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bandabou
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:25 PM
Discussion for today....

4 majors, no.1...but NO wimbledons. Can she be considered a great?

ans
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:26 PM
Maybe we could discuss this in 5 years.

Oneofakind0490
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:28 PM
I thought these Enna threads had died. Your just as much of a troll as Cali.

Geisha
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:29 PM
Justine, right now, I would say is becoming a great. IMO, I don't think you HAVE to win Wimbledon if you are a great. Yes, it is very prestigous, but back in the day, a lot more tournaments were grasscourt and I think it was easier to win on grass back then. And you can also have things like what has happened to Seles- her first three Wimbledons, she doesn't win. She's in her peak or entering it and she gets stabbed.

*Karen*
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:29 PM
Why not i think she'll have atleast another 5 years of good tennis and could still win wimbledon. I don't really think you become known as a great until you stop playing. Theres also lots of players who never won Roland Garros but are sort of considered as greats such as Hingis, Davenport and Venus.

SJW
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:30 PM
your obsession is becoming boring.

yawn.

Sam L
Jul 10th, 2005, 01:37 PM
I think that since 1988 but especially in the 21st century, all the slams have equalled out. A slam is a slam is a slam is never truer.

Of course, it's still better to have 1 of each than to have 4 French Opens only.

But I don't think it should be considered a blemish on Justine's career that she doesn't have a Wimbledon.

That is, Venus, before she won her #5 was NOT greater Justine despite her Olympic gold medal.

I think Justine needs another slam to be a great and I'm pretty sure she'll get it (let's face it, she'll win at least another French Open), so I consider her a great.

5 is the cut-off for "great" in my book.

Filip!
Jul 10th, 2005, 02:27 PM
Off course she's great :)

le bon vivant
Jul 10th, 2005, 02:34 PM
In a word, Yes.

thrust
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:20 PM
With 23 titles in all, including 4 Slams on different surfaces, she is very close to being considered a great player. Her record, so far, is superior to many in the Hall of Fame. I think she is a great player NOW!!

Calimero377
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:27 PM
Discussion for today....

4 majors, no.1...but NO wimbledons. Can she be considered a great?


No.

partbrit
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:28 PM
I think she will win Wimbledon at some point. I think she can do anything she sets out to do. I believe we will see a bit more variety in her game in the future, and--provided she stays healthy--she will see her win over and over.

Calimero377
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:29 PM
Justine, right now, I would say is becoming a great. IMO, I don't think you HAVE to win Wimbledon if you are a great. Yes, it is very prestigous, but back in the day, a lot more tournaments were grasscourt and I think it was easier to win on grass back then. And you can also have things like what has happened to Seles- her first three Wimbledons, she doesn't win. She's in her peak or entering it and she gets stabbed.


... and did never compete in Wimbledon again.
:sad:



Oops ....

Calimero377
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:31 PM
I think that since 1988 but especially in the 21st century, all the slams have equalled out. A slam is a slam is a slam is never truer.

Of course, it's still better to have 1 of each than to have 4 French Opens only.

But I don't think it should be considered a blemish on Justine's career that she doesn't have a Wimbledon.

That is, Venus, before she won her #5 was NOT greater Justine despite her Olympic gold medal.

I think Justine needs another slam to be a great and I'm pretty sure she'll get it (let's face it, she'll win at least another French Open), so I consider her a great.

5 is the cut-off for "great" in my book.


10 in my book.

Pengwin
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:32 PM
10 in my book.

So the woman who dominated the first half of the 90s isn't a great?

Calimero377
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:50 PM
So the woman who dominated the first half of the 90s isn't a great?

Of course Graf is a great. She is the greatest of them all.

Graf was #1 for 148 weeks in the first half of the 90ies (= 57 %).
She won a record 42 titles and a record 3 Wimbledons in 90-94.

But I wouldn't say she "dominated". Seles was quite good too in those years (OK, she sucked in the 80ies, in the 2nd half of the 90ies and in the 21st century).

vandy
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:52 PM
don't forget these non-greats.
borg, no U.S. open, no
Samparas, no french no
Lendel, Wimb. no

Wojtek
Jul 10th, 2005, 03:55 PM
Thread starter isn't normal. It's the third thread with this title.

stenen
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:00 PM
don't forget these none greats.
borg, no U.S. open, no
Samparas, no french no
Lendel, Wimb. no

Borg doesn't have AO either. He didn't bother to go there. Neither did he enjoy playing at USO.

minboy
Jul 10th, 2005, 04:14 PM
I'm not sure Wimbledon matters that much when considering great players :
Seles : no W, still a great
Wilander : no W, still a great
Lendl : no W, still a great

On the other hand, Martinez, Krajicek, Cash, Stich, Ivanisevic....are not among the greats.

jenny161185
Jul 10th, 2005, 05:20 PM
yes

mboyle
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:31 PM
Well, I don't throw around the term "great" lightly. If I am going to call you an all time great, I want the following qualifications:

10 grand slams total or multiple years winning 3/4
No. 1 ranking for a while (100 weeks should do it)

Singles only, unless there are exceptions (Martina Hingis is an exception.)

mboyle
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:33 PM
All time greats, to me:
Divine Suzanne
Helen Wills
Maureen Connolly
Margaret Court
Billy Jean King
Chris Evert
Martina Navratilova
Steffi Graf
Monica Seles
Martina Hingis (very debatable)

and Silliams is going to get there...

cartmancop
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:36 PM
She's not there yet but she will be... She'll win a few more majors barring major injury & will someday get to # 1 again...

Brooks.
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:36 PM
All time greats, to me:
Divine Suzanne
Helen Wills
Maureen Connolly
Margaret Court
Billy Jean King
Chris Evert
Martina Navratilova
Steffi Graf
Monica Seles
Martina Hingis (very debatable)

and Silliams is going to get there...

so in your opinion hingis is already there.......but serena still has to get there .....you really dont like serena very much do you :rolleyes:

mboyle
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:38 PM
so in your opinion hingis is already there.......but serena still has to get there .....you really dont like serena very much do you :rolleyes:

Well, see I don't really believe that. I just thought I had to include doubles somehow, and Martina is the best modern doubles player (since 1990.) She carried teams to nine grand slam titles (with like 6/7 different people.) That has to count for something, right:shrug: . But yeah, Serena seems like the better player if I don't have a formula or anything, so...

Knizzle
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:39 PM
All time greats, to me:
Divine Suzanne
Helen Wills
Maureen Connolly
Margaret Court
Billy Jean King
Chris Evert
Martina Navratilova
Steffi Graf
Monica Seles
Martina Hingis (very debatable)

and Silliams is going to get there...

No way Hingis should be on that list.

cellophane
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:45 PM
I don't know, but I think I will start tearing my hair out if I see her being called Enna one more time.

Brooks.
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:46 PM
Well, see I don't really believe that. I just thought I had to include doubles somehow, and Martina is the best modern doubles player (since 1990.) She carried teams to nine grand slam titles (with like 6/7 different people.) That has to count for something, right:shrug: . But yeah, Serena seems like the better player if I don't have a formula or anything, so...

and serena has 6 doubles slams and 2 mixed.....oh but thats right.......it only counts for hingis :rolleyes: ;) :p

Angel_Mars
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:46 PM
Is JHH a great? Yes, I do think so...........

cartmancop
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:48 PM
No way Hingis should be on that list.

Yeh Hingis is debatable...if u put her u probably have to put Venus for sure & Davenport.

Hingis had 5 singles & 9 doubles GSs , I think that's right

Venus now has 5 singles, 6 doubles & 2 mixed GSs & counting. + the gold medals...

furrykitten
Jul 10th, 2005, 08:53 PM
Who is Enna?

selyoink
Jul 10th, 2005, 11:09 PM
Yes she is a great.

And I believe she will eventually win Wimbledon. She did make the final at Wimbledon before any other grand slam afterall.

Fingon
Jul 10th, 2005, 11:39 PM
Discussion for today....

4 majors, no.1...but NO wimbledons. Can she be considered a great?

No, and none of the active players is, IMO, they need to have double figures GS singles titles to be there, so not even Serena qualifies.

Volcana
Jul 10th, 2005, 11:42 PM
There are only seven truly great players. Navratilova, Court, Wills Moody, Graf, Evert, King and Lenglen (not necessarily in that order).

If Maureen Connolly and Monica Seles had not suffered their respective tragedies, they'd no doubt be on my list too.

Not quite, Maria Bueno, Serena, Evonne Goolagong, Molla Mallory.

So whoever 'Enna' is is a no.

timray
Jul 10th, 2005, 11:53 PM
Enna is half great and half good. :smash:

Gowza
Jul 11th, 2005, 12:30 AM
no, maybe in the future, we will have to see.

Cybelle Darkholme
Jul 11th, 2005, 12:33 AM
No, and none of the active players is, IMO, they need to have double figures GS singles titles to be there, so not even Serena qualifies.

So andre agassi is not a great player?

kabuki
Jul 11th, 2005, 12:50 AM
If she can stay healthy, she will be.

TF Chipmunk
Jul 11th, 2005, 01:16 AM
First of all, I have no idea who Enna is :rolleyes: Second of all, even if I did guess who this person was referring to (Justine perhaps? :p) she still has so many more years left in her to become greater.