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View Full Version : Why Dinara is not top 5 material...


tenn_ace
Feb 15th, 2004, 03:19 AM
... at least, yet. IMO her game is too predictable. she is able to overpower lower ranked girls, but when it comes to big guns she loses either because they, at least, match her in power or outsmart her reading her game easily. I'm not saying that she can't play an all-court game, but, unfortunately, she doesn't do it relying solely on her power. BTW, her groundstokes are very predictable: topspin, mostly cross court.

goldenlox
Feb 15th, 2004, 03:22 AM
Top 5? Dinara is 17. Let her mature a little. Where was Nastya at 17?
The less pressure to be great early in her career, the better.

AjdeNate!
Feb 15th, 2004, 03:23 AM
She's young yet... hopefully her game matures. I have confidence that she'll be beating the big babes sometime.

AnDyDog621
Feb 15th, 2004, 03:24 AM
Hey if she can overpower top 15 players all the time right now...she could be top 10 by end of the year imo

~|Naomi|~
Feb 15th, 2004, 05:52 AM
she is able to overpower lower ranked girls, but when it comes to big guns she loses either because they, at least, match her in power or outsmart her reading her game easily.


Last I checked Schiavone and Schnyder are both ranked ahead of Dinara as is Dokic whom she beat in Shanghai and Maleeva whom she beat in Moscow. She beat Coetzer at AO when Coetzer was seeded and ranked above Dinara.

No one is saying Dinara is top 5 at the moment. I think she can definately be top 20 by the end of the year though.

tenn_ace
Feb 15th, 2004, 02:43 PM
Schiavone and Schnyder are hardly big guns... as is Coetzer these days. and if nobody is saying (according to you), then did you even reply in this thread? :rolleyes:

the cat
Feb 15th, 2004, 05:36 PM
The most concerning thing to me about Dinara is her constantly getting steamrolled when she plays a great player. She doesn't even make the match competitive. But the year and her career are still young so that could change.

Dinara really needs to make the top 20 this year and I think she will. :) And I'm glad we're not hearning anymore of that talk about her having a better career than her brother Marat will. That's not happening.

goldenlox
Feb 15th, 2004, 05:40 PM
The only time I watched Dinara play was the US Open. And the JHH match was so one-sided, it was hard to judge.
When you are 17, and 6 foot tall, it's important to have a solid foundation for your game. And then build a complete game over time.
Dinara's results show she is probably doing this.

the cat
Feb 15th, 2004, 07:27 PM
Excellent countterpoint, Miss Lox. All very tall tennis players need extra time to develope.

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 02:18 AM
Dinara will win a GS. But not this year.

AnDyDog621
Feb 16th, 2004, 10:41 AM
Im a huge fan, but for some reason i don't see that happening(probably cause she is Russian)....but if she does, i hope she is the first one...hehe, beat Maria from doing it first

Sammm
Feb 16th, 2004, 03:49 PM
She's only 17 for goodness sake! What hae most of you guys done at that age? I'm only 16 so the question doesn't apply to me.

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 05:26 PM
sammm, calm down... with nerves like that you won't live past 30.

as for Dinara, I am not saying that she not worthy of anything. she's still an outstanding athlete and a tennis player, but she is not a top 5 material yet. she's is still developing as other pointed out here, so, hopefully, she'll be there.

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 05:35 PM
but she is not a top 5 material yet.
I think this expression makes no sense logically. The word "yet" in it. A player is Top 5 material or not regardless of her current results. Simply because the concept of "material" is based on potential, not results.

Was Tatiana Golovin a Top 5 material a month ago? Is she now? Did anything change in terms of her potential since then?

Martian KC
Feb 16th, 2004, 05:40 PM
I think she needs to work on her movement.

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 05:55 PM
I think this expression makes no sense logically. The word "yet" in it. A player is Top 5 material or not regardless of her current results. Simply because the concept of "material" is based on potential, not results.

Was Tatiana Golovin a Top 5 material a month ago? Is she now? Did anything change in terms of her potential since then?
to me it does... Justine wasn't a top 5 material when she started, but she kept working and improving and as much as you don't like me to use her example, she showed last year (Jan-March) that she would be there (even though she still had ways to go to get there).

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 06:32 PM
to me it does... Justine wasn't a top 5 material when she started, but she kept working and improving and as much as you don't like me to use her example, she showed last year (Jan-March) that she would be there (even though she still had ways to go to get there).
Oh, really? She has always been a top 5 material. From the very beginning. Since she won her first WTA tournament that she played. Took Davenport to a tight 3-setter in the first GS she played.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 06:46 PM
How about Nastya? Did she have top 5 talent in 2000?
Anna and Elena are her age, and were both in the top 10 then.

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 06:55 PM
How about Nastya? Did she have top 5 talent in 2000?
Anna and Elena are her age, and were both in the top 10 then.
Even given my great sympathy to Nastya, I do not think she is a Top 5 talent. She does not have a physique for that.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 07:01 PM
But Nastya can hit with pace, and handle pace. And she moves well.
Unless you have obvious weapons, you have to reach the top 5 through consistency and court coverage.
That might develop over time. And Nastya will be in the top 5 pretty soon.

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 07:09 PM
But Nastya can hit with pace, and handle pace. And she moves well.
Unless you have obvious weapons, you have to reach the top 5 through consistency and court coverage.
That might develop over time. And Nastya will be in the top 5 pretty soon.
We are talking about different things. When I say "Top 5", I mean a Top 5 resident, not reaching Top 5 once a career. Not Huber, MJF, Dokic or Hantuchova. Those players are not Top 5 players. They reached Top 5 due to circumstances rather than because they belong there. Nastya can easily be like them or better. But I am talking about potential of having a long spell - years of staying in Top 5. I do not think that Nastya has a potential for that.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 07:14 PM
I'm thinking about the potential. I don't remember Nastya's game in 2000 or before. I didn't see her then. I think her potential may have increased.

I think Nastya will spend a lot of time in the top 5. I don't expect Capriati, Davenport, and Venus to play full schedules anymore.

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:03 PM
I agree that Nastya is not top 5 material even though she is 2-3 places away from it.

Anna K. was once. Lena L. - I don't think so.

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:05 PM
Oh, really? She has always been a top 5 material. From the very beginning. Since she won her first WTA tournament that she played. Took Davenport to a tight 3-setter in the first GS she played.
forgetting that it was clay (her fav surface) and Davenport least one?

try searching these boards going just a year ago and you will see that even then people were saying that she's hardly top 5.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:13 PM
Who's talking about Lena L.?

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:20 PM
I meant Lena D... no need to get nasty. unless of course u'r ok to be treated the same way.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:23 PM
I thought maybe you switched to doubles potential.
I think Nastya has a chance to be like Mauresmo, and stay in the top 5.

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:23 PM
forgetting that it was clay (her fav surface) and Davenport least one?
Forgetting that Davenport was in top form and played excellent ckaycourt tennis, beating a bunch of very good claycourters and losing in a tight three-setter to eventual champion Steffi Graf? And played a rookie?

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:26 PM
Forgetting that Davenport was in top form and played excellent ckaycourt tennis, beating a bunch of very good claycourters and losing in a tight three-setter to eventual champion Steffi Graf? And played a rookie?
forgetting it was a first round match and Juju was virtually unknown (including to Davenport), so surprises do happen in the 1st round...

Babsi has never been considered a top 5 material even after her win over Williams...

ys
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:28 PM
I meant Lena D... no need to get nasty. unless of course u'r ok to be treated the same way.
And Elena D. has all potential in the world. All she has to do is to try her best and she will be Top 5 easily. For as long as she stubbornly refuses professional coaching appropriate for a Top 5 player, and prefers holidays to grand slam preparation, she will be where she is, at very best.

tenn_ace
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:31 PM
not with serve like that and that's what she has right now.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 08:54 PM
Lena D. showed top 5 potential at Amelia Island. It doesn't seem like she can hold that form.
It takes tremendous focus to play her style. It's draining, both physically and mentally.

Lena B. has top 5 potential. Just watch her play Capriati.

goldenlox
Feb 16th, 2004, 10:44 PM
Now that I think about it, Nastya, Elena D., Lena, Nadia, Dinara, Maria S., and Vera Z. all have top 5 potential.
And I'm still optimistic about Sveta, but I'll not count her at this time.

They need to stay healthy and focused.To actually do it is much different than being able to play at that level once in a while.

the cat
Feb 18th, 2004, 09:56 PM
Other than Myskina, I see only 1 other Russina with top 5 potential. And her name is Maria Sharapova. But a few of them do appear to be top 10 material. I can see as many as 8 Russina's in the WTA top 20 in the near future with 3 Russina's in the top 10 at the same time. :D We really can't ask for much more than that the the Williams sisters and the top 2 Belgians on the WTA scene.

ys, Myskina is top 5 material because she's almost in the top 5. I know she took advantage of the absence of the Williams sisters. But so did everyone else. Especially Justine Henin.

goldenlox
Feb 18th, 2004, 10:16 PM
They mean top 5 like Kim. Where the player is in the top 5 for years.
Potential and doing it is different. You have to go deep into a lot of tournaments and stay healthy.
When most players are rolling and win a lot they get injured.
Nastya has not had a bad loss (to a non-top 5) since Linz when she lost to Schnyder.
If Nastya keeps that up, she will be a top 5 player for a long time.

the cat
Feb 18th, 2004, 11:00 PM
Well said. Making the top 5 is hard enough. But staying there is even harder.

goldenlox
Feb 18th, 2004, 11:14 PM
Nadia made the semis of last year's French Open. Now she is injured.
Elena D. at Amelia Island played like she can be top 5.
Sustaining it, and staying healthy, make it so difficult.
Dinara and Maria are tall and early in their careers. So potential is there. Over time, we will find out how good they can be. If they stay healthy.

*JR*
Feb 18th, 2004, 11:15 PM
Give Coach Choudury a little time with Sister Safina, OK? ;)

ys
Feb 18th, 2004, 11:31 PM
Other than Myskina, I see only 1 other Russina with top 5 potential. And her name is Maria Sharapova. But a few of them do appear to be top 10 material. I can see as many as 8 Russina's in the WTA top 20 in the near future with 3 Russina's in the top 10 at the same time. :D We really can't ask for much more than that the the Williams sisters and the top 2 Belgians on the WTA scene.

ys, Myskina is top 5 material because she's almost in the top 5. I know she took advantage of the absence of the Williams sisters. But so did everyone else. Especially Justine Henin.Yeah, the cat, I trust you, just two years ago you were saying that Russian girls of this generation won't be top 5 as opposite to true Top 5 players Dokic and Hantuchova. Congratulations on jumping new bandwagon. And on your longsighted Top 5 vision. Which is always a step behind of real events.

goldenlox
Feb 18th, 2004, 11:51 PM
The word "potential" leaves it too wide open.
How about - who will be in the top 5 for years?

Right now, Nastya is the only player I would bet on. But I keep hope for many others.

But the real goal is to win majors and be #1. Everyone has to improve a lot.

the cat
Feb 19th, 2004, 03:26 PM
I said that 2 years ago, ys? :confused: And how I am jumping on the bandwagon? I think Myskina is now a top 5 caliber tennis player. She has proved me wrong. I used to think she was only a top 10 caliber player. And I think Maria Sharapova could be a top 5 player in a couple of years. That's hardly jumping on the bandwagon. And when I say Myskina will make the top 5 and Sharapova could make the top 5 I'm thinking they will move in and out of the top 5. I have seen nothing from either of them that says they will be solid memebers of the top 5. Of course if Maria can develope her serve into a weapon and add about 20 pounds of weight to her frame then it's a differsnt story.

I don't see why people are down on Safina. She needs a couple years to develope and get comfortable with her height, frame and hardhitting game.

Good point about Petrova, GL. Poor Nadia. :( If she could only stay healthy.

goldenlox
Feb 20th, 2004, 12:38 AM
I can understand why people are down on Dinara. She still has a lot to prove.
But for a 17 year old, she is right on target. I look forward to watching Dinara move up the rankings.

goldenlox
Feb 13th, 2005, 06:02 PM
If she beats Mauresmo in a Tier II final, she might be top 5 material.

goldenlox
Feb 13th, 2005, 06:06 PM
Even given my great sympathy to Nastya, I do not think she is a Top 5 talent. She does not have a physique for that.
How dare you! :lol:

KV
Feb 13th, 2005, 06:13 PM
And she def. A. Mauresmo :bounce: Improved mentally, a few weeks ago she wouldn't have def. T. Golovin after being 3-5 down in the FS. She took a big step forward, celebrates her first win against a topplayer after losing several times in 3 setters vs. the top ranked. As well like E. Dementieva she returned a large number of first serves from Momo. Of course as for D. Safina it always will be diffiuclt to become as good as her broth.

Derek.
Feb 13th, 2005, 06:15 PM
Dinara is definetly playing like she's a top 20 player. Let's see if she keeps it up. ;)

ys
Feb 13th, 2005, 09:10 PM
How dare you! :lol:

Is she Top 5? :lol: You are late. :lol: