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View Full Version : A factor in the Lakers not being able to win.


jojoseph
Jun 14th, 2004, 04:20 AM
I'm gonna post this from another messageboard I post at.

Here's a stat I wanna run past you all. The same thing happened against the Sixers, but for those of you that have been paying attention, you'd have noticed that foul calling has become an art with today's officials. Most notably during the Kings/Lakers matches ups since '00 or so, the refs always seem to be quick to call fouls that seem to sway the tide of momentum to one team or the other. One game Shaq gets all the calls, the next he doesn't get any. Some days it's more blatant than others, but it seems to occur most often during playoff games when as you know, the league would love to see series go 7 games.

For those that don't know, the abbreviation you're looking at is PF for personal fouls.

Lakers foul totals for 2003 season (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/index.html)

Lakers foul totals for the playoffs (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/index.html)

Lakers foul totals for first round (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_quarter_stats.html)

Lakers foul totals for conference simifinals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_semi_stats.html)

Lakers total fouls in Conference finals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_finals_stats.html)

Now look at Lakers foul totals for NBA finals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/nba_finals_stats.html)

Now, simply look at the averages for all of them, you'll note the unimaginative proportion of team fouls attributed to the Lakers for the NBA Finals compared to the rest of the statistics. That's unreal.

Now, don't get me wrong, the Pistons have a great defense, but when you can't play without being called for a foul and it's this bad, come on, how can you expect to win a game. Also, if the Lakers go up 2-1 there's no way in hell the Pistons are gonna win and odds are Lakers close out in 5, but with the Lakers down 1-2, that makes a 7 game series a whole lot easier to get to, not to mention someone OTHER than the Lakers bringing home the bacon.

One more thing to look at is how the Pistons have shot 35 more free throws in the series than the Lakers that the media has been quick to point out. Well, no fucking duh.

I'll post the stats from tonight's game as it becomes available, but preliminary stats suggest it was a whopping 35-20 in terms of personal fouls. I'm surprised Phil didn't purposely get ejected. The fucking Lakers were complaining all night and the refs didn't give a shit.

Bacardi
Jun 14th, 2004, 04:21 AM
Lakers won't win, because Davidson who owns both the Pistons and the Bolts is going for the double title, the NBA Championship and he's already got the Stanley Cup. :woohoo:

Rtael
Jun 14th, 2004, 04:22 AM
Well....when you commit fouls....you get called. Sorry if that's too complicated. :retard:

jojoseph
Jun 14th, 2004, 04:27 AM
Well....when you commit fouls....you get called. Sorry if that's too complicated. :retard:
Not when you're playing for the Pistons. :bs:

jojoseph
Jun 14th, 2004, 04:29 AM
you should put this in the NBA THREAD- interesting- Phil did try to plead this case in last press conference about fouls and I actually thought the game tonight would have been different- i think the lakers will win next game- i still feel like the games are tipped to go the distance...
Lol just about every Laker player on the court were pleading their case, but the ref's didn't give a flying fuck.

...

disposablehero
Jun 14th, 2004, 05:24 AM
Well....when you commit fouls....you get called. Sorry if that's too complicated. :retard:
Unless you are Derek Fisher intentionally fouling with a minute left in the game. Anyone notice that, he couldn't buy a foul there?

Rocketta
Jun 14th, 2004, 05:39 AM
I think people should be able to foul the Lakers more since their allowed to stack the deck and try to buy championships...:o;):tape:

Amadé
Jun 14th, 2004, 05:48 AM
I think people should be able to foul the Lakers more since their allowed to stack the deck and try to buy championships...:o;):tape:
http://www.kournikova.com/community/images/smilies/king.gif I will pretend you didn't say that. lol. Lol just about every Laker player on the court were pleading their case, but the ref's didn't give a flying fuck.
Notice that too, but it may be my personal bias. :D

Rocketta
Jun 14th, 2004, 06:30 AM
http://www.kournikova.com/community/images/smilies/king.gif I will pretend you didn't say that. lol.

ok, I understand.....:wavey::lol:

jojoseph
Jun 14th, 2004, 08:16 AM
Let's be real here, the Pistons have an excellent team, but even that team should be gobbled up by the Lakers.

And here's what I said I was gonna post, the stats including PF's...

Lakers fouls versus Detroits..
35-20 what a joke (http://www.nba.com/games/20040613/LALDET/boxscore.html)

Here's some more homework for y'all.
Here's a link to a page whereby you can click on different stats to find that average fouls for the Pistons during the season, in the first round, in the second round, in the third round, in the playoffs in general, and in the NBA Finals.

Pistons average fouls for and for opponents (http://www.nba.com/pistons/stats/2003/index.html)

Note that never does any opponent ever average anywhere close to 35 fouls in one game. And you're telling me the best team in the NBA is gonna all of the sudden get demolished in this fashion and committ this amount of fouls against this same team? :rolleyes: I mean, come on, now.

And I'm not just talking about stats, anyone with a brain that watched that game saw it as well as most, that the Pistons weren't getting called for shit and the Lakers got called for just about everything. 35 equals to almost 1 foul every 1 and a half minutes. That's unreal.

Shuji Shuriken
Jun 14th, 2004, 11:39 AM
okay...I just have one thing to contribute :)

FUCK THEM DOWN PISTONS :bounce: :woohoo: :bounce:!

TimBo
Jun 14th, 2004, 12:04 PM
I think that Shaq cant do it all himself. Last nite he had 16 rebouds and 36 points. No other player on the team has contributed like that. Kobe did one game, but he's got to help out. Malone is hurt as well.

Rick fox is as worthless as tits on a male animal. Ok, just had to throw that it. lol

Shuji Shuriken
Jun 14th, 2004, 12:59 PM
I don't see any bias with respect to fouling and LA losses. They are trying to play more defence ala the Pistons, but they have never been a team known for great defence. That way, they foul more. The Pistons have always played great defence, and can play great defence without fouling the person they mark. The thing is, if Kobe AND Shaq don't step up, the Lakers lose. In addition to the great defence the Pistons play, they play team ball, and nearly the whole team always steps up :). Let's wear this ring Big Ben and Mr. Rasheed :bounce:. Go Billups, go Hamilton :kiss: :bounce: :hearts:

bee
Jun 14th, 2004, 01:02 PM
maybe the Piston is just the better team... :) :) :)

TimBo
Jun 14th, 2004, 01:03 PM
I don't see any bias with respect to fouling and LA losses. They are trying to play more defence ala the Pistons, but they have never been a team known for great defence. That way, they foul more. The Pistons have always played great defence, and can play great defence without fouling the person they mark. The thing is, if Kobe AND Shaq don't step up, the Lakers lose. In addition to the great defence the Pistons play, they play team ball, and nearly the whole team always steps up :). Let's wear this ring Big Ben and Mr. Rasheed :bounce:. Go Billups, go Hamilton :kiss: :bounce: :hearts:


I would love to Prince have a HUGE game and have lots of points and rebounds. Ive always liked him, of course he played for KY and that's my team

- L i n a -
Jun 14th, 2004, 02:02 PM
I'm gonna post this from another messageboard I post at.

Here's a stat I wanna run past you all. The same thing happened against the Sixers, but for those of you that have been paying attention, you'd have noticed that foul calling has become an art with today's officials. Most notably during the Kings/Lakers matches ups since '00 or so, the refs always seem to be quick to call fouls that seem to sway the tide of momentum to one team or the other. One game Shaq gets all the calls, the next he doesn't get any. Some days it's more blatant than others, but it seems to occur most often during playoff games when as you know, the league would love to see series go 7 games.

For those that don't know, the abbreviation you're looking at is PF for personal fouls.

Lakers foul totals for 2003 season (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/index.html)

Lakers foul totals for the playoffs (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/index.html)

Lakers foul totals for first round (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_quarter_stats.html)

Lakers foul totals for conference simifinals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_semi_stats.html)

Lakers total fouls in Conference finals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/conf_finals_stats.html)

Now look at Lakers foul totals for NBA finals (http://www.nba.com/lakers/stats/2003/nba_finals_stats.html)

Now, simply look at the averages for all of them, you'll note the unimaginative proportion of team fouls attributed to the Lakers for the NBA Finals compared to the rest of the statistics. That's unreal.

Now, don't get me wrong, the Pistons have a great defense, but when you can't play without being called for a foul and it's this bad, come on, how can you expect to win a game. Also, if the Lakers go up 2-1 there's no way in hell the Pistons are gonna win and odds are Lakers close out in 5, but with the Lakers down 1-2, that makes a 7 game series a whole lot easier to get to, not to mention someone OTHER than the Lakers bringing home the bacon.

One more thing to look at is how the Pistons have shot 35 more free throws in the series than the Lakers that the media has been quick to point out. Well, no fucking duh.

I'll post the stats from tonight's game as it becomes available, but preliminary stats suggest it was a whopping 35-20 in terms of personal fouls. I'm surprised Phil didn't purposely get ejected. The fucking Lakers were complaining all night and the refs didn't give a shit.
Aren't you that nutso Anna fan that went on some stupid tirade about her site?

It makes sense you'd start this topic then.

jojoseph
Jun 15th, 2004, 01:04 AM
Aren't you that nutso Anna fan that went on some stupid tirade about her site?

It makes sense you'd start this topic then.
In one simple word, no. I have no idea who you are referring to and frankly don't care.

And I think I've read enough of your posts about anna to conclude that you have no business talking about nutso's. :retard:

jojoseph
Jun 15th, 2004, 01:07 AM
I don't see any bias with respect to fouling and LA losses. They are trying to play more defence ala the Pistons, but they have never been a team known for great defence. That way, they foul more. The Pistons have always played great defence, and can play great defence without fouling the person they mark. The thing is, if Kobe AND Shaq don't step up, the Lakers lose. In addition to the great defence the Pistons play, they play team ball, and nearly the whole team always steps up :). Let's wear this ring Big Ben and Mr. Rasheed :bounce:. Go Billups, go Hamilton :kiss: :bounce: :hearts:
lol I always hear the commentators among numerous officials in the sports industry talking about the Lakers great defense in addition to their offense. That is well known in the sports industry.

And once again, going back simply at the stats, the Lakers never averaged at any point in time, more pf's per game than their opponents, yet the disparity in the NBA Finals is :retard: .

Steam
Jun 15th, 2004, 02:51 AM
I haven't been following the NBA Finals at all but one way to tell if the fix is in is if Dick Bavasi is heavily involved.

Doesn't bother me though since, fuck the Lakers, I hate them too.

jojoseph
Jun 15th, 2004, 03:51 AM
I should have elaborate just a bit on the whole "fix" thing. I'm not saying there is a great elaborate fix on, I'm simply stating what I can clearly show to be true, and that is that the ref's appear to be calling games very strangely during Lakers games. I have noticed this since the Lakers started playing the Kings in the playoffs since 2000. I don't think a big fix is involved due to the amount of coverup that would be involved, outside that of the refs. It could just be an unwritten rule among the refs that they are to push things a certain way to get more revenue for the league or for a variety of reasons. While there may be a bigger fix on, I don't want to overreach too much and risk some of the credibility I am already putting on the line by even suggesting what I am suggesting. :)

decemberlove
Jun 16th, 2004, 03:18 AM
interesting theory . great excuse

but it has nothing to do with them losing

they have lost their spark and their heart

Steam
Jun 16th, 2004, 04:04 AM
interesting theory . great excuse

but it has nothing to do with them losing

they have lost their spark and their heart
That about sums it up. I haven't been following it at all. I watched portions of the game tonight and they were lifeless compared to Detroit. I was going to turn it on at the end to see the celebration but got so engrossed in Curb Your Enthusiasm Season 2 that I forgot about it. Oh well.

The NBA is notorious for horrible officiating but you would think if they wanted to fix it they would have it go more than five games in order to maximize profits.

Doesn't matter to me though. Fuck the Lakers. Yeah, fuck the Lakers I hate them too.

harloo
Jun 16th, 2004, 04:14 AM
The fix is in, the fix is in!!! Call the commissioner!!!

I think jojoseph makes some very good points with some accurate information, however I still feel that the Lakers intensity throughout this final series has been down. Losing Karl Malone to injury really hurt them, and while I don't think the Pistons are better than the Lakers they did come this year and beat them pretty badly.

decemberlove
Jun 16th, 2004, 04:44 AM
That about sums it up. I haven't been following it at all. I watched portions of the game tonight and they were lifeless compared to Detroit. I was going to turn it on at the end to see the celebration but got so engrossed in Curb Your Enthusiasm Season 2 that I forgot about it. Oh well.

The NBA is notorious for horrible officiating but you would think if they wanted to fix it they would have it go more than five games in order to maximize profits.

Doesn't matter to me though. Fuck the Lakers. Yeah, fuck the Lakers I hate them too.
how do you like the CYE2 dvd?

DunkMachine
Jun 16th, 2004, 06:43 AM
The Lakers cannot withstand the power of the big fucked up afro. The Lakers can't even see the basket.

jojoseph
Jun 16th, 2004, 08:00 AM
Thanks guys. :)

Welp, as it turns out, the Pistons didn't didn't need any help from the refs tonight as the Pistons handled it all by themselves. Congrats to them, and now the league has their cinderella story. :)

lata

*JR*
Jun 16th, 2004, 11:48 AM
Congragulations to coach Larry Brown For Finally Adding An NBA Title To his NCAA trophy. Sincere Sympathy To The Mailman, Karl Malone :worship: who like Patrick and Sir Charles may retire without ever having gotten a ring.

lakeway11
Jun 16th, 2004, 12:05 PM
K.U. :yeah:

Steam
Jun 16th, 2004, 10:22 PM
how do you like the CYE2 dvd?
I have only watched two episodes so far and they were both good. It seems like the HBO DVDs don't have any extra shit but I don't really need that the majority of the time anyway. I loved the first season and I think this should be no different. I heard that it starts to get really good in Season 3 though.