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View Full Version : I think Anna should of played that match out...


Dawn Marie
May 7th, 2002, 06:39 PM
I mean really... I just don't think she was that hurt.. she should of played it on out.

What do you all think? I think she was upset that she was getting beat by a Junior, I mean I would be upset too, but it's always better to play it on out.

veryborednow
May 7th, 2002, 06:44 PM
I think she should do what she feels is right for the physical state of her body.

Dawn Marie
May 7th, 2002, 06:57 PM
True but that is one thing she has never done. Remember Acura last year? came back and re-injured her foot again. I mean this pull out didn't surprise me, but I somehow got the feeling that she was exagerrating her injury. I think she should of let this up n coming Junior get the whole win. Just my opinion. In other words I think she faked the injury to get the hell outta dodge.

And let me add, I could be wrong and that she was so hurt that she had to pull out right then and there.

junkartist
May 7th, 2002, 06:58 PM
I read that she retired due to cramping...

Hurley
May 7th, 2002, 07:03 PM
should HAVE

Dawn Marie
May 7th, 2002, 07:04 PM
Probably cramping in her Brain..but I somehow still think there was more to this pull out. Her ego was crushed.

Bright Red
May 7th, 2002, 07:06 PM
I hear what you're saying, Dawn. But I think that if I were in Anna's shoes, I would have also pulled out. No one's hurt. Sveta still gets the win and the quality points, it's just that Anna doesn't get the loss.

I won't speculate as to whether or not Anna was injured. I believe she was, as I give players the benefit of the doubt. But personally, I would pull out if I were Anna even if I wasn't injured. I wouldn' t want that loss on my record--especially given what people are already saying.

RAA
May 7th, 2002, 07:21 PM
its a tough call to make if you didn't see the match (I didn't). I mean, maybe she was really in tons of pain from cramping?
It does sound odd that someone would retire with only (potentially) one more game to play - it does sound a bit odd. I guess I am giving her the benefit of the doubt.

but I think we would all do well to respect when a player is injured and the decision that they make.
some players play through pain and injury and are not able to perform up to snuff, and get criticized for that.
some players withdraw before playing a point and get criticized for that.
and some players default during a match, and get criticized for that.
whats a player to do??

all our faves have been in one of these positions. I mean, poor hingis couldn't even move her legs in the australian open final and she didn't default. And then she pulls out of doubles at the nasdaq after losing to serena and get criticized for that. Poor seles twists her ankle before a match at the nasdaq a few years ago (not 100% sure of the exact tourney right now) and gamely goes out and plays and gets routed by hingis, and she gets bood off the court.
what's a player to do...?

we should cut them some slack,though.
when a player is hurt, it sucks. I am not a big fan of Hingis, but I am very sorry that she is injured. I am a big fan of venus and serena and hate it when they get injured. I would much rather have all of them out there slugging it out on the court than NOT playing at all.

vw43
May 7th, 2002, 09:56 PM
This thread cracks me up for numerous reasons. I remember back on the old Sanex board when people were speculating whether or not Venus was "really hurt" before withdrawing from Indian Wells. The insinuation is the same but Dawn Marie's reaction was completely different, I assure you.

If it's your opinion that she should have finished one last game, I tend to agree but I must say, that I've learned not to try and be an off court doctor. If a player says he or she is hurt then he or she is hurt. I didn't see the match either but I will give Anna the benefit of the doubt and in the same fashion give credit to Sveta for winning. A win is a win.

Tatiana Panova
May 7th, 2002, 10:00 PM
I disagree Dawn - everyone thinks that Anna is weak-minded but she is great competitor and I think she has suffered bigger losses on bigger stages. I think as a pro she is entitled to make the decision.

Crazy Canuck
May 7th, 2002, 10:03 PM
Anna is a professional athlete, and knows her body better than any of us do.

If she felt she was preventing further pain by withdrawing, then she mad the right decision.

I can't tell how injured a person is by looking at a picture of them, or reading an article, or seeing them on TV - and am forever curious how it is that people seem to think that they are able to analyse the seriousness of an injury when given the same information :confused:

Get well soon Anna :sad:

Amanda
May 7th, 2002, 10:05 PM
Would she have quit if she were leading 5-2 instead of being down 2-5 in the third. Would you have encouraged her to continue if she were leading enroute to her first tournament title?
I don't think so!;)

Richie77
May 7th, 2002, 10:05 PM
Originally posted by Tatiana Panova
I disagree Dawn - everyone thinks that Anna is weak-minded but she is great competitor and I think she has suffered bigger losses on bigger stages. I think as a pro she is entitled to make the decision.

That's true. But some people will probably question her judgement this time around. I won't say anything - if she's injured, she's injured, plus I also haven't read any reports of the match yet.

maccardel
May 7th, 2002, 10:09 PM
What a shame. just sad. really sad....maybe she should stop playing tier events and return to Nick's camp. Hey how about some challengers?

I say she should just retire and become a porn star. I mean she was giving it away for free and plus she is already playing with balls anyway and coming away all hurt and cramped.

Be for real. She is becoming the laughing stock of the wta. One thing you can be sure of and give her credit for is being consistent...a loss is a loss and right about now, no one expects her to win.....at least with that she is consistent.

Lelu
May 7th, 2002, 10:12 PM
I don't think she got it, Hurley ;). Although, she should HAVE. That's her native language, after all.

Crazy Canuck
May 7th, 2002, 10:23 PM
Laughing stock?

I fail to see whats laughable about a former top ten player, and the biggest draw on the WTA - who sat out most of last year injured, and is now struggling to regain form.

Am I missing the joke?

Tatiana Panova
May 7th, 2002, 10:29 PM
I agree Becs the WTA need Anna so badly!! She is by far the biggest crowd puller and it ain't just because of her looks - she is a persona, a star.

rated_next
May 7th, 2002, 10:36 PM
Dawn: :wavey:

Paola Suarez d. Serena Williams 6:3 4:6 5:2 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.

Virginia Ruano Pascual d. Serena Williams 7:5 4:1 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.

Martina Hingis d. Serena Williams 0:6 6:3 3:0 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.

Sandrine Testud d. Serena Williams 7:6 3:0 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.

Joannette Kruger d. Serena Williams 5:1 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.

Jana Novotna d. Serena Williams 2:6 6:3 2:0 ret.
Serena is injured in this match.


Svetlana Kuznetsova d. Anna Kournikova 4:6 6:4 5:2 ret.
Anna isn't injured in this match.


This thread is as idiotic as the 50 year old Dawn.

moon
May 7th, 2002, 10:55 PM
well I agree that Anna should've done what's best for her, and I didn't see the match so whatever.

BUT, rated next-- if you're going to list ALL the times Serena retired you should list ALL the times Anna retired also. I don't believe this is her first time is it? Besides, since when is it a crime to retire?

Fingon
May 7th, 2002, 11:04 PM
Originally posted by moon
Besides, since when is it a crime to retire?

my question exactly.

Ryan
May 7th, 2002, 11:08 PM
I agree Rated_Next, btu not about the stupid Dawn part.:p

Anna obivously wa in pain and couldn't continue, it happens to everybody.

Lelu
May 7th, 2002, 11:15 PM
If retiring is not due to a legitimate injury, it still is not a crime.
However, it can certainly be called:
cheating,
unethical,
unsportsmanlike,
unprofessional.

Alas, we will never know with a high degree of certainty whether the claimed injury was real, will we? We can only judge by the evidence, which, in many cases, is circumstantial at best. Hence, heated discussions (like this one) of the fans who totally lack objectiveness on the subject.

Fingon
May 7th, 2002, 11:23 PM
Lelu, good that somebody can be the voice of reason here :)

the cat
May 7th, 2002, 11:25 PM
Well said Becca! ;)

Dawn Marie, Anna unlike some players, doesn't have a history of retiring from matches while injured or suffering. She had never done it until today. In fact, she gallantly played on torn ankle ligaments 2 years a go to finish a match she ended up losing. Maybe that was a mistake. Because she's not as fast as she used to be.

Was her ego crushed to lose to another Russian girl, who just happens to be the junior world champion? Of course it was. But I'll give Anna the benefit of the doubt, because she's earned it, Dawn. Capiche?

Anna better get used to facing alot of Russian girls in the future. That's going to be very hard for her. I hope she can handle it. Because when she plays Maria Sharapova, Anna will be under tremendous pressure to win. And they all want to beat her badly. Get ready Anna! The Russian girls are coming, and they're looking for you!

Udachi Anna! :kiss:

disposablehero
May 7th, 2002, 11:42 PM
If you are going to retire one game away from losing the match, you had better be very, very hurt.

Amanda
May 8th, 2002, 12:05 AM
I agree. Once again, if Anna were ahead 5-2 instead of trailing 2-5 in the final set, would you have encouraged her to quit? I still don't think so!

:p

Martian Martin
May 8th, 2002, 12:14 AM
Moon, Anna has never retired during a match, this is the 1st time she's had to, even when she twisted her ankle against Leon Garcia in Berlin 2 years ago when she was almost near the end, when she should have retired, but didn't because she wanted to finish the match, the result of this? Was she had to miss Rome, went out early because of the French Open, Eastbourne and Wimbledon because of it.

Fingon
May 8th, 2002, 01:07 AM
I simply believe that you don't have the right to moan if something says something about your favourite if you do the same all the time with other people's favourites.

just my thought

Joseosu19
May 8th, 2002, 01:41 AM
lol @ Hurley's Should have...That's what I was coming in here for...

I think what rated next was trying to prove is that there were plently of times when serena was losing and retired...:wavey:

marshmellow
May 8th, 2002, 01:50 AM
yeah. i saw hurleys post too. lol.

I get your point Amanda. If I was hurt but was leading 5-2 in the third set, I would play on, perhaps even after the trainer tells me not to, for at least one more game. But that would be me cos Iím just stubborn. And the drive to win the match would be enough to make me go on. But itís a totally different case if youíre behind and hurting. Thereís just no motivation there to continue on and risk injuring yourself more. I wish anna could have finished the match too. I liked the fact that she hasnít retired from her singles matches before, but have you had cramps while playing tennis? Your movement is hindered and sometimes you canít move at all. And anna has been treated from dehydration before in 99. and yes, she lost that match too. If that was the injury that made her retire then I can accept that and move on. http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys/7.gif

No one knows how she could have been feeling. So much more that I give her the benefit of the doubt. I wasnít there and I didnít even see the match. I understand that for all those who feel that annaís gotten so much more than she deserves, this is your chance to smile and gloat. But what if she really is injured? And badly at that? I get no satisfaction from hearing news of a player getting hurt, even if that player is my least favorite. Do you have to feel sorry for her? Heck no. But thriving on the fact that she lost is a whole other thing. And it just isnít for me. I just hope that anna rests up now. And I hope she can bounce back from this.

__________________
Goooo anNa!
http://www.boomspeed.com/marshmellow/anna.jpg good luck to anna, martina and daniela!

harloo
May 8th, 2002, 02:15 AM
What does Serena have to do with this? :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: If you have an issue with someone saying that they think Anna retired because she wanted to save face, then why don't you just disagree with that instead of trying to bring Serena into it.

I feel like if Anna was hurt, then she retired plain and simple. Who really cares? It's most likely that she wouldn't win the tournament anyways, so I don't see the big deal. I feel like when a player is injured, none of us know what is going on with their body. All of our opinions is just speculation, so their is no reason to take any of it serious as some have chosen to do.

marshmellow
May 8th, 2002, 02:25 AM
i think it was just to say that it could happen to anyone. now i wouldn't have gone to enumeration, but i thought rated was quite funny actually....sorryhttp://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys/7.gif ...

__________________
Goooo anNa!
http://www.boomspeed.com/marshmellow/anna.jpg good luck to anna, martina and daniela!

Dawn Marie
May 8th, 2002, 06:24 AM
Ricardo, you missed my point entirely. I think Anna was a bit hurt but faked the extint of it. I think her ego was hurt and injured more then her leg cramp. And I feel that she should of played her match out Serena retires due to being really hurt as she soon does't follow her loss up with an appearance right after she withdraws:)

Agree with disposable and Amanda:)

ajayares
May 8th, 2002, 09:17 AM
So at 2-5 down when it is your time to serve and you actually have a problem with your right shoulder and obviously can't serve, what should you do?? Hit 8 serves into the net, to finish the match??? obviously that is what you are saying dawn...

Perhaps this picture might give a clearer picture on the subject, to atleast show she wasn't faking..
http://community.kournikova.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=6203

juggler
May 8th, 2002, 09:17 AM
copy and paste from are similar thread

THIS IS THE FIRST TIME ANNA HAS RETIRED

lets not kid ourself, of course anna retired at 2-5 because she knew she had no chance of winning the match at the point.

but the fact is she was never 100% from very early in the match. after the first set, which she won, she received treatment.

now anna realised that she was injured, but in her mind there was still a chance of winning, and if she could get thru that match who knows about later rounds. so what anna did was compete and fight like hell up unto the point she realised there was no possible way she could win the match.

so why should she give the opponent the satisfaction of winning? its a thing called pride. anna has pride in herself and there is no way a person with any pride would roll over and give someone the match when they know they have been unable to compete at anywhere near 100% for the majority of the match. yes she does suck at the moment. but to just serve probably underarm 8 balls into the net to concede that match is demeaning to her as a tennis player and her as a person. any person with any self respect would not let this happen.

had sveta dominated the match completely and anna then received her injury in the last couple of games then i have no doubt anna would have said "yep, you were too good today" and would have definately not retired. you only have to look to berlin 2000 when this exact situation happen. anna twisted her ankle badly late in the match against gala leon garcia. but she knew that gala probably deserved to win so she let her serve it out.

This is certainly not the first time someone in anna's situation had done this and certainly wont be the last.

sartrista7
May 8th, 2002, 01:51 PM
lol@Hurley

So Dawn, should Serena have played out that match against Suarez where she was 5-2 down? I don't think you took this attitude then. Why is it different for Anna? Why should Anna play out a match when it's OK for Serena to quit?

And bear in mind that players who HAVE played through pain in the past - Lindsay in Munich, Serena last year at KB - have found themselves sidelined for lengthy periods of time. Anyway, no-one's harmed. Sveta still gets the bonus points and is now in her first WTA QF (she beat Noorlander today).

On a side note, why are people making this out to be such a bad loss? Sveta may be a junior not in the top 100, but she's on her way there - and Anna's lost to people with MUCH less talent.

TS
May 8th, 2002, 02:24 PM
LOL Jerome ;) Thanks for saving me the trouble ;)

Martian Martin
May 8th, 2002, 04:37 PM
Very good post Satrista.

Dawn, so if Serena had been in the same position against Kuznetsova, I know it's unlikely but if she had been, down 2-5 and injured, you'd have been saying go on Serena let the girl get her win, doesn't matter if you get injured and do yourself a bad injury. I don't think so. It's just double standards.

HEAVYHITTER
May 8th, 2002, 05:20 PM
Anna retired because she was getting WHIPPED.

btw, if it makes you feel better Serena retired those time because she was getting beat.

and just for the record in the future when the Williams are Ranked #1 and #2,

One of them will retire.....................because they WANT TO.

vw43
May 8th, 2002, 05:27 PM
:rolleyes:

HEAVYHITTER
May 8th, 2002, 05:31 PM
I understand vw43...........the TRUTH hurts

Martian Martin
May 8th, 2002, 05:38 PM
What a bunch of crap heavyhitter.

Let's play a game of spot the difference

Svetlana Kuznetsova d. Anna Kournikova 4-6 6-4 5-2 ret

Paola Suarez d. Serena Williams 3-6 6-4 5-2 ret

Yes, I can see a lot of difference here :rolleyes:

HEAVYHITTER
May 8th, 2002, 05:48 PM
and your POINT?

vw43
May 8th, 2002, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by HEAVYHITTER
I understand vw43...........the TRUTH hurts

:rolleyes: :kiss: :kiss: :rolleyes:

Dawn Marie
May 8th, 2002, 06:26 PM
Sarsita7, When Serena retired I do think she was seriously injured, but when Anna retired I do think it was exagerrated because a younger gal was beating her that day.

I remember when so many people kept saying Serena and Venus faked their injuries, all I am saying is that in this particular case I think Anna, was a bit hurt and could have played and faked the extint of her injury. I do think she may have been cramping, but still could/should have played. Note: I also said that I could be wrong, though.

:) :wavey:

Weevee
May 8th, 2002, 06:42 PM
Do players have the right to make the decisions that are in their own best interest? If they do what is the argument?

sartrista7
May 9th, 2002, 01:29 PM
Originally posted by Dawn Marie
Sarsita7, When Serena retired I do think she was seriously injured, but when Anna retired I do think it was exagerrated because a younger gal was beating her that day.

I remember when so many people kept saying Serena and Venus faked their injuries, all I am saying is that in this particular case I think Anna, was a bit hurt and could have played and faked the extint of her injury. I do think she may have been cramping, but still could/should have played. Note: I also said that I could be wrong, though.

:) :wavey:

:wavey: at Dawn

I hear what you're saying, but how can you tell? Did you see the Anna (or Serena) match? I didn't see either. Maybe one (or both) retired out of pride. Maybe one (or both) genuinely couldn't play on. Maybe it was a combination of the two... but you can't assume that Serena retired for one reason and Anna for another if you didn't actually see what was going on. Either you believe them BOTH, or you disbelieve them BOTH.

rated_next
May 9th, 2002, 01:59 PM
sartrista7: don't even bother arguing with her ... dawn may be 50 years old, but she has the brain of a 3 year old child