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View Full Version : Sorry folks, but Maria has no class...


Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:01 AM
I mean first of all congratulations to her for winning the title. Second of all I think her c'mon's and excessive screaming was a little much. She obviously knew Serena was injured and really was spitting in her face by doing what she was doing. I don't know if I'm just being bitter but I mean c'mon! :p

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:03 AM
Absolutely classless, immature and horribly egoistical.

Junex
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:04 AM
i just want to ask you all what would have been your actions be if you were there playing in the YEC Championship against Serena.

You are all fool and hypocrites.

i guess you have never play a match with intensity.

Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:04 AM
Absolutely classless, immature and horribly egoistical.

I could have put it that way but I'm not sure if I know how to use those words in my vocabulary :p

I mean I know she's 17, but it must be frustrating for Serena. That would be like Serena pumping her fist at Venus (when she double faults) in the Wimbledon 2003 final :tape: can you imagine?

Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:05 AM
i just want to ask you all what would have been your actions be if you were there playing in the YEC Championship against Serena.

You are all fool and hypocrites.

i guess you have never play a match with intensity.

Actually I have but I would never, ever, ever pump my fist and act as if I couldn't believe I just won when the player was hitting like 50 mph serves.

KindaNice
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:05 AM
Well...remember, that Serena was hitting unbelievable shots EXCEPT her serve. Maria was probably pumping herself up and not being unsportsmanlike to Serena. It is hard once you know your opponent is injured. Plus.....she IS 17.

Although....I have to admit...I was hoping Maria would have toned down the kissing the crowd and stuff and maybe have gone over to Serena once again afterwards to check on how she was doing. I kept waiting for her to do that...but nope.

Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:06 AM
I know this thread is just a retaliation thread, but

Why would the player's attitude change because her opponent is injured? If you have a different mental attitude because your opponent is injured, it's a BAD, BAD thing.

I understand the whole come on at a long rally which is okay but to say it when someone double faults or on match point is kind of ridicoulous.

bmxbandit
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:07 AM
i just want to ask you all what would have been your actions be if you were there playing in the YEC Championship against Serena.

You are all fool and hypocrites.

i guess you have never play a match with intensity.
:rolleyes:

I'd show some RESPECT to my opponent.

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:07 AM
I could have put it that way but I'm not sure if I know how to use those words in my vocabulary :p

I mean I know she's 17, but it must be frustrating for Serena. That would be like Serena pumping her fist at Venus (when she double faults) in the Wimbledon 2003 final :tape: can you imagine?
I know, this is just disgusting behavior... Well, very rude. Disgusting might be my emotions talking ;) But this is just ugly to act that way. I'm much in favour of a competitive player, but who knows when to be competitive and pump her fist. What Maria was doing was embarrassing.

Dan23
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:07 AM
:rolleyes: :retard: :yawn: :zzz: :speakles:

Martian Willow
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:07 AM
I imagine Maria cares as much for what you think as Serena does what I think. :)

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:09 AM
I imagine Maria cares as much for what you think as Serena does what I think. :)
Probably.

moby
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:09 AM
at least maria is consistent
i mean, she does it all the time
you can't accuse her of doing it JUST to psych serena out

Junex
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:10 AM
Well i guess those who said Masha is acting rude are also those who have voted against maria to win this YEC.

what a coincidence.

Somehow when you are down 4-0 in a set (or 4-1) you have to do something extra to motivate yourself and refocus even if it means being ruce. its part of the game and eveyone does that. Others may have the Sportsmanship award but they never get a championship, because they are too nice.

TennisTutor
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:10 AM
I mean first of all congratulations to her for winning the title. Second of all I think her c'mon's and excessive screaming was a little much. She obviously knew Serena was injured and really was spitting in her face by doing what she was doing. I don't know if I'm just being bitter but I mean c'mon! :p

She was just responding to Serena's game.
Serena was going for broke, clobbering everything tiring to end the point. For a while she was pulling it off but at the end of the day Serena’s conditioning was her downfall.

Good match to both players.

CC
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:10 AM
:shrug: But she wasn't fist pumping half as much as she's capable of.

Aphrodite
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:10 AM
Well...remember, that Serena was hitting unbelievable shots EXCEPT her serve. Maria was probably pumping herself up and not being unsportsmanlike to Serena. It is hard once you know your opponent is injured. Plus.....she IS 17.

Although....I have to admit...I was hoping Maria would have toned down the kissing the crowd and stuff and maybe have gone over to Serena once again afterwards to check on how she was doing. I kept waiting for her to do that...but nope.
this is real life not a soup opera, Maria was winning and she was happy, just because someone is injured doesnt mean you give them free points away, Serena has done the same thing its part of being a competitive player and champ, and to tell you the truth nobady is perfect.
Anyway I feel bad for Serena in this match, but quite frankly this year hasnt been a williams year it has been russians all year, and its kind of right that a russian should win the only bad part about it is that Serena should have not gotten injured and I really do feel bad for her, but also, i think if your a serena fan you should be happy for her weeks ago she was loosing to jidkova this is a good start. be happy for masha and serena.

cool bird
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:11 AM
I have to say after watching this match. Sharapova really disappointed me. I have never understood why people get a her just becuses she enjoys winning and pumps her fist. But there is a time and place I know she was down 0-4 but when she got back to 4 all and Serena had cearly tanked the match was in so much pain. And was throwing in double after double dont be doing it then. Have respect. And her Dad should of never come on to the court. You can say what you want about Richard Williams but he would never of done that. After seeing a player so hurt.

Dan23
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:11 AM
at least maria is consistent
i mean, she does it all the time
you can't accuse her of doing it JUST to psych serena out
Exactly, its part of her game...shes at her best when pumped up
Much like many other players :D

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:11 AM
Well i guess those who said Masha is acting rude are also those who have voted against maria to win this YEC.

what a coincidence.

Somehow when you are down 4-0 in a set (or 4-1) you have to do something extra to motivate yourself and refocus even if it means being ruce. its part of the game and eveyone does that. Others may have the Sportsmanship award but they never get a championship, because they are too nice.
I don't think Serena is nice, but she is not disrespectful, which is what Maria is.

bandabou
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:12 AM
It´s cool....if that is what she needs? Fine....Me personally would have trimmed down a bit, because I didn´t have to do THAT much to win my points.

Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:12 AM
Well i guess those who said Masha is acting rude are also those who have voted against maria to win this YEC.

what a coincidence.

Somehow when you are down 4-0 in a set (or 4-1) you have to do something extra to motivate yourself and refocus even if it means being ruce. its part of the game and eveyone does that. Others may have the Sportsmanship award but they never get a championship, because they are too nice.

Yes I admit I like Serena. But the fact is that Serena would never (even though everyone thinks she's a ruthless bitch) pump her fist at Maria if she were injured.

KindaNice
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:13 AM
Junex - I agree. I wonder how many people posting here actually PLAY tennis (instead of spending all their time posting in front of the computer)...and know what it like to get that intense. Yes I agree, she may have gone a bit overboard...but it IS a HUGE tournament.

But...Serena....handled herself with class and grace. Way to go girl!

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:14 AM
Certiainly not mentioning your opponent in the ending speech isn't classy.

faste5683
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:14 AM
Personally, I would have liked for Maria to have been even more gung-ho! Those wimpy-assed "come on's!" and fist pumps after every point are o.k. I guess, but a nice ten second stare-down after hitting a clean winner is truly the way to pour salt into your opponent's wounds.

:wavey:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:14 AM
She did go a little overboard with the fist pumps.

I can understand wispering or even saying cmon to yourself but when you shout it out and pump your fist in the air after your opponent hits a serve that is like floating on the air and you hit a winner that any semi-decent player could hit off it, then yes .... you are going overboard.
Gosh, I can't believe it, but I totally agree with you on this Ayla.

Knizzle
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:14 AM
Well i guess those who said Masha is acting rude are also those who have voted against maria to win this YEC.

what a coincidence.

Somehow when you are down 4-0 in a set (or 4-1) you have to do something extra to motivate yourself and refocus even if it means being ruce. its part of the game and eveyone does that. Others may have the Sportsmanship award but they never get a championship, because they are too nice.
But Serena has 6 slams while being gracious, Venus 4, Lindsay 3. I'm not seeing your point.

LindsayRocks89
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:14 AM
I don't even think Maria mentioned Serena in her speech or said something graceous like hope u get better, u played great. . .nothing

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:15 AM
Certiainly not mentioning your opponent in the ending speech isn't classy.
I hope she mentioned her father... He does a great coaching job ;)

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:16 AM
I don't even think Maria mentioned Serena in her speech or said something graceous like hope u get better, u played great. . .nothing

She didn't even mention Serena. That's just tacky Maria.

Paldias
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:16 AM
OMFG :tape: if Maria honestly didn't realize Serena was injured what an idiot :tape:...

Chrissie-fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:17 AM
So what? This is competition. Sharapova is there to try and win for Sharapova,not to feel sorry for her opponents.

Absolutely classless, immature and horribly egoistical.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:17 AM
I have to say after watching this match. Sharapova really disappointed me. I have never understood why people get a her just becuses she enjoys winning and pumps her fist. But there is a time and place I know she was down 0-4 but when she got back to 4 all and Serena had cearly tanked the match was in so much pain. And was throwing in double after double dont be doing it then. Have respect. And her Dad should of never come on to the court. You can say what you want about Richard Williams but he would never of done that. After seeing a player so hurt.
:worship: :worship: :worship:

G1Player2
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:17 AM
I was shocked that Maria didn't even acknowledge Serena in her speech...I was hoping she would say something like, "Get well soon Serena," but nothing...Serena had just said some very good things about Maria in her speech and Maria didn't even mention Serena...Classless! Classless! Classless!

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:17 AM
I don't even think Maria mentioned Serena in her speech or said something graceous like hope u get better, u played great. . .nothing
She changed a lot... I think her head is getting too big, because last year in Québec, in her speech, she was all shook up for Milagros and wished her well, etc. I used to like her, now she's turning into a self-centered bitch.

KindaNice
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:18 AM
Yeah...not mentioning Serena was bad. But hopefully she thanked her father for apparently cussing out someone in the stands......

moby
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:18 AM
I don't even think Maria mentioned Serena in her speech or said something graceous like hope u get better, u played great. . .nothing
she probably figured that that probably wasn't even serena out there
and even if she did say something nice to serena, serena would forget it

17 year olds hold grudges easily, you know ;)

lizchris
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:18 AM
I hope she mentioned her father... He does a great coaching job ;)
She should; he taught her everything he knows about being an ass. Which she was tongiht. And I am not saying this because I wanted Serena to win.

franny
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:18 AM
1. She was losing.
2. When you change your mentality, you lose.
3. Serena was playing unbelievable off the ground, Serena could still have won. It was vital for Maria to keep her intensity.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, Maria forgot to congratule Serena. I'm sure she said some nice words to Serena at their greeting at net. But still, Maria really should have congratulated Serena. It's okay Maria, next time. She was too out of it by the ceremony to think really.

t_fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:19 AM
Chubin, if you believe your own words, you must be a loser. Risk acting differently and you have 4-0 down. She did what brought her the victory, this is not Salvation Army.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:19 AM
I don't even think Maria mentioned Serena in her speech or said something graceous like hope u get better, u played great. . .nothing
She didn't say one word about Serena or to her. :rolleyes: Then again, she's "only 17" :rolleyes:

XaDavK_Kapri
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:21 AM
She should; he taught her everything he knows about being an ass. Which she was tongiht. And I am not saying this because I wanted Serena to win.
I was being sarcastic. "Coaching" as in warning ;)

CC
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:21 AM
Certiainly not mentioning your opponent in the ending speech isn't classy.
Ok, this is one thing I will fault her for. She should have mentioned Serena out of courtesy. Surely she knows this by now.

tennisluver99
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:21 AM
Maria has no class, Serena has no class....Let's just admit that none of the WTA players have class. They're all bitches towards each other. Nothing new.

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:23 AM
I mean first of all congratulations to her for winning the title. Second of all I think her c'mon's and excessive screaming was a little much. She obviously knew Serena was injured and really was spitting in her face by doing what she was doing. I don't know if I'm just being bitter but I mean c'mon! :p
you're being bitter.... serena playing the injury card. that's her own fault.... she's out of shape.... and the cmon's sharapova was screaming??? that's what sharapova does... she always does it, so that point isn't even valid... and serena was still playing well so she was pumping herself up.... serena is the classless little shit. her comments before the match were absolutely ridiculous....

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:24 AM
Maria has no class, Serena has no class....Let's just admit that none of the WTA players have class. They're all bitches towards each other. Nothing new.
myskina has tremendous class ... :yeah:

AjdeNate!
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:25 AM
Well, I for one, am glad you all have something to bitch and moan about until January. :angel: I'd hate for it to get dullsville around here.

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:27 AM
IT was sick how Maria barley said anything at the net and didn't wish Serena a good recovery in her speech, DISGUSTING......

Serena, you are the real winner and the real class act, had it not been for the injury, its obvious you would have won. Get well for 05!

i officially hate Sharapova......classlessova.

Fingon
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:32 AM
I see,

they can't go on about Maria being the tier III queen now let's start 300 threads about her "rude" behaviour.

and btw, I've seen many players celebrate their opponents errors especially Serena.

I wonder if they realize how inmature and pathetic they look (the moaners). Serena has 1000 times more class than some of her fans (or should I say Maria's haters).

At the end of the day, who cares? Maria won, end of story.

lizchris
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:35 AM
I see,

they can't go on about Maria being the tier III queen now let's start 300 threads about her "rude" behaviour.

and btw, I've seen many players celebrate their opponents errors especially Serena.

I wonder if they realize how inmature and pathetic they look (the moaners). Serena has 1000 times more class than some of her fans (or should I say Maria's haters).

At the end of the day, who cares? Maria won, end of story.
Not when her opponents were injured she didn't.

lizchris
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:36 AM
BTW, Maria now makes Martina Hingis look like Miss Congeniality.

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:39 AM
I see,

they can't go on about Maria being the tier III queen now let's start 300 threads about her "rude" behaviour.

and btw, I've seen many players celebrate their opponents errors especially Serena.

I wonder if they realize how inmature and pathetic they look (the moaners). Serena has 1000 times more class than some of her fans (or should I say Maria's haters).

At the end of the day, who cares? Maria won, end of story.

Posts like these actually hold weight when the person attempting to judge actually has maturity and isn't pathetic themselves in judging others. How hypocritical.
:rolleyes:

mishar
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:40 AM
This whole "class" thing is so weird. What is this, Miss Porter's finishing school? They're athletes competing. They're playing for a million dollar prize. Tennis history is filled with players who did vicious, unsportsmanlike things to upset their opponent's game. Pumping your fist and shouting "c'mon" is not among them. Maria might be a spoiled egotist, but I can name a few things Serena did when she was 17 that were a bit rude. (And I'm a big Serena fan -- have been since she was a bratty kid)

moby
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:40 AM
so how does martina come into the picture now?

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:41 AM
It's not even the "come ons" that are wrong. Serena might do that ocasionally and NOT to the extent that Sharapova did on such an injured opponent, if you say so, prove it!!!!

Serena would NEVER not acknowledge a very injured opponent at net or in an acceptance speech no matter what tournament she won, NEVER

Maria Classlessova just has poor manners obviously, and no class.

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:41 AM
What a great and wild match! Great playing from both girls! What composure and self-confidance from a 17-year-old kid to win Wimbledon and 4 months later to become the year-end champion! She managed to pump herself up in the third after being down 3-0 and hit some great shots to end it. Maria is definately the Russian to watch and 2005 is going to be so exciting! Masha was a little too excited to mention Serena in her award speech but I think she can be forgiven - it's hardly the first time a winner has not talked about her opponent.

Congratulations Maria and great job getting to the finals Serena!:bounce: :worship: :kiss:

And to all the haters - get a grip, you're making fools of yourselves!

AjdeNate!
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:45 AM
Just a point to ponder......... have the anti-Maria fans actually seen a match from Sharapova that wasn't WI or YEC 2004? Just throwin' that out there.

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:46 AM
yeah but Serena was badly injured, therefore it becomes kinda rude to fail to mention her in your speech or wish them a recovery at net.

Im sure Maria might mature eventually and become more respectful, im not saying Serena was always a prime example of class as she is now, it takes time, but Maria and her dad seemed on the extreme side today.

Honestly, If I were Serena and i had said all those nice things about Maria, and i was that badly hurt and she failed to acknowledge me in the least, i would feel hurt and wronged.

nouf
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:47 AM
ahahahahah i laugh! sorry! jalousy! its tennis! the best won!

:-) tkxs mauresmo !

mishar
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:48 AM
I can promise you one thing. Serena does not give a flying fuck if Maria mentioned her in her speech or not. People on this board feel much more strongly about that kind of thing than most of the players, especially serena.

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:50 AM
I can promise you one thing. Serena does not give a flying fuck if Maria mentioned her in her speech or not. People on this board feel much more strongly about that kind of thing than most of the players, especially serena.

And?

The same could be said about all the times people at this board make a big deal about Serena's comments this way and that. What's the difference?

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:50 AM
I know this thread is just a retaliation thread, but

Why would the player's attitude change because her opponent is injured? If you have a different mental attitude because your opponent is injured, it's a BAD, BAD thing.
It really wasn't about her fist pumping on Serena's double faults and UFE's from obvious pain, which was classless enough, but it's from her speech where she said, "I wore her down" and never, NOT ONCE, acknowledged Serena as a great competitor and thank her for a great game. NOT ONCE. Maybe Maria needs to grow up. I certainly hope it's all due to immaturity.

Lucy
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:51 AM
i was also kinda irritated when she kept screaming and pumping her hands towards the last set like she worked so hard to win those last few points. it was obvious that serena was injured. she couldn't ever serve right. but she did earn that win as did get to the finals and she hung in there. What really bothered me the most was that she didn't acknowledge serena during her speach.

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:53 AM
I can promise you she does. I don't know if you are a Serena fan or not. But any good fan that knows Serena well, knows she is a VERY amigable, respectful and well mannered person off the court. She is sensitive to the way she treats others and im sure she expects the same in return.

Im sure she'll wanna destroy Sharapova next time they play, obviously. But beyond the tennis there lies a fine line of person to person respect that Maria failed to touch on.

For a nice person, an emotional and sensitive person like Serena, that is both rude and hurtful.

mishar
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:53 AM
And?

The same could be said about all the times people at this board make a big deal about Serena's comments this way and that. What's the difference?
There is no difference. I think all those threads are ridiculous. People criticize Serena for sneezing.

moby
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:54 AM
It's not even the "come ons" that are wrong. Serena might do that ocasionally and NOT to the extent that Sharapova did on such an injured opponent, if you say so, prove it!!!!

Serena would NEVER not acknowledge a very injured opponent at net or in an acceptance speech no matter what tournament she won, NEVER

Maria Classlessova just has poor manners obviously, and no class.
ok so now there's a cap on the number of "come ons" you can say in a match
lets make it 20, or about 10 between toilet breaks

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:55 AM
IT was sick how Maria barley said anything at the net and didn't wish Serena a good recovery in her speech, DISGUSTING......

Serena, you are the real winner and the real class act, had it not been for the injury, its obvious you would have won. Get well for 05!

i officially hate Sharapova......classlessova.
Classlessova Sharapova. :lol:

Sharapova's_Boy
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:56 AM
She's 17, cut her some freaking slack. :rolleyes:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:56 AM
Posts like these actually hold weight when the person attempting to judge actually has maturity and isn't pathetic themselves in judging others. How hypocritical.
:rolleyes:
How true. :rolleyes:

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:57 AM
There is no difference. I think all those threads are ridiculous. People criticize Serena for sneezing.

True, but it did bother me that Maria didn't mention her opponent, for whatever reasons. The fist pumping all that went on during the match doesn't matter because that's during competitive play, but that bit at the end was just ridiculous. One shouldn't have to be prompted for such things. At wimbledon she had to be reminded by the interviewer on court that she even had an opponent. This seems to be the usual for Maria.

mishar
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:57 AM
I've been a Serena fan since she reached the finals of Chicago in 1997 and I agree with you that she seems like a terrific person off the court. I also think she's pretty thick-skinned. And I think she really doesn't care about a trivial thing like what someone says in the awards ceremony. She's got a lot more interesting things to think about.

I'm sure she hates to lose. I'm sure she will come out in 2005 eager to defeat Maria and I'll bet she will succeed, as long as she is dedicated to the sport.

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:57 AM
I still think it hurt Serena. Im not saying she's gonna cry and dwell on why Maria didnt say anything to her, not at all. But however, while Serena stood on the side and listened to Maria's winning speech, YOU KNOW she was thinking, "i wonder what she's gonna say about me" and it had to feel like shit to hear nothing.

Honestly I would have no problem with Maria if she had won the match normally or if she had been SOMEWHAT curtious. But it was all the contrary.

For us Serena fans we can look at the positive. Serena DID play better, she has better stats than MAria for the match, at times we saw VINTAGE rena groundstrokes that Maria could just stare at, and thats the kind of Serena we will see in 05 :)

mishar
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:59 AM
True, but it did bother me that Maria didn't mention her opponent, for whatever reasons. The fist pumping all that went on during the match doesn't matter because that's during competitive play, but that bit at the end was just ridiculous. One shouldn't have to be prompted for such things.
Yeah, it bothered me too. I just don't think it means the girl is Satan. :devil:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 05:59 AM
What a great and wild match! Great playing from both girls! What composure and self-confidance from a 17-year-old kid to win Wimbledon and 4 months later to become the year-end champion! She managed to pump herself up in the third after being down 3-0 and hit some great shots to end it. Maria is definately the Russian to watch and 2005 is going to be so exciting! Masha was a little too excited to mention Serena in her award speech but I think she can be forgiven - it's hardly the first time a winner has not talked about her opponent.

Congratulations Maria and great job getting to the finals Serena!:bounce: :worship: :kiss:

And to all the haters - get a grip, you're making fools of yourselves!
What you obviously don't realize is that coming back from 4-0 in the third on an obviously injured opponent whose pain is getting worse by the minute is nothing to brag about. She didn't do anything I couldn't have done or any other player. :rolleyes:

mp3junkie
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:00 AM
I have to say after watching this match. Sharapova really disappointed me. I have never understood why people get a her just becuses she enjoys winning and pumps her fist. But there is a time and place I know she was down 0-4 but when she got back to 4 all and Serena had cearly tanked the match was in so much pain. And was throwing in double after double dont be doing it then. Have respect. And her Dad should of never come on to the court. You can say what you want about Richard Williams but he would never of done that. After seeing a player so hurt.I agree with this post 1000%. You are absolutely right on point regarding Richard Williams.

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:02 AM
Yeah, it bothered me too. I just don't think it means the girl is Satan. :devil:


No she's not Satan, it just doesn't endear her to me. But that's why we have favorites :)

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:14 AM
What is wrong with you sore losers? Are you all about 12 because anyone who has watched tennis closely for at least a few years knows that if a player needs to pump herself or himself up and shout a few come ons to help themselves win then that's what they should do! You are delusional if you think that other players, including Serena would not try to win using whatever they needed to keep their confidance up, regardless if their opponent was "injured" or not. Maria did NOT go overboard on this; she was undoubtedly tired from playing 5 straight matches and needed to energize herself, especially after Serena's injury timeout when Maria had been playing so well.

And she forgot to mention Serena in her award speech! Big deal! The kid just won the YEC and was nervous and excited. She was classy enough to talk about the charitable cause she was donating the car to and I'm sure she'll say something about Serena later.

Masha beat your fav and won. Get over it, hatred for this kind of stuff is disgusting.

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:16 AM
Get over it, hatred for this kind of stuff is disgusting.

Get over the fact that people have different opinions and are free to express them.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:16 AM
hatred for this kind of stuff is disgusting.
And so are you.

Venus Forever
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:19 AM
She went overboard, as simple as that.

Fist pump, talk to yourself, try to hype yourself up, but don't be so dramatic about it. She was literally fist pumping, looking at Serena, and shouting c'mon at the same time. That, to me, is very disrepectful, and very much overblown.

....and that little drop to the knees at the end.... give me a break. :rolleyes:

A victory over an injured opponent, unless it's your first GS, and sometimes not even then, is not something to be very dramatic about.

But, whatever.... that's just my opinion.

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:19 AM
And so are you.
:lol: Omg, the level of maturity here!

Diesel
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:21 AM
:lol: Omg, the level of maturity here!

Of which you've done absolutely nothing to raise :haha:

faboozadoo15
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:24 AM
But Serena has 6 slams while being gracious, Venus 4, Lindsay 3. I'm not seeing your point.
serena australian open-- wtf are you talking about? oh yes, so gracious against loit.

Venus+Serena#1fan
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:25 AM
I would have the same opinion of Classlessova even if had beaten Henin-Hardenne who I am NOT a fan of.

tennispro105
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:28 AM
she definitely needed to tone it down... the first 4 games she lost were because of her immaturity as a tennis player and inexperience and any other player would have won 6-0 that set. it was obviously not close and should not have been that close 'score wise' and maria should have toned everything down. it's ok to encourage yourself, just get mature enough so you know when it's appropriate and when it's not.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:28 AM
serena australian open-- wtf are you talking about? oh yes, so gracious against loit.
First, was Loit injured when Serena beat her in a tough three-setter? Secondly, did she not go to the net and congratulate her on a great game and lastly, she didn't have to give a speech and say anything about Loit, since it was the FIRST ROUND!!!!! :rolleyes:

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:43 AM
I can promise you she does. I don't know if you are a Serena fan or not. But any good fan that knows Serena well, knows she is a VERY amigable, respectful and well mannered person off the court. She is sensitive to the way she treats others and im sure she expects the same in return.

Im sure she'll wanna destroy Sharapova next time they play, obviously. But beyond the tennis there lies a fine line of person to person respect that Maria failed to touch on.

For a nice person, an emotional and sensitive person like Serena, that is both rude and hurtful.
oh get over yourself... welcome to sports. it's competitive and not every is friendly with one another... she's 17 and serena is a brat off the court. is donating a porsche to the victims of serbia not good enough for you??? what would serena have done??

Masharapova
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:45 AM
This site is for encouraging the female tennis players not the opposite!

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:48 AM
This site is for encouraging the female tennis players not the opposite!
:rolleyes:

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:59 AM
First, was Loit injured when Serena beat her in a tough three-setter? Secondly, did she not go to the net and congratulate her on a great game and lastly, she didn't have to give a speech and say anything about Loit, since it was the FIRST ROUND!!!!! :rolleyes:
If you actually followed tennis, you would know that in this match Serena got a warning for calling Loit "a fucking bitch".

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:01 AM
If you actually followed tennis, you would know that in this match Serena got a warning for calling Loit "a fucking bitch".
She didn't call Loit a fucking bitch, she called herself that. She got a warning for an audible curse word. Now, I guess we see who actually follows tennis and those are actually blinded by their hate for Serena. :)

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:03 AM
She didn't call Loit a fucking bitch, she called herself that. She got a warning for an audible curse word. Now, I guess we see who actually follows tennis and those are actually blinded by their hate for Serena. :)
she called herself a fucking bitch and got warned???? LOL... that's even more embarrassing and stupid... :lol:

StarDuvallGrant
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:05 AM
She went overboard, as simple as that.

Fist pump, talk to yourself, try to hype yourself up, but don't be so dramatic about it. She was literally fist pumping, looking at Serena, and shouting c'mon at the same time. That, to me, is very disrepectful, and very much overblown.

....and that little drop to the knees at the end.... give me a break. :rolleyes:

A victory over an injured opponent, unless it's your first GS, and sometimes not even then, is not something to be very dramatic about.

But, whatever.... that's just my opinion.


It's not a bad opinion.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:06 AM
she called herself a fucking bitch and got warned???? LOL... that's even more embarrassing and stupid... :lol:
Be that as it may, that's what happened. Now what? All of the players curse themselves on court. Jen is especially guilty of it. Now what? You look stupid. :lol:

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:07 AM
She didn't call Loit a fucking bitch, she called herself that. She got a warning for an audible curse word. Now, I guess we see who actually follows tennis and those are actually blinded by their hate for Serena. :)
If you want to think she said it to herself, go right ahead.:)

G1Player2
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:11 AM
If you want to think she said it to herself, go right ahead.:)
I just saw that match...Serena DID NOT...I repeat DID NOT call Loit a fuck** bitc*... One more time, Serena DID NOT call Loit that...

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:12 AM
If you want to think she said it to herself, go right ahead.:)
Whatever. You've proved yourself just as stupid as deckham. :rolleyes:

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:12 AM
And I'm not the one blinded by hatred and bitterness. I like Serena and have never posted anything negative about her.

Hatred like yours is quite sad.

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:12 AM
Be that as it may, that's what happened. Now what? All of the players curse themselves on court. Jen is especially guilty of it. Now what? You look stupid. :lol:
oh i know myskina's cursed herself and her coach on the court multiple times... but to call yourself a fucking bitch and get warned????? lol.. she needs therapy.

and you know better than to think she said that to herself... it was at loit.

StarDuvallGrant
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:15 AM
Not much of a loss there. Maria never had it to lose :shrug:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:15 AM
And I'm not the one blinded by hatred and bitterness. I like Serena and have never posted anything negative about her.

Hatred like yours is quite sad.
Good for you, wanna a gold star? :lol:

But, let me get this straight. You included yourself in being "NOT THE ONLY ONE BLINDED BY HATRED AND BITTERNESS", and then in the same breath you say that you like Serena and have never posted anything negative about her. To whom is your hatred and bitterness directed? And, you say I'm quite sad? :lol:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:18 AM
oh i know myskina's cursed herself and her coach on the court multiple times... but to call yourself a fucking bitch and get warned????? lol.. she needs therapy.

and you know better than to think she said that to herself... it was at loit.
Why is Serena different from Vampira...huh I mean Myskina, other than the obvious?

Shoulderpova
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:19 AM
what a quatsch.You don't like Masha just because she's better than her opponents.For anyone the good chances never come so often.The main thing is that in which way you can catch them.A win is always a win.Moreover Serena's injury is not Masha's faul.Masha's obviously played great tennis and she totally deserves the victory.That's all.
Masha will reach the number one soon ;)

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:20 AM
i don't know... she's black, myskina's white???

what are you looking for here???
myskina's is always gracious and classy... we'll start with that..

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:21 AM
what a quatsch.You don't like Masha just because she's better than her opponents.For anyone the good chances never come so often.The main thing is that in which way you can catch them.A win is always a win.Moreover Serena's injury is not Masha's faul.Masha's obviously played great tennis and she totally deserves the victory.That's all.
Masha will reach the number one soon ;)
How deep. :rolleyes:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:23 AM
i don't know... she's black, myskina's white???

what are you looking for here???
myskina's is always gracious and classy... we'll start with that..
OMG, you can't possibly be this stupid. HOW IS MYSKINA DIFFERENT FROM SERENA WHEN MYSKINA CURSES HERSELF AND YOU CAN'T BELIEVE SERENA DID? Do you get it now? Geez. :rolleyes:

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:24 AM
OMG, you can't possibly be this stupid. HOW IS MYSKINA DIFFERENT FROM SERENA WHEN MYSKINA CURSES HERSELF AND YOU CAN'T BELIEVE SERENA DID? Do you get it now? Geez. :rolleyes:
oh isn't that cute... a little short tempered and short on humor eh?

lol, she didn't get warned for calling "herself" (supposedly) a fucking bitch...

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:53 AM
oh isn't that cute... a little short tempered and short on humor eh?

lol, she didn't get warned for calling "herself" (supposedly) a fucking bitch...
Not short tempered, I thought if I put it in larger print, you'd understand better.

Oh I see, Myskina curses herself, but she doesn't get caught. That makes Serena different from Myskina in cursing herself.

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:56 AM
lol.. you don't get it do you....

serena yelled that at loit... i can't believe she called herself a fucking bitch...

jacobruiz
Nov 16th, 2004, 07:58 AM
Good for you, wanna a gold star? :lol:

But, let me get this straight. You included yourself in being "NOT THE ONLY ONE BLINDED BY HATRED AND BITTERNESS", and then in the same breath you say that you like Serena and have never posted anything negative about her. To whom is your hatred and bitterness directed? And, you say I'm quite sad? :lol:
:rolleyes: I said "I am not the one blinded by hatred and bitterness" Even though you quoted my post in your message, you still didn't get it right. Yes you're sad.

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:04 AM
wow... glad you put that in caps or i couldn't have seen it.

when you play tennis you get angry and scream out at yourself you fucking bitch???
fine... ok....

i go through every curse word in the book... but i don't think i've ever told myself that... :lol:

Princess Sarah.
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:06 AM
Yeah the girl has no class but she won! GET OVER IT!

G1Player2
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:07 AM
lol.. you don't get it do you....

serena yelled that at loit... i can't believe she called herself a fucking bitch...

Like I said, I just watched the match and Serena DID NOT call Loit that...Stop trying to make things up to get your point across...

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:08 AM
:rolleyes: I said "I am not the one blinded by hatred and bitterness" Even though you quoted my post in your message, you still didn't get it right. Yes you're sad.
Okay, feel better now. Do you still want that gold star? :rolleyes:

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:13 AM
Like I said, I just watched the match and Serena DID NOT call Loit that...Stop trying to make things up to get your point across...
i like all these random people who pop in here and express their opinion. i obviously thought otherwise when i saw it... so you can think what you want and i'll think what i want.

Jakeev
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:15 AM
You know this fucked up thread is no better than the "Serena has no class threads."

But what really friggen gets me, and I have been around this joint to know better but I never learn, is that the same people who defended Serena to the hilt in those threads, have no qualms coming in an equally fucked up thread like this and pick on Maria.

It never ends and 2005 will just see more threads like this....

G1Player2
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:15 AM
i like all these random people who pop in here and express their opinion. i obviously thought otherwise when i saw it... so you can think what you want and i'll think what i want.
Think what you want buddy, I don't care...But like I said, Serena DID NOT say that to Loit...But think what you want, it isw clear that the only delusional one is you...

deckham
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:17 AM
yep... only me... :lol:

G1Player2
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:20 AM
yep... only me... :lol:
LOL...You said it, the only people who would think otherwise are the ones who dislike Serena Williams...I love being right!

ttlltt69
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:30 AM
I am neither Serena nor Maria"s fan. Neutral!

Honestly, had Serena retired, things would have been better! She hung in there as she must have strong belief she could win and be the champion , she led 4-0 after injuries break and could not close out the match too bad... Maria still the Chili Padi. Please give Maria her due!

Spunky83
Nov 16th, 2004, 08:31 AM
I think it´s about time to have another poll concerning the question: Who´s the classiest top ten player?

Masharapova
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:07 AM
DeDe4925 :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed:

Hagar
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:17 AM
I think Maria is basically behaving in the same way Serena sometimes behave.

Joana
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:24 AM
I'll never understand the point of threads like these. It's like all those "Serena is arrogant", "Justine cheated", "Steffi vs Monica"... It's meaningless. You know exactly who is going to post, and what they are going to say. There is no discussion, just repeating the same things over and over and over again. And it gets really ugly.

Martian Willow
Nov 16th, 2004, 10:09 AM
DeDe4925 :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed:

She's cute, isn't she? A troll, yes, but a cute one. :)

jenny161185
Nov 16th, 2004, 10:47 AM
she always being like this , getting pumped of errors etc who cares If I was in the YEC final Id be cheering if someone gave me errors and Ive seen Serena do it aswell.

TFan1156
Nov 16th, 2004, 10:59 AM
What is wrong with you sore losers? Are you all about 12 because anyone who has watched tennis closely for at least a few years knows that if a player needs to pump herself or himself up and shout a few come ons to help themselves win then that's what they should do! You are delusional if you think that other players, including Serena would not try to win using whatever they needed to keep their confidance up, regardless if their opponent was "injured" or not. Maria did NOT go overboard on this; she was undoubtedly tired from playing 5 straight matches and needed to energize herself, especially after Serena's injury timeout when Maria had been playing so well.

And she forgot to mention Serena in her award speech! Big deal! The kid just won the YEC and was nervous and excited. She was classy enough to talk about the charitable cause she was donating the car to and I'm sure she'll say something about Serena later.

Masha beat your fav and won. Get over it, hatred for this kind of stuff is disgusting.

Very well reasoned post. And I will add this. Welcome to the big time Maria. You have collected two one million dollar checks. You are on billboards and are signing big money endorsement deals. #4 in the world and a very bright future ahead. And now you got a lot of people that dislike you. Oh well, strap in and enjoy the ride girl. You got the stuff. :)

Dementinator
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:04 AM
Well From the comfort of the Bridge of the SS Dementieva on her way back to Moscow its seems to me that Masha did have a lot of luck! now Masha fans dont get me wrong ,i am not a "hater" but lets face it she was in the easy group ,and when she ran into a player playing well i.e Momo she lost! then she plays Nastya who is winning then goes into "shit mode" and throws the match away! She comes across Serena who was thrashing her then gets injured and cant really play properly any more!
Yes Iknow luck IS a factor of any Tournament but until Masha beats a top player who is playing their best and NOT injured I am still not convinced!
All the fist pumping get right on my tits!! it shows a lack of respect and for gods sake somebody glue her old mans ass to his chair!! he is soooo irratating he needs to take a leaf outa Richard Williams or Vera Dementievas book ,they now how to behave!
So yes i do reckon Masha could be more classy she needs to show more respect ,still she is young so i supose u have to make allowances!

~RedRose~
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:08 AM
What is wrong with you sore losers? Are you all about 12 because anyone who has watched tennis closely for at least a few years knows that if a player needs to pump herself or himself up and shout a few come ons to help themselves win then that's what they should do! You are delusional if you think that other players, including Serena would not try to win using whatever they needed to keep their confidance up, regardless if their opponent was "injured" or not. Maria did NOT go overboard on this; she was undoubtedly tired from playing 5 straight matches and needed to energize herself, especially after Serena's injury timeout when Maria had been playing so well.

And she forgot to mention Serena in her award speech! Big deal! The kid just won the YEC and was nervous and excited. She was classy enough to talk about the charitable cause she was donating the car to and I'm sure she'll say something about Serena later.

Masha beat your fav and won. Get over it, hatred for this kind of stuff is disgusting.
Firstly Serena ain't my fav, secondly Im not 12, and thirdly Ive been watching and following tennis for a hell of alot longer than 2 years.

Maria was quite rude today. Firstly about the speech. When the whole last set was filled with Serena's 70mph serves and Serena's straining groundstrokes, you can't just forget to mention that your opponent fought well. It just doesn't happen. If it is the case, then Maria is really dumb because Serena's injury was the no.1 factor of that match.

And about the fist pumping .... yes it is overboard. She fist pumped double faults. She fist pumped every bloody thing. And it wasn't just personal fist pumping it was CMON!!!!!!!!! fist pumping. It was embarressing for her.

Yeh sure, shout some cmon's when you hit a great winner in a rally. Dont yell CMON!!! when your opponent hits a sitting duck 60mph serve and you slam it down the line. Dont yell CMON!!! when your oppent hits an easy groundstroke out. It is pathetic. Maria is one of the onli players I know who fist pumps doublefaults and it is very very very petty. I have seen the very rare occasion when it is a df at like 40-ad and you win the game and you give a little cmon, but Maria was CMON! ing df's at 0-0. She was very unsportsman like.

You can blame age. But 17 is an age where people should know how to be respectful.

SharapovaFan16
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:10 AM
maria was down 4-0 in that set, yea ok let's not fire yourself up haha stfu

AnaIvanovicFan
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:12 AM
at least shes hot

bandabou
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:13 AM
"injured", jaco? So you´re doubting the injury......

Jakeev
Nov 16th, 2004, 12:10 PM
I'll never understand the point of threads like these. It's like all those "Serena is arrogant", "Justine cheated", "Steffi vs Monica"... It's meaningless. You know exactly who is going to post, and what they are going to say. There is no discussion, just repeating the same things over and over and over again. And it gets really ugly.
Bravo Joanna but the name calling isn't exactly the problem so much as the backstabbing and hypocrisy.

If you are gonna bash Serena and Maria ok fine but don't turn around and try to to defend the other while bashing the other at the same time.

That is the kind of crap that never ceases to amaze me.

TFan1156
Nov 16th, 2004, 01:09 PM
Firstly Serena ain't my fav, secondly Im not 12, and thirdly Ive been watching and following tennis for a hell of alot longer than 2 years.

Maria was quite rude today. Firstly about the speech. When the whole last set was filled with Serena's 70mph serves and Serena's straining groundstrokes, you can't just forget to mention that your opponent fought well. It just doesn't happen. If it is the case, then Maria is really dumb because Serena's injury was the no.1 factor of that match.

And about the fist pumping .... yes it is overboard. She fist pumped double faults. She fist pumped every bloody thing. And it wasn't just personal fist pumping it was CMON!!!!!!!!! fist pumping. It was embarressing for her.

Yeh sure, shout some cmon's when you hit a great winner in a rally. Dont yell CMON!!! when your opponent hits a sitting duck 60mph serve and you slam it down the line. Dont yell CMON!!! when your oppent hits an easy groundstroke out. It is pathetic. Maria is one of the onli players I know who fist pumps doublefaults and it is very very very petty. I have seen the very rare occasion when it is a df at like 40-ad and you win the game and you give a little cmon, but Maria was CMON! ing df's at 0-0. She was very unsportsman like.

You can blame age. But 17 is an age where people should know how to be respectful.

I hear you but let us put it in perspective. Injured players can be dangerous as Serena well proved to be the first 4 games of the 3rd set. Maria needed to do all she could to pump herself up to come back then close out the match. As to Maria`s other accomplishments, well she beat 3 other top players in the tournament. Mo Mo was an experimental, practice match. Maria is now on top of the tennis world and deserves it. Her ten years of hard work and sacrifice are paying off. And Serena will probably be heard from again. This could be the making of a great rivalry. :)

Fingon
Nov 16th, 2004, 02:38 PM
Not when her opponents were injured she didn't.
I won't bother arguing with you since you are always right :rolleyes:

Fingon
Nov 16th, 2004, 02:45 PM
I'll never understand the point of threads like these. It's like all those "Serena is arrogant", "Justine cheated", "Steffi vs Monica"... It's meaningless. You know exactly who is going to post, and what they are going to say. There is no discussion, just repeating the same things over and over and over again. And it gets really ugly.
having a rational discussion was never the aim of certain posters.

They just vent out their frustration by trying to disminished other players. Like I said before, since the "tier III queen" doesn't apply anymore they have to find ways to attack Maria and this's a "good" one.

They don't realize that they are trying to make their favourites look better by lowering other players, that is lowering the bar. Serena doesn't need that but these posters are too busy moaning to realize that.

What Maria did is what other players, including Serena have done multiple times, and she didn't wish Serena a speedy recovery, not it's not what she says but what she doesn't say, I am sure if she said something some posters would jump on her for being fake.

and don't get me in the the relatiation threads, really I know some people are very young but the level of inmaturity and silliness really reaches new highs every day in wtaworld (should probably be renamed to lalaworld).

SJW
Nov 16th, 2004, 02:48 PM
with a father like Yuri...i'm not surprised.

i'm seriously not surprised and can't say i'm all that bothered. but justifying her actions is something else. all she had to do was play, and she would win. i'm glad Serena was the gracious one :)

!!!--Duiz™--!!!
Nov 16th, 2004, 02:51 PM
only this thread is not very classy... how can you judge one when you cannot even express "classily" about other people...

Jaime Bahena
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:08 PM
So what? This is competition. Sharapova is there to try and win for Sharapova,not to feel sorry for her opponents.

Holy sh*t, somebody with reason. If I was in a tennis match, and my opponent had to stop the match because of injury, you can bet that I'm not going to turn down the trophy or prize money. Being healthy is part of competition, just like being "on your game" is part of competition in business, medicine, education. Point is: if your goal is to be better than your opponent, every little bit helps.

SJW
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:11 PM
holy sh*t, somebody without reason.

the purpose of this thread wasn't to attack sharapova for winning, but showing her immaturity for yelling and screaming at an injured opponent.

her winning desire is not what people take issue with. her "lack of respect", and her fans' continuing defence of it while criticising other players, is.

Jaime Bahena
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:13 PM
Admit it, tennis fans: Masha has had a "dream season." At 17, she has beaten some of the best players in the world, and there is no end in sight. If other players continue to have "unlucky" years due to injury, Masha will continue to have great years.

SJW
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:14 PM
Admit it, tennis fans, Masha is lucky!!

i never have much trouble admitting stuff, but this has to be the easiest thing ever.

mr_zebra
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:17 PM
I can't think of one other player on the tour who has EVER cheered and fist pumped when an obvioulsy injured player makes an injury induced, horrible unforced error.

Like i said in another thread- It'd be like a 5.0 level player, playing a wheelchaired opponent, and cheering and yelling "YEA!! CMON!!" when the wheelchair player double faults.

ans
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:23 PM
I have just seen the match.

First of all, well done by Maria, she's really achieved much this year and at such a young age... Her behaviour shows she's only 17 and indeed not mature enough to show some compassion or class, I think she might still grow in this. Me too, I expected some kind words for serena at the net or afterwards or during her speech. But as a fan of Kim, I'm maybe expecting too much:p (see her match at Rosmalen against an injured Justine).

Apart from her press conferences (and the really silly!! skirt) I admire serena. Look at how nice she was at the net! And she insisted on finishing the match though it was painful and embarrassing to watch, shows some real courage. She's a player I sometimes really like and sometimes really can't stand (with some help of some of her fans on this board).

xan
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:29 PM
,i am not a "hater" but lets face it she was in the easy group ,and when she ran into a player playing well i.e Momo she lost! The "easy group" that included the US Open champion and the recent World No 1 player - as well as vera zvonareva, who many people here were saying was much better than Masha only a few weeks ago.

The Momo match was not important. It was a "dead rubber", both were qualified and neither wanted to wear themselves out before the Semi's. In other words, it wasn't a vital match, neither went "all-out". It was more of an exhibition for the fans. I always knew that whoever won the 1st set would probably stroll the match.

then she plays Nastya who is winning then goes into "shit mode" and throws the match away! Nastya went off top-form a little, and Maria came back at her. That's what tennis matches are all about. It was Maria who fought her way to a win over a player who has always had a mental dominance over her. A particularly good win.


She comes across Serena who was thrashing her then gets injured and cant really play properly any more!
Thrashing? :lol: Serena won the first set by one break of serve. Then Maria went 5-2 up before the injury affected Serena! Maria was unsettled by the break in play and went down after the injury 4-0 to a freed-up Serena. Only then did Maria settle and fight back. Yes Serena's injury affected the last set. But she was by no means "thrashing" Maria before then.


Yes Iknow luck IS a factor of any Tournament but until Masha beats a top player who is playing their best and NOT injured I am still not convinced!
But of course no-one Maria beats is ever "playing at their best" according to the excuse-makers, so it is an impossible demand.

Lets just settle on the fact that if someone turns up to play, and Maria beats them, THEY LOST!

All the fist pumping get right on my tits!! it shows a lack of respect Then we'll just have to eliminate 95% of the WTA as being disrespectful.

:lol: :lol: @ Serena supporters complaining about fist-pumping!

bandabou
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:33 PM
Last 6 games were so painful to watch indeed Ans.....Serena reduced to serving like Elena D....:sad:

xan
Nov 16th, 2004, 03:35 PM
Last 6 games were so painful to watch indeed Ans.....Serena reduced to serving like Elena D....:sad:
Jo Durie said she should have served underarm!

gmak
Nov 16th, 2004, 04:25 PM
well this will just go on and on and on.....

i don't think serena at 17 was the model of maturity and class :rolleyes:
even at Wimbledon a few years back she was pumping and yelling COME ON! at Els Callens' doublefaults!

however i agree about the speech, she shoulfd have said something about serena but she's not the only one :shrug: svetlana didn't even mention elena at the US Open speech either...

JLDementieva
Nov 16th, 2004, 04:43 PM
at least shes hot
so as long as you're hot you are excuesd from everything?

ans
Nov 16th, 2004, 04:54 PM
Last 6 games were so painful to watch indeed Ans.....Serena reduced to serving like Elena D....:sad:
Yes, her serve reminded me of Elena D's too:)

Hope to see your serena and my fave next year, compeating like in the good "old" days.

FrauleinSteffi
Nov 16th, 2004, 06:45 PM
Serena was actually gracious but so was Maria she was interviewed by ESPN too & she was Gracious against Serena at Wimby too....Everyone gangs up on Maria because she is pretty & a model but they forget shes no Anna K the girl is awesome..This year Winning Wimby & THe YEC both over Serena..also beat this year..Myskina,Svetlana,Venus,Davenport,Ai,Vera...S erena puts her ugly Nike footwear in her mouth every time she talks to the press whether over Davenport this past weekend or matches with Jen & Hingis & Shes loving herself whatever OMG This is like the pot calling the kettle black....injured or not Serena lost & Maria won ok

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:32 PM
You know this fucked up thread is no better than the "Serena has no class threads."

But what really friggen gets me, and I have been around this joint to know better but I never learn, is that the same people who defended Serena to the hilt in those threads, have no qualms coming in an equally fucked up thread like this and pick on Maria.



So, and what's wrong with that? They hate Serena and Venus and I hate Maria. What, I'm supposed to let them talk bad about my favs and I can't say anything negative about theirs? Someone I genuinely dislike. Puhleeze. :rolleyes:

Pick on Maria??!!! So, Maria is above criticizm?

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:33 PM
DeDe4925 :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed:
Masharapova:rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed: :rolleyes: :smash: :armed:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:34 PM
She's cute, isn't she? A troll, yes, but a cute one. :)
I think you're cute too. A real troll, but a cute one. Like the one I have with orange hair on top of my computer. :p :lol:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:37 PM
Well From the comfort of the Bridge of the SS Dementieva on her way back to Moscow its seems to me that Masha did have a lot of luck! now Masha fans dont get me wrong ,i am not a "hater" but lets face it she was in the easy group ,and when she ran into a player playing well i.e Momo she lost! then she plays Nastya who is winning then goes into "shit mode" and throws the match away! She comes across Serena who was thrashing her then gets injured and cant really play properly any more!
Yes Iknow luck IS a factor of any Tournament but until Masha beats a top player who is playing their best and NOT injured I am still not convinced!
All the fist pumping get right on my tits!! it shows a lack of respect and for gods sake somebody glue her old mans ass to his chair!! he is soooo irratating he needs to take a leaf outa Richard Williams or Vera Dementievas book ,they now how to behave!
So yes i do reckon Masha could be more classy she needs to show more respect ,still she is young so i supose u have to make allowances!
:worship: :worship: :worship: :worship:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:39 PM
Firstly Serena ain't my fav, secondly Im not 12, and thirdly Ive been watching and following tennis for a hell of alot longer than 2 years.

Maria was quite rude today. Firstly about the speech. When the whole last set was filled with Serena's 70mph serves and Serena's straining groundstrokes, you can't just forget to mention that your opponent fought well. It just doesn't happen. If it is the case, then Maria is really dumb because Serena's injury was the no.1 factor of that match.

And about the fist pumping .... yes it is overboard. She fist pumped double faults. She fist pumped every bloody thing. And it wasn't just personal fist pumping it was CMON!!!!!!!!! fist pumping. It was embarressing for her.

Yeh sure, shout some cmon's when you hit a great winner in a rally. Dont yell CMON!!! when your opponent hits a sitting duck 60mph serve and you slam it down the line. Dont yell CMON!!! when your oppent hits an easy groundstroke out. It is pathetic. Maria is one of the onli players I know who fist pumps doublefaults and it is very very very petty. I have seen the very rare occasion when it is a df at like 40-ad and you win the game and you give a little cmon, but Maria was CMON! ing df's at 0-0. She was very unsportsman like.

You can blame age. But 17 is an age where people should know how to be respectful.
:worship: :worship: :worship:

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 09:54 PM
having a rational discussion was never the aim of certain posters.

Most of the posts have been rational, but nothing seems ever to be rational to you when you don't agree with the people asserting the arguments.

They just vent out their frustration by trying to disminished other players. Like I said before, since the "tier III queen" doesn't apply anymore they have to find ways to attack Maria and this's a "good" one.

They don't realize that they are trying to make their favourites look better by lowering other players, that is lowering the bar. Serena doesn't need that but these posters are too busy moaning to realize that.

Why do you generalize so? I don't have to lower Maria to make Serena look better. Serena did that all by herself last night. She was the greater champion, the better sportswoman and gutsiest player. Maria lowered herself by her behavior on court during the last six games. I've seen people try to pump themself up, but the way she did it was not proper way in light of the circumstances. Maybe she needs a lesson on tennis court etiquette. I've never seen any other player on tour behave that badly on court with the endless fist pumping of DF's and come ons after service return winners of 50mph serves. If someone can name someone who's done worse, please prove me wrong. So what if we're pissing and moaning about it. The behavior was appalling.

What Maria did is what other players, including Serena have done multiple times, and she didn't wish Serena a speedy recovery, not it's not what she says but what she doesn't say, I am sure if she said something some posters would jump on her for being fake.

That's bullshit and it's a lie about Serena. If someone can recall a time when someone acted as appalling as Maria did last night during a tennis match and thereafter, I wish they would come forward and have proof when they come. And, there you go assuming and generalizing again about what people would do. You're just as bad as those you critisize. You're jumping all over people for something that you don't even know would happen.


and don't get me in the the relatiation threads, really I know some people are very young but the level of inmaturity and silliness really reaches new highs every day in wtaworld (should probably be renamed to lalaworld).

Then seriously, why Fingon do you waste your time with us immature, silly retaliatory people in lalaworld? It would seem to me that a mature, no-nonsense, smart guy like yourself wouldn't want to be bothered with such craziness. Yet, you're here everyday or every other day like the rest of us.

DeDe4925
Nov 16th, 2004, 10:01 PM
Da hata' will always find something against Maria. Sad reality when you're white and blond.
So, are you making fun of the state of people of color in this world? Don't you think it's insensitive of you to make light of the plight of people of color?

améliemomo
Nov 16th, 2004, 10:42 PM
Mariah sharapova is definitely NOT a classy player because she behaves very bad on a court, her match against serena prove it.

SHE DOESNT KNOW what "respect" and "humility" mean, she belongs to theses kind of persons that i cant bare, as for me she is a good player but she was dominated by serena yesterday, she took advantage of serena injury, She didnt win by herself but serena who "give " her the victory, serena deserved to win. :rolleyes:

I found serena too kind and polite with her at the end of the match in giving her congratulations, sharapova didnt seem to listen to her she was looking for the camera :rolleyes:

she is THE STAR!!! :rolleyes:

bovina_forever
Nov 16th, 2004, 11:05 PM
And when ever she yeld out come on when Serena double falted it was like she was rubbing it in her face that she was hurt

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:12 AM
I can't think of one other player on the tour who has EVER cheered and fist pumped when an obvioulsy injured player makes an injury induced, horrible unforced error.

Like i said in another thread- It'd be like a 5.0 level player, playing a wheelchaired opponent, and cheering and yelling "YEA!! CMON!!" when the wheelchair player double faults.
:worship: :worship: :worship:

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:19 AM
i don't think serena at 17 was the model of maturity and class :rolleyes:
even at Wimbledon a few years back she was pumping and yelling COME ON! at Els Callens' doublefaults!

...
Was Els Callens injured???!! :rolleyes: Good God, you people just don't get it.

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:20 AM
...Everyone gangs up on Maria because she is pretty & a model
OMG :rolleyes:

Doc
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:36 AM
Why do you generalize so? I don't have to lower Maria to make Serena look better. Serena did that all by herself last night. She was the greater champion, the better sportswoman and gutsiest player. Maria lowered herself by her behavior on court during the last six games. I've seen people try to pump themself up, but the way she did it was not proper way in light of the circumstances. Maybe she needs a lesson on tennis court etiquette.

What a load of cr@p! tennis court "ettiquette" indeed. This isn't a game of croquet on the vicar's lawn. This is professional tennis, in which players urge themselves on and give 100%.

I've never seen any other player on tour behave that badly on court with the endless fist pumping of DF's and come ons after service return winners of 50mph serves. If someone can name someone who's done worse, please prove me wrong. So what if we're pissing and moaning about it. The behavior was appalling.

This is so surreal. Supporters of Serena complaining about pumping and whooping and psyching yourself up!!! What universe are you living in?? Maria's fist pumps are nothing to Serena's, when she happens to be hitting winners. As for Maria "fist-pumping DFs", I didn't see that at all. And if you hit a winner off a serve, you are entitled to celebrate. The Eurosport commentators agreed that Maria was doing the right thing in pumping herself up. Especially when she was 0-4 down and only two games away from defeat.

Jo Durie said, "She doesn't want to look to see if Serena's hurting, she needs to work to make her hurt more." Harsh. But that is professional tennis. Serena wanted to win, and if Maria had eased off, and let her win the match, all the haters would be jumping up and down with glee gloating over how useless and flukish Maria was to be beaten by an injured Serena!

That's the hypocrisy we see here. What really upsets the haters is that they have been proved wrong again, and that Maria has beaten their heroes and taken another Major... That's what produces the bitterness and spitefulness.

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:55 AM
What a load of cr@p! tennis court "ettiquette" indeed. This isn't a game of croquet on the vicar's lawn. This is professional tennis, in which players urge themselves on and give 100%.

Obviously you know nothing about tennis or tennis history. Do you play? You can't even spell etiquette, so there's no need for me to even continue in this vain with you. :rolleyes:

This is so surreal. Supporters of Serena complaining about pumping and whooping and psyching yourself up!!! What universe are you living in?? Maria's fist pumps are nothing to Serena's, when she happens to be hitting winners. As for Maria "fist-pumping DFs", I didn't see that at all. And if you hit a winner off a serve, you are entitled to celebrate. The Eurosport commentators agreed that Maria was doing the right thing in pumping herself up. Especially when she was 0-4 down and only two games away from defeat.

I'm surprised you can spell surreal. Do you know what it means? We are talking about pumping fists when the opponent is injured and they can barely lift their arm to hit the serve. :rolleyes: The more gracious thing would have been to just receive the DF and move to the other side of the court. That's what Serena did when she played an injured Venus at Wimby 2003.

Do you actually think she was doing something fantastic hitting winners off of 50mph serves? I give Maria more credit than that. Even the commentators said her serving was of the country club circuit, not a professional tennis player's serve and certainly not a Serena serve. I could see if Serena was even able to place the serves better in the fifth set and she hit a winner, but she was hitting them so that they sat right up for any amateur player to hit a winner off of. Therefore, the come on's were ridiculous. I'm not saying she didn't need to pump herself up to get her head back in the game after going down 0-4, but in light of circumstances, do it discretly to herself. Why can't you understand that?

Jo Durie said, "She doesn't want to look to see if Serena's hurting, she needs to work to make her hurt more." Harsh. But that is professional tennis. Serena wanted to win, and if Maria had eased off, and let her win the match, all the haters would be jumping up and down with glee gloating over how useless and flukish Maria was to be beaten by an injured Serena!

Are you that obtuse? No one is saying Maria should have eased off and neither is anyone saying she should have let Serena win, that's stupid. But, there was no sense in rubbing her injury and defeat in her face. I'm sure, Maria will live to regret her behaviour last night. Of course we would have done those things if Serena won. But, that's different because she was injured. It would have been a fantastic feat because Maria is such a good player. But, when the fifth set started and the pain on Serena's face was so obvious, we all knew she wasn't going to win. Therefore, your last comment is a moot issue.

That's the hypocrisy we see here. What really upsets the haters is that they have been proved wrong again, and that Maria has beaten their heroes and taken another Major... That's what produces the bitterness and spitefulness.

The only hypocrisy that exists is your failure to see the truth. You are so blinded by your worship of Maria, you can't see what she did was wrong. Maria still hasn't proven anything with regard to Serena. She beat a a semi healthy (still recovering from knee surgery and soreness) Serena in Wimby, but she beat a severely injured Serena last night. When she beats an 80% Serena, then I'll be convinced that she's the better player. But, last night proves nothing. It could have gone either way. We'll never know. Also, let me just clue you in on this...the YEC is NOT a Major. :)

Becool
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:12 AM
why some fans thinks some posters criticize maria because she's "a model and pretty"? :rolleyes:

Tennisfan-Mtl
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:15 AM
I mean first of all congratulations to her for winning the title. Second of all I think her c'mon's and excessive screaming was a little much. She obviously knew Serena was injured and really was spitting in her face by doing what she was doing. I don't know if I'm just being bitter but I mean c'mon! :p

Oh ! But isn't it what Serena usually do too ???

Orion
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:31 AM
If someone can name someone who's done worse, please prove me wrong. So what if we're pissing and moaning about it. The behavior was appalling.



That's bullshit and it's a lie about Serena. If someone can recall a time when someone acted as appalling as Maria did last night during a tennis match and thereafter, I wish they would come forward and have proof when they come.



Justine Henin-Hardenne lying about having her hand raised (Roland Garros 2003 Semi-Final). Martina Hingis crossing to Seles' side to point to the line.How about personal insult/attack? Not mentioning someone in a speech is one thing, calling a female player half man is entirely different (ref. Martina Hingis on Amelie Mauresmo). And S. Williams is no picnic in being generous towards players on court. When avenging her loss to Mauresmo (Rome 2003 Semi-Final) at Roland Garros (Quarter-Final), every point Mauresmo won was followed by a glare of pure hate from Williams, and every unforced error by Mauresmo followed by a scream of joy from Williams. That is bad behavior. Sharapova wasn't very classy out there today, but in comparison to Hingis, Henin, and Williams (on occassion only, I think Williams is wonderful), she is not as terrible a human being as you think.

Doc
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:01 AM
Obviously you know nothing about tennis or tennis history. Do you play? You can't even spell etiquette, so there's no need for me to even continue in this vain with you. :rolleyes:

Oops. My finger slipped. That reflects on my knowledge of tennis enormously :rolleyes:

My point stands. If anyone breaches "tennis etiquette" with grunts, fist-pumps, glares and loud celebrations, it is Serena.

I'm surprised you can spell surreal. Do you know what it means?
That's why I used the word. It means something (like your complaint) that is unbelievably outrageous and illogical while trying to pass itself off as quite normal and commonplace. In other words you express outrage at Maria pumping herself up while supporting the player best known for doing exactly the same thing!

We are talking about pumping fists when the opponent is injured and they can barely lift their arm to hit the serve.
Sorry. there's no law about when you can and can't pump your fist. If Serena had been lying immobile on the ground writhing in agony, then fist-pumping might have been a little out of place. However in fact Serena was hitting huge winners all over the court, and racing around like a banshee, running up a 4-0 lead. Under such circumstances holding back is not an advisable course.

The more gracious thing would have been to just receive the DF and move to the other side of the court. Which is what Masha did.

Do you actually think she was doing something fantastic hitting winners off of 50mph serves? I give Maria more credit than that. Even the commentators said her serving was of the country club circuit, not a professional tennis player's serve and certainly not a Serena serve.

The Eurosport commentators said that Serena was very dangerous when injured. She proved this by taking a 4-0 lead after the injury. In such circumstances of course a player must go all out. I haven't noticed Serena holding back against players with country club serves. If Serena couldn't play, she had options - she could default, she could start serving underarm. This, the commentators advised.
I could see if Serena was even able to place the serves better in the fifth set and she hit a winner, but she was hitting them so that they sat right up for any amateur player to hit a winner off of.
"Off of" - and you're criticising my grammar?

Therefore, the come on's were ridiculous. I'm not saying she didn't need to pump herself up to get her head back in the game after going down 0-4, but in light of circumstances, do it discretly to herself. Why can't you understand that?
Some people may be abe to pump themselves up discretely, others can't. The game is much more intense now than it was in the past, when all serves were 60 mph. That means you've got to be up there prepared to exchange pinpoint accurate groundstrokes at 90 miles an hour. You don't get up to that sort of level with a whispered "Come on , pull yourself together, old girl,"

Are you that obtuse? No one is saying Maria should have eased off
That's exactly what you're saying. You're saying she should have kept quiet, not pumped herself up into making great shots, and played in some sort of restrained casual style that is not hers. She wouldn't have got the win that way.

and neither is anyone saying she should have let Serena win, that's stupid. But, there was no sense in rubbing her injury and defeat in her face. I'm sure, Maria will live to regret her behaviour last night. Of course we would have done those things if Serena won. But, that's different because she was injured. It would have been a fantastic feat because Maria is such a good player. But, when the fifth set started and the pain on Serena's face was so obvious, we all knew she wasn't going to win. Therefore, your last comment is a moot issue.

Fifth set? I presume you mean 3rd set?? And the players didn't seem to think the match was settled...

"I just started hitting every ball as hard as I could," Williams said. "And I think I lived off her mistakes. Once she stopped making them, she was able to come back and win the match."

"I think she figured that she can't really do anything from her serve," Sharapova said. "So she's got to hit everything as hard as she could. And that is exactly what she did. And there is not too much I could do. She was hitting the ball as hard as she could. And everything was going in."

The only hypocrisy that exists is your failure to see the truth. You are so blinded by your worship of Maria, you can't see what she did was wrong.
Maria played normally. End of story. You actually seem more blinded by your disappointment at Serena's loss and self-admitted hatred of Maria, so as to try and blame her for Serena not winning. The "upstart" Maria has beaten your "queen" twice, at just 17, and it hurts, so you lash out at Maria.

Maria still hasn't proven anything with regard to Serena. She beat a a semi healthy (still recovering from knee surgery and soreness) Serena in Wimby,

Serena was perfectly healthy at Wimbledon. Ask Amelie.

but she beat a severely injured Serena last night. When she beats an 80% Serena, then I'll be convinced that she's the better player.
"Severely injured" is pushing it a bit. "Severely injured" is being carried off court on a stretcher. Serena suffered an abdominal muscle strain that made her service action painful, but it didn't affect her other shots. Yes. Serena was injured, which detracts from Maria's win. But Maria was moving ahead in the match well before the injury.

jacobruiz
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:30 AM
Great post, Doc. I thought Maria was too restrained until she finally got back on track in the 3rd after watching Serena hit so many great shots after her injury time-out. After that she clenched her fist more but there was nothing wrong with her actions on court.

If a player is "severely injured" she should retire. If she chooses to continue to play her opponent has no choice but to try to win, within the rules, of course. Maria played her usual game, regained her calm and confidence and won.

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:33 AM
Oh ! But isn't it what Serena usually do too ???
No. :confused: As a matter of fact, name one time. Just one.

Dan23
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:34 AM
Well From the comfort of the Bridge of the SS Dementieva on her way back to Moscow its seems to me that Masha did have a lot of luck! now Masha fans dont get me wrong ,i am not a "hater" but lets face it she was in the easy group ,and when she ran into a player playing well i.e Momo she lost! then she plays Nastya who is winning then goes into "shit mode" and throws the match away! She comes across Serena who was thrashing her then gets injured and cant really play properly any more!Cmon Captain that really isnt a very intelligent post...:p
Surely from the comfort of the SS Dementieva bridge you would have seen the Zurich SF too..how do you explain that?
Ask Vera which group was the easy one..Maria played 2 members of the Red group too for 2 wins..both Momo and Maria have talked about their match being below the standards they'd usually put into a match..
Nastya going into "shit mode"?? She had just come off a straight sets win over Lena (who I am a big fan of) and Lindsay..
I wouldnt call 4-6 5-2* being thrashed either..

Yes Iknow luck IS a factor of any Tournament but until Masha beats a top player who is playing their best and NOT injured I am still not convinced!
All the fist pumping get right on my tits!! it shows a lack of respect and for gods sake somebody glue her old mans ass to his chair!! he is soooo irratating he needs to take a leaf outa Richard Williams or Vera Dementievas book ,they now how to behave!
So yes i do reckon Masha could be more classy she needs to show more respect ,still she is young so i supose u have to make allowances!..and it continues..
Id call beating Sugiyama, Davenport, S. Williams, V. Williams, Dementieva, Kuznetsova and Myskina some pretty decent wins over some pretty decent players...
Also Yuri's behaviour really has very little to do with Maria..

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:35 AM
Justine Henin-Hardenne lying about having her hand raised (Roland Garros 2003 Semi-Final). Martina Hingis crossing to Seles' side to point to the line.How about personal insult/attack? Not mentioning someone in a speech is one thing, calling a female player half man is entirely different (ref. Martina Hingis on Amelie Mauresmo). And S. Williams is no picnic in being generous towards players on court. When avenging her loss to Mauresmo (Rome 2003 Semi-Final) at Roland Garros (Quarter-Final), every point Mauresmo won was followed by a glare of pure hate from Williams, and every unforced error by Mauresmo followed by a scream of joy from Williams. That is bad behavior. Sharapova wasn't very classy out there today, but in comparison to Hingis, Henin, and Williams (on occassion only, I think Williams is wonderful), she is not as terrible a human being as you think.
I stand corrected. However, that comment about Serena having pure hate, that's ridiculous. She also looked at Venus during Slam finals when Vee would hit an ace or winner against her. I doubt it's pure hate, just intensity.

Justeenium
Nov 17th, 2004, 04:42 AM
Justine Henin-Hardenne lying about having her hand raised (Roland Garros 2003 Semi-Final). Martina Hingis crossing to Seles' side to point to the line.How about personal insult/attack? Not mentioning someone in a speech is one thing, calling a female player half man is entirely different (ref. Martina Hingis on Amelie Mauresmo). And S. Williams is no picnic in being generous towards players on court. When avenging her loss to Mauresmo (Rome 2003 Semi-Final) at Roland Garros (Quarter-Final), every point Mauresmo won was followed by a glare of pure hate from Williams, and every unforced error by Mauresmo followed by a scream of joy from Williams. That is bad behavior. Sharapova wasn't very classy out there today, but in comparison to Hingis, Henin, and Williams (on occassion only, I think Williams is wonderful), she is not as terrible a human being as you think.

talk about full of errors, you :retard: Justine did not lie you moron. Get your shit straight; Rena was being unclassy that day. Do I have to pm Faste and explain it to an imbecile like you.

Martina H did that against Steffi, yes it was against the rules, but all she was doing was pointing to the right mark, that doesn't make her a horrible person.

http://www.genmay.com/images/smilies/shiki.gif

jacobruiz
Nov 17th, 2004, 05:25 AM
Justine Henin-Hardenne lying about having her hand raised (Roland Garros 2003 Semi-Final). Martina Hingis crossing to Seles' side to point to the line.How about personal insult/attack? Not mentioning someone in a speech is one thing, calling a female player half man is entirely different (ref. Martina Hingis on Amelie Mauresmo). And S. Williams is no picnic in being generous towards players on court. When avenging her loss to Mauresmo (Rome 2003 Semi-Final) at Roland Garros (Quarter-Final), every point Mauresmo won was followed by a glare of pure hate from Williams, and every unforced error by Mauresmo followed by a scream of joy from Williams. That is bad behavior. Sharapova wasn't very classy out there today, but in comparison to Hingis, Henin, and Williams (on occassion only, I think Williams is wonderful), she is not as terrible a human being as you think.
And how about when Patty was so pissed off at Conchita Martinez during a match(I forget what tournement)that she approached the net to shake hands with her arm outstretched and then pulled it back at the last moment, glaring at Conchi!:lol:

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 05:42 AM
Oops. My finger slipped. That reflects on my knowledge of tennis enormously :rolleyes:

No, you said there is no tennis etiquette in professional tennis. There always has been and there is now. There's obviously less of it, especially with the likes of players like Maria.

My point stands. If anyone breaches "tennis etiquette" with grunts, fist-pumps, glares and loud celebrations, it is Serena.

Did Serena do this against an injured opponent? Noooooo. Her sister was injured in the Wimbledon 2003 final. Did we see Serena with fist pumps, glares and loud celebrations, NO. My argument has nothing to do with celebrating a fine shot or win. It has to do with basic courtesy for a player you know is injured and certainly is not at their best. You just don't get it. Like I said, you're too blind to see.

That's why I used the word. It means something (like your complaint) that is unbelievably outrageous and illogical while trying to pass itself off as quite normal and commonplace. In other words you express outrage at Maria pumping herself up while supporting the player best known for doing exactly the same thing!

It's not surreal because you've taken what we are saying about Maria out of context. If this were a match where both players were physically healthy, my statement would be bizarre, but that wasn't the case. I said nothing about her pumping herself up. I said she could do it, but more discretely. Sure, all of the players fist pump and yell to pump themselves up, but I don't see them do that to players making DF's because they are injured. You said, "As for Maria "fist-pumping DFs", I didn't see that at all." Well, are you blind? Oh, that's right you are. :rolleyes: Everyone else saw it but you. I hope you taped the match so you can replay it, but I doubt you see it then. Even if you do, you probably won't admit it.

Sorry. there's no law about when you can and can't pump your fist. If Serena had been lying immobile on the ground writhing in agony, then fist-pumping might have been a little out of place. However in fact Serena was hitting huge winners all over the court, and racing around like a banshee, running up a 4-0 lead. Under such circumstances holding back is not an advisable course.

:lol: If Serena were lying immobile on the ground writhing in agony there would be no need to fist pump, it would be time to call an ambulance. :rolleyes: Good God!!! Of course there's no law about when you can and can't pump your fist, but to do so after hitting a winner any amateur could hit is demeaning to Maria. Yes, Serena was hitting huge winners and ran up a 4-0 lead in the third set, but it cost her, because her injury obviously worsened in the fifth game. She DF'ed three times. Were you watching this match or just listening to it on Eurosport?


Which is what Masha did.

No, she pumped her fist and said "yea" everytime. :confused:


The Eurosport commentators said that Serena was very dangerous when injured. She proved this by taking a 4-0 lead after the injury. In such circumstances of course a player must go all out. I haven't noticed Serena holding back against players with country club serves. If Serena couldn't play, she had options - she could default, she could start serving underarm. This, the commentators advised.

:rolleyes: Of course Eurosport commentators are objective and unbiased in their commentary. No one is saying Maria shouldn't go all out after a 4-0 deficit, but obviously Serena shot her wad in those four games and at the start of the 5th game, she was spent and in pain. You keep trying to twist what I'm saying into what you want to hear me say. No one suggested that Maria should have held back against Serena and her country club serves at 50mph. The fist pumping and the come on's were not necessary. How many times do I have to explain that to you? Sure Serena had options and she chose to stay in the match in pain, which you should be praising. At least Maria didn't win by default. But, the point is the way Maria was behaving was uncalled for. It was classless.

"Off of" - and you're criticising my grammar?

I didn't criticize your grammar, I criticized your spelling. Not the same thing. But, if that's the best you can come up with in response to the following: "I could see if Serena was even able to place the serves better in the fifth set and she hit a winner, but she was hitting them so that they sat right up for any amateur player to hit a winner off of. " Then, oh well. :rolleyes: I guess you can't answer that. Again, just so you don't twist it to support your argument, I said that in regard to her fist pumping and "COME ON". It would be funny if it weren't so pathetic on Maria's part.


Some people may be abe to pump themselves up discretely, others can't. The game is much more intense now than it was in the past, when all serves were 60 mph. That means you've got to be up there prepared to exchange pinpoint accurate groundstrokes at 90 miles an hour. You don't get up to that sort of level with a whispered "Come on , pull yourself together, old girl,"

I guess Maria can't. That's a shame for her. Well, Serena's serve was 50mph, so I think you made my point for me. This wasn't a situation where the serves were over 60 mph, and she had to be prepared to exchange pinpoint accurate groundstrokes at 90 miles per hour in the fifth game of the third set. Again, for the 10th time, there was no need for yelling "Come on".


That's exactly what you're saying. You're saying she should have kept quiet, not pumped herself up into making great shots, and played in some sort of restrained casual style that is not hers. She wouldn't have got the win that way.

That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying she could have toned it down a notch or two. But, I guess she's not a champion her fans make her out to be. Nor is she a very good player if she must yell and carry on against an obviously injured opponent to win.


Fifth set? I presume you mean 3rd set?? And the players didn't seem to think the match was settled...

"I just started hitting every ball as hard as I could," Williams said. "And I think I lived off her mistakes. Once she stopped making them, she was able to come back and win the match."

"I think she figured that she can't really do anything from her serve," Sharapova said. "So she's got to hit everything as hard as she could. And that is exactly what she did. And there is not too much I could do. She was hitting the ball as hard as she could. And everything was going in."

No actually I meant fifth game of the third set. Here, they are talking about the first four games of the third set. So, those comments are irrelevant, because everyone knew from the fifth game on in the third set that Serena could not keep up the pace she set for herself in the first four games of that set. The pain had become increasingly worse and you could see it in her face and in her movements. Did the Eurosport commentators say anything about that? The whole point again, is the display of Maria during this time with the fist pumps and the "come on's", not that anyone expected her to lower her level of play or let Serena win.

Maria played normally. End of story. You actually seem more blinded by your disappointment at Serena's loss and self-admitted hatred of Maria, so as to try and blame her for Serena not winning. The "upstart" Maria has beaten your "queen" twice, at just 17, and it hurts, so you lash out at Maria.

Yes, she played normally. No one expected her not to. I did expect some grace and class, but as she points out ad nausem, she's only 17. I am disappointed at Serena's loss and I do hate Maria, but I'm not blinded by it. I don't blame Maria for Serena not winning. It's no one's fault, Serena got injured. It can happen to anyone. Even your precious Maria. I hope whomever she plays against when that happens, and it will, her opponent will be more gracious than she was with Serena. Serena has lost before and she will lose again. But, she will also win again and hopefully it will be against Maria at OZ '05. Yes, she's beaten Serena twice at 17. Been there before with Serena when she beat the No. 1 player Martina Hingis to win the US Open at 17 in 1999. I know how you feel. It's fun to be on that high horse, but you bust your ass when you fall off, and you WILL fall. Hopefully, they will meet many times next season, if Maria decides to start playing Tier 1's and 2's instead the 3's and 4's.



Serena was perfectly healthy at Wimbledon. Ask Amelie.

Yeah, that's why she pulled out of a couple of tournaments with a sore knee after Wimby. She hasn't been completely healthy all year. So, don't lie to make yourself feel better about Marias victories over Serena. She still hasn't beaten a healthy Serena.


"Severely injured" is pushing it a bit. "Severely injured" is being carried off court on a stretcher. Serena suffered an abdominal muscle strain that made her service action painful, but it didn't affect her other shots. Yes. Serena was injured, which detracts from Maria's win. But Maria was moving ahead in the match well before the injury.

Have you ever pulled or torn a muscle? Whether you classify the injury as severe or not, the pain is very severe. Again, did you even watch the match? If it didn't effect her other shots, why at the start of the fifth game in the third set, did she start missing? The pain worsened.

It sure does detract from Maria's win. I'm glad you admit that. When was Maria moving ahead in the match? Serena became injured in the second set when she tried to serve 124 and 127mph, which is the only reason she won the second set 6-2.

You sir are living in a fantasy world. I hope it doesn't come crashing in before you're ready.

Dan23
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:07 AM
Yeah, that's why she pulled out of a couple of tournaments with a sore knee after Wimby. She hasn't been completely healthy all year. So, don't lie to make yourself feel better about Marias victories over Serena. She still hasn't beaten a healthy Serena.


...Serena became injured in the second set when she tried to serve 124 and 127mph, which is the only reason she won the second set 6-2.
You seem to be the only one believing these things..
Whos living in the fantasy world??

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:19 AM
You seem to be the only one believing these things..
Whos living in the fantasy world??
You don't read very well then. Who needs reading comprehension lessons. Maybe you just need glasses. :o

Dan23
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:23 AM
You don't read very well then. Who needs reading comprehension lessons. Maybe you just need glasses. :o
Yes maybe I do need glasses...my eyes are sore from constantly reading all the drivel posted in this thread :)

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:25 AM
Yes maybe I do need glasses...my eyes are sore from constantly reading all the drivel posted in this thread :)
:retard: Duhh, then it's time to move on or shut your computer off. Do you know how to tie your shoe laces? :)

Dan23
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:33 AM
:retard: Duhh, then it's time to move on or shut your computer off. Do you know how to tie your shoe laces? :)
..and miss out on the sensible discussion provided by some of the more credible members of the forum?
Yea my shoes laces are tied :)

Junex
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:35 AM
I stand corrected. However, that comment about Serena having pure hate, that's ridiculous. She also looked at Venus during Slam finals when Vee would hit an ace or winner against her. I doubt it's pure hate, just intensity.


LOL @ this post!

how do you know about intensity?

Fingon
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:41 AM
Most of the posts have been rational, but nothing seems ever to be rational to you when you don't agree with the people asserting the arguments.

obviously we have different definitions of what rational is, especially when I've never seen anything rational coming for you. (eg the antichrist)


Why do you generalize so? I don't have to lower Maria to make Serena look better.

are you really that stupid?, first, I don't generalize, I said SOME, see the fucking word SOME fans. Second, I didn't say that it was to make Serena look better, that's something the little voices in you head are telling you, I said it's a way to vent out their anger, learn to read, and to understand what you read.

Serena did that all by herself last night.
indeed

She was the greater champion,

if you had said a great champion I would have had to agree, but greated is debatable

the better sportswoman and gutsiest player.

again, your opinion

Maria lowered herself by her behavior on court during the last six games. I've seen people try to pump themself up, but the way she did it was not proper way in light of the circumstances.

I've seen Serena doing the same, not once, but multiple times, and I didn't think it was wrong btw.

Maybe she needs a lesson on tennis court etiquette. I've never seen any other player on tour behave that badly on court with the endless fist pumping of DF's and come ons after service return winners of 50mph serves.

I thought you liked Serena, obviously you haven't seen much of her

If someone can name someone who's done worse, please prove me wrong. So what if we're pissing and moaning about it. The behavior was appalling.

Serena Williams


That's bullshit and it's a lie about Serena. If someone can recall a time when someone acted as appalling as Maria did last night during a tennis match and thereafter, I wish they would come forward and have proof when they come.

and what fucking proof you want? a video, surely you don't expect anybody to list the matches were Serena has done that (basically all the matches where she wasn't playing well) but one case I do remember is against Kim Clijsters US Open 99.

And, there you go assuming and generalizing again about what people would do. You're just as bad as those you critisize. You're jumping all over people for something that you don't even know would happen.

oh please, it has happened all the time, since the Sanex board nearly 6 years ago, it has happened every fucking time with no exception, don't come with cheap philosophy for dummies, you don't do it very well



Then seriously, why Fingon do you waste your time with us immature, silly retaliatory people in lalaworld? It would seem to me that a mature, no-nonsense, smart guy like yourself wouldn't want to be bothered with such craziness. Yet, you're here everyday or every other day like the rest of us.
your point being? maybe I found pathetic people like you amusing, maybe I am bored and don't have anything else to do (like when I am at work), maybe among all the mediocrity there are indeed some posters whose opinions are worth reading. Get a better argument, the "if we are as bad why you are with us" is not a very good one and shows that without solid rational arguments you resort to attack the person, certainly, I didn't expect less from you.

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:49 AM
..and miss out on the sensible discussion provided by some of the more credible members of the forum?
Yea my shoes laces are tied :)
Well, that leaves you out. :)

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:50 AM
LOL @ this post!

how do you know about intensity?
What makes you think I wouldn't know? :rolleyes:

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 07:50 AM
obviously we have different definitions of what rational is, especially when I've never seen anything rational coming for you. (eg the antichrist)

Of course we do, if you use that example, you're an atheist. You don't believe in the bible. Like I said, you accuse everyone of being irrational who doesn't think like you or agree with you. I don't think there's anyone who's posted on this board who hasn't been a victim of your "rational" accusation. :rolleyes: It's become a bit boring and you need a new bit.

are you really that stupid?, first, I don't generalize, I said SOME, see the fucking word SOME fans. Second, I didn't say that it was to make Serena look better, that's something the little voices in you head are telling you, I said it's a way to vent out their anger, learn to read, and to understand what you read.

No, but you think I am. But, I consider the source. So, it really doesn't matter. You said, "They don't realize that they are trying to make their favourites look better by lowering other players, that is lowering the bar. Serena doesn't need that but these posters are too busy moaning to realize that."

You do generalize. No where in the portion of the post I responded to do you say the "fucking word SOME fans". Maybe you need to go back and read what you wrote. You said "certain posters" I assume meaning Serena fans who have criticized Maria and other players, since you began the next sentence with what Serena doesn't need. By not singling out and naming the posters, you generalized by saying all of us (and there are quite a few of us), had the same intention, and that would be venting out our frustration by trying to disminished other players. You go on to say that we don't realize (because of course we're all irrational and don't know what we're doing :rolleyes: ) is that we are trying to make our favorites look better by lowering other players. Now since Serena is my favorite, wouldn't it be logical to conclude that that is who I was trying to make look better by lowering other players, namely Maria in this case? Especially since you said, Serena doesn't need that, but we are too busy moaning to realize that? So, to say you didn't say it was to make Serena look better is a lie. So, where do the little voices come from, unless you're talking about when I read what you wrote.


I've seen Serena doing the same, not once, but multiple times, and I didn't think it was wrong btw.

Okay, can you give an example of when and where you've seen Serena pump her fists and say "come on" against an obviously injured player?

I thought you liked Serena, obviously you haven't seen much of her

Let me preface my question by saying that I was referring to Serena against an injured player. The reason why I didn't mention it in my previous post was because I assumed you would understand that we are talking about playing in the same situation as last night. Again, can you provide an example of when you've seen Serena fist pumping DF's and 50mph serves of an injured player?

Serena Williams

To be honest I can't recall Serena behaving badly against an opponent in a match. But if you think she has exhibited appalling behavior, I welcome you to refresh my recollection. Someone did come up with the likes of "Justine Henin-Hardenne lying about having her hand raised (Roland Garros 2003 Semi-Final). Martina Hingis crossing to Seles' side to point to the line.How about personal insult/attack? Not mentioning someone in a speech is one thing, calling a female player half man is entirely different (ref. Martina Hingis on Amelie Mauresmo)." The poster did mention Serena in her semi-final against Amelie at the French '02, but I really don't consider stare downs in a competitive match against a healthy player appalling behavior.

and what fucking proof you want? a video, surely you don't expect anybody to list the matches were Serena has done that (basically all the matches where she wasn't playing well) but one case I do remember is against Kim Clijsters US Open 99.

How about some "fucking" examples. For example, what did she do to Kim at the US Open 99?

oh please, it has happened all the time, since the Sanex board nearly 6 years ago, it has happened every fucking time with no exception, don't come with cheap philosophy for dummies, you don't do it very well

Great comeback. I wasn't trying to bring "cheap philosophy for dummies", I was trying to be rational. I haven't been on these boards that long, so I must defer to you on what the posters are likely to do in any given situation or circumstance. But, I didn't see any of that going on when Maria gave her speech at Wimby. I don't recall anyone saying she was being fake. I don't recall anyone saying anyone has been fake in their speeches after defeating someone in a final. But, again I must defer to your intimate knowledge of the posters of this board. You are the expert, having knowledge of their intentions and having the burden of having to inform them of this.

your point being? maybe I found pathetic people like you amusing, maybe I am bored and don't have anything else to do (like when I am at work), maybe among all the mediocrity there are indeed some posters whose opinions are worth reading. Get a better argument, the "if we are as bad why you are with us" is not a very good one and shows that without solid rational arguments you resort to attack the person, certainly, I didn't expect less from you.

I thought my point was pretty straight forward. If the posters on this board are all these things, then don't come here any more and be subjected to it. I didn't know it was that difficult. Excuse me...but do you have the audacity to accuse me of resorting to personal attacks, just because I posed a rational question to you? I assume rationality is not lost on you.

Let's see, what did you call me and accuse me of in this one post?

Oh yes..."I've never seen anything rational coming for you. (eg the antichrist)";"are you really that stupid?";"learn to read, and to understand what you read";"don't come with cheap philosophy for dummies, you don't do it very well"; "maybe I found pathetic people like you amusing"; and last but not least, "Get a better argument, the "if we are as bad why you are with us" is not a very good one and shows that without solid rational arguments you resort to attack the person, certainly, I didn't expect less from you."

But based on the history of your posts, I don't expect anything less from you. :)

Cuckoo
Nov 17th, 2004, 09:03 AM
Whats with the large weak Posts Dee? Can't you say what you think in less then 5 lines, but ramble on and try and look eloquent and sophisticated with large paragraphs.

Reminds me of the Time when I was your age.....we had to walk 15 miles.....;)

SJW
Nov 17th, 2004, 09:27 AM
if Maria was injured, and Serena started fist pumping on her double faults, and forgot to mention her during the ceremony IN A MATCH SUCH AS THAT IN MARIA'S HOMETOWN/STATE (Florida) then i'd lose quite a lot of respect for her.

but you know what? i don't have to worry about that, cuz it wouldn't happen :)

Greatest
Nov 17th, 2004, 10:52 AM
I mean first of all congratulations to her for winning the title. Second of all I think her c'mon's and excessive screaming was a little much. She obviously knew Serena was injured and really was spitting in her face by doing what she was doing. I don't know if I'm just being bitter but I mean c'mon! :p

Why all these derrogatory stuff on Maria? She's classless, she's a disgrace, she's disrespectful and immature. GIVE ME A BREAK, and GIVE HER SOME CREDIT. LOTS OF IT.

She played extremely well, and it took a lot of heart, guts and composure to come back in the final set. I thought Serena had it won, and you can bitch about her injury all you want, but Serena really played through it and displayed some AMAZING stuff.

Instead of sour graping, you should RESPECT her, because her story has been the most compelling in 2004 and she's done a LOT for the game--and all at the young age of 17.

Tennisfan-Mtl
Nov 17th, 2004, 11:11 AM
Why all these derrogatory stuff on Maria? She's classless, she's a disgrace, she's disrespectful and immature. GIVE ME A BREAK, and GIVE HER SOME CREDIT. LOTS OF IT.

She played extremely well, and it took a lot of heart, guts and composure to come back in the final set. I thought Serena had it won, and you can bitch about her injury all you want, but Serena really played through it and displayed some AMAZING stuff.

Instead of sour graping, you should RESPECT her, because her story has been the most compelling in 2004 and she's done a LOT for the game--and all at the young age of 17.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

Sharapower
Nov 17th, 2004, 01:29 PM
Classless or not I don't really care. She's my very fave. She makes tennis an even greater show than it already was.

Whenever Maria is on the court, wins or loses, dominates or srtruggles, she does the show. That is priceless, that's all the class I want from a tennis player.

Sometimes she's acting rude ? Big deal ! She's not the only one. I can understand that top level athletes live in permanent pressure, that's likely to have an effect on your behavior when you're in the heart of the action. Then when the show is finished it's finished, you better forget it all and prepare for the next battle.

As long as Serena was on the court, the match was in play. Nobody pointed a gun at her and said "finish the match and undergo the physical pain, the moral pain of not being able to play your 100%, the humiliation of a defeat and the attitude of the b*tch at the other side of the net". She did that by herself, and she was at two games of being totally right.

So, I think Maria was totally right as well to do what she could not to lose.

Forgetting to mention Serena in Maria's speech was not good, I recognize. Maria was all at her joy of winning after being so close to lose so she forgot there was a great opponent she had to beat and who deserved her congratulations and relief for her injury. But Maria apologized in public, which means she acknowledge she was in fault. Case closed.

Experimentee
Nov 17th, 2004, 01:56 PM
I dont mind Maria's fistpumping and come on's or anyones for that matter. But it is quite rude to do it when your opponent is injured and cant serve properly. I have never seen Serena do it to an injured opponent.
Its also common etiquette to mention your opponent in the speech afterwards, especially if they were injured and still fought hard and finished the match. Maria still has a lot of things to learn. Though she should know all that already, because 17 is not that young. Shes very close to legal adult age so she should know these things.

xan
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:10 PM
I dont mind Maria's fistpumping and come on's or anyones for that matter. But it is quite rude to do it when your opponent is injured and cant serve properly. I have never seen Serena do it to an injured opponent.
Its also common etiquette to mention your opponent in the speech afterwards, especially if they were injured and still fought hard and finished the match. Maria still has a lot of things to learn. Though she should know all that already, because 17 is not that young. Shes very close to legal adult age so she should know these things.
We've been through all this many times now...

For an injured opponent, Serena was blasting high powered winners all over the place.

When you're playing top rank tennis you have to gee yourself up and go for your shots. Hold back, get distracted by your opponent, and you lose.

As Jo Durie said when commentating the match. "Maria doesn't want to look to see if Serena is hurting, she needs to make it hurt more."

Remember the 2003 Autralian Open? Serena was 1-5 down in the final set to Kim Clijsters, spraying 63 unforced errors across the court. She got injured, developing massive blisters, then proceeded to turn the match round and win 7-5!!!! Why? Because the injury removed her distractions and added them to Kim.

So if you're injured (especially if you're Serena) don't expect anyone to tone down their play for you.

xr6turbo
Nov 17th, 2004, 02:38 PM
We've been through all this many times now...

For an injured opponent, Serena was blasting high powered winners all over the place.

When you're playing top rank tennis you have to gee yourself up and go for your shots. Hold back, get distracted by your opponent, and you lose.

As Jo Durie said when commentating the match. "Maria doesn't want to look to see if Serena is hurting, she needs to make it hurt more."

Remember the 2003 Autralian Open? Serena was 1-5 down in the final set to Kim Clijsters, spraying 63 unforced errors across the court. She got injured, developing massive blisters, then proceeded to turn the match round and win 7-5!!!! Why? Because the injury removed her distractions and added them to Kim.

So if you're injured (especially if you're Serena) don't expect anyone to tone down their play for you.


Having a blister is just a little bit different to having at torn abdominal muscle...

Sharapower
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:19 PM
Having a blister is just a little bit different to having at torn abdominal muscle...
Once again, if it was as hard as you say, she could withdraw. Since she didn't, she considered she still had her chances so it was Maria's business to finish the job she's paid for, i.e. playing her tennis and do whatever is allowed by the rules of tennis to win the match.

SJW
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:28 PM
Oh please.

You would find a way to defend her, just like Maria fans defend Maria at the moment.

when Serena's wrong, i say she's wrong. i don't defend the stupid things she does. see the Linzi quote for example :o

Sharapower
Nov 17th, 2004, 03:31 PM
I said in some other thread that tennis is sport of combat. Of course you're not supposed to kill or to wound your opponent, but it's still a fight between two persons, it's symbolically violent, and it's tricky.

In a scale of 1 to 10 of rude behavior in tennis, I would put the fist-pumping + c'mon on injured opponent's DF at 3. It's quite nothing compared to cheating, and man, they do all cheat : how many times did they give the point to an opponent when they knew perfectly that the umpires' call were wrong in their favor ? And what about those who pretend not to be ready to receive the opponent's serve just in order to piss him/her and jeopardize his/her concentration ? Those who make direct verbal attacks toward the opponent in press-conferences before and/or after the match and so on ... ? I objectively think that these behaviors are way mor reprehensible than what you guys reproach to Maria, but I've never seen such a big mess about it on this board and God knows it happens several times in every little tournament.

I really find that too many people are so prompt to find the evil out of everything Maria does without an ounce of objectivity. An extraterrestrial who never heard about tennis and comes to this board get some knowledge would think "Well that Maria Sharapova, must be some devil or some antechrist, probably a pervert serial killer with her mouth full of foam !! That's scaring !!!" That's kind of unfair for this young lady who has a notorious reputation of sweetness and grace.

Sanneriet
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:35 PM
"I know her the way she is. She has always been like this. And once I lost to her because she starts crying. I was 4-1 up in the third set. I was playing unbelievable. And suddenly Vera started crying. And she was talking to herself. So I stopped. So I lost in a tiebreaker."
-- Svetlana Kuznetsova on the car crash known as Russian countrywoman Vera "The Crying Game" Zvonareva. This is from Tennis-X.

I thought that this was what nearly happened to Sharapova. She did need to regain her focus, but should learn to only cheer DF's inwardly.

DeDe4925
Nov 17th, 2004, 06:47 PM
Whats with the large weak Posts Dee? Can't you say what you think in less then 5 lines, but ramble on and try and look eloquent and sophisticated with large paragraphs.

Reminds me of the Time when I was your age.....we had to walk 15 miles.....;)
I'm sorry, I'll try to tone down the eloquence and sophistication so you won't feel so left out next time.

Now when you had to walk 15 miles, was that from your trailer to the ice house for more beer or what? ;)

Orion
Nov 17th, 2004, 07:36 PM
talk about full of errors, you [retard] Justine did not lie you moron. Get your [s***] straight; Rena was being unclassy that day. Do I have to pm Faste and explain it to an imbecile like you.

Martina H did that against Steffi, yes it was against the rules, but all she was doing was pointing to the right mark, that doesn't make her a horrible person.



Never in my post did I say Hingis was a horrible person. I said "but in comparison to Hingis, Henin, and Williams (on occassion only, I think Williams is wonderful), she [Sharapova] is not as terrible a human being as you [meaning a collective group who don't care for her] think."

If you couldn't grasp that, I'll spell it out for you: people seem to think that, because a 17 year old girl (who happens to have the bad habit of winning against top players now and then) makes mistakes, she's automatically the scum of the earth. I may quote others as saying "what a whore" "that bitch" etc. Personal attacks, nothing constructive or interesting.

I infer from your name you are a Justine supporter. I really don't care. Truth is, Justine played dirty that day, and even afterwards said that she will do anything to win a match. Injury timeouts, lying to refs (yes, I said lying!), etc. So, if you have a different version of what happened, please let me know. I long to hear your gentle words.

As for your language, I would appreciate you not being so insensitive to mentally challenged people, as my son has cerebral palsy. In addition, rather than be critical of someones opinion (yes, you may politely disagree, but that is no reason to be a jerk to everyone you disagree with), perhaps you could come up with an inteligible, interesting reply. Before you respond to this, think very carefully about what you say, and grow up a little. Don't let meaningless opinions of people you don't know consume you.

maccardel
Nov 17th, 2004, 09:34 PM
What I don't understand was the falling down and acting like she played the match of her life. I mean Serena was hurt wasn't she? So it was a matter of time before Maria would have won....and then she falls down like "oh my" no one in the arena was feeling that, that is why she got up so fast. Now she has to defend those points next year.

SJW
Nov 17th, 2004, 10:04 PM
But between that and a losing a lot of respect. http://cache.wtaworld.com/wtaworld/ubb/icons/icon12.gif

I don't see the difference between that match and how Serena acted during her match against Callens at Wimbledon for example. :rolleyes:

Serena injured is still better than Callens and such, so I don't see why Maria should change her attitude even knowing Serena is injured.

If a player is THAT injured, then she can just retire from the match. If she doesn't, then why would her opponent change her attitude? I like Maria even less than Serena (if that's possible), but people seem to nit-pick at everything she does, pretty much like some people do with the Williams sisters. :rolleyes:

i don't comment on things that i didn't see. didn't see the callens match i'm afraid :)

lorelai
Nov 19th, 2004, 09:15 PM
The point that might need to be made here is that these are all GIRLS...and many who have been trained in a very narrow way most of their lives. Now all of a sudden we're surprised when they act like self-centered girls??? Go to the mall (or better yet to a country club outing for girls), find a girl who has been given a lot of attention over her relative few years on the planet, and you will find a version of these tennis girls. Sooner or later they will all age gracefully or end up villified for a good portion of their careers. Look at the elder stateswomen of the game, and you will find an abundance of class. Just let em grow up, and if at 25 she is still goofy acting, then lament the fact that she never learned how to be a classy individual.

Cuckoo
Nov 19th, 2004, 11:54 PM
I don't know, But Serena opted to play the remainder of the game, She must of knew that she was injured somewhat, but not injured enough to default and retire from the game, knowing that she could still play good enough tennis to squeeze outsome sort of win.

If you decide to carry on in a Tennis Match, knowing that your injured, no matter how great or how big the Tournament is, you know the consequences, If you are playing , you are deemed fit to play. It's the Decision she made and Maria doesn't have to change her attitude or be softer.

If Serena chose to play then Serena has to bare the consequences of playing a legitimite (sp) game of Tennis.

It was her decision.

GL 4 both next season anyway :D

faste5683
Nov 20th, 2004, 12:51 AM
Truth is, Justine played dirty that day, and even afterwards said that she will do anything to win a match. Injury timeouts, lying to refs (yes, I said lying!), etc. So, if you have a different version of what happened, please let me know. I long to hear your gentle words.


It has been posted here (ad nauseam) that Justine never lied to anyone during the point in question because she was never *asked* a question. The umpire CANNOT question of a player; it's against the rules.

:wavey:

mashenka best 1
Nov 27th, 2004, 08:07 PM
"this young lady who has a notorious reputation of sweetness and grace."

nice contradiction there.. hunchback of wisdom

(THE BELLES the belles!...)

(ha!mmm)