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AcesHigh
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:27 PM
This is something I do not get for the life of me :confused:

I see Aga as a young player who has yet to fully develop her game. However, I often see glimpses of brilliance. Many times she can be incredibly smart on the court, constructing points beautifully. How she works angles and varying spins takes a lot of skill, not to mention her dropshots and lobs.

Of course she can play the role of a purely defensive player and she's definitely had stinkers... but I think calling her a pusher seems a little ignorant, no?

fouc
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:32 PM
people call her pusher because she lack power, period.

BournemouthBoy
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:33 PM
players with a good all round game are often labelled pushered by people who don't understand tennis.

Ingokoer
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:34 PM
I think thats for the same reasons why they call Caro a pusher. In most matches, Aga and Caro hit less winners than their opponents and only benefit from errors. They haven't that killer instinct and also no real aggression and power in their game. Aga's second serve is a shame for a Top 10 player, it is like the serve of a 6 year old girl.

Thats why Aga and Caro will always have a negative head to head against aggressive players like Williams sisters, Sharapova, Clijsters, Henin...

AcesHigh
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:37 PM
I think thats for the same reasons why they call Caro a pusher. In most matches, Aga and Caro hit less winners than their opponents and only benefit from errors. They haven't that killer instinct and also no real aggression and power in their game. Aga's second serve is a shame for a Top 10 player, it is like the serve of a 6 year old girl.

Thats why Aga and Caro will always have a negative head to head against aggressive players like Williams sisters, Sharapova, Clijsters, Henin...

The difference between them though, is that I can't think of any matches where Caro uses the entire court, or constructs points like I know Aga can.. I havent seen much of a net game from Caro or much variety to be honest. I think "pusher" is a stupid term overall, but there is some truth to the claim that Wozniacki's game is very "limited"

DOUBLEFIST
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:41 PM
I don't find Aga to be a pusher. I think she's a counter-puncher who lacks a superior weapon. I think her style of play differs greatly from Caro's.

guapogreg08
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:41 PM
I think thats for the same reasons why they call Caro a pusher. In most matches, Aga and Caro hit less winners than their opponents and only benefit from errors. They haven't that killer instinct and also no real aggression and power in their game. Aga's second serve is a shame for a Top 10 player, it is like the serve of a 6 year old girl.

Thats why Aga and Caro will always have a negative head to head against aggressive players like Williams sisters, Sharapova, Clijsters, Henin...

false. aga is not a pusher. she has wonderful court craft, great touch, can volley quite well, and, i think, can hit harder than caroline. caroline has little variety, but merely stays on, or behind rather, the baselines pushing balls back with (sometimes) heavy spin. agnieska rocks

fawnrc
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:42 PM
I think she is less of a pusher now than a couple of years ago, Caro is also developing some power to her forehand. But for me it is mainly due to the power of their shots along with the fact that they appear to win against the top players if they are having off days (error filled). Ignorance is a strong way to describe the fact that some call them pushers, but to each his own.

TennisFan66
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:45 PM
This is something I do not get for the life of me :confused:

I see Aga as a young player who has yet to fully develop her game. However, I often see glimpses of brilliance. Many times she can be incredibly smart on the court, constructing points beautifully. How she works angles and varying spins takes a lot of skill, not to mention her dropshots and lobs.

Of course she can play the role of a purely defensive player and she's definitely had stinkers... but I think calling her a pusher seems a little ignorant, no?

Its very simple really. If you cannot serve 125mph and hit the ball really hard (doesn't matter if the ball lands way outside the court. Its still GOOD), you are a pusher.

hingisGOAT
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:46 PM
Radwanska is no "all court player," what an insult to actual all-court players! Her forecourt game is pathetic, very weak volleys and a lifeless forehand. If anything Radwanska is a "C" level junkballer, with lots of lame defensive shots that aren't at all powerful and don't have enough spin to be harmful to an opponent playing at 60% or more of their level....

fouc
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:49 PM
Radwanska is no "all court player," what an insult to actual all-court players! Her forecourt game is pathetic, very weak volleys and a lifeless forehand. If anything Radwanska is a "C" level junkballer, with lots of lame defensive shots that aren't at all powerful and don't have enough spin to be harmful to an opponent playing at 60% or more of their level....

:rolleyes:

hingisGOAT
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:52 PM
:rolleyes:

Radwanska's volleys are sad, learn to volley before rolling your eyes at everything

joão.
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:53 PM
players with a good all round game are often labelled pushered by people who don't understand tennis.

:spit:

fantic
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:54 PM
not everyone can be like Hingis, so...

TennisFan66
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:54 PM
Radwanska is no "all court player," what an insult to actual all-court players! Her forecourt game is pathetic, very weak volleys and a lifeless forehand. If anything Radwanska is a "C" level junkballer, with lots of lame defensive shots that aren't at all powerful and don't have enough spin to be harmful to an opponent playing at 60% or more of their level....

From reading this, I would have thought Aga was ranked something like 250.

slamchamp
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:55 PM
Radwanska is no "all court player," what an insult to actual all-court players! Her forecourt game is pathetic, very weak volleys and a lifeless forehand. If anything Radwanska is a "C" level junkballer, with lots of lame defensive shots that aren't at all powerful and don't have enough spin to be harmful to an opponent playing at 60% or more of their level....
THIS
I don't find her volleys that good..her forehand is really weak and her serve sucks :shrug:

Adrian.
Mar 30th, 2010, 06:59 PM
thread # 154454515 about Aga being pusher or not:rolleyes:

guapogreg08
Mar 30th, 2010, 07:00 PM
thread # 154454515 about Aga being pusher or not:rolleyes:

at least it's in question. with caroline, it certainly is not.

Adrian.
Mar 30th, 2010, 07:01 PM
at least it's in question. with caroline, it certainly is not.

True:lol::lol::lol:

tea
Mar 30th, 2010, 07:06 PM
Why do people call Aga a pusher?
Are you new here? No. Why do you equate general 'people' to 'TF posters'? Haven't got used yet we're living in the different dimension, and any our stamp is finite?:)

miffedmax
Mar 30th, 2010, 07:14 PM
She has a nice slice and dropper. Her volleys are waaaaaay overestimated by some people around here, as is her point construction, although I would argue that's more a reflection of the modern game than a slam at Aga--slightly above average point construction looks brilliant compared to no point construction at all, which is what the main tactic a lot of the power players of today use.

One of the problems with women's tennis is that it's pretty much a divide between ball bashers and pushers right now. There aren't that many real tacticians because the equipment and pace of the game discourages it. The handful of women who manage to actually come to the court with gameplans, the physical tools to execute them AND the mental strength to survive and adjust when those gameplans breakdown are the few how have lots of slams. A few others may have two out of three. And some look really, really cute with bangs.

_marial_
Mar 30th, 2010, 07:37 PM
Because they don't like her and think they can offend her by calling her "pusher" :shrug:

The Dawntreader
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:09 PM
I never call players 'pushers', because i feel it's just a indistinct term, that doesn't offer much insight at all. It certainly isn't objective either.

Radwansk is hero-worshipped in some quarters of this forum, because she supposedly has so many dimensions and facets enwrapped in her game- i don't see this at all. Predictable, repetitve groudstrokes, unable to put any kind of pace on the ball, especially on the FH, which has such deacceleration on contact, benign serving. Her dropshots are actually disguised in their quality, by the fact that she has the intuition to cover them at the net. It's pretty obvious to me, that she's no remarkable 'tactically', than most players on tour.

Hitting a slice backhand, a drop-shot, a lob does not automatically equate a master tactician, especially if the ultimate execution and effect are non-existent. Hitting two-handed backhand, even with pace can still be a means of a particular tactic. It's the same notion that impressionist painters somehow think they have more nuances and intricacies in their works, than someone who lays thick impasto on a canvas. It doesn't work like that. Aesthetic is NOT nessecarily a tactical characteristic.

Nothing against Radwanska at all, but her comparisons to Hingis (:spit: )? Just totally elevates a player unfairly.

Leo_DFP
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:09 PM
Wozniacki = pusher. Murray = pusher. Roddick = pusher (with a big serve).

Radwanska is not a pusher. People just call her that because she lacks power. But she actually takes the ball early and hits flat, through the court. She's much more willing to open up the court with angles. She tries stuff. The problem for her is that her effort level and ability to think on the court are often lacking. She's emotionally and mentally inconsistent. She's a POOR MAN'S HINGIS with less ball-striking talent, but remember the real Hingis (i.e. '96-'00) was not a pusher but an attacking player in her own right.

Ironically, Andy Roddick is probably the biggest pusher in the world, in men's and women's. He never hits any groundstroke winners at all. :lol:

Leo_DFP
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:11 PM
She has a nice slice and dropper. Her volleys are waaaaaay overestimated by some people around here, as is her point construction, although I would argue that's more a reflection of the modern game than a slam at Aga--slightly above average point construction looks brilliant compared to no point construction at all, which is what the main tactic a lot of the power players of today use.


This.

Russianboy
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:15 PM
at least it's in question. with caroline, it certainly is not.

:lol:

AcesHigh
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:35 PM
No one is calling her Hingis or a master tactician :) I just don't think she gets enough credit. :)
She's no multi-slam winner (although with her generation I think she can win a slam), but I find her refreshing and I wish more people would appreciate what she at least TRIES to do.

Patrick345
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:44 PM
This is something I do not get for the life of me :confused:

I see Aga as a young player who has yet to fully develop her game. However, I often see glimpses of brilliance. Many times she can be incredibly smart on the court, constructing points beautifully. How she works angles and varying spins takes a lot of skill, not to mention her dropshots and lobs.

Of course she can play the role of a purely defensive player and she's definitely had stinkers... but I think calling her a pusher seems a little ignorant, no?

Call her whatever you want, but she is a lesser 2010 version of Martina Hingis. Hingis couldnīt overcame her physically limitations ten years ago, and neither will Radwanska, when the game has become even more athletic. You just canīt win a Slam with her strength.

GracefulVenus
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:44 PM
She actually strikes the ball. She has nice touch and feel. Not a pusher, just lacking power, that's all.

vixter
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:50 PM
I agree with you TS.
But on this forum, players are either ballbasher or pusher, there is nothing in between. :)

SVK
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:51 PM
I actually havenīt any idea...she is a smart player.

changel
Mar 30th, 2010, 08:52 PM
Because she is.

DOUBLEFIST
Mar 30th, 2010, 09:35 PM
She has a nice slice and dropper. Her volleys are waaaaaay overestimated by some people around here, as is her point construction, although I would argue that's more a reflection of the modern game than a slam at Aga--slightly above average point construction looks brilliant compared to no point construction at all, which is what the main tactic a lot of the power players of today use...

Agreed, but I don't think the best of her point construction ability was on display today. I think Vee had too much to say about that. Agi' lacks the weapons to impose enough of her tactics against Vee and, therefore, can't shape the point as she would normally. Against girls who are content to play pitty-pat with her, her point construction ability is in full bloom, but against the bigger, smarter hitters, she's gonna struggle.

Call her whatever you want, but she is a lesser 2010 version of Martina Hingis. Hingis couldnīt overcame her physically limitations ten years ago, and neither will Radwanska, when the game has become even more athletic. You just canīt win a Slam with her strength.

Agi's no Hingis. Hingis had MORE power, took the ball earlier, was mentally stronger and much more aggressive off the ground. The only thing TRULY Hingis-like about her game is that second serve :help:

AnnaK_4ever
Mar 30th, 2010, 09:48 PM
No one is calling her Hingis or a master tactician :) I just don't think she gets enough credit. :)
She's no multi-slam winner (although with her generation I think she can win a slam), but I find her refreshing and I wish more people would appreciate what she at least TRIES to do.

Two words: Sydney, Safina.

AcesHigh
Mar 30th, 2010, 09:52 PM
Agreed, but I don't think the best of her point construction ability was on display today. I think Vee had too much to say about that. Agi' lacks the weapons to impose enough of her tactics against Vee and, therefore, can't shape the point as she would normally. Against girls who are content to play pitty-pat with her, her point construction ability is in full bloom, but against the bigger, smarter hitters, she's gonna struggle.

I actually think she can hold her own against heavy hitters. The problem Venus presents is that her footspeed is just way too much for many of these girls on tour to handle. Watch Aga try to hit a dropshot and it's obvious to anyone watching that Vee is going to get to it with enough time to smack it for a winner. Against slower players with poor footwork (which accounts for a lot of the players on tour), Aga should definitely be able to do more than compete.

fantic
Mar 30th, 2010, 09:56 PM
concur (not THIS. :lol:). Aga's drop shots were not bad (not GREAT, but), just Venus was so fast..

SIN DIOS NI LEY
Mar 30th, 2010, 11:48 PM
.

Ironically, Andy Roddick is probably the biggest pusher in the world, in men's and women's. He never hits any groundstroke winners at all. :lol:

True

Roddick almost never hits a clean baseline winner .

Infiniti2001
Mar 30th, 2010, 11:57 PM
I'd like to know too. I mean she's nothing like Wozniaki :shrug:

edificio
Mar 31st, 2010, 12:48 AM
I don't think she's a pusher, but she really needs to improve her serve. 64 mph? Eeek! That's in the same match where Venus hit some into the teens. Sometimes she really does get good placement on her serve, though. She definitely should not try the bulkup routine that hampered Jankovic's game. However, more speed on that serve would help a lot.

delicatecutter
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:08 AM
I notice the people who routinely call Aga a pusher have yet to add their "insight" into this thread. And it's because she's not one. They just don't like her and want to insult her. Bottom line.

Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.

AcesHigh
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:26 AM
I notice the people who routinely call Aga a pusher have yet to add their "insight" into this thread. And it's because she's not one. They just don't like her and want to insult her. Bottom line.

Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.

Beautifully said :worship:

At her best Aga should be a #5-10 ranked player who may win a big title in her career or make a slam final or two. However, with the lack of young talent, she could do a lot better than that.

goldenlox
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:29 AM
There is no way she should be ranked 5-10.
Caro just buried her, and people dont want Caro higher than 5-10

Midnight_Robber
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:29 AM
Radwanska didn't play well today, but I don't regard her as a pusher. Everyone knows that she lacks power, but when she's playing well you can at least discern something that resembles actual tactics. (Angles, placement, an attempt to draw the opponent into the net etc.) I agree however that she's no Hingis and proably shouldn't be compared to her - but she does have *some* variety to her game at least. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and with her lack of upper-body strength she's always at risk of being blasted clean off the court. She does need to add some power to her game if she has any intention of being truly competitive with the top players.

But despite all that, she doesn't fulfil the critical criteria for a pusher - a player who has no plan beyond retrieving the ball and keeping it in play, irrespective of their power or lack thereof.

tennisbum79
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:36 AM
Because she is.

Of all the current pushers, she also favors moon-balling more

darrinbaker00
Mar 31st, 2010, 01:59 AM
If you make your living from tournament prize money, much less have a top-10 ranking like Agnieszka Radwanska, you are not a "pusher." Period. Anyone who thinks otherwise doesn't know jack about tennis. Period.

Jajaloo
Mar 31st, 2010, 02:01 AM
Because she pushes harder than Yanina does dope.

fantic
Mar 31st, 2010, 02:05 AM
I notice the people who routinely call Aga a pusher have yet to add their "insight" into this thread. And it's because she's not one. They just don't like her and want to insult her. Bottom line.

Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.

THIS! :lol:

moby
Mar 31st, 2010, 04:13 AM
Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.Yes. I think of her as an opportunist. A pickpocket. She even looks the part.
Radwanska has a few things she does better than other players (mainly because those other players are terrible at those), such as her instincts in the midcourt.
One of her favourite strategies is to shorten the court of play to the forecourt, reducing/simplifying the game to her advantage.

Anyway, I don't really know what she is, but she's not very good.

DOUBLEFIST
Mar 31st, 2010, 04:46 AM
Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.
Agreed. And, I'm not even a "fan" of Agi's.

and :lol: at "Wo:zzz:niacki"

Sassy-Na
Mar 31st, 2010, 04:48 AM
Because she pushes harder than Yanina does dope.

:happy: :happy: :happy:

ArturoAce.
Mar 31st, 2010, 05:31 AM
Most of them are too stubborn to watch an entire match of hers and truly analyze her game. Once they see that she has a floppy forehand and weak serve they just stop and conclude there. Unfortunately, all people want is power, and they never even go to think about placement and timing. The fact that she attempts to come in and volley, lob, drop shot (incredibly), move her opponent to awkward places on the court, or recieve a serve at the service line is enough to not consider her a pusher. It doesn't matter how long I make this paragraph, people will still just refuse to give up their opinions based on the prime reason that she is has no power. :o

anywho. :lol:

donniedarkofan
Mar 31st, 2010, 07:14 AM
Two words: Sydney, Safina.

Three words:
Get a life

le bon vivant
Mar 31st, 2010, 07:23 AM
And her match with Venus today gave you this impression? :lol::lol:

bhathiya9999
Mar 31st, 2010, 08:47 AM
When the player got lack of power with his shot then he become a pusher.

petesz
Mar 31st, 2010, 08:51 AM
because she pushes

AnnaK_4ever
Mar 31st, 2010, 09:36 AM
I notice the people who routinely call Aga a pusher have yet to add their "insight" into this thread. And it's because she's not one. They just don't like her and want to insult her. Bottom line.

Clearly she is not a power player. She does the best she can with her limited resources. She is not a master strategist. I find comparisons of her to Hingis rather offensive to Martina, and I was not a fan. What I do like about her game is that she incorporates variety and is interesting to watch. She is not a pusher because unlike Wo:zzz:niacki, she is not just content to get the ball back deep to the middle of the court. Aga tries (to the best of her ability) to construct points with the plan on winning them.

I like how Radwanska's non-stop 'drop shot + lob' combos (the only thing she can do on the court) are considered a "point construction" and her prays for the opponent to miss an overhead or dump it into the bottom of the net are considered a "plan on winning points".
I mean, com'on... :lol:

madmax
Mar 31st, 2010, 10:27 AM
I like how Radwanska's non-stop 'drop shot + lob' combos (the only thing she can do on the court) are considered a "point construction" and her prays for the opponent to miss an overhead or dump it into the bottom of the net are considered a "plan on winning points".
I mean, com'on... :lol:

:lol: :devil:Owned...Pushwanska and Pushniacki both share a common trend - hoping for their opponents misses rather than taking destiny into their own hands...That's why I could never be a fan of such cowardish playing style, and to call such blasphemy "an all court" game is even more ridiculous

tiffanykatya.
Mar 31st, 2010, 11:07 AM
Maybe only because she lacks power that many girls today have.

Lachy
Mar 31st, 2010, 11:50 AM
She has an alright backhand, but whenever I see her hit a forehand it just looks like a push technically.:shrug: