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khyber
Jan 21st, 2005, 07:50 PM
I started to watch the delayed coverage of the Sharapova match on ESPN but ended turning it off because I couldn't stand the constant screaming/grunting of Maria. Now, I'm sure this has been discussed a thousand times here already, but I don't think I'm the only person that finds this too distracting. Maybe I can try watching the match without the sound, but I do actually like to hear the commentators because sometimes they are informative.

I understand that sometimes you grunt when making a huge effort but I don't think I'm going to be able to watch and enjoy her tennis as it progresses. I don't like anyone who constantly grunts, but Maria's volume and shriek level are in a class by themselves.

Am I being silly?

SerialKiller#69
Jan 21st, 2005, 07:51 PM
i assume you don't like seles.:shrug:

pla
Jan 21st, 2005, 07:59 PM
khyber, you are not silly. It's disturbing from time to time but try to ignore it. Maria is an exciting player to watch and it would be pitty to miss her matches because of that.

For the record in the begging I didn't like Seles because of her grunt but then she worked on it and I learnt myself to ignore it so at the end it was great to watch her :D (I mean by pure tennis-pleasure I've never been a Seles fan)

rockbottom
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:03 PM
I started to watch the delayed coverage of the Sharapova match on ESPN but ended turning it off because I couldn't stand the constant screaming/grunting of Maria. Now, I'm sure this has been discussed a thousand times here already, but I don't think I'm the only person that finds this too distracting. Maybe I can try watching the match without the sound, but I do actually like to hear the commentators because sometimes they are informative.

I understand that sometimes you grunt when making a huge effort but I don't think I'm going to be able to watch and enjoy her tennis as it progresses. I don't like anyone who constantly grunts, but Maria's volume and shriek level are in a class by themselves.

Am I being silly?
Then don't watch her ya dumbass, did someone force you to watch her. turn the channel, clean your toilet whatever who gives a shit.

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:08 PM
Then don't watch her ya dumbass, did someone force you to watch her. turn the channel, clean your toilet whatever who gives a shit.


But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

:confused:

XaDavK_Kapri
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:12 PM
But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

:confused:
:haha:

ans
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:16 PM
I have the same problem with dementieva's "barking";)

baleineau
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:18 PM
they should leave the grunting behind them when they play the seniors tour. its childish and unnecessary.

Serena!
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:24 PM
Yeah! I agree, but, Maria is the only one who is hard to watch. Venus and Serena make loud grunts, but, they're not SCREAMS! I just think it's kinda annoying to watch, and probably distracting to her opponents! lol

*Jean*
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:26 PM
Hummm !! How not to like the screaming ??!! I loooooove the screaming/grunting of Sharapova, Lee-Waters, Linetskaya...:) That gives some emotion and some pulse to the matches, moreover if they are full of tense...it's exciting !! Not sexually exciting...but just exciting ^^

TFan1156
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:27 PM
Am I being silly?

Not at all. The way you feel is the way you feel... However, Maria herself is not concerned at all about how the grunts effect fans. She is there for one reason and one reason only, to win a tournament. She blocks out the rest, and in spite of the grunts, I am sure she will continue to attract many spectators. Guess you only have two choices, cut off the sound or listen to it...

R&J
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:28 PM
But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

:confused:

Just a matter of opinion. I like the grunting :yeah:

AjdeNate!
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:29 PM
I love the noise. You can watch tennis with your eyes closed and still know who's winning. :lol:

casino
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:56 PM
Personally I think grunting makes matches exciting. I remember there was even a wta tour commercial and the whole time they were focusing on the grunts during the commercial. It's exciting for tennis. Of course with Sharapova it might be too much (I didn't see this particular match), but I have no problem with the grunts of Serena, Seles, Venus, Dementieva, etc. I wish more people would do it because it adds more intensity, drama and excitement.

alfajeffster
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:58 PM
But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

:confused:

You're just hateful, you know that Cali?!?:lol:

alfajeffster
Jan 21st, 2005, 08:58 PM
P.S.- it's only a matter of time before we have feminine bleeding on court...

katiektc
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:03 PM
P.S.- it's only a matter of time before we have feminine bleeding on court...

Emh.....what?

Martian KC
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:04 PM
Does anyone remember what happened when the umpire apologised to the crowd?
I missed it.

faboozadoo15
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:06 PM
i like grunting... and i would find it difficult to likie women's tennis if you cant take grunts. there are several girls who are louder than maria.

Go_Ruskies
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:09 PM
I don't the grunting all that much. For some reason it's a bit more annoying on T.V. than when you hear it live.

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:35 PM
I love the noise. You can watch tennis with your eyes closed and still know who's winning. :lol:


There are three good tests for you:

Watche videos of the following matches with you eyes closed and try to guess who is winning:

USO 95 final
USO 96 final
FO 98 final

Well?

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:38 PM
Personally I think grunting makes matches exciting. I remember there was even a wta tour commercial and the whole time they were focusing on the grunts during the commercial. It's exciting for tennis. Of course with Sharapova it might be too much (I didn't see this particular match), but I have no problem with the grunts of Serena, Seles, Venus, Dementieva, etc. I wish more people would do it because it adds more intensity, drama and excitement.


Wow, then you are one of those guys who buy all those X-rated videos with grunting women?
:confused:

bronco
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:48 PM
Seles was nearly banned for her grunting she upset Navratilova one year big style probably cos she was kicking martina's butt on grass lol

then she shut up in the final and steffi as a result made her look stupid.

serena should be spoken too her grunt does put people off because its pure aggression its like she wants to fight not play tennis

most of the girls today play very aggressive and they all scream its more of a scream then a grunt caused by physical effort.

if you are new to tennis i suggest you go back a few years and watch matches of sabatini v graf and navratilova and see how tennis should be played

honest people putting effort into it and none of this psyco bullshit that todays prima donna's get into.

long live the real ladies of tennis :)

Teemu
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:49 PM
Doesn't bother me at all.

casino
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:57 PM
There are three good tests for you:

Watche videos of the following matches with you eyes closed and try to guess who is winning:

USO 95 final
USO 96 final
FO 98 final

Well?

Why do you hate Seles so much? I understand that you're obsessed with Steffi, but no need to put down Monica any chance you get wether her accomplishements or even the effects of the stabbing. I bet you celebrated when Monica was stabbed. :rolleyes:

Maria Croft
Jan 21st, 2005, 09:59 PM
it's not like she is grunting on purpose or anything like that, some other players like schiavone have really annying sounds as well, you should deal with it or just change the channel, that's part of wta tennis, and it always will be. First we had seles, now we have sharapova, in ten years from now i'm sure there will be a new grunter lol !!

wipeout
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:02 PM
I remember Serena once played a dropshot or a volley at Wimbledon that involved almost no movement or effort of any kind but she still grunted loudly anyway. :lol:

It's a nervous habit to some extent, I guess. :)

I lean left and right and duck when playing videogames so I can't talk about unconscious things we do that don't make any sense. :o ;)

I wonder if it's something players start doing unconsciously when they're young because they feel the pressure from coach, parents, etc. to do well so they grunt loudly to show or at least sound like they are trying their hardest.

PointBlank
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:05 PM
Her grunting is not like Seles..Monica does it everywhere..Maria picks and chooses to use it..in Memphis she never grunted..Wimbledon she sounds like shes gettin punched when she hits the ball..

Maria Croft
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:06 PM
sometimes she is quite yeah, but when she really wants to win points she starts to grunt, it's her way of working harder for her points I guess !! Nothing wrong with that.

Knizzle
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:08 PM
There are other russians with similar grunts as Maria, but they don't do it every shot, every point like her. I think that's what annoys some people.

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:08 PM
Seles was nearly banned for her grunting she upset Navratilova one year big style probably cos she was kicking martina's butt on grass lol

then she shut up in the final and steffi as a result made her look stupid.
...


:lol:
What, Seles was nearly BANNED for her grunting?
Is this a new Selesian fantasy in the Selesian parallel universe?

Maria Croft
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:10 PM
There are other russians with similar grunts as Maria, but they don't do it every shot, every point like her. I think that's what annoys some people.


But sharapova doesn't grunt all the time ;)

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:13 PM
Why do you hate Seles so much? I understand that you're obsessed with Steffi, but no need to put down Monica any chance you get wether her accomplishements or even the effects of the stabbing. I bet you celebrated when Monica was stabbed. :rolleyes:


No, I left the Hamburg stadium very subdued as all the fans did that fateful day.

BTW, I don't hate Seles. I don't even hate her ugly style of tennis which contradicts everything I expect from women's tennis. Actually she is a nice girl. But I have realized from reading in WTAWorld that Selesians are the most delusional fans of them all. No excuse is too cheap to be used again and again.

volta
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:24 PM
i do have a prob with that and i think that she feels that she needs to stop at least to scream so loud cuz against Li the crowd was laughing @ it and even one person imitaded that. sure yall can compare her to Vee to Seles but this 3 don´t scream the same way don´t get me wrong but Maria scream is pretty annoying.
yes sometimes i changed the channel when i was seeing a Seles game cuz those screams were very high but she learned to control them. so does Maria has to do just learn to control them or she´s gonna have the same probs with the other players that Seles had.
oh Dementieva is also a bit annoying lol

Knizzle
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:34 PM
But sharapova doesn't grunt all the time ;)
More than any other player I've seen.

T-T
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:35 PM
The ladies are cute when they do it. But I'm absolutely allergic to Gustavo Kuerten's moans.

deep bass
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:35 PM
In the final game today there was no screaming although you could clearly hear her breath exhale on contact with the ball, and she won it no problem.

As an aside, the commentators on Eurosport were saying that if the press picked up on the noise (and the 'shut up' from the crowd during the penultimate game) the crowd could take against her if she kept it up.

casino
Jan 21st, 2005, 10:58 PM
No, I left the Hamburg stadium very subdued as all the fans did that fateful day.

BTW, I don't hate Seles. I don't even hate her ugly style of tennis which contradicts everything I expect from women's tennis. Actually she is a nice girl. But I have realized from reading in WTAWorld that Selesians are the most delusional fans of them all. No excuse is too cheap to be used again and again.

I'm sorry, but Martina Navratilova, Bud Collins, Tracy Austin, Virginia Wade, John McEnroe, Chris Evert, Pam Shriver, Mary Carillo, Billie Jean King and basically every huge tennis expert have said a million times that Monica's stabbing litterally changed women's tennis history and that she was on her way to become the greatest ever. It's not the "delusional Seles fans" who only believe it, it's the WORLD. These experts also said that Monica never became the same player after the stabbing both mentally and game wise. The only people who are delusional are the Graf fans (such as yourself) who want to dismiss the stabbing as nothing too significant to women's tennis history. All the rest of the world, including the most important people in tennis, have spoken thousands of times on how the stabbing changed women's tennis history and both the careers of Monica & Steffi to a huge degree. So get your facts straight.

Kart
Jan 21st, 2005, 11:57 PM
Selesians are the most delusional fans of them all.
Yet don't include the most delusional fan of all though :p.

Still I'm in a good mood today and anyway you're in positive credit with me these days sweetheart for your love of Gaby - which shines through despite your attempts to hide by pretending to be a Steffi fan :kiss:.

Calimero377
Jan 21st, 2005, 11:59 PM
I'm sorry, but Martina Navratilova, Bud Collins, Tracy Austin, Virginia Wade, John McEnroe, Chris Evert, Pam Shriver, Mary Carillo, Billie Jean King and basically every huge tennis expert have said a million times that Monica's stabbing litterally changed women's tennis history and that she was on her way to become the greatest ever. It's not the "delusional Seles fans" who only believe it, it's the WORLD. These experts also said that Monica never became the same player after the stabbing both mentally and game wise. The only people who are delusional are the Graf fans (such as yourself) who want to dismiss the stabbing as nothing too significant to women's tennis history. All the rest of the world, including the most important people in tennis, have spoken thousands of times on how the stabbing changed women's tennis history and both the careers of Monica & Steffi to a huge degree. So get your facts straight.


How many percent of your tennis experts are from the U.S.?
And Monica Seles is a citizen of which country exactly?

And even those experts didn't say that Seles was "on her way to become the greatest ever".
Seles had not the same success as a 22+year-old as a teenager.
Same with so many other players. Austin, Jaeger, Sabatini, Hingis, Venus come to mind. And who knows whether Serena, Henin and Clijsters may have their best times behind them already.

Kart
Jan 21st, 2005, 11:59 PM
As for Sharapova - yes she's noisy but most TVs have adjustable volume so adjust :).

Bezz
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:02 AM
She only gets really loud and on most points when its a close match, or the points are long. Seles and Serena shout, scream and growl jsut as loud.

casino
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:15 AM
How many percent of your tennis experts are from the U.S.?
And Monica Seles is a citizen of which country exactly?

And even those experts didn't say that Seles was "on her way to become the greatest ever".
Seles had not the same success as a 22+year-old as a teenager.
Same with so many other players. Austin, Jaeger, Sabatini, Hingis, Venus come to mind. And who knows whether Serena, Henin and Clijsters may have their best times behind them already.

Again, Monica was STABBED on the tennis court and left for years, she was in a depression, she was just 19 when she was stabbed. Her approach to tennis was never the same after that event, her outlook on tennis changed. For you to assume that her results when she cameback in her 20's up until now would have been the same if she had continued to played without the stabbing is RIDICULOUS. The stabbing is part of her now and we will never know how a Seles without stabbing. Her whole outlook and dedication on tennis would have been totally different. Just the fact that she still refuses to play in Germany shows that it's still on her mind. After the stabbing, she litterally became ANOTHER person and a tennis player with a different mental approach to the game. Without the stabbing, she would have been going for all sorts of records and her focus would have been 100% on tennis, not an attitude like "I'm just happy to be here" like all the years after the comeback. :rolleyes:

Also, what does nationality have to do with anything?????? A DONKEY would be able to know that the stabbing changed tennis history and everyone in the world knows it including experts from all over the world.

Lemonskin.
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:31 AM
How did a thread about Sharapova turn into another discussion of Seles' stabbing? :lol:

casino
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:34 AM
How did a thread about Sharapova turn into another discussion of Seles' stabbing? :lol:

Camilero like usual put down Monica by mentionning her losses. Then when I asked him why he always put her down, he started talking about how the stabbing was meaningless and how Seles fans are crazy. Talk about hate and ignorance. I told him how all the experts have said how huge was the stabbing to tennis history, but now he saids oh it's because Monica is a US citicizen so they are being nice to her. He's just an idiot! :lol:

fammmmedspin
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:37 AM
I'm sorry, but Martina Navratilova, Bud Collins, Tracy Austin, Virginia Wade, John McEnroe, Chris Evert, Pam Shriver, Mary Carillo, Billie Jean King and basically every huge tennis expert have said a million times that Monica's stabbing litterally changed women's tennis history and that she was on her way to become the greatest ever. It's not the "delusional Seles fans" who only believe it, it's the WORLD. These experts also said that Monica never became the same player after the stabbing both mentally and game wise. The only people who are delusional are the Graf fans (such as yourself) who want to dismiss the stabbing as nothing too significant to women's tennis history. All the rest of the world, including the most important people in tennis, have spoken thousands of times on how the stabbing changed women's tennis history and both the careers of Monica & Steffi to a huge degree. So get your facts straight.
"Change" is an entirely neutral verb - it just means it would have been different. Obviously it changed history.

You can't conclude from that though that she was certain to become the greatest player ever (whatever that means) Its plain silly - she could have won 20 more GS or 0 additional GS. They said the same thing about Hingis and Venus and look what happened there too.

casino
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:41 AM
"Change" is an entirely neutral verb - it just means it would have been different. Obviously it changed history.

You can't conclude from that though that she was certain to become the greatest player ever (whatever that means) Its plain silly - she could have won 20 more GS or 0 additional GS. They said the same thing about Hingis and Venus and look what happened there too.

And without the stabbing Graf could have also won 0 slams too. Everything would have been different with Monica still around, including Steffi's draws and her being seeded at the opposite half. Also Steffi's approach and confidence became bigger with the dominant #1 woman OUT. My point is: The stabbing DID have a huge effect on tennis. The no.1 player who won the 7 of the last 8 grandslams she entered, including 3-1 in grandslam finals against Graf, was knocked out from tennis. It doesn't take a genius that the odds for her to have continued winning many slams are HUGE.

Also Hingis stopped winning because many huge players came including Davenport, Venus and Serena. The game became more powerful. Up until 1996, Monica would have played the same exact field, it was still Graf vs Aranxta vs Sabatini vs Conchita for years. So it was very different from the Hingis situation where she stopped winning because of the arrival of Davenport, Venus, Serena.

fammmmedspin
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:43 AM
Its not the grunting its the shouting after and within points. At some point someone is going to apply the intimidation or distracting or interrupting play rules. That will make the "hand" and "I saw the ball out" issues look trivial. Wasn't there a thread about someone doing this in some challenger? You expect it would have happened by now but for the fact its very difficult to define allowable and illegal noise once the grunting cat was let out of the bag.

andrewC
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:47 AM
Nothing against Sharapova, she's a great player but i think she does have the most annoying grunt on the tour today... She grunts when volleying, when in a not-too-strenuous rally, grunts when serving, then grunts even louder when she attempts to hit a winner. argh! lol :D

SpikeyAidanm
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:49 AM
I don't mind it, my Step Dad hates it tho lol

Chunchun
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:50 AM
:eek:

I love Maria or others' grunting :drool:

Doc
Jan 22nd, 2005, 12:55 AM
I find it odd that its only the women who seem to get hassled about grunting.

Why the double-standard when the average male match sounds like a gorilla mating frenzy?

fammmmedspin
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:00 AM
And without the stabbing Graf could have also won 0 slams too. Everything would have been different with Monica still around, including Steffi's draws and her being seeded at the opposite half. Also Steffi's approach and confidence became bigger with the dominant #1 woman OUT. My point is: The stabbing DID have a huge effect on tennis. The no.1 player who won the 7 of the last 8 grandslams she entered, including 3-1 in grandslam finals against Graf, was knocked out from tennis. It doesn't take a genius that the odds for her to have continued winning many slams are HUGE.

Also Hingis stopped winning because many huge players came including Davenport, Venus and Serena. The game became more powerful. Up until 1996, Monica would have played the same exact field, it was still Graf vs Aranxta vs Sabatini vs Conchita for years. So it was very different from the Hingis situation where she stopped winning because of the arrival of Davenport, Venus, Serena.
Yes but you are taking the main point that history changed in unknowable direction in 93 and then defining some of the possible directions. Problem is they are infinite . For example : its also possible that Wimbledon 92 or USO 95 were the future pattern of Graf-Seles relations not AO 93. Graf could have got even better than she did with more challenge. Novotna, ASV, MJF could have been better if Steffi hadn't beaten them so much. Someone like Huber could have had a completely different career if every GS draw after AO93 was different and her confidence had grown.The point is anything could have happened. Even if there was any evidence (and the notion of Monica's dominance of Graf rests entirely on AO93 given Fo92 and W 92) you can't extrapolate unknowables.

Hingis is a good case of this too. Change history and keep her on her horse, or let Majoli miss 2 balls in her SF, and what would Hingis's career look like after her Grand Slam? Let Capriati miss one ball in that AO final? One "no" to her shoe company and with the benefit of hindsight all Hingis needed to do was wait till the power hitters hit themselves into the hospitals. History changes all the time - Monica's career is just one of the more obviously significant and tragic unknowables but similar unknowables were Peter Graf's tax returns, Monica's taste in food and Hingis's horse.

Veritas
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:09 AM
No, I left the Hamburg stadium very subdued as all the fans did that fateful day.

BTW, I don't hate Seles. I don't even hate her ugly style of tennis which contradicts everything I expect from women's tennis. Actually she is a nice girl. But I have realized from reading in WTAWorld that Selesians are the most delusional fans of them all. No excuse is too cheap to be used again and again.

Oh, but 'Seles' (the poster) didn't even make any derogatory comments about Steffi whatsoever, yet you find it all so necessary to pick out his post in particular and use it as an excuse to bash his fave? :rolleyes:

casino
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:17 AM
Like I said before, if you made a poll in 1993 before the stabbing on who people thought would win more slams in the next 3 years, most people AND most experts would have picked Seles. Yeah, the stabbing happened, and we will never know what would exactly have happened. But that does not mean that the stabbing is irrelevant. It's as if someone stabs Navratilova in her prime and Evert gets all the slams wins, and then I tell you "oh it's too bad, Navratilova might have not won anything anyways", let's act as if nothing happened just because we can't go back in time, Chris is the greatest and Navratilova well too bad. :rolleyes:

Also if Monica got an injury, or her father had taxe crimes, no Seles fan would give an excuse. But the stabbing had a specific purpose of hurting Seles' career and making Graf become #1 again, and Seles or her family had nothing to do with it. It's a totally different situation.

And as a Seles fan, I don't ask Graf fans to say "Monica is greater". I ask them to stop putting Monica down, stop acting as if the stabbing was not that important to both their careers and at least by respect for tennis history acknowledge the possiblity of Monica becoming the greatest without the stabbing. But the Graf fans simply say "Oh the stabbing does not matter, Steffi would have 10 more slams and Monica probably would have won 1 or 2 if she was not stabbed". That is worst than what Parche did, because it's total disrespect and litterally stabbing Seles again by denying everything she had worked for and all the accomplishements she was doing. You have to at least respect tennis fans who believe that Monica might have been the greatest. Heck even at Wimbledon, she already had a better record than Steffi and Navratilova at the same point of their careers. And she already had more frenchs and more WTA championships than Graf and as many US Open and Australian, despite being 5 years younger. Stop acting as if "nothing important happened, she could have lost so it's no big deal". :rolleyes:

Philbo
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:22 AM
I'm sorry, but Martina Navratilova, Bud Collins, Tracy Austin, Virginia Wade, John McEnroe, Chris Evert, Pam Shriver, Mary Carillo, Billie Jean King and basically every huge tennis expert have said a million times that Monica's stabbing litterally changed women's tennis history and that she was on her way to become the greatest ever. It's not the "delusional Seles fans" who only believe it, it's the WORLD. These experts also said that Monica never became the same player after the stabbing both mentally and game wise. The only people who are delusional are the Graf fans (such as yourself) who want to dismiss the stabbing as nothing too significant to women's tennis history. All the rest of the world, including the most important people in tennis, have spoken thousands of times on how the stabbing changed women's tennis history and both the careers of Monica & Steffi to a huge degree. So get your facts straight.
I see calimero couldnt help but hijack another thread and turn it into a Seles/Graf shirtfight.

Just refer to my signature to see who the real most delusional fan is.

To the topic..

I have to say that Sharapova's grunting totally sux because she is an actress. As soon as Li Na started to play a bit better mid 2nd set, Sharapova's grunts became screams that Li Na should have complained about.

The good old aussie crowd couldnt help but have a good laugh at how stupid Maria sounded and that distracted Li Na during points.

Maria says she doesnt think about it but I think thats as true as when she says she doesnt watch any other womens matches - i.e total crap.

Its too much of a coincidence that when her opponent raises their game, her grunt goes louder and louder into the range of the absurd.

It sounded like she was having multiple orgasms out there last night!

andrewC
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:39 AM
I see calimero couldnt help but hijack another thread and turn it into a Seles/Graf shirtfight.

Just refer to my signature to see who the real most delusional fan is.

To the topic..

I have to say that Sharapova's grunting totally sux because she is an actress. As soon as Li Na started to play a bit better mid 2nd set, Sharapova's grunts became screams that Li Na should have complained about.

The good old aussie crowd couldnt help but have a good laugh at how stupid Maria sounded and that distracted Li Na during points.

Maria says she doesnt think about it but I think thats as true as when she says she doesnt watch any other womens matches - i.e total crap.

Its too much of a coincidence that when her opponent raises their game, her grunt goes louder and louder into the range of the absurd.

It sounded like she was having multiple orgasms out there last night!

:haha:
I agree and think Sharapova uses the grunts as intimidation. She does have the game to back it up but its a bit of an unfair tactic. never mind, we can't do anything about it can we!

Lemonskin.
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:58 AM
:haha:
I agree and think Sharapova uses the grunts as intimidation. She does have the game to back it up but its a bit of an unfair tactic. never mind, we can't do anything about it can we!
If this is true then surely Serena and Monica are/were guilty of the same crime?

Doc
Jan 22nd, 2005, 02:01 AM
:haha:
I agree and think Sharapova uses the grunts as intimidation. She does have the game to back it up but its a bit of an unfair tactic. never mind, we can't do anything about it can we!

Nuts!

Maria grunts louder when she puts more intensity into her play. That's usually in the crunch situations.

Someone who does seem to "put on" the grunts is Serena. Many times she hits a soft shot with a huge grunt attached, almost as if to mislead the other player.

Lemonskin.
Jan 22nd, 2005, 02:10 AM
I'm really not put off by grunting by any player.

If it helps them get more out of themselves, good luck to them!

T-T
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:01 AM
Why the double-standard when the average male match sounds like a gorilla mating frenzy?


:lol: :lol: :lol:

RVD
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:05 AM
But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

:confused: :lol: :lol: :lol: OH CHRIST MAN!! You hit the nail on the head here. :lol: :lol:

RVD
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:10 AM
P.S.- it's only a matter of time before we have feminine bleeding on court... :haha: :haha: STOOOP!! MY SIDE IS HURTING!!!! :haha:
Three cheers for Maria "ORGASMA" Sharapova! Hip-Hip EEIII-YEEEEEEE!!!!! Hip-Hip EEIII-YEEEEEEE!!!!!!

RVD
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:27 AM
If this is true then surely Serena and Monica are/were guilty of the same crime?Someone who does seem to "put on" the grunts is Serena. Many times she hits a soft shot with a huge grunt attached, almost as if to mislead the other player.HATERS!! :mad: :rolleyes:

Shuji Shuriken
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:33 AM
I don't think it's that she gruntson every shot. It's the volume of her grunts. It's extremely loud :eek: :eek:

R&J
Jan 22nd, 2005, 03:52 AM
I'm sorry, but Martina Navratilova, Bud Collins, Tracy Austin, Virginia Wade, John McEnroe, Chris Evert, Pam Shriver, Mary Carillo, Billie Jean King and basically every huge tennis expert have said a million times that Monica's stabbing litterally changed women's tennis history and that she was on her way to become the greatest ever. It's not the "delusional Seles fans" who only believe it, it's the WORLD. These experts also said that Monica never became the same player after the stabbing both mentally and game wise. The only people who are delusional are the Graf fans (such as yourself) who want to dismiss the stabbing as nothing too significant to women's tennis history. All the rest of the world, including the most important people in tennis, have spoken thousands of times on how the stabbing changed women's tennis history and both the careers of Monica & Steffi to a huge degree. So get your facts straight.

The name Monica Seles to this guy Calimero377, seems to bring out the negative feelings in himself, towards Graf's (almost) perfect career. Monica might have been derailed from her major momentum run when the attack happened - and Graf did go on to take over again as if Monica had never been there. Yes, Graf did go on to win tons of titles after that day, but it will never erase the feeling in history that Monica was robbed of possibly going on to be the "best ever".
He thinks that if he bad talks Monica enough here, that it will make him feel better about "Graf is the best in tennis" theory. Maybe people will start to forget about what happened.
Just talk about Monica and tennis, and he will be around soon to talk about Graf and how she never had a problem with Monica on the tennis court :rolleyes: and the thing is, he takes the things so personal to a degree that it is creepy. Almost like he is trying to cover up for something bad that he did, and trying to make it seem like it really didnt change anything. Which is just so false, makes you think who is this german guy on this forum? Freaky:scared:

ginger_fish668
Jan 22nd, 2005, 04:21 AM
Maria's screamnig doesn't bother me, but I understand why some of her opponants might find it distracting...she is VERY vocal. :)

@m@nd@
Jan 22nd, 2005, 04:53 AM
it does bother me sometimes...but i still like her :D

JenFan75
Jan 22nd, 2005, 04:57 AM
Then don't watch her ya dumbass, did someone force you to watch her. turn the channel, clean your toilet whatever who gives a shit.



English isn't your first language, is it?

TennisTutor
Jan 22nd, 2005, 04:57 AM
Yeah! I agree, but, Maria is the only one who is hard to watch. Venus and Serena make loud grunts, but, they're not SCREAMS! I just think it's kinda annoying to watch, and probably distracting to her opponents! lol

.I disagree, when Venus and Serena grunt they sound like they are being stabbed.
Serena is the worst with those “orgasm” like sounds she sometimes makes.
I can’t watch them for more than just a few minutes.
Maria sounds sexy

Knizzle
Jan 22nd, 2005, 05:18 AM
Someone who does seem to "put on" the grunts is Serena. Many times she hits a soft shot with a huge grunt attached, almost as if to mislead the other player.
Is she supposed to tip her opponent off by stopping her grunt to hit a dropshot or a slice. Either way she is still making contact with the ball and if she is grunting she will grunt when she makes contact with the ball.

jacobruiz
Jan 22nd, 2005, 06:30 AM
I find it odd that its only the women who seem to get hassled about grunting.

Why the double-standard when the average male match sounds like a gorilla mating frenzy?
I don't understand the double standard on fist pumps and c'mons either.:confused:

TM
Jan 22nd, 2005, 06:43 AM
I started to watch the delayed coverage of the Sharapova match on ESPN but ended turning it off because I couldn't stand the constant screaming/grunting of Maria. Now, I'm sure this has been discussed a thousand times here already, but I don't think I'm the only person that finds this too distracting. Maybe I can try watching the match without the sound, but I do actually like to hear the commentators because sometimes they are informative.

I understand that sometimes you grunt when making a huge effort but I don't think I'm going to be able to watch and enjoy her tennis as it progresses. I don't like anyone who constantly grunts, but Maria's volume and shriek level are in a class by themselves.

Am I being silly?

No...Sometimes I can't watch Sharapova play tennis because of it too...After every point! With the constant slapping of the thighs! She seems *flaky to me but I love her she great for America!!

*related to the common slang use of the word to describe
a person as eccentric, crazy, or just unreliable.

mp3junkie
Jan 22nd, 2005, 06:52 AM
Then don't watch her ya dumbass, did someone force you to watch her. turn the channel, clean your toilet whatever who gives a shit.
Your comments are so uncalled for you idiot.

Calimero377
Jan 22nd, 2005, 07:28 AM
Oh, but 'Seles' (the poster) didn't even make any derogatory comments about Steffi whatsoever, yet you find it all so necessary to pick out his post in particular and use it as an excuse to bash his fave? :rolleyes:


He said that Seles was on her way to be The Greatest Player Ever. Which is utterly ridiculous considering
- that Graf was slumping (has been proven by her results again and again)
- that Seles had many close calls in her slam matches (early rounds, finals)
- that even a #1-Seles was 2-3 H2H against Graf
- that Seles didn't have much impact on the game post-95.

IF Graf had been beating Sabby almost all the time and never losing ot Navi in 90/92 (as it was the case in 88/90),
IF Seles had won in slam early rounds easily,
IF Seles had beaten Graf regularily and
especially IF Seles had won more slams post-return

OR IF even, let's say, 2 of those 4 "Ifs" had happended this rabid Selesian would have a case when maintaining that Seles "was on her way to be the greatest ever". But so it is only BS meant to denigrate Graf. Period.

Calimero377
Jan 22nd, 2005, 07:58 AM
The name Monica Seles to this guy Calimero377, seems to bring out the negative feelings in himself, towards Graf's (almost) perfect career. Monica might have been derailed from her major momentum run when the attack happened - and Graf did go on to take over again as if Monica had never been there. Yes, Graf did go on to win tons of titles after that day, but it will never erase the feeling in history that Monica was robbed of possibly going on to be the "best ever".
He thinks that if he bad talks Monica enough here, that it will make him feel better about "Graf is the best in tennis" theory. Maybe people will start to forget about what happened.
Just talk about Monica and tennis, and he will be around soon to talk about Graf and how she never had a problem with Monica on the tennis court :rolleyes: and the thing is, he takes the things so personal to a degree that it is creepy. Almost like he is trying to cover up for something bad that he did, and trying to make it seem like it really didnt change anything. Which is just so false, makes you think who is this german guy on this forum? Freaky:scared:



:lol:
No, I just want to point out some facts that are almost forgotten in Selesian circles. The single most important point is that Graf was SLUMPING bigtime in 90/92. HELLO!!!!

1) Steffi played 36 slams between 1987 and 1996. She missed only SEVEN finals!!! And now it comes - FIVE of those misses occured within a 2.25-year time frame in 90/92. Ms. Seles had NOTHING to do with that!
2) Graf is 29-11 H2H against Sabatini - but 4-8 in 90/92. Ms. Seles had NOTHING to do with that.

So it is really no wonder that Seles - a very good tennis player - took over in 91 rather easily. Nevertheless it is telling that Graf won 3 of 5 matches during the time Seles was #1. And that only the two closest of these 5 matches were the two Seles wins.

Today we KNOW that Graf raised her game again in 93/96, we know that she made almost all the slam finals again in 93/96 - and we know that Seles became fatter for the rest of her life, that her gaining weight which was plain to see even in 92/93 simply continued. That many people may have thought in 93 that Seles would continue to win 3 slams a year is excusable. Although experts detected the build-in limitations of Seles's game already then.

Every player can come up with "Ifs" as an excuse for failure. Graf has many of those (her dad humiliating her publicly causing long-lasting scandals). Seles has (BTW, her dad's illness and subsequent death is a far more convincing excuse for "distraction" that this totally over-blown stabbing incident). Hingis has.

BTW, I admit it - I was there, on April 30th 1993, in Hamburg at the Citizen Cup. But no, I didn't stab Monica. ;)

We can continue the woulda-coulda game ad infinitum. Graf has many, many woulda-couldas she could come up with. In an ideal world she would have won 30+ slams. Actually she is the most underachieving player since Mo Connolly probably.

:wavey:

JohnBoy
Jan 22nd, 2005, 08:25 AM
But you have to admit that this grunting/screaming is very embarrassing for women's tennis. OK, the usual porn junkies may be attracted. But do we want this clientéle?

How funny is that !!! We all know full well that there are some male supporters who see the woman's game in some sort of sexual perverted way..

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jan 22nd, 2005, 08:29 AM
Most players grunts are cool. But Maria's are PIERCING. That match with Lee-Waters was soooooo loud.

Veritas
Jan 22nd, 2005, 09:18 AM
If the players or the spectators can't cope with Maria's grunts, then they should either have their ear plugs ready when they're on court or turn the volume down if they're watching the match on telly.

He said that Seles was on her way to be The Greatest Player Ever. Which is utterly ridiculous considering
- that Graf was slumping (has been proven by her results again and again)
- that Seles had many close calls in her slam matches (early rounds, finals)
- that even a #1-Seles was 2-3 H2H against Graf
- that Seles didn't have much impact on the game post-95.

IF Graf had been beating Sabby almost all the time and never losing ot Navi in 90/92 (as it was the case in 88/90),
IF Seles had won in slam early rounds easily,
IF Seles had beaten Graf regularily and
especially IF Seles had won more slams post-return

OR IF even, let's say, 2 of those 4 "Ifs" had happended this rabid Selesian would have a case when maintaining that Seles "was on her way to be the greatest ever". But so it is only BS meant to denigrate Graf. Period.

I see this as more of a paranoia scenario for you. So he doesn't follow your lead and use every one of his posts as a literary temple dedicated to Graf. Big deal. You're the one who's delusional here - he didn't even utter a negative word towards Graf.

Y'know, this latest showing of obsession really demonstrates how pathetic you can be. Someone speaks out in favour of his fave and does it without the usual "Graf's got a big ugly nose" or "Graf and Parche are mutual benefactors" insults that only the extreme fans would resort to using, and even that level of restraint would set off one of your many ranting sprees that do nothing but make you look immature.

Maria Croft
Jan 22nd, 2005, 10:05 AM
let's put it like this, a lot of players grunt, male and female by the way, seles was the worst in her time and sharapova is the loudest of this generation !! To think that is distracts your opponent is bull because that would mean that everything could be distracting like fist pumping for example, it's only distracting if you let it !! so it's not fair to say sharapova uses it to win, like she needs it !! That goes for all the other players that grunt as well !! If you can't handle that you should switch the channel and if you don't get over it already !!

volta
Jan 22nd, 2005, 10:13 AM
oh Sprem screaming is annoying as hell 2

cheesestix
Jan 22nd, 2005, 01:14 PM
let's put it like this, a lot of players grunt, male and female by the way, seles was the worst in her time and sharapova is the loudest of this generation !! To think that is distracts your opponent is bull because that would mean that everything could be distracting like fist pumping for example, it's only distracting if you let it !! so it's not fair to say sharapova uses it to win, like she needs it !! That goes for all the other players that grunt as well !! If you can't handle that you should switch the channel and if you don't get over it already !!

I think it's annoying and distracting. It's not like a fist pump, because a fist pump is only after a point is completed. Some players grunt after every shot that they hit, which can distract their opponent while the ball is still in play. How is it really any different than a player yelling "MISS IT!" or something as their opponent is hitting the ball? What's the difference? 1 second?

A lot of players do it. Maria may be the worst, from what people say, but the WS aren't far behind (if at all). I find it ironic that so many WS fans diss Maria about the grunt, but they won't admit that Venus and Serena are just as (or almost as) bad as Maria.

Experimentee
Jan 22nd, 2005, 02:51 PM
I agree that it was very annoying! I dont normally mind loud grunts, like Seles or Serena, but Maria's dont sound like normal grunts, they are high pitched, like screams. They hurt your ears more than the low pitched growling grunts that are more normal in tennis.