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View Full Version : Do you think Sesil will be able to get any WC's when she comes back?


tenn_ace
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:33 PM
any guesses?

In other words, would YOU give her one if you were a tournament director?

darrinbaker00
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:33 PM
any guesses?

In other words, would YOU give her one if you were a tournament director?
N-O.

LDF
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:34 PM
any guesses?

In other words, would YOU give her one if you were a tournament director?

Nope.

Dexter
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:35 PM
yes, the tournament would be THUNDEROUS!!!

tenn_ace
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:35 PM
well, I, for one, would give her one and even market that... scandals sell, right?

Louis Cyphre
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:38 PM
N-O.

coz she will beat Venus again?

Dexter
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:39 PM
well, I, for one, would give her one and even market that... scandals sell, right?
exactly! :lol:

honeyke
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:39 PM
No!Why?This b**** doesn´t deserve it!

tenn_ace
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:41 PM
exactly! :lol:


seriously, her first match on wta tour will be a big attraction here... I bet. ;) :bounce:

that'd be funny if her first opponent is Venus :haha:

tennisbuddy12
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:42 PM
yeah.....in a 10K Bulgaria event (calling Dokic)

RenaSlam.
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:43 PM
No but I'll give her 2-year old daughter one when she returns.

Elenarulez
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:44 PM
yes ... I'd give her one ...

!Gio!
Nov 14th, 2006, 08:58 PM
The way that people react to a 15,16 year old girl on here disgusts me, its so immature.
Get off your high horses, nobody is perfect and everyone deserves a second chance. To answer the question, yes I would give her a wildcard, she was and will still hopefully be a talented prodigy.

WhatTheDeuce
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:01 PM
When is she allowed back?

I'd definitely give her a WC, would add some minor buzz to the event.

tenn_ace
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:02 PM
When is she allowed back?

I'd definitely give her a WC, would add some minor buzz to the event.


see? we agree...

saki
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:05 PM
I'd give her a WC. She'd add some interest to any tournament - people are curious to see her. And she was so young when the drugs stuff happened that she deserves a second chance.

LindsayRulz
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:07 PM
When is she allowed back?



Australian Open 2008?

WhatTheDeuce
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:08 PM
Australian Open 2008?
Can anyone confirm that?

tenn_ace
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:09 PM
Australian Open 2008?

Her last match was in Nov 2005, so I guess, it's Nov 2007.

LindsayRulz
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:11 PM
Her last match was in Nov 2005, so I guess, it's Nov 2007.

No I think she can't play until AO 08 :sad:

Slumpsova
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:12 PM
i'm sure Sesil will get ones. at least @ 25K Sofia.i can't wait for her coming back thunderous at shut the haters' mouth.

Ben.
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:16 PM
She will get a wildcard in2 a tournament, but only the ITF ones in Bulgaria or in Europe somewhere i reckon.

jazar
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:21 PM
i think her return will create quite a buzz. she will maybe get a wildcard into a reasonably high profile tournament, like a tier 3 or something, then go back and play at a lower level til her ranking permits her to get into the big tournaments again

goldenlox
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:22 PM
She's not Hingis, but if Sesil plays well when she gets back, TD's will want her in their draw.

clonesheep
Nov 14th, 2006, 09:50 PM
Her 2-year ban officially started at Jan 1, 2006, so she will be allowed to play again on Jan 1, 2008.

I guess major WTA tournaments (tier I-IV) will be reluctant to give her wild card, given that she was banned and not having been sick or injured. If a WC is given to Sesil it might draw complaints from other players. I think she should try to play ITF events and build from there.

LH2HBH
Nov 14th, 2006, 10:18 PM
I'd give her a QUALI WC and ask for a peecup in return.

stevos
Nov 14th, 2006, 10:44 PM
I for sure would! She will get some, I think, but mostly for ITF's.

drake3781
Nov 14th, 2006, 10:49 PM
i'm sure Sesil will get ones. at least @ 25K Sofia.i can't wait for her coming back thunderous at shut the haters' mouth.

This is what I think, something in her home country or nearby. She will have to move up to get into others; that will be interesting to see.

njnetswill
Nov 14th, 2006, 11:00 PM
Of course. The tour needs more characters like her.

AnnaK_4ever
Nov 14th, 2006, 11:17 PM
No way.

go hingis
Nov 14th, 2006, 11:18 PM
I think it depends who else needs a wild card at the time. I would give it to Jennifer, Monica, Serena etc over her in a minute but if I had to pick out of a bunch of no names from my home country or say a Dechy then Yes, Sesil can come.

Junex
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:19 AM
I would love too to the extent that i would even offer her appearance money!!!


Question; I thought her ban was retroactive to the time she was caught since all her rankung points and prize money were taken back?

tenn_ace
Nov 15th, 2006, 01:15 AM
I would love too to the extent that i would even offer her appearance money!!!


Question; I thought her ban was retroactive to the time she was caught since all her rankung points and prize money were taken back?

Drug ban upheld for Sesil04/07/2006http://www.tas-cas.org/en/medias/media4.htm (http://www.tas-cas.org/en/medias/media4.htm):
Lausanne, 3 July 2006 - The Court of Arbitration for Sport (CAS) has dismissed the appeal filed by the Bulgarian tennis player Sesil Karatancheva against the decision of the Anti-Doping Tribunal of the International Tennis Federation (ITF) of 11 January 2006.
The ITF Anti-Doping Tribunal has found that the player tested positive twice with the prohibited substance 19-norandrosterone (19-NA) on 31 May 2005 (French Open) and on 5 July 2005 (out-of-competition test in Tokyo). The ITF Anti-Doping Tribunal ordered the disqualification of her result achieved at Roland-Garros in 2005 and the disqualification of all her individual results in all competitions subsequent to the French Open 2005. Furthermore, the ITF Anti-Doping Tribunal imposed a two-year suspension on the player commencing on 1 January 2006.
The player filed an appeal with the CAS on 27 January 2006 to request the annulment of the ITF decision. The player put forward that the elevated levels of 19-NA were due mainly to her pregnancy condition on one hand and biochemical influence of the regularly taken food supplements, on the other. She also argued that the doping control procedures in Paris and Tokyo were violated. The ITF answered that the 19-NA in the players samples was not endogenously produced and that there were no procedural discrepancies relating to the Paris and Tokyo tests.
This matter was submitted to a CAS Panel composed of three arbitrators : Mr Quentin Byrne-Sutton, from Geneva/Switzerland (President), Mr Beat Hodler from Bern/Switzerland and Judge James Robert Reid, from West Liss/England. The parties, their representatives, witnesses and experts were heard by the Panel at a hearing in Lausanne on 5 May 2006.
The CAS Panel rejected the arguments raised by the player and found in particular that the concentrations of 19-NA found in the players Paris sample deviated from the values of 19-NA which might be found in a pregnant woman in her tenth week of pregnancy, in a range that would make it very unlikely for the concentrations of 19-NA to be consistent with the normal endogenous production of the same substance at that stage of pregnancy. As a consequence, the arbitrators confirmed the existence of a doping offence. Concerning the sanction, they maintained the two-year suspension, although Sesil Karatancheva was only 15 years old when the offences occurred. The Panel considered that, as a matter of equality, the anti-doping rules must apply in equal fashion to all participants in competitions they govern, irrespective of the participants age. The Panel also noted that an exception based on age is not spelled out neither in the ITFs Tennis Anti-Doping Program, nor in the World Anti-Doping Code.
As a consequence, the ITF decision is confirmed in full. The full text of the CAS award is published on the CAS website (www.tas-cas.org, section Case Law).

From http://www.tas-cas.org/en/pdf/Karatancheva.pdf (http://www.tas-cas.org/en/pdf/Karatancheva.pdf):
75. Accordingly we consider that the period of ineligibility should start as at the date when we would, but for the holiday period, have issued our decision. We decide pursuant to Article M.8.3(b) that the period of ineligibility shall start on 1 January 2006. The two year period is therefore the calendar years 2006 and 2007. The ban will expire at midnight on 31 December 2007.
76. We conclude by noting that the player is, fortunately for her, very young and talented. She is easily young enough and talented enough to recover from the blow to her career occasioned by this case. We would hope and expect that she will keep her skills honed during her period of ineligibility and will learn from this experience the lessons necessary to ensure that she does not in future fail to comply with the anti-doping rules applicable in her sport. In particular we hope that both she and her advisers will do their utmost to ensure that she takes every precaution to avoid ingesting, inadvertently or otherwise, not just prohibited substances as such, but also dietary supplements that could be contaminated with a prohibited substance.

KimC&MariaSNo1's
Nov 15th, 2006, 03:07 AM
i think she wont come back

hwanmig
Nov 15th, 2006, 11:13 AM
I think she will, I do think she should be given a second chance.
But its kinda sad seeing people who use illegal drugs(marijuana, crack...) act like their saints.

hdfb
Nov 15th, 2006, 11:49 AM
probably only lower tier tournaments......

i seriously dont get the hype around this girl....

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:23 PM
I wouldn't give her a wildcard. I think the sentence passed was, for a change, appropiate. Neither too harsh or too soft. She is still young and she does have immense talent. I hope she is able to go on to have a great career and that she is able to put this scandal behind her. But what she did was very serious and it is quite right that she should have to work her way back up the rankings starting with the smallest tournaments. Good luck to her.

Parsley
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:27 PM
Even if she makes a successful comeback you won't be watching her on tv until at least 2009. It will take a LOOONG time for her to climb back the rankings.

basset
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:28 PM
N O !!!!!!!!!!
no wild cards for cheaters!

CrossCourt~Rally
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:52 PM
I'd give her a QUALI WC and ask for a peecup in return.

:spit:

controlfreak
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:56 PM
Why on earth should she get a second chance? If you worked for a bank and one of your employees was caught stealing, would you give them a second chance after they had done their prison time? Because that is exactly what Karatantcheva did, she was trying to earn more prize money than she was entitled to by using drugs to enhance her athletic performance. As far as I know she reached the quarterfinals of Roland Garros in 2005 which was worth €110,370, by cheating! People have been killed for much smaller acts of thievery! DO NOT try to argue that the effects of nandrolone or whatever she took may have been insignificant in this achievement. Drug users do not have the right to use that argument.

You may argue that she was only 15 and did not understand the implications. Well every 15-year-old I have ever known has understood right and wrong to the extent that they would think twice before deciding to gain an unfair advantage on the world stage where hundreds of thousands of dollars are at stake.

The only possible argument that can be used to defend this player is that she was given illegal supplements without her knowledge. This is an argument which is highly dubious and anybody would be well within their rights to be rather skeptical of it.

Any tournament director who gives this girl a second chance in tennis is basically taking a ridiculously soft stance against doping, to the extent that they would practically be promoting drugs in sport. As such, they should be shot in the kneecaps and suspended by their bollocks over a vat of elephant dung for six weeks!

:armed: :fiery:

ps: I even used to like Sesil before it transpired that she was THE LOWEST FORM OF CHEATING SCUM THAT EXISTS ON THIS PLANET!

Shvedbarilescu
Nov 15th, 2006, 12:57 PM
Even if she makes a successful comeback you won't be watching her on tv until at least 2009. It will take a LOOONG time for her to climb back the rankings.

That is probably true.

Nicjac
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:13 PM
Why on earth should she get a second chance? If you worked for a bank and one of your employees was caught stealing, would you give them a second chance after they had done their prison time? Because that is exactly what Karatantcheva did, she was trying to earn more prize money than she was entitled to by using drugs to enhance her athletic performance. As far as I know she reached the quarterfinals of Roland Garros in 2005 which was worth 110,370, by cheating! People have been killed for much smaller acts of thievery! DO NOT try to argue that the effects of nandrolone or whatever she took may have been insignificant in this achievement. Drug users do not have the right to use that argument.

You may argue that she was only 15 and did not understand the implications. Well every 15-year-old I have ever known has understood right and wrong to the extent that they would think twice before deciding to gain an unfair advantage on the world stage where hundreds of thousands of dollars are at stake.

The only possible argument that can be used to defend this player is that she was given illegal supplements without her knowledge. This is an argument which is highly dubious and anybody would be well within their rights to be rather skeptical of it.

Any tournament director who gives this girl a second chance in tennis is basically taking a ridiculously soft stance against doping, to the extent that they would practically be promoting drugs in sport. As such, they should be shot in the kneecaps and suspended by their bollocks over a vat of elephant dung for six weeks!

:armed: :fiery:

ps: I even used to like Sesil before it transpired that she was THE LOWEST FORM OF CHEATING SCUM THAT EXISTS ON THIS PLANET!


When I started reading your tennis-related post I thought someone hacked into your account :eek: ;)

But the shot in the kneecaps gave you away, so I can rest assured :kiss:

Anyway, I am not your opinion. People make mistakes, teenagers make even more incredible mistakes, but they are teenagers and not all their brain cells are connected in the right places yet. And in this case, some influential people in her entourage ever missed that developmental step.

She was banned, that was tough enough (kind of a prison sentence), she served that sentence, and if she comes back she deserves a second chance. If we would'nt give second chances we'd all rot in hell before the age of 17.

I'd give her a wildcard without a bling ... uhm ... I meant in a blink.

MyskinaManiac
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:23 PM
Im under the belief that she probably didn't know what was doing at the time of her taking the drugs... she probably was lead to believe that they were supplements. Of course, her dad was her coach, so he obviously had a major influence on her taking the banned substance/s.

On a whole, her banning was not only a banning for her, but it was a banning deigned to set some kind of a precendent and to retain the clean image of the sport. Lastly, it probably served as a punishment to Sesils coach or father, I mean if you were in her situation wouldn't you pissed off and ready to murder the person who influenced you to take the illegal substance?

But, as I mentioned before, someone has to get the punishment. Sesil should not be welcomed back with open arms because the tour does not condone illegal drug use. However, she should have the rights of every other player and at her age of return (18) she would be able to play in as many tournaments as her heart desires... so yes I believe her return will be rather fast and 'thunderous'.

Peace out.

matthias
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:26 PM
i wouldnt give her a WC
she should work up with challengers

matthias
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:31 PM
.

You may argue that she was only 15 and did not understand the implications. Well every 15-year-old I have ever known has understood right and wrong to the extent that they would think twice before deciding to gain an unfair advantage on the world stage where hundreds of thousands of dollars are at stake.



the age thing is so lame, she was ready to earn more then 100.000$ in one torunament, but is not able to understand what is right or wrong??? :haha:

Craigy
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:32 PM
No. She cheated :)

Louis Cyphre
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:37 PM
The way that people react to a 15,16 year old girl on here disgusts me, its so immature.
Get off your high horses, nobody is perfect and everyone deserves a second chance. To answer the question, yes I would give her a wildcard, she was and will still hopefully be a talented prodigy.

what do you expace from 12 y.o. or from 30 y.o. do NOTHING in their life ;)
At 15 Sesil reach Top40 and a lot of people are angry when someone so young make such a succes :drool:

Nicjac
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:38 PM
the age thing is so lame, she was ready to earn more then 100.000$ in one torunament, but is not able to understand what is right or wrong??? :haha:

Yeah, that is the reason. You want $$$, and you do stupid things to get them. Especially in an environment in which $100.000 is not considered a lot of money. Even a lot of "old" and supposingly smart senior managers fall into that trap. Well, in their case (Mannesmann, Enron, Siemens are some recent examples) it it millions in double digits.

matthias
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:42 PM
Yeah, that is the reason. You want $$$, and you do stupid things to get them. Especially in an environment in which $100.000 is not considered a lot of money. Even a lot of "old" and supposingly smart senior managers fall into that trap. Well, in their case (Mannesmann, Enron, Siemens are some recent examples) it it millions in double digits.


sure, but if someone is not ready for the buisness then she is not ready,
few people are never ready for the big-buisness
sure - 100.000 are not that much money in tennis-buisness
since coach, management and all the people around her want money too
but i can not sell myself with 15 as the next big thing and then when i do something stupid then "im just 15"

she was ready to sign million-dollar contracts, but when she some critics came up she came always with stuff like "im just 17" bla bla bla

saki
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:47 PM
You may argue that she was only 15 and did not understand the implications. Well every 15-year-old I have ever known has understood right and wrong to the extent that they would think twice before deciding to gain an unfair advantage on the world stage where hundreds of thousands of dollars are at stake.


You may disagree with it on principle but the fact is that we don't consider 15 year olds capable of adult responsibilities. In most countries, we don't consider them capable of choosing to smoke, drink, get married, have sex and we don't tend to try them in court under the same rules or punish them to the same extent.

Dawn Marie
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:50 PM
HELL NO!!

Because she didn't EARN anything the year prior. She cheated by using dope. She needs to EARN her rank fair and square when she comes back! It wouldn't be fair to those who play by the rules and who are working their asses off for a WC.

SESIL, needs to EARN her rank DOPE FREE. With a mindset like hers in would behoove her to come out playing without a freebie! EARN IT the hard way. It will benefit her in the end.

MyskinaManiac
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:54 PM
At the end of the day, it's only fair that she gets the full ban... she plays in a professional sport, regardless of her age that's what one has to expect if they are attenpting to cheap the system. She's already tried to take the easy road (drugs) she should take the harder path of qualifying for small tournaments out in the country-side of Europe.

Nicjac
Nov 15th, 2006, 04:56 PM
sure, but if someone is not ready for the buisness then she is not ready,
few people are never ready for the big-buisness
sure - 100.000 are not that much money in tennis-buisness
since coach, management and all the people around her want money too
but i can not sell myself with 15 as the next big thing and then when i do something stupid then "im just 15"

she was ready to sign million-dollar contracts, but when she some critics came up she came always with stuff like "im just 17" bla bla bla

You are right, people around her wanted that kind of money - and used a talented teenager to get to that. So, should the teenager be punished forever or should she get another chance and, hopefully, change her views and entourage?

And I wouldn't compare a regular teenagers life (which is taxing and terrifying enough) with a life in which several 100.000 people know your name. She took all the blame, she might never recover from it, she served her sentence, so I think one should give her another chance.

And a small remark- Maria Sharapova was the one who used that "only 17" line once too often.

matthias
Nov 15th, 2006, 05:00 PM
yes, she should get another chance - 2 year ban and then she get another chance
but i think she should try to make it on her own, without WC
just to show all the critics how serious she is with her comeback

Nicjac
Nov 15th, 2006, 05:03 PM
yes, she should get another chance - 2 year ban and then she get another chance
but i think she should try to make it on her own, without WC
just to show all the critics how serious she is with her comeback

All right, I can relate to that view. :)

MyskinaManiac
Nov 15th, 2006, 05:07 PM
I agree

-sugi-
Nov 15th, 2006, 05:08 PM
Yes, definetely.

Uranus
Nov 15th, 2006, 05:27 PM
Stop talking of her, she won't play until 2008...

I guess she won't be given any WC, anyway she doesn't deserve any, she had to think of the consequences before taking forbidden substances :o