PDA

View Full Version : Gamesmanship?


supergrunt
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:08 PM
When Radwanska kept moving back and forth on Maria's second serve? Mary Carillo said very frankly that it was.

Chrissie-fan
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:15 PM
If you don't like Radwanska it's gamesmanship, if you do like her it's smart tactics. But it really doesn't matter. You do what you have to in order to win.

selyoink
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:18 PM
It wasn't gamesmanship. Plenty of players move around like that before the serve. I've seen Maria and Ana both do it. Sharapova should have realized that Aga was moving backwards once she actually served not to mention her returns were hardly overpowering.

karin1492
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:18 PM
You have to take what Mary Carillo says, put it in a box, burn the box, then dump the ashes on her head.

sammy01
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:20 PM
no way every player does it! aga was intimidating maria, which maria didnt like because thats what she normaly does to other players!

Wayn77
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:21 PM
NO.

It's competition. Anything to get an edge on your opponent and keep it. Radwanska wasn't breaking any rules.

If there is any nonsense it's the umpire's job to step on it.

Slutiana
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:23 PM
You have to take what Mary Carillo says, put it in a box, burn the box, then dump the ashes on her head.

:spit: finally, a JH and a williams fan can agree on something!:bounce:

Viktymise
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:23 PM
Iv seen lots of players do it, and Sharapova did it like mad in the final few rounds of Wimbledon 2004, particularly against Davenport.

champGS1452
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:23 PM
Doesn't matter. In the words of Lindsay, Radwanska is in the next round and Maria is in the hotel room packing.

Poova
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:24 PM
Of course not, it was very smart tactics from Aga. Great to see another player who uses her brain on the court.

Bijoux0021
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:25 PM
All players do it. Sharapova does it all the time. She was doing it in her match doday; it just didn't work out for her.

jujufreak
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:26 PM
nothing wrong with what Agnieszka did :)

she's a clever girl :cool:

Lulu.
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:28 PM
Nope.

vadin124
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:28 PM
my very own Bartoli :hearts: :angel: does the same thing...so no way gamesmanship

damn Mary Carillo...ugly smack-faced bigoted freak!

Warrior
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:29 PM
NO.

It's competition. Anything to get an edge on your opponent and keep it. Radwanska wasn't breaking any rules.

If there is any nonsense it's the umpire's job to step on it.

This is an actual definition of gamesmanship!

mckyle.
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:31 PM
Who cares? Oh wow, the girl wanted to win. People put too much emphasis on gamesmanship.

Wayn77
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:31 PM
This is an actual definition of gamesmanship!

I prefer to call it TACTICS! ;) :lol:

Bruno71
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:32 PM
They almost all do this kind of thing, so if it is indeed gamesmanship, it's not something that we can hold Radwanska any more accountable for than any other player.

Jasmin
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:33 PM
Mary just loves Maria. I don't listen to her.

Bijoux0021
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:33 PM
Radwanska stopped doing it in the 2nd set and lost it badly. She went back to doing it in the 3rd set as she was in the first, and it paid off.

WF4EVER
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:37 PM
As far as I'm considered, if it's not illegal, I don't see how it's gamesmanship. Furthermore she's not the only player who is moving when being served. For some of them it's for their own nerves and not to put off their opponent, but she knew it would affect Sharapova so she employed it.

It's like standing way into the service box on your opponents second serve which is done all the time, or standing way back on a big servers second serve to throw them off. I heard MJF (I think) say a couple of years ago that she did it to Brenda McCarthy during a match and she double-faulted. I see nothing ethically wrong with that. The opponent has to be in control of herself and forget everything else.

It was a good tactic by Radwanska. Maria should have been focussed on her own intentions and not let that bother her.

Crybabies.

I can't imagine how suicidal some tennis higher-ups are right now. LMAO.

Brooklyn90
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:39 PM
It was a smart play and obviously worked.

.ivy.
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:39 PM
When Radwanska kept moving back and forth on Maria's second serve? Mary Carillo said very frankly that it was.

Because when someone does it against Sharapova it's gamesmanship. :rolleyes:

Please, if Sharapova did it, it'd be called "brilliant tactics." It's not Aga's fault she has a brain.

OMFG
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:43 PM
Yeah and it's done against the innocent girl called Maria who never used gamesmanship herself (Patty and changing racket at match point, nah, that doesn't count of course!)

Olórin
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:44 PM
You have to take what Mary Carillo says, put it in a box, burn the box, then dump the ashes on her head.

:spit: Brilliant :lol:

Chrissie-fan
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:44 PM
Who cares? Oh wow, the girl wanted to win. People put too much emphasis on gamesmanship.
I agree. Most of the gamesmanship talk that we get here on a nearly daily basis is BS in my opinion, nothing more. Tennis is as much a mental game as a physical, tactical or technical game. Your mind is as important as your serve, backhand or footwork. And just as in these other areas of the game a player also tries to get an edge in the mental department. Nothing unsportsmanlike about it, that's competition!

RND
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:46 PM
Well,I have to say yes.But there are a bunch of players using it.So it cant be a big deal. :shrug:

jdyshrky
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:54 PM
God, we always have these posts and we always have people who have no idea what gamesmanship is. It's using a dubious [although not technically illegal] tactic to win a game. Do you understand?

And in this case it was. If I was Maria, who wants to win at any cost, I would have brought it to the umpire's attention, there isn't a lot he could do but he might have and if not it would have brought it to Radwanska's attention and she may have changed things, but maybe not. It could have helped. She wasn't just standing in, she was moving back and forth and to the side quite quickly WHILE Maria was serving which is really distracting. She would stand really close to the service line then back off.

It was a great match but Radwanska obviously was aware Maria's serve was troubled and played on this with her junior tactics. I don't mind whether other players do it or whether Maria does it, in this instance it tarnished the victory. The press conferences will be interesting.

Merton
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:55 PM
No.

Sir Stefwhit
Sep 1st, 2007, 07:57 PM
If you don't like Radwanska it's gamesmanship, if you do like her it's smart tactics. But it really doesn't matter. You do what you have to in order to win.

I clicked in this particular thread to say almost the exact same thing. The overall objective is to play within the outlined rules and secure the win. Players often get criticized when doing things that take an opponent by surprise or do something outside of the box, but let's not forget they're playing to win.

Almost all the top players have been accused of gamesmanship, Serena and her injuries, Masha and her grunting and yelling "come on" when opponents make mistakes, Hingis and her underhanded serve, Justine and her injuries and unsportsmanlike like conduct, etc...

I'm not a fan of players trying to break other players momentum by calling the trainer or taking bathroom breaks at suspicious times during a match, but for the sake of consistency, if it falls within the rules it's fair game. At the end of the day tennis is for the strong minded. Along with developing strokes, players should take more time developing the mental aspect of the game so when things happen they can stay focused.

KoOlMaNsEaN
Sep 1st, 2007, 09:04 PM
I thought we didn't listen to Mary anymore..

It was obviously tactics

Serenita
Sep 1st, 2007, 09:11 PM
You have to take what Mary Carillo says, put it in a box, burn the box, then dump the ashes on her head.


:worship:

BuTtErFrEnA
Sep 1st, 2007, 09:36 PM
no carillo :o

CoolDude7
Sep 1st, 2007, 09:40 PM
I've seen Maria do it several times.

Asaph
Sep 1st, 2007, 09:43 PM
No. That was good tactics. Gamesmanship is disrupting a player's momentum by taking a bathroom break or calling atrainer when you really don't need to do either. Standing in the serve box to imtimidate is not gamesmanship. Carillo is biased to Maria. This is why people don't like her as a commentator. She does this w/ players she likes but if this was a player she did not like she would say Aga was the better tactitian.

WhatTheDeuce
Sep 1st, 2007, 10:33 PM
Mary Carillo didnt say what she was doing was gamesmanship, she said it would be considered gamesmanship if she went right up to the line and hopped/jumped around back and forth etc. That's not really what Radwanska was doing.

And no, it wasnt gamesmanship. It was quite clever actually, and it worked well.

Sir Stefwhit
Sep 2nd, 2007, 12:29 AM
It's all a matter of perspective and semantics. Gamesmanship is just a synonym for tactics. That's problem with tennis, always too concerned about so-called tennis etiquette and tradition. Don't get me wrong I'm all about those things too, it's just that in most sports the emphasis is on competition and the heat of battle. What people don't seem to understand is that those things aren't comprised by using strategy and anything else at your disposal to your advantage.

JOLYN1
Sep 2nd, 2007, 12:46 AM
When Radwanska kept moving back and forth on Maria's second serve? Mary Carillo said very frankly that it was.
No, It was not gamesmanship and Mary Carillo is just upset that Maria lost. Maria herself said that was not the reason she lost. You win some and you lose some. Maria needs to retool her game because she is getting beat much to often. I felt sorry for her that her father left before the end of the match. She needs to lose him as a coach but unfortunately she is stuck with him as her father.

Thanx4nothin
Sep 2nd, 2007, 12:49 AM
If you don't like Radwanska it's gamesmanship, if you do like her it's smart tactics. But it really doesn't matter. You do what you have to in order to win.

Well frankly it ain't that cut and dry, I like aga, but think it WAS in fact gamesmanship, but they both used it out there so you live by the sword and you die by the sword.

ImaVeggie
Sep 2nd, 2007, 01:31 AM
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)

games·man·ship
–noun

1. the use of methods, esp. in a sports contest, that are dubious or seemingly improper but not strictly illegal.
2. the technique or practice of manipulating people or events so as to gain an advantage or outwit one's opponents or competitors.

MisterMan
Sep 2nd, 2007, 01:35 AM
What are you talkin about ? Radwanska SAID IT HERSELF in the interview - read it !! It absolutely WAS gamesmanship.
"She don't like it when you move when she serve"...

It was, she did it, it's legal. End of story.