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View Full Version : I Think The Rafa-Roger Final Showed Us Why Best Of 5 Matches Exist!


MrSerenaWilliams
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:30 PM
That was ONE of the MOST FANTASTIC tennis matches that I've seen.

And I was talking with one of the posters here, and wondered why they discontinued best-of-5 finals for the YEC?

I think Best of 5 Finals for the YEC and GS finals would be GREAT!

Don't you think so?

Slumpsova
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:31 PM
totally agreed. but i don't think women can produce such amazing 5 sets match though. they will screw up at 3rd or 4th bc of the exaustion.

*waiting for this thread to be closed*

Zamboni
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:44 PM
totally agreed. but i don't think women can produce such amazing 5 sets match though. they will screw up at 3rd or 4th bc of the exaustion.

*waiting for this thread to be closed*
I'm leaving it:angel:

May I suggest a title change though?
Something like "Should WTA have best of 5 sets for GS and YEC finals?" would reflect the thread better ;)


Oh and btw, I remember seeing 1 best of 5 WTA match, I think the last year they had it at the YEC. 4th set (last set) wasn't pretty....

eugreene2
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:53 PM
Yea, I don't know if best fo 5 for Women is good ... I like it the way it is. You could argue that this is harder because you've gotta be on your game from the 1st ball.

Kworb
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:55 PM
We've got to respect the limitations of women. Most could only play five sets if they lose their intensity on court. It would be so boring.

Expat
Jul 7th, 2008, 05:55 PM
you want to see a chaky kuzzy match over 5 sets :help:

Dave.
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:03 PM
Yesterday's match was special but one of the very few special ones. The other 5 setters normally bore me to death.

My option is to have both men and women play 3 sets. That way there would be no argument about prize money and you could fit more matches on the bigger courts.

The YEC finals never really took off (there were what, 3 five-setters over that period).

young_gunner913
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:07 PM
you want to see a chaky kuzzy match over 5 sets :help:

Remember it would be only GS/YEC finals. ;) Well never see a Chaky 5 set match. ;):p:lol:

kiwifan
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:09 PM
Nadal should of won it in 3. He gagged hard the the match on his serve 2 point in a row.

5 sets and Fed winning would have made your point better. :nerner:

Mikey B
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:09 PM
yes, best of 5 sets at majors and YEC.. but they should start it at the YEC before they bring them to the slams... how many times have we seen two set matches get close at the end of the second, if they were 5 setters we'd probably see closer and more interesting match...

Max565
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:11 PM
Rafa v Rog was an exception... not all best of 5 matches are like that.

I've never seen a best of 5 match played by women... how were they?

Marshmallow
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:15 PM
you want to see a chaky kuzzy match over 5 sets :help:

Yeah but the likelihood of Chaky and Kuzzy reaching these big finals?

It's an interesting idea with pros and cons. I mean, there is the issue of stamina (considering women have to try to maintain some feminine physique otherwise face denigration).

But at the same time, had the mens match been best of 3 sets, Roger would have lost 6-4 6-4 in an abysmal match. We shouldn't underestimate the ability of top female players to stage these comebacks. Dementieva, Kuznetsova, Serena, Jankovic, Sharapova and some others I think could last 5 sets. Provided Anemia is sorted, Venus too.

Who knows, had Venus V serena been best of 5, Serea could have been able to find her range and game.

Also, I've seen a good few mens matches where the loser has just been exhausted in the final set. Could as many men last tough 5 setters without cheap points off big serves? Just a thought.

Bruno71
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:30 PM
There may be a player or 2 (Dementieva) that could last a long 5 setter but that's about it. If players like Venus, JJ, Sveta are tiring out in 3rd sets, can we imagine them going that distance?

AnnaK_4ever
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:32 PM
They should have played best of 3 so that humilation of Federer didn't last for 7 hours.

architennis
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:39 PM
^^ what the..? did you and the rest of the world watch the same match? It was FAR from a humiliation. Both men played one of the best matches ever played at the Wimby Final.

Re: Best of 5 sets. I think it would actually make the women work and train harder. It's not impossible. Unless, you feel that women just can't "hang".

Expat
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:50 PM
Yeah but the likelihood of Chaky and Kuzzy reaching these big finals?

It's an interesting idea with pros and cons. I mean, there is the issue of stamina (considering women have to try to maintain some feminine physique otherwise face denigration).

But at the same time, had the mens match been best of 3 sets, Roger would have lost 6-4 6-4 in an abysmal match. We shouldn't underestimate the ability of top female players to stage these comebacks. Dementieva, Kuznetsova, Serena, Jankovic, Sharapova and some others I think could last 5 sets. Provided Anemia is sorted, Venus too.

Who knows, had Venus V serena been best of 5, Serea could have been able to find her range and game.

Also, I've seen a good few mens matches where the loser has just been exhausted in the final set. Could as many men last tough 5 setters without cheap points off big serves? Just a thought.

one of them did reach the finals last year
and quite honestly if justine was still around we would have seen 3 set blowouts with the players lucky to get 6 games in the FO year after year
not just once like it happened with the rafa / fed FO final in a year where federer is declining
what is more important that the quality of women's tennis be improved
we only have ballbashers and chokers in the game right now

cn ireland
Jul 7th, 2008, 06:56 PM
No, because the women are so used to 3 sets I reckon the quality wouldn't be great over 5 sets. Its fine the way it is:).

I do agree with you on one thing though, that men's final yesterday was one of the best matches i've ever seen:eek:! Absolutely brilliant!!

ASP0315
Jul 7th, 2008, 07:04 PM
in olympic finals. :rocker2:
Well mens get to play best of five finals there where as women play best of three.

Oh BTW in last olympics Nicolas Massu played ten sets on the same day. ;)
His doubles gold medal match started at around 12:00am and finished at 4:00 am. then he came back on court to singles gold medal match at 5:30 pm and finished at around 9:00pm

It is possible for women to play best of five set finals. So i'll back this idea just for the finals.

Dodoboy.
Jul 7th, 2008, 07:36 PM
It is possible at finals.

I would hate to see it on clay but maybe at USO and Wimby and YEC.

cellophane
Jul 7th, 2008, 08:17 PM
In finals definitely.

SV_Fan
Jul 7th, 2008, 08:35 PM
Honestly only at the YEC's. Many people must forget that at one point the WTA was wayy bigger than the ATP. But also I think many people have forgotten about the thriller between Justine and Venus. Serena and Capriati. Many other matches. IMO opinion many matches will not be as high quality as Rafa Roger but many have come so razor sharp close to it. Many.

MaBaker
Jul 7th, 2008, 08:54 PM
They should defenetly play best of 5 in GS finals, and Dinara to play in every final :yippee:

égalité
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:04 PM
I would like 5-set finals at big events. But there have also been some GREAT 3-set matches in recent years:

2005 Wimbledon final, 2003 US Open semifinal, 2001 Australian Open quarterfinal, 2001 US Open semifinal, 2004 San Diego semifinal

MrSerenaWilliams
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:06 PM
BOTH of the 2005 AO and 2004 Wimbly SFs were pretty good too.

I would like 5-set finals at big events. But there have also been some GREAT 3-set matches in recent years:

2005 Wimbledon final, 2003 US Open semifinal, 2001 Australian Open quarterfinal, 2001 US Open semifinal, 2004 San Diego semifinal

Rena's quarterfinal?

AcesHigh
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:10 PM
This line of thinking makes no sense. You have a classic match played by the two of the GREATEST MALE players EVER. And somehow that leads one to think women should play best of 5?? This was a rarity..something we might not see for decades. How this relates to women who cant even play the caliber of a regular men's match is beyond me.

Women should stick to 3 sets. Finals are ugly enough.

égalité
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:11 PM
BOTH of the 2005 AO and 2004 Wimbly SFs were pretty good too.



Rena's quarterfinal?

Er, 2000 US semi. Whoops. :p

Corswandt
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:14 PM
I Think The Rafa-Roger Final Showed Us Why Best Of 5 Matches Exist!

A full afternoon and a large part of an evening of my life that I'll never get back.

Nadal was clearly the better player throughout, should have won in 4 or even in 3. Fifth set was an unnecessary horror show.

Best of five should go.

MrSerenaWilliams
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:15 PM
This line of thinking makes no sense. You have a classic match played by the two of the GREATEST MALE players EVER. And somehow that leads one to think women should play best of 5?? This was a rarity..something we might not see for decades. How this relates to women who cant even play the caliber of a regular men's match is beyond me.

Women should stick to 3 sets. Finals are ugly enough.

Well I mean, they did do 5 sets at the Masters, so it's not something that would be brand new :shrug:

AcesHigh
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:18 PM
Well I mean, they did do 5 sets at the Masters, so it's not something that would be brand new :shrug:

You're right..and I did not see those, so I honestly do not represent the most informed opinion. However, I heard they got rid of those for a reason and those did not go so well.

I just think it's in teh best interest of fans and players to keep 3 sets.

KoOlMaNsEaN
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:20 PM
YEC 5 set finals would be great again :)

thrust
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:46 PM
In the Slams, men play best of 5 in all rounds. The women should play best of 3 till the final round, then play best of 5 in the final. I do think best of 5 for women in all rounds would be a bit too tough for most players. For the men in Slams I would have them play 3 of 5 till the quarter finals, then 3 of five for the rest of the tournament.

xan
Jul 7th, 2008, 09:55 PM
I think 5 set finals for slams are a good idea - though it would hit some players hard.

In most matches however, for men and women, no. Most 5 set matches would have had the same result if played over three sets.

MrSerenaWilliams
Jul 7th, 2008, 10:05 PM
In most matches however, for men and women, no. Most 5 set matches would have had the same result if played over three sets.

We could find out who is the James Blake of the WTA :bounce:

Cakeisgood
Jul 7th, 2008, 11:40 PM
Rafa v Rog was an exception... not all best of 5 matches are like that.

I've never seen a best of 5 match played by women... how were they?

Agreed. Most 5 setters are snorefests.

IceHock
Jul 7th, 2008, 11:47 PM
Well there's a difference though, Federer and Nadal both have amazing talent, the likelyhood you'd see something like that on the WTA tour is about 2%, they are both in their own league, I do think however having best of five sets for the women would be good, the matches should at least be better than what we are seeing or they could just shit the bed from exhaustion, they should probably attempt it at a few tournaments first outside of the grand slams and YEC, maybe at some tier one's to start out with.

LeonHart
Jul 7th, 2008, 11:54 PM
I vote No. I can't stand how long 5 setters are. Even if they're a classic I don't think I'd spend 5 hours rewatching the entire thing.

ImaVeggie
Jul 8th, 2008, 12:26 AM
The Men should play 2 out of 3, IMHO.

ASP0315
Jul 8th, 2008, 12:54 AM
Here are some better solution to make a best of 5 set Final imo:
1) Well i think the better solution is giving players a 15-30 minutes recess after every two sets and continuing the match.
2) or Making the finals the best of 4 with 5th set super tiebreak.
3) or lessing the number games and using no-ad rule (i.e using WTT format) and make it a best of five

SIN DIOS NI LEY
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:09 AM
We could find out who is the James Blake of the WTA :bounce:

You mean , who is the biggest joke in Grand Slams ? :confused:

Uranium
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:11 AM
Women should not play best of 5 sets.
Wimbledon 2005 was remember because Venus saved championship point in the third and went on to win. If that would have been 5 sets, Venus would win in 4 since Lindsay would have been out of gas.
Best of 5 sets are a bad idea for women's tennis, the final set would just be sloppy tennis full of errors

Fan_of_Venus
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:11 AM
Yes, At Major Finals and YEC Final

ASP0315
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:31 AM
You mean , who is the biggest joke in Grand Slams ? :confused:

This is coming from a David Ferrer fan whose GS record is no better than Blake. :haha:

Natasc
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:31 AM
Women should not play best of 5 sets.
Wimbledon 2005 was remember because Venus saved championship point in the third and went on to win. If that would have been 5 sets, Venus would win in 4 since Lindsay would have been out of gas.
Best of 5 sets are a bad idea for women's tennis, the final set would just be sloppy tennis full of errors

Totally agreed.
men body are totally different..and they make way less ues than women

the quality of 5 sets would not be the same of men's 5 sets
I rather less sets and more quality

I already think that long 3 sets sometimes are too much for the women.

SIN DIOS NI LEY
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:38 AM
This is coming from a David Ferrer fan whose GS record is no better than Blake. :haha:

Tell me when the ultimate clown Flake reaches semis in a Grand Slam and 3 Qfs :dance:

Ferrer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Flake and Karlovic together :D

ASP0315
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:48 AM
Women should not play best of 5 sets.
Wimbledon 2005 was remember because Venus saved championship point in the third and went on to win. If that would have been 5 sets, Venus would win in 4 since Lindsay would have been out of gas.
Best of 5 sets are a bad idea for women's tennis, the final set would just be sloppy tennis full of errors

first thing i repect your opinion. i do agree Davenport is not a good mover on court and is capable of running out of gas. But there are also several players who are very fit on the tour.

here one thing i have to say about that bolded part
1) More than 90% of Wta matches are sloppy and full of errors.(but suprisingly the third usually seems to be exiting these days anyway.)
2) If you just take a look previously Grandslam finals most of them are are one sisded matches and were completed very quickly without much effort from both of the finalists.(just take a look at last years AO final, FO final and USO and even Wimby final were lopided and is filled with a lot of errors.) I do not mind error full match as long as it has some drama in it.
3) Well i know womens stamina is different from men and yes i understand the situation but i think there a soultions that can be experimented to see how it work before completly writing it off. Like i posted in my previous post where i proposed some solutions. I think WTA needs to experiment in an event and see how it works before abandoning it.

Dave.
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:48 AM
Women should not play best of 5 sets.
Wimbledon 2005 was remember because Venus saved championship point in the third and went on to win. If that would have been 5 sets, Venus would win in 4 since Lindsay would have been out of gas.
Best of 5 sets are a bad idea for women's tennis, the final set would just be sloppy tennis full of errors

I think it would have been more a case of Lindsay succumbing to her severe back injury she suffered during the match than running out of gas. Lindsay was extremely fit back then.

But I agree, 5 setters are a bad idea.

SharapovaFan16
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:50 AM
This line of thinking makes no sense. You have a classic match played by the two of the GREATEST MALE players EVER. And somehow that leads one to think women should play best of 5?? This was a rarity..something we might not see for decades. How this relates to women who cant even play the caliber of a regular men's match is beyond me.

Women should stick to 3 sets. Finals are ugly enough.

Agassi vs Baghdatis at the US Open anyone? Still this one was the best match I've seen of all time. If women want equal $ go to 5 sets, if they don't want equal $ stay at 3 sets. Easy as that.

HippityHop
Jul 8th, 2008, 02:54 AM
To paraphrase what someone else said, best of 3 means that you can't come out round assing and goldbricking in the first set.

If you lose the first and the second you're toast. It might make the men be on their game from the first ball and not think that they can pull it out if they lose the first set.