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Spice
Feb 27th, 2012, 11:36 AM
Does any one think it would be time for the WTA to finally change the tournament names as International and Premier, then this Premier 5 rubbish!

Surely the Men's game is much easier to understand 100, 500 and 250, and it is easier to explain to a non tennis person who is watching that the ranking points to win a event are that of the number of the event.

Also if you go to the men's site and click on the Tournament page, it shows who is playing. The WTA is so secretive and it is 2012 not 1980!

I have to say the CEO is good though!

doktor
Feb 27th, 2012, 12:01 PM
Yes.

They need to create a secondary tour in the vein of the ATP Masters series to replace the Premier Mandatories.

The ATP players genuinely value the Masters shields, they have a prestige that the PM and P5 nonsense don't, and never will.

The WTA also desperately needs some continuity throughout the value of the tournaments, but to allow them to keep their individuality - it's a tough ask. They need to find a way to help bring the tournaments like Beijing up in value to the players and the spectators alike - imagine if all the Premier Mandatory tournaments were as hotly contested and valued as say Rome.

Not to mention some of the only tournaments with any prestige left are slowly being destroyed by the schedule, see Sydney, Paris Indoors, Kremlin Cup - these tournaments have a rich history and once meant something now they're just another leg in the seemingly endless parade of tournaments.

Also, the tourneys are all being played on basically the same colour courts, playing identical speed and in similar stadiums, its boring and repetitive, They need to give the big tourneys some individuality in court colour, speed and even decoration (flowers, music, the way they interact with the players etc.).

I'm obviously not saying i have the answers but these seem to me the major problems with the tournaments and of course it's just my opinion.

Spice
Feb 27th, 2012, 12:11 PM
I have to agree with you. Have the Super 9 at least instead of this useless premier tournaments then this premier 5. It is like the WTA thought oh we will call them Premier Events, then the highest paying events have piped up and said oh we want more than that.

They can't even get coverage of every semi final and final of all their events. If you watch, the ATP has coverage every week and most weeks every day of most events!

DokicRules
Feb 27th, 2012, 12:32 PM
The changes the WTA needs to make have long been obvious to insiders, but they lack the courage to institute them, plain and simple:

(1) Strictly enforced time clock between points - warning then point penalty for any violation

(2) Girls play in bikini tops, tank tops (with stomach exposed) or atheltic bras only

(3) Hot ball boys only, and must be shirtless

(4) No lets on serves that hit the net - just play that shit out - nobody cares

(5) Players must stay in the same house during tournaments, covered in all rooms (including bathrooms) with surveillance cameras - a la Big Brother, streamed live 24/7 on the Internet

(6) Ban all creepy father-coaches from the tour - meaning: all father-coaches - beginning with Wozniacki

(7) More Borna Bikic (http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_GWJatwb-WlI/SX3ydHtAEEI/AAAAAAAAICM/hIlOZ_-hhH8/s400/BornaBikic.jpg)!!!!

(8) Winner of each match can make the loser perform a humilating task - licking the court clean, dancing nude in front of the crowd, crawling on all fours and barking like a dog

(9) More botox for Mary Carillo!!

(10) No more rain delays! Players play no matter the weather - wet t-shirt rallies are hot!!

(11) Bring back Vera Zvonerava's "coach" (http://gototennis.com/2010/07/01/hot-streak-vera-zvonarevas-coach-and-hitting-partner-sergey-demekhine/), Sergey Demekhine, in whatever capacity he wants that involves screen time and shirtless crotch grabs (http://gototennis.com/wp-content/gallery/sergey-demekhine-vera-zvonarevas-coach/sergeydemekhinemajorforv53swhatsagirltodowithaguyl ikethisbybruceweber-1.jpg).

The day the WTA has the courage to make these changes is the day the Tour returns to dominance.

Spice
Feb 27th, 2012, 12:44 PM
Not a reality show!

Wiggly
Feb 27th, 2012, 01:12 PM
The WTA killed a bunch of tournaments to get some prize money in Asia/Middle East.

The thing is, you get a big fat cheque but no prestige at all.

GeeTee
Feb 27th, 2012, 01:26 PM
Oh - for the days tennis used to be a sport and players used to enjoy travelling the world...

Rather than just playing a US circuit and appearing in a reality TV show..

everythingtaboo
Feb 27th, 2012, 01:30 PM
The WTA killed a bunch of tournaments to get some prize money in Asia/Middle East.

So true. RIP Zurich. :rolleyes:

Spice
Feb 27th, 2012, 01:32 PM
Filderstadt, I loved that event, Essen, and Brighton! Steffi loved Brighton

GeeTee
Feb 27th, 2012, 01:33 PM
The changes the WTA needs to make have long been obvious to insiders, but they lack the courage to institute them, plain and simple:

1) Ban all creepy fathers

2) Put on weirdass TV/Internet streams for creepy sexually frustrated fans

Fixed that 4 ya..

Excelscior
Feb 27th, 2012, 03:13 PM
Yes.

They need to create a secondary tour in the vein of the ATP Masters series to replace the Premier Mandatories.

The ATP players genuinely value the Masters shields, they have a prestige that the PM and P5 nonsense don't, and never will.

The WTA also desperately needs some continuity throughout the value of the tournaments, but to allow them to keep their individuality - it's a tough ask. They need to find a way to help bring the tournaments like Beijing up in value to the players and the spectators alike - imagine if all the Premier Mandatory tournaments were as hotly contested and valued as say Rome.

Not to mention some of the only tournaments with any prestige left are slowly being destroyed by the schedule, see Sydney, Paris Indoors, Kremlin Cup - these tournaments have a rich history and once meant something now they're just another leg in the seemingly endless parade of tournaments.

Also, the tourneys are all being played on basically the same colour courts, playing identical speed and in similar stadiums, its boring and repetitive, They need to give the big tourneys some individuality in court colour, speed and even decoration (flowers, music, the way they interact with the players etc.).

I'm obviously not saying i have the answers but these seem to me the major problems with the tournaments and of course it's just my opinion.

Good Post.

I didn't read most of them yet. But you already said it all. :) :devil: :)

Excelscior
Feb 27th, 2012, 03:14 PM
The WTA killed a bunch of tournaments to get some prize money in Asia/Middle East.

The thing is, you get a big fat cheque but no prestige at all.

This as well.

A lot of the European and American tournaments have suffered, while the top players still have caught on to the new tournament areas in prestige and participation.

pov
Feb 27th, 2012, 03:45 PM
IMO The name of the tournaments isn't that important. Whether they're called Masters or Premier is irrelevant and I don't see how the WTA changing the name will make players value them more. The WTA has a few great and well-know players who have set a precedent of playing "part-time." Since though players have achieved more than most, their actions have a subtle influence on the other players.

bobito
Feb 27th, 2012, 04:17 PM
I started a thread along similar lines last year and somebody suggested having Gold, Silver and Bronze events.

Gold- 1000 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier Mandatories and P5s. Top 20 ranked players must play at least 8 of the 9 events and 8 results must count towards their ranking. Effectively the same as the ATP Masters series.

Silver - 500 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier 470 point events.

Bronze - 300 points for the winner, the current International Series events.

One other change, again in line with the ATP. The points for runner-up should only be 60% of those for the winner, not the current 70%. Tennis is a tournament sport and the importance of winning the tournament should be reflected in the rankings.

Patrick345
Feb 27th, 2012, 04:22 PM
Does any one think it would be time for the WTA to finally change the tournament names as International and Premier, then this Premier 5 rubbish!

Surely the Men's game is much easier to understand 100, 500 and 250, and it is easier to explain to a non tennis person who is watching that the ranking points to win a event are that of the number of the event.

Also if you go to the men's site and click on the Tournament page, it shows who is playing. The WTA is so secretive and it is 2012 not 1980!

I have to say the CEO is good though!

The points donīt have to necessarily equal the name (it certainly wouldnīt hurt though), but it simply helps identify which tournaments are the most important and valuable. Go ask a person to put International, Premier, Premier 5, and Premier Mandatory in order of their value and they are WTF is wrong with you. And that is really such a simple problem to solve.

Patrick345
Feb 27th, 2012, 04:26 PM
I started a thread along similar lines last year and somebody suggested having Gold, Silver and Bronze events.

Gold- 1000 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier Mandatories and P5s. Top 20 ranked players must play at least 8 of the 9 events and 8 results must count towards their ranking. Effectively the same as the ATP Masters series.

Silver - 500 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier 470 point events.

Bronze - 300 points for the winner, the current International Series events.

One other change, again in line with the ATP. The points for runner-up should only be 60% of those for the winner, not the current 70%. Tennis is a tournament sport and the importance of winning the tournament should be reflected in the rankings.

I like the Gold, Silver, Bronze idea. Everybody can put that in order without following the sport and immediately knows a player, who won gold events is better than a player that won bronze events. International events should only be 250 points for the winner.

Lunaris
Feb 27th, 2012, 07:10 PM
They need to return to the Tier system, which was much easier to understand.

babsi
Feb 27th, 2012, 07:22 PM
It should never have been changed, why replace something that was simple with something that is more complicated for people that don't really follow tennis?

I can't see the WTA changing it though as it would be admitting they were wrong, which of course they never are. The Roadmap has been one big success, hasn't it?!?

LightWarrior
Feb 27th, 2012, 08:48 PM
Whoever created the new sytem is plain stupid. What a mess, I get confused even myself. Even more confusing is that I've also noticed there is no word about "the roadmap" and "mandatory tournaments" this year on the WTA website. Doesn't say which Premier tourneys are mandatory...

Marlene
Feb 27th, 2012, 09:41 PM
I started a thread along similar lines last year and somebody suggested having Gold, Silver and Bronze events.

Gold- 1000 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier Mandatories and P5s. Top 20 ranked players must play at least 8 of the 9 events and 8 results must count towards their ranking. Effectively the same as the ATP Masters series.

Silver - 500 points for the winner. These would be the current Premier 470 point events.

Bronze - 300 points for the winner, the current International Series events.

One other change, again in line with the ATP. The points for runner-up should only be 60% of those for the winner, not the current 70%. Tennis is a tournament sport and the importance of winning the tournament should be reflected in the rankings.

I like the differentiation, but I think I prefer the no-nonsense, non-biased 1000, 500 and 250 type designators the ATP tour is using. Gold, silver and bronze are just cutesy in a different way than Premiers etc.

As for the second issue with 60% vs 70%; been there, done that - it's not going to change much. I've played around with various alternative ranking systems, and you have to make some pretty serious modifications in order to reshuffle the top10 or top20. The problem is that nobody on the WTA tour has been sufficiently consistent for the past 1-2 years. If you merely modify the point distribution (win vs final vs semifinal, etc.), then all their ups and downs are just going to cancel each other out. I'm not saying I'm against a different point distribution, BTW, just that it's not gonna be an insta-fix for the ranking system.

bobito
Feb 27th, 2012, 09:52 PM
I like the differentiation, but I think I prefer the no-nonsense, non-biased 1000, 500 and 250 type designators the ATP tour is using. Gold, silver and bronze are just cutesy in a different way than Premiers etc.

The ATP has their Masters series. I would like to see the WTA do something similar to differentiate those tournaments that have something very close to a full strength field (mandatories and P5s) and those which are only guaranteed 2 or fewer top 10 players (premiers and internationals). Not fussed what you call them so long as it's clear which is the more important. I would also like to see the term Premier Mandatory consigned to rubbish bin on the grounds of it being very poor English. Mandatory is not a noun!:mad:

As for the second issue with 60% vs 70%; been there, done that - it's not going to change much. I've played around with various alternative ranking systems, and you have to make some pretty serious modifications in order to reshuffle the top10 or top20. The problem is that nobody on the WTA tour has been sufficiently consistent for the past 1-2 years. If you merely modify the point distribution (win vs final vs semifinal, etc.), then all their ups and downs are just going to cancel each other out. I'm not saying I'm against a different point distribution, BTW, just that it's not gonna be an insta-fix for the ranking system.

I have no desire to reshuffle the top 10 or top 20. I just think the current distribution of points doesn't sufficiently represent the nature of the sport and the importance of winning finals.

Wiggly
Feb 27th, 2012, 09:55 PM
Cancel on-court coaching.

It doesn't "enhance" the fan experience in any shape or form.
Most of the coaches are screaming something in a foreign language that 90% of the viewers don't understand while the player is clearing thinking about the Loubitins she saw yesterday. It doesn't look good.

Improve the website. It's useless. The ATP owns them on every aspect.
Improve the twitter section. Half of it is Sarah Borwell bitching about some American/British thing.
The ATP's Youtube account is INSANE. Copy it.

Focus on what matters on-court.
Live women tenni? Only the WTA can offer it.

LightWarrior
Feb 27th, 2012, 10:06 PM
Cancel on-court coaching.

It doesn't "enhance" the fan experience in any shape or form.


Well it did after I read the transcript of the Woz/Piotr conversation during the Goerges match. The way he talked to his daughter was terrible and eye-opening.

doujyr
Feb 27th, 2012, 10:21 PM
the scheduling of the kremlin cup whe week before the yec is shocking. can't help but think it was retaliation by the us-based wta hq for recent russian success.

LightWarrior
Feb 27th, 2012, 10:32 PM
the scheduling of the kremlin cup whe week before the yec is shocking. can't help but think it was retaliation by the us-based wta hq for recent russian success.

I doubt it. It was part of the whole package with the dowgrading of Linz and cancelation of Filderstadt and Zurich. Instead we got stupid Tokyo and Beijing. Yeah...:help:

Miracle Worker
Feb 27th, 2012, 11:32 PM
They should cancel Mandatory events, cause a lot players really don't care about such stupid things like playing in Beijing or Indian Wells. Of course they come and smile but tank early and go home. The same with this stupid rule about playing in Premiers 5 (playing in 4/5 or 3/5 of them - no one understand this).

Bring some freedom to choose events in which players want play - if top10 player wants play in MM they should play there - so the rule about limits is to cancel too.

Meelis
Feb 27th, 2012, 11:54 PM
They should cancel Mandatory events, cause a lot players really don't care about such stupid things like playing in Beijing or Indian Wells. Of course they come and smile but tank early and go home. The same with this stupid rule about playing in Premiers 5 (playing in 4/5 or 3/5 of them - no one understand this).

Since $$$ is priority for the WTA, there`s not much alternative for the mandatory events. Beijing would not pay almost $5 millions, if WTA would not guarantee all top players (except the ones who canīt be motivated with money/ranking penalties anymore).