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getright
May 10th, 2006, 02:04 AM
There's a grocery list of reasons for Williamses' decline


May 9, 2006
By Joel Drucker
Special to CBS SportsLine.com



Last week a supermarket clerk saw I was wearing tennis clothes and asked if I'd ever seen the duo he called "the sisters" play. He added, "They sure kick butt, don't they?" I told him that Venus and Serena Williams were great players but these days weren't taking home any hardware.

I didn't tell him that saying that left me feeling quite ambivalent.

At one level, the erosion of Venus and Serena makes me mad, angry that two champions who might have been catalysts for making tennis popular in the manner of Tiger Woods have lost their way and opted for glitz over glory.

The compassionate part of me is sad, seeing a sorry tale of rise and decline, set amid a lonely sport where responsibility and desire are strictly personal and maintaining solitary focus is a tough go. Then again, it's important to remember what motivated Venus and Serena to reach this point.

In the spring of 1978, Richard Williams was watching TV and saw a woman named Virginia Ruzici holding up a large check. She'd just won the French Open. A light bulb went off in his head: Bring a daughter into the world and make her a tennis champion. Just in case, why not two?

So here is the takeaway: Richard saw big money -- tennis as a means, not an end. Mission accomplished. By obeying their dad's orders, Venus and Serena will never have to work a day in their lives. With each having lived barely a quarter-century, what remains?

Regardless of intent, the duo's journey from Compton to Wimbledon is one of the most incredible tales in the history of sports. As Lindsay Davenport once said, "Imagine if Tiger had a brother chasing him down on the 16th hole of the Masters."

Imagine indeed, and for a time, that's exactly what Venus and Serena were doing. Not once in the 20th century did two sisters meet in the finals of a major tennis tournament (I assume you don't remember the Watson rivalry of 1884). But starting with the 2001 U.S. Open, Venus and Serena squared off in six Slam finals in less than two years. So powerful, swift and gutsy were these two that they could even overcome their technical limits with raw and compelling confidence.

But the way competition works is that rivals study, catch up and seek to surpass. And since tennis players have no teammates banging them around in practice to get better and pursue that title, dedication is strictly an individual matter.

On the one hand, this can trigger incredible efforts of singular ambition, as evidenced by the careers of Pete Sampras, Jimmy Connors, Chris Evert and Martina Navratilova. But deregulation can leave one adrift. John McEnroe, Boris Becker and Andre Agassi all spent many hours lamenting the burdens of being the world's best and that perhaps it might not be so great to try to be a champion. Joe Montana's fellow 49ers would've kicked his butt had he spoken with such angst about the pursuit of a Super Bowl ring.

"Tennis is harder because you always have to take the shot," says former NBA player John Lucas, an All-American in both basketball and tennis. "But basketball makes you a better person because you learn to work with other people and create something that's bigger than you. Team play gives you something to strive for."

Venus and Serena -- for a time a team unto themselves, theoretically pushing and supporting one another -- have always been keen to discuss their offcourt interests. Venus, more cerebral and reticent, is drawn to her interior design business and books. The visceral Serena favors fashion and acting.

So long as they were competing and winning, who dared argue that these activities would divert their focus? But as their dedication wavered and wandered -- in the first four months of 2006, the two played but one event, January's Australian Open, repeatedly withdrawing from subsequent tournaments with injuries -- it's left me wondering if these offcourt pursuits are merely a smokescreen for an evasion of the heavy lifting it takes to be a world-class athlete.

"I'm not just a tennis star," Serena once said, "I'm a superstar."

Proud of her ability to command a camera, always more eager to discuss her footwear than her footwork, Serena last week issued a news release declaring her desire to return to the WTA Tour and overcome her knee and ankle injuries. Oddly enough, it's not even displayed on her bubble-gum pink website (which does offer ways to get Serena Williams wallpaper and ring tones).

Having sat through news conferences where Serena has filed her nails, argued over the meaning of the word "ghetto," and usually failed to credit her opponent for anything other than being a "nice girl," my initially response boiled down to one word: Whatever.

I am in large part heartily bored with Serena's persona but still willing to hold out a candle in hopes that she might have the gumption to make a go at being a champion once again.

It's tougher to assess Venus. Lacking Serena's external swagger -- in fact, there are times Venus speaks as if she's near-catatonic -- she tends to be far more pensive than her younger sister.

Best of all, she has started to play again too. Last week she fought through cramps to earn a 4-6, 7-5, 6-4 win over longstanding rival Martina Hingis at an event in Warsaw.

Not having seen the match (curse this international sport -- and $100 to someone who can get me a tape), it's tough to know what conclusion to draw. Is Hingis playing at the level of a Wimbledon champion, or is Venus barely a top 20 player?

Venus played gutsy tennis to win Wimbledon last year, but even then it was clear she'd take very little from that win and build a consistent pattern of play. Upon losing to Kim Clijsters at the U.S. Open last September, she issued a lame excuse that her opponent's weak play and change of pace had been the reason for her defeat.

Run that by me again: Steve Nash and the Suns were playing so poorly that Kobe and the Lakers couldn't help but blow that lead. Golly, there are times I know precisely why tennis generates such poor cultural traction in this country. In a nation of individuals, the last thing we want from the sports world is yet another showcase of self-reliance run amok.

Tempting at is to say it's mostly a matter of desire, that all Venus and Serena need to do is get out there and they'll be making my local supermarket clerk happy, there are a number of technical and physical factors affecting both sisters.

First off, they get injured for a very cogent reason. For world-class players, they have terrible technique, muscling the ball more with their arms and wrists than using all of their body weight to generate pace. It's most apparent on each of their forehands, which can fly when not timed properly.

Venus' service motion, a delivery she once claimed was patterned after Pete Sampras' great serve, is horrifically unbalanced and likely to cause shoulder problems. At the world-class level, bad technique triggers a vicious cycle of injuries, the inability to train, poor fitness and erratic competition.

Second, the upgrades in power Venus and Serena brought to the tour have been matched by many other players. No longer do they have the biggest weapons. Now it's a matter of their willingness to try to grub out improvements.

As children, these two followed their father's directions right to the top. To do so they occupied, as most tennis players do, a bubble of self-assurance and self-absorption.

"Why," Connors once asked me, "should I even care what anyone else does?"

As adults, do they have the gumption to go for greatness? Let me repeat: I only want them to make the effort. Certainly they don't have to. Personal responsibility is tennis' bedrock.

But as Billie Jean King says, "Do you want to be 50 years old, sitting in your chair, asking yourself, 'What if? What if I'd put it on the line and let myself see who I could be?'"

Memo to Venus and Serena: Stop trying to be so interesting. Just be interested.

http://www.sportsline.com/tennis/story/9428402

CrossCourt~Rally
May 10th, 2006, 02:12 AM
This article belongs at the Tabloid Section at the Grocery Store. :tape:

Summer Snow
May 10th, 2006, 02:13 AM
:yawn:

MrSerenaWilliams
May 10th, 2006, 02:18 AM
Intersesting final quote though....

Stamp Paid
May 10th, 2006, 02:23 AM
"I'm not just a tennis star," Serena once said, "I'm a superstar."

I thought Anna Kournikova said this. :confused:

Rocketta
May 10th, 2006, 02:24 AM
Can I really take seriously what a *cough* tennis reporter *cough* has to say when he doesn't even know how to get a copy of a match, um are you that boring that you have no friends in Europe that can get you a copy if you don't know how to get it off the net?

and it's funny that he's left with the feeling of 'whatever' when he thinks about Serena because I'm sure that's what she thinks about him. :lol:

Stamp Paid
May 10th, 2006, 02:28 AM
"First off, they get injured for a very cogent reason. For world-class players, they have terrible technique, muscling the ball more with their arms and wrists than using all of their body weight to generate pace. It's most apparent on each of their forehands, which can fly when not timed properly."

Which is why Serena has a knee/leg injury right now, ROTFLMAO. Idiot journalist. :smash: Neither has "horrible" technique, Serena actually has awesome technique on the forehand side. Blame all of Venus and Serena's injuries on how they hit forehands.

vettipooh
May 10th, 2006, 02:41 AM
He's such an a@#!! He tells them to 'stop trying to be so interesting', yet, that's the one reason he's so interested in them :rolleyes:............they are interesting young women!! Get over it, already!!! They are what they are!!!!

vogus
May 10th, 2006, 02:44 AM
thanx for posting. A great article by one of the best tennis writers anywhere.

Check out Drucker's book on Jimmy Connors.

CJ07
May 10th, 2006, 02:58 AM
I really don't understand why these journalists feel that the sisters owe them anything :shrug:

LoveFifteen
May 10th, 2006, 03:03 AM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:

Mother_Marjorie
May 10th, 2006, 03:16 AM
I really don't understand why these journalists feel that the sisters owe them anything :shrug:

I've told people forever that Venus and Serena create jobs.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 03:18 AM
This article is crap, Venus and Serena have a fundamental right to live their lives the way they want to. How the hell is that reporter going to tell them to stop doing outside activities. Even McDonalds acknowledged their interest in other things other than tennis. Which is why they let Venus design the hats for the Olympics and a McDonald's ad in a magazine even showed Venus designing outfits, not playing tennis. Venus and Serena will never, ever, ever, be solely dedicated to tennis. I wish these dumb reporters would accept it a move on, and at least respect what the Williams sisters are doing with their lives. One day they will be like Magic Johnson and Michael Jordan and be big time businesswomen.

crazyroberto6767
May 10th, 2006, 03:20 AM
Meh, the last line is at least a decent try at inspiration. It's pretty much the same old same old though. Tennis does not equal basketball. That quote by Venus has been run through 8000X times. Was it really clear at Wimby that Venus wouldn't improve? :p @ not knowing about Eurosport. Them failing to give credit is pretty much the same deal about being run through 8000X. He mentions possible injuries that haven't happened or are not sidelining the sisters lately. "I only want them to make the effort.", yeah so do Chrissie, Martina N., etc. The article is well-written though, even if the information and standpoint has been regurgatated quick a bit lately.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 03:23 AM
Venus and Serena have opened up many doors for women's sports, especially endorsements and TV ratings wise. At least the store clerk knew who Venus and Serena are enough to ask the dude about them. I Didn't see the clerk asking about MOMO or Roger, just goes to show how big Venus and Serena are.

vettipooh
May 10th, 2006, 03:25 AM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:
I noticed there are 7 foods on your list.........is that one for each slam she's won??:rolleyes: :bounce: :worship: :wavey:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 03:29 AM
I wish Serena's knee could do a press conference, maybe then reporters would believe that it's a legitimate problem.

CrossCourt~Rally
May 10th, 2006, 03:31 AM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:

HEY LEAVE HOT POCKETS OUT OF THIS!!! :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:

tennisboi
May 10th, 2006, 03:35 AM
He is right about the girls technique it's very awkward epically Venus' serve but he making a valid point in the regard that Vee and Rena will be remembered as much for their rise as for their fall. It's no lie I’m their biggest fan but I will admit they do have the capacity to be legends and their it throwing away. I don't want to sound cliché but the ball is firmly in their court

CrossCourt~Rally
May 10th, 2006, 03:37 AM
He is right about the girls technique it's very awkward epically Venus' serve but he making a valid point in the regard that Vee and Rena will be remembered as much for their rise as for their fall. It's no lie I’m their biggest fan but I will admit they do have the capacity to be legends and their it throwing away. I don't want to sound cliché but the ball is firmly in their court

Well said.... :yeah:

Volcana
May 10th, 2006, 03:40 AM
The author misses his own point.As adults, do they have the gumption to go for greatness?The question is, do they have the gumption to define their own goals? Or will they let others do that for them?

meyerpl
May 10th, 2006, 03:48 AM
On one hand, there are parasitic sports writers who will snidely lambaste the Williams sisters, regardless of what they do.
On the other hand, if Serena Williams gained two hundred pounds and some writer pointed out that the extra cargo was adversely affecting her game, some fans would rise-up in protest and proclaim that he doesn't know what he's talking about.

vogus
May 10th, 2006, 03:52 AM
The author misses his own point.The question is, do they have the gumption to define their own goals? Or will they let others do that for them?


Goals? The sisters don't appear to have any goals. More than anything in this world, they wanted to fulfill their father's prophecy and use tennis to make themselves rich and famous. Now they are rich and famous. If they want to spend the rest of their lives enjoying and showing off their wealth and fame, fine. But that isn't a goal by most definitions.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 03:56 AM
Theses sports writers will eat crow this year!

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:03 AM
Goals? The sisters don't appear to have any goals. More than anything in this world, they wanted to fulfill their father's prophecy and use tennis to make themselves rich and famous. Now they are rich and famous. If they want to spend the rest of their lives enjoying and showing off their wealth and fame, fine. But that isn't a goal by most definitions.

Venus is the CEO of her own business and is getting a BACHOLER'S DEGREE this year and Serena is the CEO of her business. Those are not goals? How many top ten tennis players can boast they have the college degrees, while they were top tennis players? Venus and Serena do have goals, on and off the tennis court. And they are not show offs when it comes to their money, what have they been showing off? Your claims are BOGUS!

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:19 AM
at least Venus and Serena have most of their grocery list checked off

became number ones in the word
played my sister in slams
won slams in singles, mixed, and doubles
won Olympic gold medals for my country
made a ton of money
won numerous titles
owned 99.5% of the girls on tour
turned the tennis establishment upside down
brought power to the game
world record holder for fastest serve
Met Coretta Scott King
brought glam to the tour
brought excitement to the tour
attracted non-traditional tennis fans
earned the hate and respect of the tennis establishment
proved people that said we would not make it wrong
won slams while in a "slump"

New list dominate the tour again

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 04:20 AM
I've learned to indulge Serena's fashion and acting aspirations, it's very obvious to anybody paying attention that she serious about them or else she would have been done with them after doing a few shows. This constant criticism she's facing from the tennis world is only increasing her drive to prove herself in another field. Bullying Serena is not going to work. All it's doing is making these other fields feel more challenging to her, thereby giving it more appeal to her. I just want her to do some really serious acting and designing and get the curiosity out of her system. If it's meant to be she'll get tired of seeing all the other players do well in tennis, her competitive drive will kick in promting her to remind everyone how gifted a player she is, and make her way back with reknewed deeper passion and more fire than ever. If you love somebody set them free, the more people try to limit her the more she'll fight to prove herself. That's just the way she was made. We all know what a fighter Serena is, this is one fight she is determined to win, I'm betting she's going to.

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 04:28 AM
at least Venus and Serena have most of their grocery list checked off

became number ones in the word
played my sister in slams
won slams in singles, mixed, and doubles
won Olympic gold medals for my country
made a ton of money
won numerous titles
owned 99.5% of the girls on tour
turned the tennis establishment upside down
brought power to the game
world record holder for fastest serve
Met Coretta Scott King
brought glam to the tour
brought excitement to the tour
attracted non-traditional tennis fans
earned the hate and respect of the tennis establishment
proved people that said we would not make it wrong
won slams while in a "slump"

New list dominate the tour again
:worship: Now that is a grocery list.

Kenny
May 10th, 2006, 05:03 AM
Bleh.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:03 AM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:


:tape: Very bad!! But funny.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:05 AM
Venus and Serena have opened up many doors for women's sports, especially endorsements and TV ratings wise. At least the store clerk knew who Venus and Serena are enough to ask the dude about them. I Didn't see the clerk asking about MOMO or Roger, just goes to show how big Venus and Serena are.


I hate to say it to you, but the store clerk didn't seem to even know their names!! He called them "those sisters" :tape:

Lulu.
May 10th, 2006, 05:12 AM
at least Venus and Serena have most of their grocery list checked off

became number ones in the word
played my sister in slams
won slams in singles, mixed, and doubles
won Olympic gold medals for my country
made a ton of money
won numerous titles
owned 99.5% of the girls on tour
turned the tennis establishment upside down
brought power to the game
world record holder for fastest serve
Met Coretta Scott King
brought glam to the tour
brought excitement to the tour
attracted non-traditional tennis fans
earned the hate and respect of the tennis establishment
proved people that said we would not make it wrong
won slams while in a "slump"

New list dominate the tour again





:bowdown:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 05:14 AM
I hate to say it to you, but the store clerk didn't seem to even know their names!! He called them "those sisters" :tape:

doesn't matter!

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:15 AM
doesn't matter!


I bet he knew Anna Kournikova by her name though! ;)

Lulu.
May 10th, 2006, 05:17 AM
I bet he knew Anna Kournikova by her name though! ;)



Probably...every guy knew her because they saw her as a piece of meat. Not a tennis player :)

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:19 AM
Probably...every guy knew her because they saw her as a piece of meat. Not a tennis player :)

Some could argue that Serena is not a tennis player right now either and more of a "piece of meat" posing for cameras . Don't forget, Anna Kournikova was at one time a very good tennis player, and she does have doubles titles to her name, so it's not like she was just a pin up girl with no talent.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 05:26 AM
I bet he knew Anna Kournikova by her name though! ;)

so why didn't the clerk ask about Anna :confused:

Why was the clerks first inclination the Sisters and not Anna. :confused:

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:31 AM
so why didn't the clerk ask about Anna :confused:

Why was the clerks first inclination the Sisters and not Anna. :confused:


Maybe he picked up a tabloid and it had a photo of skimpy dressed Serena in it at the check out stand? :devil:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 05:33 AM
sisters are more famous, people associate tennis with the "sisters" :devil: :devil:

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 05:42 AM
sisters are more famous, people associate tennis with the "sisters" :devil: :devil:

I think Anna is more famous really. And Anna was famous first. :devil:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 05:55 AM
I think Anna is more famous really. And Anna was famous first. :devil:

I have four brothers and none of them know Anna, but they know the Williams sisters. No one in my famliy knows who she is, I'm the only one that knows who she is because I follow tennis and I never heard of Anna until I followed tennis.

But I know Venus and Serena they were on the front pages of NYC newspapers. Don't ever recall ANNA making front page for 8.5 million New Yorkers to see.

several market studies already proved that Venus and Serena were the most recognizable.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 06:12 AM
I have four brothers and none of them know Anna, but they know the Williams sisters. No one in my famliy knows who she is, I'm the only one that knows who she is because I follow tennis and I never heard of Anna until I followed tennis.

But I know Venus and Serena they were on the front pages of NYC newspapers. Don't ever recall ANNA making front page for 8.5 million New Yorkers to see.

several market studies already proved that Venus and Serena were the most recognizable.


Obviously, your brothers are gay, and it's quite easy for you to say market studies say anything, without producing them for everybody to see ;) :devil:

JoJoCircus
May 10th, 2006, 06:16 AM
HEY LEAVE HOT POCKETS OUT OF THIS!!! :drool: :drool: :drool: :drool:

Ever tried Lean Pockets, some of those are actually pretty good.

Back to the subject, when it rains it pours and when the media shit on people they shit in bucketloads, why was this diatribe about the sisters necessary right now? Leave the fricken girls alone :fiery:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 06:22 AM
Obviously, your brothers are gay, and it's quite easy for you to say market studies say anything, without producing them for everybody to see ;) :devil:

Nope my brothers are straight, they just don't know Anna. :devil:

I could produce it but I'm not, your the one that needs the validation not me, so you look for it. :devil: :devil:

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 06:25 AM
Nope my brothers are straight, they just don't know Anna. :devil:

Are you sure they are straight? Maybe they just haven't told you yet ? :awww:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 06:29 AM
Are you sure they are straight? Maybe they just haven't told you yet ? :awww:

Why do they have to be gay because they dont know Anna :confused: :confused: My mother, father, sisters, and friends don't know who she is either are they gay too? :confused: :confused:

vogus
May 10th, 2006, 06:30 AM
Obviously, your brothers are gay, and it's quite easy for you to say market studies say anything, without producing them for everybody to see ;) :devil:


better not to argue with him, he's delusional from all that crack he's been smoking.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 06:36 AM
I really don't understand why these journalists feel that the sisters owe them anything :shrug:

They seem to think they own them and know better what they should do than
they do. Why don't they shut up or go give all the other women on the tour advice? ::shrug: There are so many who can use some :rolleyes:

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 06:40 AM
So let me get this straight-- any man who is not attracted to Anna Kornikova must be gay?? WTF?? :rolleyes:

vogus
May 10th, 2006, 06:40 AM
They seem to think they own them and know better what they should do than
they do. Why don't they shut up or go give all the other women on the tour advice? ::shrug: There are so many who can use some :rolleyes:


well, do you think mag publishers are going to pay journalists to write a column telling the slumping Jelena Jankovic or Natalie Dechy to get their slack asses in gear? Of course not, who the hell wants to read about those players. They are not newsworthy.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 06:42 AM
better not to argue with him, he's delusional from all that crack he's been smoking.

Funny, that's exactly what I thought about you :lol:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 06:48 AM
So let me get this straight-- any man who is not attracted to Anna Kornikova must be gay?? WTF?? :rolleyes:

I was thinking the same thing.

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 07:28 AM
I hate to say it to you, but the store clerk didn't seem to even know their names!! He called them "those sisters" :tape:
Loud and wrong as usual. He refered to them as "the sisters" which is the thing their fans sometimes refer to them as. Then he added, "They sure kick butt, don't they?" If he didn't them how would he know how good they are?

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 07:31 AM
Obviously, your brothers are gay, and it's quite easy for you to say market studies say anything, without producing them for everybody to see ;) :devil:
Like you and those stats you never produced. :lol:

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 07:33 AM
I was thinking the same thing.
Co-sign.

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 07:34 AM
So let me get this straight-- any man who is not attracted to Anna Kornikova must be gay?? WTF?? :rolleyes:
No, she's just letting us know about her gay attraction to Anna.

Stamp Paid
May 10th, 2006, 07:42 AM
No, she's just letting us know about her gay attraction to Anna.

ROTFLMAO you called it!! :worship:

Marcell
May 10th, 2006, 01:54 PM
This writer basically answered his own question. For Richard, tennis was a means not the end. I saw ESPN Chronicle where Richard said he didn't want his children to do it like Zina,Tracy Austin or Jennifer they should just be themselves. He wanted them to get an education,stay away from drugs and stay away from having babies.What better advice can a parent give his child than to be themselves. It was quite interesting that in that same interview Venus said there are many thing she wanted to do in her live and tennis was not the first thing she said. As a matter of fact,she said she wanted to be an Archeologist,Astronaut,Tennis player, and who knows what other interest will come in the future.I think these women knows what makes them happy and barring injuries they will decide if tennis is that thing.One thing that Richard said that was hilarious was that he has never seen a 14 year old that was ready to turn pro and by the time they are 25 you have a fool on your hand.Presuming they live to 75, you have 50 years to deal with a fool.
Writers and former tennis players see what could have been, but are they missing the fact that this is maybe what was planned.

Justine Fan
May 10th, 2006, 02:09 PM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:

Now that is very, very funny LoveFifteen :haha: :haha:

:yeah:

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 02:37 PM
The author is right. Any great athlete who has behaved the way they do would be criticized. And it's true that they can "live their lives the way they want", but that doesn't mean they won't be criticized for it. ;)

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 02:52 PM
Goals? The sisters don't appear to have any goals. More than anything in this world, they wanted to fulfill their father's prophecy and use tennis to make themselves rich and famous. Now they are rich and famous. If they want to spend the rest of their lives enjoying and showing off their wealth and fame, fine. But that isn't a goal by most definitions.
Venus has been getting her college degree, planning and launching a business, while playing professional tennis and being the second most successful women's tennis player in the business, behind only her sister Serena.

Together they have won nearly half the slams of this century! You don't accomplish these kinds of things without setting goals. What other top player has opened a business and completed their college degree while playing professional tennis?! Just try to be a little fair; you might not agree with their goals or priorities, but don't say they don't have them. That's just either stupid or disingenuous. :rolleyes:

And the single focused ones have done what exactly? Give Justine her props for being the banner child for single-focus tennis. But even she found a way to play tennis and find a husband. Guess that is a more legitimate pursuit for a woman tennis player in your mind.

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 02:53 PM
at least Venus and Serena have most of their grocery list checked off

became number ones in the word
played my sister in slams
won slams in singles, mixed, and doubles
won Olympic gold medals for my country
made a ton of money
won numerous titles
owned 99.5% of the girls on tour
turned the tennis establishment upside down
brought power to the game
world record holder for fastest serve
Met Coretta Scott King
brought glam to the tour
brought excitement to the tour
attracted non-traditional tennis fans
earned the hate and respect of the tennis establishment
proved people that said we would not make it wrong
won slams while in a "slump"

New list dominate the tour againLOVE IT!

borisy
May 10th, 2006, 02:56 PM
Venus is the CEO of her own business and is getting a BACHOLER'S DEGREE this year and Serena is the CEO of her business. Those are not goals? How many top ten tennis players can boast they have the college degrees, while they were top tennis players? Venus and Serena do have goals, on and off the tennis court. And they are not show offs when it comes to their money, what have they been showing off? Your claims are BOGUS!

Shit! Bachelor's degree? That's the hardest thing to achieve in this world. I'm really impressed.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 02:56 PM
The author is right. Any great athlete who has behaved the way they do would be criticized. And it's true that they can "live their lives the way they want", but that doesn't mean they won't be criticized for it. ;)

That's hypocrisy in the highest degree if you asked me :rolleyes: Many always thought the sisters were usurpers and couldn't wait to see them gone. Well, their "inevitable" downfall (according to some )which many were fervently praying for is upon us , shouldn't all the naysayers be happy ?? Why can't they let them ride off in the sunset in peace?? :shrug:

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 02:59 PM
Shit! Bachelor's degree? That's the hardest thing to achieve in this world. I'm really impressed.

You're right shithead :rolleyes:

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 03:00 PM
Venus has been getting her college degree, planning and launching a business, while playing professional tennis and being the second most successful women's tennis player in the business, behind only her sister Serena.

Together they have won nearly half the slams of this century! You don't accomplish these kinds of things without setting goals. What other top player has opened a business and completed their college degree while playing professional tennis?! Just try to be a little fair; you might agree with their goals or priorities, but don't say they don't have them. That's just either stupid or disingenuous. :rolleyes:

And the single focused ones have done what exactly? Give Justine her props for being the banner child for single-focus tennis. But even she found a way to play tennis and find a husband. Guess that is a more legitimate pursuit for a woman tennis player in your mind.
Plz. Why not do one thing at a time and do it right instead of doing 5 things and doing each of them half-assed? Yeah, Venus and Serena have won half the slams of this century, but that is a lop-sided figure as they won ALOT at the turn of the century and aren't winning that many now. :rolleyes: I think Vogus was talking about present-day (tennis) goals. That's what the article is about in the first place.
Why does Venus need to start a business now? She's only in her 20s, there would be plenty of time for that later. And besides, it's not like she needs the money.
Yes plenty of athletes have lives outside of tennis. But if you're an athlete, that's pretty much your job, and that should be your priority. Athletes are so spoiled these days that they forget about that, and I'm not just saying Venus and Serena. They weren't the first and they won't be the last to be this way.

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 03:02 PM
Shit! Bachelor's degree? That's the hardest thing to achieve in this world. I'm really impressed.It's pretty hard to achieve, given the demands of professional tennis. Let's see you count the other female tennis players that have done it, if it's so easy/

Have you even done it? Can't tell, with that logic.

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 03:08 PM
It's pretty hard to achieve, given the demands of professional tennis. Let's see you count the other female tennis players that have done it, if it's so easy/

Have you even done it? Can't tell, with that logic.
Well, it's not like she is getting her degree in astrophysics or something. :rolleyes: And it's not like she's playing very many tournaments. Also, rich people can get anything they want. She could've wrote out a check and been handed a diploma without ever having opened a book. I know people that have done it.

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 03:09 PM
Plz. Why not do one thing at a time and do it right instead of doing 5 things and doing each of them half-assed? Here's a guess: because they choose too! Even when they were dominating through Wimbledon 2003 and both left the tour due to injury, they were doing other things and people were complaining: why can't they commit to a full schedule, blah, blah.
If winning most grand slams of other players on tour is half-assed, that is pretty scary for the rest of the tour. Work-a-bee Momo and play til you drop Kim have two combined with their singular devotion! Now that's half-assed. To work so hard and achieve so little.

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 03:12 PM
Well, it's not like she is getting her degree in astrophysics or something. :rolleyes: And it's not like she's playing very many tournaments. Also, rich people can get anything they want. She could've wrote out a check and been handed a diploma without ever having opened a book. I know people that have done it.
You are so silly! If that was the case, then it wouldn't have taken her nearly seven years. She could have written a check in seven minutes. Come on, even you can do better than that.

And it doesn't matter what the subject is? She has demands on her time that other college students don't. Are you really that dumb!

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 03:20 PM
Here's a guess: because they choose too! Even when they were dominating through Wimbledon 2003 and both left the tour due to injury, they were doing other things and people were complaining: why can't they commit to a full schedule, blah, blah.
If winning most grand slams of other players on tour is half-assed, that is pretty scary for the rest of the tour. Work-a-bee Momo and play til you drop Kim have two combined with their singular devotion! Now that's half-assed. To work so hard and achieve so little.
You can only keep that shit up for so long though before it bites you in the ass, and that's exactly what's happening now.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 03:29 PM
Well, it's not like she is getting her degree in astrophysics or something. :rolleyes: And it's not like she's playing very many tournaments. Also, rich people can get anything they want. She could've wrote out a check and been handed a diploma without ever having opened a book. I know people that have done it.

This is almost embarrassing :o :eek: Do you have a degree in astrophysics? :shrug: I suppose no degree counts for you unless it's in astrophysics :rolleyes: And no, "rich people" don't get handed diplomas by normal schools for writing out a check. However, if your grandfather endows a building ----- :lol:

lizchris
May 10th, 2006, 03:35 PM
Venus and Serena have opened up many doors for women's sports, especially endorsements and TV ratings wise. At least the store clerk knew who Venus and Serena are enough to ask the dude about them. I Didn't see the clerk asking about MOMO or Roger, just goes to show how big Venus and Serena are.


The clerk didn't ask about Maria Sharapova either. And she is supposed to be the biggest female athlete in the world at the moment.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 03:38 PM
Plz. Why not do one thing at a time and do it right instead of doing 5 things and doing each of them half-assed? Yeah, Venus and Serena have won half the slams of this century, but that is a lop-sided figure as they won ALOT at the turn of the century and aren't winning that many now. :rolleyes: I think Vogus was talking about present-day (tennis) goals. That's what the article is about in the first place.
Why does Venus need to start a business now? She's only in her 20s, there would be plenty of time for that later. And besides, it's not like she needs the money.
Yes plenty of athletes have lives outside of tennis. But if you're an athlete, that's pretty much your job, and that should be your priority. Athletes are so spoiled these days that they forget about that, and I'm not just saying Venus and Serena. They weren't the first and they won't be the last to be this way.

What exactly are your credentials? :shrug: It just amazes me that someone who spends so much time on this message board thinks he can tell Venus Williams how to live her life :haha: Oh well, nothing the Venus does will satisfy some people , so her fans should get use to it by now :eek:

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 03:39 PM
The clerk didn't ask about Maria Sharapova either. And she is supposed to be the biggest female athlete in the world at the moment.

Oh stop--- she's the future of tennis :tape:

Paneru
May 10th, 2006, 03:41 PM
I think Anna is more famous really. And Anna was famous first. :devil:

Anna was famous first but
she is not more famous than
the Sisters.

Paneru
May 10th, 2006, 03:43 PM
What exactly are your credentials? :shrug: It just amazes me that someone who spends so much time on this message board thinks he can tell Venus Williams how to live her life :haha: Oh well, nothing the Venus does will satisfy some people , so her fans should get use to it by now :eek:

:cool:

Venus couldn't care less what any of them think!
She's living her life and loving it! :)

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 03:51 PM
:cool:

Venus couldn't care less what any of them think!
She's living her life and loving it! :)
I'm sure she's loving being injured all the time and losing in the 1st rd. of grand slams. :rolleyes:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:22 PM
Well, it's not like she is getting her degree in astrophysics or something. :rolleyes: And it's not like she's playing very many tournaments. Also, rich people can get anything they want. She could've wrote out a check and been handed a diploma without ever having opened a book. I know people that have done it.

A degree is a degree, most people are not astrophysics majors so what's your point? Venus has been working on her degree for the past 8 years, so she was earning this degree while she was winning slams, and winning tournaments and playing a lot. When Venus did write a check to her school it went to scholarships for other students. . :hatoff:

Venus is not the type of cheat to "pay for a degree," if she would have paid the school she would have received her degree years ago. Venus does her own work, go to her website she has plenty of pics to prove it. Venus' company also provides internships to students at her college. :worship:

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 04:29 PM
No, she's just letting us know about her gay attraction to Anna.


I wouldn't have even thought of that since I'm straight, must be you who is gay for thinking in that vein, thanks for revealing that. :lol:

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 04:30 PM
Anna was famous first but
she is not more famous than
the Sisters.


I think Anna is probably more famous, along with Maria Sharapova ;)

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:31 PM
I'm sure she's loving being injured all the time and losing in the 1st rd. of grand slams. :rolleyes:


She lost in the 1st round in one recent slam, big deal! so did Kuzzy, Andy, Justine, and Myskina,

Have you accomplished more than VENUS or SERENA?

At least Venus won a GRANDSLAMinO5!

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 04:31 PM
So let me get this straight-- any man who is not attracted to Anna Kornikova must be gay?? WTF?? :rolleyes:

You do need to get it SRAIGHT, she said her brothers didn't even know who Anna was, so would assume they might be gay...............

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 04:31 PM
A degree is a degree, most people are not astrophysics majors so what's your point? Venus has been working on her degree for the past 8 years, so she was earning this degree while she was winning slams, and winning tournaments and playing a lot. When Venus did write a check to her school it went to scholarships for other students. . :hatoff:

Venus is not the type of cheat to "pay for a degree," if she would have paid the school she would have received her degree years ago. Venus does her own work, go to her website she has plenty of pics to prove it. Venus' company also provides internships to students at her college. :worship:
LOL I earned my degree the hard way too. And I have to say if I had her kinda money I would say "fuck getting a degree" so I gotta give her props for that. And she does (and Ree) do alot of great things. :worship:
The whole tennis thing just annoys me though.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 04:33 PM
Loud and wrong as usual. He refered to them as "the sisters" which is the thing their fans sometimes refer to them as. Then he added, "They sure kick butt, don't they?" If he didn't them how would he know how good they are?


I don't think I'm wrong here, I've had alot of casual tennis fans talk to me about tennis, and they don't seem to know the Williams sisters names, they usually say "so how are those two sisters doing" and I say "which one?" and they say "I don't know, those two black sisters".... so sounds to me like they don't know their names and that grocery guy probably didn't either.

GrandSlam05
May 10th, 2006, 04:34 PM
Guys who gives a shit who's "more famous". It's about winning, not posing.

TomTennis
May 10th, 2006, 04:34 PM
at least Venus and Serena have most of their grocery list checked off

became number ones in the word
played my sister in slams
won slams in singles, mixed, and doubles
won Olympic gold medals for my country
made a ton of money
won numerous titles
owned 99.5% of the girls on tour
turned the tennis establishment upside down
brought power to the game
world record holder for fastest serve
Met Coretta Scott King
brought glam to the tour
brought excitement to the tour
attracted non-traditional tennis fans
earned the hate and respect of the tennis establishment
proved people that said we would not make it wrong
won slams while in a "slump"

New list dominate the tour again

If onyl I could find a supermarket with these items in...id be straight there :tape: :lol:

:rolleyes: at the article. Maybe it would have worked if he wrote it a few weeks back, but not now that Venus is back. It'll take a some matches to get her groove again but when she does..... :devil: be ready!

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:37 PM
I think Anna is probably more famous, along with Maria Sharapova ;)

A lot of people don't even know who Sharapova is, one day she may be bigger than the sisters, but I can tell you it aint today!

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 04:44 PM
You do need to get it SRAIGHT, she said her brothers didn't even know who Anna was, so would assume they might be gay...............


Well they don't know her and they are not gay, and they don't watch tennis, but when they do see me watching it they ask whether Venus or Serena are playing.

griffin
May 10th, 2006, 04:47 PM
mmmm, cupcakes :hearts:

so sounds to me like they don't know their names and that grocery guy probably didn't either.

Fine, even if we agree for the sake of argument that Grocery Guy did not know their names he still new who they were. Note that Grocery Guy asked about "the sisters" - not "the french chick with the big shoulders," "that swiss guy who wins everything," "the blond chick who liked to sell her ass as jailbait," or "the blond chick who used to sell her ass but at least won a Slam."

Mind you, my money says "grocery guy" only exists as a rhetorical device in the first place.

Infiniti2001
May 10th, 2006, 05:00 PM
mmmm, cupcakes :hearts:



Fine, even if we agree for the sake of argument that Grocery Guy did not know their names he still new who they were. Note that Grocery Guy asked about "the sisters" - not "the french chick with the big shoulders," "that swiss guy who wins everything," "the blond chick who liked to sell her ass as jailbait," or "the blond chick who used to sell her ass but at least won a Slam."

Mind you, my money says "grocery guy" only exists as a rhetorical device in the first place.

Shhh!! You're making too much sense :eek:

CrossCourt~Rally
May 10th, 2006, 05:03 PM
The clerk didn't ask about Maria Sharapova either. And she is supposed to be the biggest female athlete in the world at the moment.

Nothing "suppose to be " about it...she is the most powerful ( not biggest :scratch: ) female athlete in the WORLD. Amazing how many times Marias name comes up in these threads from other players fans... :lol: :wavey:

V-MAC
May 10th, 2006, 05:15 PM
:lol: at the "who is more famous" argument going on here. ye guys can be so petty sometimes ;) anyway thanks for posting the article but geez, why can't these journos just let Vee and Serena be :rolleyes:

griffin
May 10th, 2006, 05:26 PM
why can't these journos just let Vee and Serena be :rolleyes:

'Cause it's their job to write, I guess. What makes me nuts is that there's nothing original here: no new insight, information or perspective. It's all just regurgitation. I just get so bored with tennis writers rehashing the same shit over and over again (and not just about "the sisters" either).

meh.

Now, about those cupcakes...

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 06:04 PM
I don't think I'm wrong here, I've had alot of casual tennis fans talk to me about tennis, and they don't seem to know the Williams sisters names, they usually say "so how are those two sisters doing" and I say "which one?" and they say "I don't know, those two black sisters".... so sounds to me like they don't know their names and that grocery guy probably didn't either.
You're so full of it, you state that people don't know who they are, then in the next breath say those same people ask you how they are doing? Why would they ask how they are if they didn't know who they are? Anyway, you could know hundreds of thousands casual tennis fans, that's only a tiny fraction of casual tennis fan population and is no where near representative of the general recognition of Venus and Serena.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 06:27 PM
You're so full of it, you state that people don't know who they are, then in the next breath say those same people ask you how they are doing? Why would they ask how they are if they didn't know who they are? Anyway, you could know hundreds of thousands casual tennis fans, that's only a tiny fraction of casual tennis fan population and is no where near representative of the general recognition of Venus and Serena.

I said they don't know them well enough to know their FIRST NAMES!!! Yet almost everybody knows Kournikova by name! And alot of people don't seem to know their names that talk to me about tennis. I know ALOT of casual fans and I talk to alot of people about tennis. Just because you can't debate what people tell me, doesn't mean I'm "full of it". Unless you follow me around every day and listen to my conversations, you have no clue. If they were that famous, people would know them by name, not just by "those sisters" or "the two black girls that are sisters".

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 06:27 PM
Nothing "suppose to be " about it...she is the most powerful ( not biggest :scratch: ) female athlete in the WORLD. Amazing how many times Marias name comes up in these threads from other players fans... :lol: :wavey:


Exactly!

dreamgoddess099
May 10th, 2006, 06:28 PM
Nothing "suppose to be " about it...she is the most powerful female athlete in the WORLD.
If that were true the press would be too busy following what Maria is doing to worry about what Serena is or isn't doing. Serena's being off tour getting almost twice the press as Maria's being on it contradicts your statement.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 06:30 PM
If that were true the press would be too busy following what Maria is doing to worry about what Serena is or isn't doing. Serena's being off tour getting almost twice the press as Maria's being on it contradicts your statement.


Newsflash, the press is constantly reporting on Maria :rolleyes:

griffin
May 10th, 2006, 06:37 PM
Newsflash, the press is constantly reporting on Maria :rolleyes:

No one said they weren't - only that they're also all over Serena despite the fact that she's not playing.

(and if you think Maria's the only player who's name comes up in threads about other players, you're kidding yourself ;) )

Paneru
May 10th, 2006, 06:38 PM
If that were true the press would be too busy following what Maria is doing to worry about what Serena is or isn't doing. Serena's being off tour getting almost twice the press as Maria's being on it contradicts your statement.

True.

Serena has done nothing tennis wise since January and yet they
keep talking about her. These tennis people bitched when she dominated and they bitch when she's not around. never satify those fools.

Guess when it comes to Serena
people will always feel the need to be talking.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 07:12 PM
Venus and Serena's reputation precedes them, the average Joe still think Serena is # 1 in the world and think that Williams sisters are on top! They bring in the rating at the slams because people want to see the Legendary Williams sisters. :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

Last year Venus made Wimby exciting and created the buzz.

Last year I was at Foxwoods Casino in Connecticut, when Venus played in the wimby final and people in the damn Bingo hall wanted to know if Venus won. This Bingo Hall is the largest bingo hall in the world, and we were playing for a million dollar jackpot, yet people still wanted to know how Venus did.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 07:25 PM
I said they don't know them well enough to know their FIRST NAMES!!! Yet almost everybody knows Kournikova by name! And alot of people don't seem to know their names that talk to me about tennis. I know ALOT of casual fans and I talk to alot of people about tennis. Just because you can't debate what people tell me, doesn't mean I'm "full of it". Unless you follow me around every day and listen to my conversations, you have no clue. If they were that famous, people would know them by name, not just by "those sisters" or "the two black girls that are sisters".

Are you polling like ten people. Becuase Venus and Serena are household names. and people who don't know thier first names know them as the Williams sisters.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 07:51 PM
Are you polling like ten people. Becuase Venus and Serena are household names. and people who don't know thier first names know them as the Williams sisters.


LOL, if they were "household names" then everybody would know their FIRST NAMES, not just "Williams".

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 07:52 PM
Venus and Serena's reputation precedes them, the average Joe still think Serena is # 1 in the world and think that Williams sisters are on top! They bring in the rating at the slams because people want to see the Legendary Williams sisters. :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown:

Last year Venus made Wimby exciting and created the buzz.

Last year I was at Foxwoods Casino in Connecticut, when Venus played in the wimby final and people in the damn Bingo hall wanted to know if Venus won. This Bingo Hall is the largest bingo hall in the world, and we were playing for a million dollar jackpot, yet people still wanted to know how Venus did.

lol, in the bingo hall no less, now that is fashionable! :tape:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 08:01 PM
lol, in the bingo hall no less, now that is fashionable! :tape:


I'm 24 and I have tons of fun at foxwoods' bingo hall, I laugh joke and have a good time when I go. The Bingo halls in casinos are not your grandmother's bingo halls, I've won 10, 000 at that bingo hall, and I was able to buy fashionable clothes. Try it sometimes it's fun! :aparty: :aparty: :aparty: There no shame in my game.

tennisrox
May 10th, 2006, 08:04 PM
:yawn:
Are you still trying to decide who is the world's most famous female athlete, by polling your local post-office employees, and the lollipop lady? Come now, lets at least attempt to be more scientific by taking a more accurate representative sample. You forgot the chinese takeaway.

Krystell
May 10th, 2006, 08:17 PM
I'm 24 and I have tons of fun at foxwoods' bingo hall, I laugh joke and have a good time when I go. The Bingo halls in casinos are not your grandmother's bingo halls, I've won 10, 000 at that bingo hall, and I was able to buy fashionable clothes. Try it sometimes it's fun! :aparty: :aparty: :aparty: There no shame in my game.

:lol: I'll take your word for it. I prefer to fly to Las Vegas and go to Caesers, MGM or the Mirage, myself.

venus_rulez
May 10th, 2006, 08:21 PM
Venus and Serena are there own people. They always have been, they always will be. Oh and when have people not complained about their outside interests? Like I said venus and serena have always done what they wanted to and people have never appreciated what they have done.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 08:24 PM
:lol: I'll take your word for it. I prefer to fly to Las Vegas and go to Caesers, MGM or the Mirage, myself.

I live in NYC, and I'm not a high roller, so I'm not going to go to Vegas at the spur of the momentjust to gamble, When I can spend my money at Foxwoods or Altlantic city. I'll have more money to play by staying close to home, it works for me!

Pheobo
May 10th, 2006, 08:31 PM
'gumption' is such a ridiculous word...

Hots4Safin
May 10th, 2006, 08:40 PM
There IS a grocery list to blame for Serena's decline ...

Hostess cupcakes
Zingers
Doritos
Ben & Jerry's
Hotpockets
Fried Chicken
Cheesecake

:tape:


you should ask Venus what was on her list last week after she sent Hingis off to Berlin.

TonyP
May 10th, 2006, 09:13 PM
First, return to the topic. It's not about Anna, or about who is the most famous. There are people more famous than any of the three of them Paris Hilton is today probably more famous than any of them. So what? From what I can figure out, she has never accomplished anything in her life except inheriting money.

Joel Drucker's article is quite good and raises some interesting issues. Both Venus and Serena are injured a lot. They always have been. The big Indian Wells controversy of 2001 was over whether Venus was really injured.

Is Drucker right? Does poor technique cause the injuries? I agree with one thing he said. For years I have said they win from the baseline because they are strong enough to hit winners on the run and they do that only with their arms and shoulders.

Does this automatically lead to eventual injury problems?

About the distractions, well, that is another issue. Maybe Venus will become the next Donna Karen. Maybe Serena will become a famous actress. But the odds are against both, and both have been working at their second jobs for awhile now. Wouldn't somebody have cast Serena in something major by now? Wouldn't some major company backed a Venus clothing line? It might still happen, but there are no quarantees, nor is there any indication of how hard they are working at it. Going to a lot of parties does not translate into doing the hard work.

Martian Willow
May 10th, 2006, 09:18 PM
Maybe he meant the Radwanskas.

Summer Snow
May 10th, 2006, 09:22 PM
:retard:

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 09:35 PM
First, return to the topic. It's not about Anna, or about who is the most famous. There are people more famous than any of the three of them Paris Hilton is today probably more famous than any of them. So what? From what I can figure out, she has never accomplished anything in her life except inheriting money.

Joel Drucker's article is quite good and raises some interesting issues. Both Venus and Serena are injured a lot. They always have been. The big Indian Wells controversy of 2001 was over whether Venus was really injured.

Is Drucker right? Does poor technique cause the injuries? I agree with one thing he said. For years I have said they win from the baseline because they are strong enough to hit winners on the run and they do that only with their arms and shoulders.

Does this automatically lead to eventual injury problems?

About the distractions, well, that is another issue. Maybe Venus will become the next Donna Karen. Maybe Serena will become a famous actress. But the odds are against both, and both have been working at their second jobs for awhile now. Wouldn't somebody have cast Serena in something major by now? Wouldn't some major company backed a Venus clothing line? It might still happen, but there are no quarantees, nor is there any indication of how hard they are working at it. Going to a lot of parties does not translate into doing the hard work.

Venus doesn't have a clothing company, she has an interior design company and she has been backed by a major developer in Florida whom her company designed model homes for. Also Crate and Barrel has backed Venus too, they are the ones that had the deal with her to design for the Olympic village. and she has other dealing with other companies too. Venus has projects in Florida, New York , San Francisco, Beverly Hills, and other places Her company also designed the set for the Tavis Smiley show.

Serena is building her acting resume and had landed several roles. and Serena is the one with the clothing line not Venus. Serena was collaborating with an intimates line and with a handbag company.

winone23
May 10th, 2006, 09:36 PM
Paris Hilton's fame is mostly confined to the United States

SAEKeithSerena
May 10th, 2006, 10:01 PM
blah blah blah

griffin
May 10th, 2006, 10:19 PM
Joel Drucker's article is quite good and raises some interesting issues.

Drucker's article is aptly titled – even if you agree with him it's nothing but a grocery list of recycled, regurgitated ideas/theories/musings that have been said dozens of times before, and said more eloquently at that. Again, there’s no new insight, there isn’t really even anthing indepth about it. Good? You have an interesting idea of good writing.


About the distractions, well, that is another issue. Maybe Venus will become the next Donna Karen. Maybe Serena will become a famous actress. But the odds are against both, and both have been working at their second jobs for awhile now. Wouldn't somebody have cast Serena in something major by now? Wouldn't some major company backed a Venus clothing line? It might still happen, but there are no quarantees, nor is there any indication of how hard they are working at it. Going to a lot of parties does not translate into doing the hard work.

Venus likes design. Serena likes fashion and acting. And? Hingis loves horses. Distraction or outside interest? Does it matter that Serena hasn’t landed a major acting role any more than it matters that Martina wasn’t good enough on horseback to compete at the highest level? Or is it more important that these women feel passionate about these pursuits and find them rewarding, regardless of whether you or I feel they’re accomplished enough in them.

I’d argue that Hingis’ hobby cost her far more than Venus and Serena’s, given that it actually took her out of competition and cost her a solid shot at French Open title at least once due to a fall/injury.

And, that the far bigger distraction to Venus and Serena has been family turmoil. After all, even before Yetunde’s murder, their parents divorced – and I’ve yet to meet the person who didn’t find their parent’s divorce to be stressful, disruptive and hard to deal with (even when they felt if was in everyone’s best interest).

Raises interesting issues or recyles same old same old (and not particularly well)?

Barbarela
May 10th, 2006, 11:15 PM
I liked it!
Good article!

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 11:20 PM
You can only keep that shit up for so long though before it bites you in the ass, and that's exactly what's happening now.and the excuse of the rest of the tour would be? they are not multi-tasking. so they should be gobbling up the grand slam trophies. but even in 2005, they played supporting actors and the williams sisters took another two off the table and then went right back to their other commitments. :lol: it must be truly infuriating.

davenport hasn't won a slam since 1999 and she's pretty single-minded in her focus. hasn't helped her much and they both denied her slam glory in the year they were "in decline" and not serious about tennis. really, what does that say about your fav!

only work-a-bee justine has managed to get more than one slam, while the williams sisters have been out and in "decline." and talk about the "shit" catching up with you from overdoing it.

vwfan
May 10th, 2006, 11:25 PM
Mind you, my money says "grocery guy" only exists as a rhetorical device in the first place.
Exactly!
I've been thinking the same thing reading this thread, that everyone is arguing about this mythical grocery store guy. It doesn't even sound believable to me.

TonyP
May 11th, 2006, 12:32 AM
griffin:

How can people continue to always bring up family problems, when we have seen an entire album's worth of photos of these two girls turning up at party after party after party? Apparently, the only aspect of their lives negatively impacted by these family tragedies is tennis. They certainly don't look all that depressed in all these pictures snapped at parties. Somebody might drag them out of the house once or twice, but lately we see a lot more of them in party clothes than tennis clothes. And they never look like anybody is dragging them out, at least, not when the evening begins.

It seems to me that both girls are simply more interested in having a good time than playing tennis. That's their right, as their fans always say, but why constantly try to blame it on family problems. They are not attending wakes, they are attending Hollywood parties. Face reality.

And fYI, what has any of this got to do with Hingis. I love these conversations, because they always degenerate into these silly discussions in which somebody says "Oh yeah, well your favorite is just as bad."

This isn't about my favorite. It ain't about Martina or Kim or Elena or Alice Marble, its about Venus and Serena. That's who Joel wrote about.

borisy
May 11th, 2006, 12:36 AM
griffin:

How can people continue to always bring up family problems, when we have seen an entire album's worth of photos of these two girls turning up at party after party after party? Apparently, the only aspect of their lives negatively impacted by these family tragedies is tennis. They certainly don't look all that depressed in all these pictures snapped at parties. Somebody might drag them out of the house once or twice, but lately we see a lot more of them in party clothes than tennis clothes. And they never look like anybody is dragging them out, at least, not when the evening begins.

It seems to me that both girls are simply more interested in having a good time than playing tennis. That's their right, as their fans always say, but why constantly try to blame it on family problems. They are not attending wakes, they are attending Hollywood parties. Face reality.

And fYI, what has any of this got to do with Hingis. I love these conversations, because they always degenerate into these silly discussions in which somebody says "Oh yeah, well your favorite is just as bad."

This isn't about my favorite. It ain't about Martina or Kim or Elena or Alice Marble, its about Venus and Serena. That's who Joel wrote about.

:worship:

GogoGirl
May 11th, 2006, 01:02 AM
Hey All,

Have the sisters EVER blamed it on family problems as it pertains to why they have not been playing tennis as much as some think they should? I think not!

The bottom line is - the sisters have only one life to live and no one can live it for them. If they never play again - it won't take any food out of any of our mouths or off our tables.

Some of these crybaby writers are seriously tripping. Why even put so much thought and ink into writing and obsessing about two players that aren't playing much tennis these days? What really is that about? It would seem to me as if they have other players to write about - as in - the players that are playing regularly. It doesn't help the writers' lot to write about two sisters they seem to be thru with because they think the sisters seem to be thru with tennis. How does that sound? And it really is pitiful when one thinks that the sisters care what the writers think and anyone else that continues to diss them.

I wouldn't care if the sisters were seen out every night. That is their business, right and preogative. They don't have to report to any of us.

It truly is dim minded to continue to harp on something that no one can change. Instead of just accepting it. It just goes to prove how much the sisters are missed on the tour. And in the U.S., it's almost like some are declaring "Hey we don't have anyone that can truly contend but Lindsay these days - so America is suffering because we would have three - but the other two have the nerve to be out for injuries." I mean..................... And where is Lindsay?

Some folks need to get a grip and just move on. When they ruled - they were villified and dismissed. Why not dismiss them now? And especially until they both come back full force. Tennis will survive w/o the Williams' sisters if folks would just try. Leave them be, ignore 'em and move on w/o them. It really is that simple.

Krystell
May 11th, 2006, 02:16 AM
griffin:

How can people continue to always bring up family problems, when we have seen an entire album's worth of photos of these two girls turning up at party after party after party? Apparently, the only aspect of their lives negatively impacted by these family tragedies is tennis. They certainly don't look all that depressed in all these pictures snapped at parties. Somebody might drag them out of the house once or twice, but lately we see a lot more of them in party clothes than tennis clothes. And they never look like anybody is dragging them out, at least, not when the evening begins.

It seems to me that both girls are simply more interested in having a good time than playing tennis. That's their right, as their fans always say, but why constantly try to blame it on family problems. They are not attending wakes, they are attending Hollywood parties. Face reality.

And fYI, what has any of this got to do with Hingis. I love these conversations, because they always degenerate into these silly discussions in which somebody says "Oh yeah, well your favorite is just as bad."

This isn't about my favorite. It ain't about Martina or Kim or Elena or Alice Marble, its about Venus and Serena. That's who Joel wrote about.


:worship: :worship:

vettipooh
May 11th, 2006, 02:21 AM
Hey All,

Have the sisters EVER blamed it on family problems as it pertains to why they have not been playing tennis as much as some think they should? I think not!

The bottom line is - the sisters have only one life to live and no one can live it for them. If they never play again - it won't take any food out of any of our mouths or off our tables.

Some of these crybaby writers are seriously tripping. Why even put so much thought and ink into writing and obsessing about two players that aren't playing much tennis these days? What really is that about? It would seem to me as if they have other players to write about - as in - the players that are playing regularly. It doesn't help the writers' lot to write about two sisters they seem to be thru with because they think the sisters seem to be thru with tennis. How does that sound? And it really is pitiful when one thinks that the sisters care what the writers think and anyone else that continues to diss them.

I wouldn't care if the sisters were seen out every night. That is their business, right and preogative. They don't have to report to any of us.

It truly is dim minded to continue to harp on something that no one can change. Instead of just accepting it. It just goes to prove how much the sisters are missed on the tour. And in the U.S., it's almost like some are declaring "Hey we don't have anyone that can truly contend but Lindsay these days - so America is suffering because we would have three - but the other two have the nerve to be out for injuries." I mean..................... And where is Lindsay?

Some folks need to get a grip and just move on. When they ruled - they were villified and dismissed. Why not dismiss them now? And especially until they both come back full force. Tennis will survive w/o the Williams' sisters if folks would just try. Leave them be, ignore 'em and move on w/o them. It really is that simple.
:worship: :worship: :worship: :worship: :worship:

tennisboi
May 11th, 2006, 02:27 AM
Guys who gives a shit who's "more famous". It's about winning, not posing.

Well said :clap2: It's more about how many slams you can win not how many premiers you attend

winone23
May 11th, 2006, 02:42 AM
Your exactly right...that goes for EVERYONE in the world. We all have one life to live and no one can live it for us. NOBODY is so "unique" that they get to use exuses of why they can't do this or why i was here and not at my profesional job. NOBODY is that "special" Not Kournikova... Not Venus..Not Serena...not ANYONE :rolleyes:
Every world class tennis player has to condition and discipline themselves to become and remain a world class athlete. It does not matter if your ranked 1,000 in the world or #1 in the world. Thats where the respect in the SPORT of PROFESIONAL TENNIS lies.
Enough of these bullshit threads from all sides...Williams Haters and the Williams Fans who try to defend everything ( right or wrong) that they do make me sick. From now on all these threads go IGNORED. I suggest the same for all the other TRUE tennis fans out there.
Grow the fu*k up and learn some sportsmanship to the rest. :wavey:

Tell this to the sports writers, tell them to worry about the other world class players and leave the Williams sisters the Hell alone and let them succeed in life their way not the establishments way.

Rocketta
May 11th, 2006, 02:45 AM
Your exactly right...that goes for EVERYONE in the world. We all have one life to live and no one can live it for us. NOBODY is so "unique" that they get to use exuses of why they can't do this or why i was here and not at my profesional job. NOBODY is that "special" Not Kournikova... Not Venus..Not Serena...not ANYONE :rolleyes:
Every world class tennis player has to condition and discipline themselves to become and remain a world class athlete. It does not matter if your ranked 1,000 in the world or #1 in the world. Thats where the respect in the SPORT of PROFESIONAL TENNIS lies.
Enough of these bullshit threads from all sides...Williams Haters and the Williams Fans who try to defend everything ( right or wrong) that they do make me sick. From now on all these threads go IGNORED. I suggest the same for all the other TRUE tennis fans out there.
Grow the fu*k up and learn some sportsmanship to the rest. :wavey:

what world are you living in where people don't get to use excuses? Have you watched politics lately? Everybody uses excuses and everybody has choices. People don't go to work everyday and use excuses to get by. People don't pay their taxes and use excuses to get by. People get caught speeding and use excuses to get by. Sometimes they work and sometimes they don't but the world is full of excuses.

People can chose to live their life how they want whether it's full of excuses or not. People can choose to feel superior on issues or not. People can choose to act mature while telling others they are not if they want. It's all choices. If you ignore these threads from now on great it's your choice but why exactly do you feel the need to let us all know that you are not going to reply to these threads again? Are you getting a lot of pressure to read and then reply to these threads?

Paialii
May 11th, 2006, 03:15 AM
His article wasn't as negative as I thought it would be when I read the title. In fact, it was actually motivational.

He's right. We all just want to see the interest and effort again. Venus' form will come together with more matches, and as for Serena, well, we'll see when she returns around the US Open or so. :-)

LoveFifteen
May 11th, 2006, 05:41 AM
you should ask Venus what was on her list last week after she sent Hingis off to Berlin.

Don't bring the Williams sister that annoys me into the discussion ... let's keep it on the sister that I love, my second favorite player! :hearts: :hearts: :hearts:

griffin
May 11th, 2006, 02:33 PM
griffin:
They are not attending wakes, they are attending Hollywood parties. Face reality.

The fact that a person does not don widow's weeds and spend all their time keeping vigils at an altar does not mean that a tragedy or family trauma has not affected them. Different people react differently to major life events, and those responses don't always follow someone ELSE'S idea of an acceptable path. Sometimes they get people rededicated to one thing or another, sometimes they get people to change priorities, sometimes they just get people lost.

And fYI, what has any of this got to do with Hingis. I love these conversations, because they always degenerate into these silly discussions in which somebody says "Oh yeah, well your favorite is just as bad."


First of all, where exactly did I say that any of these women's outside interests were BAD?

Second, to explain why I brought Hingis into this I was simply pointing out that Venus and Serena are not/were not the only tennis players to have them. I used Hingis as an example because I was responding most directly to you, and figured her interests just might be something YOU would be familiar with - I seem to remember you singing her praises for that very reason on more than one occasion. Particularly around the time of her retirement (leave of absence?), you were telling us how tennis was never her entire life, and how that made her special and how much you appreciated that about her. So it begged the question, how is it that Martina's outside interests and the fact "she had a life outside tennis" was praiseworthy and made her special - despite the fact they have sometimes had a negative impact on her tennis - yet Venus and Serena having outside interests, etc., is worthy instead of scorn?

I'd expect some of the kiddies to get defensive and miss the point, but frankly, I thought that should have been clear enough the first time I posted.

GrandSlam05
May 11th, 2006, 02:47 PM
and the excuse of the rest of the tour would be? they are not multi-tasking. so they should be gobbling up the grand slam trophies. but even in 2005, they played supporting actors and the williams sisters took another two off the table and then went right back to their other commitments. :lol: it must be truly infuriating.

davenport hasn't won a slam since 1999 and she's pretty single-minded in her focus. hasn't helped her much and they both denied her slam glory in the year they were "in decline" and not serious about tennis. really, what does that say about your fav!

only work-a-bee justine has managed to get more than one slam, while the williams sisters have been out and in "decline." and talk about the "shit" catching up with you from overdoing it.
What I'm saying is that the older they get the harder it's going to get to "just show up" and win. If they think they can continue this pattern until they're 30 then I can guarantee you it won't work.
And your "what does that say about your fav" is truly ingenious. :tape:
I never said Lindsay was better than the WS in the first place, you're making that shit up. Not everyone has to be fans of the same people you idiot.
Besides, this thread is not about who is better than the WS, it's about how they could be better.

Heavy_Hitter
May 11th, 2006, 03:08 PM
:bowdown:
Serena needs to stop wasting Nikes endorsement money and start winning titles. Why does she want to be a C-class actress (at best) instead of one of tennis' greatest legends?

vwfan
May 11th, 2006, 03:09 PM
What I'm saying is that the older they get the harder it's going to get to "just show up" and win. If they think they can continue this pattern until they're 30 then I can guarantee you it won't work.
And your "what does that say about your fav" is truly ingenious. :tape:
I never said Lindsay was better than the WS in the first place, you're making that shit up. Not everyone has to be fans of the same people you idiot.
Besides, this thread is not about who is better than the WS, it's about how they could be better.
First of all, I like Lindsay and happen to be a fan. But the truth is that being single-minded about tennis hasn't brought her any closer to slam glory nor has it prevented her from injury that invariably occurs after years of playing tennis.

And, I agree that Venus and Serena can't just show up after long layoffs and expect to win as easily as they did in the past. But there are people dogging it out every day on tour and not winning either. Heck Venus probably has a better ratio of titles/total tournaments played than say Petrova, Schnyder, Mauremso or Dementieva over the past year. That's my point!

People are always trying to diminsh their accomplishments. They are simply the best in the game. They've shown it time and again. And just because they don't do what everyone else on tour does, means very little. And the fact that they don't, may be why they have a winning strategy.

And don't call me an idiot, just because you can't follow and then win an argument! :lol:

TonyP
May 11th, 2006, 03:15 PM
Griffin:

Yes, different people react differently, but most of us who have lost loved ones do not decide to hit the MTV music video awards while we are grieving. And I think I must have under estimated Serena's acting talent, because if she was hurting over the family tragedies, she sure didn't let it show in any of those party pictures.

This assumption, that family tragedies are at the root cause of their malaise, is simply pretty hard to swallow.

And for the record, Hingis quit tennis. She held a news conference and said she was leaving. She was never specific about whether she'd come back, but she formally pulled out of the tour. She showed the tour respect in that manner, something she did all along. She didn't sign up for tournament after tournament and then pull out of them one by one, usually after the tickets had been sold. And we didn't see her dancing at some Hollywood hotspot, after claiming she couldn't play tennis due to injury.

Martina has always been what you'd call a "stand up" person in her relationship to the tour and her responsibilities as a top player. Sorry to say, the Willies have a reputation of being just the opposite, two girls who have always looked out for number one and nobody but number one.

And again, you seem to miss many of the main points Joel Drucker was making. What about all the injuries? Why are two of the biggest and strongest girls in tennis history constantly injured? They bring all this "athleticism" to tennis. They also bring higher insurance premiums I guess, because they are always in need of medical care.

Is Drucker right? Do both of them have bad technique and bad mechanics, which results in their never ending spate of injuries?

Don't Williams fans wonder why their favorites are always getting injured?

Infiniti2001
May 11th, 2006, 03:21 PM
The fact that a person does not don widow's weeds and spend all their time keeping vigils at an altar does not mean that a tragedy or family trauma has not affected them. Different people react differently to major life events, and those responses don't always follow someone ELSE'S idea of an acceptable path. Sometimes they get people rededicated to one thing or another, sometimes they get people to change priorities, sometimes they just get people lost.



First of all, where exactly did I say that any of these women's outside interests were BAD?

Second, to explain why I brought Hingis into this I was simply pointing out that Venus and Serena are not/were not the only tennis players to have them. I used Hingis as an example because I was responding most directly to you, and figured her interests just might be something YOU would be familiar with - I seem to remember you singing her praises for that very reason on more than one occasion. Particularly around the time of her retirement (leave of absence?), you were telling us how tennis was never her entire life, and how that made her special and how much you appreciated that about her. So it begged the question, how is it that Martina's outside interests and the fact "she had a life outside tennis" was praiseworthy and made her special - despite the fact they have sometimes had a negative impact on her tennis - yet Venus and Serena having outside interests, etc., is worthy instead of scorn?

I'd expect some of the kiddies to get defensive and miss the point, but frankly, I thought that should have been clear enough the first time I posted.


:worship: :worship: Uh griffin , by now you should realize that this poster 's entire motivation is to complain endlessly about the Williames :rolleyes:
Meanwhile he and the other naysayers flog the same old tired arguments :o Whatever will they do for entertainment when ther Williams sisters retire? :shrug: I suspect they'll be talking about them for 20 years after that :lol:

vwfan
May 11th, 2006, 03:23 PM
Don't Williams fans wonder why their favorites are always getting injured? They are injured a lot, but it is more obvious than when others are missing from the tour.

Remember that:
Davenport had knee surgery, was out of six months, out for her back several times, out for her knee before and after the surgery.
Henin, out with the her illness several times, and several other minor injuries
Momo, out with her back for the early part of 2004
Kim, out for months with her wrist, then ankle
Maria, out with her shoulder
Mary, out for most of this year (don't even know her injury)
Hingis was out for almost four years
Capriati has been out for more that 1 1/2 years
Chanda Rubin, out for more that 1 1/2 years

All the players are out a lot, it's just that williams sisters are missed more and they already only play a limited number of tournaments anyway.

Infiniti2001
May 11th, 2006, 03:28 PM
They are injured a lot, but it is more obvious than when others are missing from the tour.

Remember that:
Davenport had knee surgery, was out of six months, out for her back several times, out for her knee before and after the surgery.
Henin, out with the her illness several times, and several other minor injuries
Momo, out with her back for the early part of 2004
Kim, out for months with her wrist, then angle
Maria, out with her shoulder
Mary, out for most of this year (don't even know her injury)
Hingis was out for almost four years
Capriati has been out for more that 1 1/2 years
Chanda Rubin, out for more that 1 1/2 years

All the players are out a lot, it's just that williams sisters are missed more and they already only play a limited number of tournaments anyway.


Hon, people always see what they want and ignore the rest :lol:

griffin
May 11th, 2006, 03:38 PM
Griffin:

Yes, different people react differently, but most of us who have lost loved ones do not decide to hit the MTV music video awards while we are grieving. And I think I must have under estimated Serena's acting talent, because if she was hurting over the family tragedies, she sure didn't let it show in any of those party pictures.

I can't say I rated invites to major awards shows, but I was seen attending parties and other events in the year after my father died. My social life didn't disappear. Doesn't mean my life wasn't significantly affected in other ways, that I wasn't greiving, or that I didn't spend the next 5-10 years dealing with some of those issues. I don't think I'm all that unique, either.

This assumption, that family tragedies are at the root cause of their malaise, is simply pretty hard to swallow.

Well we're even, because what I find hard to swallow is how any reasonable person would think such events would NOT have an affect on them.

What it seems to boil down to, Tony, is that the main difference in this discussion is who you like or don't like in the first place, and everything they do or say is going to be filtered through that.

(btw, "retired (leave of absence?)" was an attempt at finding a short version of how to describe Martina's step back from tennis - not an attempt to take a shot at her.)

Infiniti2001
May 11th, 2006, 03:47 PM
Ah shucks!!! You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to griffin again. :p

harloo
May 11th, 2006, 04:35 PM
Enough of these bullshit threads from all sides...Williams Haters and the Williams Fans who try to defend everything ( right or wrong) that they do make me sick. From now on all these threads go IGNORED. I suggest the same for all the other TRUE tennis fans out there.
Grow the fu*k up and learn some sportsmanship to the rest


Well you better run for cover and stay out of GM because their are many bullshit threads here that doesn't involve the name Williams. But then again the sisters seem to be the main focus of criticism on this board and it's been that way for years.

Also annointing yourself as the ultimate TRUE tennis fan is kind of cute. That's right you don't need validation from anyone Frazier, but please keep it to yourself because the attitude is nauseating.;)

SelesFan70
May 11th, 2006, 04:39 PM
Why do folks always compare Tiger to Venus and Serena? :rolleyes:

harloo
May 11th, 2006, 04:47 PM
Hey All,

Have the sisters EVER blamed it on family problems as it pertains to why they have not been playing tennis as much as some think they should? I think not!

The bottom line is - the sisters have only one life to live and no one can live it for them. If they never play again - it won't take any food out of any of our mouths or off our tables.

Some of these crybaby writers are seriously tripping. Why even put so much thought and ink into writing and obsessing about two players that aren't playing much tennis these days? What really is that about? It would seem to me as if they have other players to write about - as in - the players that are playing regularly. It doesn't help the writers' lot to write about two sisters they seem to be thru with because they think the sisters seem to be thru with tennis. How does that sound? And it really is pitiful when one thinks that the sisters care what the writers think and anyone else that continues to diss them.

I wouldn't care if the sisters were seen out every night. That is their business, right and preogative. They don't have to report to any of us.

It truly is dim minded to continue to harp on something that no one can change. Instead of just accepting it. It just goes to prove how much the sisters are missed on the tour. And in the U.S., it's almost like some are declaring "Hey we don't have anyone that can truly contend but Lindsay these days - so America is suffering because we would have three - but the other two have the nerve to be out for injuries." I mean..................... And where is Lindsay?

Some folks need to get a grip and just move on. When they ruled - they were villified and dismissed. Why not dismiss them now? And especially until they both come back full force. Tennis will survive w/o the Williams' sisters if folks would just try. Leave them be, ignore 'em and move on w/o them. It really is that simple.

GogoGirl, you are on point as usual. What baffles me is what you stated in your last paragraph. When the sisters ruled tennis they were villified for dominating the sport. I remember the running line was, "Who will beat the Williams sisters?". Mary Carillo and Pam Shriver even had discussions with a foreign player on how to beat one of the sisters. All of that resistance and indifference towards the sisters from their home country during their domination really left a bad taste in my mouth.

Now that the sisters are not playing all of the sudden they are important to the game. :o I agree with you, the tennis world is moving along fine without the sisters now. We all know that it would be better if they were playing but all these articles about them are childish. Writers would be better off discussing some of the new players on tour who are actually playing now. Let the sisters be and move on.;)

harloo
May 11th, 2006, 04:48 PM
Why do folks always compare Tiger to Venus and Serena? :rolleyes:

And how is this relevant to the subject at hand?:confused: :tape: ;)