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View Full Version : Do Fans of J-Lo and Beyonce Know......


Couver
Sep 20th, 2003, 09:31 PM
That both of them wear Fur?

The reason I ask is because while some of you may know and not care some of you may not know. While I never liked J-Lo, I was a fan of Beyonce's until I found out (although I guess I should have noticed in her video she dances around in a big fox carcass.)

Anyway I just wanted to make you aware. IMO celebrities who wear fur are very irresponsible. There is no reason with all the faux fur out there to be killing innocent animals, not the mention the fact that the fur looks better on the animal.

It's sad actually to see too murderers having such success.

J-Lo, Beyonce= Fur SCUM :fiery:

Malin
Sep 21st, 2003, 01:27 AM
oh cry me a river

Berlin_Calling
Sep 21st, 2003, 02:56 AM
who the hell cares? geez...my mom wears fur too, now i should hate her forever also :rolleyes:

Jarrett
Sep 21st, 2003, 03:20 AM
If you eat meat then you aren't any better than them.

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:33 AM
I'm a vegan actually so I guess I am better than them :)

Like I said I posted this for their fans that do care that innocent animals are tortured and killed so these two HAGS can look good.

And no it's not fake fur, punch in J-Lo and Beyonce and fur into any search engine and the articles will come up.

As for the poster who asked that about their mother, that's up to you. But again that fur probably looks nasty on your mom and much better from the animal she had killed to have it.

Insensitive people like you bunch make me sick.

Jarrett
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:38 AM
well good for you! look down on the rest of us! ;) I seriously did not eat meat for a few weeks after I saw a public access video about what the animals went through. I was sick that whole night gagging. I don't know why I didn't change the channel. I just couldn't turn away. I only at meat again without knowing it at school and just ordered a burger at school and didn't notice until I sat down and took a bite. :eek:

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:43 AM
I don't look down on people who eat meat. Some people need that level of protein to survive, and IMO what you eat is your choice, it's essential in some cases to survival. I do not eat meat as a personal choice.

Killing something just so you can wear it's dead body and prance around IS disgusting and ignorant. But hey if the celebs are doing it then it must be ok.

Barrie_Dude
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:53 AM
I don't look down on people who eat meat. Some people need that level of protein to survive, and IMO what you eat is your choice, it's essential in some cases to survival. I do not eat meat as a personal choice.

Killing something just so you can wear it's dead body and prance around IS disgusting and ignorant. But hey if the celebs are doing it then it must be ok.
I think that you and I will disagree here.

Jarrett
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:53 AM
Would it be okay if she actually ate the meat? Can you eat fox meat?

Berlin_Calling
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:55 AM
I don't look down on people who eat meat. Some people need that level of protein to survive, and IMO what you eat is your choice, it's essential in some cases to survival. I do not eat meat as a personal choice.

Killing something just so you can wear it's dead body and prance around IS disgusting and ignorant. But hey if the celebs are doing it then it must be ok.

Is it any of YOUR business what other people are wearing?

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 04:58 AM
Yes actually! As celebrities they are public figures and they choose to prance that fur in front of my face, so I can comment on it if I want.

Wearing fur serves no use....actually it may have in the past when our ancestors were freezing their asses off to keep warm. But now?

My point is that Jennifer Lopez and Beyonce are promoting murder. I can't wait till PITA pies these too ladies.

Berlin_Calling
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:00 AM
Umm...Im not just talking about B and JHo. Im talking about the millions and millions of people in this world who wear fur.

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:00 AM
If she were actually eating the fox and then reusing the fur, I think there is a case for that being ok I guess. However I'd bet she isn't eating fox meat.

Beyonce and J-Lo don't exactly eat whatever they want. Afterall their publicists can't have them ballooning up!

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:09 AM
Well I am agaisnt anyone who wears fur! Actually I've gotten into awesome arguments with people at parties who were wearing fur.

My thread however was to point out that J-Lo and Beyonece wear fur, like me some people actually care and would like to know so they don't give money to these too women.

Berlin_Calling
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:17 AM
Actually I've gotten into awesome arguments with people at parties who were wearing fur.

Sounds like those parties were a blast...:tape:

BTW, wearing fur is a personal preference and that wouldnt interfere with how much B or JHo was payed. But dont get me wrong, its wrong to kill a tiger or an animal like that for a jacket but minks are perfectly fine.

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:22 AM
Well those minks are kept in horrendous conditions, and then killed. It takes more than a dozen of them to make 1 coat. At least if they are going to kill the poor creatures they could make their life somewhat better.

It boggles my mind you know how humans think they have some entitlement to this Earth. All evolution gave us was a brain instead of claws. I'd love to see some people put into tiny cages and then get killed so a cheetah could have a new hat.

But wait humns are some of the ugliest animals on this planet, so no one would want to wear our skin.

Berlin_Calling
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:24 AM
God gave us humans authority over the animals, therefore, we can kill those mean minks :p:angel:

Barrie_Dude
Sep 21st, 2003, 05:27 AM
God gave us humans authority over the animals, therefore, we can kill those mean minks :p:angel:
Have you ever seen a mink! I have! In Fact, they used to swim with us at the cottage!

Couver
Sep 21st, 2003, 06:26 AM
Please humans have no authority over anything. Well I guess the only up side is humans are on their way to wiping each other out with war, so hopefully a more intellingent species takes over.

Barrie_Dude
Sep 21st, 2003, 06:27 AM
Please humans have no authority over anything. Well I guess the only up side is humans are on their way to wiping each other out with war, so hopefully a more intellingent species takes over.
My cat has already taken over!

caramel
Sep 21st, 2003, 07:49 AM
They wear fur???? Real fur???? I´mma shoot them! :armed:

Annisha
Sep 21st, 2003, 08:14 AM
Luna..I TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOU!!!! I cant believe some of that atttitudes here!! I find it disgusting anyone that wears fur....as u said minks are kept in terrible conditions and ive seen horrific footage of them being tortured just so some rich vain b****h can feel good about themselves grrrrrr. I also cant stand ppl that hunt animals so they can have a trophy on their wall...eg an antelopes head..its sickens me!! I cant beleive ppl are making jokes about the mink or saying it doesnt matter about the mink...humans are the ugliest species on this planet..we kill out of greed, passion...ect...animals only kill for survival

Barrie_Dude
Sep 21st, 2003, 08:24 AM
They wear fur???? Real fur???? I´mma shoot them! :armed:
My cat wears real fur!

decemberlove
Sep 21st, 2003, 08:29 AM
God gave us humans authority over the animals, therefore, we can kill those mean minks :p:angel:

people in power gave us god as a way to control the masses :p :angel:

Barrie_Dude
Sep 21st, 2003, 08:37 AM
people in power gave us god as a way to control the masses :p :angel:
I am with DL! Shoot Everyone! :armed:

theprophe
Sep 21st, 2003, 01:37 PM
I hope that when you say your vegan, that you also don't eat fish, or eggs, or any dairy products

Martian Willow
Sep 21st, 2003, 01:48 PM
...that's what vegan means, dumbass... :)

Martian Willow
Sep 21st, 2003, 01:50 PM
people in power gave us god as a way to control the masses :p :angel:

...I always found your attitude towards theism more amusing when you had the Kierkegaard quote in your signature... :)

Princess Fiona
Sep 21st, 2003, 01:50 PM
I'm not a fan of J-Lo or Beyoncé... (I think Beyoncé has a nice body and it should motivate me to exercise... ;) ) luna, thanks for the thread. I like to know celebrities who wear fur - okay, it is their personal choice but I think it is wrong. I am totally against the wearing of fur... The conditions in which these poor animals are kept are atrocious. The fur industry - grrrr!! :fiery: I think a little less of J-Lo and Beyoncé now... (Why did I not really see Beyoncé wearing that coat in her video? Concentrate a little more Fiona!! *growl* ;) )

King Aaron
Sep 21st, 2003, 07:53 PM
I know about that. What you all should know though is that P!nk is an avid supporter of PETA and she does NOT use fur. ;) :D

GBFH
Sep 21st, 2003, 07:55 PM
that can o' paint better have acid in it, 'cause DD will fuck you up :cool:

decemberlove
Sep 21st, 2003, 09:52 PM
...I always found your attitude towards theism more amusing when you had the Kierkegaard quote in your signature... :)

its flattering you remembered my attitude and my signature, but WHY did you find it more amusing?

decemberlove
Sep 21st, 2003, 09:57 PM
my personal opinion on fur, i wouldnt wear it cos i dont like the way it looks and feels... kinda creepy to me. im with DD on let the people do what they want.

PETA is ridiculous. please, its one thing to have love and respect for animals, but it doesnt say much about your organization when you have absolutely no respect for human life.

CondiLicious
Sep 21st, 2003, 09:58 PM
J-Lo and Celine Dion apparently wear chinchilla fur...

decemberlove
Sep 21st, 2003, 09:59 PM
j.lo wears fox fur eyelashes

Rtael
Sep 21st, 2003, 10:26 PM
I don't see anything wrong with eating meat because that's the way it is in the wild....Animals eat other animals (or plants, but we aren't natural herbivores) to survive.....However I've never seen a wolf killing a rabbit to make a rabbit-pelt coat.....So I'm totally against killing animals just for your vanity, and m_pierce14 I don't know if you were joking or not, but either way your comments are fucking disgusting.

Rtael
Sep 21st, 2003, 10:28 PM
if anyone is against the wearing of fur, then fucking don't wear fur. or leather. or eat meat. or wear leather shoes. or purchase leather seats for your home or car. or use most brand name cosmetics. or take antibiotics or any other pill tested on animals who eventually die from testing procedures. if that's your personal decision on this issue then live it to the fullest and let it encompass every area of your life.



last time I checked we actually do eat cows.....hence the reason we can wear leather.....and animal testing isn't right but it DOES save human lives....the only lives your fur coat saves are the lives of the people who don't have to look at your fat ugly ass.

decemberlove
Sep 21st, 2003, 11:15 PM
the original purpose of fur was to keep a person warm... its much warmer than wool or cotton, thats for sure. i understand taht people dont necessarily wear fur for the purpose of warmth anymore, BUT lets not point all the blame on fashionistas, they werent the ones to start the trend, ok?

Rtael
Sep 21st, 2003, 11:26 PM
and it's this same attitude that make most of us think of peta organizers in the same sense we do those who end up killing doctors who perform abortions. you go too far when you infringe upon someone's legal right to dress in whatever they wish to wear. rtael...let's not talk about fat or ugliness, shall we? because we don't know each other. stick to the topic and give your opinion one way or the other. what you're doing now is a sure sign of ignorance...grow up.



Yeah, I'm not the most mature person in the world I will admit, but I do have to put myself a level above someone who kills animals for nothing more then their own vanity.

Couver
Sep 22nd, 2003, 02:04 AM
And just as you have the right DeuceDiva to wear Fur, I have the right to come on this message board and talk about it!

As I said with my opening post some of their fans who do care about animals would like to know that these two women are killing animals simply to make a fashion statement.

And no I don't go around throwing paint on fur coats cause that's assault, but I do get into arguments with people who wear them and you know what that's MY RIGHT!

So you have your right to support an industry of murder and I have the right to post away and judge you for it :)

And I'm LMAO at the person who said PETA has no value for human life. Last I checked PETA hasn't made a coat out of Naomi Campbell. Besides what's to value about human life? human beings are vile creatures.

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 02:23 AM
That both of them wear Fur?

The reason I ask is because while some of you may know and not care some of you may not know. While I never liked J-Lo, I was a fan of Beyonce's until I found out (although I guess I should have noticed in her video she dances around in a big fox carcass.)

Anyway I just wanted to make you aware. IMO celebrities who wear fur are very irresponsible. There is no reason with all the faux fur out there to be killing innocent animals, not the mention the fact that the fur looks better on the animal.

It's sad actually to see too murderers having such success.

J-Lo, Beyonce= Fur SCUM :fiery:
I have a new found respect for you, luna_moonstone. :)

As for this:

J-Lo = whore, untalented piece of shit. This has NOTHING to do with fur. She's fake, she turned her back on her community and she thinks she's Julia Roberts. LMAO! I've always hated that $lut.

Beyonce = never really cared for her music, but if I ever thought she had an ounce of talent before, it's all gone. So soon she will follow J-Lo's path. And she's trying to act too. LMAO! Keep your day job honey, and stay away from fur.

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 02:31 AM
Although, btw luna, you know Venus and Serena have worn fur before? Were they fake though? It's only been once though. That white fur coat they both shared. Venus wore it once, and Serena later. Let me know if it was fake or not.

Couver
Sep 22nd, 2003, 03:05 AM
Hey Sam L. Well I checked into Venus' a while ago and according to PETA it was fake! Although I was pretty shocked when I first saw it. :eek:

I didn't know Serena wore one so I'm gonna have to get on that right after I type this.

PETA usually has a list of celebs who have worn real fur on their website, and they also sometimes have a little blurb saying if that celeb has since stopped or is continuing to do so.

I always check there now. I once went off on Mariah Carey for wearing fur and then checked the site and found out it was fake, so I was kinda :tape:

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 03:18 AM
Hey Sam L. Well I checked into Venus' a while ago and according to PETA it was fake! Although I was pretty shocked when I first saw it. :eek:

I didn't know Serena wore one so I'm gonna have to get on that right after I type this.

PETA usually has a list of celebs who have worn real fur on their website, and they also sometimes have a little blurb saying if that celeb has since stopped or is continuing to do so.

I always check there now. I once went off on Mariah Carey for wearing fur and then checked the site and found out it was fake, so I was kinda :tape:
I hope you'll forgive me. :sad: And Venus too. :sad: Thank you! :)

BTW, from what I saw, Serena wore the same one Venus wore, I think they shared, but I could be wrong.

Couver
Sep 22nd, 2003, 03:29 AM
Forgive you for what? I'm aware we have had our differences, but I certainly don't harbour any ill will toward you.

Berlin_Calling
Sep 22nd, 2003, 03:34 AM
So much for freedom of speech without people attacking you...

harloo
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:33 AM
I agree with DeuceDiva, because I'm really sick of these PETA fanatics trying to impose their way of thinking on the public. It's ok to disagree on someone's stance on a particular subject, but to purposely red paint someone's clothes is unethical no matter how their supporters try to defend this point.

Futhermore, the PETA fanatics really should go to their congress instead of attacking celebrities to bring attention to their issues with the fur industry. Going after a celebrity has not gotten them anywhere. But the real goal is to gather attention to a lost cause, because really what makes anyone think the government will stop the making of fur?(especially with the huge profits it makes for the economy).

All I'm saying is this: Everyone has a right to wear what the hell they want, and should not have to worry about someone attacking them for doing so. I think the people who are so AGAINST fur should focus their energies on the people who are making the MONEY off of fur, otherwise all the ranting is a lost cause.

GBFH
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:38 AM
PETA are delusional lefty liberal wackos. honestly, there are more important things to worry about than someone wearing fur.

GBFH
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:39 AM
and wasn't there some attention seeking skank whore from PETA who changed her name to goveg.com or something?

i hope none of them runs with scissors.

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:47 AM
I think the people who are so AGAINST fur should focus their energies on the people who are making the MONEY off of fur, otherwise all the ranting is a lost cause.

Oh believe me, we are. But it also doesn't hurt to bring down people wears fur.

Take J-Lo, for example, her movie TOTALLY bombed! She's total rock bottom now. Hope that whore rots in hell.

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:48 AM
and wasn't there some attention seeking skank whore from PETA who changed her name to goveg.com or something?

i hope none of them runs with scissors.
And she's a skank whore because?

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:51 AM
Also just because someone is anti-fur, it doesn't mean they have to be left and liberal. Good Grief! :rolleyes:

I support very conservative opinions as well as liberal opinions. I'm an individual, I don't define myself left or right.

harloo
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:53 AM
Oh believe me, we are. But it also doesn't hurt to bring down people wears fur.

Take J-Lo, for example, her movie TOTALLY bombed! She's total rock bottom now. Hope that whore rots in hell.

Sorry Sam L but this is exactly why I have NO respect for Peta fanatics. When you personally attack someone and act as if they must live by your precepts concerning what they wear I have a problem with that.

I don't have a problem with protesting, because that is the cornerstone of democracy. However, I don't agree with PETA's usuage of tactics. They really make themselves look bad when they go to a Victoria Secret fashion show and run on the stage with signs like a bunch of caged animals.

BTW, Jlo's Gigli movie was already predicted to be a failure before it came out. If you want to believe PETA had anything to do with the outcome the sales, then go ahead.

It's ok to dream. :D

GBFH
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:57 AM
And she's a skank whore because?

hmm....it's a catch-all I use to describe any woman i don't particularily care for. it's extremisists like the goveg.com girl who give proponents of animal rights a bad name. it was a publicity stunt, and utterly absurd.

Sam L
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:59 AM
Sorry Sam L but this is exactly why I have NO respect for Peta fanatics. When you personally attack someone and act as if they must live by your precepts concerning what they wear I have a problem with that.

I don't have a problem with protesting, because that is the cornerstone of democracy. However, I don't agree with PETA's usuage of tactics. They really make themselves look bad when they go to a Victoria Secret fashion show and run on the stage with signs like a bunch of caged animals.

BTW, Jlo's Gigli movie was already predicted to be a failure before it came out. If you want to believe PETA had anything to do with the outcome the sales, then go ahead.

It's ok to dream. :D
Um.. if you read above, I said I hated J-Lo from the beginning. I only found out today that she wore fur. :confused:

Believe me, my opinion of her didn't get any lower, it was as low as it could be anyway. LMAO!

But it just goes to show what happens to those who wear fur. Also do you remember my "Is Daniela Hantuchova wearing fur?" thread. Look where her career is now. LMAO! :lol:

Chance
Sep 22nd, 2003, 08:06 AM
--->Dumb question<----what about leather?

Couver
Sep 22nd, 2003, 09:55 AM
I just don't understand this argument that PETA violates human rights? So if PETA throwing paint or blood on a fur coat is wrong, well then what about KILLING an animal simply to look good?

So just because humans can talk and because we've managed to bring everything under our thumb only our rights matter? So even though mink and foxes, and beaver etc can feel pain, can feel fear their rights don't count?

By these arguments I should be allowed to put Beyonece in a cage, skin her and then dance around in her skin.

As a supposedly enlightend species we should try and make sure all things that live on this planet have equal rights. Ugh humans are so selfish and self-centered it makes me sick.

Annisha
Sep 22nd, 2003, 12:55 PM
December Love..i dont know much about PETA because we dont hear much about their actions down here in Australia...h'ever u said in ur msg "PETA is ridiculous. please, its one thing to have love and respect for animals, but it doesnt say much about your organization when you have absolutely no respect for human life." I wish that human life had more respect for animals...has anyone heard about the sheep on a ship in the middle east?? There are 50,ooo of them on this ship...cramped in hot tempuratures...at least 10'000 have died so far...saudi arabia rejected this boat of sheep so now no-one will take them..its horrific to imagine the pain of these animals..the sufereing grrrrrrr....please animals have feelings to!!!!

doloresc
Sep 22nd, 2003, 01:30 PM
J-Lo = whore, untalented piece of shit. This has NOTHING to do with fur. She's fake, she turned her back on her community and she thinks she's Julia Roberts. LMAO! I've always hated that $lut.

i am not by any stretch of the imagination a fan of jennifer lopez's. i haven't seen any of her films and i am not familar with her music (i don't keep up with contemporary music). however, sam l, to say "she thinks she's julia roberts "makes me wonder that you think lopez has no right to aspire to be on julia roberts' level. i may be wrong but that's they way i'm interpretting the comment.

Berlin_Calling
Sep 22nd, 2003, 04:32 PM
I just don't understand this argument that PETA violates human rights? So if PETA throwing paint or blood on a fur coat is wrong, well then what about KILLING an animal simply to look good?

What is throwing red paint or blood on someone's fur coat going to accomplish besides you guys pissing the general public off? NOTHING, your not making any point when ruining other people's property and no ones going to not buy fur because of some crazy idiots damaging expensive products that people paid a lot of money to get.

decemberlove
Sep 22nd, 2003, 06:41 PM
luna:
laugh all you want about me saying PETA is a ridiculous organization... perhaps you do not follow the news. they HAVE attacked people and they HAVE been known to be violent.

PETA is a step below anti-abortion protesters on the lunacy scale.

violence and violating another persons rights is NOT the best way to get your message across. there are much better solutions than acting like a five year old.

Martian Willow
Sep 22nd, 2003, 07:01 PM
i didn't know that this thread (or any thread for that matter) was for the purpose of putting ourselves a level above anyone else (for whatever reason). what you need to remember though, is that most of us who do wear furs aren't the ones who do the killing. these animals are dead when bought. so you see, if i hadn't purchased it, someone else would. either way, it's already dead.

...that's got to be one of the most fuckwitted arguments I've ever heard...they are killed because people pay for them to be killed...if people didn't buy them, they wouldn't be killed...it's called 'supply and demand'...if you're paying, you're PRECISELY as responsibly for the treatment and killing of those animals as the farmers... :)

Martian Willow
Sep 22nd, 2003, 07:31 PM
...and you can't stop looking down on people who pay for the needless torture and killing of animals as the worthless savages they are... :)

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 12:33 AM
luna:
laugh all you want about me saying PETA is a ridiculous organization... perhaps you do not follow the news. they HAVE attacked people and they HAVE been known to be violent.

PETA is a step below anti-abortion protesters on the lunacy scale.

violence and violating another persons rights is NOT the best way to get your message across. there are much better solutions than acting like a five year old.
Um, I don't even see a comparison. Anti-abortion people have murdered doctors who perform abortions. PETA has done nothing even remotely close.

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 12:36 AM
Also I have a question. Sure, you think PETA is nuts. If you don't want to support them, that's FINE! But have they done anything to you? Why are you defending J-Lo and these other celebrities? Are you related to them? Are you also a fur wearing celebrity? Cause if you're not, then why are in here feeling sorry for them? :confused:

Let PETA do whatever they want, as long as they're not interfering with YOUR life, right? :confused:

Please tell me, harloo, m_pierce, DeuceDiva, etc.. how PETA has ruined your life? :confused:

Couver
Sep 23rd, 2003, 12:53 AM
Decemberlove said: violence and violating another persons rights is NOT the best way to get your message across. there are much better solutions than acting like a five year old

So killing another living creature is what better than acting like a five year old? This is what I don't understand.Why are humans isolated in this sphere of rules and freedoms all by themselves? Humans are apes, just another type of species on this planet.

So if you are arguing that PETA destroying someone's property is an evil and vile act, then how can you support an industry that KILLS another species, that just happens to not be human? Apparently those in fur and the fur industry are right down there with anti-abortionists. From where I'm looking PETA even by these arguments is a step above.

Chris_Martin's_woman
Sep 23rd, 2003, 12:59 AM
fur on a person is butt ugly anyways, it ruins the whole outfit!!!!:ras::cuckoo:

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:06 AM
--->Dumb question<----what about leather?
One fight at a time. Fur is used a lot less than leather. However, fur requires the death of more animals, and these animals also come from those who are in captivity that normally aren't, for example, minks. Whereas leather mostly comes from cows. So to stop leather would be like to stop meat-eating, and that's just way too complicated right now.

However, I don't wear leather anyway.

Very good points, Luna!

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:21 AM
Decemberlove said: violence and violating another persons rights is NOT the best way to get your message across. there are much better solutions than acting like a five year old

So killing another living creature is what better than acting like a five year old? This is what I don't understand.Why are humans isolated in this sphere of rules and freedoms all by themselves? Humans are apes, just another type of species on this planet.

honey, two wrongs dont make a right. you want to get a message across, do it in a more mature way and people will respect you and your cause more. MLK didnt get his dream by running around and pushing whites around, now did he? same for womens rights movement. you want people to take you seriously, you have to act seriously.

[quote]So if you are arguing that PETA destroying someone's property is an evil and vile act, then how can you support an industry that KILLS another species, that just happens to not be human? Apparently those in fur and the fur industry are right down there with anti-abortionists. From where I'm looking PETA even by these arguments is a step above.

I NEVER said it is an evil and vile act so dont put words in my mouth where they dont belong in an attempt to make your argument better. as i remember, those were YOUR words.

also, you obviously dont understand the scale. i said a step below on the lunacy scale, as in, the most sane at the bottom and the least insane at the top, now do you understand?

i support animal rights and dont wear fur nor do i eat red meat, however, i will not support an organization who resorts to violence in an attempt to get attention.

bottomline, and ive said this a MILLION times in this thread and yet it still hasnt gotten through some heads yet, violence and violation of a persons personal LEGAL property is not the way to get a message across.

CC
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:22 AM
I believe I am a compassionate person --- even when it comes to animals who I consider to be beneath me --- however I have no problem whatsoever with eating these said animals or wearing their skin.

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:23 AM
I bought a mink coat the other day, and let me tell you, that shit is PHAT!! :cool:

I'm getting all the hoes now! ;)

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:24 AM
oh btw, it looks hot with my sea turtle boots! :cool:

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:28 AM
Um, I don't even see a comparison. Anti-abortion people have murdered doctors who perform abortions. PETA has done nothing even remotely close.

check my post above.

and yes, they can both be compared. both feel the need to get their message across by violating anothers persons basic human rights and/or using violence rather that using a peaceful method. PETA has attacked people wearing fur/leather/etc.

and im throwing the anti-abortion people into one big group. i feel even those that go outside clinics, protest, and throw pictures of aborted fetuses are violating another persons basic human rights.

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:30 AM
I believe I am a compassionate person --- even when it comes to animals who I consider to be beneath me --- however I have no problem whatsoever with eating these said animals or wearing their skin.
Obviously you know nothing about science. The DNA difference between us and chimps are like less than 2%. Without animals, we wouldn't be here! Heck, we are them! :eek: Looking after animals is, looking after our future and our children's future. Don't you understand that? :confused:

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:33 AM
check my post above.

and yes, they can both be compared. both feel the need to get their message across by violating anothers persons basic human rights and/or using violence rather that using a peaceful method. PETA has attacked people wearing fur/leather/etc.

and im throwing the anti-abortion people into one big group. i feel even those that go outside clinics, protest, and throw pictures of aborted fetuses are violating another persons basic human rights.
Well I don't support PETA attacking people, but protests are fine.

Couver
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:38 AM
I DO understand in part where you are coming from decemberlove. I agree, while I do fight with people who wear fur I have never physically attacked a person in fur because that is assault. And ultimately it's their choice, but I would never stop trying to spread awareness about the cruelty.

However PETA does do a lot of good. They actually attempt to speak for other species who otherwise cannot. Granted some may take it too far, but not all. Like all organizations there are different people in all of them some good, some bad.

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:39 AM
do you guys get mad when you see pictures of cave men wearing fur?

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:44 AM
do you guys get mad when you see pictures of cave men wearing fur?
Our ancestors depended on fur and meat for survival. But they were primitive. Just like people who are wearing fur and eating a lot of meat today are primitive. However, at that time it was necessary, today it is not.

Most people who wear fur now, do not do it because they need warmth, but because for fashion. There lies the problem. Moreover, when cavemen were alive there were many many species of animals in the world and none were near extinction. Today there are fewer and more near extinction.

They're very different scenarios.

CC
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:47 AM
Obviously you know nothing about science. The DNA difference between us and chimps are like less than 2%. Without animals, we wouldn't be here! Heck, we are them! :eek: Looking after animals is, looking after our future and our children's future. Don't you understand that? :confused:

Humans have dominion over animals, though this does not justify abuse of the latter. I can certainly see where animal lovers and defenders are coming from, but I also believe people have a personal right to live their lives as they please, as long as they do so within the laws of society.

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:49 AM
Our ancestors depended on fur and meat for survival. But they were primitive. Just like people who are wearing fur and eating a lot of meat today are primitive. However, at that time it was necessary, today it is not.

Most people who wear fur now, do not do it because they need warmth, but because for fashion. There lies the problem. Moreover, when cavemen were alive there were many many species of animals in the world and none were near extinction. Today there are fewer and more near extinction.

They're very different scenarios.
not true, not true at all. did you know that their used to be beauty pageants during the cavemen days?? they used to use the fur from the nicest animals to dress up.

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:50 AM
I DO understand in part where you are coming from decemberlove. I agree, while I do fight with people who wear fur I have never physically attacked a person in fur because that is assault. And ultimately it's their choice, but I would never stop trying to spread awareness about the cruelty.

However PETA does do a lot of good. They actually attempt to speak for other species who otherwise cannot. Granted some may take it too far, but not all. Like all organizations there are different people in all of them some good, some bad.


its nice to see you have some flexibility on the issue.

personally, id rather support greenpeace than PETA.

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 01:57 AM
its nice to see you have some flexibility on the issue.

personally, id rather support greenpeace than PETA.
Good Lord, decemberlove, Greenpeace is according to you just as bad as PETA if not worse! At least PETA doesn't get involved in politics and stuff. Which is all fine, but with politics you need to be realistic sometime, you can't just say PEACE ALL THE TIME for example. Greenpeace gets involved in way too much.

OK, folks, here's a solution, let's all support WWF. :yeah:

CC, you're right, but laws need to be progressive, which they're not unfortunately. Also humans do not have dominion over ALL animals. We don't even know some of them exists!

CC
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:00 AM
Sam we have dominion over the notion of "animals," even if we are not aware of all that exist.

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:02 AM
Cya guys and gals later! :wavey:

I'm off to watch football and eat some cow flesh! :lick:

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:10 AM
Sam we have dominion over the notion of "animals," even if we are not aware of all that exist.
Right and what about viruses? These are living things too. They're not animals, per se, but they are living. And they could well wipe us off this planet. So looks like they have dominion over us. :eek:

Bottomline, there are so many things we don't know about nature and animals that you can't just pull out something like "We're here to rule over the Earth and the animals". I always laugh whenever I hear this comment. How long have humans inhabited this Earth? 5 million years, maybe a bit more. This is nothing!

CC
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:44 AM
Right and what about viruses? These are living things too. They're not animals, per se, but they are living. And they could well wipe us off this planet. So looks like they have dominion over us. :eek:

Bottomline, there are so many things we don't know about nature and animals that you can't just pull out something like "We're here to rule over the Earth and the animals". I always laugh whenever I hear this comment. How long have humans inhabited this Earth? 5 million years, maybe a bit more. This is nothing!

There are many such possibilities for destruction when it comes to the frailty of life on earth. God, or the idea of God is considered a Supreme Being and could equally rid himself of all lifeforms. If we are to go in that direction then this debate would become merely a discussion of ifs, ideas, and possibilities.

I tend to boil my arguments and views down to a few simple truths.

Sam L
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:55 AM
I tend to boil my arguments and views down to a few simple truths.

Yeah I thought so cause anyone who thinks, we as humans have dominion over all animals would have to be thinking "simple".

Gospodin
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:51 AM
i cant believe the level of stupidity on this thread with replies like "cavemen have beauty pageants too" or "my cat wears fur should i hate them too"? bs. dunno, answers like these come from people who know they are wrong yet try to be funny to make themselves look smart. :rolleyes:

but i have never seen as much stupidity as with those who say "we have dominion over animals". please, who do you think you are? tarzan? you idiots dont even own the land where those animals are living let alone have dominion over them. this is the biggest arrogance humanity has ever spawned, that he actually owns the earth as a gift from god almighty... please get some brains and some compassion. we are not the only carbon based life forms on this planet and there is no justification moral or otherwise for the slaughter of animals for pleasure.

CC
Sep 23rd, 2003, 02:24 PM
I don't necessarily like to repeat myself, but here are the simple truths in this issue:

Animals are valuable --- some animals obviously serve certain purposes and contribute to our knowledge and understanding of the world.

Regardless, a human life to me, is more valuable than an animal's life.

People make their own personal choices about how they wish to live their lives, and whether or not my beliefs conflict with their's has no bearing on their rights and practices in accordance with society's laws.

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 03:33 PM
i cant believe the level of stupidity on this thread with replies like "cavemen have beauty pageants too" or "my cat wears fur should i hate them too"? bs. dunno, answers like these come from people who know they are wrong yet try to be funny to make themselves look smart. :rolleyes:


um, its called a joke. go find yourself a sense of humor.

lets say theres a fire and you can only save one of the two, a human baby or a cat, which one do you save?

you dont even have to answer :)

andylover_16
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:00 PM
you dont really have to have a sense of humor to think that is stupid but anyways.....i agree that humans are at a higher level than an animal....though animals should not be used for fur and such pleasures to humans...theirs a difference in eating meat and killing animals for their fur......btw december love i'd have to say the human;)

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:05 PM
true, true, but joe is infamous for being stupid, right joey? its ok, i forgive him cos i understand he is a dirty mexican :p

i think in order for as all tolive in harmony we have to respect all kinds of life, animals, plants, humans, etc. its not gonna happen and our lack of compassion and respect for others will be our downfall.

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:11 PM
true, true, but joe is infamous for being stupid, right joey? its ok, i forgive him cos i understand he is a dirty mexican :p

i think in order for as all tolive in harmony we have to respect all kinds of life, animals, plants, humans, etc. its not gonna happen and our lack of compassion and respect for others will be our downfall.
I was about to say thank you, and give you a sweet kiss for that post you made, but now i'm going to say, Fuck off you filthy cuban! :fiery:

lol :kiss:

decemberlove
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:16 PM
:devil:

King Satan
Sep 23rd, 2003, 07:17 PM
that smiley fits you perfectly! lol

Ballbuster
Sep 23rd, 2003, 10:20 PM
I eat them to keep my protein intake up, and I would wear them too if they didn't make me look to faggety.

Sam L
Sep 24th, 2003, 12:46 AM
um, its called a joke. go find yourself a sense of humor.

lets say theres a fire and you can only save one of the two, a human baby or a cat, which one do you save?

you dont even have to answer :)
Well Gospodin is very new, how could they have known King Satan (Joe's) infamous ways around here? :p

Sam L
Sep 24th, 2003, 12:51 AM
I don't necessarily like to repeat myself, but here are the simple truths in this issue:

Animals are valuable --- some animals obviously serve certain purposes and contribute to our knowledge and understanding of the world.

Regardless, a human life to me, is more valuable than an animal's life.

People make their own personal choices about how they wish to live their lives, and whether or not my beliefs conflict with their's has no bearing on their rights and practices in accordance with society's laws.
To some people, some human lives are much more important than others. I'm not just talking about slavery in the past but also now with the many injustices in the world. Does this make it right? Can we just put our hands up and say, well because most people think it's ok, it must be okay? :confused:

Where will we be if minority groups didn't fight for what's right in history?

Also I'm going back to the question I asked which nobody answered.

Alright, if you don't support PETA, but why do you have something against it? Did PETA do something to you? Please tell me if they did. :confused:

Rtael
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:09 AM
I don't think there is anything wrong with leather, cause you eat the cow anyway, so you're not killing it just so you can look like a dumb fuck.....


BTW DD, if I actually believed in hell, I'd believe you were going there....


You know how there used to not be any laws that said white people couldn't beat the crap out of their slaves? That didn't make it right did it? No, I didn't think so. Please, try a better argument next time. (Gee, if you were a slave-owner, though, I'd bet you say well it's not against the law to rape and kill my slaves, so I'll do it until they make me stop!) :rolleyes:

Rtael
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:10 AM
To some people, some human lives are much more important than others. I'm not just talking about slavery in the past but also now with the many injustices in the world. Does this make it right? Can we just put our hands up and say, well because most people think it's ok, it must be okay? :confused:

Where will we be if minority groups didn't fight for what's right in history?

Also I'm going back to the question I asked which nobody answered.

Alright, if you don't support PETA, but why do you have something against it? Did PETA do something to you? Please tell me if they did. :confused:



grr! You stupid tard! I didn't read the third page and you stole my idea before I even thought it! :p :p :worship: :wavey:

Rtael
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:11 AM
um, its called a joke. go find yourself a sense of humor.

lets say theres a fire and you can only save one of the two, a human baby or a cat, which one do you save?

you dont even have to answer :)


alright, but say you have to choose between a serial rapist and a little kitten, which do you choose?

you don't even have to answer.

King Satan
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:11 AM
"BTW DD, if I actually believed in hell, I'd believe you were going there...."

you hear that dd? you're coming to stay with me! :devil:

Rtael
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:26 AM
--- so...by way of your analogy, you're saying that slaves are on the same level as animals? please...be clear about this.


Their treated with same amount of disregard and lack of respect, and I think they should be treated as equals in so-much as regards to cruelty/and plain old useless murder.

Sam L
Sep 24th, 2003, 01:30 AM
You know how there used to not be any laws that said white people couldn't beat the crap out of their slaves? That didn't make it right did it? No, I didn't think so. Please, try a better argument next time. (Gee, if you were a slave-owner, though, I'd bet you say well it's not against the law to rape and kill my slaves, so I'll do it until they make me stop!) :rolleyes:

--- so...by way of your analogy, you're saying that slaves are on the same level as animals? please...be clear about this.

What he means, and this is a very good point is that what's accepted by general society at some point in history, need not be accepted by all, nor does it mean it cannot be changed.

Take another example, how about in ancient Rome, where they fed Christians to lions? Back then it was alright, but now do we think so?

It's about change for the better. That's the bottomline. People don't need to wear fur, they can do without it.

CC
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:14 AM
To some people, some human lives are much more important than others. I'm not just talking about slavery in the past but also now with the many injustices in the world. Does this make it right? Can we just put our hands up and say, well because most people think it's ok, it must be okay? :confused:

Where will we be if minority groups didn't fight for what's right in history?

Also I'm going back to the question I asked which nobody answered.

Alright, if you don't support PETA, but why do you have something against it? Did PETA do something to you? Please tell me if they did. :confused:

We're not makig a comparison between humans. We are making a comparitive distinction between the value of human life versus the value of animal life. Why are we equating slaves with animals? Humans are not animals. Well ... you know what I mean. Don't quote me --- I've had some rum.

Sam L
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:25 AM
We're not makig a comparison between humans. We are making a comparitive distinction between the value of human life versus the value of animal life. Why are we equating slaves with animals? Humans are not animals. Well ... you know what I mean. Don't quote me --- I've had some rum.
And again, please answer my question!

IT'S OK if you don't support PETA, but why do you have to HATE it? Just leave us alone and we'll do our job.

Unless you are J-Lo and we're interfering with your life, or you're one of the catwalk models. You're not, are you? :confused:

CC
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:28 AM
And again, please answer my question!

IT'S OK if you don't support PETA, but why do you have to HATE it? Just leave us alone and we'll do our job.

Unless you are J-Lo and we're interfering with your life, or you're one of the catwalk models. You're not, are you? :confused:

I have not said anything about PETA.

Unless you're the Mink and J-lo is interfering with your life ...

Sam L
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:38 AM
I have not said anything about PETA.

Unless you're the Mink and J-lo is interfering with your life ...
See here we go again.

luna_moonstone created this thread to inform potential J-Lo and Beyonce fans of their actions.

If you think there's nothing wrong with what these celebs are doing, fine just move on.

Isn't it that simple? :confused:

There will be plenty of other people who will care.

CC
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:48 AM
See here we go again.

luna_moonstone created this thread to inform potential J-Lo and Beyonce fans of their actions.

If you think there's nothing wrong with what these celebs are doing, fine just move on.

Isn't it that simple? :confused:

There will be plenty of other people who will care.

It's ok to care. And I guess it's ok to assassinate the characters of those who have different viewpoints than you.

We talk about lack of respect and compassion for animals but "activists" are just as guilty of intolerance as those you condemn. But I guess you have a right to be hateful and vicious towards others simply because you "care."


~moving on as suggested~

King Satan
Sep 24th, 2003, 02:59 AM
what about insects? do you all get mad when insects are slaughtered?

decemberlove
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:14 AM
alright, but say you have to choose between a serial rapist and a little kitten, which do you choose?

you don't even have to answer.

the rapist... and then throw his ass in jail.

i fucking hate cats. now if it was a dog, a different story :)

btw, not all humans are serial rapists :rolleyes:


oh, and if DD is going to hell, where the fuck am i going?

adss
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:14 AM
do fans of jennifer lopez know she's a talentless media whore?

decemberlove
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:19 AM
dont lie DD, youd take the rapist just so you can shoot his nuts off with your glock ;)

GBFH
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:27 AM
dont lie DD, youd take the rapist just so you can shoot his nuts off with your glock ;)

:haha:

DD ---> :armed:

decemberlove
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:46 AM
you're going to a dimension beyond the basement of hell. :p you'd better get your life together and start agreeing with these guys or they'll start digging dimensions even deeper than that for you. :D ;)


oooh, im excited :devil:

decemberlove
Sep 24th, 2003, 03:46 AM
regarding xtians and lions. yes, it was done in the past. but the only people it was alright with were the romans. not everyone else. also, there are those who would think that the change was in fact not for the better but for the worse. ;)

haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa :lol:

Rtael
Sep 25th, 2003, 01:35 AM
well, it's very difficult to choose between two animals, for that's exactly what a serial rapist is. an animal. so for me it would be a toss-up.


Sorry sweety, someone should have told you sooner. Humans are Animals! Of the Animal Kingdom! Humans are animals. There is no distinction. sorry.

Rocketta
Sep 25th, 2003, 01:45 AM
well, it's very difficult to choose between two animals, for that's exactly what a serial rapist is. an animal. so for me it would be a toss-up.

tough choice for DD knowing how much she loves cats.....:devil:

Couver
Sep 25th, 2003, 05:58 AM
Actually if a Cat and a Baby were trapped in a burning building, the Cat could probably find it's way out alone. Thus you could save the baby.

Most animals are far more resourceful and better able to handle disasters than humans. Humans are slow to grow and are pretty defensless and useless for much of their lives.

treufreund
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:07 AM
LUNA MOONSTONE RULEZ!!!

Responses like "I will do whatever the hell I want" bla bla bla are just totally weak. Luna is 100% correct. Cruelly killing other being and ripping their fur to make adornments for people is unjustifiable.

Period.

kku
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:11 AM
if anyone is against the wearing of fur, then fucking don't wear fur. or leather. or eat meat. or wear leather shoes. or purchase leather seats for your home or car. or use most brand name cosmetics. or take antibiotics or any other pill tested on animals who eventually die from testing procedures. if that's your personal decision on this issue then live it to the fullest and let it encompass every area of your life.

but...you have no right to impose your isms on anyone else's rights to wear what they want. i respect that some people feel this way. but if i'm wearing a fur coat and you come anywhere near me with a can of paint, know this. it'll be the last can of paint you ever throw. :mad:

Amen :worship: :worship: :worship:

I suppose many activists just want to have their beliefs understood and noticed. I respect that because they've worked hard to find a cause that they are really interested in and passionate about.

But what irks me is when a few of them behave with unnecessary actions. They have their thoughts and they want to make them heard and hopefully supported. I doubt physically or verbally abusing other people who wear fur or eat meat is a good way to have those people turn away from their "practices".

kku
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:12 AM
My cat wears real fur!

My God :eek: Your cat makes more money than I do ;)

kku
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:13 AM
my personal opinion on fur, i wouldnt wear it cos i dont like the way it looks and feels... kinda creepy to me. im with DD on let the people do what they want.

PETA is ridiculous. please, its one thing to have love and respect for animals, but it doesnt say much about your organization when you have absolutely no respect for human life.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

kku
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:16 AM
--- if this is the case, and you're human (which i am taking for granted that you are since i've yet to meet another life form on this planet with typing capabilities) then i feel sorry for you. your life isn't valuable and you're a vile, vile creature. :) have a nice day.
:wavey:

:haha: :haha: :haha:

kku
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:24 AM
luna:

I don't agree with killing animals for vanity or indulging in wealth as well.

But there comes a point when you have to realise that by slamming other people verbally (or in the case of PETA, physically), it won't be progressive at all because it'll just infuriate other people who might see the actions of the organisation as barbaric and insulting. Sure, those who kill animals are worse, but why bring yourself down to their levels?

Peaceful, deep debates and discussions will do far more for one's credibility. And that well-earned respect will inevitably earn the organisation more supporters.

I support PETA's right to lobby for animal rights, but I completely detest their efforts to humiliate other people.

decemberlove
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:25 AM
Actually if a Cat and a Baby were trapped in a burning building, the Cat could probably find it's way out alone. Thus you could save the baby.

Most animals are far more resourceful and better able to handle disasters than humans. Humans are slow to grow and are pretty defensless and useless for much of their lives.

trapped, as in CAN NOT GET OUT. i didnt know cats suddenly had the ability to open doors that are locked. anyway, youre picking the question apart in an attempt to disregard the original point.

Sam L
Sep 25th, 2003, 06:31 AM
Actually if a Cat and a Baby were trapped in a burning building, the Cat could probably find it's way out alone. Thus you could save the baby.

Most animals are far more resourceful and better able to handle disasters than humans. Humans are slow to grow and are pretty defensless and useless for much of their lives.
Amen to that. :worship:

Very good points, treufreund. Keep fighting, you guys!

:worship:

treufreund
Sep 26th, 2003, 08:17 PM
hiya sam, raa, and Luna :wavey: