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View Full Version : Is Kournikova becoming irrelevant?


Volcana
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:16 PM
How about to hardcore tennis fans?

There was a thread around recently. Kournikova out of Top 50 (http://www.wtaworld.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=56645)

I noticed something odd about it right away, but waited to comment. Now seems appropriate, since a few days have gone by. This was a poll-thread about Anna Kounikova. In two days, it generated 18 responses and 51 votes. Three years ago, a two day old poll about Kournikova would have had hundreds of response and votes in that time period. My guess is that Anna's appeal among the ticket buying public is as high as never. Well, probably a little down, but I've no doubt she in the top five players on the tour in worldwide popularity.

I'm not talking about everybody. I'm talking posters from here. Anna just doesn't generate the frenzy she used to. Not many people aren keen to discuss her TENNIS anymore. I doubt that effects her reality much, since I'm sure she's still mobbed wherever she goes. But maybe she's stopped counting as a player. Used to be analysts would mention Kournikova having the game to win big if she got her head together. Now we don't hear her favored to win even Tier III's and IV's.

Has tennis given up on Anna?

tennisIlove09
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:18 PM
Tennis may be giving up on her, but the male population will never :)

ys
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:24 PM
Has tennis given up on Anna?


The less hype the better..

persond
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:26 PM
:D :D And, add to that, vile old men and what've you got...??? :drool::drool::drool::drool:

An Anna Kournikova "love fest"---absolutely nothing to do with tennis, from a "purist" point of view.!!!!:p :p :p :p

Uxobi
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:28 PM
A lot of fans have been turned off by Anna's poor performances on the court. To many, she is a walking tennis joke. As a media call girl, she is still in business....she will continue to be used as long as she remains on the tour.

sartrista7
Feb 14th, 2003, 08:32 PM
I used to be a Kournikova defender (though only a mild supporter) - there used to be so much crap about how bad she was at tennis, how she couldn't even win a tournament etc., that her actual talent and potential was overlooked. But she seems to care less and less on court about winning: those matches against Justine and Angelique were awful, especially at a Slam, but the worst thing wasn't that she missed every second shot - it was that she plainly did not care. And right now, I can't say I care much about her either. It'd be nice if she won a title, cos lots of people would be quite embarrassed, but she's ultimately a non-factor.

Simplify
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:07 PM
Don't give up, Anna! Keep working and believing!:)
It'd be nice if she won a title, cos lots of people would be quite embarrassed, but she's ultimately a non-factor.
Who would be embarrassed?

sartrista7
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:22 PM
Originally posted by Simplify
Who would be embarrassed?

The Kournikova haters ;)

auntie janie
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:23 PM
Volcana, I noticed the same fall-off in poster interest as you did. Last week I started a topic about Anna's surprising (to me) decline in doubles, wondering about it, and it got VERY few replies. No one really cared, I guess.

On the tennis court, imo, Anna has been irrelevant for years now, in the sense that no one (least of all, the players themselves) expects her to do any damage in a draw of top players, as they may have anticipated 5 years ago.

But I guess the fall-off in poster interest is natural, as the player in question has not given anyone much room for hope of a return to contender-status in years. And Hope is a really important component of being a sports fan.

Leena
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:33 PM
I think the hardcore tennis fans stopped caring about her around 2001 when it became noticeable that she was not putting in the effort to be a player. The tennis fans shouldn't care if she doesn't. I wish she'd make a decision to either stick fully with tennis, or fully do modeling or whatever the hell she does.

RAA
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:34 PM
I agree with Janie
from a tennis perspective, it is "what have you done for me lately?". THe players don't see her as a threat, I don't think. I don't think many worry about drawing her early in a slam, for instance. She doesn't go that deep in tournies anymore. Male interest will always be high, but with few solid tennis results, there becomes less and less to actually DISCUSS about here. I mean, the most posts we got recently were on whether/how she was being promoted in Memphis. her Marketing elicited lots of comments...
her tennis however,
well, there is not much to be said about it right now..

Mrs. Peel
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:39 PM
Originally posted by sartrista7
The Kournikova haters ;)


Kournikova haters have had their folly for years now...and Anna's own actions on the court has added fuel to the fire....it has been soooooo long, I think if she won a title, her detractors would breathe a sigh of relief:p After all the hype, the attention and her tennis achievements...will much change?

*JR*
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:44 PM
Believe it or not, I wish she'd win SOME event like a Tier IV or V, just 2C how she'd play after that with "the monkey off her back".

Leena
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:49 PM
I still think Anna can win an event, even with the low effort she's playing with now. She's never entered the Tier IV or V's, except for Shanghai last year where she almost won. She's rumored to play Pattaya this year... so maybe she'll play some dinky tourneys. She can win one just with her raw talent.

irma
Feb 14th, 2003, 09:53 PM
anna is not interesting anymore

there is another player who likes to hang around famous people and the big difference is well you know;)

*JR*
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:01 PM
Irma, if you mean Marti, I hope she lives a year like the teenager she never got 2B, and is only a "public person" in relation to the Tacchini thing (if they don't settle).

irma
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:06 PM
no I don't mean marti.

I mean the number 1 in the world;)

TatiAnnah°lic
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:07 PM
I hope she soon becomes irrelevant so i can stop reading this kind of threads bashing Anna :rolleyes:

Leena
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:15 PM
Nobody is really bashing Anna here... just people talking about how she's sunk in the rankings.

~ The Leopard ~
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:37 PM
*Sigh*, she does seem irrelevant as a force in tennis right now. :(
I'm one of her biggest fans, but it's hard to keep the faith when she has these terrible mental meltdowns...on top of the constant injuries.

Still, I hope she hangs in there. She is still an exciting player to watch, with an aggressive game. As rd said, it'd be good to see how she would play without the monkey on her back.

Two things in her defence. First, I have no idea how people can infer that she doesn't care when she is playing badly. I watched most of her matches at the Oz Open, some on TV but others live. It's obvious to me that the problem is, in part, that she cares too much and feels terrible pressure. She was almost in tears when playing Henin.

Second, I also have no idea how people draw the inference that she does not work hard. Maybe she should work *smarter*, such as by hiring a sports psychologist to help her with her mental weakness. But all reports from insiders, such as other players, are that she is one of the hardest working players on the tour in terms of the time and effort she puts into practice. How people jump to any other conclusion is totally beyond me.

Anyway, I still hope that she can get over some of these problems and have a good year.

Volcana
Feb 14th, 2003, 10:40 PM
AKFan#1 - I challenge you to go back to my post that started this thread, and find even one bash of Anna. In fact, the thread isn't even ABOUT Anna, but rather about other people's reactions to her, and how that's changed.

Or is your definition of bash, 'failure to worship'?

decemberlove
Feb 14th, 2003, 11:37 PM
maybe people are just tired of saying the same shit over and over again. one can only recycle a statement so many times.

there's not much to say about her tennis considering she's only played a few matches the last couple months.

matthias
Feb 14th, 2003, 11:51 PM
becoming? for me she was always irrelevant

Gowza
Feb 14th, 2003, 11:57 PM
some people have always thought she was irrelevant, for some people they have lost faith in her and she has become irrelevant while others no longer talk about her as much because they want her to have a lower profile and les hype so she can get her career on track while people like me still follow her results but don't particularly have any expectations on her until she starts playing more lower tier tournaments rather than getting wildcards into the higher tier tournaments.

Bezz
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:05 AM
I dont think she has always been irrelvant, for the last few year since her injury nobody has really been scared of playing her-athough sometimes the low ranked players just seem a bit intimidated becuase it is Kournikova rather than her game. Its tough to say how she is gonna fair this year, she hasnt played alot. Her loss to Henin showed for now at least she is not a threat to anyone inside the top 10.

Gowza
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:06 AM
but yes i think more people think she is irrelevant.

i think that while she was in the top 50 people thought in the back of their minds that she was a decent player even if they wouldn't admit it to the public. i'm pretty sure that she turned some heads when she reached #8 in the world and some people believed she could be good.

most of her popularity tho, comes from her beauty but it is that as well as being an established player that made her so popular with the media and why she does all this modelling.

i think if she had never reached the top 50 or especially if she hadn't reached that wimbledon semis then she wouldn't hav so much attention for her beauty she would just be ALMOST a forgotten player.

look at players like harkleraod and hantuchova. at first everyone looked at harkleroad as a sex symbol but it has stopped and she is ranked just inside the top 100, i think if she gets in the top 50 this will pick up again.

hantuchova wasn't a sex symbol until her breakthrough year last her and now she is doing quite a lot of modelling.

the same with babsi schett, when she was at the top she did a lot of modelling and now she doesn't do as much.

it starts with hype, that their is a young beauty on the rise. if they don't have a very quick passage into the top 50 then that will die down but when they get up in that area the sponsors and the popularity comes back. when they drop in rankings everything else drops.

so ot isn't just to do with beauty IMO, i believe is a combination of rank, performance and beauty.

calabar
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:13 AM
What do you mean "becoming" irrevalent? She HAS been for some time now.

VSFan1 aka Joshua L.
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:17 AM
Unfortunately, she has become irrevelant.

I say that because despite what you love/hate about her, she brings notice to tennis and that is what tennis needs. She may be overhyped or overhated, but those types of comments are what gives us more fans and thus more tennis on tv, and thus a more interesting tour. :)

Weevee
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:46 AM
Most posters are fans of tennis

Yak
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:02 AM
We don't have anything to say about her anymore because she is injured 3/4 of the time. The moment that I still believe ruined her career is when she injured her thumb during a win against Graf at Eastbourne 1998 in the 1/4 finals! I'm pretty sure after that win, she would have won the tournament. Since that injury, there has been up and downs but a lot more downs!

I still have faith in her! Look at Tauziat! She got her break throught when she was 29-30 and reached her career high ranking of number 3 at 32! I'm pretty sure that when Anna gets older(gets more mature about her tennis), that she'll be a top player! I always had that in the back of my mind that she would be a late-bloomer!

Go Anna! I still believe in you!

selesfan
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:03 AM
I could care less about Anna, I don't hate her but I am a tennis fan and her game or lack of one doesn't interest me at all.

CoryAnnAvants#1
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:07 AM
Kournikova will be irrelevant in terms of winning tournaments and challenging top 10. But she will never be irrelevant in terms of ticket sales. I will run across Arthur Ashe Stadium nude if a tournament ever denies Anna a Main Draw WC and makes her play qualies. And when she does play at a tournament, especially a GS, she HAS to be put on a stadium court for security reasons. She can't be put on a court appropriate to her ranking. Can you imagine the madhouse that would ensue if she were to play on of those rinky dink outside courts with three rows of bleachers on each side?:eek: Because she's on the stadium court, she gets the attention, a low ranked player gets her day in the spotlight, the newspaper say "Stick to modeling," she gets hounded with questions about her commitment, etc. A few of my friends who don't really follow tennis were having a convo about Anna a couple of weeks ago, and it went something like this.

-OMG she has a such nice body
-Yeah but she can't play. She's just not a good player.
-Dude who cares? She's hot!

As long as Anna knows how to bend over to return serve, she'll do just fine for the rest of her life.

auntie janie
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:17 AM
Interestingly, I think this no-title business matters FAR more to the media than it would to the other players.

Let's face it; top players don't care who can win a Sopot or a Shanghai. What they do notice is, who can sometimes beat THEM. Lina Kras's win over Monica Seles this week makes her more relevant to the game than if she had won some Tier 4 title somewhere. And that win also makes her more relevant on today's Tour than Anna is right now, despite her lower ranking.

Anna might win one of these minor events this year and get her first title. But it won't matter, because her last wins over top-5 and even top-10 players are becoming distant memories. Until she upsets one of the top girls, she is not really part of their world, no matter how often she claims that she is.

But because she is always in the news, Anna will retain her role as a kind of side part of the tennis message-board discussion, like, forever.

disposablehero
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:22 AM
Anna is in an unusual spot now. Less hype, less fame, and less expectations on her game could be good for her and give her a chance to right herself. However, she is so used to huge exposure and huge endorsement money that I worry she might abandon tennis for acting or modelling if that exposure dries up. She seems a bit too comfortable in the jet-set scene to settle for "that player who used to have all the fuss over her". It will be interesting to see how the evolution of Anna plays out from here.

FP
Feb 15th, 2003, 05:39 AM
unfortunately yes and long time ago :(

vogus
Feb 15th, 2003, 07:28 AM
Until the thumb injury in 1998, Kournikova was unquestionably playing like someone who was going to stake out a place in the Top 5. She was kicking everyone's butt and almost everyone was scared of playing her. Then, from '98 to the Aussy Open '01, she wasn't Top 5 stuff anymore, but she was still a really solid, competetive Top 15 player, even though all that talk about no title was already going. It's only in the last two years that her tennis has gone to hell - because she started to believe all those assholes who said she's not a good player.

I think in a way Kournikova's managers liked that she didn't win a title, because it let her stay bigger than tennis, and thus mass-marketable to the general commercial culture. But now it's gone too far - nobody in tennis respects her any more and that is going to spread to the endorsement part of it too. Yeah, she can go and make B-grade movies instead of tennis, but would that make her any more relevant than what she is now: basically the unofficial WTA mascot.

vogus
Feb 15th, 2003, 07:30 AM
oh and another thing - Anna K doesn't even make my Top 10 list of the hottest-looking chicks on the Tour any more.

diggerariel
Feb 15th, 2003, 12:44 PM
I will always root for Anna to go as far as possible in every single tournament she plays for the rest of her life :drool: ..... well, unless she plays Lindsay. :worship:

ajayares
Feb 15th, 2003, 02:09 PM
Originally posted by Leena
I think the hardcore tennis fans stopped caring about her around 2001 when it became noticeable that she was not putting in the effort to be a player. The tennis fans shouldn't care if she doesn't. I wish she'd make a decision to either stick fully with tennis, or fully do modeling or whatever the hell she does.

Well just another one of the intelligent posters who we have on this message board :rolleyes:
She had her highest ranking in 2001 and had an injury that kept her off the court for the best part of 7 mths, but it was noticeable that she wasn't putting in the effort.

Yeah, that's what happened and you wonder why Annafans (real ones) don't comment on the stupid polls created and the equally stupid threads too.

doloresc
Feb 15th, 2003, 05:10 PM
"becoming" is the operative word. kournikova still has cachet insofar as being a recognizable name in the tennis world but her popularity in my opinion is on the wane. with players not as naturally gifted as anna winning singles titles (dechy and tanasugarn come to mind) it shines an even more negative light on kournikova's title deficiency. in fairness to anna she isn't the first phenom from any sport who more or less "flopped" when turning pro.

juggler
Feb 16th, 2003, 03:50 AM
its very hard to do anything of note when u play just 3 matches in 5 and a half months.

i just wonder where she would be now had she not had a serious injury in february 2001.

if she had played a consitent schedule since then, where do u think her ranking would be?

GBFH
Feb 16th, 2003, 04:05 AM
Without that devastating injury in 2001, I think she'd be in the top 15...not top 10.

I just want her to stay healthy for six months...I don't really care about her ranking since no tournament director would ever refuse her a wildcard.

I think Anna's been on a slow, and painful decline since 1998. After the 2001 season, however, she's been a shell of her former self. Get well soon, Anna.

Sophie
Feb 25th, 2003, 11:14 PM
ESPN is doing a poll on the "hottest" female athlete. Serena and Daniela are on the list, Kournikova is not.

The media may have decided she is irrelevant.

I wonder what her future holds?

▀coene
Feb 25th, 2003, 11:23 PM
Come back on the tennis court Anna Kournikova, I miss you. :sad:

Jennifer's wife
Feb 26th, 2003, 12:24 AM
Poor Anna! She's not beautiful enuff to be a supermodel and she's not good enuf to be a super tennis player. she's just stuck in the middle *breaking into song!*:D :D :p

monicain
Feb 27th, 2003, 09:54 AM
The media may have decided she is irrelevant.


I wish they really did so.

ajayares
Feb 27th, 2003, 10:49 AM
Originally posted by Sophie
ESPN is doing a poll on the "hottest" female athlete. Serena and Daniela are on the list, Kournikova is not.

The media may have decided she is irrelevant.

I wonder what her future holds?

Wow she isn't on a poll :rolleyes:

BTW perhaps next time before thinking the media think she is irrelevant, why don't you learn to read the details about the poll, not that I give a toss bag if she is, or isn't on it.

leslie
Mar 1st, 2003, 10:02 PM
She is irrelevant.

AndySW6
Mar 1st, 2003, 10:05 PM
it seems that by the length of this discussion that she is not irrelevant.

She is a good player, very beautiful and at the end of the day in huge demand.

I think she can play much better than she does at present.

I wish her all the luck in the world.

*JR*
Mar 2nd, 2003, 05:19 PM
Perhaps you Anna fans should look @ the "lineup" of avatar pics in User Control Panel. Some are on-court pics, some are off-court in warmup suits. Some are in non-athletic outfits, inc. Jen in a bra. Only 1 of the (now 24) is @ all like a pin-up photo. Guess who? While there is nothing offensive about the pic, you tell me if Anna is portrayed as one known for being a professional athlete! There's a famous line from the comic strip Pogo: "We have met the enemy and he is us". Well, Anna fans, among "enemies" of her being considered relevant as a pro athlete is every single one of you who dosen't tell the operators of this board to @ least offer an avatar that bears some relevance to that Anna quotation I've seen so much: the one that emphasizes her saying "...tennis is my life".