View Full Version : My New take on Jen.....& Some Jen Deners

Cybelle Darkholme
May 5th, 2002, 10:48 PM
The way i read posts is that I go through most of the new ones. Just to let you know that I don't troll through the jen den. If theres a new post on the search and I think the thread is interesting I will leave my opinon.

Also I had made my peace with Fedgate and was jumping off the jen bandwagon, I had made my point so it made sense to stop. However if some people feel its necessary to stoop to personal attacks based on an opinon I have of a tennis player they like, well then maybe I should keep expressing my opinon because obviously you take what I say to heart.

Yeah at first it was funny, then boring, depressing and now it is amusing again. But there are some posters that seem obsessed with ragging on Jen, like "Sigh, bell ".

I'm sure Cy-hell and her cronies are licking their chops, waiting for an on-court outburst from our Jenny. L Gojennifer

Wow I guess stooping to personal attacks might be a tactic you picked up from your favorite player jen. I mean we are talking about the woman who cursed out bjk. Im sure her disresepectful behavior must rub off somehow, right?

I also find it funny that the media, the very media who adores jen all realize that girl was wrong, jen's teammates know she was wrong, the usta knows she was wrong, yet jen and some of her fans refuse to see it. no wonder all these negative articles about her are surfacing because obviously they are warranted. Most of her outrageous antics are on tape for all to see anyway.

Although it does seem like some of you jen deners have some sense.

Whilst I do not seek to condone Jennifer's behaviour, in truth I find it quite disgusting, it's occasions like this that see everyone trying to be G-d. She has made a huge error, but to bring the game into disrepute is a huge statement

also I'd like to thank veryborednow for this great article that sums up the situation with jen quite nicely. After this I think I will move on from fedgate because really everything that needed to said was said, lets just hope a certain pair of ears was listening.

Tennis: Richard Evans: Return of the bad girl
Billie Jean King takes a stance against superstar arrogance, but will she get the support she deserves?

Superstar arrogance touched new heights when the supposedly reformed Jennifer Capriati told Billie Jean King to “F*** off” when she was removed from the United States Fed Cup team at Charlotte, North Carolina, last weekend.
According to observers, who included coach Zina Garrison and hitting partner Jonathan Stark as well as numerous United States Tennis Association (USTA) volunteers, a look of incredulity crossed Capriati’s face when it dawned on her that King, the Fed Cup captain and, ironically, her doubles partner when she played her first professional tournament at the age of 14, was going to carry out her threat to remove the Australian and French Open champion from the team on the grounds that she insisted on practising with her own coach.

Just a few minutes before, Garrison, the Wimbledon finalist in 1990, had taken Capriati to one side to explain why the rule was for the good of the whole team.

“But Jennifer was trying to establish who was in control and she lost sight of what’s right,” Garrison said. “She got very upset and used a lot of profanities. I thought, ‘Come on girl, don’t you understand Billie Jean is the reason you are here?’ If you can’t respect Billie Jean, you’ve still got a lot of growing up to do.”

As is so often the case, a tennis father-turned-coach looms in the background of this story. Stefano Capriati did his best to push himself to the forefront after King laid down the rules in a team meeting at the beginning of the week for the tie against Austria, which the United States ultimately lost.

Capriati, who turned up 20 minutes late, had the rules reiterated to her personally by King, including the salient one that no personal coaches would be allowed to attend practice sessions. At the time Capriati, a woman of few words, merely nodded and said: “Okay.”

Capriati, having said she wanted to practise at 1pm, made her own way to the Olde Providence Racquet Club and appeared on court at 11am with her father. After a big hug from Stefano, with whom King has always had warm relations, the captain informed him of the rule and asked him to respect it. He agreed, but went over to the court where Monica Seles was practising and watched her. King knew that Seles didn’t like this, so a USTA security guard was told to go and ask Mr Capriati to leave.

At that point Mr Capriati stormed over to his long-time friend and, in full view of everybody, began screaming abuse at her, pointing a finger an inch from King’s face. She told him to calm down.

That night, Jennifer turned up 20 minutes late for a private team dinner at the Ballantyne Hotel and the matter was not discussed. However, the next day, King received a call at the courts from Fed Cup chairwoman Carol Graebner to say that Capriati had decided to quit the team. But even before the USTA hierarchy could be contacted, Graebner called back to say the Capriatis had changed their minds and “would play by the rules”.

At a subsequent press conference, Capriati praised King for the way she had helped her during a Fed Cup match in Las Vegas two months before she won her first Grand Slam title in Australia in January 2001. King has always been supportive of the young woman whose troubles with drugs and the law sent her spinning off the tracks before she reached 20.

All that seemed to count for little the following day when Capriati, having been nominated for the team at the draw, practised with her colleagues for half an hour and then let it be known that she had booked a separate practice court, hired a high-school hitting partner and was preparing to have a further session with her father.

The captain, along with Garrison and Stark, then approached her. “You know the rules,” said King, “please don’t do this.” But Capriati was adamant. In the statement she released later, she said: “I strongly protested at this directive. Looking beyond the Fed Cup, I was also preparing for some very important tournaments, including the defence of my title at the French Open. It is amazing to me that I am being penalised so severely for wanting to prepare as best I can for the Fed Cup and my other commitments.”

King has been asked by the USTA, which is trying to tip-toe around the issue, not to make any public statement, but in a private conversation yesterday, she agreed to be quoted as saying: “Jennifer broke the rules on many occasions, and in fairness to the other players, who all supported me, I had no option but to take her off the team. It was a decision that led to a short-term loss for a long-term gain.”

That much will be true only if the game’s leaders rally round the woman who has done more than anybody else to popularise women’s tennis, and thereby send a signal to Capriati’s pampered colleagues on the Sanex WTA Tour that rules are rules and have to be obeyed.

The USTA’s response leaves much to be desired. After many phone calls, the following statement was finally extracted: “The USTA supports Billie Jean King and has enormous regard for her leadership on our team and our sport. Jennifer Capriati is an important part of American tennis and a key contributor to America’s success in world tennis. We have every confidence that the goals of the USTA, Billie Jean King and Jennifer Capriati can and will be reconciled.”

When the player apologises, perhaps? There was no sign of that from the Capriati camp. Nor, anywhere in that statement, a word of criticism of the Capriatis’ behaviour. So are we to assume the USTA feels it is acceptable to use profane language to a captain of one of their teams? Is it so desperate for Capriati’s services it is prepared to abandon its duties and not issue a reprimand for appallbehaviour that was appalling? What will she do — refuse to play the US Open? Is Stefano going to blow his trumpet so hard that the walls of the Arthur Ashe stadium fall down? It is about time somebody in authority in tennis started insisting that the players adhere to some of sport’s 10 commandments, which include: 1 Respect the rules; 2 Respect your captain; 3. Don’t use profane and abusive language in public.

The fact is that Capriati and her father have brought the sport into disrepute, and somebody in authority ought to have the guts to tell them so.

Let me follow this up by saying finally someone has some sense. After hearing all that about players no being bigger than the game of tennis, bjk finally let a player know that that is so true. Tennis did not begin and will not end with Jen and her ego. Maybe she should take a few lessons from monica on ettiquette.

Cybelle Darkholme
May 5th, 2002, 11:29 PM

im in such a devilish mood that i wont let this thread die so soon.

May 5th, 2002, 11:33 PM
cybelle, maybe you'd just be better off staying out Jens Den ?

Anyway, Selestials is the best ... I'm sure you'll find some nice pics of Mike Sell in there.

Cybelle Darkholme
May 5th, 2002, 11:38 PM
Thanks Kar, I am still on my hunt for mike though I think he's avoiding me.:lick:

I never thought people were so territorial on here. I admit I did go to jen's den once to post something that was negative about jen, that was a mistake on my part and i apologized. I think I went there again but didn't post anything negative.

I thought the whole purpose of a message board was to you know leave messages. Who knew that some would be so petty to take personal swipes. I guess the truth hurts so much they feel they have to lash out? If thats the case I recommend anger management courses or maybe a few meds.:angel:

Is monica playing in the upcoming german open? I hope she's in jens section because I know she'd love to get a win after that tight match in florida.

May 5th, 2002, 11:47 PM
Sadly Monica isn't playing until Rome - probably spending the time working hard with Mike ... ;).

May 5th, 2002, 11:49 PM
Superstar arrogance touched new heights when the supposedly reformed Jennifer Capriati told Billie Jean King to “F*** off” when she was removed from the United States Fed Cup team at Charlotte, North Carolina, last weekend. :eek: :eek: :eek:

But Jennifer was trying to establish who was in control and she lost sight of what’s right,” Garrison said. “She got very upset and used a lot of profanities. I thought, ‘Come on girl, don’t you understand Billie Jean is the reason you are here?’ If you can’t respect Billie Jean, .”

If info in article is accurate then I certainly agree with Garrison
Jen, you’ve still got a lot of growing up to do....

Cybelle Darkholme
May 5th, 2002, 11:57 PM
Nooooo Kart! Tell me it isnt so! They're really just friends, right? Right?:eek: :wavey:

May 6th, 2002, 12:00 AM
LOL, no he's just her coach as far as I know - of course, no one knows anything about Monica's private life as she keeps it pretty much a secret.

So, I guess Mike's just saving himself for you - as soon as you eventually hunt him down :).

May 6th, 2002, 12:07 AM
Well it appears that I have sense, so thank you Cybelle and please with that in mind, let me share my opinions on this one.

In almost every thread about this debacle I have made it clear that despite being a massive fan of Jennifer's, she is indefensible on this one. Being a fan does not mean blindly keeping the faith, but supporting them through whatever trouble comes their way. At the risk of going over old ground again, being a fan of Jennifer's makes it pretty easy to see that a player can have huge faults. This is a girl who tried and nearly succeeded to throw everything away...so, it's a bit hypocritical of me to say she's perfect.

Sure Jennifer still has a lot of growing up to do. I can only hope she does it soon, but as a fan, I will not be deserting her. I will continue to support her. Trust me when I say that as a Jen fan, these are by no means the most difficult of times we've been through.

I am aware that there are some people on this board who will continue to focus on Jennifer as a person, not as a player, which is a shame on a TENNIS board, but to each, their own. And whilst you focus on her as a person, you choose to blank out some beneficial moments and concentrate on her negative episodes. A slight self-fulfilling prophecy, but she has provided you with the ammunition, so take aim.

As I said before, she has made a big mistake, one which some wish to hang her over. As a fan, whilst I cannot defend her, I can and will continue to support her in the hope that one day, she grows into the person, she can be, in a similar manner to which she has grown into the player she can be.

Cybelle Darkholme
May 6th, 2002, 12:07 AM
What a relief! That means I can tell my friend Vanna in roma to go ahead with plan "hot cakes" on video. which is for her to throw her bottle of water on mike and catch it on all video when he strips to get dry.

May 6th, 2002, 12:08 AM
Jennifer using profanities doesnt mean she isnt reformed, everyone has a personality and when arguing a lot of people swear. Jennifer is as human as anyone.

May 6th, 2002, 02:04 AM
Very good article. As anyone knows me from the previous boards and this board, I am a very huge Jenn fan. But her behavior is starting to get very annoying. Jenn knew the rules and did not need to drag her "daddy" into this. I like Jenn and she is still my favorite. I think it would be a blessing in disguise for her if she gets booed like Hingis did in Paris in 99(That's only if Jenn shows her same obnoxious behavior) That would teach her to be more courteous on court like Hingis has since then. Anyways Jenn I still love ya!

May 6th, 2002, 02:32 AM

May 6th, 2002, 02:55 AM
Though I would agree that on the surface, if the information is acurate, Jen's behaviour is wrong at this point, I hardly think that Jennifer is guilty of bringing the game into dis repute! And, furthermore, all the top athletes, regardless of the sport, are pampered and there are overly large ego's to deal with. Jennifer is hardly the first in tennis and I am quite sure is not the only one on tour to behave in such a fashion. Frankly, I think this has been blown way out of proportion and it is just fuel for the "Capriati Bashers" who seem to have problems with Jennifers sucsess! I suppose, however, that this is the price to pay for the fame!:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

May 6th, 2002, 03:15 AM
Glad most of you are able to stick with your fav (Jen) and still acknowledge her (for lack of better word) shortcomings.

Go WTA and their Faithful Fans!

Some of us can appreciate how you guys feel.

Hopefully like my favs Jen like fine wine will get better with time:)

May 6th, 2002, 03:16 AM
whatever hater!

May 6th, 2002, 03:45 AM
Originally posted by Vanity
whatever hater!

Are you refering Jennifer on BJK?:rolleyes: ;)

Vanity, everybody is a hater for you:rolleyes:

May 6th, 2002, 04:38 AM

Dayum you REALLY HATE!!!!!!! Jennifer.

I do to! Nonetheless, back off already. When she got BOOTED I knew then it was the beginning of the end.

Look at all of the articles flying. She F**ked up.....Big time!

Jen was 2001 sensation. It's over. 2002 belongs to Serena/Venus.......and EVERYBODY KNOWS IT.

Therefore, sit back, relax and let their racquet do the talking.

Besides, I'm CONVINCED Jennifer is suffering from "ROID" rages. She can't handle her new drug of choice.

May 6th, 2002, 07:22 AM
Well Cybelle since you are so completely consumed and obsessed about Jennifer I have a little idea that might appease you.

Go to her house, tell she needs time out and sit in the corner. Maybe that will make you feel better so that you can have some peace of mind and get over it.

Now, for the 8970th time, not all of us agree with how Jennifer handled the FedCup.

But this is not the issue Cybelle it's the fact that because you don't like her "behavior," you are compelled to critizise her for every "peccadillo" she creates, and then you turn around and piss other people off with your rantings.

You also try to defend youself to the hilt yet I have not seen you once come to her defense when other posters have said rather mean and scathing things about her.

I take it you find that ok? You also have a problem with how her fans are treating you? I bet you the most expensive dinner in town that if posters were blasting your favorite tennis player you would be right there to defend her.....at any cost I would imagine.

Gee woman did you spend hours on end creating this thread? Did it finally make you feel better to get it off your chest?

Well good girl if it did. Now will you finally move on?

May 6th, 2002, 12:33 PM

You broke the deal. You know.....the deal the Jen Dens set.

Cybelle Darkholme
May 6th, 2002, 12:51 PM
heavyhitter I hate no one life is too short for that

jak i can several times defended jen about her past. the past is the past and thats where it should stay. she has moved on from that and i respect her for that. also jak, I see you had no comment for the personal attacks from other posters. Just because i have strong opinions doesnt mean im obsessed. To me a sign of obsession is when others feel the need to slam other posters because of their opinion. maybe FANaticism is a better word.

in any case i agree that the fedgate episode did not cast some negative shadow over the entire game of tennis, thats a bit ridiculous.

I have also stated numerous times how jen's game is great to watch. But you cannot seperate a player from their behavior. Take for instance goran, who is a homophobe. Fine the man won wimbledon in style but I dont respect him because he is a homophobe. Should i respect a player who is racist? How about anti-semitic? So behavior does influence how one feels about a player or anyone for that matter.

Regarding jen snuff really hit it on the head and I'm dropping this issue. after a post like that there really isnt anything for me to say so thats it. maybe i came off a little too zealous but my feelings toward jens behavior just hit critical mass during fedgate. Now however everything is back to normal levels, people change and you have to step back and give them the chance to.

May 6th, 2002, 12:58 PM
Kudos to Jenn fans who accepted the facts here !!:D
Now this is how a fan should be like! :D:D
I'm glad people are finally begining to understand the true picture here.
There are a lot of Jenn fans and BJK haters ,who simply do not want to change their opinion ,because it's too late to change their opinion,and they want to save face.
However, in their hearts they know that they are wrong.
Barrie, I think cybelle is bringing up more and more articles as proof that Jennifer was wrong in this case,to convince the guys who have not yet agreed to the facts.
However she has not realised that these people know the truth ,but are not ready to accept it in public on the board.
Cybelle ,leave this behind.
Every person knows that Jennifer was in the wrong here.Only some people will not agree to it openly.They will never do it,as they have save their faces.
So it's best to leave them to themselves :D

May 6th, 2002, 01:47 PM
Oh my God. Shock! Horror! Player uses 'profane language'! You know what - get the fuck over it. It's something you do when you're angry. It's not something that merits criticism in any way.

May 6th, 2002, 04:00 PM
HEAVYHITTER, i know of no deal with us.

anyway, fuck, were u raised by a someone from southpark? what the fuck?!? i mea, how much hate in one man?!?

this thread in meaning-less, because most of the Jenn's Denesr (including myself) already admitted she did a mistake, a big mistake if u like, im just asking a couple of thing:

1.its over. get of it, & stop posting 10 thread about it each day, it just proves us more & more how much u like Jenn & obsessed with her!

2.dont bring up the "how will the children see it", im 13 & it doesnt effect my personal life whatsoever.

im begging u.. listen to me, stop being so full of urselves & with hate, JUST STOP.

May 6th, 2002, 06:08 PM
I think deftman said it best and others have made great posts, too, so the thread did bring something good.

In defense of fans of Jen like myself, though, I still have a critical judgement of Billy Jean for a last minute addition to the rules and I don't like the characterization of me as wanting to save face. The rule looks suspiciously like it's aimed at ejecting a certain dad and looks like control for the sake of control. It also looks like it was made by a rube—someone who couldn't anticipate how it would effect a volatile and emotional player. She only had four players to manage and she knew them all. If Billy Jean couldn't do that or Jen was an insurmountable problem, then okay. But, geesh, what did BJK need? She didn't need to whip these players into playing shape in five days.

Arbitrary rules often engender disrespect for the people who make them—at least from many of us in the US. The only defense of the rule has been "rules are rules" regardless of their lack of value. Part of our national charactor is to reject that and rebel. Obviously that character is a large part of a large segment of us–not a large part of everyone or of every group or even of the majority in the US. So, what you see in the stubborn defense of Jen and in the support for BJK is two different belief systems. One tests every system and the other accepts systems until they see a problem. We tend to be of two different parties and are suspicious that the other is tearing down our country; we often accuse each other of that. Hence, the patriotic fervor in Newsweek's sports reporter ICON and columnist in his scathing denunciation of Jennifer and the damage he believes that she has done to sports and America and honor and impressionable teens and little children and flowers. The key word there was 'believes'. He and his group really believe there was damage and they hate people who see no damage worse than they dislike Jen.

Neither group is going to budge.

May 7th, 2002, 11:16 AM
Cybelle, if perhaps I was oversensitive toward you than I apologize.

But when I see posters constantly going out of their way to critique players they don't like, and then pissing off their fans in the process, I frankly find that quite obsessive.

If you say you like Jen's game I believe you. If her "behavior" disturbs you, I can respect that.

But remember their are many who like Jen for the way she is and don't necessarily find her bratty just because of how she reacts to situations on or off court.

May 7th, 2002, 02:39 PM
with all due respect, cybel, get over it. This thread was complete bullshit and you know it.

Also, Jen's Den is for fans of Jennifer Capriati. If you don't like what you find there then don't go there.

Move on and support your faves instead of busying yourself with criticizing other peoples faves. It's immature and old.

:confused: :confused: :( :(

Boca Punch
May 7th, 2002, 02:57 PM
vw43 - - I think I'm in love......you took the words right out of my fingers!! :kiss: :kiss: :hearts: :hearts: