PDA

View Full Version : Serena, The Best Ever????


Cybelle Darkholme
Jul 19th, 2002, 03:47 PM
She plays no junior tennis since the age of 10. Nevertheless, look how the Terror Fabulous dominated the WTA top players, as a new comer:

-At the age of 16 in only her second WTA tournament draw, as a Wild Card, Serena defeated world’s #7 Mary Pierce in straight sets, and world’s #4 Monica Seles with scores of 6-1, 6-1, to become the lowest ranked player ever (#304) to defeat two top 10 players in one tournament.
-In her 3rd WTA tournament draw, Serena beats world’s #3 Lindsay Davenport.
-In her 4th WTA tournament draw and first Grand Slam, Serena defeated world’s #9 Irina Spirlea.

So, in just first four tournament draws on the WTA tour, Serena had wins over the world’s #3, #4, #7, and #9 players.

-In her 6th WTA tournament draw, Serena defeated world’s #10 Irina Spirlea (again).
-In her 7th WTA tournament draw, Serena defeated world’s #7 Conchita Martinez on clay.
-In her 13th WTA tournament draw, Serena defeated world’s #3 Jana Novotna.

And so, that’s how Serena Williams broke Monica Seles record of being the fastest player to defeat five or more top 10 players upon joining the WTA tour. Monica Seles did it her first 33 tournaments, while Serena did it in her first 13 tournaments.

-Her first WTA titles came back to back in her 16th and 17th tournaments on the tour, when she won the 1999 Paris Indoor title and 1999 Indian Wells title. For the Paris Indoor title, Serena defeated #5 Nathalie Tauziat, #10 Julia Halard-Decugis, and # 9 Amelie Mauresmo. For the Indian Wells title, Serena defeated #2 Lindsay Davenport, #8 Mary Pierce, and #7 Steffi Graf, to become the first unseeded player to win a Tier I tournament. Also, Graf’s 20 straight wins as a finalist streak ended when she met Serena in finals.
-In her 18th WTA tournament draw, Serena defeated #3 Seles, #9 Coetzer, and #1 Hingis on her way to the Key Biscayne finals, where she lost to Venus, ending a 16 match win streak (the longest win streak for that year). It also allowed her to enter the WTA top 10 for first time as #9 after 13 months on the tour.

So before Serena entered the WTA top 10 in second year on the tour, she had the following 16 wins over top 10 players:
1. #7 Mary Pierce
2. #4 Seles
3. #3 Davenport
4. #9 Spirlea
5. #10 Spirlea
6. #7 Martinez
7. #3 Novotna
8. #5 Tauziat
9. #10 Halard-Decugis
10. #9 Mauresmo
11. #2 Davenport
12. #8 Pierce
13. #7 Graf
14. #3 Seles
15. #9 Coetzer
16. #1 Hingis.

-In her 22nd WTA tournament draw, Serena won her 3rd WTA title when she defeated #4 Arantxa Sanchez-Vicario, and #2 Hingis.
-In her 23rd WTA tournament draw, Serena won her first Grand Slam title, the 1999 US Open (the lowest seed to ever win that title), when she defeated #4 Seles, #2 Davenport, and #1 Hingis. She is one of only two women to win a Grand Slam in only her second year, the other being Monica Seles.
-In her 24th WTA tournament draw, Serena won her 5th WTA title, when she beats #10 Sanchez Vicario, #2 Davenport, and #5 Venus for the Munich Grand Slam Cup.

And so, at the end of her second year on the WTA tour no Top 5 player had a winning record against this rookie, Serena Williams. And, she racked up a total of 24 wins against top 10 ranked players at the end of her second year.

Will we see anyone come on the WTA tour and make such an immediate presence of dominating the top players again anytime soon?

saki
Jul 19th, 2002, 05:51 PM
I strongly suspect that people said the same about Seles, Hingis, Graf & others. Only time will tell.

jay_k
Jul 19th, 2002, 05:54 PM
The poll needs to have more options IMO :)

disposablehero
Jul 19th, 2002, 06:05 PM
This poll needs to have a few more options. Serena didn't win a Slam at age 16, didn't beat a world #1 twice at age 16, didn't rattle off a 36 match winning streak which included 3 of the 8 biggest titles at age 16, did not go 3 tough sets in a Slam Semifinal with a world #1 who was on a 5 Slam winning strwak at age FIFTEEN, and did not win 7 Singles Slams before her 19th birthday.

She also didn't win THE Grand Slam at age 18, like Mo Connolly did, or win 130+ consecutive matches, like Helen Wills did, or win 6 consecutive Singles Slams, as Martina Navratilova did.

But she has won 19 straight matches and 2 consecutive Singles Slams. Maybe she is the best ever. Maybe she can beat Hewitt too. :rolleyes:

Freefall
Jul 19th, 2002, 06:08 PM
maybe one game for a 6-1 6-0 loss against Hewitt hehe

GoLindsay
Jul 19th, 2002, 11:00 PM
Well said disposablehero:)

Kart
Jul 19th, 2002, 11:21 PM
Serena is not the best ever, but if she carries on her form she has an opportunity to be one of the best ever.

Oasiatic
Jul 19th, 2002, 11:40 PM
I agree with Kart.

Weevee
Jul 20th, 2002, 02:11 AM
She is very very good!

TSequoia01
Jul 20th, 2002, 02:33 AM
Originally posted by disposablehero
This poll needs to have a few more options. Serena didn't win a Slam at age 16, didn't beat a world #1 twice at age 16, didn't rattle off a 36 match winning streak which included 3 of the 8 biggest titles at age 16, did not go 3 tough sets in a Slam Semifinal with a world #1 who was on a 5 Slam winning strwak at age FIFTEEN, and did not win 7 Singles Slams before her 19th birthday.

She also didn't win THE Grand Slam at age 18, like Mo Connolly did, or win 130+ consecutive matches, like Helen Wills did, or win 6 consecutive Singles Slams, as Martina Navratilova did.

But she has won 19 straight matches and 2 consecutive Singles Slams. Maybe she is the best ever. Maybe she can beat Hewitt too. :rolleyes:

Impressive statistics and Serena probably will never match most of those. But in their peak form, the person or persons who did those things could not defeat Serena. When it is all said and done, Serena will be considered one of the greatest tennis players to ever play. Back when those events occurred with the exception of Navratilova in her later years, those champions were basically fat.

Daniel
Jul 20th, 2002, 02:35 AM
Originally posted by Kart
Serena is not the best ever, but if she carries on her form she has an opportunity to be one of the best ever.

I agree with Kart

Kart
Jul 20th, 2002, 02:50 AM
Originally posted by TSequoia01


Impressive statistics and Serena probably will never match most of those. But in their peak form, the person or persons who did those things could not defeat Serena. When it is all said and done, Serena will be considered one of the greatest tennis players to ever play. Back when those events occurred with the exception of Navratilova in her later years, those champions were basically fat.

Well one of the the persons who did those things beat Serena last year, 12 years on from when she achieved them so I wouldn't go so far as to say that she could not defeat Serena in peak form - it would have been a sight to behold if we could get them both onto court at their peaks :cool:.

Williams Rulez
Jul 20th, 2002, 03:04 AM
I agree with Kart... :D

TSequoia01
Jul 20th, 2002, 03:12 AM
Originally posted by Kart


Well one of the the persons who did those things beat Serena last year, 12 years on from when she achieved them so I wouldn't go so far as to say that she could not defeat Serena in peak form - it would have been a sight to behold if we could get them both onto court at their peaks :cool:.

True Monica is the exception, it's just that when I watch Chris Evert Kart, (they showed her serving at Wimbledon) that served seemed like it took 30 seconds to cross the net. Then you get people who say Chrissie would have done this and that. Come on, Chrissie would have done nothing. They go on to say well she won this and that. I say cool she was a great player "in her day". Even Martina in 97 was fat. People yearn for that time when she won 3 grand slams. I tell them Martina has never played better, been more fit, been faster or hit harder than in 2000 or 2001. True she had better results but has never played better. In spite of this Martina really has no game for Serena. So to me they can cool it on yesteryear. :cool:

Mark43
Jul 20th, 2002, 04:21 AM
Whatever, Tsequoia!

I, too, agree with Kart. Serena can easily be one of the best ever or the very best ever if she can keep improving...only time will tell.

Volcana
Jul 20th, 2002, 04:47 AM
22 more GS singles titles would help secure her place as best all time.

evadafan
Jul 20th, 2002, 04:54 AM
Isn't Hingis's record against Serena pretty even???

Becool
Jul 20th, 2002, 04:59 AM
for me she always was! :bounce: :bounce:

Sam L
Jul 20th, 2002, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by Volcana
22 more GS singles titles would help secure her place as best all time.

Volcana we ALL already know Serena is better than Margaret Court. If they played Serena would KILL her. She doesn't need 25 slams to prove she's better than her.

Anyway. A side note. Serena was the last teenager to win a grand slam title when she won the US Open 99 as a 17 year old. In fact, together with Hingis (18) in the finals made the LAST all-teenage grand slam final.

I don't know, have we seen the last of the tennis teen queens? :confused:

I think Serena may be the best ever. I know one thing, she has displayed the best attacking tennis by any female tennis player ever. BUT her dominance will have to last longer to get the status of the BEST EVER.

Experimentee
Jul 20th, 2002, 03:07 PM
I dont think this thread is about Serena having the best career ever, but the best tour debut. Thats the reason for all the stats on the first two years. I think the question is who will be the next player to defeat that many top 10 players in the first year without having played any juniors, and i think no one will!

"Topaz"
Jul 20th, 2002, 05:42 PM
Originally posted by Experimentee
I dont think this thread is about Serena having the best career ever, but the best tour debut. Thats the reason for all the stats on the first two years. I think the question is who will be the next player to defeat that many top 10 players in the first year without having played any juniors, and i think no one will!
Good point, Experimentee, except for the last part. The future is always wide open.

sartrista7
Jul 20th, 2002, 08:36 PM
Serena's entrance on to the WTA was indeed stunning... especially given the number of top players she managed to beat. Question, though: she was ranked 304 entering Chicago, so she must have played at least 3 tournaments (WTA, WTA qualies, or Challengers) prior to that... I know she played Moscow the week before and lost in r1 to Kimberly Po, anyone know what the others were?

Ryan
Jul 20th, 2002, 09:14 PM
Volcana we ALL already know Serena is better than Margaret Court. If they played Serena would KILL her. She doesn't need 25 slams to prove she's better than her.



Now way. Having them play a match would prove NOTHING. Court played with a wooden racket,(think so anyway) and the time difference and all the subtleties make up different players in different surroundings. Serena will need(but wont get) 22 more slams to ever be considered the greatest.

Williams Rulez
Jul 21st, 2002, 03:02 AM
I don't think Serena needs 22 more slams... I think 20 more is more than enough... ;) :p