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View Full Version : Great play by Sugiyama or more choking by Clijsters?


TeeRexx
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:02 AM
After dropping the Australian Open final to SERENA some believed that
Kim had choked rather than facing the fact that she was beaten by a championship caliber opponent.

Ai Sugiyam played an incredible three set match against alez Stevenson and then went on to play and defeat Clijsters in three sets after only resting 1 1/2 hours.

Did Ai put on a Superwoman performance or is Kim really choking under the pressure of a final on a regular basis?

selesfan
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:09 AM
I think it was great play by Ai, she was determined to win. Kim never really had a huge lead to say she choked.

victory1
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:10 AM
Ai was the better more determined player today. Kim will regroup, just like any other top player.

Gowza
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:11 AM
well actually at the oz open it wasn't the final so you can't really say she is choking in FINALS on a regular basis.

i believe that she has separated herself from the field besides the williams sisters so i think to some degree is is choking. sugiyama has played well this week beating some good names and some in-form players.

kim really should have won the match but she is
1-1 in finals this year. so she hasn't choked on a regular basis in finals.

her expectation because of what she did at the end of last year is not to lose to any player rannked lower than her but last year both venus and serena lost to a couple of players. and kim has lost to good players.

i don't think we can call it choking quite yet.

WtaTour4Ever
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:12 AM
Yeah, its not like she was up 5-1 and lost it, she just didn't play her best match today, guess its hard playing against someone you are close to :-) Kidding, but hey, you can't play great everyday. Regardless congrats to Ai on her big win.

graf630
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:16 AM
Kim is my #1 favorite,and I have to say I do think there was a little bit of choking.But I think Ai just played such good tennis today,Kim didn't really have an answer.I am sure Kim never thought Ai would have the energy to play the way she played .The adrenilin was flowing freely in Ai. She was the more consistant and patient one today.
Much deserved win Ai ! :worship:

leslie
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:21 AM
I do believe Kim choked. She lost to Serena in the AO, lost to Venus a couple of weeks ago now this. I have said it and I will say it again that lost to Serena has been devastating to Kim she has not gotten over it yet and I hope she is seeing a therapist.

leslie
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:24 AM
I guess pam and maryjo can shut their traps now. Were they talking about how many ue Kim was making. If it were the W/S everytime they made an ue pam and maryjo would point it out. I hate thoes two.

treufreund
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:24 AM
I think Kim never felt like she was playing great all week long and Ai really was playing her perfectly. Ai picked the right shot almost every time. So that put a lot of pressure on Kim and Ai deserved this tournament every bit as much as Maggie and Patty did last fall and Justine in Dubai. :bounce:

DunkMachine
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:31 AM
I think it was a little bit of both. She had some appaling games at times during the match. Her losing to Ai only proves that Kim isn't no. 1 material.

o0O0o
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:33 AM
Ai is not a player who has "on" and "off" days nor does she change her gameplan throughout a match. She is what she is and consistently plays the same quick, flat, counterpunching style and hasn't changed her shots in YEARS. She played exactly the same from beginning to end, which was like shit. Yes I think Ai played a bad match, she did nothing spectacular, it's just that Kim couldn't hit a ball in the court. She is becoming an expert choke artist, maybe it's because I like her? It seems unavoidable.

Cybelle Darkholme
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:36 AM
Funny I thought you had to be in a position to win in order to choke a match away. You know, like having two match points and being up 5 1? Kim was never in a position to win this match today. Ai outplayed her.

And just because Ai doesn't do anything "spectacular" doesn't mean she plays like shit. Don't be bitter and "hate" on Ai just because she crushed kim beneath her sneakers and then scraped her off in time for their doubles match. :kiss:

Hawk
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:42 AM
Kim was never had matchpoint on anything..so I don't know if you call it choking. Ai played well and she won. Kim played bad and she lost. It's as simple as that.

This board is far too sadistic...

Venus Forever
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:43 AM
I definitely think it was Sugiyama who won the match and not Clijsters who lost it.

Ai played great tennis today, she went for many of her shots, and she didn't miss often.

Congrats Ai!!:D:D

kournikovafan13
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:47 AM
Ai is not a player who has "on" and "off" days nor does she change her gameplan throughout a match. She is what she is and consistently plays the same quick, flat, counterpunching style and hasn't changed her shots in YEARS. She played exactly the same from beginning to end, which was like shit. Yes I think Ai played a bad match, she did nothing spectacular, it's just that Kim couldn't hit a ball in the court. She is becoming an expert choke artist, maybe it's because I like her? It seems unavoidable.

LMAO. Were you even watching the match?

Ai played a great match. She hit many winners off both wings, had some good serves, volleyed great, scrambled fantastically, and didn't make that many errors.

bis2806
Mar 3rd, 2003, 03:34 AM
Kim didn't choke... it was just that she wasn't good enough :rolleyes:

LeonHart
Mar 3rd, 2003, 03:41 AM
Ai definitly outplayed Kim today. Even though it was evident that Ai was tired, she still gave it her all and ran every shot down. She gave Kim NO EASY POINTS, even when she was down. Kim did not choke, she just made more errors today, and bad plays at the net.

Crazy Canuck
Mar 3rd, 2003, 03:48 AM
Who else thinks that the FIX was on? :D

Dawn Marie
Mar 3rd, 2003, 05:01 AM
Ai won the match and Kim lost.

Ai played a great match and I can't stand biased Pam and biased MJF.

the pressure is on . :wavey:

hingis-seles
Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:37 AM
Seles, Kim is 1-2 in finals this year. She won Sydney and lost the finals in Antwerp and Scottsdale.

TeeRexx
Mar 3rd, 2003, 06:42 AM
I just got tired of how MJF & PS kept saying how Kim beat VENUS in the WTA championships, in which big sis was clearly injured and failed to mention or glossed over how badly VENUS and SERENA beat Kim this year.

Ai played like an inspired woman, but I believe that Kim did getup 4-3 in the third set and failed to pull away from this lower ranked player.

The fans and media have put to much GWH pressure on poor Kim, not to mention that daddy is beginning to mouth off as well.

The rumble in Miami should be quite interesting.

Come-on-kim
Mar 3rd, 2003, 08:17 AM
Ai played terribly well!!! Except when Kim leveled the score at 4-4 in the third set, Ai wasn't making an error!!!

Halardfan
Mar 3rd, 2003, 09:02 AM
Ai deserves the credit, she is a top class player and person. :)

TeeRexx
Mar 3rd, 2003, 10:39 AM
Boy, the way Ai was playing, if SERENA had tried to play with that knee not 100%, the Japanese superwoman might have given little sis her first loss of the year.

leslie
Mar 3rd, 2003, 11:47 AM
Ai played terribly well!!! Except when Kim leveled the score at 4-4 in the third set, Ai wasn't making an error!!!

Please explain to me how does someone play TERRIBLY WELL. Either you played terribly or you played well.

per4ever
Mar 3rd, 2003, 11:55 AM
people tend to forget that a player can have a bad day, or not having the right shape. Nobody can play a whole year at their best, not even Serena. Kim had a bad day, Ai played well and deserves the win :)

catkey94
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:01 PM
Please explain to me how does someone play TERRIBLY WELL. Either you played terribly or you played well.

It's called an oxymoron. Meaning using two totally different (or opposite)words to make a statement like: agree to disagree, pretty ugly, a little big, almost ready, living dead, current history, etc...

Experimentee
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:05 PM
I dont think Kims choked at all this year. At the AO Serena started playing amazing when she was down, Venus in the final just played too well, and i dont know about this but it sounds like Ai played her best and Kim never had a lead, so i dont think that was choking. I dont believe Kim is affecteed at all.

Come-on-kim
Mar 3rd, 2003, 12:26 PM
Please explain to me how does someone play TERRIBLY WELL. Either you played terribly or you played well.
Ai played terribly well!!! Means that she was awsome!! She played extremely well!

Crazy Canuck
Mar 4th, 2003, 12:14 AM
It's hard to close out the match when you were never really leading it ;)

TeeRexx
Mar 4th, 2003, 12:26 AM
A lead may also be playing with more than 90 minutes rest and being the much higher ranked and favored player. ;)

Rocketta
Mar 4th, 2003, 12:30 AM
wasn't kim leading 6-3, 4-2 at one point in the match?? is that not a significant lead? I'm not saying she choked or anything I'm just saying she was in the lead considerably at one point.

tennisIlove09
Mar 4th, 2003, 12:39 AM
Tragically, I haven't seen Ai play that many matches. But from the few I have seen, she doesn't have a big weapon other than her speed. So, did Ai just track everything down until Kim made the error?

CoryAnnAvants#1
Mar 4th, 2003, 01:10 AM
Kim served for the match at 5-4 and hit three errors that game. I'd call that choking. Sugiyama was playing well (especially after a 3 hr match) but Clijsters had her ON A STRING until that point. When Sugiyama broke to 5-5, that was the kick in the ass she needed. Suddenly, Ai was firing on all cylinders with huge down the line backhands, amazing returns of serve, and beautiful touch volleys. Kim only played a sloppy game at 5-4, but boy did she pay for it.

BTW, how did Ai react after the win..I left at 4-4 in the third

ico4498
Mar 4th, 2003, 02:55 AM
Ask a hunnerd sport fans to define choking ... you'll get millions of answers.

I don't think losing a lead, however imposing, is necessarily choking.

I don't think losing a match, you're favored to win is necessarily choking.

I do agree with Gladwell's definitive piece ...

http://www.gladwell.com/2000/2000_08_21_a_choking.htm

BelgianGirl
Mar 4th, 2003, 06:15 PM
Kim didn't choke in my opinion, she was never really 'in control' of the match and played very inconsistent troughout the whole match. That's not choking! In my opinion a player chokes when she's the better player and is in control of the match, and suddenly loses control and the match... That's not exactly what happened in my opinion.
Ai played a great match and deserved to win this title! :)

TeeRexx
Mar 4th, 2003, 06:23 PM
-----
"In my opinion a player chokes when she's the better player and is in control of the match, and suddenly loses control and the match... "
----

From that definition it does, however, seem that there was some choking going on in the last OZ semifinal. :eek: :)

harloo
Mar 4th, 2003, 06:57 PM
I watched the match from beginning to end, and thought that Kim was in control of the match but AI wouldn't go away for anything. Kim was in control, but AI's resistance and will not to give up won her the match. If this was someone else like Natalie Dechy, Elena, or Myskina, they would of melted under the pressure, but AI just took it to Kim in the final set and it shocked Kim because only the top 5 players do that.

IMO, Kim was waiting for AI to start making alot of mistakes and errors and it didn't happen at all. The Asian wonder held her ground, and took the trophy. I think it was more of AI winning it, than Kim losing it by choking.

Halardfan
Mar 4th, 2003, 09:31 PM
Harloo's take on this seems pretty accurate. :)

Ai is tops in my book. :)

CJ07
Mar 4th, 2003, 11:42 PM
Clijsters served for the match, was up 4-2 and was up in 90% of the games in the third set.

Choked maybe, but Ai did play well.