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View Full Version : Will Davenport and Hingis be able to take the pressure?


TeeRexx
Jul 7th, 2002, 01:00 PM
Chris Evert is personally leading an effort to put Davenport and Hingis in the front of the "Stop the Williams Now" group. At every chance that is available, old Chris will tell everyone how VENUS and SERENA will have their party stopped when her two heros arrive back on the scene.

Lindsay and Hingis will both be coming back from very serious injuries and just playing will be task enough without having to shoulder the new task of Hercules to stop the Williams sister onslaught.

The main target of the knights of chris will be SERENA, whom neither of these two has ever been able successfully handle. Little sis owns Davenport and was in the process of tucking Hingis away in one of her designer purses before the injury to Sergio's babe-for-now.

And to have the D&H duo going against VENUS will be more difficult than ever now that the big sis is going to take her loses to SERENA out on everyone else on the tour.

So if bitter old Chris keeps pushing Hingis and Davenport against the Williams, she may push them not only out of contention with all of the pressure, but out of the sport as well.

Cybelle Darkholme
Jul 7th, 2002, 07:50 PM
Yes they can take the pressure but will they produce results?

Lindsayfan
Jul 7th, 2002, 07:57 PM
they dont have any pressure,pressure is only on Venus and Serena.

evadafan
Jul 7th, 2002, 07:59 PM
THe pressure is on Venus, titleless since what, Justine's choke-fest in Amelia Island???

Bezz
Jul 7th, 2002, 08:01 PM
I agree with lindsayfan, venus and serena are the worlds no1 and no.2 and its now Davenport and Hingis who will challenging for the top spot so they have no pressure. I dont expect them to beat venus and serena as soon as they get back but i expect by the end of this year and the start of next they should have beaten them at least once each.

RockSteady
Jul 7th, 2002, 09:08 PM
Hingis will worry about Capriati first, a player she should double bagel every time they play. As soon as she gets that under control, then she will worry about Venus and Serena.

And all Evert wants, just like us sane people who enjoy good tennis, is competition. If they beat them or not, Lindsay and Martina will provide competition.

TeeRexx
Jul 8th, 2002, 02:35 AM
An insane quote:
-------
"Hingis will worry about Capriati first, a player she should double bagel every time they play"
-------

That statement is beyond stupid. :)

Ryan
Jul 8th, 2002, 02:54 AM
Tee Rexx: I do think Hingis won't double bagel Capriati every time thye play, Hingis is clearly the better player IMO. If she hadn't choked this year, and underestimated Jen last year, she would Aussie Open-less. After that painful loss in Australia, I don't see Hingis losing to Jen Cap often.

harloo
Jul 8th, 2002, 03:16 AM
Lmao@tee about Serena tucking Martina in one of her designer purses. That was funny.

The problem with Chrissy is that she is bias, and is acting like Davenport and Hingis will stop the Williams completely. It's so funny because she goes on and on about it like before they left they were dominating the sisters.

Lindsay and Martina have never had a problem with nerves or alot of pressure until they face a sister. Then they feel the pressure which is understandable, but I think having them back would be good for the game. It will be fun to watch Lindsay vs Serena because the Jen-Rena rivalry is overdone.

TeeRexx
Jul 8th, 2002, 03:25 AM
Harloo - Yeah, Prissy Chrissy is really on a mission. Maybe she should be the new Dr. Evil.
And silly Ryan can be Mini-Me the way he believes that Hingis will stop the Williams. :)

I will patiently be waiting for the return of Lindsay and Marti and how they handle the pressure of Dr. Evil.

Volcana
Jul 8th, 2002, 03:54 AM
Tee Rexx - I watch a fair bit of Wimbledon coverage and I didn't hear Chris Evert saying anything that I'd describe the way you did. She did say they might have a better chance than any of the currently active players, but that's no more than we've said. MIGHT have a better chance.

Part of her job is making the tour seem competitive. She really can't say 'Lindsay and Martina are returning to destroyed by the Williams sisters and left to decay by the side of the road.' That would not sell tickets. (Well, MANY tickets. There's an audience for everything.)

But I didn't see all the coverage, and she might have said far more biased things than i heard. But from what i saw this tournament, she was more than fair.

Larrybid
Jul 8th, 2002, 07:10 AM
Look, of the 2 comtenders that Chrissy has so much hope for, I see only Lindsay as serious competition. Lindsay is a great ball striker with a serve that can be enough of a weapon to keep the Williams' from dominating play. But Hingis? Great ball striker, with no weapons to keep the sisters from dominating play. No way.

Hingis is still an excellent player, with a clean enough game to beat almost anyone else, but can someone explain how she can beat a clean playing Williams with her lolipop serve? Hingis only chance of beating a Williams is if they are wild as hell - and that puts her on the same level as a half-dozen other players.

AjdeNate!
Jul 8th, 2002, 07:13 AM
They shouldn't have any pressure on them at all. They've both been out for so long, it'll be a joy just to have them playing again.

IAM#1
Jul 8th, 2002, 07:20 AM
i totally agree it was getting on my nerves when she kept saying that.. she kept saying it like everytime the sisters played Hingis or Davenport they lost.

Jeff
Jul 8th, 2002, 07:25 AM
Seriously, I doubt that Hingis and Davenport's main focus right now is to be at #1 as soon as possible. Right now they are sidelined from tennis, which is a major part of their life. What's important to them right now is that they remain healthy and are able to retun to the game.

Sure, once they are back into the game, their goal will be to rise back to the top, but I doubt they are going to expect extraordinary results right away.

Will be great to see them both back on court, that's for sure ;)

Maajken
Jul 8th, 2002, 08:49 AM
Originally posted by Seles
They shouldn't have any pressure on them at all. They've both been out for so long, it'll be a joy just to have them playing again.

I completely agree with this. I dont think Martina nor Lindsay will come back to the tour thinking oh no now we have to face the Williams' blah blah blah. They'll be happy to win a few matches at first, to get the confidence back and to get back at the level they were at before they got injured. And if Venus and Serena can improve their tennis (which they have done the past year or so) then theres no reason why Martina and Lindsay cant do it as well.

The pressure is on Venus and Serena, they're 1 and 2. Its up to them to prove whether they can maintain that position or not. The others' job is simply to challenge them, push them as far as possible and beat them in the end.

Sam L
Jul 8th, 2002, 01:23 PM
Someone needs to get over their obsession with Chris Evert :eek:

Bright Red
Jul 8th, 2002, 01:55 PM
I think that there will be pressure on Hingis and Davenport to the extent that they are active players who have won Grand Slam events in the past. There's always pressure on past champions, IMO. They will want to win another Slam, or else they'll have to accept that they are "has-beens". Given this objective, it will be very difficult given how well everyone (especially Serena) is playing.

RAA
Jul 8th, 2002, 02:36 PM
I agree with Bright Red. Especially for Hingis, she has not proven that she can win slams in the era of the big hitters.
Davenport, of course, IS a big hitter, so she has less to prove. Plus, Davenport has pretty much exceeded expectations given her level of talent etc.
When Hingis was #1 at, what, age 17, people were thinking that the sky was the limit on the number of title and Grand Slams. but she has not been able to compete well on a regular basis against first Davenport, then Capriati and Serena and Venus. so, she still has that pressure on her to "prove" herself.

Ntosake
Jul 8th, 2002, 03:17 PM
I think it will be great to see Lindsay and Martina return. They are both champions and so they are already familiar with handling pressure in all forms.

What I think they should be wary of this time however, is the fact that there will be added pressure on them to be some sort of "saviours" of the game (it's already begun in the media and elsewhere)---but as long as they don't buy into that nonsense angle and just come back, play their style of tennis, have fun, keep working and improving their chances to win (against ALL comers, not just the Williams!) then they will do well.

treufreund
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:20 PM
I am not so sure that Lindsay's serve will be difficult for Serena at all since she feasted on Venus's and Amelie's bigger serves. At least when you take some pace off like Virginia Ruano Pascual did you get Serena to overhit some and then she takes some pace off the return. The key is to jam her some and confuse her and mix it up and place the serve. Vary the pace a lot and different spins and pick your spots. She will still return well but it's not that Davenport will bother her with her pace. It will be SMART serving that can help. Hingis and Davenport can both do that like Justine Henin does. Amelie and Venus's serve were not varied enough and Serena was feeding off the pace cuz she got grooved into it. She loves pace and so does Venus so actually I think most serve around 90mph are better if they are really well placed. When you add more pace you tend to miss more or go for less on placement side of things and then they wind up in Serena's wheelhouse and her confidence grows. Both Davenport will have a tough time but because Davenport is bigger people think she will have a better chance. Earlier this year Hingis took Serena to a third set where just one break made the difference. Davenport did the same at the US open last year but both girls have also had some bad losses to especially Serena.

treufreund
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:25 PM
RAA,

I do think having four match points at Oz is sufficient evidence that Hingis CAN win the Grand Slams. You can say that you have to win in order to actually prove it but anyone who plays tennis knows that if you have four match points that you definitely have enough game which is the same as saying that you CAN win.

Ryan
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:30 PM
And silly Ryan can be Mini-Me the way he believes that Hingis will stop the Williams.


Silly Tee Rexx, I never said Hingis would stop the Williams. I just want her to provide some competition for them, to make the otur interesting.:D

RockSteady
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:35 PM
Ryan, TeeRexx reads what he wants to read.

Ryan
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:39 PM
Ryan, TeeRexx reads what he wants to read.


No, really?;) :p I guess it explains why most of his posts are irrelevant to the topic at hand.

TSequoia01
Jul 8th, 2002, 05:52 PM
I do think there will be added pressures when they return. The same pressures now placed upon Jen. There undoubtedly is a cry to stop Venus and Serena. Each one of the commentators not just Chrissie uttered the "Cry". The ladies tour needed Martina and Lindsay back, McEnroe included. Let's see if these added expectation pressures have any effect. :cool:

Helen Lawson
Jul 8th, 2002, 06:02 PM
I think something has been wrong with Hingis mentally for at least a year now. I do not know whether it is burn out, love, or something else. Lindsay is certain to be able to handle the pressure. She is extremely tough. She has been off the tour and people forget she has one of the best killer instincts in the business. Whether she will be playing at the necessary level to challenge the Williamses is another story. Lindsay did poorly against them for the year or so before the injury, except for when she wiped the floor up with Serena at the 2000 U.S. Open. She must have loved that. You can tell in her face Lindsay hates losing to them, and she hates losing to them all the time as she had been prior to the injury. I do not think it is anything personal, but Lindsay likes to win and she hates constant losses to the same players. Mentally, she wants it bad and will have no problem with the pressure. It is where her game is post-injury that is the wildcard for now.

RockSteady
Jul 8th, 2002, 06:31 PM
"I think something has been wrong with Hingis mentally for at least a year now."

She is no longer competitive or focused. She admits as much...why practice tennis when you could party/date/sleep/whatever. That's her stance. I think the more she plays, the less she enjoys tennis. However, after a lay-off, she is hungry. Which is why, in January/February, when the season ends, she starts off strong. In the last two years, she has beaten, in Sydney and Melbourne,

Kim Clijsters twice
Serena twice
Venus
Lindsay
Seles
Sandrine Testud
Lisa Raymond
Meghann Shaughnessy
Amanda Coetzer

I don't think Hingis is a mental head case, but she tends to give up, which is why she doesn't satisfy many of her fans: she isn't a traditional fighter of an athlete. She's there to have fun, not to fight. The only match I've seen her truly show "fight" is Aussie Open last year, coming from 4-1 and 5-3 and 6-5 down against Serena. But her matches against Serena this year, Jen, Elena, Venus...she doesn't push herself when she's down. But I don't think that's a "mental" problem.

TeeRexx
Jul 8th, 2002, 10:20 PM
I absolutely that when Davenport and Hingis return they will be bombarded with questions regarding whether they can stop the Williams.
And Evert will be leading the charge.
Wait until the U.S. Open

Oh yeah, Rockead will be perfect for the part of Fat Bastard. :) LOL

Rolling-Thunder
Jul 8th, 2002, 11:40 PM
I too am sick and tired of the constant whining and carping about the "lack" of competition.

I look forward to Lindsay's and Hingis' return. Perhaps we will see Hingis getting wiped off the court 6-4 6-0 like at Miami again. And we will most likely see Lindsay lose to Serena nearly every time again. I think Lindsay's last victory over Serena was the 2000 US Open. But we can't forget Serena's revenge on Lindsay at Indian Wells 6-2 6-1. mmmm And Lindsay last beat Venus at Linz in 2000 after Venus' long 35 match streak and and Olympics victories. In addition, apart from Hingis' trashing of an out of shape Venus at the 2001 Australian Open I can't really recall anything else Hingis has done in a while against her.

Venus though generally the victor vis-a-vis the two needs to stop playing the game of fighting base line rallies. She should really use her serve to get in and aggressively end the rally earlier.

As for Serena, when in form can generally expect to come out on top when she faces either Lindsay or Hingis. Sorry, but she just does what each of them does better. And it really is a sad sign of desperation to harken back to the 2000 US Open Lindsay vs. Serena quarter-final for any solace. Everyone knows though everyone doesn't concede that Serena, the new #1 player, is hardly the same player from 2001 let alone 2000. Hingis' drubbing 6-4 6-0 is the best indication of what the "new" Serena looks like against the would be, anointed and crowned saviours; those former #1 players who have been put in the unenviable position of "dethroning" the #1 and #2 players in the world.

Good luck! Can't say it will be easy...

:drool:

TeeRexx
Jul 9th, 2002, 05:37 AM
Rolling-Thunder - Good post. Let them all come and see what they can really do now that VENUS and SERENA are at full steam. :)

And Marti is definitely going through a mental block, especially after the debacle at OZ this year.

RockSteady
Jul 9th, 2002, 05:54 AM
I see everyone is trying to kick Hingis when down. :sad: But that's fine. Hingis is 4-6 in her last ten matches against the sisters, and if she didn't miss a smash that she has made every time since she was 9, she would be 5-5. Still, she has a losing record recently against the two most dominate players on tour. Who doesn't? But NOBODY else on tour is 4-6 in their last ten against the sisters. It might not be a good stat for Martina, but it is better than the rest of the tour.

And no, I don't like the fact that Hingis gave up in her last match against Serena, but hey, Serena played solid and Hingis couldn't handle it. Remember, the match before that, Hingis took her to 6-4 in the third, and would have won if Serena wasn't serving out of her mind.

The least Hingis does is give them competition. You're right, she does struggle, but so what? She pushes them 99% of the time, and occasionally beats them. That's all I want. Good, competitive tennis!

The one thing I truly disagree with:

"Sorry, but she just does what each of them does better"

Hingis does MANY things better than Serena. Their games aren't even similar at all, and Serena's weaknesses are Martina's strengths, and vice-versa (which is what makes their rivalry so interesting).

Hingis has better:

volleys
anticipation
consitence
passes (including lobs)
touch
court-sense

Serena has better:

first serves
second serves
forehand
power
speed
mental toughness

They are virtual opposites on the tennis court.

Jakeev
Jul 9th, 2002, 05:56 AM
What is really cool about Lindsay is that when she returns, she will care less about who is on top. She will do what she always have: played the best to her ability and stay her usual cool, classy self.

It's amazing how people think the pressure will be on her when that will be the furthest thing on her mind.

Alan
Jul 9th, 2002, 06:01 AM
LEt them just do their best. Lets not put pressure on only two players, it's up to all the good players out there!

earthcrystal
Jul 9th, 2002, 06:30 AM
Grammer note: One who exhibits bias = biased.

Sorry for the interruption, but I see this mistake made repeatedly and it's been bugging me for awhile now. :p

Lisbeth
Jul 9th, 2002, 07:51 AM
Agree with Rocksteady on all counts. I'm not sure Serena is always mentally tougher than Hingis but on current form I'd agree she is.

I think Lindsay and Martina will be serious contenders but they certainly won't win every match against Venus and Serena either.

harloo
Jul 9th, 2002, 09:02 AM
Lindsay and Martina is the saviour for the white tennis world. Sorry, had to say it and be honest about it. The have thrown Jen to the curb now seeing that she has lost to the sisters the last couple of times. But don't fret, McEnroe tried to make excuses for Jen so he could save her before it's too late. She is the annointed one until Lindsay and Martina return.

Volcana, I don't know what matches you were watching but Prissy Chrissy and McEnroids was going on and on about it every match they commentated with the sisters involved. Lindsay and Martina will challenge the sisters. Then she was so disrespectful, saying Serena was so clumsy she kept falling in her match. She keep going on and on about power, like that's all the sisters games were about. That chick is biased(thanks earthcrystal for the correction you are so smart):rolleyes:. Both of them needs to be fired, because I would rather hear Martina N, Pam Shriver, Zina Garrison, Mary Jo, Mary Carillo(even though she can get a little crazy at times also. Chrissy needs to consider becoming a gossip columnist, because she is too messy for her own good.

TeeRexx
Jul 9th, 2002, 09:36 AM
Harloo - Thanks for correcting Volcana. I guess the volume is not working on his TV.

I guess you also saw James Earl Jones in "The Great White Hope"? Great film. So who will star in the sequel, Jenn, Marti or Lyn? :eek: :)

BigTennisFan
Jul 10th, 2002, 09:12 PM
:D @McEnroids!:D

Raj
Jul 10th, 2002, 09:20 PM
THIS DEBATE IS GETTING REALLY BORING NOW.
CAN WE JUST LEAVE HINGIS AND DAVENPORT ALONE!
AND JUST WAIT AND SEE.
I THINK THEY BOTH KNOW WHAT THEY GOTTA DO, TO GET BACK AT THE TOP. IS IT POSSIBLE? ISNT IT?
ONLY TIME WILL TELL!

TSequoia01
Jul 10th, 2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by RockSteady
Hingis does MANY things better than Serena. Their games aren't even similar at all, and Serena's weaknesses are Martina's strengths, and vice-versa (which is what makes their rivalry so interesting).

Hingis has better:

volleys - (Not against Serena - never would get to net, in fact it would be Serena at net)

anticipation - (intangible which cannot be measured so reduces down to opinion)

consistency - (Agreed)

passes (including lobs) - (This used to be true but no longer. Serena's passing shots are powerful and awesome. Lobs? You must not have been watching the topspin lobs Serena has been hitting lately..jawdropping)

touch - (agreed)

court-sense - (Another intangible subject to opinion)

Serena has better:

first serves - (By far)

second serves - (By far)

forehand - (By far)

power - (By far)

speed - (By far)

mental toughness - (Lately yes)

They are virtual opposites on the tennis court. Backhand - (Left out, But Serena's is superior)

Now this is just about right ;)

Richie77
Jul 10th, 2002, 11:20 PM
I'm not sure about Hingis...the focus that she once had is just not there anymore.
Lindsay, meanwhile, has NO pressure at all. Lindsay is at her best when she's just flying under the radar. That's how it was when she won each of her Slam titles...she was fit, she was playing great, and the attention was focused on someone else.

Lindsay will probably NOT get back into the Top 5 this year...too many points to defend. But after that, she has a great opportunity to camp out there for a while...possibly becoming a solid No. 3 to Serena and Venus. And if everything breaks right, she could win another Slam. I think she has a better chance at winning a Slam than Hingis.