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RYNJ
Jan 14th, 2011, 02:31 AM
http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=12609264

So, Now What's Your Sign?
By BRIAN BRAIKER1/13/2011, 8:54 PM EST

Debunking an Astrological Controversy That Erupted Over New Zodiac Dates
Believe it or not, astrologers actually saw this one coming.

An astrological controversy erupted online Thursday after a newspaper article suggested that the dates that determine the Zodiac signs had shifted by about a month, throwing millions of believers into self-doubt and panic.

The tilt of the Earth's axis has gradually shifted since the ancient times when the Babylonians determined the dates of the Zodiac. The calendrical rejiggering also supposedly re-introduced a sign discarded by the Babylonians: Ophiuchus, alternatively called the much-cooler sounding Serpentarius.

Under this calculus your correspondent, an erstwhile Aquarius, is now a Capricorn.

Twitter, predictably, exploded with outrage and irony. One user, @pnuts_mama, tweeted, "it's our identity!! ahh!! existential crisis!! postmodernism defined!!" Time magazine's television critic James Poniewozik joked, "I'm not a Cancer? Suddenly all those bigoted anti-Gemini pamphlets I self-published look embarrassing."

But astrologers and astronomers -- two groups that don't always see eye-to-eye -- agree that this is old news. About 3,000 years old.

"Astronomers have known about this since 130 BC. Hipparchus was able to determine that this would happen," says Parke Kunkle, a board member of the Minnesota Planetarium Society. "It astounds me that this has taken off the way it has in the last day or two."

The popular astrologer Susan Miller called the news "ridiculous." In an interview with ABC News, she said, "We've known about this for ages. The constellations don't suggest what's coming up, it's the planets! The constellations are a measuring device."

"In ancient days there were, like, 50 constellations. Then they finally got together and agreed on 18. Then they narrowed it down," says Miller. "I'm getting so many tweets. Trying to explain something technical in 140 characters is hard!"

Out of Alignment

In short, your astrological sign has not changed.

What has changed, subtly and very gradually, is the tilt of the earth's axis as it revolves around the sun. If you watch a spinning toy top, explains Kunkle, you will see its axis wobble. That's called precession. The Earth's axis does the same thing. It's currently facing Polaris, often called the North Star, but 3,000 years ago it was pointing at an obscure star called Thuban.

"Three thousand years ago the sun was 'in' whatever it was in," says Kunkle, who is also a professor at Minneapolis Community and Technical College. "Now it's about a whole constellation off from that."

In an August 2009 Pew poll, 25 percent of Americans said they believed in astrology; 71 percent said they did not. Kunkle falls into the latter category ("I'm a scientist," he says drily.)

But, he says, "You could predict when to harvest, when to plant, by the stars. So there is some predictive nature there. Then they took it too far, using it to determine when to go to war and people's personalities."

Jane Zimmerman can take some solace in that. A stay-at-home mom in San Francisco, Zimmerman was just this week told by an older, wise-looking lady that she and her husband Jason had compatible signs. "I took heart," she jokes. "I was glad."

But Zimmerman, 37, was born on Dec. 2, meaning that her "new" sign would be Ophicius while her husband remained a Pisces.

"When it suits me, the Zodiac is great. If it's going to tell me that I'm not a great match to Jason, then it's a load of crap," she says. "Unless we don't get along any more. If there start to be cracks in our relationship, I guess I'll know what to blame."

The 'New' Dates

See if your Zodiac sign was said to have to have changed:

Capricorn: Jan. 20 - Feb. 16 Aquarius: Feb. 16 - March 11 Pisces: March 11- April 18 Aries: April 18- May 13 Taurus: May 13- June 21 Gemini: June 21- July 20 Cancer: July 20- Aug. 10 Leo: Aug. 10- Sept. 16 Virgo: Sept. 16- Oct. 30 Libra: Oct. 30- Nov. 23 Scorpio: Nov. 23- Nov. 29 Ophiuchus: Nov. 29- Dec. 17 Sagittarius: Dec. 17- Jan. 20

In The Zone
Jan 14th, 2011, 02:59 AM
P.S. It only applies to people born after 2009 because that's when the constellation shift is recognized ;)

All signs stay the same for people before 2009.

Which makes sense by definition, I fit a cancer and not a gemini. We won't know the behaviors and personalities of people born in 2009 and on for a while now but I am sure they might match their new signs, too.

delicatecutter
Jan 14th, 2011, 03:08 AM
Thanks for the clarification lol. I'm definitely not a Taurus. :rolls:

ElusiveChanteuse
Jan 14th, 2011, 03:13 AM
Should be an Aquarius now.:) :p

hDHrKHTp2NM
:inlove:

Crazy Canuck
Jan 14th, 2011, 03:16 AM
There is so much in this article that I want to make fun of.

northern lad
Jan 14th, 2011, 03:46 AM
my question about the whole thing, since the sign determines how a planet will behave in your chart, is this new sign... what behaviors does it represent? is it a fire sign? water?, etc...

M2k
Jan 14th, 2011, 04:25 AM
P.S. It only applies to people born after 2009 because that's when the constellation shift is recognized ;)

All signs stay the same for people before 2009.

Which makes sense by definition, I fit a cancer and not a gemini. We won't know the behaviors and personalities of people born in 2009 and on for a while now but I am sure they might match their new signs, too.


Oh god for a moment I thought I now was a Taurus :sobbing: talk about boring !


Gemini all the way :rocker2:

Ksenia.
Jan 14th, 2011, 10:11 AM
Still pisces :p

propi
Jan 14th, 2011, 01:16 PM
Gosh, I remember the Ophiuchus thingy striking back in 1995!!! And of course after 3 days none spoke about it anymore, I guess this will be the same... I am a proud Libra and I will stay like this with my indecision and my cr*ppy love... :banana:

Crazy Canuck
Jan 14th, 2011, 06:58 PM
So if I've always defined myself as a Taurus (because that's what I do: define myself by a Zodiac sign, rather than my actions), do I have to develop a whole new personality to fit my proper sign? That sounds exhausting.

*JR*
Jan 14th, 2011, 07:46 PM
P.S. It only applies to people born after 2009 because that's when the constellation shift is recognized ;)

All signs stay the same for people before 2009.
Darn! So I don't become an...

VwGNrpX8KCM

Mrs. Dimitrova
Jan 14th, 2011, 09:04 PM
For some reason my personalities always strongly match those described for my star sign. :lol:

KournikovaFan91
Jan 14th, 2011, 09:06 PM
My personality fits a Pisces so glad I won't be an Aquarius.

northern lad
Jan 14th, 2011, 10:20 PM
POPPYCOCK

http://freewillastrology.com/guest_astros.html

Jose.
Jan 14th, 2011, 10:32 PM
I am Ophiuchus(who?) :cheer:

Sam L
Jan 14th, 2011, 10:37 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=12609264

So, Now What's Your Sign?
By BRIAN BRAIKER1/13/2011, 8:54 PM EST

Debunking an Astrological Controversy That Erupted Over New Zodiac Dates
Believe it or not, astrologers actually saw this one coming.

An astrological controversy erupted online Thursday after a newspaper article suggested that the dates that determine the Zodiac signs had shifted by about a month, throwing millions of believers into self-doubt and panic.

The tilt of the Earth's axis has gradually shifted since the ancient times when the Babylonians determined the dates of the Zodiac. The calendrical rejiggering also supposedly re-introduced a sign discarded by the Babylonians: Ophiuchus, alternatively called the much-cooler sounding Serpentarius.

Under this calculus your correspondent, an erstwhile Aquarius, is now a Capricorn.

Twitter, predictably, exploded with outrage and irony. One user, @pnuts_mama, tweeted, "it's our identity!! ahh!! existential crisis!! postmodernism defined!!" Time magazine's television critic James Poniewozik joked, "I'm not a Cancer? Suddenly all those bigoted anti-Gemini pamphlets I self-published look embarrassing."

But astrologers and astronomers -- two groups that don't always see eye-to-eye -- agree that this is old news. About 3,000 years old.

"Astronomers have known about this since 130 BC. Hipparchus was able to determine that this would happen," says Parke Kunkle, a board member of the Minnesota Planetarium Society. "It astounds me that this has taken off the way it has in the last day or two."

The popular astrologer Susan Miller called the news "ridiculous." In an interview with ABC News, she said, "We've known about this for ages. The constellations don't suggest what's coming up, it's the planets! The constellations are a measuring device."

"In ancient days there were, like, 50 constellations. Then they finally got together and agreed on 18. Then they narrowed it down," says Miller. "I'm getting so many tweets. Trying to explain something technical in 140 characters is hard!"

Out of Alignment

In short, your astrological sign has not changed.

What has changed, subtly and very gradually, is the tilt of the earth's axis as it revolves around the sun. If you watch a spinning toy top, explains Kunkle, you will see its axis wobble. That's called precession. The Earth's axis does the same thing. It's currently facing Polaris, often called the North Star, but 3,000 years ago it was pointing at an obscure star called Thuban.

"Three thousand years ago the sun was 'in' whatever it was in," says Kunkle, who is also a professor at Minneapolis Community and Technical College. "Now it's about a whole constellation off from that."

In an August 2009 Pew poll, 25 percent of Americans said they believed in astrology; 71 percent said they did not. Kunkle falls into the latter category ("I'm a scientist," he says drily.)

But, he says, "You could predict when to harvest, when to plant, by the stars. So there is some predictive nature there. Then they took it too far, using it to determine when to go to war and people's personalities."

Jane Zimmerman can take some solace in that. A stay-at-home mom in San Francisco, Zimmerman was just this week told by an older, wise-looking lady that she and her husband Jason had compatible signs. "I took heart," she jokes. "I was glad."

But Zimmerman, 37, was born on Dec. 2, meaning that her "new" sign would be Ophicius while her husband remained a Pisces.

"When it suits me, the Zodiac is great. If it's going to tell me that I'm not a great match to Jason, then it's a load of crap," she says. "Unless we don't get along any more. If there start to be cracks in our relationship, I guess I'll know what to blame."

The 'New' Dates

See if your Zodiac sign was said to have to have changed:

Capricorn: Jan. 20 - Feb. 16 Aquarius: Feb. 16 - March 11 Pisces: March 11- April 18 Aries: April 18- May 13 Taurus: May 13- June 21 Gemini: June 21- July 20 Cancer: July 20- Aug. 10 Leo: Aug. 10- Sept. 16 Virgo: Sept. 16- Oct. 30 Libra: Oct. 30- Nov. 23 Scorpio: Nov. 23- Nov. 29 Ophiuchus: Nov. 29- Dec. 17 Sagittarius: Dec. 17- Jan. 20

Um, hasn't there always been a 13th sign? I knew about this ages ago. Is it just becoming official now or something?

Plus, if you're going for astrology, go for vedic astrology which at least makes more sense scientifically because it has a better understanding of the positions of the planets in astronomy.

Hachiko
Jan 14th, 2011, 11:38 PM
Um, hasn't there always been a 13th sign? I knew about this ages ago. Is it just becoming official now or something?

Plus, if you're going for astrology, go for vedic astrology which at least makes more sense scientifically because it has a better understanding of the positions of the planets in astronomy.

This. :worship:

JN
Jan 15th, 2011, 01:31 AM
I was already on the cusp of Scorpio with Sagittarius, now I actually am one. But why does it only last 7 days? :confused:

Uranus
Jan 15th, 2011, 01:40 AM
Does anyone really believe in astrology anyway?

Sean.
Jan 15th, 2011, 03:52 AM
I went from being Capricorn to Sagittarius.

What does that mean? :unsure:

eck
Jan 15th, 2011, 06:24 AM
...What does it mean when my birthday falls on July 20?
Half Gemini half Cancer?

Camini?
Gemcer?

Wigglytuff
Jan 15th, 2011, 03:26 PM
http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=12609264

So, Now What's Your Sign?
By BRIAN BRAIKER1/13/2011, 8:54 PM EST

Debunking an Astrological Controversy That Erupted Over New Zodiac Dates
Believe it or not, astrologers actually saw this one coming.

An astrological controversy erupted online Thursday after a newspaper article suggested that the dates that determine the Zodiac signs had shifted by about a month, throwing millions of believers into self-doubt and panic.

The tilt of the Earth's axis has gradually shifted since the ancient times when the Babylonians determined the dates of the Zodiac. The calendrical rejiggering also supposedly re-introduced a sign discarded by the Babylonians: Ophiuchus, alternatively called the much-cooler sounding Serpentarius.

Under this calculus your correspondent, an erstwhile Aquarius, is now a Capricorn.

Twitter, predictably, exploded with outrage and irony. One user, @pnuts_mama, tweeted, "it's our identity!! ahh!! existential crisis!! postmodernism defined!!" Time magazine's television critic James Poniewozik joked, "I'm not a Cancer? Suddenly all those bigoted anti-Gemini pamphlets I self-published look embarrassing."

But astrologers and astronomers -- two groups that don't always see eye-to-eye -- agree that this is old news. About 3,000 years old.

"Astronomers have known about this since 130 BC. Hipparchus was able to determine that this would happen," says Parke Kunkle, a board member of the Minnesota Planetarium Society. "It astounds me that this has taken off the way it has in the last day or two."

The popular astrologer Susan Miller called the news "ridiculous." In an interview with ABC News, she said, "We've known about this for ages. The constellations don't suggest what's coming up, it's the planets! The constellations are a measuring device."

"In ancient days there were, like, 50 constellations. Then they finally got together and agreed on 18. Then they narrowed it down," says Miller. "I'm getting so many tweets. Trying to explain something technical in 140 characters is hard!"

Out of Alignment

In short, your astrological sign has not changed.

What has changed, subtly and very gradually, is the tilt of the earth's axis as it revolves around the sun. If you watch a spinning toy top, explains Kunkle, you will see its axis wobble. That's called precession. The Earth's axis does the same thing. It's currently facing Polaris, often called the North Star, but 3,000 years ago it was pointing at an obscure star called Thuban.

"Three thousand years ago the sun was 'in' whatever it was in," says Kunkle, who is also a professor at Minneapolis Community and Technical College. "Now it's about a whole constellation off from that."

In an August 2009 Pew poll, 25 percent of Americans said they believed in astrology; 71 percent said they did not. Kunkle falls into the latter category ("I'm a scientist," he says drily.)

But, he says, "You could predict when to harvest, when to plant, by the stars. So there is some predictive nature there. Then they took it too far, using it to determine when to go to war and people's personalities."

Jane Zimmerman can take some solace in that. A stay-at-home mom in San Francisco, Zimmerman was just this week told by an older, wise-looking lady that she and her husband Jason had compatible signs. "I took heart," she jokes. "I was glad."

But Zimmerman, 37, was born on Dec. 2, meaning that her "new" sign would be Ophicius while her husband remained a Pisces.

"When it suits me, the Zodiac is great. If it's going to tell me that I'm not a great match to Jason, then it's a load of crap," she says. "Unless we don't get along any more. If there start to be cracks in our relationship, I guess I'll know what to blame."

The 'New' Dates

See if your Zodiac sign was said to have to have changed:

Capricorn: Jan. 20 - Feb. 16 Aquarius: Feb. 16 - March 11 Pisces: March 11- April 18 Aries: April 18- May 13 Taurus: May 13- June 21 Gemini: June 21- July 20 Cancer: July 20- Aug. 10 Leo: Aug. 10- Sept. 16 Virgo: Sept. 16- Oct. 30 Libra: Oct. 30- Nov. 23 Scorpio: Nov. 23- Nov. 29 Ophiuchus: Nov. 29- Dec. 17 Sagittarius: Dec. 17- Jan. 20

I find it hard to believe that they "have known about it for years" and yet never mentioned it.

I also find it suspect that for years they have been telling us that it's in the stars and now suddenly it's not. This seems like grasping at straws for people who don't want to admit they were wrong all along. This is the same thing that happened when Pluto got demoted from planet, and likely the same thing that happened when they finally admitted the world was round and not flat.

Monica_Rules
Jan 15th, 2011, 04:57 PM
I am such a typical Aquarian so being a Capricorn would be just weird.

Crazy Canuck
Jan 15th, 2011, 05:36 PM
Does anyone really believe in astrology anyway?
Tragically, yes.

tennisboi
Jan 15th, 2011, 05:36 PM
NO WAY AM I ANYTHING BUT A GEMINI WE'RE UNIQUE I NEVER WANT TO BE STABLE LIKE A TAURUS I FIND THEM BORING

Jarl_02
Jan 15th, 2011, 05:57 PM
Still pisces :p

Same here

Nicolás89
Jan 15th, 2011, 06:01 PM
I don't know if astrology is real or not but I do know that the Scorpio personality fits me like a ring so I know I couldn't be a Libra. :p

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jan 16th, 2011, 04:30 AM
NO WAY AM I ANYTHING BUT A GEMINI WE'RE UNIQUE I NEVER WANT TO BE STABLE LIKE A TAURUS I FIND THEM BORING

Me too! I love being moody and unpredicatable.

Vartan
Jan 16th, 2011, 04:41 AM
Ophiclius, who?

ivanban
Jan 16th, 2011, 09:37 AM
:spit: I am so not Leo

gentenaire
Jan 16th, 2011, 10:36 AM
I went from being Capricorn to Sagittarius.

What does that mean? :unsure:

Absolutely nothing.

Astrology is bollocks anyway.

Josh.
Jan 16th, 2011, 11:48 AM
P.S. It only applies to people born after 2009 because that's when the constellation shift is recognized ;)

All signs stay the same for people before 2009.

Which makes sense by definition, I fit a cancer and not a gemini. We won't know the behaviors and personalities of people born in 2009 and on for a while now but I am sure they might match their new signs, too.

Oh thank fuck. I have my star sign tattooed on my wrist. If it had changed, well. Shit.

DaMamaJama87
Jan 16th, 2011, 02:21 PM
P.S. It only applies to people born after 2009 because that's when the constellation shift is recognized ;)

All signs stay the same for people before 2009.

Which makes sense by definition, I fit a cancer and not a gemini. We won't know the behaviors and personalities of people born in 2009 and on for a while now but I am sure they might match their new signs, too.

Why does this make sense? The constellations cannot change overnight, they have been moving since the Babylonians wrote them down more than 2000 years ago. This should be the final nail in the astrology coffin. The whole idea is ignorant and sometimes dangerous. Behaviours and personalities have nothing to do with what stars were in the sky when you were born, especially now that you know that the actual stars in the sky at that moment were different from your supposed astrological sign. :lol: Don't try turn something that disproves astrology into something that supports it :tape: :help:

Helen Lawson
Jan 16th, 2011, 02:32 PM
This article makes total sense. The last few years, I've felt much saner, far more intellectual and more facile mentally. That might explain the shift from Cancer to Gemini in my case.

*JR*
Jan 16th, 2011, 02:46 PM
This article makes total sense. The last few years, I've felt much saner, far more intellectual and more facile mentally. That might explain the shift from Cancer to Gemini in my case.

Isn't it like retroactively changing past Oscar winners? :p

northern lad
Jan 16th, 2011, 05:16 PM
Why does this make sense? The constellations cannot change overnight, they have been moving since the Babylonians wrote them down more than 2000 years ago. This should be the final nail in the astrology coffin. The whole idea is ignorant and sometimes dangerous. Behaviours and personalities have nothing to do with what stars were in the sky when you were born, especially now that you know that the actual stars in the sky at that moment were different from your supposed astrological sign. :lol: Don't try turn something that disproves astrology into something that supports it :tape: :help:

because the constellations have nothing to do with how tropical astrology (which is what the western world uses.) sidereal astrology uses constellations. in tropical astrology, the names of the signs were based off of the constellations, but everything else is based on planets and the seasons.:p

Helen Lawson
Jan 16th, 2011, 05:25 PM
Isn't it like retroactively changing past Oscar winners? :p

Well, most Oscar winners are Aries and Leo, arrogant fame-whores made total sense. Now I don't know....

Safe-From-Harm
Jan 16th, 2011, 06:23 PM
:unsure:

Anyway, I'm still the same sign.

hurricanejeanne
Jan 16th, 2011, 07:41 PM
There have always been two zodiacs people, calm down. :p

There's the Tropical Zodiac, the one we all know and the Sidereal. The Sidereal is the one that's changing. Sidereal has always been a tad more technical with it's dates since it's actually based on the constellations and the seasons. But I was born September 19. I'm a Virgo on the cusp of Libra in the tropical zodiac and that hasn't change with all this happening to the Sidereal.

Curcubeu
Jan 16th, 2011, 08:10 PM
I'm surely no stupid taurus! I'm always too talkative :rolls:

And I heard that astrologers also said that their "science" bases on more than some constellations of stars up there, but more on experiences and researches :p

¤CharlDa¤
Jan 17th, 2011, 01:05 PM
Meh, I'd become a Taurus....Much more of a Gemini!

new-york
Jan 17th, 2011, 05:48 PM
I went from being Capricorn to Sagittarius.

What does that mean? :unsure:

Horns out, wings in. :shrug:

CrossCourt~Rally
Jan 17th, 2011, 10:57 PM
I'm no longer a Virgo... i'm a LEO! :woohoo:

DaMamaJama87
Jan 18th, 2011, 07:56 AM
There have always been two zodiacs people, calm down. :p

There's the Tropical Zodiac, the one we all know and the Sidereal. The Sidereal is the one that's changing. Sidereal has always been a tad more technical with it's dates since it's actually based on the constellations and the seasons. But I was born September 19. I'm a Virgo on the cusp of Libra in the tropical zodiac and that hasn't change with all this happening to the Sidereal.

If the tropical zodiac is not related to the constellations and is fixed, then it's completely made up. Why bother naming the signs after constellations at all, if the whole system is arbitrary? Why not just assign random names to each sign? Why are the dates separating the signs when they are? Why not just change signs at the end of every month? That would be just as valid. This business is a joke.

Mr.Sharapova
Jan 18th, 2011, 11:11 AM
Thank god I'm still a Capricorn :rocker2:

Nicolás89
Jan 18th, 2011, 11:28 AM
If the tropical zodiac is not related to the constellations and is fixed, then it's completely made up. Why bother naming the signs after constellations at all, if the whole system is arbitrary? Why not just assign random names to each sign? Why are the dates separating the signs when they are? Why not just change signs at the end of every month? That would be just as valid. This business is a joke.

:unsure:

Why do you care so much? Who cares if it's real or not? A lot of people believes it. People is used to believe man made stuff anyways, religion by ex.

Betten
Jan 18th, 2011, 01:15 PM
Interesting. I didn't even know there were two different systems.

Just Do It
Jan 18th, 2011, 01:47 PM
Still staying a Virgo :lol: