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View Full Version : Do people not realize just how incredible JHH is??


Davenselesport
Jun 6th, 2005, 12:28 AM
Let's review shal we:

MIAMI

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R128 BYE
R64 H2H SPEARS, ABIGAIL USA 78 W 6-4 6-3
R32 H2H LLAGOSTERA VIVES, NURIA ESP 72 W 6-3 6-2
R16 H2H (7) MOLIK, ALICIA AUS 8 W 6-4 2-6 6-2
Q H2H (2) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 3 L 6-1 6-7(6) 6-2


CHARLESTON (unseeded)

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R64 H2H (10) JANKOVIC, JELENA SCG 20 W 5-7 6-4 6-3
R32 H2H PENG, SHUAI CHN 48 W 6-2 4-6 6-4
R16 H2H BENESOVA, IVETA CZE 51 W 6-2 6-3
Q H2H (1) DAVENPORT, LINDSAY USA 1 W 3-6 6-3 1-0 ret.
S H2H (13) GOLOVIN, TATIANA FRA 25 W 7-6(4) 7-5
F H2H (2) DEMENTIEVA, ELENA RUS 5 W 7-5 6-4


WARSAW (unseeded)

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R32 H2H (L) CHLADKOVA, DENISA CZE 56 W 6-2 6-2
R16 H2H VENTO-KABCHI, MARIA VEN 58 W 6-3 7-5
Q H2H (4) SCHNYDER, PATTY SUI 13 W 6-1 6-2
S H2H (0) IVANOVIC, ANA SCG 37 W 6-4 7-5
F H2H (2) KUZNETSOVA, SVETLANA RUS 7 W 3-6 6-2 7-5


BERLIN

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R64 H2H BENESOVA, IVETA CZE 58 W 7-5 4-6 6-1
R32 H2H KIRILENKO, MARIA RUS 48 W 2-6 6-1 6-3
R16 H2H (Q) PESCHKE, KVETA CZE 67 W 4-6 6-4 6-2
Q H2H (1) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 2 W 6-2 6-4
S H2H (7) SCHNYDER, PATTY SUI 13 W 6-0 6-1
F H2H (6) PETROVA, NADIA RUS 12 W 6-3 4-6 6-3


FRENCH OPEN

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R128 H2H MARTINEZ, CONCHITA ESP 45 W 6-0 4-6 6-4
R64 H2H RUANO PASCUAL, VIRGINIA ESP 66 W 6-1 6-4
R32 H2H MEDINA GARRIGUES, ANABEL ESP 34 W 4-6 6-2 6-3
R16 H2H (6) KUZNETSOVA, SVETLANA RUS 7 W 7-6(6) 4-6 7-5
Q H2H (2) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 2 W 6-4 6-2
S H2H (7) PETROVA, NADIA RUS 9 W 6-2 6-3
F H2H (21) PIERCE, MARY FRA 23 W 6-1 6-1


Whoever counts her out of Wimbledon is :cuckoo:

PointBlank
Jun 6th, 2005, 01:14 AM
She cant beat Maria at Wimbledon. Grass suits Maria much better, And she will have a tough time with Serena on it. Clay is just her surface and she did amazing on it this year.

VeeReeDavJCap81
Jun 6th, 2005, 01:17 AM
She is amazing on clay. She's great on other surfaces, but she can't dominate on grass and hardcourts like she can on clay.

Davenselesport
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:09 AM
Right... I suppose Wimbledon will be the toughest for her to win... its the only one left she needs

Jakeev
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:21 AM
Morever, I am just not sure how much energy Justine will have left for Wimbledon.

I think Carlos Rodriquez said she should probably take several weeks off to rest her body after she has such a tough albiet successful clay-court season.

Frankly, I think Justine's best bet at Wimbledon is a easier draw in the early rounds which could preserve some energy for the tougher opponents ahead.

Justeenium
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:31 AM
She beat Kim Clijsters twice on hardcourts in 2003 and some people think Justine can't dominate on hardcourt???

:lol:

Veritas
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:35 AM
I think people underestimate JHH on grass. She's won in the Netherlands before, and pre-2003, her best GS results came at Wimbledon anyway. She'll do well there...provided she doesn't get a nightmare draw (e.g. going up against Serena, Lindsay or Maria in the QF).

felipe2004
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:38 AM
Let's review shal we:

MIAMI

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R128 BYE
R64 H2H SPEARS, ABIGAIL USA 78 W 6-4 6-3
R32 H2H LLAGOSTERA VIVES, NURIA ESP 72 W 6-3 6-2
R16 H2H (7) MOLIK, ALICIA AUS 8 W 6-4 2-6 6-2
Q H2H (2) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 3 L 6-1 6-7(6) 6-2


CHARLESTON (unseeded)

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R64 H2H (10) JANKOVIC, JELENA SCG 20 W 5-7 6-4 6-3
R32 H2H PENG, SHUAI CHN 48 W 6-2 4-6 6-4
R16 H2H BENESOVA, IVETA CZE 51 W 6-2 6-3
Q H2H (1) DAVENPORT, LINDSAY USA 1 W 3-6 6-3 1-0 ret.
S H2H (13) GOLOVIN, TATIANA FRA 25 W 7-6(4) 7-5
F H2H (2) DEMENTIEVA, ELENA RUS 5 W 7-5 6-4


WARSAW (unseeded)

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R32 H2H (L) CHLADKOVA, DENISA CZE 56 W 6-2 6-2
R16 H2H VENTO-KABCHI, MARIA VEN 58 W 6-3 7-5
Q H2H (4) SCHNYDER, PATTY SUI 13 W 6-1 6-2
S H2H (0) IVANOVIC, ANA SCG 37 W 6-4 7-5
F H2H (2) KUZNETSOVA, SVETLANA RUS 7 W 3-6 6-2 7-5


BERLIN

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R64 H2H BENESOVA, IVETA CZE 58 W 7-5 4-6 6-1
R32 H2H KIRILENKO, MARIA RUS 48 W 2-6 6-1 6-3
R16 H2H (Q) PESCHKE, KVETA CZE 67 W 4-6 6-4 6-2
Q H2H (1) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 2 W 6-2 6-4
S H2H (7) SCHNYDER, PATTY SUI 13 W 6-0 6-1
F H2H (6) PETROVA, NADIA RUS 12 W 6-3 4-6 6-3


FRENCH OPEN

Rnd Opponent Rank W/L Score
R128 H2H MARTINEZ, CONCHITA ESP 45 W 6-0 4-6 6-4
R64 H2H RUANO PASCUAL, VIRGINIA ESP 66 W 6-1 6-4
R32 H2H MEDINA GARRIGUES, ANABEL ESP 34 W 4-6 6-2 6-3
R16 H2H (6) KUZNETSOVA, SVETLANA RUS 7 W 7-6(6) 4-6 7-5
Q H2H (2) SHARAPOVA, MARIA RUS 2 W 6-4 6-2
S H2H (7) PETROVA, NADIA RUS 9 W 6-2 6-3
F H2H (21) PIERCE, MARY FRA 23 W 6-1 6-1


Whoever counts her out of Wimbledon is :cuckoo:
yes, she's 27-1 this year: 96,43% winning percentage :)

@m@nd@
Jun 6th, 2005, 03:01 AM
i realized how incredible she is on clay :)

wateva
Jun 6th, 2005, 03:05 AM
clay and grass are 2 totally different surfaces. justine needs some top seeds to be upset early (maria, serena, lindsay) to have a chance at the title. won't count her out though. :)

jenny161185
Jun 6th, 2005, 03:55 AM
Id go for Justine against Lindsay defo I cant wait shes great on fast surfaces too gotta love the grass season .................. night!

ginger_fish668
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:20 AM
Justine's amazing....on clay. Great on hardcourts as well.

But she just isn't the best on grass. No one's counting her out of Wimbledon, but the odds of her winning aren't too good. There's Lindsay, Maria, Serena...etc.

VeeDaQueen
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:38 AM
2-6 2-6 Wimbledon '03 :)

skanky~skanketta
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:48 AM
i dont know why people are saying she cant beat lindsay on grass. i'm pretty sure she can. she beat her on hardcourts and lindsay is terrific on hard.

well whatever, i'll just wait till wimbledon is over.

skanky~skanketta
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:48 AM
2-6 2-6 Wimbledon '03 :)

get the score right. thats not.

rue
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:49 AM
Justine plays really well on grass. People should remember that her first grandslam final was at Wimbledon and that she has reached the semis there too in previous years. She is a champion and will find a way to get through her matches.

Julia1968
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:54 AM
Whoever counts her out of Wimbledon is :cuckoo:

Yes, you are correct. Considering she's won two grand slam events on hardcourt, two on clay, and made the finals and semifinals at Wimbledon, Justine is threat whatever surface she plays on.

She is by far the toughest mentally on tour to date.

No one in the top ten can stake claim to Justine's win/loss record.

I'm excited for her chances at Wimbledon. Other than Sharapova and Davenport standing in her way, she should do very well. And add tons of points this Wimby since she didn't play last year.

VeeDaQueen
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:59 AM
get the score right. thats not.

oh sorry, 3-6 2-6. :haha:

tennischick
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:00 AM
Right... I suppose Wimbledon will be the toughest for her to win... its the only one left she needs
she'll get it -- it's just a matter of time. she has an awesome will to win :worship:

Berlin_Calling
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:08 AM
i cant wait till Justine proves the haters wrong :haha:

Jakeev
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:21 AM
i cant wait till Justine proves the haters wrong :haha:

Uh who is hating Justine? This has been nothing but an objective view about Justine and Wimbledon.

Sheesh.:rolleyes:

ginger_fish668
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:23 AM
Uh who is hating Justine? This has been nothing but an objective view about Justine and Wimbledon.

Sheesh.:rolleyes:


Exactly. :)

deja_entendu
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:38 AM
Uh who is hating Justine? This has been nothing but an objective view about Justine and Wimbledon.

objective?

Lady
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:40 AM
Nobody predicted that she will go unbeaten on clay this year!
Nobody believed that she can go unbeaten on summer hard in 2003.

So really that's just the way it is in GM.

The thing is that she's 27-1 this year, has the most titles on tour this year, and yet she played well in about only 6-7 matches. :p

Juju #1
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:41 AM
Uh who is hating Justine? This has been nothing but an objective view about Justine and Wimbledon.

Sheesh.:rolleyes:


Yeah, very objective...It sounds to me that she would have better chances on grass if she had bad results on clay. And that logic is :tape:

Jakeev
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:44 AM
Well since there are threads of Williams fans thinking Justine fans say Justine is a shoo in to win Wimbledon, I guess objective was the wrong word:rolleyes:
Guess Chrispy was sort of right, but fan groups are already starting the shit......

Crazy Canuck
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:07 AM
She is amazing on clay. She's great on other surfaces, but she can't dominate on grass and hardcourts like she can on clay.
I'd say that her summer hardcourt season of 2003 was pretty dominant :shrug:

VeeDaQueen
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:12 AM
I'd say that her summer hardcourt season of 2003 was pretty dominant :shrug:

Guess who was missing Summer 2003 :wavey:

!<blocparty>!
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:15 AM
Whoever counts her out of Wimbledon is :cuckoo:

Some of us also know the difference between Grass and Clay.

I don't think anyone is 'counting her out'. She, like other players, will always have a great chance but isn't among the top favourites (in some peoples opinions, including mine. :) )

Other players have games that suit grass MUCH better than the red dirt.

pigam
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:17 AM
lol @ people wishing her an easy draw at wimbledon. Those people clearly don't know Justine :)

Lady
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:33 AM
I'd say that her summer hardcourt season of 2003 was pretty dominant :shrug:

And the begginning of the 2004 too! ;)



And she doesn't have to be dominant on grass, she just need to win only 7 matches.

Lady
Jun 6th, 2005, 07:35 AM
But the thing is Justine even doesn't wanna be THE favourite for Wimby, she's gladly give this honour to Serena, Maria, anyone actually.

Justine said pretty honestly - The favourites are created to get them OUT of the tournament, so I just don't get why some Ju fans want to see her in the role of the favourite! :)

Justine Fan
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:32 AM
She beat Kim Clijsters twice on hardcourts in 2003 and some people think Justine can't dominate on hardcourt???

:lol:

What about that epic match with Capriati in USO 2003? That was hardcourt and that was an amazing win - mind you so was the final. I think she has a chance at most GS's because she is an all-round player!

justine&coria
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:34 AM
I don't understand people saying Justine just have a little chance at Wimbledon.
The last years, she's got beaten by the bests (Serena and Venus) playing close to their best!
Sharapova didn't have to face an in-form Serena. Yet, some people act as if she's among the best players ever on grass.
And Justine was nowhere near to the level she is now. Did you see her serve against Pierce ? She volleys well, defends well etc. And now, she has the intimidation factor, and she might not be afraid of the Williams anymore, like she was the last years (at least, I hope so).

Grass suits Justine well : Justine's done well on grass before. I personaly think she's as good on clay than on grass. But Serena and Venus at their best are/were just better.

Justine can take advantage of Sharapova's lack of movement. That's why I think it's less difficult for Justine to beat Sharapova than even a not-good Serena.

Some people are just :rolleyes: : because Justine's good on clay, because she's won RG, she won't win Wimbledon! :rolleyes:
I'm not saying she's THE favourite, but ... If Serena plays like last year against Sharapova, there's lot of chance, that Justine'll pass her. (but I'm sure, Serena won't !!)

What I'm a bit scared about, is that if Justine wants to win Wimby, she'll have to extend her winning streak to 31 ! :scared: :bolt:

Andy T
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:37 AM
Beating 4 grand slam champions (including two reigning ones) en route to the RG title is pretty impressive.

saki
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:54 AM
There's no point in arguing with the nay-sayers. They're the same people who said "Justine can't beat Kim on hardcourt", "she can't win a match on hardcourt", "she can't win a tournament on hardcourt", "she can't win a slam on hardcourt" and Justine has proved them wrong every time.

Justine has an excellent game for grass - before 2003, her best GS results were at Wimbledon and her win-loss record on grass is right up there with her clay win-loss record. The difference between the surfaces isn't Justine's ability as much as it is the fact that there is only Serena who comes close to Justine on clay but there are three players in Serena, Maria and Lindsay (and four, if Venus should happen to hit form again) who are close/equal to/better than Justine on grass. After such an exhausting clay season, I'm not sure that Justine will win Wimbledon this year but she's a top contender up with the other three and I'd put money (real money, not Vcash) on her winning it someday.

DEETHELICK
Jun 6th, 2005, 10:44 AM
She is incredible.

If my fave Elena D had a tenth of the mental strength and grit Justine possesses then Elena would have RG and the maybe the USO in her GS kitty and the abuility to employ her new serve consistently.

Justine has raised the bar for mental strength. She has displayed superb mental tenacity, that is right up there with greats like Evert, Graf, Seles and ASV, all known for their mental strength.

Serena and Maria are close, but Maria has just begun and Serena has been losing focus recently.

rottweily
Jun 6th, 2005, 10:49 AM
She cant beat Maria at Wimbledon. Grass suits Maria much better, And she will have a tough time with Serena on it. Clay is just her surface and she did amazing on it this year.

Do you wanna bet on that?

rikvanlooy
Jun 6th, 2005, 10:53 AM
I don't understand people saying Justine just have a little chance at Wimbledon.
The last years, she's got beaten by the bests (Serena and Venus) playing close to their best!
Sharapova didn't have to face an in-form Serena. Yet, some people act as if she's among the best players ever on grass.
And Justine was nowhere near to the level she is now. Did you see her serve against Pierce ? She volleys well, defends well etc. And now, she has the intimidation factor, and she might not be afraid of the Williams anymore, like she was the last years (at least, I hope so).

Grass suits Justine well : Justine's done well on grass before. I personaly think she's as good on clay than on grass. But Serena and Venus at their best are/were just better.

Justine can take advantage of Sharapova's lack of movement. That's why I think it's less difficult for Justine to beat Sharapova than even a not-good Serena.

Some people are just :rolleyes: : because Justine's good on clay, because she's won RG, she won't win Wimbledon! :rolleyes:
I'm not saying she's THE favourite, but ... If Serena plays like last year against Sharapova, there's lot of chance, that Justine'll pass her. (but I'm sure, Serena won't !!)

What I'm a bit scared about, is that if Justine wants to win Wimby, she'll have to extend her winning streak to 31 ! :scared: :bolt:

Hm, i had a look at the serve statistics of JHH and, well, they are incredible.

JHH had the fastest serve : 194 km per hour and her average was a staggering 180. Nobody comes even close with that kind of average. She served 20 km per hour faster than Mary Pierce and 15 km per hour faster than Sharapova.

JHH has a very good return of serve (the serve of Sharapova was taken apart).

JHH has a good volley.

JHH has a low center of gravity.

Sharapova was telling everybody that she was outserved by JHH in their last match and

what's the conclusion :

JHH hasn't got a chance against Sharapova on grass.

We will see about that. If JHH serves like she did against Sharapova and Pierce nobody is going to stop her from winning Wimbledon.

rottweily
Jun 6th, 2005, 10:54 AM
clay and grass are 2 totally different surfaces. justine needs some top seeds to be upset early (maria, serena, lindsay) to have a chance at the title. won't count her out though. :)

Justine needs nothing. The higher the seed the better she plays.

rikvanlooy
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:04 AM
Justine needs nothing. The higher the seed the better she plays.

Right on, man, she had very tough draws and she always won, so ...

Who really thinks Davenport is going to win against JHH in this kind of form ? Davenport lost all of her matches against JHH since 2003 AND I don't think JHH is going to give her the match like Kim did at RG.

JHH is a mental rock and the biggest fighter.

Is Davenport ready for a 3 hours fight with JHH and doess she have the mental strength to win ?

Geisha
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:08 AM
I think a lot of you guys are overreacting at Justine's dominance. Think, to win her second Grand Slam, she had to beat, IMO, one good player- Svetlana Kuznetsova. Petrova is practically a pushover against the top players and Pierce is still returning to form and was WAY lower than her best in the finals.

Justine played 13 three-set matches this year already. She won 12 of those matches, which is an amazing feat, but she went to three sets with Kirilenko, Benesova, Peschke, Peng, Garrigues. Those are not dominant figures.

She never played any great claycourters here- Jennifer, Serena, Amelie, would have given her a lot more trouble and she didn't have to play any of them. Not to mention she was losing to Lindsay Davenport before Lindsay got injured in the QF.

Don't get me wrong, Justine has been the best player on tour this year, but what I am trying to say is that she has had zip competition. Her best wins were over Patty Schnyder and Maria Sharapova- that's not saying much. If you want to look at good, tier I dominance, look at Venus in 2001, the summer hardcourt season from Wimbledon to the US Open- one loss, to Meghann Shaughnessy, but wins over Davenport, Serena, Justine, Kim, Jennifer, and a lot of others.

Allez-H
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:10 AM
I can't believe some people are acting as if Justine is toast on grass against all the Big Babes. Justine's game actually suits the grass extremly well and she has proved in previous years that she's a real contender on it. Now her game even suits the grass more, her serve has gotten much better, she comes to net much more ( just look at her match agains Molik this year where she had some like 23/32 net approaches ---> ain't too shabby), mentally she's much more tougher, she's got a very speedy game and she's just a better ballplayer then she used to be. I don't say she'll win it this year, it might come too early and she might still be tired but I'm positive that she'll win it one day.

pigam
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:12 AM
to answer the initial question: some people do, some people don't :p allez ;)

Allez-H
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:13 AM
I think a lot of you guys are overreacting at Justine's dominance. Think, to win her second Grand Slam, she had to beat, IMO, one good player- Svetlana Kuznetsova. Petrova is practically a pushover against the top players and Pierce is still returning to form and was WAY lower than her best in the finals.

Justine played 13 three-set matches this year already. She won 12 of those matches, which is an amazing feat, but she went to three sets with Kirilenko, Benesova, Peschke, Peng, Garrigues. Those are not dominant figures.

She never played any great claycourters here- Jennifer, Serena, Amelie, would have given her a lot more trouble and she didn't have to play any of them. Not to mention she was losing to Lindsay Davenport before Lindsay got injured in the QF.

Don't get me wrong, Justine has been the best player on tour this year, but what I am trying to say is that she has had zip competition. Her best wins were over Patty Schnyder and Maria Sharapova- that's not saying much. If you want to look at good, tier I dominance, look at Venus in 2001, the summer hardcourt season from Wimbledon to the US Open- one loss, to Meghann Shaughnessy, but wins over Davenport, Serena, Justine, Kim, Jennifer, and a lot of others.
Svetlana twice, Nadia twice, Elena D :shrug: zip competion :shrug:

rikvanlooy
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:17 AM
I think a lot of you guys are overreacting at Justine's dominance. Think, to win her second Grand Slam, she had to beat, IMO, one good player- Svetlana Kuznetsova. Petrova is practically a pushover against the top players and Pierce is still returning to form and was WAY lower than her best in the finals.

Justine played 13 three-set matches this year already. She won 12 of those matches, which is an amazing feat, but she went to three sets with Kirilenko, Benesova, Peschke, Peng, Garrigues. Those are not dominant figures.

She never played any great claycourters here- Jennifer, Serena, Amelie, would have given her a lot more trouble and she didn't have to play any of them. Not to mention she was losing to Lindsay Davenport before Lindsay got injured in the QF.

Don't get me wrong, Justine has been the best player on tour this year, but what I am trying to say is that she has had zip competition. Her best wins were over Patty Schnyder and Maria Sharapova- that's not saying much. If you want to look at good, tier I dominance, look at Venus in 2001, the summer hardcourt season from Wimbledon to the US Open- one loss, to Meghann Shaughnessy, but wins over Davenport, Serena, Justine, Kim, Jennifer, and a lot of others.

LOL LOL LOL LOL LOL

Who is on top of the list of top 5 wins, top 10 wins and top 20 wins ?

Look, saying, that winning against number 1, 2, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, ... of the ranking doesn't mean anything is saying : ****** .

Your statement is the same as saying : all those wins of Navratilova and Everts don't mean anything. They only had to beat ONE good player (what was true in those days).

Geisha
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:19 AM
Svetlana twice, Nadia twice, Elena D :shrug: zip competion :shrug:

That is competition, but not dominant competition. Come on, now, Nadia? She's a pushover to the top players. Elena D.? Okay, I can say that was a good win and so were the two against Svetlana.

Let's compare Justine's five tournaments to Serena's five tournaments until the end of the French Open.

Justine wins four titles (Charleston, Warsaw, Berlin, FO)
27-1 win/loss record
wins over: Svetlana x2, Elena Dementieva, Nadia Petrova, Schnyder, Lindsay, Maria x2.

Serena wins three titles (Scottsdale, Miami, Rome, FO)
28-2 win/loss record
wins over: Hingis x2, Venus x2, Capriati x4, Mauresmo, JHH.

I would much rather have Serena's ONE less title and ONE more loss, with wins over current or previous or futures #1 players (Jen, Venus, Marti, JHH, Momo), than have Justine's Tier II wins over Dementieva, Petrova, Kuznetsova, Schnyder, and her two good wins over Maria. That's all. I just think Serena's record is a lot more impressive.

pigam
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:26 AM
That is competition, but not dominant competition. Come on, now, Nadia? She's a pushover to the top players. Elena D.? Okay, I can say that was a good win and so were the two against Svetlana.

Let's compare Justine's five tournaments to Serena's five tournaments until the end of the French Open.

Justine wins four titles (Charleston, Warsaw, Berlin, FO)
27-1 win/loss record
wins over: Svetlana x2, Elena Dementieva, Nadia Petrova, Schnyder, Lindsay, Maria x2.

Serena wins three titles (Scottsdale, Miami, Rome, FO)
28-2 win/loss record
wins over: Hingis x2, Venus x2, Capriati x4, Mauresmo, JHH.

I would much rather have Serena's ONE less title and ONE more loss, with wins over current or previous or futures #1 players (Jen, Venus, Marti, JHH, Momo), than have Justine's Tier II wins over Dementieva, Petrova, Kuznetsova, Schnyder, and her two good wins over Maria. That's all. I just think Serena's record is a lot more impressive.

:yeah: go mary go!!

rottweily
Jun 6th, 2005, 11:30 AM
You forget one thing Serena was at 100%.
Justine just partially recovered from a virus.

Allez-H
Jun 6th, 2005, 12:33 PM
That is competition, but not dominant competition. Come on, now, Nadia? She's a pushover to the top players. Elena D.? Okay, I can say that was a good win and so were the two against Svetlana.

Let's compare Justine's five tournaments to Serena's five tournaments until the end of the French Open.

Justine wins four titles (Charleston, Warsaw, Berlin, FO)
27-1 win/loss record
wins over: Svetlana x2, Elena Dementieva, Nadia Petrova, Schnyder, Lindsay, Maria x2.

Serena wins three titles (Scottsdale, Miami, Rome, FO)
28-2 win/loss record
wins over: Hingis x2, Venus x2, Capriati x4, Mauresmo, JHH.

I would much rather have Serena's ONE less title and ONE more loss, with wins over current or previous or futures #1 players (Jen, Venus, Marti, JHH, Momo), than have Justine's Tier II wins over Dementieva, Petrova, Kuznetsova, Schnyder, and her two good wins over Maria. That's all. I just think Serena's record is a lot more impressive.
Yeah but where's Hingis, Venus, Capriati Mauresmo and Serena? Either they're retired, injured or just didn't win the matches that they to win in orde to play Justine. And that's a pity for them :shrug: Justine beat everyone who was in her way. If you're gonna start talking like that Serena's win at the AO wasn't all that impressive either since Justine, Kim and Jennifer weren't there. Justine beat the players she had to beat and they're were some pretty good players betwen them. Kuzi 2x, nadia 2x (you underestimate Nadia too much, I suggest you whatch her final against Justine in Berlin), Elena D, Maria 2X, Molik,... Those are the best players she can play right now and they aren't the easiest, certainly when you come back after a long lay-of.

bandabou
Jun 6th, 2005, 12:56 PM
No news....Justine on clay is just dominating whereas she isn´t DOMINATING on other surfaces, there are more players who can give her trouble on grass,hardcourts, etc..

alibaby
Jun 6th, 2005, 01:10 PM
Justine needs nothing. The higher the seed the better she plays.
absolutely!and just a little point for all those williams lovers:i know,they will crush me fo that,but fact is:the difference between justine and the williams girls is,that she is MUCH,MUCH more focused on her tennis!!and NOT(like serena),about themselves,their own clothes connection,or whatever!!AND i never heard of justine saying,she did not even know her opponent(like venus vs sesil),even more disappointing for the fact,that sesil is by far no "no-name"player anymore a long time before!!that shows that they care more about themselves than their sport!but,why should they?they already have anything!!but,dont get me wrong,i dont hate them,i know,they do some charity work.its just a statement.i just want to get those "superfans"come down a bit more!i have been reading these threads for some time now,and i just wanted to give my thoughts...

Junex
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:29 PM
But the thing is Justine even doesn't wanna be THE favourite for Wimby, she's gladly give this honour to Serena, Maria, anyone actually.

Justine said pretty honestly - The favourites are created to get them OUT of the tournament, so I just don't get why some Ju fans want to see her in the role of the favourite! :)


I never!!!!

I always love to support the underdog.

so i dnt really care if people would make a big fuss over who is favorite or not to win wimby.

DA FOREHAND
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:42 PM
She beat Kim Clijsters twice on hardcourts in 2003 and some people think Justine can't dominate on hardcourt???

:lol:

It reamains to be seen if she can dominate on a hardcourt.

LOL at the poster who said she cant beat Maria on grass, and even struggles against Serena....Struggling would be losing in a third set, Serena blitzed her in two quick easy sets. How many times has Maria beaten Justine on gras?? :confused:

She can't beat Serena on grass, and would probably struggle against Maria.

rottweily
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:47 PM
It reamains to be seen if she can dominate on a hardcourt.

LOL at the poster who said she cant beat Maria on grass, and even struggles against Serena....Struggling would be losing in a third set, Serena blitzed her in two quick easy sets. How many times has Maria beaten Justine on gras?? :confused:

She can't beat Serena on grass, and would probably struggle against Maria.

It remains to be seen Justine can't beat Serena on grass :p

Juju #1
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:49 PM
It reamains to be seen if she can dominate on a hardcourt.

LOL at the poster who said she cant beat Maria on grass, and even struggles against Serena....Struggling would be losing in a third set, Serena blitzed her in two quick easy sets. How many times has Maria beaten Justine on gras?? :confused:

She can't beat Serena on grass, and would probably struggle against Maria.


Justine is the only player over 20 who improves her game every year.
Serena, on the other hand, plays much worse than in 2003 (2002)

alibaby
Jun 6th, 2005, 02:57 PM
Justine is the only player over 20 who improves her game every year.
Serena, on the other hand, plays much worse than in 2003 (2002)
so it is...

Hazy
Jun 6th, 2005, 03:46 PM
I'd say that her summer hardcourt season of 2003 was pretty dominant :shrug:
Guess who was missing Summer 2003 :wavey:

Guess who doesn't care :bigwave:

DA FOREHAND
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:29 PM
Justine is the only player over 20 who improves her game every year.
Serena, on the other hand, plays much worse than in 2003 (2002)


I don't know about the former statement, but I can say Justine works hard and isn't afraid of change or the growing pains associated w/making improvments...she's to be commended for that.

Juju #1
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:37 PM
I don't know about the former statement, but I can say Justine works hard and isn't afraid of change or the growing pains associated w/making improvments...she's to be commended for that.


And what about Serena these days ?

DA FOREHAND
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:40 PM
And what about Serena these days ?
I wouldn't know I'm not a Serena fan.

Juju #1
Jun 6th, 2005, 04:45 PM
I wouldn't know I'm not a Serena fan.


But you think Justine can't beat Serena on grass this year...

DA FOREHAND
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:13 PM
But you think Justine can't beat Serena on grass this year...


Anythings possible....but if there was a matchup at Wimbledon, I'd put my vcash on Serena.

rottweily
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:17 PM
She can't beat Serena on grass, and would probably struggle against Maria.

Anythings possible....but if there was a matchup at Wimbledon, I'd put my vcash on Serena.

Wow your opinion is very volatile. A bit scared? :lol:

harloo
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:19 PM
Question: Do people realize how great Justine is?

Answer: If told every other post how can you not come to that conclusion.:worship: :lol:

bandabou
Jun 6th, 2005, 05:49 PM
Justine is the only player over 20 who improves her game every year.
Serena, on the other hand, plays much worse than in 2003 (2002)

what, you expect her to win 4 majors in a row again?

DA FOREHAND
Jun 6th, 2005, 06:37 PM
Wow your opinion is very volatile. A bit scared? :lol:
yeah i'm a-scared...what do I get out of Serena winning or losing ....I'm a Venus Williams fan.

Filip!
Jun 6th, 2005, 06:42 PM
No news....Justine on clay is just dominating whereas she isn´t DOMINATING on other surfaces, there are more players who can give her trouble on grass,hardcourts, etc..

She did also win many other titles and slams beside clay-tournament. Remember?

kosmikgroove
Jun 6th, 2005, 08:42 PM
That is competition, but not dominant competition. Come on, now, Nadia? She's a pushover to the top players. Elena D.? Okay, I can say that was a good win and so were the two against Svetlana.

Let's compare Justine's five tournaments to Serena's five tournaments until the end of the French Open.

Justine wins four titles (Charleston, Warsaw, Berlin, FO)
27-1 win/loss record
wins over: Svetlana x2, Elena Dementieva, Nadia Petrova, Schnyder, Lindsay, Maria x2.

Serena wins three titles (Scottsdale, Miami, Rome, FO)
28-2 win/loss record
wins over: Hingis x2, Venus x2, Capriati x4, Mauresmo, JHH.

I would much rather have Serena's ONE less title and ONE more loss, with wins over current or previous or futures #1 players (Jen, Venus, Marti, JHH, Momo), than have Justine's Tier II wins over Dementieva, Petrova, Kuznetsova, Schnyder, and her two good wins over Maria. That's all. I just think Serena's record is a lot more impressive.

well now you're being honest. all you really wanted to do is try and prove how JHH isn't quite as great as another player.... and yet the thread was about how good of a shot Justine has at Wimbledon. (which btw, numerous people have proven that Justine's past and PRESENT form shows to be true)

If you're so confident in past numbers of years ago then you should continue to bet all your $ on Navritalova to win Wimbledon. I still believe that Serena has a great chance to win this year, but again since when did this become a battle of "justine vs. serena - who's greater?" some people ... some people...

Dana Marcy
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:43 PM
I always knew Juju was gifted but where she won me over on Saturday was after the match. She actually came across likable and genuine during the awards ceremony and her interview with Bud Collins.

I still prefer Kim when it comes to the Belgians but I now like Juju. I know she doesn't need my approval LOL but I never warmed up to her because she came across cold to me.

Allez-H
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:45 PM
I always knew Juju was gifted but where she won me over on Saturday was after the match. She actually came across likable and genuine during the awards ceremony and her interview with Bud Collins.

I still prefer Kim when it comes to the Belgians but I now like Juju. I know she doesn't need my approval LOL but I never warmed up to her because she came across cold to me.


You wouldn't have been the first one ;)

bandabou
Jun 6th, 2005, 09:54 PM
She did also win many other titles and slams beside clay-tournament. Remember?

Yep...but if you´re Justine: where would you rather play Serena: on clay or on hardcourts,grass, indoors?

rikvanlooy
Jun 8th, 2005, 01:18 PM
what, you expect her to win 4 majors in a row again?

Yes, bandabou, JHH will never win as many slams as Hingis (5).

She will never be able to win Wimbledon (final, 2 x semi final in the last three attempts), US Open and the AUS Open (winner last time she participated).

I am almost convinced JHH wants to win at least 10 slams. In the open area only 3 players have achieved this (Evert, Navratilova and Graf).

She wants to be the best of her generation. So she will have to win more slams than Serena.

I have to say that winning 4 in a row is going to be difficult, but not impossible.

NicoMary
Jun 8th, 2005, 01:23 PM
Justine is an amazing player...but i have to say that she has the chance to be in a period of time...since 2002 in which the competition is way less harder taht it could be...

If serena, Kim, Vénus and linsday were really playing their BEST TENNIS...hénin wouldn't have won all of her grand slam title...

She is lucky and she know how to deal with really well...she is smart That's it

volta
Jun 8th, 2005, 01:58 PM
2-6 2-6 Wimbledon '03 :)
:devil:

Lynx
Jun 8th, 2005, 02:50 PM
Justine is an amazing player...but i have to say that she has the chance to be in a period of time...since 2002 in which the competition is way less harder taht it could be...

If serena, Kim, Vénus and linsday were really playing their BEST TENNIS...hénin wouldn't have won all of her grand slam title...

She is lucky and she know how to deal with really well...she is smart That's it
That's a pretty big accolade you give Justine here - saying that no less than 4 other top players need to play their BEST TENNIS to keep Justine from winning as many majors as she did...

minboy
Jun 8th, 2005, 02:56 PM
Justine is an amazing player...but i have to say that she has the chance to be in a period of time...since 2002 in which the competition is way less harder taht it could be...

If serena, Kim, Vénus and linsday were really playing their BEST TENNIS...hénin wouldn't have won all of her grand slam title...

She is lucky and she know how to deal with really well...she is smart That's it

I wonder if there has ever been a player whose achievements were as discredit as Justine's.

Kim was laying her best tennis in 2003. Lindsay says she 's never felt as physically sharp as in 2004 ( also said she was inspired by Justine in that way ). Serena was beaten by Justine at the time evryone thought she was unbeatable. Justine used to push Venus to 3 sets when Venus was at her best and Justine very far from her 2003-2005 form.

...But, yeah, I guess she 's lucky:rolleyes:

cynicole
Jun 8th, 2005, 02:59 PM
...But, yeah, I guess she 's lucky:rolleyes:

I'd rather be lucky than good. ;)

alexusjonesfan
Jun 8th, 2005, 03:07 PM
the best players all always the luckiest :p

NicoMary
Jun 8th, 2005, 03:09 PM
That's a pretty big accolade you give Justine here - saying that no less than 4 other top players need to play their BEST TENNIS to keep Justine from winning as many majors as she did...


I mean we saw several times that Vénus and Serena were way much stronger than justin when they were Just playin'....(semi of RG Vénus/hénin)...

Ok for Davenport that is true that she is and always have been under Hénin since Justine is on top....
But i mean When Hingis and Davenport were n°1... there was Vénus, Serena, Seles, Pierce, Capriati who were playin her top tennis....
finally today except Kuznetsova, Schnyder and Pierce there is just a few players in the top 15 who are playin' at their best level....

But i am not saying that hénin do not deserve all thoses titles...but it makes me a bit sad when people says that she wants to be the best of her generation , beat Serena in the number of grand slam titles..that she is the most talented ever...... She is the best right now...that's it

minboy
Jun 8th, 2005, 03:14 PM
I mean we saw several times that Vénus and Serena were way much stronger than justin when they were Just playin'....(semi of RG Vénus/hénin)...

Ok for Davenport that is true that she is and always have been under Hénin since Justine is on top....
But i mean When Hingis and Davenport were n°1... there was Vénus, Serena, Seles, Pierce, Capriati who were playin her top tennis....
finally today except Kuznetsova, Schnyder and Pierce there is just a few players in the top 15 who are playin' at their best level....

But i am not saying that hénin do not deserve all thoses titles...but it makes me a bit sad when people says that she wants to be the best of her generation , beat Serena in the number of grand slam titles..that she is the most talented ever...... She is the best right now...that's it

I guesses I've missed Venus/Justine RG 1/2 :lol: :lol: Anyway, she used to beat Justine when Justine wasn't half the player she is now.


"Venus, serena, Pierce, Seles, Capriati"....Hello!!!! Venus , Serena and Capriati are still around if I'm not mistaken. And saying Hingis and Davenport had harder times because Pierce was at her best is truly laughable.

rottweily
Jun 8th, 2005, 04:48 PM
But i am not saying that hénin do not deserve all thoses titles...but it makes me a bit sad when people says that she wants to be the best of her generation , beat Serena in the number of grand slam titles..that she is the most talented ever...... She is the best right now...that's it


Why does Justine's quest for improvement and perfection make you sad?

bandabou
Jun 8th, 2005, 06:02 PM
Yes, bandabou, JHH will never win as many slams as Hingis (5).

She will never be able to win Wimbledon (final, 2 x semi final in the last three attempts), US Open and the AUS Open (winner last time she participated).

I am almost convinced JHH wants to win at least 10 slams. In the open area only 3 players have achieved this (Evert, Navratilova and Graf).

She wants to be the best of her generation. So she will have to win more slams than Serena.

I have to say that winning 4 in a row is going to be difficult, but not impossible.

I was talking more about Serena...because you said something about her form.

Big words by Juju...shows she´s confident. At least people see her as being talented. When Serena wins it is ONLY because she is big and powerful.

shap_half
Jun 8th, 2005, 07:56 PM
Let's jst give it up. Justine sucks!!!!!! She doesn't deserve anything she's ever won. And she won't win anything in the future. :shrug: