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lizchris
Apr 25th, 2006, 06:15 PM
Essence magazine reproted last night that the Duke rape accuser is so afraid for her lfie and the life of her children that she is running fom relative to relative. She is also receiveing death threats from white supremacists and Duke supports. She is also so afraid of white men now that she screams at the sight of one.

If this is an act, then she is a great actress, but if she is telling the truth, who knows how brutal these allgeged rapists and others in that house treated her.

Aquanetta
Apr 25th, 2006, 06:48 PM
A stripper cries wolf. I feel for her only if her account is factual.

Gonzo Hates Me!
Apr 25th, 2006, 07:03 PM
A stripper cries wolf. I feel for her only if her account is factual.

"Cries wolf?" lol. are strippers a lesser bread of human or something?

lizchris
Apr 25th, 2006, 07:11 PM
A stripper cries wolf. I feel for her only if her account is factual.


You don't know if she cried wolf or not. But you sound like most of the peiple on talk radio and cable news shows. Just because this woman is a stripper and to as lesser extenst, a black woman, her claims should not not be believed.

*JR*
Apr 25th, 2006, 07:47 PM
She is also receiveing death threats from white supremacists and Duke supports.
Not to make light of this, but @ first I thought you meant threats by supporters of David Duke. :o (Though the supremacists probably were if they're old enough). ;) And if GoTennis now has an NT forum, I wonder what Danny and TPlayer are saying about this whole thing? :scratch:

Aquanetta
Apr 25th, 2006, 07:50 PM
You don't know if she cried wolf or not. But you sound like most of the peiple on talk radio and cable news shows. Just because this woman is a stripper and to as lesser extenst, a black woman, her claims should not not be believed.

What I mean by “a stripper cries wolf” is just what you said: her credibility will be questioned because of her profession. I do not endorse that train of thought! I am sympathetic if she’s telling the truth and people are dismissing her claims because she’s a stripper.

Lord Nelson
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:08 PM
She is also so afraid of white men now that she screams at the sight of one.
What a racist she is. I still found this phrase funny. :lol:

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:15 PM
This whole case just sounds fishy to me. I really still believe it isn't being handled properly.

I don't think it is doing her, the team or anyone involved to have this much press involved you know? It unforutnate that the case couldn't be done behind closed doors. That way her life, the vast majority of the team and the school that had nothing to do with it and her kids wouldn't have to go through all this stuff.

As for the death threat allegations, I'm pretty sure its just conjecture, and nothing serious even if true. I highly doubt you're going to see the women get touched. It still is unfortuante either way though.

harloo
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:20 PM
I believe this is happening considering that even a local strip joint in the area has a sign up saying,"Lacrosse Players Welcome". It makes you wonder about the morality of particular citizens in that community. When students are out protesting in defense of the alleged rapists then you know somethings wrong. Defend the good ole boys at all costs. She should leave after the case is over and take her children before one of them gets her.

SJW
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:23 PM
As for the allegations, I'm pretty sure its just conjecture, and nothing serious even if true.
this part surprises me greatly.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:24 PM
this part surprises me greatly.
I meant the death threats, the death threats.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:27 PM
When students are out protesting in defense of the alleged rapists then you know somethings wrong. Defend the good ole boys at all costs.

I wonder if you'd think the same if the lacrosse player who was accused was black and the women was white.

SJW
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:30 PM
I meant the death threats, the death threats.

and i'm not really surprised.

SJW
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:30 PM
I wonder if you'd think the same if the lacrosse player who was accused was black and the women was white.

would you?
no.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:32 PM
I still find it fishy that these upper-class, Southern, white Lacrosse players hired a BLACK stripper in the first place, without some ulterior motive(s).

But then again, I am a racist and have trust issues with white people. So take that as you wish.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:35 PM
would you?
no.
If that were the case I would think that you would never know what happened because if its Black vs. White things always end up being about Race. Especially if a black man is accused off doing anything to a white women, good luck to him in getting justice.

I just think its rediculous that everything always has to be racial. I mean its rediculous but true to say that if it was the black player on the lacrosse team that was accused, then maybe would the truth be found out. But since because it appears to be a racial mix, the "truth" will most likely never be found out, its aroused far too much racial tensions. And I think thats a shame.

Unfortunately though, thats the way the world works.

GrandSlam05
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:36 PM
I wonder if you'd think the same if the lacrosse player who was accused was black and the women was white.
Probably not. No one seemed to have much sympathy for Nicole when they found out OJ beat the crap outta her. And she wasn't even a stripper. :lol:

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:38 PM
If that were the case I would think that you would never know what happened because if its Black vs. White things always end up being about Race. Especially if a black man is accused off doing anything to a white women, good luck to him in getting justice.

I just think its rediculous that everything always has to be racial. I mean its rediculous but true to say that if it was the black player on the lacrosse team that was accused, then maybe would the truth be found out. But since because it appears to be a racial mix, the "truth" will most likely never be found out, its aroused far too much racial tensions. And I think thats a shame.

Unfortunately though, thats the way the world works.

Kobe got justice. :worship:

GrandSlam05
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:39 PM
But then again, I am a racist and have trust issues with white people
You can say that again.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:39 PM
I still find it fishy that these upper-class, Southern, white Lacrosse players hired a BLACK stripper in the first place, without some ulterior motive(s).

But then again, I am a racist and have trust issues with white people. So take that as you wish.

And thats why the case is as big as it is. Its just heightened some blacks trust issues with whites, and pissed off white people because either A) they're being typecasted as bigots or B) those who are bigots will be damned to lose to the blacks.

This case is just like the OJ simpson case in that it has little to do with the actual crime, just the two races that are involved in it.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:41 PM
You can say that again.

:lol::lol::lol:

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:42 PM
Probably not. No one seemed to have much sympathy for Nicole when they found out OJ beat the crap outta her. And she wasn't even a stripper. :lol:
Tell me about it. I remember my aunt said "Good for OJ, he got himself one. White folk have been killing up n***** for years."

I'm not saying that was the common sentiment among blacks at all, but at the same time it did seem that what happened to Nicole was an after thought.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:43 PM
And thats why the case is as big as it is. Its just heightened some blacks trust issues with whites, and pissed off white people because either A) they're being typecasted as bigots or B) those who are bigots will be damned to lose to the blacks.

This case is just like the OJ simpson case in that it has little to do with the actual crime, just the two races that are involved in it.

those poor, southern white people :baby: typecast as bigots

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:48 PM
Tell me about it. I remember my aunt said "Good for OJ, he got himself one. White folk have been killing up n***** for years."

I'm not saying that was the common sentiment among blacks at all, but at the same time it did seem that what happened to Nicole was an after thought.

You are such a hypocrite.
How is that any different from your disregard about a woman who was possibly gang raped. :rolleyes:

ptkten
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:49 PM
These allegations are most likely true and it's a shame. However, it's irrelevant to the actual case because it doesn't say anything about the accused.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:49 PM
those poor, southern white people :baby: typecast as bigots
Right.

I swear (not saying you, just in general) the most racist people aren't the white people.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:51 PM
Right.

I swear (not saying you, just in general) the most racist people aren't the white people.

Which people are they then?

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:55 PM
You are such a hypocrite.
How is that any different from your disregard about a woman who was possibly gang raped. :rolleyes:
Thanks for calling me out.

I remember when I first heard about the case I didn't think gee thats horrible that she might have been raped, but WTF I wanted to see a rematch of Duke-Maryland. After I got over the fact that the lacrosse team wouldn't get to play and I read about the racial shit I got pissed about that.

I suppose its just because I play lacrosse so my initial reaction was going to be more inclined toward the actual team rather than the case. It was pretty insensitive.

So that is being a bit of a hypocrite. All in all, the point still stands.

However, it can just be said both ways, I suppose. But I will conceed to my hypocracy and insensitivity on that front. Yet that comment was more in agreeance with another post, not one meant to be stand-alone.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:57 PM
Same people as these.
what he said.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 08:59 PM
Thanks for calling me out.

I remember when I first heard about the case I didn't think gee thats horrible that she might have been raped, but WTF I wanted to see a rematch of Duke-Maryland. After I got over the fact that the lacrosse team wouldn't get to play and I read about the racial shit I got pissed about that.

I suppose its just because I play lacrosse so my initial reaction was going to be more inclined toward the actual team rather than the case. It was pretty insensitive.

So that is being a bit of a hypocrite. All in all, the point still stands.

However, it can just be said both ways, I suppose. But I will conceed to my hypocracy and insensitivity on that front. Yet that comment was more in agreeance with another post, not one meant to be stand-alone.

So the initial gang-rape didn't piss you off. The Lacrosse did.
Then when you found he particulars of the case out, the gang-rape STILL didnt piss you off. The racial issue pissed you off.

I guess you are right, the most racist people aren't white people.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:00 PM
You appear to be the most racist poster ITT, because the racial issue is whats forefront for you, at least most folks in here care about the rape and the ones that dont are frontin like they do. :tape:

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:13 PM
So the initial gang-rape didn't piss you off. The Lacrosse did.
Then when you found he particulars of the case out, the gang-rape STILL didnt piss you off. The racial issue pissed you off.

I guess you are right, the most racist people aren't white people.
Well my thing is that its unfortunate and obviously its bad, but it is what it is and you can't do anything to change it. Its a sunk cost.

However, the details of the case is something that can be controlled and changed, and so therefore even though yes its bad that a rape may have happened, its futile to belabore over it.

I mean that sounds horrible I know, but while I do feel bad for the women nothing and no one can change what happened, however what is happening now can be affected. And especially since the case is so fuzzy (as to whether it was a rape or foulplay) , and with the ramifications its having on the present I'm more inclined to be vocal about whats tangible.

Its just being pragmatic.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:14 PM
You appear to be the most racist poster ITT, because the racial issue is whats forefront for you, at least most folks in here care about the rape and the ones that dont are frontin like they do. :tape:
The racial issues aren't the forefront, personally I'm more dissapointed that the team is being maligned like this and they can't play. Its just something that frustrates me.

And isn't it better to be honest then pretend (when you probably think the same if not worse)?

RVD
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:17 PM
I wonder if you'd think the same if the lacrosse player who was accused was black and the women was white.JEEVES!! Give it a rest already with the meaningless hypothetical!!!!!!

I will never understand why people make these sorts of statements when history constantly answers this question for you? :scratch:

Oh, I know why...
Because it is an attempt at mental subterfuge, misdirection, or diminishing the value of other human beings.

Hey, I have a hypothetical for ya...
I wonder what would happen if the guys were elite bastard Lacrosse players with priors, and the woman was a black stripper?

Oh wait...THAT'S REALLY HAPPENING!! :rolleyes:

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:21 PM
The racial issues aren't the forefront, personally I'm more dissapointed that the team is being maligned like this and they can't play. Its just something that frustrates me.

And isn't it better to be honest then pretend (when you probably think the same if not worse)?

Well then your beef is with the Head of Duke athletics, and that frustration is :topic: to the subject of this girl and her friend being gangraped or not.

RVD
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:22 PM
anyway... :lol:

It looks like my prediction is on the way to coming true.
It certainly took the White Supremacist a while to engage.

Now all we need is a Black Muslim group to join in, and then the fun really begins.
*SIGH*

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:22 PM
Well my thing is that its unfortunate and obviously its bad, but it is what it is and you can't do anything to change it. Its a sunk cost.

However, the details of the case is something that can be controlled and changed, and so therefore even though yes its bad that a rape may have happened, its futile to belabore over it.

I mean that sounds horrible I know, but while I do feel bad for the women nothing and no one can change what happened, however what is happening now can be affected. And especially since the case is so fuzzy (as to whether it was a rape or foulplay) , and with the ramifications its having on the present I'm more inclined to be vocal about whats tangible.

Its just being pragmatic.

This explanation would be more plausible if you hadn't posted a certain opinion before even knowing the particulars of this case. An opinion that BTW, has remained constant since.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:30 PM
This explanation would be more plausible if you hadn't posted a certain opinion before even knowing the particulars of this case. An opinion that BTW, has remained constant since.
My opinion crystalized after I read there was no DNA evidence.

However for closure, point taken.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:33 PM
My opinion crystalized after I read there was no DNA evidence.

Even though in like, 75% of rape cases there is no DNA evidence? :D
Seems like you already had a pre-conceived notion. And sought information that would confirm it.

harloo
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:35 PM
I wonder if you'd think the same if the lacrosse player who was accused was black and the women was white.

Gee SMM you sure do know how to spin a situation. In the scenario you mentioned above if a group of priviledged black lacrosse players who felt they were above the law were accused of gang raping a white stripper I would take the accusation seriously. The issue is more about priviledge than race to me personally.

SJW
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:43 PM
:o

:tape:

:lol:

i know right!
Justin is killing me :lol:

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:44 PM
Gee SMM you sure do know how to spin a situation. In the scenario you mentioned above if a group of priviledged black lacrosse players who felt they were above the law were accused of gang raping a white stripper I would take the accusation seriously. The issue is more about priviledge than race to me personally.
Ok well in that case, I can understand that.

However at the same time, while you're not "above" the law in some sense, you pretty much are if you have money.

I remember this case where this man was accused (who was black) of 47 counts of embezzlement worth over 4 million and 40 years in jail.

But because the judge used to babysit him and was on the board of the private school he went to he got off with 9 months in a country club jail and community service :tape: .

harloo
Apr 25th, 2006, 09:55 PM
Probably not. No one seemed to have much sympathy for Nicole when they found out OJ beat the crap outta her. And she wasn't even a stripper. :lol:

This is such broad generalization because many people cared that Nicole was a battered wife. The media's polarization of the case was detrimental to race relations because alot of black folks believed he was guilty.

However for years white defendents with priviledge have used our judicial system to slither their way out of being convicted even when they were guilty. So when O.J. hired high profile defense attorneys and got away with murdering Nicole it was suprising how some white people reacted. This is the system that the rich take advantage of regardless of color. The O.J. case had more to do with class than anything because I guarantee you if O.J was a regular brotha off the streets who was at the mercy of a public defender he would of been convicted even by a jury of all blacks.

RVD
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:03 PM
This is such broad generalization because many people cared that Nicole was a battered wife. The media's polarization of the case was detrimental to race relations because alot of black folks believed he was guilty.

However for years white defendents with priviledge have used our judicial system to slither their way out of being convicted even when they were guilty. So when O.J. hired high profile defense attorneys and got away with murdering Nicole it was suprising how some white people reacted. This is the system that the rich take advantage of regardless of color. The O.J. case had more to do with class than anything because I guarantee you if O.J was a regular brotha off the streets who was at the mercy of a public defender he would of been convicted even by a jury of all blacks. :worship: :worship: Could not have been stated better.

This is exactly what happens when the laws work against the very framers of such designed to protect the priviledged. Muddying the water even more were the personal vendettas of some crooked detectives with histories of evidence planting and harassment, and you have a case where we'll never know the truth of what actually happened. :shrug:

At any rate, great points.

harloo
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:09 PM
But can you speak of privilege in the US without speaking of race and/or money?

You are correct joie, they go hand in hand. What concerns me is the fact that some people act as if race is solely the reasoning behind my opinion on the issue. When SMM flipped the scenario asking if the accuser was white would you have the same opinion I responded that it had more to do with priviledge in my mind. Of course race is a part of the equation here and it's being played out in that way instead of a group of men misbehaving at a frat party potentially violating a young woman.

hablo
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:10 PM
This is such broad generalization because many people cared that Nicole was a battered wife. The media's polarization of the case was detrimental to race relations because alot of black folks believed he was guilty.

However for years white defendents with priviledge have used our judicial system to slither their way out of being convicted even when they were guilty. So when O.J. hired high profile defense attorneys and got away with murdering Nicole it was suprising how some white people reacted. This is the system that the rich take advantage of regardless of color. The O.J. case had more to do with class than anything because I guarantee you if O.J was a regular brotha off the streets who was at the mercy of a public defender he would of been convicted even by a jury of all blacks.
I never thought of the O.J. case in that light.
Thanks for a different perpective.

Stamp Paid
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:13 PM
Yes that was sarcasm Habs :kiss:

Mother_Marjorie
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:14 PM
I believe this is happening considering that even a local strip joint in the area has a sign up saying,"Lacrosse Players Welcome". It makes you wonder about the morality of particular citizens in that community. When students are out protesting in defense of the alleged rapists then you know somethings wrong. Defend the good ole boys at all costs. She should leave after the case is over and take her children before one of them gets her.

How can you question the morality of citizens in a community that are rallying the battlecry "innocent until proven guilty?" Especially in light of the fact initial DNA testing supports the "alledged rapists" including witnessed alibi's????

I'm reminded of another recent rape case in which a young woman that claimed Kobe Bryant raped her received death threats. Similar to the Bryant case, the defense is investigating the background of the accuser, including the request of medical and criminal histories.

Funny thing....there hasn't been one word on Court TV, CNN, Fox News, CBS, NBC about the Duke accuser being threatened by White Supremecists or "scared" to be around "white" men. As pro-prosecution as Nancy Grace is on Court TV, something like that she would have been ALL OVER.

I think just about every racial stereotype (both sides) has been played out and the trial has yet to begin.

hablo
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:17 PM
Yes that was sarcasm Habs :kiss:
Ah ok, thanks for answering my question! :kiss:

dementieva's fan
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:17 PM
You appear to be the most racist poster ITT, because the racial issue is whats forefront for you, at least most folks in here care about the rape and the ones that dont are frontin like they do. :tape:

Hagar, Erika_Angel and Jigglypuff beat him to that coveted position, he is just a student of them.

CJ07
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:29 PM
But can you speak of privilege in the US without speaking of race and/or money?
Yes and No.

Obviously there is a high correlation between low income and minorities, however when you look at those at the top, even those who are weatlthy, it really depends.

Whether you're black, white, whatever, if you have money you're attitude is more likeley to be influenced based on how you got the money, not your actual race.

Old money people and new money people are very very different

harloo
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:37 PM
How can you question the morality of citizens in a community that are rallying the battlecry "innocent until proven guilty?" Especially in light of the fact initial DNA testing supports the "alledged rapists" including witnessed alibi's????

I'm reminded of another recent rape case in which a young woman that claimed Kobe Bryant raped her received death threats. Similar to the Bryant case, the defense is investigating the background of the accuser, including the request of medical and criminal histories.

Funny thing....there hasn't been one word on Court TV, CNN, Fox News, CBS, NBC about the Duke accuser being threatened by White Supremecists or "scared" to be around "white" men. As pro-prosecution as Nancy Grace is on Court TV, something like that she would have been ALL OVER.

I think just about every racial stereotype (both sides) has been played out and the trial has yet to begin.

I questioned the morality because any community that would allow a sign of that nature to be posted in the midst of a very public trial obviously has little concern about justice. The whole issue is not being taken seriously which is my own personal opinion.

What I find funny is how many people compare this case to the Kobe Bryant trial because of the racial element. In that case celebrity was involved which pales in comparison to the Duke situation. What does the accusser have to gain by claiming she was raped by a group of unknown Lacrosse players?

As you stated above death threats happened during the Kobe trial, so why are you questioning the validity of the accuser recieving death threats here? Alot of disgruntled fans and supporters of the team are very capable of making death threats. CNN, Fox News, CBS, and other stations will eventually pick up on the information but it's a bit suprising that Essence had to break the story. This shows you right here how the media is selective with their coverage.

RVD
Apr 25th, 2006, 10:43 PM
Mind if I make a few necessary alterations? :)

How can you question the morality of citizens in a community that are rallying the battlecry "innocent until proven guilty?" Especially in light of the fact initial DNA testing seemingly supports the "alledged rapists" including witnessed alibi's????This works better now. ;)
I'm reminded of another recent rape case in which a young woman that claimed Kobe Bryant raped her received death threats. Similar to the Bryant case, the defense is investigating the background of the accuser, including the request of medical and criminal histories.After chcking a few similar similar cases, this is a typical course in the investigation.
[QUOTE=MarJenAll20]Funny thing....there hasn't been one word on Court TV, CNN, Fox News, CBS, NBC about the Duke accuser being threatened by White Supremecists or "scared" to be around "white" men. As pro-prosecution as Nancy Grace is on Court TV, something like that she would have been ALL OVER. Could not agree more. I have my beliefs, but nothing solid as to why this is. Let's just say that it appears the media favor the defense in this case. ;)
I think just about every racial stereotype (both sides) has been played out and the trial has yet to begin.This case has been handled in a very amateurish way from the start. I'd be surprised if it is not eventually thrown out.

lizchris
Apr 26th, 2006, 02:20 PM
How can you question the morality of citizens in a community that are rallying the battlecry "innocent until proven guilty?" Especially in light of the fact initial DNA testing supports the "alledged rapists" including witnessed alibi's????

I'm reminded of another recent rape case in which a young woman that claimed Kobe Bryant raped her received death threats. Similar to the Bryant case, the defense is investigating the background of the accuser, including the request of medical and criminal histories.

Funny thing....there hasn't been one word on Court TV, CNN, Fox News, CBS, NBC about the Duke accuser being threatened by White Supremecists or "scared" to be around "white" men. As pro-prosecution as Nancy Grace is on Court TV, something like that she would have been ALL OVER.

I think just about every racial stereotype (both sides) has been played out and the trial has yet to begin.


It was in yesterday's N Daily News, which is where I got the information. In additoin, it was the local news in the NYC area.

Sam L
Apr 26th, 2006, 02:22 PM
She screams at the sight of white men? Um right...

ALL white men? :eek:

Okaaay...

Cybelle Darkholme
Apr 26th, 2006, 02:30 PM
So bascially before DNA evidence ever existed no rape ever happened, right?

Whatever.

Just because there is no DNA evidence does not mean a crime did not happen. Only an idiot who knows nothing about the law would think that.

Relying strictly on one piece of evidence is not the only way to build a case. DNA evidence would have helped her claim but if they wore condoms then what?

Its tough in these he said she said situations.

Cybelle Darkholme
Apr 26th, 2006, 02:44 PM
Old money people had their wealth passed down to them and did not earn any of it. At least the new money people earned what they have themselves.

Wealth creates wealth and those old money people can sit back and live off the profits and dividends forever.

Now the question becomes is that what equal opportunity is all about in America?

We need to rewrite the tax codes in this country and the public education system needs a total revamp.

meyerpl
Apr 26th, 2006, 02:50 PM
This is such broad generalization because many people cared that Nicole was a battered wife. The media's polarization of the case was detrimental to race relations because alot of black folks believed he was guilty.

However for years white defendents with priviledge have used our judicial system to slither their way out of being convicted even when they were guilty. So when O.J. hired high profile defense attorneys and got away with murdering Nicole it was suprising how some white people reacted. This is the system that the rich take advantage of regardless of color. The O.J. case had more to do with class than anything because I guarantee you if O.J was a regular brotha off the streets who was at the mercy of a public defender he would of been convicted even by a jury of all blacks.
Excellent post!! In the criminal justice system, there are striking disparities in terms of how justice is done based on factors including race, class and wealth. In my experience, while race is certainly a factor, class and wealth are more so.

meyerpl
Apr 26th, 2006, 03:15 PM
This is such broad generalization because many people cared that Nicole was a battered wife. The media's polarization of the case was detrimental to race relations because alot of black folks believed he was guilty.

You have to really, really, really, really, really want to believe otherwise in order to be able to do so. I'm talking click your heels together and say it three times and wish you were back in Kansas want to believe.

That whole debacle was detrimental to race relations and makes me sick just thinking abouit it. It did drive home a point very forcefully though, how deeply flawed our criminal justice system is, not that that hadn't already been done in past cases. In terms of race, the shoe was on the other foot for a change. In terms of wealth and class, it was just more of the same.