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plantman
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:29 PM
Henin unfazed by Federer comparisons

By Mark Ledsom

ZURICH, Oct 16 (Reuters) - Women's world number one Justine Henin shrugged off comparisons to male counterpart Roger Federer on Tuesday and said she was giving little thought to her place in sporting history.

Speaking to reporters on a free day after receiving a bye into the second round of the Zurich Open, the Belgian added that the defence of her 2004 Olympic title would be one of her main goals for 2008.

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"It's an honour to hear those kind of compliments," Henin said when asked about the sporting comparisons being made between her and Federer.

"But I never like to compare myself to anyone because I just like to do my job the best I can. I do it for myself, the people I love, my fans -- but I don't really run after being part of the history of the sport."

Henin, 25, has dominated the women's tour this year despite a turbulent off-court season that has included a split from her husband and a reunion with her previously estranged family.

Since skipping the Australian Open following the breakdown of her marriage, the Belgian has gone on to win eight titles so far this season, adding the 2007 French and U.S. Open titles to her total haul of seven Grand Slams.

UNBEATEN RUN

She also reached the semi-finals at Wimbledon -- the only Grand Slam title still to elude her -- and is unbeaten in 16 matches since then.

"I've been dominating the sport for the last few months, that's for sure but it's hard to stay at your top all the time," Henin said on Tuesday.

"I've been playing tennis for 20 years and giving everything for it, so I'm not going to stop now because I still have the feeling that there is a lot I want to do."

Unlike Federer, who is just two trophies away from equalling Pete Sampras's record of 14 Grand Slam singles titles, Henin knows that the corresponding record in the women's game is probably far beyond even her agile reach.

Australia's Margaret Smith Court leads the way with a seemingly unassailable 24 Grand Slam singles title, 11 of which were won in the Open era.

More recently, Steffi Graf accumulated 22 Grand Slam singles titles with Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova each collecting 18.

"When you see what the greatest girls in the sport, like Martina Navratilova and Steffi Graf, have achieved then you have to think that nobody is going to do that again in the women's game," Henin said.
GOLDEN SLAM

"It's a great feeling to be winning a lot of Grand Slams but my motivation is just that I love so much being on the court and competing at the highest level."

One achievement that Henin could still match is the "Golden Slam" requiring a player to win all four Grand Slams and the Olympic gold medal.

To do that in one year, as Graf did in 1988, Henin will have to defend her 2004 Olympic gold at next year's Beijing Olympics and finally add the Wimbledon title to her long list of victories.

"That's a tough, tough goal, so let's go one step at a time," grinned Henin. "I will definitely be at the Olympic Games which is one of my main goals for sure. My win in Athens was the most beautiful experience of my career.

"As for Wimbledon, I will do everything I can to win there. For a little girl who dreamed of winning Grand Slams it would be a great achievement if I could win the lot.

"But if I don't do it, I won't feel any less of a champion because there are a lot of great players who never managed to win all four."

Kworb
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:39 PM
Wow, I thought her first RG win was the most beautiful experience of her career. But it's true that for every Olympic gold there are 16 Slams.. so I can see how that would mean the most to her.

Mightymirza
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:39 PM
Justine :worship:

Expat
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:40 PM
is there any doubt that she is not going to win the golden slam
i dont think so

taddict
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:42 PM
Allez Justine "Federer" Henin :lol:

:worship: :worship:

taddict
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:44 PM
is there any doubt that she is not going to win the golden slam
i dont think so

Yes of course there is doubt :rolleyes:

Until the umpire says Game Set Match Henin ..... then it's not over is it?

Helaena
Oct 16th, 2007, 04:57 PM
i know asking for the golden slam next year is too much but im proud that juju is the defending champ of 3/5 of the titles...:kiss:

Mr. Magassi
Oct 16th, 2007, 05:01 PM
i like Justine... but she's no Roger...

Wintermute
Oct 16th, 2007, 06:17 PM
It would be amazing if Justine could do the Golden Slam. But I think it's a very long shot. The difference between her and Federer is that he's been able to avoid getting any really serious injuries so far in his career whereas Justine has at times struggled physically. That will always be a limitation on what she can achieve, especially when the pressure is so high and competition so tough.

She needs to work out a very forgiving schedule for next year so she can be her best at the big events, plus a little bit of luck of course.

Expat
Oct 16th, 2007, 06:21 PM
It would be amazing if Justine could do the Golden Slam. But I think it's a very long shot. The difference between her and Federer is that he's been able to avoid getting any really serious injuries so far in his career whereas Justine has at times struggled physically. That will always be a limitation on what she can achieve, especially when the pressure is so high and competition so tough.

She needs to work out a very forgiving schedule for next year so she can be her best at the big events, plus a little bit of luck of course.

pressure high yes
competition tough u gotta be kidding me
she could sleep walk through the draws these days given the level of play we have currently

plantman
Oct 16th, 2007, 06:48 PM
It would be amazing if Justine could do the Golden Slam. But I think it's a very long shot. The difference between her and Federer is that he's been able to avoid getting any really serious injuries so far in his career whereas Justine has at times struggled physically. That will always be a limitation on what she can achieve, especially when the pressure is so high and competition so tough.

She needs to work out a very forgiving schedule for next year so she can be her best at the big events, plus a little bit of luck of course.

She's figured that out! Her "08" year will be her best yet!:)

Wintermute
Oct 16th, 2007, 07:09 PM
pressure high yes
competition tough u gotta be kidding me
she could sleep walk through the draws these days given the level of play we have currently

I'm not talking about competition in the early rounds. I mean in the crunch rounds of Slams when the Top 5 will be playing one another.

I wouldn't count either of the Williams sisters out. You never know whether they'll turn up to a tournament in great form or not. Serena in particular will surely be desperate to take Justine down at her next opportunity. Plus Sharapova might fix herself in the off-season.

thrust
Oct 16th, 2007, 07:12 PM
Her competition is no less weak than Roger^s. Due to her size she is at more of a disadvantage than he is. What made her Olympic win so "Sweet" was that she came off her sick bed to do it and that it was the only Gold Medal Belgium won that year. Some players love winning for their Country, as well as for themselves. Justine is an exceptionally intelligent woman, that is one of the main reasons she is a great Champion.

Apoorv
Oct 16th, 2007, 07:25 PM
Justine :worship:

Expat
Oct 16th, 2007, 07:51 PM
I'm not talking about competition in the early rounds. I mean in the crunch rounds of Slams when the Top 5 will be playing one another.

I wouldn't count either of the Williams sisters out. You never know whether they'll turn up to a tournament in great form or not. Serena in particular will surely be desperate to take Justine down at her next opportunity. Plus Sharapova might fix herself in the off-season.

the top 5 against henin is competitive ????? only maria gave her any competition and we all know what form maria is in right now
serena is in desperate shape not desperate to beat justine ya she can turn it around but will no longer be able to do it
venus rains down unforced error one after another and cannot win tier 3 tournaments
but the clincher is anna c ranked so high as she is that really speaks volumes of the level of tennis we have currently

yes losses can happen to anybody
she may also lose her mind like serena did against justine at FO 03 and someone can sneak a win but 99% probability says that unless venus serena maria or amelie step up their game she isn't losing

Meghanns Journey
Oct 16th, 2007, 08:09 PM
I love how Justine brings it all down to the earth by calling tennis her job. We get so wrapped up in wanting our favorites to do well that often we forget that some days they totally hate their job and want to call in sick. LOL ;)

vejh
Oct 16th, 2007, 09:27 PM
^lol. I'm totally jealous of Ju for loving her job so much.

karimcartoon
Oct 16th, 2007, 09:56 PM
this is absolutely ridiculous! federer is better. he has better technique off both wings and ... just because she dominated ONE year ... come on federer has been doing this since 2004. she's not there yet. she'll have to dominate through '09 for me to even consider that and im not a sacred williams' sister fan either.

taddict
Oct 17th, 2007, 12:16 AM
^lol. I'm totally jealous of Ju for loving her job so much.

:lol: So am I. I want a job like Ju's !:sad:

Junex
Oct 17th, 2007, 12:43 AM
Yeah...
She is not federer....
She is Justine that is why I love her..

I hate Federer.....
If anything because he is going to steal Petes thunder...... :sob:

Junex
Oct 17th, 2007, 12:47 AM
Oh BTW.... If anyone wins the 4GS, the Olympics & YEC + Miami in a calendar year....

Can we call it "DIAMOND SLAM"
or it is just too tacky....

j-fan
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:27 AM
Oh BTW.... If anyone wins the 4GS, the Olympics & YEC + Miami in a calendar year....

Can we call it "DIAMOND SLAM"
or it is just too tacky....

Didn't someone say that Justine has a chance to win a diamond tennis ball in Doha next year? If so, it could be a Gold-and-Diamond-plus-a-yellow-Porsche-GS-with-a-YEC year.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

komorli
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:51 AM
:lol: So am I. I want a job like Ju's !:sad:

It seems nice, with all the attention and everything. But there's a lot of behind the scenes stuff that we don't know about. It's a lot of hard work and sacrifice. Justine does talk about how hard she has to work, but I don't think we have any idea how hard unless we experience it ourselves. The life of a professional is not as glamourous as it seems; it's a HUGE risk in life. Becoming a professional is a one-time shot thing; if you make it, congratulations. If you don't, all your hard work and commitment go down the drain (this might include education), and you are left with no money, so you end up quitting and working at some local tennis club. The traveling and hotels are EXPENSIVE. The top pros are fortunate to be able to afford all those expenses easily, but those that are at the bottom of the rankings really struggle and end up staying at Motel 6. So I'd much rather go to college. ;) I know a couple guys who go pro, make it to the top 200 in the ATP rankings, but had to quit because of expenses.

Ok, that's enough digressing from me. ;) The comparison between Justine and Federer is not emphasizing results and accomplishments, but style of play. Justine's game is not equally as good as Federer's, which is wear a lot of people interpret the comparison. However, Justine's game is proportional to Federer's in a sense that both play great all-court games, just at different levels. Kind of like two triangles with one triangle with side lengths of 3, 4, 5; while the second triangle has side lengths of 6, 8, 10. Not the same lengths, but proportional. (I've been doing waaaaaay too many SAT practice problems......:o )

harloo
Oct 17th, 2007, 02:08 AM
this is absolutely ridiculous! federer is better. he has better technique off both wings and ... just because she dominated ONE year ... come on federer has been doing this since 2004. she's not there yet. she'll have to dominate through '09 for me to even consider that and im not a sacred williams' sister fan either.

You don't have to be a "sacred Williams fan" to realize this just a REAL fan of tennis.:lol: But don't hold you're breathe, some posters on the board actually believe the top female players are on the same level as top male players. Obviously they don't watch men's tennis, it's a sad case indeed.:tape:

pepsi
Oct 17th, 2007, 02:16 AM
Henin had a great year, but she is no Federer yet.

Miranda
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:44 AM
no roger yet, he almost completely dominated the tour and almost never lost, even i am not his fans ;)

LUIS9
Oct 17th, 2007, 04:25 AM
the top 5 against henin is competitive ????? only maria gave her any competition and we all know what form maria is in right now
serena is in desperate shape not desperate to beat justine ya she can turn it around but will no longer be able to do it
venus rains down unforced error one after another and cannot win tier 3 tournaments
but the clincher is anna c ranked so high as she is that really speaks volumes of the level of tennis we have currently

yes losses can happen to anybody
she may also lose her mind like serena did against justine at FO 03 and someone can sneak a win but 99% probability says that unless venus serena maria or amelie step up their game she isn't losing

I agree totally. Venus and Serena' form of late is quite mediocre, they may be a bit uninterested in tennis at the moment plus they never really thrive during the fall season.

The women's game currently is in very bad shape and it has been in bad shape for at least two and a half years. I mean even a Ferrero versus Falla match is a lot more interesting than a wta match, for example that Moscow final was anything but pretty. More importantly so many complain about the mens game to be based on the serve and points are so short, but the men produce a lot more exciting rallies, longer rallies and actually construct points a lot better than the women these days; it is quite sad.

The women's game was so exciting and compelling from 99' to 01' (02'-03' was an amazing display of Serena's dominance but she had very little competition, Venus was her only true rival but was not willing to beat up on lil sis understandably yet selfish me would not pity my younger sibling in such a situation :o:devil:) (most of '03 and a great portion of '04 was Henin's year(the russians played horribly against one another in '04, Sharapova played probably her finest match at the all England club and she signaled her arrival with a huge statement in 04') but she too had no competition; Davenport was again finding her best form and Clijsters was always bound to be a choker, Venus and Serena were mostly injured or missing in action) when then the talented belgians arrived on tour and where giving glances of what was to become of them as professionals of this wonderful sport.

The top ten currently is very scrappy at best, Jankovic is a great athlete but she has many limitations especially her serve and nerves.

Ivanovic is so talented but so streaky as well, one tournament she makes a final or even wins the next she barely escapes the first rounds or loses in her first match. Chakvetadze is a pretty good player but she's certainly over ranked.

Kuznetsova is a great player and a gifted athlete (I still believe she's carrying a bit too much yummy in her tummy) Venus and Serena belong in the top ten but unfortunately their form of late isn't suggesting this and they rarely do well during the fall season. Henin is doing a fine job at saving the state and form of the top ten tennis and top tennis on the women's tour. Dementieva is finally back and she belongs in the top ten, her serve is the only unworthy shot she possesses and it's mainly a mechanic and a mental issue.

I am not sure is Hantuchova belongs in the top ten, she's good and plenty talented but theres always a question mark because of her inconsistency and mental fragility.

The WTA tour is in need of a serious revamp, sadly as it may sound. :o

karimcartoon
Oct 17th, 2007, 04:31 AM
yeah wta is getting a little ... eh ... it needs a little firepower.

LUIS9
Oct 17th, 2007, 04:39 AM
Ok, that's enough digressing from me. ;) The comparison between Justine and Federer is not emphasizing results and accomplishments, but style of play. Justine's game is not equally as good as Federer's, which is wear a lot of people interpret the comparison. However, Justine's game is proportional to Federer's in a sense that both play great all-court games, just at different levels. Kind of like two triangles with one triangle with side lengths of 3, 4, 5; while the second triangle has side lengths of 6, 8, 10. Not the same lengths, but proportional. (I've been doing waaaaaay too many SAT practice problems......:o )

Are you taking that dreaded examination soon? Firstly good luck and don't sweat it, sure if you get a 1500 or is it a 1550? (these days) you get a free ride at Cal Tech wihieee, whatever.... blah...... :rolleyes:

College admission is a lot more than just your SAT scores, sure they are important and they certainly help the Ivy leagues to separate their top candidates from their accepted ones; nonetheless, your college essay may actually be your most important aspect during the admission process. It's the one piece of the admission equation where you can certainly stand out by writing an elegant individualized essay based on you and your specific academic experience and pursuit. Be unique and show it on your essay, yeah sure make sure to maintain a good H.S GPA it totally helps, especially for scholarships and it says a lot about your academic potential and ability.

But don't sweat it the SAT is not the all encompassing piece of your college admission. By the way those are the famous pythagorean triples, who does forget those? after such a bombarding one gets on them in High School geometry course. :lol: ;)

Good analogy and it's an interesting way of comparing Henin and Federer. hehe ;)

mediter
Oct 17th, 2007, 06:50 AM
how can she get double bagelled by screamapova? she can't be that great

Direwolf
Oct 17th, 2007, 07:01 AM
i know asking for the golden slam next year is too much but im proud that juju is the defending champ of 3/5 of the titles...:kiss:

Righ now, shes defending 4/6
YEC-Roland Garros-Olympics-USO

Forehand_Volley
Oct 17th, 2007, 07:32 AM
this is absolutely ridiculous! federer is better. he has better technique off both wings and...
Have you seen Roger Federer's backhand??? Its his weakest shot and the most attackable by his rivals, Nadal and Djokovic. When things get close, Roger hits his backhand defensively and more often than not runs around it to hit forehands. Henin's backhand penetrates better and is more of a weapon in women's tennis than Federer's backhand is in the men's game.

Helaena
Oct 17th, 2007, 07:37 AM
Righ now, shes defending 4/6
YEC-Roland Garros-Olympics-USO

yay! great!!!! :bounce:

Hashim.
Oct 17th, 2007, 08:08 AM
:)

karimcartoon
Oct 17th, 2007, 08:20 AM
Have you seen Roger Federer's backhand??? Its his weakest shot and the most attackable by his rivals, Nadal and Djokovic. When things get close, Roger hits his backhand defensively and more often than not runs around it to hit forehands. Henin's backhand penetrates better and is more of a weapon in women's tennis than Federer's backhand is in the men's game.

thats true. justine also gets tight in matches. but you have to agree that federer has more options on the court that justine. But Federer has the best one handed slice in the men's game so to attack his backhand you must be a great player. Also Justine's forehand was her weakness, now she hits it with a western grip lots of top spin that drives her opponents back but sometimes she tends to get tight with that shot. I agree with the fact that Justine is a great player, but federer has more weapons and options.

OrdinaryfoolisNJ
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:09 PM
Someone here wrote that one Olympic gold was like 16 GS? I beg to differ!

For me, I was a fan of tennis for more than 15 years BEFORE it was again an Olympic sport. So my favs like Billie Jean King, Margaret Court, Chrissie Evert (and many champions before them since the sport was removed from the games) had no chance of playing for a gold.

Sure, Chris played in 1988, but she was 33 years old, physically and mentally struggling, and way past her prime (even though she could still play very well at times and beat anyway even up through her retirement -- it still was not her prime). Even Martina was over 30 and past her prime when the Olympics again became an official sport awarding competitive gold.

So for me, the Olympic gold means little. For me, Wimbledon is the crown glory of tennis! Followed by the US and French Opens then the Aussie Open.

As for the "Golden Slam," Steffie was not able to repeat that feat, nor another grand slam -- as in all four events in one year (although she came close), so its not an easy thing to do. We'll see if Henin can pull it off, even in an era where I feel her competition is not that stunning (outside of the WS).

Henin is a great player, but she has really only dominated this year since the spring. And she's dominating when I see the Williams' sisters struggling physically, and mostly not at their very best. To me, if Henin can dominate when and if Serena and Venus (who is aging) get well and are peaking again, THEN her name can appear in the same sentence with Federer (who will pass Sampras) or Court or Graf or Navratilova or Evert.

thrust
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:41 PM
how can she get double bagelled by screamapova? she can't be that great

How can he, Roger, lose two in a row to Canas? Justine^s shoulder was a problem for her in the semis against Jankovic. In that match her serving % was much lower than in her previous matches. That match went three sets, which contributed to her lack of power the next day in the finals. Also, Maria problbly played the best tennis of her carrer against Mauresmo and Justine at that USO. Obviously a great 5-5 125 female is not going to be as good a player as a great male player the size of Roger who is at least 6ft, 180 lbs.

shap_half
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:47 PM
thats true. justine also gets tight in matches. but you have to agree that federer has more options on the court that justine. But Federer has the best one handed slice in the men's game so to attack his backhand you must be a great player. Also Justine's forehand was her weakness, now she hits it with a western grip lots of top spin that drives her opponents back but sometimes she tends to get tight with that shot. I agree with the fact that Justine is a great player, but federer has more weapons and options.

name one person in the whole worls whose shots don't fall short when they're tight. you think federer doesn't get tight? the only reason we're even bringing this is up is becasue justine doesn't shy away from verbally admitting when she gets tight. Most importantly, I think out of everyone out there, Justine does the best job of making you win a match when she's in a losing (or "tight") position.

And no, Federer doesn't have more weapons or options.

shap_half
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:53 PM
Someone here wrote that one Olympic gold was like 16 GS? I beg to differ!

For me, I was a fan of tennis for more than 15 years BEFORE it was again an Olympic sport. So my favs like Billie Jean King, Margaret Court, Chrissie Evert (and many champions before them since the sport was removed from the games) had no chance of playing for a gold.

Sure, Chris played in 1988, but she was 33 years old, physically and mentally struggling, and way past her prime (even though she could still play very well at times and beat anyway even up through her retirement -- it still was not her prime). Even Martina was over 30 and past her prime when the Olympics again became an official sport awarding competitive gold.

So for me, the Olympic gold means little. For me, Wimbledon is the crown glory of tennis! Followed by the US and French Opens then the Aussie Open.

As for the "Golden Slam," Steffie was not able to repeat that feat, nor another grand slam -- as in all four events in one year (although she came close), so its not an easy thing to do. We'll see if Henin can pull it off, even in an era where I feel her competition is not that stunning (outside of the WS).

Henin is a great player, but she has really only dominated this year since the spring. And she's dominating when I see the Williams' sisters struggling physically, and mostly not at their very best. To me, if Henin can dominate when and if Serena and Venus (who is aging) get well and are peaking again, THEN her name can appear in the same sentence with Federer (who will pass Sampras) or Court or Graf or Navratilova or Evert.

Did Federer have to play Sampras at his peak? or Agassi?

So then Justine will never win this argument. It's too bad that Justine came into her own when Serena and Venus both started in their decline. It's too bad that the Williams sisters upto this point have been unable to turn their game around to beat Justine. It'too bad that there's no one out there able to challenge Justine this year -- though I doubt anyone would have been able to.

Is it fair to say, "until Serena or Venus can turn back time, transform their bodies to match the bodies of Court or Navratilova, play with the racquet technology of their time that they can't be mentioned in the same sentence as blah blah blah blah blah blah"??

In addition, I'm under the impression that many will claim that as long as Justine can beat Serena or Venus on a non-clay surface, that the sisters aren't playing their peak, they're unfit, they're injured, and a whole list verbal diarrhea.

j-fan
Oct 17th, 2007, 01:56 PM
I think serve is one area where Federer is definitly more dominating than Justine in their respective tours. He can count on a service winner at critcial times. However, this is much due to Justine's height than anything else. He is probably in the top three in the ATP (above Roddick IMHO) while Justine is in the top 10.

To me to say that Justine is a female Federer is figuratively true. They can both pull out a great variety of shots with very smooth movements around the court. One will never compare a Sharapova or a Williams to Federer because their games are no inferior to his but fundamentally different.

I love both of their games.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

Donny
Oct 17th, 2007, 02:06 PM
Federer is, imo, the best to play men's tennis. Ever. Henin, imo, is not the best to ever play women's tennis. That's why they don't belong in the same sentence.

That and the fact that Henin isn't even best of her generation yet, much less of all time.

Donny
Oct 17th, 2007, 02:09 PM
I think serve is one area where Federer is definitly more dominating than Justine in their respective tours. He can count on a service winner at critcial times. However, this is much due to Justine's height than anything else. He is probably in the top three in the ATP (above Roddick IMHO) while Justine is in the top 10.

To me to say that Justine is a female Federer is figuratively true. They can both pull out a great variety of shots with very smooth movements around the court. One will never compare a Sharapova or a Williams to Federer because their games are no inferior to his but fundamentally different.

I love both of their games.

:worship: :worship: :worship:

If Federer had Roddick's serve, he'd be unbeatable. Yes, I genuinely mean that.

Regardless, there's still wayyyyy more than 2 betters servers in the ATP. Mirnyi, Karlovic, Guccione, Ljubicic, Monfils, et al.

OrdinaryfoolisNJ
Oct 17th, 2007, 02:19 PM
Did Federer have to play Sampras at his peak? or Agassi?

So then Justine will never win this argument. It's too bad that Justine came into her own when Serena and Venus both started in their decline. It's too bad that the Williams sisters upto this point have been unable to turn their game around to beat Justine. It'too bad that there's no one out there able to challenge Justine this year -- though I doubt anyone would have been able to.

Is it fair to say, "until Serena or Venus can turn back time, transform their bodies to match the bodies of Court or Navratilova, play with the racquet technology of their time that they can't be mentioned in the same sentence as blah blah blah blah blah blah"??

In addition, I'm under the impression that many will claim that as long as Justine can beat Serena or Venus on a non-clay surface, that the sisters aren't playing their peak, they're unfit, they're injured, and a whole list verbal diarrhea.

Neither is Henin having to play Court, Navratilova or Evert at their primes, so your first question about Federer and Sampras makes no point in my opinion.

There is no way to compare "eras," as the technology and people of eras change so much, we can only compare the intangibles like mental toughness and court smarts and how a player reacts when things get dicey. So, I can make no sense of your comments regarding racquet technology and such, so I'll leave it be.

I think that Henin has a lot of what the great champions have, but she has not proven herself against a worthy consistent challenger as many of the other greats of all time have done, so at the moment, she is a good player for her era and nothing more.

But I do agree that each generation has to play what is there -- in this generation, I personally don't believe the competition is that deep outside of Serena and Venus, and that is unfortunate for Justine when comparing her to other greats (although, I also thought that at times, Steffi's competition was lacking, still she was dominate for a long time -- so that counts). Also, Justine has really just begun a domination of sorts on all surfaces, so to be considered amongst the greats, she'll have to do that for five or six more years.

Federer is constantly challenged on his current greatness because of the lack of an equally worthy challenger on ALL surfaces (Nadal still needs to grow his hard court game), although no one can challenge the intangibles such as the beauty of his game, his mental toughness, his court smarts. He has every intangible. But, if Federer manages to win the French Open (particularly in a great match against Nadal), he will have one upped Pete.

As for the sisters issue -- they are not conjecture but fact. They are not excuses, but what is and has happened in their lives. Like it or not! Its a shame that their strong bodies are actually so fragile. Its their Achilles Heel. They've not had the luck of consistent good health.

cogent53
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:11 PM
Many good points made. Many commentators push the female-Federer angle, due to the style of play. Roger is probably the best player ever, and is beautiful to watch. Justine plays in a similarly attractive style, but isn't quite a complete a player as Roger - but then who is?? I think she is comparable to Roger in the way that Sharapova is comparable to Roddick - power with little subtlety. (actually there are a lot of those on the WTA!)

Jasmin
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:15 PM
Federer is, imo, the best to play men's tennis. Ever. Henin, imo, is not the best to ever play women's tennis. That's why they don't belong in the same sentence.

That and the fact that Henin isn't even best of her generation yet, much less of all time.

ITA...Henin should but unfazed because there really is no comparison.

bie
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:24 PM
The article is about the style of play and that's simelar so there is a certanly a comparision.

taddict
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:36 PM
Well the media and some commentators (some who are ex-players) seem to think so! :)

Jasmin
Oct 17th, 2007, 03:55 PM
Yeah we know how smart some of those commentators are. They still have their preferences that cloud their judgement. It's pretty obvious and disappointing when they commentate for the men and women.

pigam
Oct 17th, 2007, 04:00 PM
If Federer had Roddick's serve, he'd be unbeatable. Yes, I genuinely mean that.

Regardless, there's still wayyyyy more than 2 betters servers in the ATP. Mirnyi, Karlovic, Guccione, Ljubicic, Monfils, et al.

:lol: Federer's service is like 10x better than Roddicks. EASILY!
Much more variety, harder to read, ...

shap_half
Oct 17th, 2007, 04:28 PM
Neither is Henin having to play Court, Navratilova or Evert at their primes, so your first question about Federer and Sampras makes no point in my opinion.

There is no way to compare "eras," as the technology and people of eras change so much, we can only compare the intangibles like mental toughness and court smarts and how a player reacts when things get dicey. So, I can make no sense of your comments regarding racquet technology and such, so I'll leave it be.

I think that Henin has a lot of what the great champions have, but she has not proven herself against a worthy consistent challenger as many of the other greats of all time have done, so at the moment, she is a good player for her era and nothing more.

But I do agree that each generation has to play what is there -- in this generation, I personally don't believe the competition is that deep outside of Serena and Venus, and that is unfortunate for Justine when comparing her to other greats (although, I also thought that at times, Steffi's competition was lacking, still she was dominate for a long time -- so that counts). Also, Justine has really just begun a domination of sorts on all surfaces, so to be considered amongst the greats, she'll have to do that for five or six more years.

Federer is constantly challenged on his current greatness because of the lack of an equally worthy challenger on ALL surfaces (Nadal still needs to grow his hard court game), although no one can challenge the intangibles such as the beauty of his game, his mental toughness, his court smarts. He has every intangible. But, if Federer manages to win the French Open (particularly in a great match against Nadal), he will have one upped Pete.

As for the sisters issue -- they are not conjecture but fact. They are not excuses, but what is and has happened in their lives. Like it or not! Its a shame that their strong bodies are actually so fragile. Its their Achilles Heel. They've not had the luck of consistent good health.

You know who else has had problems with good health? Justine. Justine has had the problem of undergoing several personal and physical problems since '04 that has made it impossible to string along the the GS success Federer has. I have no doubt that if Justine hadn't been struck with illness in '04 that she would have close to the number of slams as Federer -- she might have already won them all. It's completely inappropriate to suggest that Justine can only be considered beyond "a good player of her generation" if she can prove herself against Venus and Serena at their peak. That's a preposterous premise.


My comment about Federer is just as valid as your comment about Justine not having to play S+V at "their peak." (Though i don't really think it matters) Sampras was on his way out as Federer was about to come in. Federer has virtually no competition save on clay. Yes, he loses every now and again, but no one has sustained a level of play that can challenge him. Roger is lucky that he hasn't gone through an energy sapping virus, several minor injuries and a divorce, because were that the case, who knows where he'd be now. I think Justine's play and the beauty of her game, her mental toughness and her court smarts are right on par with Roger and probably better than the Williams sisters. I don't think that because I'm her fan. I'm her fan because I think that.

JustineTime
Oct 17th, 2007, 08:04 PM
In addition, I'm under the impression that many will claim that as long as Justine can beat Serena or Venus on a non-clay surface, that the sisters aren't playing their peak, they're unfit, they're injured, and a whole list verbal diarrhea.

:tape:

:shout: SHUT UP! WILL YOU SHUT UP!!!!:shout:

;)

JustineTime
Oct 17th, 2007, 08:14 PM
You know who else has had problems with good health? Justine. Justine has had the problem of undergoing several personal and physical problems since '04 that has made it impossible to string along the the GS success Federer has. I have no doubt that if Justine hadn't been struck with illness in '04 that she would have close to the number of slams as Federer -- she might have already won them all. It's completely inappropriate to suggest that Justine can only be considered beyond "a good player of her generation" if she can prove herself against Venus and Serena at their peak. That's a preposterous premise.


My comment about Federer is just as valid as your comment about Justine not having to play S+V at "their peak." (Though i don't really think it matters) Sampras was on his way out as Federer was about to come in. Federer has virtually no competition save on clay. Yes, he loses every now and again, but no one has sustained a level of play that can challenge him. Roger is lucky that he hasn't gone through an energy sapping virus, several minor injuries and a divorce, because were that the case, who knows where he'd be now. I think Justine's play and the beauty of her game, her mental toughness and her court smarts are right on par with Roger and probably better than the Williams sisters. I don't think that because I'm her fan. I'm her fan because I think that.:hehehe: :bigclap:

Nicely done, Mate. :yeah: Bloody well said :)

Mileen
Oct 17th, 2007, 08:50 PM
Allez Justine "Federer" Henin :lol:

:worship: :worship:

Fufu :hug: :worship:

M2k
Oct 17th, 2007, 09:01 PM
Someone here wrote that one Olympic gold was like 16 GS? I beg to differ!

For me, I was a fan of tennis for more than 15 years BEFORE it was again an Olympic sport. .


Lord!! :lol:

...that poster meant that there are 16 GS's between each Olympic cycle. 16 Grand Slams for avery Gold Medal (every four years) :o

stickwitju(ju)
Oct 17th, 2007, 11:17 PM
Of course Justine's unfazed. She knows as does everyone else that neither she nor anyone else on either tour that's currently playing will catch Roger.

:weirdo:

justineheninfan
Oct 22nd, 2007, 05:48 AM
I love Justine, she is my favorite player male or women by far. However she is not even close to a female Federer, atleast not a this point. She has never had a 3-slam year, she went 3 and a half years between non-French Open slams, and last year she went 1-3 in slam finals vs people she was all capable of beating for sure. She struggles with her nerves and self belief at times, and Federer never had trouble with that.

Federer does not face an all-time great in their prime, but Justine does not either. Unless you count Serena in her prime that is, or even consider her an all time great (both Serena and Justine are sort of borderline all-time greats at this point IMO). Neither has great competition, but Federer is much more dominant vs it. I think Justine could have won alot more slams the last several years, but bad luck with injuries, and sometimes choking matches she could have won, especialy last year when she went 1-3 in slam finals but could have won any of them.

treufreund
Oct 22nd, 2007, 06:40 AM
Justine's backhand is much more of a weapon, respectively. Also her touch lobs and her drop shots and drop volleys are better than federer's. Federer does not even seem to know how to hit a drop shot or topspin lob. I love Federer though. But the truth is that Justine and Roger have very similar styles. Justine has a more aggressive mindset IMO. Both are great movers but Federer is SLIGHTLY more graceful. Justine has less endurance but more variety of shot within each rally. Her slice has improved tremendously but Fed's is better. Her forehand with short angles hit flat and with pace are better but his rolling forehands are slightly better. But overall these are very similar styles and similar personalities with great professionalism and determination.

treufreund
Oct 22nd, 2007, 06:43 AM
Also Fed has more service options but Justine's return of serve is more aggressive IMO. But any way you slice it even the great Martina Navratilova, one of the most knowledgeable tennis players ever, says that they are very similar. You simply cannot dismiss what Martina says on this topic (even though she has many haters on here. The woman knows tennis like very few people in this world. Also John McEnroe has compared them)