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dsanders06
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:10 PM
Try to keep this thread as untrollish as possible so that the winning side can bump it and gloat at the end of the season :bigwave:

dsanders06
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:10 PM
I predict Maria will win their 2013 H2H 5-2 :oh: (which would give her the edge in their Career H2H)

iWill
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:15 PM
I'm not willing to put a certain number BUT I will say that Azarenka will lead the H2H in Finals.

madmax
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:19 PM
Maria will win all the final matches against Vuvurenka next season.
Redemption will be very sweet:cheer:

moodin0931
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:28 PM
Azarenka 5-1

sweetadri06
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:37 PM
Vika? Just because there are more hardcourts tournaments than clay, where maria has the edge.

Exordes
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:49 PM
If they have matches in Australian Open and US Open, Vika will beat Maria in 2013 as she did in 2012. It´s a pity that in the Olympics Vika´s opponent in the semifinals wasn´t either Sharapova or Kirilenko. Then we could have seen which one is better on grass.

Both of them will be top seeded players in the beginning of the season, and it requires that both of them will go deep on tournaments that will be any head to head games in the first place. If Maria Sharapova plays with a similar success as Petra Kvitova or Caroline Wozniacki did in 2012, then she won´t have many matches against Azarenka. But as in December 2012, it seems likely that the Unholy Trinity Vika-Maria-Serena will dominate the next season as well.

dsanders06
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:54 PM
I'm not willing to put a certain number BUT I will say that Azarenka will lead the H2H in Finals.

I actually think it'll be the opposite to 2012 in that respect: I think Maria will win their biggest matches, and Vika will pick up a couple of the less important ones. I'm not going to pretend it's anything more than a gut instinct though.

iWill
Dec 12th, 2012, 10:58 PM
I actually think it'll be the opposite to 2012 in that respect: I think Maria will win their biggest matches, and Vika will pick up a couple of the less important ones. I'm not going to pretend it's anything more than a gut instinct though.

I felt the opposite and mostly because of their YEC SF match. I think Maria is always tough to beat but (trying to throw no shade here) how often have you seen Sharapova throw up a bagel or breadstick in a final? Compared to Azarenka anyway...you could be totally right though lol!

Six Feet Under
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:28 PM
Azarenka 4-2

In The Zone
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:33 PM
Just screams inferiority complex.

Layabout
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:38 PM
Vika to lead the H2H 5-1

Stonerpova
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:43 PM
Pretty even I think. Azarenka will be favored in the matches on slower hard courts, Sharapova will most likely win on clay, and USOS/US Open matches are a crapshoot.

Uranus
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:45 PM
Maria to win the H2H imo.

Kuzzy24
Dec 12th, 2012, 11:58 PM
Maria to lead like 3-2

Manitou
Dec 13th, 2012, 12:04 AM
Try to keep this thread as untrollish as possible so that the winning side can bump it and gloat at the end of the season :bigwave:

I hope for a major power shift to happen in 2013, so the direct match-up between Maria and Vika will not be as important anymore. That's my humble hope...

As to the reality, I think Azarenka is generally stronger physically and technically, but is much, much weaker mentally. And that is impossible to predict. A win in AO may boost Azarenka for the whole year, while her unexpected early loss may put her down for a long time.



--

blistering
Dec 13th, 2012, 01:25 AM
Well, this is a tricky one. I would like them to meet as much, or ideally even more, than they did in 2012 because their matches have this epic feeling about them all the time. I guess I'm in the minority that is fairly certain that quick courts actually favor Azarenka in this match-up (see the Beijing beatdown). So if they meet at Wimbledon and Maria is in claypova mode I would, indeed, expect a thrashing.

On quicker surfaces Azarenka's pace redirection will expose Maria's limited movement even more as she'll need to reach those balls quicker. Also, the court wouldn't take as much pace away from Maria's shots, allowing underpowered Azarenka to make the most of it.

Slower surfaces are where Maria is at her most dangerous nowadays, particularly on her forehand side. She just has much more time to load up on the shots, as she's the heaviest hitter on tour at the moment, alongside Serena. Though I do have to say that from the USO onwards there was visible progress in Sharapova hitting earlier on the forehand side without losing pace (probably from the training on grass), which hopefully further improves next year as she still is a power player.

Anywho, regarding the topic, I think they'll end up even at 4-4 or 5-4 for one of them. I'm not sure they'll be meeting on clay as Azarenka may not get that far (still pissed off Maria didn't face her in the finals of RG. That would've been a thing of beauty).

ServeCaspian
Dec 13th, 2012, 01:28 AM
Maria. :scratch:
But it will be close either way.

Angelpova
Dec 13th, 2012, 01:58 AM
Maria 4-1

dsanders06
Dec 13th, 2012, 02:07 AM
I hope for a major power shift to happen in 2013, so the direct match-up between Maria and Vika will not be as important anymore. That's my humble hope...

As to the reality, I think Azarenka is generally stronger physically and technically, but is much, much weaker mentally. And that is impossible to predict. A win in AO may boost Azarenka for the whole year, while her unexpected early loss may put her down for a long time.

Honestly, I think mental strength is one area where Vika (uncharacteristically) had an edge on Maria in 2012 - that certainly accounted for the result of their US Open match at any rate.

Well, this is a tricky one. I would like them to meet as much, or ideally even more, than they did in 2012 because their matches have this epic feeling about them all the time. I guess I'm in the minority that is fairly certain that quick courts actually favor Azarenka in this match-up (see the Beijing beatdown). So if they meet at Wimbledon and Maria is in claypova mode I would, indeed, expect a thrashing.

On quicker surfaces Azarenka's pace redirection will expose Maria's limited movement even more as she'll need to reach those balls quicker. Also, the court wouldn't take as much pace away from Maria's shots, allowing underpowered Azarenka to make the most of it.

I do agree that in terms of hardcourts, quicker ones favour Vika in this match-up (even though Vika generally is better on slower ones), and so Vika would probably beat Maria on a quick hardcourt (the very few genuinely quick HCs that are left - Stanford, Cincinnati, Beijing, Tokyo etc.) -- but I'm not sure I'd extend this to grass. Vika's footwork and defence is nowhere near as good on grass as it is on hardcourts, and without stellar footwork she becomes less consistent, and without that she's without her main weapon in this match-up. Plus, Maria's serve would get more cheap points / Vika's return would be neutralised a bit.

Also, just to play devil's advocate :devil: , although clay probably favours Maria, I'm not convinced that it's TOTALLY nid. Imo people are reading too much into Azarenka's weak performance at RG this year, she did actually play reasonably well at her other two claycourt tournaments this year and I think she will have decent results on it in her career. Even though clay will probably always be the one where Maria matches up best against Vika, I wouldn't necessarily expect Stuttgart-style matches in all their clay matches.

For me, the most encouraging thing about their YEC match was that Maria managed to win even though she wasn't outstanding, she just played tactically the right way. I was getting a little bit worried that she/her coach hadn't actually figured out how to play her at all, and that the Stuttgart and first set of the US Open match were just because Maria was on fire and that she wasn't actually consciously aware of what she was doing -- but the fact that in the YEC match, she wasn't striking the ball as well as she can, yet still won comfortably because she actually had a good gameplan, does give me some hope that they have figured her out since Stuttgart (and that their Beijing match was hopefully a blip).

madmax
Dec 13th, 2012, 02:50 AM
I hope for a major power shift to happen in 2013, so the direct match-up between Maria and Vika will not be as important anymore. That's my humble hope...

As to the reality, I think Azarenka is generally stronger physically and technically, but is much, much weaker mentally. And that is impossible to predict. A win in AO may boost Azarenka for the whole year, while her unexpected early loss may put her down for a long time.



--

LMAO:spit:

Letigre
Dec 13th, 2012, 08:13 AM
I think it will be pretty much like this year, with Azarenka winning most of their matches as she is the better, fitter
stronger and more resourceful player. Unlike María, she has a plan B in her game if things doesn´t work for her (USO semis) while Sharapova only tries to hit harder and harder. Like this year, I am afraid she will only loose to Maria on a bad day.

fluffyelloballz
Dec 13th, 2012, 08:16 AM
Vika 6-3

Yashal
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:48 AM
3-3.

Valanga
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:54 AM
Azarenka 4-2(-ish or 3-1)

Miss Atomic Bomb
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:57 AM
Depends on which Vika shows up.

Its hard to predict which way Vika will go after her first major season, could've a Kvitova like season for all we know. If she continues playing like she did at the majors this year, she should increase their H2H gap.

doomsday
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:59 AM
I think it will be pretty much like this year, with Azarenka winning most of their matches as she is the better, fitter
stronger and more resourceful player. Unlike María, she has a plan B in her game if things doesn´t work for her (USO semis) while Sharapova only tries to hit harder and harder. Like this year, I am afraid she will only loose to Maria on a bad day.

We said trolls to the left :wavey:


Sent from my iPhone using Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

bandabou
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:00 AM
Depends how often they meet on clay/hc's..Hc's it seems Maria's figuring that part out, so it should make for fun rivalry.

Beat
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:26 AM
azarenka keeping up her beatdowns.

Cosmic Voices
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:40 AM
Vika is actually a decent player on clay, I mean she pushed Na extremely in their RG match in the year Na was flourishing on clay :shrug:

Anyway in 2013 I predict:

V - M

Slow HC
2 - 0

Grass
0 - 1

Clay
0- 2

Indoor
0-1

Fast HC
1-1

so thats 3-5 in Maria's favour.
ofc indoor can be combined with any surface so take that into account

i would find it hilarious if they met like once next year after so many final meetings in 2012

C. Drone
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:58 AM
They wont meet at all.

doomsday
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:11 AM
They wont meet at all.

Serena will do her very best to interfere :lol: as the N3 seed it's very likely though.
She will snatch both of them.

Miss Atomic Bomb
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:13 AM
Serena will do her very best to interfere :lol: as the N3 seed it's very likely though.
She will snatch both of them.

She won't be the N3 seed for too long. Afterwards Australia, they will have plenty of opportunities to play eachother in the semis.

Smitten
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:37 AM
What does it matter? Azarenka will be a non-entity in 2013. She has no staying power with that useless game.

Exordes
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:46 AM
I´ve got good memories about these Premier Mandatory tournaments.

Indian Wells Final 2012:
ttpiVC8NpyI

Beijing Final 2012:
sqp4eLVbK1E

I would say that Vika would be a favourite against Maria in Australian Open, Indian Wells, US Open and Beijing if they meet again in 2013. But who know if they have that many head to head games next year.

StoneRose
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:50 AM
^^Sweet moments.
2013 Vika-Maria 4-1.

Setsuna.
Dec 13th, 2012, 01:44 PM
Vika. She is the better player now.

HRHoliviasmith
Dec 13th, 2012, 01:52 PM
I´ve got good memories about these Premier Mandatory tournaments.

Indian Wells Final 2012:
ttpiVC8NpyI

Beijing Final 2012:
sqp4eLVbK1E

I would say that Vika would be a favourite against Maria in Australian Open, Indian Wells, US Open and Beijing if they meet again in 2013. But who know if they have that many head to head games next year.

http://ic.pics.livejournal.com/_infernox_/6052054/24799/24799_original.gif

The Dawntreader
Dec 13th, 2012, 02:12 PM
Azarenka.

mauresmofan
Dec 13th, 2012, 02:22 PM
Oh please no more they sound like 2 crows fighting over a bag of crisps.

http://farm7.staticflickr.com/6145/5938473751_ba5c8ef705_z.jpg

Leon Daniel
Dec 13th, 2012, 02:43 PM
They will meet 5 times. Sharapova will win 4.

young_gunner913
Dec 13th, 2012, 03:55 PM
Just screams inferiority complex.

It really does. :rolls:

bandabou
Dec 13th, 2012, 04:31 PM
I do agree that by creating this thread..Mashafans have shown that they worry more about Maria facing Vika that they were willing to admit. Interesting.

HRHoliviasmith
Dec 13th, 2012, 04:46 PM
I do agree that by creating this thread..Mashafans have shown that they worry more about Maria facing Vika that they were willing to admit. Interesting.

it didn't take this thread to figue that out tbh. :lol:

NashaMasha
Dec 13th, 2012, 04:51 PM
Vika. She is the better player now.

sure sure , but she will be extremely injured at least 3 times next year , of course during her matches against Masha which she will lose:)

It think it will be 3-3 or 3-2 in Masha's favour , Vika will still win some matches vs Crapova/Doublefaultpova and will lose to Goatpova and Claypova

Vincey!
Dec 13th, 2012, 04:58 PM
I think it depends of the number of time they'd face eachothers but I'd give a slight advantage to Sharapova, something like 2-1 or 3-2 if they play more often than that then I'd go with Sharapova with a bigger margin. Sharapova is having the edge on Vika more and more now...She won it on clay and on indoor court. She managed to make tight matches on hard court too. This will give her confidence to continue on proper hard court next season.

dragonflies
Dec 13th, 2012, 05:40 PM
They wont meet at all.


Going to the AO, Serena will have a lead of 1,000+ points over Azarenka and almost 1,000 points over Sharapova in safe points. The later 2 also have lots of points to defend in the first half of the season, so if Serena plays a normal schedule, she is likely to be ranked ahead of both of them till Wimbledon. That means Aza and Maria could meet in the SF, instead of only in the finals.

StoneRose
Dec 13th, 2012, 05:58 PM
I do agree that by creating this thread..Mashafans have shown that they worry more about Maria facing Vika that they were willing to admit. Interesting.

it didn't take this thread to figue that out tbh. :lol:This. Vika fans have no need to start a thread like this, we know already, our only problem is Serena. Just as a reminder and note that Exordes left out the not unimportant AO 2012:

I´ve got good memories about these Premier Mandatory tournaments.

Indian Wells Final 2012:
ttpiVC8NpyI

Beijing Final 2012:
sqp4eLVbK1E

I would say that Vika would be a favourite against Maria in Australian Open, Indian Wells, US Open and Beijing if they meet again in 2013. But who know if they have that many head to head games next year.

MashaFan01
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:36 PM
It all depends on Masha's serve - If she's able to serve better than in their 2012 meetings (which I hope she does) then she'll defeat Azarenka in their 2013 meetings more often then not

Lucyxx
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:38 PM
It won't be easy, but Vika needs to rethink her game. She needs to be a little more aggressive from the baseline, but even then Masha is real powerful. Perhaps a few more droppers to keep Maria honest.

Masha 3-2.

Both in great shape so should meet each other at least 10 more times throughout their respective careers.

They both play every point so tough that it's hard to see either blowing away a H2H 3-0 or something.

Craig.
Dec 13th, 2012, 09:50 PM
This. Vika fans have no need to start a thread like this, we know already, our only problem is Serena. Just as a reminder and note that Exordes left out the not unimportant AO 2012:

You go on and on about Maria fans being "pressed" when it comes to Vika and then you go on and post shit like this. Give me a break.

StoneRose
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:41 PM
You go on and on about Maria fans being "pressed" when it comes to Vika and then you go on and post shit like this. Give me a break.Some of them are, you have to be blind not to see that :confused:. We all know who they are too. And they're not only pressed about Vika, about Serena, sometimes Aga too. Pick some random threads here preferably with the name Serena or Vika in it and you can enjoy them all.

18majors
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:43 PM
Maria won't lose to Vika again.

Stonerpova
Dec 13th, 2012, 10:58 PM
Maria won't lose to Vika again.

Let's not go overboard :lol:

hurricanejeanne
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:15 PM
It'll be close. Like a 4-3 edge. However I'm not sure who would pull out the winning record. Based on their overall head-to-head, I'd give the nod to Vika but you cannot count Maria out. But it's certainly nice that we have a rivalry again.

dsanders06
Dec 13th, 2012, 11:17 PM
It really does. :rolls:

I do agree that by creating this thread..Mashafans have shown that they worry more about Maria facing Vika that they were willing to admit. Interesting.

it didn't take this thread to figue that out tbh. :lol:

Orrr, maybe, just maybe, the thread was created because I genuinely want to discuss the most interesting rivalry on the WTA right now. Or are you guys seeing what you want to see again like in the "where does Serena go from here", where you genuinely all believed that I'd written Serena was washed-up and that the thread was an "epic fail" even though nothing I wrote in it was disproven :happy:

Kindly don't post in this thread again unless you have something to contribute other than lame GIFs and/or failed attempts at burns.

This. Vika fans have no need to start a thread like this, we know already, our only problem is Serena. Just as a reminder and note that Exordes left out the not unimportant AO 2012:

You're generally not one to exaggerate for the sake of trash-talking (from what I've seen of you), so I can only think you must genuinely believe that Maria is no threat to Vika. But I just don't understand HOW you could think that. :lol: Their last 4 matches, Maria won 2 comfortably, while Vika won 1 comfortably and 1 in an epic 3-setter. Maria won 5 of the last 9 sets. There's nothing whatsoever to suggest that Vika is guaranteed to give her beatdown after beatdown in 2013 :spit:

(and to be clear: I'm not saying Vika definitely won't dominate Maria, I'm just saying there's no grounds to claim it's NID and that EITHER player is no threat to the other).

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 12:57 AM
You're generally not one to exaggerate for the sake of trash-talking (from what I've seen of you), so I can only think you must genuinely believe that Maria is no threat to Vika. But I just don't understand HOW you could think that. :lol: Their last 4 matches, Maria won 2 comfortably, while Vika won 1 comfortably and 1 in an epic 3-setter. Maria won 5 of the last 9 sets. There's nothing whatsoever to suggest that Vika is guaranteed to give her beatdown after beatdown in 2013 :spit:

(and to be clear: I'm not saying Vika definitely won't dominate Maria, I'm just saying there's no grounds to claim it's NID and that EITHER player is no threat to the other).I exaggerated a bit because it's downright impossible to answer intelligently to the dumb arguments some Masha fans bring to the table.

But yes, i certainly believe Vika will have the edge. There were 6 matches this year and Vika won the first 2 with very convincing scorelines. It got closer thereafter, Maria was much too strong in Stuttgart. Maybe Vika underestimated her there but based on that encounter alone i'd give Maria the edge on that surface. USO was close too, then again Vika was considerably stronger second and third set. Maria just couldn't hit through Vika anymore. YEC Vika was clearly very tired, imo she shouldn't have played Linz with such an important tournament coming up but i got the impression she was already happy to clinch #1 there. Underestimation and fatigue can be no excuses of course and there are undoubtedly excuses to be made for Maria as well on some of these occasions.

Apart from the numbers, 4-2 this year, it's the way their matches on HC go. I don't think Maria can keep up with the pace Vika put's in these rallies for 2 sets. Of course Maria has more power and can hit winners (and also errors) more easily than Vika but she needs some time to do that, on form Vika isn't giving her that time on HC. And HC's where most of the tournaments are played. Grass, i don't know. I thought Vika played a slightly better grass season than Maria but they didn't meet so it's unclear for now.

I'm surprised myself you give Masha the edge 5-2. She would have to be playing a lot better or Vika a lot worse in their H2H than this year for that to happen.

Matt01
Dec 14th, 2012, 01:07 AM
Maria won't lose to Vika again.


Yeah, because Maria won't even make it far enough to even meet Vika. :wavey:

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 01:28 AM
Yeah, because Maria won't even make it far enough to even meet Vika. :wavey::lol:. I think she will actually. I certainly see them meeting some 6 times again next year.

Stonerpova
Dec 14th, 2012, 01:34 AM
:lol:. I think she will actually. I certainly see them meeting some 6 times again next year.

Same here. I mean they met 6 times this year, and that's without them playing any US Open Series tourneys. They could meet up to 8 times next season if they maintain consistency and Serena doesn't destroy them repeatedly.

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 01:40 AM
Same here. I mean they met 6 times this year, and that's without them playing any US Open Series tourneys. They could meet up to 8 times next season if they maintain consistency and Serena doesn't destroy them repeatedly.No meetings on grass and only one on gravel as well.

JarkaFish
Dec 14th, 2012, 02:14 AM
Vika's going to lead it once again.

I don't doubt it for a second.

it-girl
Dec 14th, 2012, 02:32 AM
Depends on which Vika shows up.

Its hard to predict which way Vika will go after her first major season, could've a Kvitova like season for all we know. If she continues playing like she did at the majors this year, she should increase their H2H gap.This.

Craig.
Dec 14th, 2012, 02:37 AM
Some of them are, you have to be blind not to see that :confused:. We all know who they are too. And they're not only pressed about Vika, about Serena, sometimes Aga too. Pick some random threads here preferably with the name Serena or Vika in it and you can enjoy them all.

I'm not disagreeing with that, trust me. But saying that Maria is no threat to Vika is reaching.

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 03:01 AM
I'm not disagreeing with that, trust me. But saying that Maria is no threat to Vika is reaching.I exaggerated slightly. But i believe Vika will stay on top in their H2H for the reasons i stated in reply to dsanders a few posts ago.

doomsday
Dec 14th, 2012, 06:03 AM
I exaggerated a bit because it's downright impossible to answer intelligently to the dumb arguments some Masha fans bring to the table.

But yes, i certainly believe Vika will have the edge. There were 6 matches this year and Vika won the first 2 with very convincing scorelines. It got closer thereafter, Maria was much too strong in Stuttgart. Maybe Vika underestimated her there but based on that encounter alone i'd give Maria the edge on that surface. USO was close too, then again Vika was considerably stronger second and third set. Maria just couldn't hit through Vika anymore. YEC Vika was clearly very tired, imo she shouldn't have played Linz with such an important tournament coming up but i got the impression she was already happy to clinch #1 there. Underestimation and fatigue can be no excuses of course and there are undoubtedly excuses to be made for Maria as well on some of these occasions.

Apart from the numbers, 4-2 this year, it's the way their matches on HC go. I don't think Maria can keep up with the pace Vika put's in these rallies for 2 sets. Of course Maria has more power and can hit winners (and also errors) more easily than Vika but she needs some time to do that, on form Vika isn't giving her that time on HC. And HC's where most of the tournaments are played. Grass, i don't know. I thought Vika played a slightly better grass season than Maria but they didn't meet so it's unclear for now.

I'm surprised myself you give Masha the edge 5-2. She would have to be playing a lot better or Vika a lot worse in their H2H than this year for that to happen.

What a lot of crap :lol: so Vika underestimated Maria in Stuttgart but this is in Stuttgart that Vika played a better match than all the previous and future meetings against Maria :lol:
Vika was simply outplayed in Stuttgart, admit it the stats speaks for themselves.

As for US Open, it's funny cause you can come up with the Vika was tired in the YEC while in US you don't pay attention to the fact that after 2 three setter over Petrova and Bartoli, Maria's shape was also in poor condition she really was hitting Vika off the court in the first set before really DFing like crazy at the end if the first set and give hope to Vika to comeback in this one, Vika didn't do anything to break at 5-1 Maria basically gave her the game.

As for the last two sets, I will admit that Vika started moving a lot better, hitting harder too but you have to be blind to not see that Maria's shots weren't as fierce as they were in the first set, she was also all over the place she had many chances to win more than 2 games in this set but she was really up and down.
She missed 2 game points at 1-0, then missed a lot of break points at 1-3 then 2-4 as well and finally blew 3 game points in a row to go 3-5 for Vika, it would have been interesting to see Vika forced to close the second set but whatever.
In the last set she won 4 games purely on her will she couldn't even return to save her life.

Anyway I think Dsanders summed it up pretty damn well in the last 4 meetings, Maria is getting more closer to Vika than you think and I also noticed that Maria's serve is also becoming stronger and stronger month by month if she keep it up she can definitely turn this rivalry to her side but I do expect Vika to prevail sometimes too that's for sure.

bandabou
Dec 14th, 2012, 07:39 AM
Orrr, maybe, just maybe, the thread was created because I genuinely want to discuss the most interesting rivalry on the WTA right now. Or are you guys seeing what you want to see again like in the "where does Serena go from here", where you genuinely all believed that I'd written Serena was washed-up and that the thread was an "epic fail" even though nothing I wrote in it was disproven :happy:

Kindly don't post in this thread again unless you have something to contribute other than lame GIFs and/or failed attempts at burns.

1. I just found it a curious case of 'humble'-pie. Because even after IW most Mashafans were dismissing Vika as a genuine rival ( saying things like she's just lucky this ain't peak Masha, yada yada, but I guess then U.S. open and Beijing happened and her fans finally realised that Vika might actually be a player and have something to say in this rivalry.

2. I'm sure we'll be talking about that infamous thread about Serena by next U.S. open. Too bad it got closed, because it'd love to see if you were gonna be man enough to admit that you'd been exposed as a fool. :lol: :wavey:

C. Drone
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:08 AM
Serena will do her very best to interfere :lol: as the N3 seed it's very likely though.
She will snatch both of them.

She won't be the N3 seed for too long. Afterwards Australia, they will have plenty of opportunities to play eachother in the semis.

Going to the AO, Serena will have a lead of 1,000+ points over Azarenka and almost 1,000 points over Sharapova in safe points. The later 2 also have lots of points to defend in the first half of the season, so if Serena plays a normal schedule, she is likely to be ranked ahead of both of them till Wimbledon. That means Aza and Maria could meet in the SF, instead of only in the finals.
I was kind of joking, but fine. :lol:

yes, ranking is clear, (750pts over Azarenka and 600pts over Maria actually), she'll be #1 after AO and the luckier one of Maria-Vika will stay #2. But there is no warrant both will be in top form and avoid upsets all the time to meet in SFs (or Finals when Serena doesnt play).

also
- Azarenka-Radwanska happened 6 times over 4 mothns and neither of it was in final. The probability of this scenario is very little.
- OTOH Azarenka-Kvitova never happened in 2012, and not just because Kvitova "sucked".
Which is more likely? 6-8 meetings or 0? :shrug:

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 12:25 PM
What a lot of crap :lol: so Vika underestimated Maria in Stuttgart but this is in Stuttgart that Vika played a better match than all the previous and future meetings against Maria :lol:
Vika was simply outplayed in Stuttgart, admit it the stats speaks for themselves.

My words were "Maria was much too strong in Stuttgart" so where am i not admitting :confused:. To say that this was Vika's best match against Maria seems ridiculous to me :help:.

As for US Open, it's funny cause you can come up with the Vika was tired in the YEC while in US you don't pay attention to the fact that after 2 three setter over Petrova and Bartoli, Maria's shape was also in poor condition she really was hitting Vika off the court in the first set before really DFing like crazy at the end if the first set and give hope to Vika to comeback in this one, Vika didn't do anything to break at 5-1 Maria basically gave her the game.

As for the last two sets, I will admit that Vika started moving a lot better, hitting harder too but you have to be blind to not see that Maria's shots weren't as fierce as they were in the first set, she was also all over the place she had many chances to win more than 2 games in this set but she was really up and down.
She missed 2 game points at 1-0, then missed a lot of break points at 1-3 then 2-4 as well and finally blew 3 game points in a row to go 3-5 for Vika, it would have been interesting to see Vika forced to close the second set but whatever.
In the last set she won 4 games purely on her will she couldn't even return to save her life.
I also mentioned in my post that underestimation and tiredness are no excuses and that Maria may have had cause not to play her best as well at times. What's done is done and we ended up 4-2. I don't see Vika folding next year so Maria would need to improve significantly on HC to turn this H2H around, i don't see that happen.

JoPova
Dec 14th, 2012, 12:30 PM
I think Vika will still be leading the h2h at the end of the 2013 season

dsanders06
Dec 14th, 2012, 03:23 PM
I exaggerated a bit because it's downright impossible to answer intelligently to the dumb arguments some Masha fans bring to the table.

Well OK, fair enough :p
And I'll admit I too was exaggerating slightly when I predicted Maria will win their 2013 matches 5-2 :oh: (probably wishful thinking because I want Maria to take the lead in the Career H2H). Realistically, I think a 2-match advantage in 2013 is the best Maria can hope for.

But yes, i certainly believe Vika will have the edge. There were 6 matches this year and Vika won the first 2 with very convincing scorelines. It got closer thereafter, Maria was much too strong in Stuttgart. Maybe Vika underestimated her there but based on that encounter alone i'd give Maria the edge on that surface. USO was close too, then again Vika was considerably stronger second and third set. Maria just couldn't hit through Vika anymore. YEC Vika was clearly very tired, imo she shouldn't have played Linz with such an important tournament coming up but i got the impression she was already happy to clinch #1 there. Underestimation and fatigue can be no excuses of course and there are undoubtedly excuses to be made for Maria as well on some of these occasions.

For me, the Australian Open and Indian Wells matches don't really have much bearing on how the "PovaRenka" match-up is now. Those 2 matches were part of a sequence where Maria lost 9 sets in a row against Vika, when Maria clearly WAS clueless on what to do against her .... whereas, in the 9 sets AFTER that, Maria has actually had a slight edge, so the match-up has clearly turned a corner since then :shrug: So I'm just not sure how relevant the AO/IW matches are for their rivalry going forward.

But yes, I do think Maria's play against Vika will continue to improve, although like I said I'm not going to pretend I have anything more substantial to base it on than gut instinct. One thing I do think that should be beared in mind is, imo, Maria doesn't get enough credit for her willingness to adapt her game to certain opponents, and her persistence in trying to beat players who are owning her at a time. I mean, apart from Serena, there's NEVER been an opponent in her whole career that Maria hasn't eventually figured out a way to play eventually, even if she first struggles with them for 1 or 2 seasons. Look at her match-up with Li -- admittedly Maria never struggled with Li quite as much as she's struggled with Vika, but still, going from losing 4 matches in a row against Li, to comprehensively figuring her out in 2012, is still a pretty drastic turn of events. :shrug:

Anyway, even if it turns out Vika ends up having the upper-hand on her in 2013, I'm still very much looking forward to it, and in fact their US Open semifinal was for me the best WTA match of the year, even if it didn't end the way I wanted it to ;) And I actually have a feeling that, irrespective of who wins the majority of their matches, most of them from now on will be closer to the USO match, rather than the one-sided wins they've mostly been getting over eachother until now.

ZeroSumGame
Dec 14th, 2012, 03:37 PM
Whoever improves on the weakest part of their game will own the other by end of 2013 :help:
Both have an inconsistent & unreliable serve, both return well with Vika having the edge.
Vika is consistent on her deep ground strokes, is very athletic and moves far better than Maria
Maria is mentally tougher, not by a wide margin but hit the lines hard with accuracy

Based on these observations, I say 3-2 Vika ...they may not even meet at all :lol: because of the other big cats interfering :lol:

StoneRose
Dec 14th, 2012, 03:49 PM
Well OK, fair enough :p
And I'll admit I too was exaggerating slightly when I predicted Maria will win their 2013 matches 5-2 :oh: (probably wishful thinking because I want Maria to take the lead in the Career H2H). Realistically, I think a 2-match advantage in 2013 is the best Maria can hope for.
Just so we're clear on this, i don't think you're one of the Masha fans using dumb arguments. Your posts are sometimes provoking which in itself is not a problem as they have good or at least interesting reasoning (most of the time :p).


For me, the Australian Open and Indian Wells matches don't really have much bearing on how the "PovaRenka" match-up is now. Those 2 matches were part of a sequence where Maria lost 9 sets in a row against Vika, when Maria clearly WAS clueless on what to do against her .... whereas, in the 9 sets AFTER that, Maria has actually had a slight edge, so the match-up has clearly turned a corner since then :shrug: So I'm just not sure how relevant the AO/IW matches are for their rivalry going forward.
Hard to tell indeed but Beijing showed the same pattern and that was a recent match.


But yes, I do think Maria's play against Vika will continue to improve, although like I said I'm not going to pretend I have anything more substantial to base it on than gut instinct. One thing I do think that should be beared in mind is, imo, Maria doesn't get enough credit for her willingness to adapt her game to certain opponents, and her persistence in trying to beat players who are owning her at a time. I mean, apart from Serena, there's NEVER been an opponent in her whole career that Maria hasn't eventually figured out a way to play eventually, even if she first struggles with them for 1 or 2 seasons. Look at her match-up with Li -- admittedly Maria never struggled with Li quite as much as she's struggled with Vika, but still, going from losing 4 matches in a row against Li, to comprehensively figuring her out in 2012, is still a pretty drastic turn of events. :shrug:

Anyway, even if it turns out Vika ends up having the upper-hand on her in 2013, I'm still very much looking forward to it, and in fact their US Open semifinal was for me the best WTA match of the year, even if it didn't end the way I wanted it to ;) And I actually have a feeling that, irrespective of who wins the majority of their matches, most of them from now on will be closer to the USO match, rather than the one-sided wins they've mostly been getting over eachother until now.Interesting thought Maria adapting her game to opponents. I'm not fully convinced. Maria has improved a lot the last 2 years and Li is fading away which may have tipped the balance in their H2H. Vika had problems with Li as well but not anymore. But it's not because Vika adapted i believe, like Maria she improved and Li hits way too many errors nowadays.

Of course my feeling is gut feeling, speculation, whatever you call it as well. I'm looking forward to their matches next year too.

Leo St
Dec 14th, 2012, 04:08 PM
from where i stand i see 3-1 azarenka in 2013

Matt01
Dec 14th, 2012, 07:01 PM
Interesting thought Maria adapting her game to opponents. I'm not fully convinced.


Maria with her one-dimensional game isn't able to adapt anything.

doomsday
Dec 14th, 2012, 07:48 PM
Maria with her one-dimensional game isn't able to adapt anything.

She sure is able to adapt on every surface though :lol:

sweetpeas
Dec 14th, 2012, 08:06 PM
Azarenka 4 2 .

blistering
Dec 14th, 2012, 08:23 PM
Honestly, I think mental strength is one area where Vika (uncharacteristically) had an edge on Maria in 2012 - that certainly accounted for the result of their US Open match at any rate.



I do agree that in terms of hardcourts, quicker ones favour Vika in this match-up (even though Vika generally is better on slower ones), and so Vika would probably beat Maria on a quick hardcourt (the very few genuinely quick HCs that are left - Stanford, Cincinnati, Beijing, Tokyo etc.) -- but I'm not sure I'd extend this to grass. Vika's footwork and defence is nowhere near as good on grass as it is on hardcourts, and without stellar footwork she becomes less consistent, and without that she's without her main weapon in this match-up. Plus, Maria's serve would get more cheap points / Vika's return would be neutralised a bit.

Also, just to play devil's advocate :devil: , although clay probably favours Maria, I'm not convinced that it's TOTALLY nid. Imo people are reading too much into Azarenka's weak performance at RG this year, she did actually play reasonably well at her other two claycourt tournaments this year and I think she will have decent results on it in her career. Even though clay will probably always be the one where Maria matches up best against Vika, I wouldn't necessarily expect Stuttgart-style matches in all their clay matches.

For me, the most encouraging thing about their YEC match was that Maria managed to win even though she wasn't outstanding, she just played tactically the right way. I was getting a little bit worried that she/her coach hadn't actually figured out how to play her at all, and that the Stuttgart and first set of the US Open match were just because Maria was on fire and that she wasn't actually consciously aware of what she was doing -- but the fact that in the YEC match, she wasn't striking the ball as well as she can, yet still won comfortably because she actually had a good gameplan, does give me some hope that they have figured her out since Stuttgart (and that their Beijing match was hopefully a blip).

Well Azarenka does know how to move pretty well on clay (though her timing in that Stuttgart final was rather bizarre, she was sliding way too early into some shots), but it neutralizes a lot of her weaponry, particularly her ability to rush opponents which is at the core of her success in general and in the Sharapova match up specifically.

The issue with grass is Maria's forehand breaking down so easily (she loves hitting her forehands while they're sitting up, contrary to Azarenka who hits them almost half volley style on a consistent basis), but yeah, Azarenka is nowhere near as good a returner on grass as she is on hardcourts. Plus her game is all about timing and hitting the ball earlier, and the roughness and irregularity of the grass does mess it up a bit (her UE count is much, much higher on that surface than on any other).

The YEC match was great from Maria (nowhere near the Stuttgart level, as that probably ranks as one of the best performances of her career), and it also proved the point that Maria absolutely NEEDS her backhand down the line clicking when facing Azarenka. Time and time again, every time Azarenka pushed Maria outwide with her own CC BH, Maria immediately hit down the line (risky, but she was pulling it off consistently), and that exposes Azarenka's vastly overrated side-to-side movement (which isn't even an asset as some make it out to be really). She needs both that shot and her serve clicking when facing Azarenka, otherwise it's a thrashing a la Beijing (I won't count the AO brainfart and the IW final where Maria's footwork was anecdotal to say the least). Speaking of Beijing, I have no idea what happened there. Azarenka played great (probably the best she's played against Maria in any of her matches), but Maria was spraying from her FH so much it was cringeworthy. That miss on set point said it all.

mikepails
Dec 14th, 2012, 08:28 PM
if Serena stays at #3 they might not even play in a slam final or many times, since at Australia, Wimbledon, U.S Open Serena is there to beat one in the semis and the other in the final, if both even get that far, thus preventing the meeting. Then at the French Azarenka is doing nothing anyway, regardless what Serena or Maria do. I have no idea how the thread starter thinks they are going to play 7 times and numerous times in slams given Serena's current rank and Serena being a 100% certain win anytime she steps on court with either Maria or Victoria.

blistering
Dec 14th, 2012, 08:36 PM
People are expecting way too much from Williams. Sure, she'll probably win the fast slams (i.e. USO and Wimbledon), but Azarenka and/or Sharapova will take the other two. Plus regardless of their H2H against Williams, they WILL beat her eventually, unless she goes all part-time on the WTA like she always does. Playing against her regularly can only do good.

sweetadri06
Dec 14th, 2012, 08:52 PM
People are expecting way too much from Williams. Sure, she'll probably win the fast slams (i.e. USO and Wimbledon), but Azarenka and/or Sharapova will take the other two. Plus regardless of their H2H against Williams, they WILL beat her eventually, unless she goes all part-time on the WTA like she always does. Playing against her regularly can only do good.

I think people are forgetting that 2013 is a different year, we don't know for sure whether Maria and Vika will be meeting regularly like last year or if Serena will be meeting them regularly either. Another player can emerge and steal everyone's thunder. Unfortunately it's not the norm in the WTA for top players to be meeting each other often, so we'll see what happens next year.

blistering
Dec 14th, 2012, 09:03 PM
I think people are forgetting that 2013 is a different year, we don't know for sure whether Maria and Vika will be meeting regularly like last year or if Serena will be meeting them regularly either. Another player can emerge and steal everyone's thunder. Unfortunately it's not the norm in the WTA for top players to be meeting each other often, so we'll see what happens next year.

Signs were good throughout the entire year though. They're probably DYING to meet each other again and that's great.

Rgarding Williams' dominance, it reminds me a lot of Henin's second half of 2007.

madmax
Dec 14th, 2012, 09:06 PM
People are expecting way too much from Williams. Sure, she'll probably win the fast slams (i.e. USO and Wimbledon), but Azarenka and/or Sharapova will take the other two. Plus regardless of their H2H against Williams, they WILL beat her eventually, unless she goes all part-time on the WTA like she always does. Playing against her regularly can only do good.

that's because this forum is fickle and is dominated by WS tards, who can't even grasp that 32 years old player cannot dominate all season long without getting injured or completely burning out... For all the great runs Williams had in the second part of the season, she was a non-factor on slow surfaces earlier in the year and was conserving her energy for fast slams. And even then she could have easily lost a Wimby match to Zheng, who choked like a rookie when she had 3 BP's to go 5-3 up in the final set...of course nobody remembers it now coz their "baby gurl" somehow escaped yet again, but the point still stands. Maria and Vika were both much more consistent and deservedly are ranked 1 and 2 in the world. I personally expect them to play in AO final yet again with Maria taking a revenge this time arround

blistering
Dec 14th, 2012, 09:26 PM
Yeah when was the last time Williams dominated for a whole year anyways? 2002? 2009-2010 doesn't count as she was playing part-time during the bleakest years in WTA history.

I too predict a Vikaria final at the AO. Williams will lose to Kerber in the QFs. Book it.

mikepails
Dec 14th, 2012, 09:31 PM
Serena's record at the Australian Open is far and away the best of any current player. She is far and away the most likely winner of that event. Azarenka is a distant 2nd favorite, and Maria at best a very distant 3rd.

bandabou
Dec 14th, 2012, 10:10 PM
Yeah when was the last time Williams dominated for a whole year anyways? 2002? 2009-2010 doesn't count as she was playing part-time during the bleakest years in WTA history.

I too predict a Vikaria final at the AO. Williams will lose to Kerber in the QFs. Book it.

And when was the last time Maria even DOMINATED? Maria at ANY age hasn't dominated like Serena did, even this year. So really stop taking diss at Serena. :wavey:

C. Drone
Dec 14th, 2012, 10:17 PM
Maria with her one-dimensional game isn't able to adapt anything.

Only thing Azarenka adapts are fake injuries and ugliness.
And Radwanska?
Kerber?
Errani?
Kvitova?
Stosur?
Li?

Almost whole WTA is one-dimensional.

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_maqnrxwuzl1r7r60a.gif

Leo St
Dec 14th, 2012, 10:35 PM
radwanska kvitova and stosur are not one dimentionals.. think of stosur for example.. she can chose how to hit her backhand depending on the match.. radwanska has great hands and use them properly whenever shes confident and kvitova is a great net player.. ill give you errani but thats not even a whole dimension.. more like half

JarkaFish
Dec 14th, 2012, 10:42 PM
Kerber isn't exactly one dimensional.

C. Drone
Dec 14th, 2012, 10:59 PM
radwanska kvitova and stosur are not one dimentionals.. think of stosur for example.. she can chose how to hit her backhand depending on the match.. radwanska has great hands and use them properly whenever shes confident and kvitova is a great net player.. ill give you errani but thats not even a whole dimension.. more like half

"she can chose how to hit her BH"
Yes, when she has time she can try a risky DTL and fails many times. Stole her time she is back to square one. Entirely depends on her opponent. And what can she do?

Radwanska has nice touch and moves well, okay. What else?

Kvitova goes to the net. And? Will she hit less UE? Will she move better?

BS excuses. Most of the players have limited technical and physical skills, limiting their on court strategies.
You dont see Radwanska ballbashing. Everyone is so full with her brilliant touch, do you think she wouldn't trade it for the ability to win actual slams with ballbashing? Or for being 6'-6'2" and have physical advantage?

One-dimensional. 90% or more of the players.

NashaMasha
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:04 PM
radwanska kvitova and stosur are not one dimentionals.. think of stosur for example.. she can chose how to hit her backhand depending on the match.. radwanska has great hands and use them properly whenever shes confident and kvitova is a great net player.. ill give you errani but thats not even a whole dimension.. more like half

not one-dimentional is only Serena in current WTA tour . Azarenka/Kvitova/Radwanska when their advantages (each has just a few of them) are not working are blown out of the court and look helpless. Azarenka can only outlast her opponents, when they are beating her heavily (like vs Cibukova), she can't offer anything more than what she has already shown. As for Serena, she has unlimited reserves....

heavyhorse
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:07 PM
Hopefully Istanbul indicates Maria is finally getting used to Azarenka's game so this rivalry can get interesting.

I'm not gonna make a figure prediction but I will say that I think it's gonna be a close H2H.

ZeroSumGame
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:35 PM
that's because this forum is fickle and is dominated by WS tards, who can't even grasp that 32 years old player cannot dominate all season long without getting injured or completely burning out... For all the great runs Williams had in the second part of the season, she was a non-factor on slow surfaces earlier in the year and was conserving her energy for fast slams. And even then she could have easily lost a Wimby match to Zheng, who choked like a rookie when she had 3 BP's to go 5-3 up in the final set...of course nobody remembers it now coz their "baby gurl" somehow escaped yet again, but the point still stands. Maria and Vika were both much more consistent and deservedly are ranked 1 and 2 in the world. I personally expect them to play in AO final yet again with Maria taking a revenge this time arround

Rankings mean nothing, perennial arse shellackings on the big stage while snatching slams & medals is what matters :wavey: :wavey: ...and how did Kvitova choke away the 2012AO semi final? I'm sure if it was her against Vika, she wouldn't have eaten a bagel :lol:

Leo St
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:43 PM
ive gone through this in my head some times and for me, theres no shame for maria to only be able to ballbash.. thats her gameplan and what shes good at.. would she benefit from more variety? sure, but her main game brought her success and lets face it, shes probably the best ever at how she plays.. but that is and will ever be a spot for dislikers to pick on and youll have to live with that.. and saying that other players like stosur are one dimentional wont make a difference imo.. for me, stosur has many dimentions to her game, she can ball bash, she can hit defensive shots with her slices, she can survive at the net, adds many spins to her balls.. and STILL, is worst than "dimensionless" sharapova.. so theres the thing for you to focus on, players may have a thousand "dimensions" but your girl is bending them at her will with just one

Cajka
Dec 14th, 2012, 11:57 PM
ive gone through this in my head some times and for me, theres no shame for maria to only be able to ballbash.. thats her gameplan and what shes good at.. would she benefit from more variety?

It's not a secret that she has to ballbash, she just has to ballbash smarter against Vika.

dsanders06
Dec 15th, 2012, 12:00 AM
Maria with her one-dimensional game isn't able to adapt anything.

Thank you for proving my point that Maria doesn't get enough credit for her ability to adapt :lol:

For the record, adapting your game doesn't just mean throwing in slices or charging the net. Go and watch Maria's matches against both Kerber and Li in Beijing this year -- she had two pretty starkly-different gameplans just in those two back-to-back matches.

Cajka
Dec 15th, 2012, 12:07 AM
"she can chose how to hit her BH"
Yes, when she has time she can try a risky DTL and fails many times. Stole her time she is back to square one. Entirely depends on her opponent. And what can she do?

Radwanska has nice touch and moves well, okay. What else?

Kvitova goes to the net. And? Will she hit less UE? Will she move better?

BS excuses. Most of the players have limited technical and physical skills, limiting their on court strategies.
You dont see Radwanska ballbashing. Everyone is so full with her brilliant touch, do you think she wouldn't trade it for the ability to win actual slams with ballbashing? Or for being 6'-6'2" and have physical advantage?

One-dimensional. 90% or more of the players.

Harsh, but kinda true. It's not even about the players, it's the surfaces that force them to be one-dimensional, it's the same with ATP. Federer for sure has variety in his game, but those "one-dimensional" players beat him more often than not. The era of edbergs and navratilovas is over, let's move on.

Radwanska is still the only one who can benefit significantly from her variety, but it was all useless until she improved her serve (more than anything) and her groundstrokes.

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:50 AM
Only thing Azarenka adapts are fake injuries and ugliness.


In that case she's in good company with Maria :wavey:

TheDream
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:14 AM
In that case she's in good company with Maria :wavey:

Matt who do you dislike more, Serena or Maria?

madmax
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:21 AM
Rankings mean nothing, perennial arse shellackings on the big stage while snatching slams & medals is what matters :wavey: :wavey: ...and how did Kvitova choke away the 2012AO semi final? I'm sure if it was her against Vika, she wouldn't have eaten a bagel :lol:

bish please...:zzz:
Barktra's slow azz was kicked to the ground in the first set of that encounter before Maria decided to serve like crap again and give a close scrapfest to aussie spectators:lol: That match was NID, just like all meaningful matches between the two will be from now on. And Vuvurenka was on absolute fire in that tournament, so there's no way the GOAT of unforced errors would have won:wavey:

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:40 AM
Matt who do you dislike more, Serena or Maria?


Venus. :)

TheDream
Dec 15th, 2012, 04:48 AM
Venus. :)

Oh Matty, Venus is irrelevant now. Even her most ardent haters don't even care about her now, so answer the question. :)

Leo St
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:13 AM
lol.. venus may have been irrelevant in 2012 because she was working her ranking.. but watch out, shell feed his hate really hard in 2013

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:15 AM
lol.. venus may have been irrelevant in 2012 because she was working her ranking.. but watch out, shell feed his hate really hard in 2013

http://cdn.crushable.com/files/2012/07/jlaw-okay.gif

C. Drone
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:41 AM
ive gone through this in my head some times and for me, theres no shame for maria to only be able to ballbash.. thats her gameplan and what shes good at.. would she benefit from more variety? sure, but her main game brought her success and lets face it, shes probably the best ever at how she plays.. but that is and will ever be a spot for dislikers to pick on and youll have to live with that.. and saying that other players like stosur are one dimentional wont make a difference imo.. for me, stosur has many dimentions to her game, she can ball bash, she can hit defensive shots with her slices, she can survive at the net, adds many spins to her balls.. and STILL, is worst than "dimensionless" sharapova.. so theres the thing for you to focus on, players may have a thousand "dimensions" but your girl is bending them at her will with just one

The shame is the hypocrisy of people, bashing ones and praising others who arent more.

Agree with what your post saying overall.

Exordes
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:47 AM
Radwanska is still the only one who can benefit significantly from her variety, but it was all useless until she improved her serve (more than anything) and her groundstrokes.

When we compare the current No.2 and current No.4 to each other, Maria Sharapova and Agnieszka Radwanska had only two head-to-head matches in 2012. Radwanska was better in Miami Final (7-5, 6-4) and Sharapova was better in YEC match (5-7,7-5,7-5). Both of them also reached finals on grass, Aga at the Wimbledon Championships (loss to Serena Williams 1-6, 7-5, 2-6) and Maria at the Summer Olympics (loss to Serena Williams 0-6, 1-6).

If we see well-rested and recharged Radwanska in 2013, she might cause lots of troubles for Sharapova, or at least for very long matches. Hopefully Aga doesn´t have to wear the bandage on her shoulder anymore.

blistering
Dec 15th, 2012, 12:16 PM
Sharapova needed to exorcise her Miami demons and she did just that in Istanbul. Future matches won't be nearly as hard for Sharapova to win and she'll need to have a REALLY bad day to lose to Radwanska again.

TheLegendof
Dec 15th, 2012, 12:22 PM
This should actually be a pretty exciting rivalry. Based on 2012 results, I would give Azarenka the edge on hardcourts and Maria the obvious edge on clay. I am actually really hoping for a Wimbledon match between these two, because I would love to see how they match up on grass. I agree that Maria is getting stronger in their hardcourt matches, though, so it should be close. Maybe 4-3 Azarenka?

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:04 PM
Sharapova needed to exorcise her Miami demons and she did just that in Istanbul. Future matches won't be nearly as hard for Sharapova to win and she'll need to have a REALLY bad day to lose to Radwanska again.
She's definitely going to lose to Aga more times.

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:10 PM
I predict Maria will win their 2013 H2H 5-2 :oh: (which would give her the edge in their Career H2H)

Your delusions amuse me :)

The Daviator
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:16 PM
:lol: at people thinking Maria will beat Vika more times in 2013 than in her entire career :spit:

The 'usual' which is Azarenka beating Maria quite comfortably will continue, of course there will always be exceptions to the rule, hence Maria's odd wins here and there, but it'll be one-sided once again for Vika. It's simply a fundamental match-up issue. Unless Maria is painting the lines on every second shot (Stuttgart), she just can't hit through Vika.

Raiden
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:28 PM
Redundant thread.

Peak Vika cannot lose to Masha of any level - she hasn't lost to her in years (when was the last time Vika lost a match outside clay and season endings (when players may have a higher propensity to be tired)?

Monzanator
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:35 PM
Azarenka - Sharapova 6-0, 12-0 sets including 4 bagels :)

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:38 PM
Sharapova will win a match, either on clay or in a YEC-like situation where she takes advantage of the circumstances. But on HC if both are fit and healthy? I don't see it.... so my guess is 4-1.

Her stans should really get used to the idea of her having a negative career H2H, her chances of turning that around are more than slim.

Monzanator
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:41 PM
Sharapova will win a match, either on clay or in a YEC-like situation where she takes advantage of the circumstances. But on HC if both are fit and healthy? I don't see it.... so my guess is 4-1.

Her stans should really get used to the idea of her having a negative career H2H, her chances of turning that around are more than slim.

Don't you worry, mate I've long come to terms with her not winning a single match anywhere against WS, Azarenka, Kvitova, Radwanska, Kerber and Wozniacki. Sharapova is the ultimate punchbag of the current WTA Top 10 and even Top 20 if you add Lisicki :) She can only win matches if the draw opens up for her and she receives a cakewalk into GS QF or anywhere else. It's a fact, period.

Stevecw
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:46 PM
Maria for sure

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:50 PM
Don't you worry, mate I've long come to terms with her not winning a single match anywhere against WS, Azarenka, Kvitova, Radwanska, Kerber and Wozniacki. Sharapova is the ultimate punchbag of the current WTA Top 10 and even Top 20 if you add Lisicki :) She can only win matches if the draw opens up for her and she receives a cakewalk into GS QF or anywhere else. It's a fact, period.

Don't forget the rain.

Monzanator
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:54 PM
Don't forget the rain.

And opponents' injuries. How could I forgot about them :sobbing:

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 02:57 PM
Cute sarcasm... if that's your way to hide from reality so be it :)

Craig.
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:00 PM
http://cdn.crushable.com/files/2012/07/jlaw-okay.gif

Do you like anyone? :lol:

Leo St
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:13 PM
either way i think the tennis fan benefits from this rivalry.. its so heated at the moment

madmax
Dec 15th, 2012, 03:31 PM
Don't you worry, mate I've long come to terms with her not winning a single match anywhere against WS, Azarenka, Kvitova, Radwanska, Kerber and Wozniacki. Sharapova is the ultimate punchbag of the current WTA Top 10 and even Top 20 if you add Lisicki :) She can only win matches if the draw opens up for her and she receives a cakewalk into GS QF or anywhere else. It's a fact, period.

don't forget that she only wins matches because of her loud intimidating screaming, which prevents much more talented likes of Radwanska, Kvitova and etc from displaying their all- arround multiple skills too:worship: Not to mention she pushes as hell and can't hit winners for shit...there was never such a lousy player with a career slam next to her name...LIKE EVER. What a sham and media creation she is:eek:

dsanders06
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:42 PM
Your delusions amuse me :)

Too easy. I'll let Bradley supply your endless collection of quotes from one time or another about how Wozniacki was guaranteed to be the best player of her generation, how Wozniacki would finish 2012 as #1, how Azarenka was going to beat Serena in every one of their matches this year, how it was impossible for Maria to beat Vika at the YEC, etc. :lol:

:lol: at people thinking Maria will beat Vika more times in 2013 than in her entire career :spit:

The 'usual' which is Azarenka beating Maria quite comfortably will continue, of course there will always be exceptions to the rule, hence Maria's odd wins here and there, but it'll be one-sided once again for Vika. It's simply a fundamental match-up issue. Unless Maria is painting the lines on every second shot (Stuttgart), she just can't hit through Vika.

Again, the YEC shows this isn't true :shrug: While Maria played very well in that match, she wasn't at the outrageously good level she was in Stuttgart. While she might not be able to play at that fantastic level that often, I don't see why she couldn't in theory ( in theory :lol: ) conjure up the level she was at in their YEC match on a semi-regular basis when she plays Vika :shrug:

(And let's not seriously try and use the "Extremely Tired" excuse :lol: )

Do you like anyone? :lol:

I think s/he is one of the strange influx of extra-obnoxious Vikastans that has suddenly been appearing this offseason :o

NashaMasha
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:47 PM
don't forget that she only wins matches because of her loud intimidating screaming, which prevents much more talented likes of Radwanska, Kvitova and etc from displaying their all- arround multiple skills too:worship: Not to mention she pushes as hell and can't hit winners for shit...there was never such a lousy player with a career slam next to her name...LIKE EVER. What a sham and media creation she is:eek:

what is more she won 4 fluke Grand Slams and some irrelevant tournaments like Yec, IW , Rome , whereas Vika won 1 legitimate Slam + 5th Slam Miami(twice) + 5.1 Slam Beijing - total 4 non-fluke Slams:):)


As for 2013 i think that their first match in the season will be very important. If Masha wins it , she may turn into domination in this match-up, if she loses she may still make a revenge during clay season. Azarenka should try not to lose on hard courts, otherwise Masha will start beating her everywhere

Vartan
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:48 PM
Azarenka fans are so delusional, :lol:. She is not some future great.

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:55 PM
Azarenka fans are so delusional, :lol:. She is not some future great.

True, she already is now :)

Vartan
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:57 PM
As is Ivanovic. Makes sense then. If they are greats, Sharapova is a legend and for this same reason Williams fans call her Godrena.

Jeffery
Dec 15th, 2012, 05:58 PM
I have no doubt.

Maria will lead the 2013 h2h 4-1.

Steven.
Dec 15th, 2012, 06:18 PM
lmfao at all of this 1 dimensional talk because there's actually a lot more behind each groundstroke than just hitting it for one.

And besides, pretty much all players are one dimensional by TF definition. Just because they can hit a couple of different shots now and then doesn't make them NOT one dimensional. Most players don't even have a reliable plan B to fall back; it's such a myth that most players have a reliable plan B. And for crying out loud, Stosur isn't one dimensional? She can hit a few flashy bh dtl winners every now and then, just as often as Maria hits nice lob and drop shots, but that doesn't make her any less one dimensional.

Besides, by TF definition, wasn't all time greats like Seles, Graf, Venus, to name a few, quite one dimensional? Watch each and every one of their match and you can pretty much predict what they are going to do 99% of the time but they are FABULOUS at what they do and that's all that matters.

The only "non-one dimensional" greats since the 90s are probably Novotna, ASV (TF would call her a one dimensional pusher tho probs), Hingis, Henin, Serena, Mauresmo, Kvitova.

Anyway on topic, I bet they won't meet much at all. I assume Kvitova will just rise to form again and snatch Vika's wig over and over and the y.e. top 3 will hopefully be some combination of maria, kvitova, serena.

Monzanator
Dec 15th, 2012, 06:21 PM
Cute sarcasm... if that's your way to hide from reality so be it :)

The reality is that Azarenka only loses to Sharapova when she is injured (Stuttgart and Istanbul). I don't have to use any forms of sarcasm to talk about so-called reality and I stand by h2h 6-0 in Azarenka's favor. What would you want me to say? That Sharapova will blow Azarenka away so you can make fun at my delusions? Neah, sorry to disappoint you but I support Azarenka in this h2h but even she will have some trouble to replicate Serena's eight year winning streak. In this case no matter how hard Azarenka tries, she won't reach the Serena level of owning Maria's ass. You'd like to see Azarenka being #1 in everything important and I imagine every Sharapova hater likes her to eat bagels from someone like Azarenka but Serena has hit it out of the ballpark long time ago. Azarenka is just a mere impostor, at least when Serena was injured, she still led 4-0 in the decider, that's guts, not quitting and making it look like you're asking for a wheelchair exit in public.

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 06:39 PM
As for 2013 i think that their first match in the season will be very important. If Masha wins it , she may turn into domination in this match-up, if she loses she may still make a revenge during clay season. Azarenka should try not to lose on hard courts, otherwise Masha will start beating her everywhere


:spit:

Leo St
Dec 15th, 2012, 07:18 PM
well congrats on d-sanders for this thread because trully there couldnt be a less conclusive end of the season for the vika-masha match up.. vika dominated the whole season but masha handled her confortably when the curtains were closin. for sure this will be uped after every match they play in the future

doomsday
Dec 15th, 2012, 07:43 PM
Maria with her real serve is no match for Vika.


Sent from my iPhone using Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 09:30 PM
Azarenka fans are so delusional, :lol:. She is not some future great.

Define "great".

If you think someone like Maria is a "great", then yeah I'd predict Azarenka will be considered a "great" at the end of her career.

Vartan
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:02 PM
Define "great".

If you think someone like Maria is a "great", then yeah I'd predict Azarenka will be considered a "great" at the end of her career.

What makes you think she is guaranteed a career slam?

Smitten
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:12 PM
Azarenka is no future great. She doesn't have the ability to rack up a ton of slams with that game.

The one slam she has is 70% luck and good fortune. Let's not kid ourselves.

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:16 PM
Azarenka is no future great. She doesn't have the ability to rack up a ton of slams with that game.



Bold and dumb statement considering she backed up her maiden slam with another SF and a final in which she was just one game away from winning her second. Luck my ass...

You somehow manage to be the dumbest among all the haters here, congrats :rolleyes:

Smitten
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:19 PM
You back up slam wins with SFs now? :haha:

The vacuum that Azarenka won all those matches in was a weakened state of the tour. Still, it only took for a few girls to play well again and Azarenka was unable to win anything big for the rest of the year until Bombjing.

Serena is still fit and healthy, Petra remains to be seen, and Martha is capable of beating her. More girls are going to come out against her after a year like this.

Her '13 season will be worse than her '12 season. That's almost a given. She doesn't have anything special to dominate.

FlopPoova
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:20 PM
I'm mostly just happy that we have a real WTA rivalry again, one that's bitter and dramatic. There is obvious dislike amongst these 2, and I for one LOVE IT.

I predict this season's H2H will be closer than last season's, with Vika struggling to maintain her momentum, especially if she has a disappointing Australian Open. Maria will likely dominate all clay encounters, but I'm really curious to see them face each other on grasscourts.

I think Maria will come up on top in this year's H2H. But barely. And I want more Vika/Petra and Petra/Maria in 2013, please

Stonerpova
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:20 PM
Bold and dumb statement considering she backed up her maiden slam with another SF and a final in which she was just one game away from winning her second. Luck my ass...

You somehow manage to be the dumbest among all the haters here, congrats :rolleyes:

That one game was pretty telling though, was it not? She didn't have the serve, the firepower, or the will to win to finish the match off.

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:24 PM
That one game was pretty telling though, was it not? She didn't have the serve, the firepower, or the will to win to finish the match off.

Her serve let her down, it's obviously the weak link of her game. I disagree about missing will though, strongly. Getting back into that match after the first set required a tremendous amount of will that pretty much no other player has been able to show playing against Serena this year. She could have folded like a cheap tent Sharapova-style but she didn't.

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:32 PM
You back up slam wins with SFs now? :haha:

The vacuum that Azarenka won all those matches in was a weakened state of the tour. Still, it only took for a few girls to play well again and Azarenka was unable to win anything big for the rest of the year until Bombjing.

Serena is still fit and healthy, Petra remains to be seen, and Martha is capable of beating her. More girls are going to come out against her after a year like this.

Her '13 season will be worse than her '12 season. That's almost a given. She doesn't have anything special to dominate.

Neither does Maria, didn't stop her from winning 4 slams and being proclaimed a great. :shrug:

NashaMasha
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:32 PM
Bold and dumb statement considering she backed up her maiden slam with another SF and a final in which she was just one game away from winning her second. Luck my ass...

You somehow manage to be the dumbest among all the haters here, congrats :rolleyes:

it's really not extremely hard these day to back up with SF and Finals .... Kim Clijsters as great player as she was managed just to win 1 Slam in tough era and won 3 in the weak era ( and could have won even more if being focused and determined including Vika's AO2012)

today we have just 3 top players , who can meet only in SF , one of them is unbeatable but she is a part-timer and focused only at Slams , the other still trying to find back her best game and playing too inconsistent ... and here is Azrenka who is healthy, young, focused, mentally tough and ready to grab titles when the first one is absent and the second one is not in form....

Azarenka is not in the league of Clijsters/Sharapova/Capriati/Davenport/Hingis but has great chances to get similar achievements just for having appeared in WTA the right time

doomsday
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:34 PM
Her serve let her down, it's obviously the weak link of her game. I disagree about missing will though, strongly. Getting back into that match after the first set required a tremendous amount of will that pretty much no other player has been able to show playing against Serena this year. She could have folded like a cheap tent Sharapova-style but she didn't.

Cheap tent Sharapova style :lol: I recall Maria closing her major final over Serena in fashion style unlike Vika.
Try again :lol:

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:43 PM
it's really not extremely hard these day to back up with SF and Finals .... Kim Clijsters as great player as she was managed just to win 1 Slam in tough era and won 3 in the weak era ( and could have won even more if being focused and determined including Vika's AO2012)

today we have just 3 top players , who can meet only in SF , one of them is unbeatable but she is a part-timer and focused only at Slams , the other still trying to find back her best game and playing too inconsistent ... and here is Azrenka who is healthy, young, focused, mentally tough and ready to grab titles when the first one is absent and the second one is not in form....

Azarenka is not in the league of Clijsters/Sharapova/Capriati/Davenport/Hingis but has great chances to get similar achievements just for having appeared in WTA the right time

Haha, okay.

Vartan
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:45 PM
It's true.

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:47 PM
it's really not extremely hard these day to back up with SF and Finals ....


Players like Kvitova, Li or Stosur didn't even manage that :shrug:

Cosmic Voices
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:47 PM
It's true.

yeh I don't see why he's trying to deny the fact - Vika's only early on in her career and rightly so isn't in the same league as some of those players. Just because she had an incredible season and won her first slam doesn't automatically place her among the best. But I'm not disparaging that she wont be a great player when she retires - its too early to tell

Stonerpova
Dec 15th, 2012, 10:59 PM
Her serve let her down, it's obviously the weak link of her game. I disagree about missing will though, strongly. Getting back into that match after the first set required a tremendous amount of will that pretty much no other player has been able to show playing against Serena this year. She could have folded like a cheap tent Sharapova-style but she didn't.

Sharapova served out her chance at beating Serena in a slam final pretty easily :shrug:

caboche
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:03 PM
For some reason, I don't think these two will meet very often next year. Maybe two or three times.

NashaMasha
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:10 PM
Players like Kvitova, Li or Stosur didn't even manage that :shrug:

Azarenka won her her first Major title on the 7th year in WTA tour with the experience of 24 Slam tournaments ... She is this type of hard workers , who are spending their whole life on practice courts and trying to compensate lack of talent/power with determinantion, consistency, being fit . She reached her peak physical form in 2012 and still mananged to win only 1 Slam on which Serena was injured and Sharapova was after injury , won two PMs, on which Serena was absent ...
and eventually she managed to "back up" her #1 ranking by straight losses to both Serena and Masha at YEC (just in comparison check how Novak legitimated his ranking)

She is not among those champions who could win big titles with a help of pure talent like Hingis, Sharapova, Clijsters and even Kuznetsova (i won't even touch more accomplished players), She wasn't competitive vs top players from her join to the tour... There was never "she'll be next great champion" in her game ... It's enough to check her W/L %, almost absence of any titles on non HC surfaces to understand to what league she does belong ....

That's it

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:14 PM
Azarenka won her her first Major title on the 7th year in WTA tour with the experience of 24 Slam tournaments ... She is this type of hard workers , who are spending their whole life on practice courts and trying to compensate lack of talent/power with determinantion, consistency, being fit . She reached her peak physical form in 2012 and still mananged to win only 1 Slam on which Serena was injured and Sharapova was after injury , won two PMs, on which Serena was absent ...
and eventually she managed to "back up" her #1 ranking by straight losses to both Serena and Masha at YEC (just in comparison check how Novak legitimated his ranking)

She is not among those champions who could win big titles with a help of pure talent like Hingis, Sharapova, Clijsters and even Kuznetsova (i won't even touch more accomplished players), She wasn't competitive vs top players from her join to the tour... There was never "she'll be next great champion" in her game ...

That's itSounds like Sharapova to me.

Pure talent and Sharapova don't belong in the same sentence.

doomsday
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:16 PM
Sounds like Sharapova to me.

Pure talent and Sharapova don't belong in the same sentence.

Wimbledon at 17 says otherwise :wavey:

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:16 PM
Azarenka won her her first Major title on the 7th year in WTA tour with the experience of 24 Slam tournaments ... She is this type of hard workers , who are spending their whole life on practice courts and trying to compensate lack of talent/power with determinantion, consistency, being fit . She reached her peak physical form in 2012 and still mananged to win only 1 Slam on which Serena was injured and Sharapova was after injury , won two PMs, on which Serena was absent ...


Really? Sharapova "was after injury" at the AO? That's your excuse.... jesus. Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:21 PM
Really? Sharapova "was after injury" at the AO? That's your excuse.... jesus. Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.


Yeah, typical Pova stan...

NashaMasha
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:21 PM
Really? Sharapova "was after injury" at the AO? That's your excuse.... jesus. Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.

it's not an excuse , it's a fact ... Sharapova was a dark hourse at AO2012 , nobody was betting on her win or even going deep to SF/F, as she was without any practice , after injury, almost like Nadal will look in 2013 at AO

Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.

reality is this
1) she was injured not long ago , she definitely wasn't training at her maximum during off-season
2) she had no warm-up tournaments
3) she played crappy the whole tournament and reached Final with a help of her mental toughness

JarkaFish
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:26 PM
Wimbledon at 17 says otherwise :wavey:

She's not a good athlete, and she has a limited variety of shots at her disposal. She achieves what she does through hard work and determination, which is totally commendable, it just gets a bit odd when her fans disparage other players for doing the same. :shrug:

caboche
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:32 PM
it's not an excuse , it's a fact ... Sharapova was a dark hourse at AO2012 , nobody was betting on her win or even going deep to SF/F, as she was without any practice , after injury, almost like Nadal will look in 2013 at AO



reality is this
1) she was injured not long ago , she definitely wasn't traing at her maximum during off-season
2) she had no warm-up tournaments
3) she played crappy the whole tournament and reached Final with a help of her mental toughness

:confused::confused::confused:

The only crappy match Sharapova played before the final was her R16 match vs Lisicki. She showed outstanding tennis in her first three matches and played okay in the QF and SF.

Jimmie48
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:34 PM
The only crappy match Sharapova played before the final was her R16 match vs Lisicki. She showed outstanding tennis in her first three matches and played okay in the QF and SF.

Don't even bother. If she gets beaten it's because she sucked, was injured etc. If the opponent on the other hand is exhausted, injured that's all because of Sharapova's brilliance. These people can't be helped...I really wonder how many beatings it takes for them to wake up.

Matt01
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:44 PM
Pova's first 3 matches at AO ended up 6:0 6:1, 6:0 6:1 and 6:1 6:2...yeah, she only won those matches by mental toughness and determination :lol:

doomsday
Dec 15th, 2012, 11:59 PM
She's not a good athlete, and she has a limited variety of shots at her disposal. She achieves what she does through hard work and determination, which is totally commendable, it just gets a bit odd when her fans disparage other players for doing the same. :shrug:

So far her limited variety of shots allowed her to win majors on every single surface, sth who IMO seems more impressive than defending a major title.

And I didn't say anything about Vika.

doomsday
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:22 AM
Don't even bother. If she gets beaten it's because she sucked, was injured etc. If the opponent on the other hand is exhausted, injured that's all because of Sharapova's brilliance. These people can't be helped...I really wonder how many beatings it takes for them to wake up.

Serena's beatdowns over Maria really calmed us because I will admit that even after so many, Maria still hasn't find a way to turn the tables against her despite playing really well sometimes.

She hasn't even beaten her in a long time but against Vika its simply not the same and Stuttgart really is a great exemple, Vika simply can't touch Maria at her best.

dsanders06
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:26 AM
Really? Sharapova "was after injury" at the AO? That's your excuse.... jesus. Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.

Pova's first 3 matches at AO ended up 6:0 6:1, 6:0 6:1 and 6:1 6:2...yeah, she only won those matches by mental toughness and determination :lol:

I'm sorry but it's a matter of record that Maria couldn't train for most of the offseason, she withdrew from her warm-up tournament for that very reason :shrug: You guys might not like it, but that's a fact. She played well at the AO on the whole, but she didn't play as well as she did from the claycourt season onwards. In particular, her forehand in her last few tournaments of 2012 was unrecognisable compared to the jerky piece of crap it was for her first few tournaments of the year.

Matt01
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:39 AM
I'm sorry but it's a matter of record that Maria couldn't train for most of the offseason, she withdrew from her warm-up tournament for that very reason :shrug: You guys might not like it, but that's a fact. She played well at the AO on the whole, but she didn't play as well as she did from the claycourt season onwards. In particular, her forehand in her last few tournaments of 2012 was unrecognisable compared to the jerky piece of crap it was for her first few tournaments of the year.


How strong was her forehand when she lost lost 3:6, 1:6 in Bejing?

dsanders06
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:42 AM
How strong was her forehand when she lost lost 3:6, 1:6 in Bejing?

:lol: :lol: Again, just that one match in the last FOUR they've played where you can use that argument.

TheDream
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:48 AM
:lol: :lol: Again, just that one match in the last FOUR they've played where you can use that argument.

Sharapova will have to hope Azarenka beats Serena in a tough, physical, marathon 3+ hour battle in the SF to stand a chance in Australia IMO, and hope Azarenka is feeling it physically and mentally in the final. If Serena is in Maria's half and both make the SF, then her chances are over. In the event she miraculously gets by Serena, there's no way she's beating them both in back to back matches.

doomsday
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:57 AM
Sharapova will have to hope Azarenka beats Serena in a tough, physical, marathon 3+ hour battle in the SF to stand a chance in Australia IMO, and hope Azarenka is feeling it physically and mentally in the final. If Serena is in Maria's half and both make the SF, then her chances are over. In the event she miraculously gets by Serena, there's no way she's beating them both in back to back matches.

You really don't know Maria :lol:

sweetadri06
Dec 16th, 2012, 01:12 AM
Sharapova will have to hope Azarenka beats Serena in a tough, physical, marathon 3+ hour battle in the SF to stand a chance in Australia IMO, and hope Azarenka is feeling it physically and mentally in the final. If Serena is in Maria's half and both make the SF, then her chances are over. In the event she miraculously gets by Serena, there's no way she's beating them both in back to back matches.

If she beats Serena in the SF,i don't think she would lose in the final. Same situation if Vika beats Serena, theyhave to both feel like no one else stands in their way and very confident.

Stonerpova
Dec 16th, 2012, 05:08 AM
I'm sorry but it's a matter of record that Maria couldn't train for most of the offseason, she withdrew from her warm-up tournament for that very reason :shrug: You guys might not like it, but that's a fact. She played well at the AO on the whole, but she didn't play as well as she did from the claycourt season onwards. In particular, her forehand in her last few tournaments of 2012 was unrecognisable compared to the jerky piece of crap it was for her first few tournaments of the year.

Yep. Even against Kerber at the AO (in my opinion her best match of the fortnight) her forehand still wasn't as good as it was at Istanbul. I just watched highlights of her Stosur annihilation and it's pretty amazing how much her strokes in general have improved since the start of this year.

Also, as a side note, Maria's form dipped pretty significantly in the second week of the Aussie Open. She needed all of her mental fortitude to put a slumping Lisicki away, she was really inconsistent against Makarova, and she won her semi against Kvitova with guts and not much else. Azarenka played a great final, but it's pretty clear that Maria was having a very, very bad day at the office.

ShiftyFella
Dec 16th, 2012, 09:02 AM
Azarenka won her her first Major title on the 7th year in WTA tour with the experience of 24 Slam tournaments ... She is this type of hard workers , who are spending their whole life on practice courts and trying to compensate lack of talent/power with determinantion, consistency, being fit . She reached her peak physical form in 2012 and still mananged to win only 1 Slam on which Serena was injured and Sharapova was after injury , won two PMs, on which Serena was absent ...
and eventually she managed to "back up" her #1 ranking by straight losses to both Serena and Masha at YEC (just in comparison check how Novak legitimated his ranking)

She is not among those champions who could win big titles with a help of pure talent like Hingis, Sharapova, Clijsters and even Kuznetsova (i won't even touch more accomplished players), She wasn't competitive vs top players from her join to the tour... There was never "she'll be next great champion" in her game ... It's enough to check her W/L %, almost absence of any titles on non HC surfaces to understand to what league she does belong ....

That's it
:lol: @ you. She was considered "next big thing" after winning two junior slams and finishing YE #1 in junior ranking, having success in mixed but she was held back because of her 'mental weakness' not her game, this year she finally 'conquered' her daemons and backed up her junior AO slam by winning it at pro level, also she has OG Gold, yeah it's mixed but still this is OG GOLD something 'more accomplished' Sharapova failed to achieve

Six Feet Under
Dec 16th, 2012, 09:04 AM
Explaining my reasoning behind 4-2 Vika: Vika will be to consistent for most occasions but Masha will have a few good days. I think Maria is a clear favourite on grass and Vika is a clear favourite on AO type hardcourts. I don't think there will be much between them on clay despite marias 'red clay dominance' I don't think anyone has dominated clay since Henin and the results will be unpredictable.

doomsday
Dec 16th, 2012, 09:45 AM
:lol: @ you. She was considered "next big thing" after winning two junior slams and finishing YE #1 in junior ranking, having success in mixed but she was held back because of her 'mental weakness' not her game, this year she finally 'conquered' her daemons and backed up her junior AO slam by winning it at pro level, also she has OG Gold, yeah it's mixed but still this is OG GOLD something 'more accomplished' Sharapova failed to achieve

:facepalm: noone give a rat ass about doubles even less about mixed doubles. If Vika wasn't your fave you would probably don't even know that she won a gold medal heck you just reminded me that she had one.:lol:

heavyhorse
Dec 16th, 2012, 10:03 AM
:facepalm: noone give a rat ass about doubles even less about mixed doubles. If Vika wasn't your fave you would probably don't even know that she won a gold medal heck you just reminded me that she had one.:lol:

I didn't even know she had one. Infact I forgot 'mixed doubles' even existed. :tape:

heavyhorse
Dec 16th, 2012, 10:19 AM
The Azarenka fans have gotten so cocky with Maria. It would be funny if in 2013 Maria started crushing her. :lol: That would make the rivalry much more interesting, especially between fans.

ReboundAce
Dec 16th, 2012, 10:52 AM
Explaining my reasoning behind 4-2 Vika: Vika will be to consistent for most occasions but Masha will have a few good days. I think Maria is a clear favourite on grass and Vika is a clear favourite on AO type hardcourts. I don't think there will be much between them on clay despite marias 'red clay dominance' I don't think anyone has dominated clay since Henin and the results will be unpredictable.

I disagree on this matter beacuse as Martha's game evolves and the serve is not her weapon anymore,she is better on clay than on grass, her game on grass is so weak, she can be easily beat by any more consistent and better server than her...but on clay maria will have the advantage over Vika:)

ShiftyFella
Dec 16th, 2012, 10:53 AM
:facepalm: noone give a rat ass about doubles even less about mixed doubles. If Vika wasn't your fave you would probably don't even know that she won a gold medal heck you just reminded me that she had one.:lol:
:facepalm: she's not my fave and just because you don't care about doubles\mixed doesn't mean other don't, besides it's Olympics every medal there counts. fact is Vika has two OG medals and Pova only one, so stay pressed.


btw. let me guess you probably forgot that she has won two GS in mixed and been RU in doubles GS F too?:lol:

doomsday
Dec 16th, 2012, 11:28 AM
I disagree on this matter beacuse as Martha's game evolves and the serve is not her weapon anymore,she is better on clay than on grass, her game on grass is so weak, she can be easily beat by any more consistent and better server than her...but on clay maria will have the advantage over Vika:)

Maria's game on grass isn't weak, I liked what I saw in OG against Lisicki(a very big hitter and big server as well) and Clijsters.
It's true that grass became her worst surface and she can be easily rushed especially on the FH side by the biggest hitters sth Azarenka isn't though.
Azarenka's serve is even more attackable on grass, her ROS are even less effective than on HC her timing is really different not to mention that she can't generate pace and redirect it as well as she can on HC.

:facepalm: she's not my fave and just because you don't care about doubles\mixed doesn't mean other don't, besides it's Olympics every medal there counts. fact is Vika has two OG medals and Pova only one, so stay pressed.


btw. let me guess you probably forgot that she has won two GS in mixed and been RU in doubles GS F too?:lol:

You can't forget sth you don't know :lol:

Carlsbadwanska
Dec 16th, 2012, 11:31 AM
0-0

bandabou
Dec 16th, 2012, 11:54 AM
You back up slam wins with SFs now? :haha:

The vacuum that Azarenka won all those matches in was a weakened state of the tour. Still, it only took for a few girls to play well again and Azarenka was unable to win anything big for the rest of the year until Bombjing.

Serena is still fit and healthy, Petra remains to be seen, and Martha is capable of beating her. More girls are going to come out against her after a year like this.

Her '13 season will be worse than her '12 season. That's almost a given. She doesn't have anything special to dominate.


Ah please...what's with this non-sense? Masha went 2 years without so much a final, then she nabbed major nr 2 and then other 2 years for no.3, then FOUR years without winning one..so why are you guys all over Vika? :shrug:

Let's wait out and see how Vika plays this out.

bandabou
Dec 16th, 2012, 11:56 AM
Sharapova served out her chance at beating Serena in a slam final pretty easily :shrug:

So did Stosur..is she better than Vika too?! :shrug:

JarkaFish
Dec 16th, 2012, 11:59 AM
Ah please...what's with this non-sense? Masha went 2 years without so much a final, then she nabbed major nr 2 and then other 2 years for no.3, then FOUR years without winning one..so why are you guys all over Vika? :shrug:

Let's wait out and see how Vika plays this out.

Such a pure talent. :oh:

ReboundAce
Dec 16th, 2012, 12:53 PM
Maria's game on grass isn't weak, I liked what I saw in OG against Lisicki(a very big hitter and big server as well) and Clijsters.
It's true that grass became her worst surface and she can be easily rushed especially on the FH side by the biggest hitters sth Azarenka isn't though.
Azarenka's serve is even more attackable on grass, her ROS are even less effective than on HC her timing is really different not to mention that she can't generate pace and redirect it as well as she can on HC.



You can't forget sth you don't know :lol:

Still very constructive by your side, but i don't see Maria as the same player she was few years ago before the surgery...when if it wasn't for Venus to beat her on two ocasions(in London) she probably would have lifted the dish two more times, but still she loves Wimbledon more than any other GS and is not able to produce a grass game, which means grass doesn't suit her anymore :(

doomsday
Dec 16th, 2012, 01:41 PM
Still very constructive by your side, but i don't see Maria as the same player she was few years ago before the surgery...when if it wasn't for Venus to beat her on two ocasions(in London) she probably would have lifted the dish two more times, but still she loves Wimbledon more than any other GS and is not able to produce a grass game, which means grass doesn't suit her anymore :(

I don't either, the surgery is part of it but there is also the fact that she is not playing on the surface as much as she used to. Since 2006, grass isn't Maria's best surface anymore IMO she adjusted her game to HC a lot more back in the day which was normal considering she was playing a lot more tournaments on the surface.
Her game now suits slow HC and clay more than the fastest surfaces but when we know that there are only few fast tournaments left it's only natural to see her making adjustments to those surfaces. She is a contender at every major with this tennis but Wimbledon will be more difficult to win again that's for sure but I prefer the way it is, I like Hodg's approach with Maria's tennis someone like Kvitova will have to do the very same to shine everywhere so far only the fastest surfaces are her kindergarden.

Monzanator
Dec 16th, 2012, 03:37 PM
Really? Sharapova "was after injury" at the AO? That's your excuse.... jesus. Stans like you deserve every beating she receives because you`re obviously unwilling to acknowledge reality.

So do all the Azarenka fans who always claim she only loses matches when she's injured. The boot is also on the other foot unless apart from being a bandwagoner you're also a hypocrite and I can perfectly see why :lol:

She's not a good athlete, and she has a limited variety of shots at her disposal. She achieves what she does through hard work and determination, which is totally commendable, it just gets a bit odd when her fans disparage other players for doing the same. :shrug:

You didn't answer the question and I can understand why :lol: Winning Wimbledon at 17 blows all the haters out of the water straight away cause they know their fave has never done that and never will unless Vekic pulls the rabbit out of the hat :D

The Azarenka fans have gotten so cocky with Maria. It would be funny if in 2013 Maria started crushing her. :lol: That would make the rivalry much more interesting, especially between fans.

Yes, they have. Wozniacki fans acted the same especially after that USO and IW matches. But look where they are now. Either silent as a bunny or bandwagoning Azarenka and pretending to be long-time fans. Hogwash and hypocrisy at it's peak :lol:

Ah please...what's with this non-sense? Masha went 2 years without so much a final, then she nabbed major nr 2 and then other 2 years for no.3, then FOUR years without winning one..so why are you guys all over Vika? :shrug:

Let's wait out and see how Vika plays this out.

Vika will play this out against much weaker field than Maria was forced to after her Wimbledon win. So this comparison makes no sense. For me Serena, Venus, Clijsters, Henin, Davenport, Mauresmo >>>>> Serena, Radwanska, Wozniacki, Li and Kvitova. Unless you disagree? :wavey:

JarkaFish
Dec 16th, 2012, 03:43 PM
Vika will play this out against much weaker field than Maria was forced to after her Wimbledon win. So this comparison makes no sense. For me Serena, Venus, Clijsters, Henin, Davenport, Mauresmo >>>>> Serena, Radwanska, Wozniacki, Li and Kvitova. Unless you disagree? :wavey:

But Maria's playing against the same field Azarenka is now and is still unable to win more than one slam every couple years. :shrug:

NashaMasha
Dec 16th, 2012, 03:45 PM
Ah please...what's with this non-sense? then FOUR years without winning one..so why are you guys all over Vika? :shrug:


:lol: how stupid a poster should be not to understand that players on surgery table and some time after it can't win Slams

blistering
Dec 16th, 2012, 03:49 PM
I get the feeling bandabou posts even more about Maria than her own stans :spit: I mean he's covering EVERY single thread about her and then some. His ability to bring Maria into unrelated threads is mighty impressive :hearts:

Monzanator
Dec 16th, 2012, 04:28 PM
But Maria's playing against the same field Azarenka is now and is still unable to win more than one slam every couple years. :shrug:

Makes no difference, it was about Azarenka playing it out, not Sharapova :shrug: Sharapova has nothing to prove anymore even is she doesn't win a single match on the tour again.

Besides I've said before I don't expect Sharapova to win a single title again on hard and grass surfaces and we only have one GS on clay these days so it's obvious she stands no chance of winning multiple slams per year :D And you've said Sharapova is "no pure talent", so that confirms your logic anyway :bounce:

bandabou
Dec 16th, 2012, 05:42 PM
Vika will play this out against much weaker field than Maria was forced to after her Wimbledon win. So this comparison makes no sense. For me Serena, Venus, Clijsters, Henin, Davenport, Mauresmo >>>>> Serena, Radwanska, Wozniacki, Li and Kvitova. Unless you disagree? :wavey:

Nice..but the last two of Maria's wins have come against Ivanovic and Errani, so it ain't like she was really tearing it apart against the older generation, no?! :shrug:

blistering
Dec 16th, 2012, 05:53 PM
Nice..but the last two of Maria's wins have come against Ivanovic and Errani, so it ain't like she was really tearing it apart against the older generation, no?! :shrug:

She ended Henin's 30+ win streak at the 2008 AO. She also beat Dementieva, Ivanovic and Jankovic in the peak years of their respective careers.

Her draw in RG was fairly easy but she backed it up by beating everybody and their mamas on real, red clay that season, so picking up the Suzanne Lenglen trophy was a mere formality after that. Aside form the 4th round shitfest against Klara, she demolished everyone. Sharapova was a lock for the title, and her lone loss that claycourt season came at the hands of her master Williams in that weird clay where Serena looks somewhat relevant.

madmax
Dec 16th, 2012, 05:59 PM
I get the feeling bandabou posts even more about Maria than her own stans :spit: I mean he's covering EVERY single thread about her and then some. His ability to bring Maria into unrelated threads is mighty impressive :hearts:

he's such an obvious Mashenka stan it just screams from all of his posts:worship:
It's only a matter of time before he comes out of the closet me thinks...

Toxic
Dec 16th, 2012, 06:12 PM
Vika 4-0 including 2 bagels http://imgsrv2.tennisuniverse.com/wtaworld/images/smilies/notworthy.gif

Cosmic Voices
Dec 16th, 2012, 06:50 PM
I get the feeling bandabou posts even more about Maria than her own stans :spit: I mean he's covering EVERY single thread about her and then some. His ability to bring Maria into unrelated threads is mighty impressive :hearts:

:oh:


so true

bandabou
Dec 16th, 2012, 06:53 PM
I get the feeling bandabou posts even more about Maria than her own stans :spit: I mean he's covering EVERY single thread about her and then some. His ability to bring Maria into unrelated threads is mighty impressive :hearts:

well, well..look who we got here?! Which formerly banned Mashatard are you?! :lol:

bandabou
Dec 16th, 2012, 06:56 PM
She ended Henin's 30+ win streak at the 2008 AO. She also beat Dementieva, Ivanovic and Jankovic in the peak years of their respective careers.

Her draw in RG was fairly easy but she backed it up by beating everybody and their mamas on real, red clay that season, so picking up the Suzanne Lenglen trophy was a mere formality after that. Aside form the 4th round shitfest against Klara, she demolished everyone. Sharapova was a lock for the title, and her lone loss that claycourt season came at the hands of her master Williams in that weird clay where Serena looks somewhat relevant.

and Vika beat Masha to win her first major..so it ain't like she beat a nobody, no?
Let's wait out and see what Vika does next year, before she's made out to be one slam wonder. All I'm saying.

18majors
Dec 16th, 2012, 07:21 PM
Hope Vika will play Petra more than once in 2013.

JarkaFish
Dec 16th, 2012, 07:22 PM
and Vika beat Masha to win her first major..so it ain't like she beat a nobody, no?
Let's wait out and see what Vika does next year, before she's made out to be one slam wonder. All I'm saying.

Dont forget Clijsters in the semis. :shrug:

But nah she's just a vulture taking advantage of a weak era.

dsanders06
Dec 16th, 2012, 07:29 PM
Still very constructive by your side, but i don't see Maria as the same player she was few years ago before the surgery...when if it wasn't for Venus to beat her on two ocasions(in London) she probably would have lifted the dish two more times, but still she loves Wimbledon more than any other GS and is not able to produce a grass game, which means grass doesn't suit her anymore :(

Her deteriation on grass isn't JUST because of the surgery -- even in 2006, before the shoulder troubles and when she generally played extremely well, her form on grass was noticeably worse than in 2004 or 2005. After her growth spurt in late '05, it just became much harder for her to strike the ball cleanly when she was having to stoop and/or hit upwards so much more than she did when she won it in '04.

Kuzzy24
Dec 16th, 2012, 07:34 PM
What are the differences between Maria's HC game and grass game?
I always thought no matter what her game always translated to grass due to her big serve ( when on) and big ground strokes , which are probably the most consistent in the top 10

VIKANADAL01
Dec 17th, 2012, 06:16 AM
Vika 3/1

Matt01
Dec 17th, 2012, 01:33 PM
and Vika beat Masha to win her first major..so it ain't like she beat a nobody, no?


But Masha was "after injury" in that tournament couldn't train properly during the off-season :shrug:

NashaMasha
Dec 17th, 2012, 04:29 PM
Dont forget Clijsters in the semis. :shrug:

But nah she's just a vulture taking advantage of a weak era.

Clijsters in 2012 was just a shade of real Clijsters and at AO she was also after a long break from tennis

Jimmie48
Dec 17th, 2012, 06:05 PM
Clijsters in 2012 was just a shade of real Clijsters and at AO she was also after a long break from tennis

Don't you think it has become kind of childish that you have a weak excuse for every one of her matches? I mean seriously, this is cringe-worthy.

JarkaFish
Dec 17th, 2012, 06:09 PM
Clijsters in 2012 was just a shade of real Clijsters and at AO she was also after a long break from tennis

Pretty sure you could come up with bullshit excuses for Maria's slam victories as well. :shrug:

Monzanator
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:26 PM
Don't you think it has become kind of childish that you have a weak excuse for every one of her matches? I mean seriously, this is cringe-worthy.

So you think Clijsters 2012 > Clijsters 2005? :lol: Yeah, right...

Pretty sure you could come up with bullshit excuses for Maria's slam victories as well. :shrug:

Maria's entire career is just one big excuse. I'm surprised you haven't noticed that already :shrug:

Cosmic Voices
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:28 PM
oh my this thread is a mess :help:

Miss Atomic Bomb
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:29 PM
Just screams inferiority complex.

And it just keeps on getting worse with each pressed Martha-fan post :lol:

bandabou
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:53 PM
So you think Clijsters 2012 > Clijsters 2005? :lol: Yeah, right...

well..she was the defending champ, no?!:shrug:

U gonna belittle every win of Vika like that and act like Maria was beating the older generation regularly?! :lol:

mikepails
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:58 PM
Well in fairness to Maria she did win 3 of her 4 slams beating the old true greats of the game like Henin or Serena, which Azarenka has never done. Maria isnt the same player she was then though, and I think these days Azarenka is the better player and will win most of their matches and more slams from here (if Maria wins any). That doesnt mean she will ever surpass Maria's career though, Maria has a huge lead already which will be hard to close and pass by even though Azarenka probably has more future success.

Monzanator
Dec 17th, 2012, 07:59 PM
well..she was the defending champ, no?!:shrug:

U gonna belittle every win of Vika like that and act like Maria was beating the older generation regularly?! :lol:

I didn't say she was beating the older generation. I've said Maria competed against tougher competition in her peak days than Vika in 2012. Competing doesn't mean beating :facepalm:

Heck, Maria's last two slams can be belittled by anyone and I won't complain because of her final's opponents. Her win over Serena has also been analyzed left, right and center and we all know by now that was the godmother of all flukes and I only need to find an excuse for USO 06. Wasn't Henin ill or something there? That makes it perfect, Maria was so damn lucky in all her slam wins it's an insult to any tennis fan to even call her a GS champion :rolleyes: There, much better now I think? :)

ServeCaspian
Dec 17th, 2012, 11:26 PM
I don't get why Maria's Finals opponents are criticized so much, especially since Ana was actually a legitimate top player in 2008. It's the players you beat overall. Everyone has had easy opponent finals even Serena with Safina, Vera, Vika etc.

Natural Joe
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:15 AM
I don't get why Maria's Finals opponents are criticized so much, especially since Ana was actually a legitimate top player in 2008. It's the players you beat overall. Everyone has had easy opponent finals even Serena with Safina, Vera, Vika etc.

OK, two things. First of all, if Vika is an easy opponent doesn't that make Masha's 3-6 0-6 loss even more embarrassing? :scratch: Secondly, how exactly was the USO final an easy match for Serena? :facepalm: But I gotta say it's cute how you were trying to throw shade with this comment yet completely failed. :lol:

oh my this thread is a mess :help:

Nothing else was to expect. :o It's nearly impossible to discuss certain topics on this board as there will always be some childish and pressed posters that seem to enjoy hating on certain players more than anything. IMO it's just a waist of time to discuss with those people.

champion88
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:19 AM
Venus gonna slay them all! :armed:

Okay, maybe not but would like to see her make QF with a nice draw.... I really think Serena will win this one and rectify the mess of last year!

Natural Joe
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:25 AM
Venus gonna slay them all! :armed:

Okay, maybe not but would like to see her make QF with a nice draw.... I really think Serena will win this one and rectify the mess of last year!

Are you sure that's the right thread? :lol:

champion88
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:32 AM
Are you sure that's the right thread? :lol:

Oops, maybe supposed to be the "WWW 2013 AO" thread :o

slamchamp
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:35 AM
OK, two things. First of all, if Vika is an easy opponent doesn't that make Masha's 3-6 0-6 loss even more embarrassing? :scratch: Secondly, how exactly was the USO final an easy match for Serena? :facepalm: But I gotta say it's cute how you were trying to throw shade with this comment yet completely failed. :lol:



idiot:weirdo:

MashaAzarenka
Dec 18th, 2012, 12:41 AM
I think it will be very close but I see Vika coming out on top again this year.

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 06:20 AM
I didn't say she was beating the older generation. I've said Maria competed against tougher competition in her peak days than Vika in 2012. Competing doesn't mean beating :facepalm:

Heck, Maria's last two slams can be belittled by anyone and I won't complain because of her final's opponents. Her win over Serena has also been analyzed left, right and center and we all know by now that was the godmother of all flukes and I only need to find an excuse for USO 06. Wasn't Henin ill or something there? That makes it perfect, Maria was so damn lucky in all her slam wins it's an insult to any tennis fan to even call her a GS champion :rolleyes: There, much better now I think? :)

And so what? You can only beat who's in front of you. Vika's been competitive with Serena numerous times...just needs that last lil step of beating her at a major.

All I'm saying stop acting like Masha's some demi-God while Vika's just a junior. For a player with 4 majors, sure Masha gets overhyped at times.

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 06:30 AM
Well in fairness to Maria she did win 3 of her 4 slams beating the old true greats of the game like Henin or Serena, which Azarenka has never done. Maria isnt the same player she was then though, and I think these days Azarenka is the better player and will win most of their matches and more slams from here (if Maria wins any). That doesnt mean she will ever surpass Maria's career though, Maria has a huge lead already which will be hard to close and pass by even though Azarenka probably has more future success.

Juju was already gone when Vika was coming into her own...and Vika gave Serena all she could handle at the U.S. open. Just a matter of time, before she beats Serena.

And about surpassing Maria..time will tell, no?! :shrug:

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 07:12 AM
And so what? You can only beat who's in front of you. Vika's been competitive with Serena numerous times...just needs that last lil step of beating her at a major.

All I'm saying stop acting like Masha's some demi-God while Vika's just a junior. For a player with 4 majors, sure Masha gets overhyped at times.

Compared to Vika she really is though :lol: Vika had an amazing year but this comparison with Sharapova is ridiculous.
Let Vika some time to prove that she is part of the elite and not a one slam wonder. This is basically her first year at the top of women's tennis.
Maria on her side has been on the top since 2004 and has nothing to prove anymore.


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JarkaFish
Dec 18th, 2012, 07:27 AM
Maria fans can keep basking in the glory of her achievements, in the present day though Azarenka is the better player. :shrug:

Maria fans can't stand this though so have to resort to a career-achievement penis measuring contest.

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 07:52 AM
Maria fans can keep basking in the glory of her achievements, in the present day though Azarenka is the better player. :shrug:

Maria fans can't stand this though so have to resort to a career-achievement penis measuring contest.

I personally don't think that Vika is clearly the better player of the two right now.
Peak Vika right now has the exact same results at majors as Past peak Pova (2 major finals for both)
Maria even won more points than Vika if we're counting the 6 biggest tournaments this year.

heavyhorse
Dec 18th, 2012, 07:53 AM
Maria fans can keep basking in the glory of her achievements, in the present day though Azarenka is the better player. :shrug:

Maria fans can't stand this though so have to resort to a career-achievement penis measuring contest.

Well of course Vika played better this year - she wouldn't be #1 otherwise :confused:

Does that make her a better overall player than Maria? I doubt it. And I'd be stunned if this Vika reign will last throughout 2013 as well. It seems like people are beginning to figure out her game and get past that ridiculous poodle howl she does everytime she hits the ball.

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 09:17 AM
I personally don't think that Vika is clearly the better player of the two right now.
Peak Vika right now has the exact same results at majors as Past peak Pova (2 major finals for both)
Maria even won more points than Vika if we're counting the 6 biggest tournaments this year.

Hmm....all well and dandy, but :secret: Peak Masha never even HAD two finals in ONE calendar year and Vika was 2 points away from winning TWO in a year. A lil bit more respect, I'd say.

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 09:24 AM
Compared to Vika she really is though :lol: Vika had an amazing year but this comparison with Sharapova is ridiculous.
Let Vika some time to prove that she is part of the elite and not a one slam wonder. This is basically her first year at the top of women's tennis.
Maria on her side has been on the top since 2004 and has nothing to prove anymore.


Sent from my iPhone using Verticalsports.com Free App (http://www.verticalsports.com/mobile)

Well, Masha was deemed as megastar after just one major too, no?! :shrug:
Maria's greater than Vika career-wise, but Vika's in the discussion of the best players of tour right niw.

ServeCaspian
Dec 18th, 2012, 09:49 AM
If Maria were compared to Venus in 2004 she would have been dismissed. :shrug:
Anyway, I'd say Vika had a better year although the numbers don't lie and it is very close, and that's with Vika playing more tournaments and her ranking system abuse or having an agent who's 'extremely good at math', however you want to put it.

It's probably the most interesting matchup for next year. I'll be interested to see how Vika backs this season up and what improvements Maria will make. Although realistically you don't know what's going to happen with any of them. This time last year nobody would have predicted Vika's start, before the clay season nobody would have predicted Maria's success (her fans believed she could but it's different from expecting it) and while Serena may still have been favoured for Wimbledon she was not considered to be in/expected to reach the form that would give her the second half of the season. You can't predict it really, that's why we watch.

jedw
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:22 AM
Azarenka, because she can *play tennis*
:p

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:25 AM
If Maria were compared to Venus in 2004 she would have been dismissed. :shrug:form that would give her the second half of the season.

And right now she wouldn't be dismissed?! :unsure:

AnnieIWillKnow
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:30 AM
And right now she wouldn't be dismissed?! :unsure:

I don't think anyone would say in all seriousness that Maria is a greater player than Venus, but the debate wouldn't be outright dismissed - as Maria has the career slam argument now. You could have a discussion over it, whereas in 2004 you'd be laughed out the room.

ServeCaspian
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:33 AM
And right now she wouldn't be dismissed?! :unsure:

You see this is your problem. You're too messy.
Right now there could at least be debate, in '04 nobody would have even read a thread suggesting such unless they wanted a laugh. Now that that's out of the way.... :rolleyes:

If you are at all better informed now, or (highly unlikely) actually interested in this thread for more than just trolling my post may seem a little clearer for you.

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:38 AM
Hmm....all well and dandy, but :secret: Peak Masha never even HAD two finals in ONE calendar year and Vika was 2 points away from winning TWO in a year. A lil bit more respect, I'd say.

Cause Maria was playing against the greatest players of modern tennis.
Sharapova peaked in a tougher era.

I don't even need to go there, there is zero comparison between the two.
Beside Maria reached 3 majors finals in less than 1 year (without even playing that well tbh) sth she couldn't even do back in the day, the field is just crappier these days.


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ServeCaspian
Dec 18th, 2012, 10:58 AM
Hmm....all well and dandy, but :secret: Peak Masha never even HAD two finals in ONE calendar year and Vika was 2 points away from winning TWO in a year. A lil bit more respect, I'd say.

:confused:
You are positively unhinged. And to think I was lulled into actually replying to your posts. :o
How does this make any sense? Peak Maria never made 2 GS Finals in a single year but post-op Maria did while playing far from her peak, yet Vika is better or deserves to be looked as equal because at her peak thus far she managed to equal (not surpass) something which post-op crapova also managed?

You're gonna have to walk me through it boo, because there's no fucking logic in that. There isn't even irrational logic. It's just all different kinds of mess. :o

bandabou
Dec 18th, 2012, 01:51 PM
:confused:
You are positively unhinged. And to think I was lulled into actually replying to your posts. :o
How does this make any sense? Peak Maria never made 2 GS Finals in a single year but post-op Maria did while playing far from her peak, yet Vika is better or deserves to be looked as equal because at her peak thus far she managed to equal (not surpass) something which post-op crapova also managed?

You're gonna have to walk me through it boo, because there's no fucking logic in that. There isn't even irrational logic. It's just all different kinds of mess. :o

Not for her career..but she shouldn't be dimissed as just a junior player either. She had a strong coming out year. now let's wait and see how she does next year. Her rivalry with Masha isn't about career achievements.

@danieln1
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:12 PM
2 players I dont like, but the worst is Azarenka, so.... Actually, if both of them could lose it would be fine by me :secret:

HRHoliviasmith
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:13 PM
2 players I dont like, but the worst is Azarenka, so.... Actually, if both of them could lose it would be fine by me :secret:

:tears:

@danieln1
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:22 PM
:tears:

Nooooooo olivia... For you I can hate Sharapova more :happy:

dsanders06
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:27 PM
If Maria were compared to Venus in 2004 she would have been dismissed. :shrug:
Anyway, I'd say Vika had a better year although the numbers don't lie and it is very close, and that's with Vika playing more tournaments and her ranking system abuse or having an agent who's 'extremely good at math', however you want to put it.

Exactly :lol: Vika obviously had a better season in that she has a slight edge on Maria in pretty much every category - but emphasis on the "slight", her edge in all those categories are extremely slim, so :lol: at some Vikastans trying to pretend she's in some whole other league. Even going by ranking points, Vika has something like a 0.5% lead over Maria.


And right now she wouldn't be dismissed?! :unsure:

I don't think anyone would say in all seriousness that Maria is a greater player than Venus, but the debate wouldn't be outright dismissed - as Maria has the career slam argument now. You could have a discussion over it, whereas in 2004 you'd be laughed out the room.

One more Slam for Maria and then.... :oh:

StoneRose
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:36 PM
^^Agree that the difference between their achievements this year is almost negligent. This is about H2H though and there the difference is at least a bit bigger. Maria has to win more than one slam from here to be compared to Venus (actually three), but there's every chance of that happening from here. I hope it does happen (but preferably not in a final against Vika).

Jimmie48
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:49 PM
Exactly :lol: Vika obviously had a better season in that she has a slight edge on Maria in pretty much every category - but emphasis on the "slight", her edge in all those categories are extremely slim, so :lol: at some Vikastans trying to pretend she's in some whole other league.

So a slight advantage equals two absolute beatdowns in important finals? :haha:

Delusional...

Monzanator
Dec 18th, 2012, 02:53 PM
Hmm....all well and dandy, but :secret: Peak Masha never even HAD two finals in ONE calendar year and Vika was 2 points away from winning TWO in a year. A lil bit more respect, I'd say.

I'll start respect Azarenka if she stops faking injuries when losing to Sharapova :wavey:

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 03:30 PM
I'll start respect Azarenka if she stops faking injuries when losing to Sharapova :wavey:

I agree with this, in her last 4 losses to Maria she pretended to be injured or sth.
Beijing 2009 : Maria's comment says it all (is her last name Jankovic)
Rome : she retired
Stuttgart : extremely injured
YEC : acting up while losing

She is a sore loser and even more against Maria, that's really sad cause she is a good competitor but her behavior sucks.

HRHoliviasmith
Dec 18th, 2012, 03:39 PM
I agree with this, in her last 4 losses to Maria she pretended to be injured or sth.
Beijing 2009 : Maria's comment says it all (is her last name Jankovic)
Rome : she retired
Stuttgart : extremely injured
YEC : acting up while losing

She is a sore loser and even more against Maria, that's really sad cause she is a good competitor but her behavior sucks.

which Rome? 2011? :angel:

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:08 PM
So a slight advantage equals two absolute beatdowns in important finals? :haha:

Delusional...

You're the delusional one.
Sharapova also beat Vika badly in Stuttgart final not only that but in the 4 majors and YEC and OG she collected more points than the current N1.
The advantage to Vika isn't that high, without Linz and another MM points she might have ended N2 in the world.

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:09 PM
which Rome? 2011? :angel:

She wasn't going to win either anyway :shrug:

Jimmie48
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:16 PM
The advantage to Vika isn't that high, without Linz and another MM points she might have ended N2 in the world.

Oh dear god, you`ve exhausted everything else..now we're down to labeling Vika a vulture :lol:

I'm still wondering where that point is reached where the self-respect of you guys kicks in... but I guess we`re not at the bottom just yet.

Craig.
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:17 PM
Oh dear god, you`ve exhausted everything else..now we're down to labeling Vika a vulture :lol:

I'm still wondering where that point is reached where the self-respect of you guys kicks in... but I guess we`re not at the bottom just yet.

REALLY? YOU of all people talking about self-respect?

Jimmie48
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:31 PM
I have nothing to blame myself for :)

doomsday
Dec 18th, 2012, 04:40 PM
I have nothing to blame myself for :)

Like he said, no self respect.:lol:

Aryman3
Dec 18th, 2012, 05:00 PM
What if this rivalry won't be important for WTA 2013 ranking of top players?

Natural Joe
Dec 18th, 2012, 05:32 PM
What if this rivalry won't be important for WTA 2013 ranking of top players?

Well, some players will have to fight for the ranks 2 and 3 behind Aga, right? :shrug:

On topic: I think Vika and Maria will meet three or four times next year. If I had to guess I'd say Vika will win the H2H 2-1.