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Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 12:42 PM
This shouldn't be seen as bashing thread, but my question is, why Rome seems to be so much better than Madrid.
I mean, look at the crowd, yesterday and today, we get full stands (e.g. Pennetta vs. Kirilenko) and even Masha vs. McHale on Center Court was filled really good.
Madrid had like 5 people in the stands for the women's matches till Friday, then 10 :help:
What's the reason for such an huge crowd at Rome? :scratch:

Also the transmission of the matches is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay better than in Madrid, we get a lot of matches on ES/ES2/Livestreams.

IMO, Rome is a really good advertisement for the sport, Madrid wasn't. :shrug:

What's your opinion on that? :D

sweetadri06
May 15th, 2012, 12:44 PM
Rome has more tradition, better clay courts and the fans appreciate women's tennis. Not so much in Madrid.

Jorn
May 15th, 2012, 12:44 PM
Rome is a 70 years old tournament and more known, Madrid is not...

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 12:47 PM
yeah, but both cities are nearly the same size (Madrid: 3,2 Mio inhabitants; Rome: 2,7 Mio)
and still Rome has the much bigger crowd, although I think tennis is higher in Spain than in Italy, isn't it :shrug:

jameshazza
May 15th, 2012, 12:48 PM
Madrid is still in its infancy and is owned by a lunatic determined to make it the biggest farce on tour. Rome has always been great.

Jorn
May 15th, 2012, 12:49 PM
yeah, but both cities are nearly the same size (Madrid: 3,2 Mio inhabitants; Rome: 2,7 Mio)
and still Rome has the much bigger crowd, although I think tennis is higher in Spain than in Italy, isn't it :shrug:
I did watch some mens matches, at the BIG 3 there were full crowd, so maybe they don't like the womens in madrid...

thrust
May 15th, 2012, 12:50 PM
Rome has more tradition, better clay courts and the fans appreciate women's tennis. Not so much in Madrid.

TRUE!

Queenpova
May 15th, 2012, 01:11 PM
outdoors. more attendance.

flareon
May 15th, 2012, 01:13 PM
I like this pennetta v kirilenko match there is much atmosphere it really does make the sport good.

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 01:15 PM
I like this pennetta v kirilenko match there is much atmosphere it really does make the sport good.

yep, that's what I'm talking about, Rome should be the 5th slam :hearts:

TheBoiledEgg
May 15th, 2012, 01:16 PM
Italian Open was the 5th slam and regarded as such until this new stupid name change into Masters and whatever :bs: name it is now

Rest Maria!
May 15th, 2012, 01:16 PM
I did watch some mens matches, at the BIG 3 there were full crowd, so maybe they don't like the womens in madrid...

Matches with Spaniards were also full.

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 01:18 PM
Matches with Spaniards were also full.

But not on the women's side :shrug:

Tenis Srbija
May 15th, 2012, 01:19 PM
outdoors. more attendance.

? Madrid is outdoors as well :lol:
Italians are more into tennis then the Spaniard.
And in terms of tradition Rome >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Madrid

madmax
May 15th, 2012, 01:19 PM
Proper clay clourts with dust swirling in your eyes
Nice attendance in all matches
Beautiful arenas filled with passionate italians

Rest Maria!
May 15th, 2012, 01:21 PM
But not on the women's side :shrug:

With stars like Nadull, Ferrer, Verdasco or Almagro you'd expect men's tennis to be vastly more popular over there. On woman's side they have Dramabel and MJMS, not really comparable.

Lisickinator
May 15th, 2012, 01:22 PM
Madrid has an ugly stadium

Zamboni
May 15th, 2012, 01:22 PM
But not on the women's side :shrug:
And you really wonder why?
Compare the ranking/careers of the Spanish men to the ranking/careers of the Spanish women, and then do the same for the Italian men and women. In Spain the men are the stars, in Italy the women.
Plus there seems to be a bigger crowd in general, the event has more tradition, etc etc.

MAGIKARPETTA
May 15th, 2012, 01:26 PM
Money (Tiriac) luckily can't buy everything. :)
In Italy we wait for this tournament all the year.

People are enthusiastic to go there and watch all the best players in the world.

Yes, we don't have a top 10 man, but I'm not able to tell you much whow we love tennis in Italy.

spiceboy
May 15th, 2012, 01:28 PM
so maybe they don't like the womens in madrid...

Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg

ptkten
May 15th, 2012, 01:29 PM
It's unbelievable the difference. Even the commentators were talking about how embarrassing it was that Maria/Serena was empty. They never should have let Madrid buy mandatory status. Rome has the history, the prestige, the crowds that make a good tennis tournament.

aloeball
May 15th, 2012, 01:31 PM
Yes !! It needs to be said !! The crowd just adds to the atmosphere of the matches and can really bring out the best in the players.

Rome is great.

Queenpova
May 15th, 2012, 01:31 PM
Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg

The power of HINGIS

Fantasy Hero
May 15th, 2012, 01:32 PM
I like this pennetta v kirilenko match there is much atmosphere it really does make the sport good.

yep, that's what I'm talking about, Rome should be the 5th slam :hearts:

:inlove:

sweetadri06
May 15th, 2012, 01:33 PM
Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg

So embarrassing. They need to downgrade this ASAP. :help:

tennisbum79
May 15th, 2012, 01:35 PM
Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg
The "empty swimming pool" look scares people away; conjures up images of drowning:lol::lol:

With that said, it is too early to call Rome a success.
Fans will start complaining as soon as they feel their faves lost because of the conditions

spiceboy
May 15th, 2012, 01:38 PM
The power of HINGIS

Hingis played only one of those YEC

Fantasy Hero
May 15th, 2012, 01:40 PM
Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg

spot the difference:

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/560214_10150830657648873_267627913872_9740812_4829 32128_n.jpg

bjurra
May 15th, 2012, 01:41 PM
Rome has more tradition, better clay courts and the fans appreciate women's tennis. Not so much in Madrid.

I have been to the WTA event (before they joined forces with ATP) and the tournament was basically empty until Wednesday/Thursday. The ATP event however has always been very popular.

bjurra
May 15th, 2012, 01:43 PM
Madrid has an ugly stadium

Amen to that.

I must say the Rome event is very pretty this year.

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 01:43 PM
Is it?

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 01:46 PM
Madrid YEC are still regarded by WTA as the best since the old times of Madison Square Garden. Atmospher was wild there every night. So it is pretty much a mystery why YEC was such a success those couple of years and Premier Madrid is an absolute disgrace.

I mean, this was no less than the semifinals between world #1 and world #3 :facepalm:

http://a5.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/577741_10150879117332631_555687630_9738342_1528680 294_n.jpg

:haha:

Even China Open has more crowd than this.

But to b fair, Spain is in its downhill of economics. Ppl r struggling to maintain their living, ain't nobody got extra money for that:o And honestly, it had better (much better) crowd a few years ago.

tennisbum79
May 15th, 2012, 01:46 PM
Rome's well documented love for naked statues in public places has always been a magnet for crowd

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/560214_10150830657648873_267627913872_9740812_4829 32128_n.jpg

Marcus1979
May 15th, 2012, 01:47 PM
Rome has always had the ability to draw the best players to play there unlike Madrid which paid money to be mandatory to force the players to attend or be penalised by the governing body.

I remember the years that Venus and Serena had a very limited schedule in the years they only ever played miami and the slams together it was either Venus or Serena that would attend most years, then we had justine who played the event pretty much every year as well as Kim, Monica, martina etc etc.

Marcus1979
May 15th, 2012, 01:48 PM
:haha:

Even China Open has more crowd than this.

But to b fair, Spain is in its downhill of economics. Ppl r struggling to maintain their living, ain't nobody got extra money for that:o And honestly, it had better (much better) crowd a few years ago.

Sydney is a much lower ranked event than this and its usually packed :lol:

Matt01
May 15th, 2012, 01:48 PM
Nice attendance in all matches
Beautiful arenas filled with passionate italians


Not really true. The attendance isn't always that great. I remember a few years ago when the WS had to play in front of empty stands and this year it for some matches it isn't that much better :shrug:

And besides that Pietrangeli Stadium is very ugly. Not quite as "cold" as that Stadium in Madrid, though.

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 01:56 PM
Sydney is a much lower ranked event than this and its usually packed :lol:

Like I said, Madrid has had better crowd as it began (2009 and 2010, I was there to experience the crowd in 2010).

Latest couple of years, becuz of its economic downhill, the crowd reduces significantly, as y'all know, Spain reduces the most in this wave.

Ain't nobody got time for that when your unemployment is at almost 30 percent.:shrug:

And personally I prefer Madrid to Rome, I dunno why, I just do.

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 01:57 PM
spot the difference:

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/560214_10150830657648873_267627913872_9740812_4829 32128_n.jpg

and that's on a TUESDAY, 2nd!!!! day of the MD!!! :bowdown::bowdown::rocker2:

Tenis Srbija
May 15th, 2012, 02:00 PM
:haha:

Even China Open has more crowd than this.

But to b fair, Spain is in its downhill of economics. Ppl r struggling to maintain their living, ain't nobody got extra money for that:o And honestly, it had better (much better) crowd a few years ago.

And Italy economy is peaking? :lol:
It's all about tennis. Rome has tradition, Madrid doesn't. End of story.

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:00 PM
Like I said, Madrid has had better crowd as it began (2009 and 2010, I was there to experience the crowd in 2010).

Latest couple of years, becuz of its economic downhill, the crowd reduces significantly, as y'all know, Spain reduces the most in this wave.

Ain't nobody got time for that when your unemployment is at almost 30 percent.:shrug:

And personally I prefer Madrid to Rome, I dunno why, I just do.

It's not like Italy is doing much better in economy :shrug:

Furthermore, the oragnisation team of Madrid, could reduce the entry, so that people can watch matches, even not having much money :shrug:

Marcus1979
May 15th, 2012, 02:00 PM
Like I said, Madrid has had better crowd as it began (2009 and 2010, I was there to experience the crowd in 2010).

Latest couple of years, becuz of its economic downhill, the crowd reduces significantly, as y'all know, Spain reduces the most in this wave.

Ain't nobody got time for that when your unemployment is at almost 30 percent.:shrug:

And personally I prefer Madrid to Rome, I dunno why, I just do.

maybe they should try and reduce ticket prices to make it more affordable so the stands don't look so bare ;)

C. Drone
May 15th, 2012, 02:03 PM
only Pietrangeli Court packed that much. Starace playing right now on center, half or more empty.

MAGIKARPETTA
May 15th, 2012, 02:03 PM
Rome's well documented love for naked statues in public places has always been a magnet for crowd

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/560214_10150830657648873_267627913872_9740812_4829 32128_n.jpg

And all watching an empty court :oh: :D

Marcus1979
May 15th, 2012, 02:05 PM
And all watching an empty court :oh: :D

imagine the crowd when the players arrive ;)

crazillo
May 15th, 2012, 02:05 PM
Prize money doesn't tell you what is the better event. Tradition does (e.g. Stuttgart and Rome).

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:06 PM
only Pietrangeli Court packed that much. Starace playing right now on center, half or more empty.

you see the pic? :unsure:
+ the stadium is big and when it is half empty, it's still nearly half more than in Madrid :facepalm:
+ Starace vs. Kubot should have been played on Pietrangeli and Flavia vs. Lil Masha on CC, it would have been full then :shrug:

still 193828940x better than Madrid, IMO :shrug:

C. Drone
May 15th, 2012, 02:14 PM
you see the pic? :unsure:
+ the stadium is big and when it is half empty, it's still nearly half more than in Madrid :facepalm:
+ Starace vs. Kubot should have been played on Pietrangeli and Flavia vs. Lil Masha on CC, it would have been full then :shrug:

still 193828940x better than Madrid, IMO :shrug:

what picture? I did check livestreams, 3 different courts.
Pietrangeli was packed even after Pennetta-Kirilenko finished. It has nothing to do with them.
Madrid had decent crowds for ATP, and center court the same size, except no boxes.
Even Delpo match had some free seats.

so Im just interested why other courts not packed and Pietrangeli is completely. :shrug:

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 02:16 PM
And Italy economy is peaking? :lol:
It's all about tennis. Rome has tradition, Madrid doesn't. End of story.

Does Italy have 30% of unemployment? (And to be specific, Italian president was accusing Spain of being the one to hinder the whole Europe)

Like I said, I witnessed what was like 2 years ago.

And yes, the Open can reduce its price but even in its peak years, Madrid Open didn't earn much money cuz they wanted a better facility (like the roof, I mean Caja Magica is actually really great) for a PM, so how can they reduce the price when all they do is losing money?:shrug:

I like Italian Open, I think it's great. But there's just no comparison, since Madrid started few years ago and now it encounters the crisis.

Rest Maria!
May 15th, 2012, 02:17 PM
so Im just interested why other courts not packed and Pietrangeli is completely. :shrug:
Women more interested in staring at statues of naked men more than watching tennis.

FORZA SARITA
May 15th, 2012, 02:17 PM
spot the difference:

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-prn1/560214_10150830657648873_267627913872_9740812_4829 32128_n.jpg
:worship::worship::worship::worship:



And besides that Pietrangeli Stadium is very ugly.

you're really a big idiot, really :facepalm:

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:18 PM
Does Italy have 30% of unemployment? (And to be specific, Italian president was accusing Spain of being the one to hinder the whole Europe)

Like I said, I witnessed what was like 2 years ago.

And yes, the Open can reduce its price but even in its peak years, Madrid Open didn't earn much money cuz they wanted a better facility (like the roof, I mean Caja Magica is actually really great) for a PM, so how can they reduce the price when all they do is losing money?:shrug:

I like Italian Open, I think it's great. But there's just no comparison, since Madrid started few years ago and now it encounters the crisis.

crisis is the same in Italy, so valid point.
Madird has more people than Rome, I'm quite sure you could find some 10.000 people with enough money to fill the stands at such a tournament :shrug::tape:

Mynarco
May 15th, 2012, 02:18 PM
Pietrangeli looks so good - those statues :inlove:
it looks small - I wonder if the capacity is >4000

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:20 PM
what picture? I did check livestreams, 3 different courts.
Pietrangeli was packed even after Pennetta-Kirilenko finished. It has nothing to do with them.
Madrid had decent crowds for ATP, and center court the same size, except no boxes.
Even Delpo match had some free seats.

so Im just interested why other courts not packed and Pietrangeli is completely. :shrug:

because the matches on it are far more interesting than the others :shrug:
We'll see now, how packed Super Tennis Arena will be now for Venus's match :dance:

Tenis Srbija
May 15th, 2012, 02:20 PM
Does Italy have 30% of unemployment? (And to be specific, Italian president was accusing Spain of being the one to hinder the whole Europe)

Like I said, I witnessed what was like 2 years ago.

And yes, the Open can reduce its price but even in its peak years, Madrid Open didn't earn much money cuz they wanted a better facility (like the roof, I mean Caja Magica is actually really great) for a PM, so how can they reduce the price when all they do is losing money?:shrug:

I like Italian Open, I think it's great. But there's just no comparison, since Madrid started few years ago and now it encounters the crisis.

The difference isn't that big. Italy is on the verge of collapse, just like Spain is. But that shouldn't affect the attendance so badly. Stands in Madrid were shockingly empty. I can't find a better reason for that but the "we don't care about tennis" opinion... :shrug:

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 02:22 PM
crisis is the same in Italy, so valid point.
Madird has more people than Rome, I'm quite sure you could find some 10.000 people with enough money to fill the stands at such a tournament :shrug::tape:

LMFAO @ this:haha:

So this is how u'll do when a tourny doesn't have enough crowd? Find ppl to fill the stand?

And like I said, the crisis, yes both Italy and Spain have. But which one has worse? It's like, try set up a tourny in Greece.

Jorn
May 15th, 2012, 02:23 PM
Its full because Kiri played! ;)

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:25 PM
LMFAO @ this:haha:

So this is how u'll do when a tourny doesn't have enough crowd? Find ppl to fill the stand?

And like I said, the crisis, yes both Italy and Spain have. But which one has worse? It's like, try set up a tourny in Greece.

No, you fool :o
I meant there should be enough people, who have enough money and are interested in tennis in a city, that has over 3 Mio. inhabitants not named Beijing :shrug::o

And the ITF tournament in Athens was/is always a nice tournament with an huge crowd :wavey:

Tenis Srbija
May 15th, 2012, 02:28 PM
LMFAO @ this:haha:

So this is how u'll do when a tourny doesn't have enough crowd? Find ppl to fill the stand?

And like I said, the crisis, yes both Italy and Spain have. But which one has worse? It's like, try set up a tourny in Greece.

:spit: do you know Greeks? They would probably live in the tournament site, have fun, parties, then some anti-goverment protest and so on... It's always party time in Greece :bounce:

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 02:28 PM
The difference isn't that big. Italy is on the verge of collapse, just like Spain is. But that shouldn't affect the attendance so badly. Stands in Madrid were shockingly empty. I can't find a better reason for that but the "we don't care about tennis" opinion... :shrug:

Yea, but that doesn't make Madrid a worse tourny.

Anyway all I'm saying is, for me I like Madrid, I like Rome too, I think every tourny has its own beauty. 4 years ago in Bangalore the stadium was FILLED, absolutely filled. But the ppl yell, spit, walk with no restriction. So does the crowd make it a better tourny? No. Becuz to judge if a tourny is better or worse, the crowd ain't the only standard. There's facilities, schedules, arrangements of the players and more. Saying Rome is SO MUCH BETTER than Madrid only judging from the number of audience ain't right.


(And yes, I'm a huge enthusiast of that city, I lived there for a year and I have 2 "I heart Madrid" shirts :oh:)

Adrian.
May 15th, 2012, 02:28 PM
3/5 of Super Tennis Arena filled for Venus vs. Halep :worship::yeah:

NashaMasha
May 15th, 2012, 02:29 PM
Fans will start complaining as soon as they feel their faves lost because of the conditions

slow high bounce clay in Rome and 17km/h wind - almost standard conditions on outdoor clay courts , it's traditional. No reasons to complaint.

Tenis Srbija
May 15th, 2012, 02:30 PM
Yea, but that doesn't make Madrid a worse tourny.

Anyway all I'm saying is, for me I like Madrid, I like Rome too, I think every tourny has its own beauty. 4 years ago in Bangalore the stadium was FILLED, absolutely filled. But the ppl yell, spit, walk with no restriction. So does the crowd make it a better tourny? No. Becuz to judge if a tourny is better or worse, the crowd ain't the only standard. There's facilities, schedules, arrangements of the players and more. Saying Rome is SO MUCH BETTER than Madrid only judging from the number of audience ain't right.


(And yes, I'm a huge enthusiast of that city, I lived there for a year and I have 2 "I heart Madrid" shirts :oh:)

Nope, it's better tournament because Rome has tradition, Madrid doesn't. The crowd is just a plus, BIG PLUS :oh:

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 02:33 PM
Yet Madrid has better facilities, which is a main character too.

So, oh well, this discussion will never end. :lol:

donellcarey
May 15th, 2012, 02:34 PM
No, you fool :o
I meant there should be enough people, who have enough money and are interested in tennis in a city, that has over 3 Mio. inhabitants not named Beijing :shrug::o

And the ITF tournament in Athens was/is always a nice tournament with an huge crowd :wavey:

Don't sis, don't come for Beijing:rolleyes::lol:

longtin23
May 15th, 2012, 02:46 PM
The clay is ordinary, not in terms of color, but the speed and bounce... Also the streaming starts from the begining with three courts being televised. The atmosphere is much more better... But the wind is messing many things...

toxina90
May 15th, 2012, 02:55 PM
History...prestige...beauty ;)

But yes the haters will come out when they realise their faves can't cope on clay ;)

MAGIKARPETTA
May 15th, 2012, 02:58 PM
There is also a connection to the city, to the history of the city, to the urban contest.

The place where tournament takes place in Madrid is totally disconnected from the country in which it is played. :shrug:

Harry.
May 15th, 2012, 03:10 PM
Rome has more history and more tradition than Madrid. The tournament has been played at almost the same location for 70 years now. Whereas Madrid is relatively new and is controlled by a megalomaniac with a God syndrome who's trying to shove a dildo down it's winners' throat. And they actually have streams for WTA matches? Plus look at the attendances. They know their tennis in Rome. It's almost full every single time in Rome, even during women matches.

tennisbum79
May 15th, 2012, 03:14 PM
slow high bounce clay in Rome and 17km/h wind - almost standard conditions on outdoor clay courts , it's traditional. No reasons to complaint.
Sure of that?
Have you consulted with your fellow Maria fans? Or Petra fans for that matter??

Sweety Darling
May 15th, 2012, 03:16 PM
Rome is boring. Madrid had drama and bitching all-round.

Matt01
May 15th, 2012, 04:05 PM
you're really a big idiot, really :facepalm:


And you are reported for insulting me just because I gave my opinion about the stadium (next time).



so Im just interested why other courts not packed and Pietrangeli is completely. :shrug:


I dunno, but it looks to me that you can visit that court directly from the facility so you don't have to pay extra fee for visiting it. Maybe there are more spectators there because it's cheaper than the 2 other big courts.

madmax
May 15th, 2012, 04:07 PM
Sure of that?
Have you consulted with your fellow Maria fans? Or Petra fans for that matter??

why would we complain about our faves playing preparation event on proper clay instead of slippery altitude carpet?

The Witch-king
May 15th, 2012, 04:11 PM
Italians do it better :shrug:

The Witch-king
May 15th, 2012, 04:18 PM
Yea, but that doesn't make Madrid a worse tourny.

Anyway all I'm saying is, for me I like Madrid, I like Rome too, I think every tourny has its own beauty. 4 years ago in Bangalore the stadium was FILLED, absolutely filled. But the ppl yell, spit, walk with no restriction. So does the crowd make it a better tourny? No. Becuz to judge if a tourny is better or worse, the crowd ain't the only standard. There's facilities, schedules, arrangements of the players and more. Saying Rome is SO MUCH BETTER than Madrid only judging from the number of audience ain't right.


(And yes, I'm a huge enthusiast of that city, I lived there for a year and I have 2 "I heart Madrid" shirts :oh:)
Um that's all well and good but how do those things affect those of us watching live streams miles away from the event?

Sammo
May 15th, 2012, 04:22 PM
Madrid is still in its infancy and is owned by a lunatic determined to make it the biggest farce on tour. Rome has always been great.

Yeah that's it, it's like comparing the Toray Pan Pacific Open to the China Open :lol:

Break My Rapture
May 15th, 2012, 04:26 PM
Is that a rhetorical question? Useless thread.

Rolling-Thunder
May 15th, 2012, 04:45 PM
I always thought there was some tradition of the Rome-Paris-London tennis axis. Its all about tradition and history combined with the perfect setting.

The Italian Open (officially named as Internazionali BNL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banca_Nazionale_del_Lavoro) d'Italia) is an annual tennis (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tennis) tournament held in Rome, Italy. It is the most prestigious red clay tennis tournament in the world after the French Open (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Open). It has been held since 1930 per Wikipedia.

MarkNL
May 15th, 2012, 04:52 PM
I'm in love with Rome now :hearts: Fantastic tournament with great courts, great coverage and great players. :D

Charlatan
May 15th, 2012, 04:58 PM
Rome>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>



Flopdrid :yawn:

NEXT

Roookie
May 15th, 2012, 04:58 PM
Rome > Stuttgart > Charleston >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Madrid

brickhousesupporter
May 15th, 2012, 04:59 PM
And you are reported for insulting me just because I gave my opinion about the stadium (next time).




I dunno, but it looks to me that you can visit that court directly from the facility so you don't have to pay extra fee for visiting it. Maybe there are more spectators there because it's cheaper than the 2 other big courts.
Matt you are an idiot.....report that!

C. Drone
May 15th, 2012, 04:59 PM
There is also a connection to the city, to the history of the city, to the urban contest.

The place where tournament takes place in Madrid is totally disconnected from the country in which it is played. :shrug:

yeah, i was thinking this too.

Wiggly
May 15th, 2012, 05:01 PM
The courts are beyond pretty. And they stands are packed.

Have you seen pictures from the Pennetta's match? It was standing room only. Insane.
The women are filling up the stadiums quite nicely this week.

C. Drone
May 15th, 2012, 05:08 PM
well, not many watched Errani. :tape: Although Bacsinsky isnt Kirilenko.

tennisbum79
May 15th, 2012, 05:20 PM
why would we complain about our faves playing preparation event on proper clay instead of slippery altitude carpet?
Because some Maria fans have complained before about the wind hindering her serve.

pov
May 15th, 2012, 05:37 PM
Because some Maria fans have complained before about the wind hindering her serve.
:haha: You're being a tad silly with this. And you know you are. Many posters have mentioned windy conditions as a reason for poor serving by one of their faves in many tournaments. If that's complaining, than everything posted about why a poster's fave lost is a complaint.

madmax
May 15th, 2012, 05:40 PM
Because some Maria fans have complained before about the wind hindering her serve.

it's not complaining - it's just reality...jeez:facepalm:
And I'd rather see Maria adjusting and maybe losing in tough conditions here than in a slam match. LOL

jameshazza
May 15th, 2012, 05:49 PM
For all the persistent lurking in SS there is worryingly little knowledge of Pova fans opinions, such as we felt the more matches won in Madrid was more time wasted. Also we are well aware that Stuttgart was indoors and would like Maria to play more matches where she has to adjust in windy conditions, hopfully preventing a repeat of RG R2 and SF from last year.

Coconut91
May 15th, 2012, 05:51 PM
Yay let's throw some more shit on Madrid. :lol: The city is awesome and doesn't deserve this, but the tournamnet has some serious problems that go beyond low attendance IMO.

- Courts suck more than ever. I've read there was a company that had developped a kind of blue clay that behaved like normal clay. Its slippery levels were normal (0,42 when it's usually between 0,4 and 0,45), but Tiriac and Santana picked other company to install the courts. This company hadn't tested the slipperiness of the courts, but ITF approved anyway. Maybe it was the cheaper choice, I don't know, but it was clearly a bad choice.

- Ticket prices are slam-like. Not sure how much more people would attend if it was cheaper, but it would definitely help. :p

- Madrid is a new tournament so it's not as famous or well established as Rome, that's for sure.

- Like magikarpetta said, La Caja Mgica is too far from the city centre, and not well communicated. It is located in a BAD neighbourhood too. They had to move Real Madrid's basketball team from there because of that. Fans weren't attending. This is to me the biggest reason for bad attendance.

- ATP is a lot more popular in Spain for obvious reasons. A lot of people lost interest in the WTA since Arantxa and Conchita retired. Most only know Sharapova, Ivanovic, Williamses and maybe Azarenka and Wozniacki, but most would rather watch Federer, Djoker or Nadal training on the outside courts than a Halep-Cirstea match, if you know what I mean.

- Add to that Tiriac's excentric and greedy persona, who has turned Madrid Open into a shallow, VIP-only circus where tennis is the last thing. I've heard a lot of romanians are "working" there thanks to their connections, so it's a reduced number of people who have to do all the work in the end. And they're treated like crap, especially the volunteers.

As for the infamous "crisis", I don't think it has such a big impact on this TBH. Unemployment stats are vastly inflated anyway, but that's another story. :lol:

FORZA SARITA
May 15th, 2012, 05:51 PM
Pushniacki relegated to court2 makes it even better :oh:

tennisbum79
May 15th, 2012, 05:55 PM
:haha: You're being a tad silly with this. And you know you are. Many posters have mentioned windy conditions as a reason for poor serving by one of their faves in many tournaments. If that's complaining, than everything posted about why a poster's fave lost is a complaint.
There is difference btewteen mentioning it as hindeance, and stating outright someone lost because of the conditions. And that has happened.

pov
May 15th, 2012, 06:00 PM
There is difference btewteen mentioning it as hindeance, and stating outright someone lost because of the conditions.
I agree with you there. But there's also a difference between blaming a loss on the weather conditions and saying that a tournament sucks overall.

TheHangover
May 15th, 2012, 06:46 PM
i'm lovin it! it looks like a "small" gran-slam. let's see tonight the crowd in serena vs voskoboeva, i bet there won't be a lot of people because it's pretty cold these days and people who go to rome to see tennis usually take a day of vacation from work, but in the evening they have to go home, so the night are only romans, the day from all italy

Wozzilroy
May 15th, 2012, 06:48 PM
Tradition

Cp6uja
May 15th, 2012, 06:50 PM
Djokovic and Nadal playing seriously :shrug:

TheHangover
May 15th, 2012, 07:04 PM
the tv coverage also is great and fri-sat-sun the tournament will be on 3 tv channels in italy

bobito
May 15th, 2012, 07:08 PM
Because this is what a clay court is supposed to look and play like

http://www.pokerpurist.com/uploadedImages/crunchsports/NewsImages/164501_Roland-Garros.jpg

and this is a fiasco

http://deportologo.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/madrid-open-blue-clay.jpg?w=490&h=311

jj74
May 15th, 2012, 07:12 PM
Djokovic and Nadal playing seriously :shrug:

Nole and Nadal need to stop complaining and just play better, because they (specially Nadal) played like crap in Madrid.

Rome is a tournament with tradition, just a classic clay tournament. Madrid was indoors not so many years ago. In my opinion they are just trying (and failing) too hard to make the tournament special, first the models as ball boys and ball girls (really bad idea), now the blue clay (not a good one either, but i think players could wait to criticied after playing and not before), the crowd react sometimes like a davis cup crowd (that's not good at all), and i think a lot of people take the tournamente like a social event and not as a sport event, or they go to just watch Nadal. And the tickets are not exactly cheap, wich means a lot of people who wanted to go, probably pass (and even more with this economy crisis).

I think they better let the tournament develop on its own terms, and with time it will be better, but i'm not betting my life on it, probably Tiriac has a lot of crazy ideas in mind to next year

Coconut91
May 15th, 2012, 07:20 PM
Because this is what a clay court is supposed to look and play like

http://www.pokerpurist.com/uploadedImages/crunchsports/NewsImages/164501_Roland-Garros.jpg

and this is a fiasco

http://deportologo.files.wordpress.com/2011/11/madrid-open-blue-clay.jpg?w=490&h=311

Nah, Madrid sucks with or without blue clay. I agree with jj74.

Rolling-Thunder
May 15th, 2012, 07:31 PM
Watching the Djokovic match now is very telling the difference between Madrid's sparse crowd and a full night crowd even being cold.

Another thing, the ball boys are much more attractive in Rome. I never saw anyone who looked like a model in Madrid.

TheHangover
May 15th, 2012, 07:32 PM
in my opinion there is a pretty relevant defect, i'm watching djokovic-tomic right now and don't you think the lights on centrale are a bit too low? i barely can see the ball, they should have put some more watts

edificio
May 15th, 2012, 07:38 PM
It is difficult to see the ball on the red clay after a week of seeing it very clearly on the blue clay.

But Rome is better because Madrid never cared about any women's matches, even when it was separate tournaments thus killing the atmosphere. The Italians/Romans are so much more into the matches. That makes it so much more fun. (Also, Caja Majica was never very magical, just kind of an ugly box.)

Crowd might be small for the final match tonight, but...it will still be better than Madrid's crowds.

Still, the blue clay makes the ball easier to see. Too bad court conditions were poor in Madrid, because I don't think blue clay is any sort of travesty, rather, the courts were not quite ready for prime time play.

TheItalianStyle
May 15th, 2012, 07:55 PM
Today the atmosphere was great, and there was a new attendance record (over 18000, while the last one was 16000+).
The reason why you see Pietrangeli so full in general is that you don't need any particular ticket to go there, just a general ground ticket.
To go to Supetennis Arena, on the other hand, you need a specific ticket and that's a silly mistake in my opinion, but I'll just wait a few more days to see if more people will show up.

mauresmofan
May 15th, 2012, 08:03 PM
I like this pennetta v kirilenko match there is much atmosphere it really does make the sport good.

I think we as fans got so used to seeing that from the late 90's to the mid 00's big attendances and great atmosphere but then the womens game seemed to lose it's lustre but again I think there's a bit of a spark this year so we'll see where it leads.

faboozadoo15
May 15th, 2012, 08:05 PM
I find it really odd that a lot of the European posters are weeping for tradition but they cheer when American tournaments that are the foundation of the tour are downgraded or cancelled.

San Diego, Amelia Island to name a few.

Wiggly
May 15th, 2012, 08:11 PM
I find it really odd that a lot of the European posters are weeping for tradition but they cheer when American tournaments that are the foundation of the tour are downgraded or cancelled.

San Diego, Amelia Island to name a few.

The WTA had great tournaments but betrayed them to go chase big money in macho countries. Huge mistake.
There's seem to be some buzz this year so maybe the crowds will come back.

Mynarco
May 15th, 2012, 08:17 PM
(And yes, I'm a huge enthusiast of that city, I lived there for a year and I have 2 "I heart Madrid" shirts :oh:)

tacky.:lol:

TheHangover
May 15th, 2012, 08:17 PM
The WTA had great tournaments but betrayed them to go chase big money in macho countries. Huge mistake.
There's seem to be some buzz this year so maybe the crowds will come back.

totally agree, only Istanbul was a positive surprise in the last years

sammy01
May 15th, 2012, 08:58 PM
Rome is a 70 years old tournament and more known, Madrid is not...

maybe you could tell the wta this, so when they shaft a long running tournament because it cant match the money of some middle east oil country or china the extra money doesn't make for a good tournament.

rome's prizemoney is nothing compared to madrid, but we all know which tournament players care for more.

sweetadri06
May 15th, 2012, 09:07 PM
Serena's 1st rd Rome night match has more people than the Madrid final. :help:

FORZA SARITA
May 15th, 2012, 09:12 PM
Serena's 1st rd Rome night match has more people than the Madrid final. :help:

and it's late and cold :tape:

Break My Rapture
May 15th, 2012, 09:17 PM
Serena's 1st rd Rome night match has more people than the Madrid final. :help:
:lol:

All that has to be said.

LightWarrior
May 15th, 2012, 09:30 PM
Madrid looks artificial with no soul, the stadium looks like a prison, the other 2 main courts like a parking lot. No crowd. Even the little crowd don't seem to care.
Rome is the opposite + beautiful surroundings (that counts, remember Amelia Island ?).
The Rome crowd is more passionate. The court on where Penetta won today was packed, all the crowd cheering for her. That was nice. That is what tennis needs. Less cash and tournaments with soul.

C. Drone
May 15th, 2012, 09:50 PM
in my opinion there is a pretty relevant defect, i'm watching djokovic-tomic right now and don't you think the lights on centrale are a bit too low? i barely can see the ball, they should have put some more watts

true, or put the floodlights in the 4 corner.

hey, still better than Roland Garros.

tonybotz
May 15th, 2012, 09:53 PM
I love Madrid - but everyone knows "Italians do it better".

Trickle
May 15th, 2012, 10:07 PM
Rome has more history and more tradition than Madrid. The tournament has been played at almost the same location for 70 years now. Whereas Madrid is relatively new and is controlled by a megalomaniac with a God syndrome who's trying to shove a dildo down it's winners' throat. And they actually have streams for WTA matches? Plus look at the attendances. They know their tennis in Rome. It's almost full every single time in Rome, even during women matches.

:hysteric:

edificio
May 15th, 2012, 10:18 PM
Madrid looks artificial with no soul, the stadium looks like a prison, the other 2 main courts like a parking lot. No crowd. Even the little crowd don't seem to care.
Rome is the opposite + beautiful surroundings (that counts, remember Amelia Island ?).
The Rome crowd is more passionate. The court on where Penetta won today was packed, all the crowd cheering for her. That was nice. That is what tennis needs. Less cash and tournaments with soul.

:yeah:

bajantoo
May 15th, 2012, 10:39 PM
The Madrid crowd doesn't seem too passionate about tennis unless a Spaniard looks like he/she could win - and that's really unfortunate.

faboozadoo15
May 16th, 2012, 12:20 AM
maybe you could tell the wta this, so when they shaft a long running tournament because it cant match the money of some middle east oil country or china the extra money doesn't make for a good tournament.

rome's prizemoney is nothing compared to madrid, but we all know which tournament players care for more.

That's very true, and it goes even deeper than that. San Diego and Amelia Island aren't on the calendar anymore because they refused to build bigger stadiums even though the profit margin was huge, there was history, the events were a smash success, and they were easily among the most popular with the players.

So now we have tournaments with bigger cash, bigger points, bigger empty stadiums, no atmosphere, and half the players can't be bothered to show up.

tennismaster8820
May 16th, 2012, 12:28 AM
Almost any tournament is much better than Madrid.
This one especially, but it's not the case that Rome always has so many spectators. :lol:
I remember people opening threads how it sucks without crowd for women's matches, it was year or two ago. :lol: :shrug:

Marcus1979
May 16th, 2012, 12:45 AM
I find it really odd that a lot of the European posters are weeping for tradition but they cheer when American tournaments that are the foundation of the tour are downgraded or cancelled.

San Diego, Amelia Island to name a few.

I remember in the 2000s the fields that San Diego would get where most of the top 10 would take part when it was only a Tier II, then we had the canadian only a few weeks later, a Tier I and would get maybe 2 of top 10, 3 at most.

Matt01
May 16th, 2012, 12:45 AM
Almost any tournament is much better than Madrid.
This one especially, but it's not the case that Rome always has so many spectators. :lol:
I remember people opening threads how it sucks without crowd for women's matches, it was year or two ago. :lol: :shrug:


Yeah, that was the point I was trying to make earlier :lol:

Marcus1979
May 16th, 2012, 12:50 AM
Because some Maria fans have complained before about the wind hindering her serve.

I remember a certain match against Davenport at Indian Wells in 2005, where the wind was blamed for the loss :angel:

Adrian.
May 16th, 2012, 08:28 AM
Yeah, that was the point I was trying to make earlier :lol:

anyway, we are talking about the current tournaments, not the ones 3, 4 years ago :rolleyes:

Tenis Srbija
May 16th, 2012, 08:35 AM
Rome is boring. Madrid had drama and bitching all-round.

It was :drool: at the beginning, then Nadal and Đoković really started to sound like "weenies" and that was :yawn: but then Serena told them that they are "weenies" and that was :lick: :lol: So kudos for the drama Madrid :yeah:

C. Drone
May 16th, 2012, 09:26 AM
That's very true, and it goes even deeper than that. San Diego and Amelia Island aren't on the calendar anymore because they refused to build bigger stadiums even though the profit margin was huge, there was history, the events were a smash success, and they were easily among the most popular with the players.

So now we have tournaments with bigger cash, bigger points, bigger empty stadiums, no atmosphere, and half the players can't be bothered to show up.

like in Madrid? :facepalm: :lol:

C. Drone
May 16th, 2012, 09:31 AM
Today the atmosphere was great, and there was a new attendance record (over 18000, while the last one was 16000+).
The reason why you see Pietrangeli so full in general is that you don't need any particular ticket to go there, just a general ground ticket.
To go to Supetennis Arena, on the other hand, you need a specific ticket and that's a silly mistake in my opinion, but I'll just wait a few more days to see if more people will show up.

Thanks the information.
Right now, Pietrangeli (Pennetta-Stephens) absolutely full while Supertennis (Radwanska-Cetkovska) basically empty.

FORZA SARITA
May 16th, 2012, 09:32 AM
Yeah, that was the point I was trying to make earlier :lol:

since when your posts make a point?:weirdo:

Adrian.
May 16th, 2012, 09:37 AM
Thanks the information.
Right now, Pietrangeli (Pennetta-Stephens) absolutely full while Supertennis (Radwanska-Cetkovska) basically empty.

meh, empty :facepalm:
there are more people for it than for the SF in Madrid between Vika and Aga :bigwave:

C. Drone
May 16th, 2012, 09:43 AM
meh, empty :facepalm:
there are more people for it than for the SF in Madrid between Vika and Aga :bigwave:

dont bet on it. :oh:

Sam L
May 16th, 2012, 09:57 AM
Italians do it better?

Matt01
May 16th, 2012, 11:51 AM
anyway, we are talking about the current tournaments, not the ones 3, 4 years ago :rolleyes:


"Why is Rome so much better than Madrid?" is a general statement about these two tournaments and nowhere does it say that we are not allowed to also compare them historically. :rolleyes:

Adrian.
May 16th, 2012, 02:25 PM
"Why is Rome so much better than Madrid?" is a general statement about these two tournaments and nowhere does it say that we are not allowed to also compare them historically. :rolleyes:

Just shut up for god's sake :o