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View Full Version : Bullshit commentator on ESPN says K-lina knew!


Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:23 AM
What a fuckin moron? What is he trying to start here? Go back to your dumbass doubles. :rolleyes:

Berlin_Calling
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:24 AM
Just saw that. I guess he can read minds just from looking at K-lina's face. :rolleyes::rolleyes:

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:24 AM
Who was it?

Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:25 AM
He said on the change over you could tell she knew that she on the changeover and that she "got one in her pocket." How do he know what is going on in her head?

*roddicksinme*
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:25 AM
luke jensen i believe

Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:25 AM
I *think* one of Jensen (sp?) brothers.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:26 AM
UGH!!!

Jensen :rolleyes:

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:44 AM
What a fuckin moron? What is he trying to start here? Go back to your dumbass doubles. :rolleyes:

She did cheat in a way. You can look at her body language and tell she new she got a free point. I think Sprem played a good match but when a cheater cheats it always come back, people will always question her win. Even when they play again it will always be in the back of Sprems head unless she has no conscious, but it amazes me the double standard had Venus did this people would want her killed, but I guess it's ok to cheat as long as it is against Venus or Serena.

Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:46 AM
I think it is only clear that they were both very confused and not sure what was going on. It was the ump fault and I don't like the way he was trying to blame K-lina. Like she was trying to get away with something. She outplayed Venus the entire match.

ys
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:48 AM
She might have known or she might not.. The point is - what Venus was thinking.. She has just banged a return winner off a serve coming from the ad-court and they declare 3:2 score and ask for a change of server. After a serve from an ad-court.. How is it even possible not to say "WTF"? I think they both must have known that something is wrong.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:56 AM
I think it is only clear that they were both very confused and not sure what was going on. It was the ump fault and I don't like the way he was trying to blame K-lina. Like she was trying to get away with something. She outplayed Venus the entire match.


I think she played good tennis but I don't think she out played Venus because if that was the case the scoreline would have been more like 62,62 instead of 76,76. I just wish Sprem would have question the umpire when she knew the score was wrong even if Venus knew, because people will only remember the mistake by the umpire and Sprem failure to correct him.

Martian KC
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:59 AM
Of course you can count on luke's insightful expertise.:rolleyes:

Knizzle
Jun 25th, 2004, 03:59 AM
I think she knew, but I agree he shouldn't say it like it's a fact because none of us really knows.

Berlin_Calling
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:00 AM
I think she played good tennis but I don't think she out played Venus because if that was the case the scoreline would have been more like 62,62 instead of 76,76. I just wish Sprem would have question the umpire when she knew the score was wrong even if Venus knew, because people will only remember the mistake by the umpire and Sprem failure to correct him.
bullshit. thats like saying why venus failed to correct him. id like you to prove that karolina knew that the score was wrong, no, you can't, no one can, that's the end of that. and what body language? all of a sudden, body language detects if one is cheating or not?

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:00 AM
Even when they play again it will always be in the back of Sprems head unless she has no conscious, but it amazes me the double standard had Venus did this people would want her killed, but I guess it's ok to cheat as long as it is against Venus or Serena.

Or you could stop trying rationalize the fact that Venus lost because you can't come to terms with it.

ys
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:04 AM
bullshit. thats like saying why venus failed to correct him. id like you to prove that karolina knew that the score was wrong
I think she knew that something is wrong. She has served just one point in a tiebreak and they take serve away from her. How can you not notice that? I think they both knew that there is a mistake, but at least one of them - Venus - failed to figure out who benefits from the mistake..

lizchris
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:08 AM
I don't think it was fair for Luke (nice name!) to say that Karolina knew she had one in the pocket unless he has proof that she did. The funny thing is that according to another thread, John McEnore and Boris Becker are saying the same thing, so I don't know.

I do know that the sports reporters in my area of the US (NYC area) were less than thrilled about what they saw. One reporter said that it looked as if the umpire had one too many beofre the match and he praied Venus for being acting like a woman for not complaining because in his opinion, she had every right to.

SelesFan70
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:09 AM
What if Karolina had beat Venus in Berlin and not lost so early in Paris..then she'd have been seeded and they wouldn't have met in the 2nd round at Wimbledon...too many "what if's" to accuse Karolina of "cheating". The point still remains the Venus has set points in both sets.

I must give Venus and Richard credit for diffusing this (eventhough ESPN is trying DESPERATELY to make it the biggest news in tennis history...EVER!! :rolleyes: )

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:10 AM
bullshit. thats like saying why venus failed to correct him. id like you to prove that karolina knew that the score was wrong, no, you can't, no one can, that's the end of that. and what body language? all of a sudden, body language detects if one is cheating or not?


If you look at the replay she looked up at her box shruged her shoulders and looked at the umpire you know it aswell. I'm not saying the girl didn't play good tennis I'm just saying she should have walked up to the umpire and questioned him, I mean wouldn't you have done the same knowing the umpire just cheated someone out of a point. From here on throughout this tournment she will be know by most people as the girl who fail to correct the umpire when she knew he was wrong. I don't think it was Venus like to question line calls because people like you would have questioned her sportsmanship.

Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:11 AM
lol re: ump being drunk. Thinking back he did seems a bit happy with a smirk on his face the whole time. :lol:

cynicole
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:13 AM
From here on throughout this tournment she will be know by most people as the girl who fail to correct the umpire when she knew he was wrong.

And from here on throughout you will known by most posters on this board as someone who could not "let it go."

Kart
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:16 AM
I think she knew, but I agree he shouldn't say it like it's a fact because none of us really knows.
I agree.

ys
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:16 AM
The umpire was lucky ( or unlucky ) it was not Serena. Venus is shy. Serena would definitely notice and would not let it go..

Berlin_Calling
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:16 AM
I don't think it was Venus like to question line calls because people like you would have questioned her sportsmanship.
nice generalisation there. just because i disagree with you doesnt mean i dont like Venus. i actually happen to like her and was rooting for her in the match. :rolleyes:

nander
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:20 AM
I think the last time Venus lost it was about beads falling from her hair, or maybe it was about a call at Wimbledon sometime ago. Serena is almost hounded off court when she made an observation about a hand at Roland Garros. Maybe Venus decided instinctively not to question it..can you imagine if she had and the umpire refused..that would certainly have led to lack of focus. I think in many ways she automatically tries to keep it in..this time it did her in.
But please someone explain how Sprem could not have known and realised that it was to her benefit.
I wish there was some way I could let the AELTA know how smug and self-satisfied their attiiude is .

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:21 AM
And from here on throughout you will known by most posters on this board as someone who could not "let it go."


I hope you will let it go when the roles are reverse and it benefits Venus or Serena but I know you want, but thats ok because Venus and Serena are held to a higher standards because they don't need to cheat to win.

fammmmedspin
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:22 AM
Let us ponder this. Karolina is 19 in the biggest match of her life in a tense tie break. She loses a narrow line call. Then we get the serve and Ted Watts recalls the score, Is she going to start thinking she got it wrong, he has altered it, he got the last call wrong, he got this score wrong, Venus got it wrong, the crowd got it wrong? Is she then going to interupt the tiebreak to query it when Venus hasn't and look a complete fool or break her own or Venus's concentration? Its the emperor with no clothes - no one noticed quite what was wrong and no one wanted to look foolish pointing it out.

Obviously a professional tennis player isn't going to go far into that chain of thought as it would be fatal to your chances. You do what the two players did - look confused, get on with it and try unsuccessfully to stop thinking about it.

fammmmedspin
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:27 AM
She did cheat in a way. You can look at her body language and tell she new she got a free point. I think Sprem played a good match but when a cheater cheats it always come back, people will always question her win. Even when they play again it will always be in the back of Sprems head unless she has no conscious, but it amazes me the double standard had Venus did this people would want her killed, but I guess it's ok to cheat as long as it is against Venus or Serena.
Why would anyone assume that Sprem had to notice it when no one else on the court did? Is your thesis that Venus is far stupider than Sprem and can't count or that being the least experienced person on the court means you have to keep the score for the umpire, linesmen, crowd and your opponent?

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:28 AM
I think the last time Venus lost it was about beads falling from her hair, or maybe it was about a call at Wimbledon sometime ago. Serena is almost hounded off court when she made an observation about a hand at Roland Garros. Maybe Venus decided instinctively not to question it..can you imagine if she had and the umpire refused..that would certainly have led to lack of focus. I think in many ways she automatically tries to keep it in..this time it did her in.
But please someone explain how Sprem could not have known and realised that it was to her benefit.
I wish there was some way I could let the AELTA know how smug and self-satisfied their attiiude is .

Of course she knew aswell as her fans thats why they are so defensive. As I see maybe Venus thought Sprem would be truthful but as you can see just like her fans thats something impossible to do when especially when you know it may give you a win against one of the best players of all time.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:29 AM
But please someone explain how Sprem could not have known and realised that it was to her benefit.
.

I believe Venus when sge says that she lost track of the score, it has happened to me many times. THAT is exactly how Sprem could also not have known. It happens. You're supposed to be able to trust the chair umpire!!!!

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:32 AM
Why would anyone assume that Sprem had to notice it when no one else on the court did? Is your thesis that Venus is far stupider than Sprem and can't count or that being the least experienced person on the court means you have to keep the score for the umpire, linesmen, crowd and your opponent?


Yes go ahead and insult Venus because Sprem decided to cheat.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:35 AM
Yes go ahead and insult Venus because Sprem decided to cheat.

Even IF she knew, it's not cheating, it's taking advantage of a situation.To cheat, she would have needed to have some part in the calling of the incorrect score.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:41 AM
There no point arguing, unlike the French Open 99 and the hand incident last year, it's 100% clear that the only person to blame is the umpire.

People who call Sprem a cheater are just trolling to get reactions. I guess some people are just really bored.

No where just trying to get you to admitt the truth.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:42 AM
No where just trying to get you to admitt the truth.

You should spellcheck before you post...I can barely understand what you mean.

adayinjune
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:51 AM
I know that when I play matches...it is really easy to get confused with the scoring. Esp. when you expect someone else to keep score for you (here it was the ump). You can tell that Karolina did not know right away (or at all) because she served a second serve.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:51 AM
You should spellcheck before you post...I can barely understand what you mean.


Spell check or not you know what I mean, but there is one word I can spell without any problem and that is CHEATER. I also know what it means.

CHEATER- The act of deceiving or swindling, or how is the a person who defrauds dishonestly for one's own gain or I like this one, a person who deprive of or destroy the effect of throught error.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:54 AM
Spell check or not you know what I mean, but there is one word I can spell without any problem and that is CHEATER. I also know what it means.

CHEATER- The act of deceiving or swindling, or how is the a person who defrauds dishonestly for one's own gain or I like this one, a person who deprive of or destroy the effect of throught error.

You had to look up the word "cheater" in the dictionary? :confused: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Julian
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:56 AM
Put yourself in Sprem's shoes..Im sure she was confused but didnt actually know what was going on..

plus if u knew would u actually go up to the umpire and tell them that the score was wrong??

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:57 AM
You had to look up the word "cheater" in the dictionary? :confused: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Yes I did. I found it next to her picture. :D

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:59 AM
Yes I did. I found it next to her picture. :D

There are pictures in your dictionary?? Cool.

Jarrett
Jun 25th, 2004, 04:59 AM
Well now he seems to change his tune a bit now he blame everyone including Venus. :rolleyes: I get confused all the time as well. Whatever Luke.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:01 AM
Put yourself in Sprem's shoes..Im sure she was confused but didnt actually know what was going on..

plus if u knew would u actually go up to the umpire and tell them that the score was wrong??


Yes.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:04 AM
There are pictures in your dictionary?? Cool.


Yah, I'm sure your are in there somewhere maybe even a couple of times. :devil:

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:05 AM
Yah, I'm sure your are in there somewhere maybe even a couple of times. :devil:

Yeah, I found one with pictures.

I'm there under smart, charming, witty, attractive, and fair. ;)

tennisluver99
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:11 AM
Sprem looked confused, but Venus also looked confused.

Why the hell didn't Venus say anything?

MarkyMark
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:11 AM
Of course you can count on luke's insightful expertise.:rolleyes:
he's a fucken all american pot head, anything he has to say must be looked at like it's coming out of a donkey's ass, k-lina won fair and square, it is not her fault that the the dumb ass in the chair made a mistake, by the way he should not be allowed to over see any more matches during the fortnight. I think it would be bad for wimbledon

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:12 AM
Yeah, I found one with pictures.

I'm there under smart, charming, witty, attractive, and fair. ;)


If you where fair you would admit to Sprem cheating. Asfar as smart, charming, witty and attractive well even dictionarys can be wrong or they placed your picture with the wrong caption. It should have said jerk, ass, and idiot.

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:13 AM
If you where fair you would admit to Sprem cheating. Asfar as smart, charming, witty and attractive well even dictionarys can be wrong or they placed your picture with the wrong caption. It should have said jerk, ass, and idiot.


...well-crafted. :rolleyes:

alwayshingis
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:14 AM
alright htm, this has been fun, but I'm off to do more important things. Have fun steaming...I'll just watch Karolina in the third round and feel great joy knowing you're in such a state.

htm
Jun 25th, 2004, 05:17 AM
alright htm, this has been fun, but I'm off to do more important things. Have fun steaming...I'll just watch Karolina in the third round and feel great joy knowing you're in such a state.


Remember cheaters never win. :angel:

bandabou
Jun 25th, 2004, 08:37 AM
Tjaa, tjaa....tough luck Vee, but alas...

Jakeev
Jun 25th, 2004, 09:31 AM
I cannot believe the bullshit I am reading in this thread. I have now watched the second-set tiebreaker four times and both players were confused highly focused on the match.

What really is crappy is that if Venus had won that set, then we would have people accusing her of cheating not Karolina.

Very sad situation for both players.

Anna F'd Enrique
Jun 25th, 2004, 09:55 AM
i think luke does a great job usually...

Steff_forever
Jun 25th, 2004, 11:50 AM
Let us ponder this. Karolina is 19 in the biggest match of her life in a tense tie break. She loses a narrow line call. Then we get the serve and Ted Watts recalls the score, Is she going to start thinking she got it wrong, he has altered it, he got the last call wrong, he got this score wrong, Venus got it wrong, the crowd got it wrong? Is she then going to interupt the tiebreak to query it when Venus hasn't and look a complete fool or break her own or Venus's concentration? Its the emperor with no clothes - no one noticed quite what was wrong and no one wanted to look foolish pointing it out.

Obviously a professional tennis player isn't going to go far into that chain of thought as it would be fatal to your chances. You do what the two players did - look confused, get on with it and try unsuccessfully to stop thinking about it.
This is the essence of the situation.
Everybody knew something was wrong. No one - even me - wanted to disrupt the match. I thought: oh, someone called:'fault', 'what did the umpire say?', ' 2all????', then everbody was stunned but everbody was silent cause no one wanted to disrupt the focus of the 2 players - even themselves. Everybody said in mind: 'I don't call, I don't want to make me an idiot, so go on.'
Strange situation.
But as Karolina looked confused to the umpire and then to Venus one of the two should have shown some reaction. Then Karolina was stunned because neither the point-maker on chair nor her opponent reacted. So she kept silent. 'Maybe', she thought, 'it's been my own mistake in thinking...'


NTL Venus should have said something. Why hasn't she ? For 2 reasons:
1. She didn't really want to lose focus by thinking of it.
2. She was afraid that the crowd would react against her (which I guess is wrong: everbody knew, something was wrong). Then she said to herself: "Don't think of this, keep cool..."

But the decisive thing in this tiebreak came later: she led 6-3 in the tie and should have used one of the setpoints. Has she started to think of the '2/2'-situation ? I guess so. And that was the deciding moment of the match. She should have brought this set home with one of the setpoints. She hasn't.
No replay, but omg this umpire was sooooooooo absent-minded.

Though it was Karolina who dominated the match. She also did in Berlin til the 3-0 leading in 3rd set. And she lost focus and played too aggressive then (UEs en mass). Yesterday she didn't. That's why she won it deservedly.

slice
Jun 25th, 2004, 11:55 AM
who cares... venus deserves it 4 that spirlea incident from the us open a few years back :rolleyes:

Steff_forever
Jun 26th, 2004, 11:10 PM
hope Karolina makes it to the SF !
Cause then Roddick and McEnroe can give their best why she doesn't deserve to win Wimbledon. pffffff

Good luck Karolina !

GoSandrine
Jun 26th, 2004, 11:14 PM
Luke's just talking out of his ass because he has nothing worth saying. :rolleyes: