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View Full Version : Venus Has A Lot Of Soul Searching (And Pratice) To Do


lizchris
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:02 PM
I didn't want to admit until now, but after Serena comes back from being off eight month and wins six straight matches to win a tournament and Venus was playing in her fourth tournament and couldn't get past the quarterfinal tells me that she is really struggling. I know she was injured at three of the four events, but I don't really see that as much of an excuse since she made the choice to take or return to the court. After her loss against Elena, it is painfully obvious that she really needs to work on her second serve and her forehand. I read somewhere that she is going to work with Billie Jean King and Zina Garrison on both of those weak points before she heads to Charleston becuase when they worked with her last year before the first round of Fed Cup and it was said that her second serve and forehand were excellent. It might not hrut her to work with free weights to get some strenght in her forearms if she isn't doing so already.

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:05 PM
I didn't want to admit until now, but after Serena comes back from being off eight month and wins six straight matches to win a tournament and Venus was playing in her fourth tournament and couldn't get past the quarterfinal tells me that she is really struggling. I know she was injured at three of the four events, but I don't really see that as much of an excuse since she made the choice to take or return to the court. After her loss against Elena, it is painfully obvious that she really needs to work on her second serve and her forehand. I read somewhere that she is going to work with Billie Jean King and Zina Garrison on both of those weka points before she heads to Charleston becuase when they worked with her last year before the first round of Fed Cup and it was said that her second serve and forehand were excellent. It might not hrut her to work with free weights to get some strenght in her forearms if she isn't doing so already.


Yep....really has to. She has to work so hard for her points and when youīre injured, thatīs a hard thing to do....looking how Serena just could bank on her serve the whole match to help out of trouble and then Venus has her serve broken almost at will....not good.

mboyle
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:08 PM
...and the obtrusive fan glasses come off:eek: :eek: :eek: ...

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:10 PM
obtrussive fan-glasses?!

TSequoia01
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:10 PM
Venus always had technique problems with her serve and forehand. But she always played over them using smarts, determination, and mental toughness. Due to her inactivity and maybe all those losses to Serena it seems her toughness has suffered. I have noticed in the last 18 months or so, she has had trouble closing out matches. This may be due to a loss of confidence. But I see this as a good thing. Now Venus will be forced to get better there no longer is any choice. :)

lizchris
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:15 PM
obtrussive fan-glasses?!
I think he/she is saying that I am one of those Williams fans who just blindy follow them witout saying anything negative about them, but this isn't the first time I said Venus has to work on her weak points.

BTW, because Serena was coming back from a long layoff, I really didn't think she was going to win; I thought Venus was going to win her fourth title. One thing I knew for a fact was that a Russian playing wasn't going to win.

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 03:35 PM
We all knew that no Russian was gonna win the thing.....

Knizzle
Apr 4th, 2004, 06:24 PM
Serena is luck she listened to the doctors advice and got 2 extra months of rest and practice because it has paid off. Venus just needs more practice and matches and she'll be OK. Part of the reason she has three losses is that she keeps running into people playing GREAT matches. Raymond played great, Kuznetsova played great, ED played very well off the ground although her serve sucked. Venus' biggest problem is NOT technique, it's seems to be motivation. Serena wasn't exactly sparkling this week, but she willed herself to win and got pumped up. She had the fire. Maybe Venus will regain her fire once that special seeding wears off and she is facing top players in the fourth round of a slam.

Paneru
Apr 4th, 2004, 07:06 PM
Serena is luck she listened to the doctors advice and got 2 extra months of rest and practice because it has paid off. Venus just needs more practice and matches and she'll be OK. Part of the reason she has three losses is that she keeps running into people playing GREAT matches. Raymond played great, Kuznetsova played great, ED played very well off the ground although her serve sucked. Venus' biggest problem is NOT technique, it's seems to be motivation. Serena wasn't exactly sparkling this week, but she willed herself to win and got pumped up. She had the fire. Maybe Venus will regain her fire once that special seeding wears off and she is facing top players in the fourth round of a slam.

I disagree!

Venus' technique is what let her down and was
why she was unable to close out the match!

When you get to that point nerves start to creep in and if your
technique is off an not working you're sunk!

Serena wasn't sparkling but her service technique held her up
and helped her through as she said!

If Venus had no motivation,
she could've simply crumbled against Hantuchova when it got tight,
she could've let Zheng's low balls take her out,
or she could've let Schiavone make it more of a match!

Venus fought through and it happened for
her when she needed her game to work.

You can have all the motivation you want but, if your technique isn't their
it isn't going to make much of a difference except to say you're going to continue to try, which Venus did!

She just needs more consistency!

She may have lost to Dementieva but I could definitely see
more improvemnt in this tournament where her game is
concerned, as in getting back to the form of just even 03' Wimbledon!

Venus just needs time,
some don't seem to realize that.

Also, it isn't fair to compare her comeback to that of anyone else's
because all of them are different and get back at their own pace.

It'll be interesting to see how many Vee fans can stick out this period
and remain positive in ther support and how many will or have abandoned ship.

In ways, seems more a test for fans than for Venus.
Who's gonna leave and who's gonna stay?

Knizzle
Apr 4th, 2004, 07:25 PM
I disagree!

Venus' technique is what let her down and was
why she was unable to close out the match!

When you get to that point nerves start to creep in and if your
technique is off an not working you're sunk!

Serena wasn't sparkling but her service technique held her up
and helped her through as she said!

If Venus had no motivation,
she could've simply crumbled against Hantuchova when it got tight,
she could've let Zheng's low balls take her out,
or she could've let Schiavone make it more of a match!

Venus fought through and it happened for
her when she needed her game to work.

You can have all the motivation you want but, if your technique isn't their
it isn't going to make much of a difference except to say you're going to continue to try, which Venus did!

She just needs more consistency!

She may have lost to Dementieva but I could definitely see
more improvemnt in this tournament where her game is
concerned, as in getting back to the form of just even 03' Wimbledon!

Venus just needs time,
some don't seem to realize that.

Also, it isn't fair to compare her comeback to that of anyone else's
because all of them are different and get back at their own pace.

It'll be interesting to see how many Vee fans can stick out this period
and remain positive in ther support and how many will or have abandoned ship.

In ways, seems more a test for fans than for Venus.
Who's gonna leave and who's gonna stay?
Before I reply, I notice that you are the "Official Magician", I am the ARCH Magician so I guess that means I have rank over you. Heh Heh Heh.....

Anyway, Venus has basically had the same techniques throughout the years, but up until even as late as Wimbledon 2003, she played as errorless as any other big hitter. Sure better techniques would have helped, but she could have Serena's technique and right now it still wouldn't help her. Serena had the technique down from 2000-2001, but where did it get her?? Eventually her DESIRE to stop losing and be a champion took over and her big results came. Like Serena just said in her interview, the player with 90% desire and 10% talent will beat the player with 10% desire and 90% talent. She was nowhere near Wimbledon 2003 form in that match because at Wimbledon she was munching up people's second serves with her FOREHAND as well as her better backhand. I know V and S are sisters, but instead of being in Key Biscayne to watch Serena she could have been somewhere practicing. I don't think Serena would have been watching Venus' SF and F had she gone down in the QF and rightfully so. Of course comebacks take time, but Venus showed by going up 3-0, and 5-3 that she is now good enough to beat top ten players in her comeback, but the desire wasn't there or she wouldn't have missed 6 straight serves. Desire improves your mental toughness. Had Venus truly DESIRED to win, she would have won. Same as in a couple of her GS finals against Serena.

"Topaz"
Apr 4th, 2004, 07:42 PM
she could have Serena's technique and right now it still wouldn't help her.
...
...
Had Venus truly DESIRED to win, she would have won...Really! :confused:

Paneru
Apr 4th, 2004, 07:46 PM
Before I reply, I notice that you are the "Official Magician", I am the ARCH Magician so I guess that means I have rank over you. Heh Heh Heh.....
:p

Had Venus truly DESIRED to win, she would have won.
:confused:

I've truly DESIRED to win many of things but that didn't
mean it was going to happen.


How do you know not having Serena's technique wouldn't have helped?
Used your powers to view into Vee's heart?

"Topaz"
Apr 4th, 2004, 07:58 PM
Kabuke, did you read my mind or what?! :angel:

Stefwhit
Apr 4th, 2004, 08:01 PM
(Knizzle) It's sad that it's implied that all Venus has to do is simply not want to lose and then suddenly everything will fall magically into place. I have to agree with everyone who is sighting her technique and confidence as two of the main issues that are hindering Venus at the moment. "Heart" is what we talk about we when we're talking about how much someone wants something and how much their willing to fight to get it. I think Venus has plenty of heart and desire. All the heart in the world wont do you any good if you don't have confidence in your shots, especially in tennis. Multiple errors due to impoper technique eats away at a players confidence so it's all inter-related. Venus is on pace, it might not be as quick as some fans would like, and it might not be the same pace as Serena, but then again they are two SEPERATE individuals who should be judged independent of one another. We haven't even explored the pshychological ramifications of how Serena's return might impact Venus, not to mention Richard's old prediction of Serena being the better player- it might not seem significant but some of the things parents say really have an affect...

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 08:02 PM
Knizz, you gotta admit it...Venus lost the match because now she canīt get away with having bad techniques anymore...not while sheīs injured as well. Serena didnīt play brilliantly or anything, but she had the techniques down...her serve could be counted on, save when she had to close-out things. averaging 6/7 aces per match as a female is a nice luxury.

sartrista7
Apr 4th, 2004, 08:02 PM
Thinking that Vee's poor technique - which she won four Slams despite of - will cut it on tour in 2004 is like thinking that Martina H's powderpuff second serve - which she won five Slams despite of - would have cut it in 2001.

If Vee had no heart or desire... she would've retired when she twisted the ankle. She fought right to the end despite everything... and that is a very good sign.

Paneru
Apr 4th, 2004, 08:26 PM
Kabuke, did you read my mind or what?! :angel:

Either great minds think alike
or maybe my mental powers are starting to kick in.
Under Knizzle's tutelage, ofcourse. ;)

DemWilliamsGulls
Apr 4th, 2004, 09:17 PM
I can slowly but surely see Venus game return to her...Venus and Serena are 2 differnet people...Serena didn't have as many injuries as Venus...and she dont have as many technique problems as Venus. I agree with most statements above...all she needs is more time, more practice she will be fine...I think we see the old Venus back at Wimbledon and the Olympics. *at least I hope* When Venus and Serena are on thier game..they are just unstoppable....especially Venus.

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 09:24 PM
I can slowly but surely see Venus game return to her...Venus and Serena are 2 differnet people...Serena didn't have as many injuries as Venus...and she dont have as many technique problems as Venus. I agree with most statements above...all she needs is more time, more practice she will be fine...I think we see the old Venus back at Wimbledon and the Olympics. *at least I hope* When Venus and Serena are on thier game..they are just unstoppable....especially Venus.

especially SERENA!!

mishar
Apr 4th, 2004, 09:36 PM
Venus is playing too tentatively, defensively. It puts her on an even keel with a player like Dementieva. Serena is going for her shots still, Venus is not. She needs to go back to forcing the point, and she needs to have the confidence to step in and move forward. Hopefully BJK and Zina can help her recover that confidence.

bandabou
Apr 4th, 2004, 09:42 PM
Yep....she isnīt moving towards and isnīt agressive like she used to be...thatīs taking away her own asset: the defense...I hope the fed cup matches can help put her on track.

Knizzle
Apr 6th, 2004, 08:02 AM
I still maintain that Venus doesn't have the same fire that she did even as late as Wimbledon 2003. I'm not blaming her for it because she's obviously been through alot in the past 9 months. If you want something bad enough, you will do what it takes to get it. Venus appeared that way for much of the third set against ED, but she didn't finish. Technique is not the bulk of Venus' problem. Really it isn't. It's confidence and desire.

pigam
Apr 6th, 2004, 08:28 AM
I disagree!

Venus' technique is what let her down and was
why she was unable to close out the match!

When you get to that point nerves start to creep in and if your
technique is off an not working you're sunk!

Serena wasn't sparkling but her service technique held her up
and helped her through as she said!

If Venus had no motivation,
she could've simply crumbled against Hantuchova when it got tight,
she could've let Zheng's low balls take her out,
or she could've let Schiavone make it more of a match!

Venus fought through and it happened for
her when she needed her game to work.

You can have all the motivation you want but, if your technique isn't their
it isn't going to make much of a difference except to say you're going to continue to try, which Venus did!

She just needs more consistency!

She may have lost to Dementieva but I could definitely see
more improvemnt in this tournament where her game is
concerned, as in getting back to the form of just even 03' Wimbledon!

Venus just needs time,
some don't seem to realize that.

Also, it isn't fair to compare her comeback to that of anyone else's
because all of them are different and get back at their own pace.

It'll be interesting to see how many Vee fans can stick out this period
and remain positive in ther support and how many will or have abandoned ship.

In ways, seems more a test for fans than for Venus.
Who's gonna leave and who's gonna stay?

From the very little I saw from her matches, I tend to agree with you.
Besides, I really can't image that Venus isn't motivated to win matches. Whenever she enters a tournament, she's ready to win it, all the way, IMHO :shrug:

jenny161185
Apr 6th, 2004, 10:55 AM
I agree with Venus needing to have confidence and desire I want to see the old Venus walk on court and just start blasting winners at will - I have no doubt that Venus will return , its just taking longer than we thought.+ I think seeing serena take nasdaq will have really boosted the fire in her belly :)

GANGSTABACKHAND!
Apr 6th, 2004, 01:14 PM
Venus will be fine!!!

Paneru
Apr 6th, 2004, 01:43 PM
Venus will be fine!!!
No doubt! :yeah:

hotandspicey
Apr 6th, 2004, 01:51 PM
I think Venus' problem is her serve and those long lanky legs.They oftentimes make her very akward on the court.,that's why she maybe has so many injuries.

calabar
Apr 6th, 2004, 02:00 PM
I think Venus' problem is her serve and those long lanky legs.They oftentimes make her very akward on the court.,that's why she maybe has so many injuries.
Listening to all these arm-chair psychiatry and psycho-analyses on Venus make me laugh sometimes. The same flawed serve that Venus has now, is the same one she used in 2001-200 season to storm to the top of the tennis world. And as for those long lanky legs - oooooooh! - well I don't believe Venus has gotten any taller since 2001, has she?

-Calabar

MrSerenaWilliams
Apr 6th, 2004, 03:10 PM
What most people don't realize is that Serena took that 8-month break BEFORE SHE WAS INJURED! Venus played two consecutive high quality matches (def. Clijsters in semis and lost to Serena in Wimby final) while she was VERY INJURED. She could have given Serena a final walk-over, but after the 01 Pac. Life Open, she didn't want Serena to have to go through that. She listened to the opinions of other people (including, the resonance of even some of you, that she was washed up, despite the fact that she had played 4 consecutive grand slam finals, something that only two other women, Serena and Steffi, had done before) and decided to play while injured, but in turn that did more to hurt her than it did to help, and while Serena's break was preventive, Venus' was necessary. When Venus takes this 3 (if she doesn't play Family Circle) week break before Fed Cup (where she and Serena should have NO problems) to build her confidence before J&S Cup, she should do alright. In my opinion, losing those 4 consecutive Grand Slam Finals to Serena probably broke her spirit, and while I don't believe she'll beat Serena again, she needs to step out of her sister's orbit, and realize that she, on her own, is a great player, and when she does that, she'll be alright.


"Go Vee, we still love you"

Whoever said, "Will the REAL Venus Williams, come back to the court...," PURE GENIUS!