unbelievable a guy who's pop career is legendary and who has such an enormous worldwide fanbase (rd: publicity) would be stupid enough to do something like this to ruin his career. Sure, he might have let teenaged guys to sleep on his bed, but I do think Jacko's sane enough to know where to draw the line between "friendly affection" and "downright sex".

Anyway, didn't the accuser launch a suit only after he was teased and bullied after the British journalist's documentary was aired? I'm going by what I heard, of course.

Denise4925
Mar 12th, 2005, 05:45 AM
I don't have access to that show, but I'll look forward to further reviews from you. :wavey:
More updates and reviews to come, if no one else beats me to it. ;)

Denise4925
Mar 12th, 2005, 05:46 AM
I don't believe Michael is sick enough, or even retarded enough, to go and do things such as fondling dicks and walking around nude in front of underaged kids.

I just find it unbelievable a guy who's pop career is legendary and who has such an enormous worldwide fanbase (rd: publicity) would be stupid enough to do something like this to ruin his career. Sure, he might have let teenaged guys to sleep on his bed, but I do think Jacko's sane enough to know where to draw the line between "friendly affection" and "downright sex".

Anyway, didn't the accuser launch a suit only after he was teased and bullied after the British journalist's documentary was aired? I'm going by what I heard, of course.
I'm not sure about your question. I think I heard something like that. But, I have nothing to go on.

Veritas
Mar 12th, 2005, 06:20 AM
I'm not sure about your question. I think I heard something like that. But, I have nothing to go on.

I'm not sure about this, but it was on an afternoon drive-home-from-school/work radio show that mentioned it. Apparently, the boy was so traumatised by all the teasing that he decided to launch a nationwide publicity lawsuit to repair his damaged ego. Again, it's pure speculation, but I found it interesting all the same ;)

Rocketta
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:05 PM
Jackson's Accuser Admits He Was Bad Student

2 hours, 22 minutes ago
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/my/addtomyyahoo3.gif (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/addtomy/*http://add.my.yahoo.com/content?id=6148&.src=yn&.done=http%3a//news.yahoo.com/news%3ftmpl=story%26cid=638%26e=2%26u=/nm/20050314/en_nm/crime_jackson_dc) Entertainment - Reuters (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/addtomy/*http://add.my.yahoo.com/content?id=6148&.src=yn&.done=http%3a//news.yahoo.com/news%3ftmpl=story%26cid=638%26e=2%26u=/nm/20050314/en_nm/crime_jackson_dc)



By Dan Whitcomb

SANTA MARIA, Calif. (Reuters) - The teenager who accuses Michael Jackson (news (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/celeb/nm/en_nm/crime_jackson_dc/14572319/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Michael%20Jackson%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw)) of sex abuse stayed cool under tough cross-examination on Monday, although he admitted he was disruptive at school and had been confused about sexuality.

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/nm/20050314/amdf894794.jpg (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050314/photos_en/mdf894794)
Reuters Photo (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050314/photos_en/mdf894794)
http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20050314/thumb.mjt12503142116.michael_jackson_mjt125.jpg (javascript: rs()
AP Photo (javascript: rs() http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/auctions/cam.gifSlideshow: Michael Jackson (javascript: rs()


The 15-year-old told jurors last week that Jackson, 46, masturbated him at least twice in February or March of 2003 after nights of heavy drinking at the singer's Neverland Valley Ranch.



Jackson is charged with molesting the boy, who was 13 at the time, plying him with alcohol in order to abuse him and conspiring to commit child abduction, extortion and false imprisonment.



Before grilling the boy on his central accusations against Jackson, lead defense lawyer Tom Mesereau confronted him with a string of complaints from teachers about disciplinary problems when he was younger, including getting into fights, disruption in class and bad grades.



"You had a meeting with (the school principal) because of allegations you had disciplinary problems," Mesereau said.



"No," the boy replied. "I had a meeting with him because I was a disciplinary problem. ... I wasn't that good of a kid then. I argued with teachers and stuff like that."



After causing a stir last week by arriving at court late, dressed in pajamas and looking shaky, Jackson was back to his popstar self on Monday, arriving on time in a bright red jacket and smart black pants with silver piping.



Jackson's lawyers, who say the boy's mother dreamed up the sex abuse to extort money from the self-proclaimed "King of Pop," are expected to do their utmost to undermine the boy's credibility.



Mesereau said the school principal had at one time asked the boy directly if Jackson had ever molested him. According to the transcript of the interview, the boy replied "No," the lawyer said. The boy acknowledged on the stand that he had responded no.



Mesereau also confronted the boy, who met Jackson when he was recovering from cancer, with an interview he gave to police around the time of his alleged molestation by the singer.



In that interview, the boy told police that his grandmother had told him that if men do not masturbate they end up raping women -- almost exactly the comment that Jackson is alleged to have made to the teen.



Standing firm, the boy told Mesereau he discussed masturbation with both Jackson and his grandmother. "Michael tried to explain to me first. He was more pushing it on me ... I guess my grandmother saw I was very confused about sexuality. She didn't make the identical quote."



The boy started his direct testimony last Thursday on a wild day that began with Jackson nearly jailed for missing court. The performer hobbled into the courthouse more than an hour after the scheduled trial start time -- in pajamas, appearing dazed and walking gingerly, as if in pain.

A Jackson attorney said the entertainer had tripped and injured his back while getting dressed, and gone to a hospital for treatment.

Rocketta
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:06 PM
Mesereau also confronted the boy, who met Jackson when he was recovering from cancer, with an interview he gave to police around the time of his alleged molestation by the singer.



In that interview, the boy told police that his grandmother had told him that if men do not masturbate they end up raping women -- almost exactly the comment that Jackson is alleged to have made to the teen.

Standing firm, the boy told Mesereau he discussed masturbation with both Jackson and his grandmother. "Michael tried to explain to me first. He was more pushing it on me ... I guess my grandmother saw I was very confused about sexuality. She didn't make the identical quote."

This is just bad.....these kids lie a lot. :sad:

apoet29
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:21 PM
I don't think Michael will be prosecuted. I really don't. While I think the boy is holding up well under cross-examination, the prosecution's witnesses have been caught in too many lies for them to be believable. Plus, I believe that the jurors feel that Michael is so scarred from his childhood that he may not know right from wrong.

harloo
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:26 PM
It's obvious the child is just lying. It's sad, but Michael is going down. He will not get away this time.

Rocketta
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:27 PM
I don't think Michael will be prosecuted. I really don't. While I think the boy is holding up well under cross-examination, the prosecution's witnesses have been caught in too many lies for them to be believable. Plus, I believe that the jurors feel that Michael is so scarred from his childhood that he may not know right from wrong.

how can you not have reasonable doubt when they keep getting caught in lie after lie after lie....how is anyone suppose to believe..."yes I lied about that but this I'm telling the truth about." :tape:

harloo
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:27 PM
I don't think Michael will be prosecuted. I really don't. While I think the boy is holding up well under cross-examination, the prosecution's witnesses have been caught in too many lies for them to be believable. Plus, I believe that the jurors feel that Michael is so scarred from his childhood that he may not know right from wrong.

apoet, I'm afraid I disagree with you. I think Michael is going to jail for sure, and the whole world will watch with excitement. Watch. The evidence really doesn't matter at this point, I expect a conviction.

apoet29
Mar 14th, 2005, 09:54 PM
apoet, I'm afraid I disagree with you. I think Michael is going to jail for sure, and the whole world will watch with excitement. Watch. The evidence really doesn't matter at this point, I expect a conviction.

Do you believe that because he is black?

RVD
Mar 15th, 2005, 12:42 AM
Do you believe that because he is black?:lol: Well, it's a known fact even in this day and age that an all white jury would never in a million years convict a Black man based on circumstantial evidence. http://deephousepage.com/smilies/Disappointed_anim.gif And neither would they ever ever convict based on no supporting evidence. We live in a utopian society where justice is dealt out to all fairly and equally. :kiss:
Ahhhh.... http://deephousepage.com/smilies/bis.gif Isn't it wonderful.

But heaven forebid we go there again. NO-No-No... :tape:

le bon vivant
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:01 AM
Do you believe that because he is black?

I think the fact that he has turned himself into a freak of nature hevaily dwarves the fact that he was born Black.

I wonder how come the actual molestation events has never been disproven, just mostly ad hominem attacks on the boy's credibility.

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:02 AM
I think the fact that he has turned himself into a freak of nature hevaily dwarves the fact that he was born Black.

I wonder how come the actual molestation events has never been disproven, just mostly ad hominem attacks on the boy's credibility.

That's how a trial goes. I'm sure the defense will get to that. He's going to show first that the boy has no credibility before he gets to the actual accusation.

Crazy Canuck
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:12 AM
:lol: Well, it's a known fact even in this day and age that an all white jury would never in a million years convict a Black man based on circumstantial evidence. http://deephousepage.com/smilies/Disappointed_anim.gif And neither would they ever ever convict based on no supporting evidence. We live in a utopian society where justice is dealt all to all fairly and equally. :kiss:
Ahhhh.... http://deephousepage.com/smilies/bis.gif Isn't it wonderful.

But heaven forebid we go there again. NO-No-No... :tape:
Ugh, what a moron.

harloo
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:21 AM
Do you believe that because he is black?
No, but here are the reasons I think he will be convicted.

1. Because he's Michael Jackson.

2. He's had one chance to get his act straight.

3. The jury was handpicked to convict him.

4. Americans love to build people celebrities up to tear them down.


Mike is going to jail.;)

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:22 AM
:lol: Well, it's a known fact even in this day and age that an all white jury would never in a million years convict a Black man based on circumstantial evidence. http://deephousepage.com/smilies/Disappointed_anim.gif And neither would they ever ever convict based on no supporting evidence. We live in a utopian society where justice is dealt all to all fairly and equally. :kiss:
Ahhhh.... http://deephousepage.com/smilies/bis.gif Isn't it wonderful.

But heaven forebid we go there again. NO-No-No... :tape:
:haha: :haha: :haha:

harloo
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:25 AM
:lol:
But heaven forebid we go there again. NO-No-No... :tape:

Alright ReeVee, lets not go there. You know how some people get about the subject.:lol: :tape:

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:28 AM
Alright ReeVee, lets not go there. You know how some people get about the subject.:lol: :tape:

Please not there again. :tape: :lol:

Crazy Canuck
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:32 AM
Alright ReeVee, lets not go there. You know how some people get about the subject.:lol: :tape:
Yes. Some people have low tolerance for people with low reading comprehension who completely fail to understand the point that was made 600 threads ago and continue to urinate all over the place. It's best we not reiterate. Some people are just stupid and would like to stay that way. I can't be bothered to try to make them see sense anymore.

RVD
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:34 AM
Ugh, what a moron.And look what came out of the woodwork. :haha:
Knew I'd catch a BIG one. :lol: :kiss:

RVD
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:36 AM
Yes. Some people have low tolerance for people with low reading comprehension who completely fail to understand the point that was made 600 threads ago and continue to urinate all over the place. It's best we not reiterate. Some people are just stupid and would like to stay that way. I can't be bothered to try to make them see sense anymore.This really has you upset hassn't it Crazy? What in the world happened to you that you are so touched off by my wonderfully lucid post? Don't worry babe, I still love you. :tape:

RVD
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:40 AM
That's how a trial goes. I'm sure the defense will get to that. He's going to show first that the boy has no credibility before he gets to the actual accusation.True. Still it's interesting that less is being said concerning the star witness' credibility than one would consider normal. Based on the past week and a half, the brother's credibility has taken several crucial blows. I wonder when the DA will seriously consider an alternative approach. Like maybe, Bubbles witnessing the crime. :lol:

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:43 AM
True. Still it's interesting that less is being said concerning the star witness' credibility than than one would consider normal. Based on the past week and a half, the brother's credibility has taken several crucial blows. I wonder when the DA will seriously consider an alternative approach. Like maybe, Bubbles witnessing the crime. :lol:
:tape: :lol:

RVD
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:55 AM
:tape: :lol::lol: It's good to keep a sense of humor about certain topics. Don't ya think? ;)

Question Denise...
Why do you think Crazy C couldn't simply come out and call me an asshole, rather than go and write a long drawn out dissertation : Yes. Some people have low tolerance for people with low reading comprehension who completely fail to understand the point that was made 600 threads ago and continue to urinate all over the place. It's best we not reiterate. Some people are just stupid and would like to stay that way. I can't be bothered to try to make them see sense anymore.Sometimes a direct approach works better than some pseudo-intellectual-anally-challenged-pompous-ass-BIYACTH-approach. :lol:

Your turn Crazy! :wavey:

le bon vivant
Mar 15th, 2005, 02:05 AM
No, but here are the reasons I think he will be convicted.

1. Because he's Michael Jackson.

2. He's had one chance to get his act straight.

3. The jury was handpicked to convict him.

4. Americans love to build people celebrities up to tear them down.


Mike is going to jail.;)

But the defense picks the jury...:tape::lol:

le bon vivant
Mar 15th, 2005, 02:08 AM
That's how a trial goes. I'm sure the defense will get to that. He's going to show first that the boy has no credibility before he gets to the actual accusation.

Oh OK, I hope so. I was thinking this was all they had...:o:tape:

harloo
Mar 15th, 2005, 03:10 AM
:lol: It's good to keep a sense of humor about certain topics. Don't ya think? ;)

Question Denise...
Why do you think Crazy C couldn't simply come out and call me an asshole, rather than go and write a long drawn out dissertation : Sometimes a direct approach works better than some pseudo-intellectual-anally-challenged-pompous-ass-BIYACTH-approach. :lol:

Your turn Crazy! :wavey:

:haha: :haha: :haha:

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 04:00 AM
:lol: It's good to keep a sense of humor about certain topics. Don't ya think? ;)

Question Denise...
Why do you think Crazy C couldn't simply come out and call me an asshole, rather than go and write a long drawn out dissertation : Sometimes a direct approach works better than some pseudo-intellectual-anally-challenged-pompous-ass-BIYACTH-approach. :lol:

Your turn Crazy! :wavey:
Okay, that's just too funny. :haha: :haha: :haha:

Denise4925
Mar 15th, 2005, 04:01 AM
But the defense picks the jury...:tape::lol:

No, they both do. But, it's more of an exclusion thing, then a picking thing.

apoet29
Mar 15th, 2005, 01:03 PM
No, but here are the reasons I think he will be convicted.

1. Because he's Michael Jackson.

2. He's had one chance to get his act straight.

3. The jury was handpicked to convict him.

4. Americans love to build people celebrities up to tear them down.


Mike is going to jail.;)

I agree with those reasons, but there is a part of me that doesn't believe that Mike is going to jail. I can't explain why.

Rocketta
Mar 17th, 2005, 12:37 AM
Boy Said Jackson Groped Him 5-7 Times, Jury Told

Wed Mar 16, 4:17 PM ET
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By Dan Whitcomb

SANTA MARIA, Calif. (Reuters) - The teen accusing Michael Jackson (news (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/celeb/nm/en_nm/crime_jackson_dc/14596955/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Michael%20Jackson%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw)) of sex abuse told police he thought the singer had molested him five to seven times but could only remember the details of two occasions, the lead investigator in the case testified on Wednesday.

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/nm/20050316/amdf897262.jpg (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050316/photos_ts/mdf897262)
Reuters Photo (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050316/photos_ts/mdf897262)
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(Reuters Video)

"He told me specifically about two events. He believes it happened between five to seven times. He could not articulate what happened but believed it happened five to seven times," Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Sgt. Steve Robel told the jury in Jackson's trial.



Robel also said the boy became withdrawn when he first told police about the alleged abuse at Jackson's Neverland ranch.



"I immediately noticed a major change in (his) demeanor. He became very, very quiet, folded his arms and sunk down in the chair. At one point in time he got a little choked up," said Robel.



The boy, who was 13 at the time of the allegations, testified last week that Jackson masturbated him at least twice at Neverland in February or March of 2003.



The teenager, who met Jackson when he was recovering from cancer, stepped down from the witness stand on Tuesday after defiant exchanges with Jackson's defense lawyer.



Wednesday's proceedings had few of the fireworks that marked the first two weeks of the trial when Jackson's accuser, his younger brother and older sister painted a lurid picture of heavy drinking and pornography with the singer behind the doors of Neverland.



Jackson is charged with committing lewd acts on his young accuser, plying him with alcohol in order to abuse him and conspiring to commit extortion, false imprisonment and child abduction.



The entertainer, who wore an electric blue jacket, aquamarine vest and black satin pants to court on Wednesday, has pleaded not guilty. He faces more than 20 years in prison if convicted on all counts.



Both Robel and another sheriff's deputy, Det. Paul Zelis, showed the jury pornographic magazines found stuffed in a box, in a briefcase in Jackson's closet, and in a night stand beside the singer's bed.

Zelis said a picture of the three children in the case was also found in the night stand. Most of the adult magazines featured naked women.

PaulieM
Mar 17th, 2005, 12:50 AM
:eek: the kid has cancer?? didn't know that before
sorry mike, whether the kid is lying or not he's got bonus victim sympathy points you're going to the slammer

Rocketta
Mar 17th, 2005, 12:56 AM
:eek: the kid has cancer?? didn't know that before
sorry mike, whether the kid is lying or not he's got bonus victim sympathy points you're going to the slammer

yeah but what I've heard from people who have been in the court the kid didn't seem too likable. :unsure: That the only sympathy he's garnering is the fact that he had cancer. Who knows what's going on in the mind of the jury though. :tape:

moon
Mar 17th, 2005, 01:12 AM
why is anyone bothering to believe anything that comes out of this kids mouth at this point? :confused: It seems like every day he has a new story.

harloo
Mar 17th, 2005, 04:20 AM
:eek: the kid has cancer?? didn't know that before
sorry mike, whether the kid is lying or not he's got bonus victim sympathy points you're going to the slammer

I will have to agree with you on this one. Even though it looks like everyone in the family including the boy is lying, Mike is going down .

Rocketta
Mar 17th, 2005, 05:42 AM
Jurors See Michael Jackson's Porn Collection

Wed Mar 16, 8:46 PM ET
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By Dan Whitcomb

SANTA MARIA, Calif. (Reuters) - Jurors in Michael Jackson (news (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/celeb/nm/people_nm/crime_jackson_dc/14599809/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Michael%20Jackson%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw))'s child molestation trial on Wednesday saw pornographic magazines, DVDs and books that were seized from the pop star's bedroom and could bolster the testimony of his young accuser.

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/nm/20050316/amdf897262.jpg (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050316/photos_ts/mdf897262)
Reuters Photo (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050316/photos_ts/mdf897262)
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(Reuters Video)

Although prosecutors did not link the sexually explicit material directly to their case against Jackson, the accuser and his brother have said the 46-year-old entertainer showed them pornography in his bedroom.



According to three police witnesses, the material was found in two briefcases in Jackson's bedroom, a box at the foot of his bed, a nightstand, a plastic bag, a computer case next to his bathroom sink, on the edge of his Jacuzzi-style bathtub, in a bathroom closet and stacked on a television.



It included magazines -- with titles such as "Barely Legal" and "Teenage" -- which feature young women meant to appear underage, along with more mainstream publications such as "Penthouse" and erotic books by well-known photographers.



Most of the magazines and videotapes featured grown women, but Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Deputy Karen Shepherd testified to finding a book titled "Camp Cove, Photos of Sydney Men," and another titled "Dress up: Playacts and Fantasies of Childhood."



Among the videotapes seized in the police raid was one titled "Believe It or Not," which promised a variety of unusual sex acts.



On cross-examination by Jackson defense attorney Robert Sanger, each of the police witnesses agreed the material was legal to possess and that the singer's young accuser had not remembered seeing any particular magazine or DVD.



In fact, the officers conceded, some of the magazines and DVDs were not published or released until after the young boy and his family left Jackson's Neverland Valley Ranch for the last time in March 2003.



In one instance, Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Detective Victor Alvarez was unable to confirm the release date of a DVD in late March 2003 because the print on the label was too small -- until Jackson lent him his reading glasses from his seat at the defense table.



The entertainer, who came to court dressed in an electric blue jacket, satin pants, an aquamarine vest and waist chain, is charged with molesting a then 13-year-old boy in February or March 2003.



He is also accused of plying the boy with alcohol in order to abuse him and conspiring to commit child abduction, extortion and false imprisonment. Jackson, who has pleaded innocent, faces more than two decades in prison if he is convicted on all 10 criminal counts.



Earlier on Wednesday, a police detective testified Jackson's young accuser told police he thought the singer had molested him five to seven times but could only remember the details of two occasions.



Santa Barbara County Sheriff's Sgt. Steve Robel said the boy became withdrawn when he first told police about the alleged abuse, adding: "He became very, very quiet, folded his arms and sunk down in the chair. At one point in time he got a little choked up."

RVD
Mar 17th, 2005, 07:38 AM
QUESTIONS:

If Michael likes little pre-pubescent boys, why does he only have girlie magazines? Wouldn't he also maintain a computer full of 'little boy' images? Or at least a private stash somewhere?

Why is it unusual that a grown man has girlie magazines in the first place? Wouldn't it be unusual if he didn't?

Wasn't it already established that the boy lied about the girlie mags; the dates; the particular titles?

How can the jury be convinced that this family is credible in the least? Wasn't it successfully established that the entire family has a history of fabricating stories to either, elicit financial assistance from TV personalities, or stealing ?

I wasn't before, but now I'm very interested in how this jury (...of Michael's peers) will view the 'evidence'.

Rocketta
Mar 17th, 2005, 01:36 PM
QUESTIONS:

If Michael likes little pre-pubescent boys, why does he only have girlie magazines? Wouldn't he also maintain a computer full of 'little boy' images? Or at least a private stash somewhere?

Why is it unusual that a grown man has girlie magazines in the first place? Wouldn't it be unusual if he didn't?

Wasn't it already established that the boy lied about the girlie mags; the dates; the particular titles?

How can the jury be convinced that this family is credible in the least? Wasn't it successfully established that the entire family has a history of fabricating stories to either, elicit financial assistance from TV personalities, or stealing ?

I wasn't before, but now I'm very interested in how this jury (...of Michael's peers) will view the 'evidence'.

I agree that these magazines don't support the claim that Michael like little boys that's probably why the prosecution backed away from making that claim. Plus the fact that a majority of them came out after the boy left. You're right though if he had porn of that variety when the boy was there he would still have the same kind when the cops came.

I would guess a lot of "single" grown men would have porn around. Only problem I can see with that is the fact that he has young children.....

harloo
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:25 PM
Jackson trial resumes with battle over computer porn

1 hour, 44 minutes ago
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SANTA MARIA, United States (AFP) - Prosecutors in Michael Jackson's child sex trial asked for permission to tell jurors about thousands of erotic pictures found on computers in the star's home.

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The request came out of earshot of the trial jury after the "King of Pop," who is suffering what aides say is "intolerable" back pain, arrived at court in California looking fit and much healthier than in recent days.



Jackson, who shuffled into court late before bursting into tears on Monday, turned up about 20 minutes early wearing a dark suit, bronze vest and gold medallion.



He smiled and waved to fans and appeared to be walking far more easily than in recent days.



Inside the courtroom, prosecutors asked Judge Rodney Melville to allow them to bring into evidence three computers and four hard-drives containing pornographic images, mostly of teens, seized at Jackson's Neverland Ranch.



It was at Neverland that Jackson is accused of molesting a 13-year-old boy two years ago after allegedly plying him with alcohol and breaking down his inhibitions by showing him raunchy pictures.



Prosecutor Gordon Auchincloss told the judge that one of the computers contained 1,700 downloaded pictures of "erotic material," most of it involving teenagers. One of the sites was called "Teen Steam."



The computer images -- most of them downloaded in 1998 and some between September and November 2003 -- were "the circumstantial link that provides powerful corroboration for our witness in this case," Auchincloss said.



He said that two of the computers also contained cached downloads from adoption websites complete with pictures of potential adoptees.



But Jackson's lawyer Robert Sanger fought back at the attempts to tell trial jurors about the computer evidence, saying that the material was heterosexual and that there was no proof that Jackson had ever looked at the pictures.



In addition, he said, none of the material was relevant to allegations that Jackson abused the young cancer survivor in February or March of 2003 as it was not downloaded or viewed during that period.



"None of the four computers have any material on them that was subject to the time period of interest here," Sanger told the judge, adding that there was nothing illegal about any of the images found on the computers.



Judge Melville declined to immediately rule on the prosecution request, but said he was inclined to bar prosecutors from showing jurors the material.



"I have serious reservations about putting this on. I'm not prepared to rule, although I'm leaning towards excluding it," Melville told the court.



Jackson has pleaded innocent to 10 charges, including molestation, plying the boy with alcohol and conspiring to kidnap the boy and his family and hold them prisoner. He faces up to 20 years in prison if convicted.



Jackson's lawyers maintain that the accuser's family made up the accusations as part of a bid to extort money from him.



Since testimony in the trial began on February 28, the now 15-year-old accuser and his brother, who is a year younger, have told jurors that Jackson showed them erotic magazines and websites and gave them alcohol.







The star's alleged victim said he was fondled by Jackson on at least two occasions in his bedroom at Neverland, near the California town of Santa Maria where his trial is underway.

Jurors were brought into the courtroom after the argument over whether to allow the computer images into evidence to hear a detective tell how he sealed evidence seized in a November 18, 2003 police search of Neverland.

Santa Barbara Sheriff's Department Detective Robert Cooley was responsible for bagging and documenting the items seized at the sprawling, fantasy-themed estate's amusement arcade.

Cooley said that while he was not specifically told the items would be dusted for fingerprints, he sealed them in a way that would allow prints and DNA analysis to be carried out at a later stage.

harloo
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:30 PM
Michael is going down. ;)

Denise4925
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:41 PM
I agree that these magazines don't support the claim that Michael like little boys that's probably why the prosecution backed away from making that claim. Plus the fact that a majority of them came out after the boy left. You're right though if he had porn of that variety when the boy was there he would still have the same kind when the cops came.

I would guess a lot of "single" grown men would have porn around. Only problem I can see with that is the fact that he has young children.....
But he hid it and anybody with children knows that you hide your porn. :p

Denise4925
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:45 PM
Michael is going down. ;)
No, it's not relevant. I'd be surprised if the judge let this inflammatory evidence in. It's prejudicial.

~ The Leopard ~
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:59 PM
We seem to have a desperate prosecution here. Wtf does it have to do with a case involving homosexual pedophilia that the guy has legal heterosexual porn on his computer?

Denise4925
Mar 23rd, 2005, 09:59 PM
We seem to have a desperate prosecution here. Wtf does it have to do with a case involving homosexual pedophilia that the guy has legal heterosexual porn on his computer?
Nothing that I can see. :rolleyes:

Crazy Canuck
Mar 23rd, 2005, 10:32 PM
We seem to have a desperate prosecution here. Wtf does it have to do with a case involving homosexual pedophilia that the guy has legal heterosexual porn on his computer?
Because people who view porn are more likely to molest children of the same sex! Isn't it obvious? :confused:

/sarcasm

Rocketta
Apr 2nd, 2005, 03:37 PM
Jackson Accuser Had No Plans to Cash In-Lawyer

Fri Apr 1, 8:51 PM ET
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By Dan Whitcomb

SANTA MARIA, Calif. (Reuters) - Michael Jackson (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/celeb/nm/en_nm/crime_jackson_dc/14751948/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Michael%20Jackson%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw)'s accuser and his family have never planned to cash in on child molestation accusations with a civil lawsuit, a family lawyer told jurors on Friday in the pop singer's criminal trial.

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Reuters Photo (http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/050401/photos_en/mdf915416)
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(AP Video)

In a charged exchange between two of California's leading lawyers, Jackson's attorney Tom Mesereau repeatedly questioned lawyer Larry Feldman about any potential plans by the accuser's family to sue Jackson.



Jackson's lawyers say the family has charged the pop singer falsely to subsequently enrich themselves in a separate civil suit.



Jackson is charged with molesting the boy at his Neverland Valley Ranch and with plying the youth with alcohol in order to abuse him. He is also accused of conspiring to commit child abduction, false imprisonment and extortion.



The pop star has pleaded innocent. He faces more than two decades in prison if convicted.



Feldman, who has consulted with the family, repeatedly denied there were plans for a civil lawsuit but acknowledged that another boy he represented in a civil suit in 1993 won a significant settlement from Jackson.



"I had no plans to file a lawsuit" in the current case, he said at one point. "I have never been asked to file any lawsuit against Michael Jackson," he added, referring specifically to the current case.



But he conceded the accuser, now 15, had the legal right to sue Jackson for about five more years.



Though prosecution witnesses are barred by Superior Court Judge Rodney Melville from telling the jury how much Jackson paid the boy, Feldman said the case was "absolutely resolved in (the accuser's) favor."



Feldman also told the jury that after Jackson paid the family in 1993 the boy stopped cooperating with authorities, who never brought criminal charges against the singer.



Feldman's testimony also set the stage for the next phase of Jackson's trial, which will begin next week and feature nine prosecution witnesses to testify about past accusations of sexual misconduct by the embattled superstar involving adolescent boys.



The boy who accused Jackson in 1993, who is now in his 20s, has reportedly been unwilling to take part in the trial and is not expected to testify, though prosecutors have listed his mother as a witness.



Feldman said it was Jackson's legal team at the time who insisted on paying the boy's parents as part of the settlement "because they (Jackson's lawyers) didn't want anybody ever talking about this."



Jackson did not admit guilt in the 1993 case.



Attorneys for the 46-year-old entertainer say the current molestation allegations were invented by the mother of the boy, who was 13 at the time.

Rocketta
Apr 2nd, 2005, 03:38 PM
didn't they go to the lawyer before they went to the cops? and the lawyer just happened to be the lawyer of a kid that got a settlement out of Michael before? but they are not looking for a civil suit. :speakles:

Experimentee
Apr 2nd, 2005, 03:55 PM
If they are lying, then it is sick that they would try to ruin someones life just for a few dollars :rolleyes:
MJ does need psychological help, but he doesnt deserve to go to jail.