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View Full Version : Did Losing 6-0 6-0 to Davenport affect Sharapova?


Volcana
Jul 5th, 2005, 11:55 PM
A first blush, the answer seems, 'no'. She made the Miami final, after all. But since that 6-0 6-0 loss, her record against top players has been. wretched.
AUS OPEN ........ 1st 110 KARATANTCHEVA ..... W 6-3 6-1
AUS OPEN ........ R64 _87 LEE-WATERS ........ W 4-6 6-0 6-3
AUS OPEN ........ R32 _64 LI ................ W 6-0 6-2
AUS OPEN ........ R16 _19 FARINA ELIA ....... W 4-6 6-1 6-2
AUS OPEN ........ QTF __5 KUZNETSOVA ........ W 4-6 6-2 6-2
AUS OPEN ........ SMI __7 WILLIAMS, S ....... L 2-6 7-5 8-6

Toray Pan Pacific R32 ... BYE
Toray Pan Pacific R16 _50 VENTO-KABCHI ...... W 7-6 6-0
Toray Pan Pacific QTF _22 LIKHOVTSEVA ....... W 6-3 6-3
Toray Pan Pacific SMI _32 ASAGOE ............ W 6-1 7-6
Toray Pan Pacific FNL __1 DAVENPORT ......... W 6-1 3-6 7-6

DOHA ............ R32 ... BYE
DOHA ............ R16 _33 DULKO ............. W 6-1 6-1
DOHA ............ QTR _35 BARTOLI ........... W 6-3 6-2
DOHA ............ SMI _28 HANTUCHOVA ........ W 6-2 6-4
DOHA ............ FNL __9 MOLIK ............. W 4-6 6-1 6-4

INDIAN WELLS .... 1st ... BYE
INDIAN WELLS .... R64 105 HAYNES ............ W 6-1 6-2
INDIAN WELLS .... R32 _37 SAFINA ............ W 6-2 6-3
INDIAN WELLS .... R16 _28 ZULUAGA ........... W 4-6 6-2 7-5
INDIAN WELLS .... QTR _33 PIERCE ............ W 6-4 6-3
INDIAN WELLS .... SMI __1 DAVENPORT ......... L 6-0 6-0

MIAMI ........... 1st ... BYE
MIAMI ........... R64 _58 DANIILIDOU ........ W 6-0 6-4
MIAMI ........... R32 _85 IRVIN ............. W 6-2 6-0
MIAMI ........... R16 _26 ASAGOE ............ W 6-1 6-2
MIAMI ........... QTR _40 HENIN-HARDENNE .... W 6-1 6-7 6-2
MIAMI ........... SMI __9 WILLIAMS, V ....... W 6-4 6-3
MIAMI ........... FNL _38 CLIJSTERS ......... L 6-3 7-5

BERLIN .......... R64 ... BYE
BERLIN .......... R32 _49 GROENEFELD ........ W 6-2 6-2
BERLIN .......... R16 _52 PENG, SHUAI ....... W 6-2 6-1
BERLIN .......... QTR _15 HENIN-HARDENNE .... L 6-2 6-4

ROME ............ R64 ... BYE
ROME ............ R32 _42 MEDINA GARRIGUES .. W 6-4 6-2
ROME ............ R16 _24 PIERCE ............ W 7-6 6-4
ROME ............ QTR _15 BOVINA ............ W 6-2 6-2
ROME ............ SMI _13 SCHNYDER .......... L 3-6 6-3 6-1

ROLAND GARROS ... 1st _41 LINETSKAYA ........ W 6-7 6-2 6-4
ROLAND GARROS ... R64 244 REZAI ............. W 6-3 6-2
ROLAND GARROS ... R32 _56 CHAKVETADZE ....... W 6-1 6-4
ROLAND GARROS ... R16 _46 LLAGOSTERA VIVES .. W 6-2 6-3
ROLAND GARROS ... QTR _12 HENIN-HARDENNE .... L 6-4 6-2

BIRMINGHAM ...... R64 ... BYE
BIRMINGHAM ...... R32 _94 KREMER ............ W 6-3 6-0
BIRMINGHAM ...... R16 _49 STOSUR ............ W 6-3 3-6 6-1
BIRMINGHAM ...... QTR _87 DANIILIDOU ........ W 7-5 2-6 6-1
BIRMINGHAM ...... SMI _19 GOLOVIN ........... W 7-5 6-1
BIRMINGHAM ...... FNL _20 JANKOVIC .......... W 6-2 4-6 6-1

WIMBLEDON ....... 1st _36 LLAGOSTERA VIVES .. W 6-2 6-2
WIMBLEDON ....... R64 _52 KARATANTCHEVA ..... W 6-0 6-1
WIMBLEDON ....... R32 _57 SREBOTNIK ......... W 6-2 6-4
WIMBLEDON ....... R16 _18 DECHY ............. W 6-4 6-2
WIMBLEDON ....... QTR __8 PETROVA ........... W 7-6 6-3
WIMBLEDON ....... SMI _16 WILLIAMS, V ....... L 7-6 6-1
And that record is somewhat worse than it looks. Miami was Henin-Hardenne's first tournament of the year. And Venus' woes (pre-Wimbledon) have been well chronicled. Sharapova was a justifiable heavy favorite in both those matches. And the Wimbledon win over Petrova was over a player who is the true 'new Kournikova'. A top ten talent who can't win a tournament.

But every tournament where she has to play someone ranked #13 or higher, she's lost since then. The jury is still out on this theory because of the surfaces involved. Half the tournaments since IW have been on clay. And even losing to Venus at Wimbledon can't be considered that bad. Venus is far and away the best Wimbledon performer since Graf and Nav.

However, I'm going to be looking for some big wins over 2005's best performers this summer. She's ranked #2, she wona slam and the YEC. And at 18 years old, she's an adult. Age no longer matters.

venusfan
Jul 5th, 2005, 11:59 PM
U trying to say ms sharapova cant beat anyone ranked in the top 7?

MLF
Jul 6th, 2005, 12:04 AM
I don't think so in all honesty. Three of her losses came on her worst surface, clay, to perennial tricky clay court opponents ( i.e Henin & Schnyder ). Venus was a class apart at Wimbledon against Maria so I don't think the 0 & 0 drubbing had a big impact on Maria. However, I do agree the hardcourt season will be a very important time for Maria in terms of whether she can secure a reputation as the one to beat on the tour or whether she'll be viewed as part of the chasing pack, even as a world #2.

jamatthews
Jul 6th, 2005, 12:05 AM
No, I think the AO loss affected her far more probably...

spartanfan
Jul 6th, 2005, 12:44 AM
I guess we won't know for sure until the next time Davenport and Sharapova play. Should be an interesting match!

sartrista7
Jul 6th, 2005, 01:07 AM
No, it's been remarkable how little she's been affected by it. I think that's mostly because of the reasons behind it - she knows exactly WHY she lost 0-6 0-6 and it was nothing to do with her game. So she can move on quite easily.

She hasn't actually had a bad loss since, actually. Clijsters beat everyone there was to beat in the IW/Miami swing. Sharapova is not ready, and may not be ready for a few years yet, to beat the likes of Henin-Hardenne and Schnyder on clay; anyone who thought she would was a little deluded. And we all know how well Venus played at Wimbledon.

Rtael
Jul 6th, 2005, 01:10 AM
But regardless of whether you think the loss affected her or not, the point remains that she hasn't won any really big titles this year. There was the Tier I at Tokyo, but that traditionally has never had a strong field and was at the very beginning of the year. Unless she wants to be demoted back down to the "pretender" list instead of being a "contender" she needs to start beating the top players more often.

Knizzle
Jul 6th, 2005, 01:21 AM
I think losses like ones to Davenport, Kim, and Venus just display that Maria seems not to know what to do when seriously challenged. Against Lindsay she mouthed the words "she's getting everything back" with a helpless look on her face. She had no plan B to stop Lindsay.

xan
Jul 6th, 2005, 01:57 AM
No, it's been remarkable how little she's been affected by it. I think that's mostly because of the reasons behind it - she knows exactly WHY she lost 0-6 0-6 and it was nothing to do with her game. So she can move on quite easily.

She hasn't actually had a bad loss since, actually. Clijsters beat everyone there was to beat in the IW/Miami swing. Sharapova is not ready, and may not be ready for a few years yet, to beat the likes of Henin-Hardenne and Schnyder on clay; anyone who thought she would was a little deluded. And we all know how well Venus played at Wimbledon.

Good points.

Maria's worst surface is clay. She's learning to play on it, but she's not yet ready to beat the clay masters.

xan
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:10 AM
I think losses like ones to Davenport, Kim, and Venus just display that Maria seems not to know what to do when seriously challenged. Against Lindsay she mouthed the words "she's getting everything back" with a helpless look on her face. She had no plan B to stop Lindsay.

No. Maria knows what to do when seriously challenged. She fights. Sometimes the other player is having their perfect "in the zone" day and its not going to work. Kim came back like a lion in Florida, hitting freely, nothing to lose, glad to be back on tour. She beat everyone she met. It's what Tracey Austin called the "surge" when a player returns free of the pressures of the tour and the weight of expectation. The same happened for Justine on clay, and probably for Venus at Wimbledon.

As far as "no plan B" goes, that can apply to a lot of players, including Lindsay. If the A game is good enough and being eecuted right, a B game is superfluous.

azinna
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:13 AM
She hasn't shown herself ready to beat top players who are gunning for her, who know what she's up to game-wise (not rocket science) and have come out to counter her strengths and attack her weaknesses. It would be great for her to start now getting those scalps again, but I actually give her until early next year to get her stuff together and develop into a more complete player.

By the way, nearly the entire top 10 know how to play very well on hard courts. And remember that American hard courts often reward the more complete player in spades. I see Sharapova's top player scalps coming during the indoor season.

Diesel
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:16 AM
It could have affected other players and their belief in beating her as much as it's affected Maria.

morningglory
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:17 AM
She hasn't shown herself ready to beat top players who are gunning for her, who know what she's up to game-wise (not rocket science) and have come out to counter her strengths and attack her weaknesses
sigh... I think you're right. Last year she was the 'new kid on the block' and so had the element of surprise...
After leading 2-0 in H2Hs the other player's coaches finally found a way to some extent counter her game, but that doesn't mean she can't beat them

VeraNuVirgosFan
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:05 AM
No!!

xan
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:34 AM
She hasn't shown herself ready to beat top players who are gunning for her, who know what she's up to game-wise (not rocket science) and have come out to counter her strengths and attack her weaknesses. It would be great for her to start now getting those scalps again, but I actually give her until early next year to get her stuff together and develop into a more complete player.

By the way, nearly the entire top 10 know how to play very well on hard courts. And remember that American hard courts often reward the more complete player in spades. I see Sharapova's top player scalps coming during the indoor season.

Maria has only had one loss this year so far to a player who hasn't held the Number 1 spot, and that was to Patty on clay. And she beat mary Pierce on clay in Rome.

On hard courts, Maria reached the Semis of the Australian, beating Kuznetsova, was runner up in Miami, having beaten Henin-Hardenne and Venus, and won Doha. So she's not been too sloppy on the concrete this year so far.

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:35 AM
I don't think it affected her at all. She just moved on.

Knizzle
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:42 AM
No. Maria knows what to do when seriously challenged. She fights. Sometimes the other player is having their perfect "in the zone" day and its not going to work. Kim came back like a lion in Florida, hitting freely, nothing to lose, glad to be back on tour. She beat everyone she met. It's what Tracey Austin called the "surge" when a player returns free of the pressures of the tour and the weight of expectation. The same happened for Justine on clay, and probably for Venus at Wimbledon.

As far as "no plan B" goes, that can apply to a lot of players, including Lindsay. If the A game is good enough and being eecuted right, a B game is superfluous.

You act as if Maria is the only one who has had a player come out and swing freely against them. Other players have been able to come back when their opponents come out swinging freely and hitting winners, everytime that happens doesn't mean you automatically are going to lose, but if you have nothing else to throw at that player then I guess you will lose.

cartmancop
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:44 AM
I don't really think any of those losses were bad or too surprising. Maria is still learning on clay, Kim had one hell of a Spring hard court season, & Venus played awesome @ Wimbledon.

It's interesting to think about the Plan B though. Who do u all think has one for every match. I haven't really seen it much since Hingis was playing her best. Say what u want about her, but she had a set gameplan, esp. for the power players & went out with that. If that didn't work she was smart enough to adjust during the changeover & even still continue to make the necessary adjustments. That's why she was competitive for as long as she was b4 the body broke down.

I think Justine is a smart player who makes adjustments midmatch...occasionally

Sharapova, Lindsay, etc. are the type of players who know that if they are playing @ their best, or near it, a plan B isn't necessary. However, all days aren't like that & it shows up more in players with their 'go for the lines' style of play...

Robbie.
Jul 6th, 2005, 04:00 AM
It's interesting to think about the Plan B though. Who do u all think has one for every match.


I think Patty Schnyder is very good at making mid match adjustments, when she's in the frame of mind to fight things out and not simply give up.

Lindsay might not have a plan B, but she, unlike Maria and many of the baseline bashers, is a great strategist. I've heard her referred to as the craftiest player on tour. At first that nomenclature seemed inappropropriate but on closer inspection, perhaps not so much. If there is a weakness in a player Lindsay will find it, and most often has the guns to exploit it. She is one of the few players who actually plays a different tactical game depending on who she is up against.

xan
Jul 6th, 2005, 04:04 AM
You act as if Maria is the only one who has had a player come out and swing freely against them. Other players have been able to come back when their opponents come out swinging freely and hitting winners, everytime that happens doesn't mean you automatically are going to lose, but if you have nothing else to throw at that player then I guess you will lose.

So. Who beat Clijsters in her Florida come-back run?

Who beat Justine in her run on clay from Charleston in April to RG in June?

Answer - NOBODY, not even Davenport.

On their come-back runs these two were too hot for anyone.

Robbie.
Jul 6th, 2005, 04:15 AM
So. Who beat Clijsters in her Florida come-back run?

Who beat Justine in her run on clay from Charleston in April to RG in June?

Answer - NOBODY, not even Davenport.

On their come-back runs these two were too hot for anyone.

Well of course this is true.

Maria had no right to beat Justine on clay. Justine at this stage is much better on clay.

The Clijsters loss, combined with the Davenport loss, really can't be dismissed so easily. You can't avoid using them as barometers of where her game was/is at and can't just dismiss the Clijsters loss because Clijsters was on a hot streak. Those losses tell us that Maria on hardcourts is good, but she's very beatable by other top players.

Fingon
Jul 6th, 2005, 04:25 AM
A first blush, the answer seems, 'no'. She made the Miami final, after all. But since that 6-0 6-0 loss, her record against top players has been. wretched.And that record is somewhat worse than it looks. Miami was Henin-Hardenne's first tournament of the year.


yes, and Charleston was the second and she won it, against Dementieva.

And Venus' woes (pre-Wimbledon) have been well chronicled. Sharapova was a justifiable heavy favorite in both those matches.


interesting how Maria losing to Venus is a bad loss :confused: but for Davenport (the player that beat her 6-0 6-0) losing to the same player is not :scratch:

And the Wimbledon win over Petrova was over a player who is the true 'new Kournikova'. A top ten talent who can't win a tournament.

so she should have lost to Petrova then? what does it prove?

But every tournament where she has to play someone ranked #13 or higher, she's lost since then.

doesn't work does it?, either use the ranking or use the ability, you can't say "top 13" and then qualify your selection.

BTW, her losses were to Kim (who had beaten world's # 1 Davenport 2 weeks before). To Justine (everyone lost to Justine on clay), to Venus (I am not a Venus fan but I don't see that as a bad loss) and to Patty (that on clay could beat Serena).

The jury is still out on this theory because of the surfaces involved. Half the tournaments since IW have been on clay. And even losing to Venus at Wimbledon can't be considered that bad. Venus is far and away the best Wimbledon performer since Graf and Nav.

there you go

However, I'm going to be looking for some big wins over 2005's best performers this summer. She's ranked #2, she wona slam and the YEC. And at 18 years old, she's an adult. Age no longer matters.

that's to be seen. IMO, Maria wasn't fully developed as a player when she won Wimbledon, then she had to develop at a accelerated pace.

One interesting statistic is that most players first win a tier 2 or tier 1 and then a GS.

Maria has gone backwards, after a few tier 3 wins, she wins Wimbledon, then the YEC, then a tier 1 (Tokyo), then a tier 2 (Doha).

In fact, Maria hasn't had many bad losses since winning Wimbledon, Mashona Washington at IW was one, but all the others have been to top players (or nearly). It's expected but because she was the Wimbledon champion, any loss looked shocking, the expections on her raised dramatically and she had to learn on the go.

Now she has it off her back, I don't expect her to have spectacular results right away, but I certainly don't think the US hardcourt season will define her career, after all, she is only 18 ;)

Zauber
Jul 6th, 2005, 05:01 AM
Did she play poorly? However on her service she should have won some games.
Were there any special circumstances? Like night before or who knows.
Or did Davenport simply play out of her mind like she did in one of the Wimbledon finals against Steffi Graf?

Did anyone see it?
I wish i had seen it. I wonder if anyone has a tape of it.
Anyone have any special information.

I am curious.
thank you

Knizzle
Jul 6th, 2005, 05:37 AM
So. Who beat Clijsters in her Florida come-back run?

Who beat Justine in her run on clay from Charleston in April to RG in June?

Answer - NOBODY, not even Davenport.

On their come-back runs these two were too hot for anyone.

Kim lost in her very first tourney back in Antwerp. Justine lost her first touney in Miami. Kim went on to win IW and Miami beating Dementieva, Davenport, Mauiresmo, Myskina, and Sharapova. All players Kim had no real trouble beating ever before, when she did face someone who she had trouble beating before, Venus in Antwerp, she lost. Justine is obviously the best clay courter in the WTA by far, but still she had SO many struggles in her matches, she was actually ripe for the picking, but no one was mentally strong enough to finish her. She had to battle through 11 3 set matches so she was hardly invincible during that time, remember Svetlana had 2 match points to knock her out of the French Open, but failed. Then Justine has a tough loss to Daniliidou in the Wimbledon 1st round. So obviously someone knew how to deal with Justine. It's a credit to Justine that she was able to be mentally stronger than her opponents, but Justine wasn't "too hot" for them.

Volcana
Jul 6th, 2005, 06:35 AM
Just a note, Davenport is NOT a player with NO 'Plan B'. She's just rarely called on to make changes. In the Wimbledon final vs Venus, she started feeding softer, off-speed shots to Venus' forehand, trying to lure VEnus into more errors by not giving her pace. It didn't work, but it WAS an adjustment.
U trying to say ms sharapova cant beat anyone ranked in the top 7?Not at all. I think she beat pretty much anybody on a given day. On a non-clay surface. But before that match, she was doing well against players who are having big years this year, losing only to Serena.

AUS OPEN ........ QTF __5 KUZNETSOVA ........ W 4-6 6-2 6-2
AUS OPEN ........ SMI __7 WILLIAMS, S ....... L 2-6 7-5 8-6
Toray Pan Pacific FNL __1 DAVENPORT ......... W 6-1 3-6 7-6
DOHA ............ FNL __9 MOLIK ............. W 4-6 6-1 6-4
INDIAN WELLS .... QTR _33 PIERCE* ........... W 6-4 6-3

*Did Pierce have her game togther by then?
After that match, there was a distinct drop-off in results. But that drop-off could have been because of the surface, or the typ and quality of the players. Venus and Kim are the best defensive players on the tour. Clay is Sharapova's worst surface.

But the losses also COULD be explained by Sharapova being in a kind of shock since that 6-0 6-0 loss. We haven't enough info to say. By the US Open, it'll be far easier to tell.

WF4EVER
Jul 6th, 2005, 07:10 AM
That's a question only she can answer. But I think those losses were just untimely and have a lot to do with the surface.

As me if I think losing to Venus at Wimby will affect her and I can honestly say that I believe it will. She was shellshocked by Venus. I don't believe she thought she could lose at Wimby at she was rudely awakened by Venus.

I always thought that that 6-0 6-0 loss was due to lack of experience more than anything else. It's like Venus. If you ask Venus if the raina ffects her at Wimby she always says it's something she has come to expect from playing there. I think the cancelling of the match that preceded Lindsay/Sharapova just didn't give her enough time to prepare mentally for the match and she just never got into a groove becuase Lindsay was striking the ball great from the word go. For as muchas I don't like Sharapova I thought that loss was really really weird and since she wasn't injured the only other way I could explain it is lack of mental preparation.

Lindsay might have been in the zone but Sharapova has too good a game to not even hold serve once.

sartrista7
Jul 6th, 2005, 07:17 AM
As me if I think losing to Venus at Wimby will affect her and I can honestly say that I believe it will. She was shellshocked by Venus. I don't believe she thought she could lose at Wimby at she was rudely awakened by Venus.

I agree. This result has more potential to affect Sharapova in the long run because she brought something very close to her A game and was completely outgunned - if anything the scoreline flatters her. It could have been 6-2 6-1. And she wasn't expecting that to happen at the scene of her triumph last year.

The 0-6 0-6 loss is different - Indian Wells is no Wimbledon. And I thought someone else would have mentioned this by now, but it's pretty well known that she was suffering menstrual pains at the time - not an excuse, obviously, but a reason for the lopsided scoreline. If you know you had something like that hindering your performance, you're not going to beat yourself up too badly over the result. And in any case - she still leads the head-to-had with Davenport.

I really don't see too much difference between her pre-IW results and post-IW results. She's running into the elite players earlier, and so doesn't get a chance to play the Kuznetsova/Molik level players whom she'd be expected to beat.

switz
Jul 6th, 2005, 08:16 AM
not really. her game is just not suited to clay at all because she has no variety. she was able to overpower patty for a set on clay but eventually it became hard to keep so manner good shots and once her game dropped a notch patty made her look foolish.

i think her level hasn't dropped much and she certainly is going to be a threat in every US tournament because she turns up every week ready to play.

bandabou
Jul 6th, 2005, 11:51 AM
No...I think the two losses that are affecting her are the two SF she lost this year to the sisters....first in Australia, she served twice for the match, had mp....still couldn't get it done. Against Venus, really she was just outplayed totally and completely....and that on grass, must be a rude awakening as someone said.

tennnisfannn
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:29 PM
But regardless of whether you think the loss affected her or not, the point remains that she hasn't won any really big titles this year. There was the Tier I at Tokyo, but that traditionally has never had a strong field and was at the very beginning of the year. Unless she wants to be demoted back down to the "pretender" list instead of being a "contender" she needs to start beating the top players more often.
You could also argue that none of the others have also gone on tear. Lindsay has been consistent but this year she has only managed to win a couple tier 2s, nothing higher.
None of the others are aslo winning that many titles, only Justine seems to be on some mini tear, winning two tier 1 and a slam but still managed to lose to a slumping eleni danilidou.
venus did exactly what maria did last year, come from a modest seeding to grab the title!
This year unlike the last few, there are many more contenders for the title in very tourny and no one has managed a really big winning streak against the top players.
if maria has any dissapointments it has to be wimbledon coz she has stated it the is tourny she wants to win over and over and over. But then venus also wants the same for this tourny.
the USO is coming and it will be all guns balzing. serena will be playing like a woman scorned and so will justine. Lindsay will be going for it tooth and nail, kim and amelie will want in on the action, venus, a confident venus is going to be very difficult to stop, maria will want in on the piece of pie.
For the next win, it will take an incredibled draw and tonnes of luck for anyone to come thru it unscathed.

Kart
Jul 6th, 2005, 02:37 PM
I think losses like ones to Davenport, Kim, and Venus just display that Maria seems not to know what to do when seriously challenged.

I think this is very true.

Maria has a serious intimidation factor against a lot of players. It is an important part of her game.

Seeing Venus, Lindsay, Kim and Justine all take her on without being intimidated cancels that out to an extent and puts her on the back foot. I suspect she's not that used to dealing with that yet.

It's all inexperience really - she's only really been recognised as a top flight player for 12 months or so now.

cheo23
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:40 PM
NO...the Thing is that ...she's having a DIFFicult TIME DEfEating Lindsay, Venus & SERENA 3 TIMes IN a ROW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Get it TOGETHER People!!!!!!!!!!! SHe'll BE BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

cheo23
Jul 6th, 2005, 03:50 PM
. Against Venus, really she was just outplayed totally and completely....and that on grass, must be a rude awakening as someone said.
Last year, When Miss Maria SHarapova "OutPlayed SERENA Totally & Completely" U didn't SEe it As that...U were saying...she was "NERvous"..a "Step Slow" etc..No Talk of "just Outplayed Totally & Completely" :retard: :rolleyes:

Doc
Jul 6th, 2005, 05:01 PM
I agree. This result has more potential to affect Sharapova in the long run because she brought something very close to her A game and was completely outgunned - if anything the scoreline flatters her. It could have been 6-2 6-1. And she wasn't expecting that to happen at the scene of her triumph last year.
Nonsense. Did you watch the first set at all? Maria played amazing tennis. And was just pipped by Venus paying her best tennis for over two years. venus was hitting everything in, with enormous power, and moving better than most commentators had seen her move, and Maria stayed with her. It took unbelievable, almost impossible shots from Venus to gain that one break of Maria's serve in the 5th game. And Masha broke back to level at 6 all. If Venus had played like she did in the Final, Maria would probably have stomped her in two sets.

Maria will be disappointed by losing, but it will help her to concentrate more on he importance of the tiebreak. if she'd won that tiebreak, the whole match aspect would have been different. Maria knows she lost to a very dangerous grass court player on the top of her form.

The 0-6 0-6 loss is different - Indian Wells is no Wimbledon. And I thought someone else would have mentioned this by now, but it's pretty well known that she was suffering menstrual pains at the time - not an excuse, obviously, but a reason for the lopsided scoreline. If you know you had something like that hindering your performance, you're not going to beat yourself up too badly over the result. And in any case - she still leads the head-to-had with Davenport.

I really don't see too much difference between her pre-IW results and post-IW results. She's running into the elite players earlier, and so doesn't get a chance to play the Kuznetsova/Molik level players whom she'd be expected to beat.

Yes. Maria has just run into some top players at the top of their form recently, often on clay. But her play at Wimbledon was great. She is actually a better player than last year, and even better results should surely come.

Knizzle
Jul 6th, 2005, 05:17 PM
Nonsense. Did you watch the first set at all? Maria played amazing tennis. And was just pipped by Venus paying her best tennis for over two years. venus was hitting everything in, with enormous power, and moving better than most commentators had seen her move, and Maria stayed with her. It took unbelievable, almost impossible shots from Venus to gain that one break of Maria's serve in the 5th game. And Masha broke back to level at 6 all. If Venus had played like she did in the Final, Maria would probably have stomped her in two sets.

Ummmmm......I know we're really used to seeing Venus play badly since the stomach injury, but this is TYPICAL Venus Williams tennis. This is not some superhuman performance that Venus has never done before. I'm sick of hearing that Maria would have stomped Venus in 2 sets cause it's not true if Venus played like what she did in the final it would have been a tight 3 set match just like the final was and also Venus' level had something to do with Lindsay who played a better tactical match against Vee than Maria did. Maria fed Vee just what she likes and Lindsay didn't do that every shot. Venus was fighting to the bitter end this Wimbledon so there would have been NO stomping going on BELIEVE THAT. Just for the record in that 3-2 game where Venus broke the shots that she hit weren't out of the ordinary. Maybe you never saw anyone attack against Maria like that, but that's how Venus aims to play the only difference now is that Venus found her confidence again.

Maria will be disappointed by losing, but it will help her to concentrate more on he importance of the tiebreak. if she'd won that tiebreak, the whole match aspect would have been different. Maria knows she lost to a very dangerous grass court player on the top of her form.

Great

Yes. Maria has just run into some top players at the top of their form recently, often on clay. But her play at Wimbledon was great. She is actually a better player than last year, and even better results should surely come.
What bad luck for Maria. She has to expect this now. My favorites have run into alot of players at the top of their game so you just have to deal with it.

Infiniti2001
Jul 6th, 2005, 05:26 PM
Hey knizzle, I'm thinking some of Maria's fans never saw Venus play before last year and earlier this year when she was clearly struggling :shrug:

Lady
Jul 6th, 2005, 06:07 PM
I watched Maria vs Venus match thanks to Knizzle and 40-0 and Venus just really played like her normal old self! Actually I have seen her playing better then that! :p
The difference was confidence! Venus finally got that winning feeling again.

And Venus played really really well in the final, it's just Lindsay played different game then Maria.

goldenlox
Jul 6th, 2005, 06:48 PM
Hey knizzle, I'm thinking some of Maria's fans never saw Venus play before last year and earlier this year when she was clearly struggling :shrug:I saw Venus beat Sveta in the Warsaw final in 2004.
And she beat Vera decisively on green clay. Venus was very good last spring.

Maria was beaten by a better player, who has much more court coverage.
Justine is a better player also.
Kim might be better, she wins when they play.
Maria still hasn't played the "good" Serena of 2002 & 2003.

Infiniti2001
Jul 6th, 2005, 07:26 PM
You're not included in that "some" goldenlox :)

GorgeousMe!
Jul 6th, 2005, 07:57 PM
It must have affected Maria. She said herself she knew what it felt like to lose like that.

But for me the real reason Maria has not done so well this year is taht last year was a fluke. Serena was not herself in the Wimbly final and Maria had a moment. She may have another one, but I believe that she wont have as many as her fans, or corporate sponsors, think.