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K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 01:23 PM
While I know that it was only a semifinal in a tier 1 that Serena lost, but her facial expressions portrayed that she didn't care it she won or not. She wasn't willing to fight until the end and push into that extra gear. The Serena of 2002-2003 didn't have these expressions and would've taken this match to a third. It was like it was either winner or error from Serena, not the keep as many balls in play until she could break down Jenny. It seems lke Serena is caught up in her whole movie career too much and this(tennis) is just something she has to do. Until she really wants to start winning everything again, her results will be sub-par for her standards. Has Serena lost her grit and grind, because the Serena I know would never lose 6-4,6-4 or 6-2,6-3 to players at all and not to mention not be fuming about it in her interview.

Martian Jeza
May 16th, 2004, 01:24 PM
If it could be true , I will be more than happy but I think that's not the case... Unfortunatly...

hollywood7172
May 16th, 2004, 01:30 PM
saying that because of one loss is a bit extreme. and she did win miami.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 01:32 PM
Donīt think so, donīt think so....Serena cares. Serena doesnīt step on the court without wanting to win every match, otherwise she wouldnīt play. Yesterdayīs match was more lack of match-rythm and match-toughness. Just that.

azza
May 16th, 2004, 01:32 PM
Shutup :)

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 01:32 PM
As a Serena fan, I must say that it seemed like Serena really didn't want to be on the court yesterday. There were no "come-on!"s from Serena yesterday. Her grunting was subdued, and she wasn't screaming at herself when she miss balls. She was playing like a priss in someways out there, and I'm sure that Richard wouldn't accept this effort from Serena. Serena found ways to win in the past, that's what I love(d) about her. Serena must realize that while she is an excellent tennis player, there are other players who can beat her when she is 100% healthy.

DelMonte
May 16th, 2004, 01:34 PM
If it could be true , I will be more than happy but I think that's not the case... Unfortunatly...

why don't you just wish she gets injured once more and leaves the game for even longer than 8 months?

http://gallery.jokeaday.com/albums/album70/trolls.jpg

Experimentee
May 16th, 2004, 01:36 PM
Oh come on :rolleyes:
You are really being too dramatic. It is not so shocking that she lost to Jen, who she always has problems with, in her first clay tournament! Its already great that she got to the semis beating a dangerous Kuznetsova easily! Give her some credit. There will never be a day when Serena loses her fighting spirit, look at her intensity all the time, thats not someone who would be playing or even on the court if she didnt care about the outcome.

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 01:36 PM
While I know that it was only a semifinal in a tier 1 that Serena lost, but her facial expressions portrayed that she didn't care it she won or not. She wasn't willing to fight until the end and push into that extra gear. The Serena of 2002-2003 didn't have these expressions and would've taken this match to a third. It was like it was either winner or error from Serena, not the keep as many balls in play until she could break down Jenny. It seems lke Serena is caught up in her whole movie career too much and this(tennis) is just something she has to do. Until she really wants to start winning everything again, her results will be sub-par for her standards. Has Serena lost her grit and grind, because the Serena I know would never lose 6-4,6-4 or 6-2,6-3 to players at all and not to mention not be fuming about it in her interview.

Oh please! :rolleyes:

So interesting how ever time one of the sister's lose
somebody always has to march out this off-court
bullshit! :cool:

Serena wasn't pleased with herself. She felt she didn't serve well. However, she's now more able to see what needs to be fixed and what she'll be doing at the French. All things considered this was a good tournament for her.

She was down 5-1 or 5-2 in the second but fought her way back to make it more respectable. Also, you can't take away from the fact that Jennifer has really started finding her form again and that matches between them have always been tight! Jennifer held it together mentally because Serena could've very well broken her at the end and got it back to 5all. Had Jennifer lost that set after being in control she could've very well gone down an all too familiar path, but she didn't!

Serena saw it for what it was and while she would've loved to win, she is able to put it into proper perspective and not over analyze every single this or that as so many of us here tend to do. You learn and move on.

Serena fought and has nothing to be ashamed of!
Jenn just fought better on that day and it was to be for her. :)

Serena hasn't gone anywhere and will be even
more primed and pumped for Paris, you can bet on it!

Martian Jeza
May 16th, 2004, 01:36 PM
why don't you just wish she gets more injured once more and leaves the game for even longer than 8 months?

http://gallery.jokeaday.com/albums/album70/trolls.jpg

You wish...

Martian Willow
May 16th, 2004, 01:37 PM
why don't you just wish she gets more injured once more and leaves the game for even longer than 8 months?

...I do hope she gets an injury and has to retire...then I can lmfao and call her a quitter...it would be really funny... :)

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 01:37 PM
I'm not saying this because I'm trying to hate on Serena, she's my 2nd favorite player, but I guess that it's the fighter in me that can't stand when other people don't give 100%. I'm sure Richard wouldn't have liked Serena's demenor on the court yesterday. I like it when Serena is all fired-up and she is screaming at herself and grunting really loud, and yelling come-on out there. I'm just saying that I didn't see that yesterday, and it's a bit unusual for Serena, that's all.

V-MAC
May 16th, 2004, 01:38 PM
i saw the highlights of the match last night on eurosport and yeah i agree serena was definitely reacting very differently in the match than ususal.i mean she looked very subdued as if for once she was accepting defeat.Also i noticed that, while in the past,serena like venus, if they missing their groundstrokes and they end up sailing long,they seem to adopt the attitude of hitting through the problem in the hope that it will eventually come right.but yesterday,serena backed off her groundstrokes completely,it was like she was just pushing the ball over the net.seemed like she had no belief in her game whatsoever. Overall just a very strange match from serena but i'm pretty sure its just gonna be a one-off.

lizchris
May 16th, 2004, 01:41 PM
I wanted Serena to win, but unlike today's finalists, she has already won the title.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 01:42 PM
Oh come on :rolleyes:
You are really being too dramatic. It is not so shocking that she lost to Jen, who she always has problems with, in her first clay tournament! Its already great that she got to the semis beating a dangerous Kuznetsova easily! Give her some credit. There will never be a day when Serena loses her fighting spirit, look at her intensity all the time, thats not someone who would be playing or even on the court if she didnt care about the outcome.


Thank you very much!

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 01:42 PM
I'm not saying this because I'm trying to hate on Serena, she's my 2nd favorite player, but I guess that it's the fighter in me that can't stand when other people don't give 100%. I'm sure Richard wouldn't have liked Serena's demenor on the court yesterday. I like it when Serena is all fired-up and she is screaming at herself and grunting really loud, and yelling come-on out there. I'm just saying that I didn't see that yesterday, and it's a bit unusual for Serena, that's all.

So, you can judge one's fight by their facial expressions? ;)

If that was the case, then Venus
should just retire right now! :lol:

Serena is more of a 'heart on her sleeve kind of person'.
However, just because she didn't hoot-and-holler as much
as you like doesn't mean she didn't fight just as hard.

People do change and grow.
Venus used to be just like Serena when she was younger
but she gradually changed and it didn't stop her from winning
or mean her desire wan't there.

DelMonte
May 16th, 2004, 01:43 PM
...I do hope she gets an injury and has to retire...then I can lmfao and call her a quitter...it would be really funny... :)

pray really hard then and hope your wish will come true.

lizchris
May 16th, 2004, 01:44 PM
...I do hope she gets an injury and has to retire...then I can lmfao and call her a quitter...it would be really funny... :)
I hope this is some sort of joke, because this is a very sick thing to say.:fiery:

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 01:46 PM
So, you can judge one's fight by their facial expressions? ;)

If that was the case, then Venus
should just retire right now! :lol:

Serena is more of a 'heart on her sleeve kind of person'.
However, just because she didn't hoot-and-holler as much
as you like doesn't mean she didn't fight just as hard.

People do change and grow.
Venus used to be just like Serena when she was younger
but she gradually changed and it didn't stop her from winning
or mean her desire wan't there.


I agree Kabuke, but I don't think that Serena will ever have Venus' presence on the court. Venus and Serena have opposite personalities, and I would've expected Serena to look more angry out there. I prefer Venus to look calm and give that ice face look, that's what intimidates the hell out of the other players.

tennnisfannn
May 16th, 2004, 01:47 PM
As a fan I wasn't too dissappointed with that loss, i wasn't either with the loss to Petrova. After 8 months I am glad she is healthy and playing again. The wins will come eventually.
Serena is proabably happy to be healthy again, not to mention how when she was recuperating they lost someone precious, losses in matches are never the same after that. SHe probably go herself some perspective and she may have seen how Venus struggled to get back to form and she has had a better return.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 01:56 PM
Exactly...itīs just a matter of putting things into perspective. Watch RG next week and then ask yourself that question again.

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 02:01 PM
Exactly...itīs just a matter of putting things into perspective. Watch RG next week and then ask yourself that question again.


I hope you know that this comment could come back to bite you in the butt. If Serena loses in the quarterfinals in Paris, then my theory is correct, but if she say gets to the finals and loses to her sister, then I will be proven wrong!!

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 02:12 PM
I hope you know that this comment could come back to bite you in the butt. If Serena loses in the quarterfinals in Paris, then my theory is correct, but if she say gets to the finals and loses to her sister, then I will be proven wrong!!

Aah.....so itīs only o.k. for her to lose to Venus?! I thought this was about "Serena not losing" period?! It was about Venus all along then?! hmmm...interesting.

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 02:29 PM
I hope you know that this comment could come back to bite you in the butt. If Serena loses in the quarterfinals in Paris, then my theory is correct, but if she say gets to the finals and loses to her sister, then I will be proven wrong!!

I'm sorry but I hope you know
how stupid that comment sounded! :cool:

How would her losing in the QF's prove your
theory correct?

Who is to say that Serena wouldn't come up against a player
who is playing out of their mind crazy!

K-lina was doing this up against Venus but she somehow pulled
it out in the best match of the year as far as I'm concerned!
Venus could've lost but nonethless she put up the effort and
while I would've been sad I'd have to give K-lina her due for playing
so extremely well!

So, Serena in theory should always have control of the match in her hands despite the outcome because 9 of 10 times she usually is, but don't underestimate the opponent and the fact that on that day they may be able to throw everything at her to which she can't handle and isn't in control.
That goes for all players no matter how great!

Besides, this only her third competition back from her injury,
just like I said with Venus, she just needs time.
And give the girl and break and get off her back! :cool: :wavey:

In theory, when it's you out there being judged or critisized for supposedly lacking heart from people analyzing you every move down to every facial expression then let's talk.

If she showed lack of fight then why didn't she just let Jenn win the second set 6-1 instead of 6-4 when Jeen was up 5-2? :cool:

Pureracket
May 16th, 2004, 02:29 PM
From the pics and the results of this past week, Serena doesn't seem to be in match shape either. With hope, she will be able to get it together by the FO(=).

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 02:33 PM
From the pics and the results of this past week, Serena doesn't seem to be in match shape either. With hope, she will be able to get it together by the FO(=).

Exactly!

Serena is human!
Just like Vee simply needed some time,
Serena just needs time to get to where
she'd ultimately like to be.

cheo23
May 16th, 2004, 02:44 PM
Has she Lost Her Will to Win.. I don't think so..I mean she Did win her 1st Tournament that Tier 1 In Miami.....J.Crap and SEReNA always play close Matches..look at the previous 8 matches between them..It was a given J.Crap was Eventually gonna win One sooner or later...Plus I think SEreNA came from 5-1 and Started playin Well but it was a little too late..Its a GREAT Preparation for the FRench Open May 24th..so she hasn't Lost her Will to WIN..GET IT TOGETHER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 02:46 PM
Aah.....so itīs only o.k. for her to lose to Venus?! I thought this was about "Serena not losing" period?! It was about Venus all along then?! hmmm...interesting.


No it's not about Venus. I'm saying that there isn't any shame to lose to one of the best players in history and someone who has had great results on clay this year. Serena defiantly has a chance to win Roland Garros, but it will certainly be tough for her to do.

Kart
May 16th, 2004, 02:46 PM
OMG how melodramatic can you get ?

Jakeev
May 16th, 2004, 02:48 PM
Can someone explain why K-Dog is being so freaking dramatic? Let's get on thing straight, when Serena decided to return to tennis, she did so at the end of the hardcourt spring season and at the beginning of the clay-court season.

We have had discussios that we knew she would not have an easy time on clay and would need to work on a lot of issues through out the season.

It's very simple, Serena is just not match tough yet and competing on clay makes it a little mor difficult compared to more faster surfaces where she can get away with not being so match tough.

So stop the crappy dramatic threads like this and give Serena time.

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 02:51 PM
No it's not about Venus. I'm saying that there isn't any shame to lose to one of the best players in history and someone who has had great results on clay this year. Serena defiantly has a chance to win Roland Garros, but it will certainly be tough for her to do.

As it will be for All the other players! ;)

It may not be about Venus but it is in the same
vein as when people were critical of Venus upon
the unsteady waters during the beginning of her return.

People were so damn harsh on Venus and then shut up after
Charleston and even grew quieter with Warsaw and Berlin.

Let's cut Serena the slack so many were unwilling
to do for Venus despite certain people saying she simply
needed time to get back into the groove, things don't happen
overnight.

skanky~skanketta
May 16th, 2004, 02:51 PM
this is serena we're talking about. she wont play if she lost her will.

hubris. thats what keeps her winning.

rock on serena!!!!

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 02:55 PM
No it's not about Venus. I'm saying that there isn't any shame to lose to one of the best players in history and someone who has had great results on clay this year. Serena defiantly has a chance to win Roland Garros, but it will certainly be tough for her to do.


blah blah.....losing is never aight! Either you want her to win all her matches or you donīt.

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:01 PM
blah blah.....losing is never aight! Either you want her to win all her matches or you donīt.


I do want her to win all of her matches, but I also want Venus to win all her matches. Serena can beat Vee anyday and if she plays her in Paris she can beat her there. I will have mixed emotions if Venus and Serena meet in the final. On one hand, if Venus wins then she can shut all the people who say that she can't win another major. On the other hand, then if Serena wins her domiance is restored on the tour.

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 03:04 PM
I do want her to win all of her matches, but I also want Venus to win all her matches. Serena can beat Vee anyday and if she plays her in Paris she can beat her their. I will have mixed emotions if Venus and Serena meet in the final. On one hand, if Venus wins then she can shut all the people who say that she can't win another major. On the other hand, then if Serena wins her domiance is restored on the tour.

Drama Queen! :angel: :kiss: :wavey:

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:06 PM
Drama Queen! :kiss: :wavey:

Kabuke, I'm not a female. I'm a male. If you're gonna say anything, call me a Drama King!!

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 03:06 PM
Kabuke, I'm not a female. I'm a male. If you're gonna say anything, call me a Drama King!!

Male or female,
still a Queen! ;)

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:08 PM
Male or female,
still a Queen! ;)


I'm not gay either Kabuke. I'm as straight as a 180 degree angle.

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 03:10 PM
I'm not gay either Kabuke. I'm as straight as a 180 degree angle.

No need for the explaination. ;)

It's an expression baby! :cool:
Calm it down. :lol:

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:12 PM
No need for the explaination. ;)

It's an expression baby! :cool:
Calm it down. :lol:

Well I'm sorry Kabuke!! I just don't enjoy people who I thought respected me start bashing me for an observation I made!!

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:15 PM
I do want her to win all of her matches, but I also want Venus to win all her matches. Serena can beat Vee anyday and if she plays her in Paris she can beat her there. I will have mixed emotions if Venus and Serena meet in the final. On one hand, if Venus wins then she can shut all the people who say that she can't win another major. On the other hand, then if Serena wins her domiance is restored on the tour.

Aaahh....then itīs aight. īCause anyday anytime...

Paneru
May 16th, 2004, 03:16 PM
Well I'm sorry Kabuke!! I just don't enjoy people who I thought respected me start bashing me for an observation I made!!

I respect you as I'm sure others do and no one is bashing you.
We just think you are overreacting. It was simply one match
and all the sudden Serena's in dier straight's according to you. :)

We all know Serena will come back, it just takes time to get all the way there.
Not to mention that Serena is still have a little knee stiffness, give her time to get her health and game all together.

Her sister just needed time and
the fact is that's all she needs.

Knizzle
May 16th, 2004, 03:17 PM
...I do hope she gets an injury and has to retire...then I can lmfao and call her a quitter...it would be really funny... :)Poor misguided former Hingis fan. If Serena ever has an injury where her doctors tell her she is fine and can play with it and Serena tells us that she doesn't want to take her losses in coming back, then you can call her a quitter to your heart's content. I wouldn't advise you to hold your breath though.

Rocketta
May 16th, 2004, 03:18 PM
I hope this is some sort of joke, because this is a very sick thing to say.:fiery:
didn't you know Willow thinks she's a comedian only she's not funny..:(

or

she is just petty and unfunny. :shrug:

Experimentee
May 16th, 2004, 03:31 PM
And how the hell can u say someone has lost their will to win after they fought back from being 1-5 down, having points to get to 5-5? :cuckoo:
You said yourself in another thread that Serena wasnt playing bad in your opinion. So this thread is completely stupid and doesnt make sense.

Mrs. Peel
May 16th, 2004, 03:34 PM
didn't you know Willow thinks she's a comedian only she's not funny..:(

or

she is just petty and unfunny. :shrug:
Put my vote for petty and not funny....:rolleyes: @Willow

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:35 PM
And how the hell can u say someone has lost their will to win after they fought back from being 1-5 down, having points to get to 5-5? :cuckoo:
You said yourself in another thread that Serena wasnt playing bad in your opinion. So this thread is completely stupid and doesnt make sense.


She didn't play that bad, but the Serena of old would've found a way to win. Some other members have agreed with me saying that Serena was really sub-dued out there. That's all.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:35 PM
And how the hell can u say someone has lost their will to win after they fought back from being 1-5 down, having points to get to 5-5? :cuckoo:
You said yourself in another thread that Serena wasnt playing bad in your opinion. So this thread is completely stupid and doesnt make sense.

Iīm tellling you....some people are just amazing!! :lol:

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:37 PM
She didn't play that bad, but the Serena of old would've found a way to win. Some other members have agreed with me saying that Serena was really sub-dued out there. That's all.

But she ISNīT the Serena of old...hello!!

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:38 PM
But she ISNīT the Serena of old...hello!!

So what are you saying, that she isn't as good as she used to be?

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:43 PM
So what are you saying, that she isn't as good as she used to be?

She isnīt....simple and it is no surprise. You canīt stay away from the game for 8 months with injuries and stuff and expect someone to still be as her old self from the bat. Serenaīs still good enough to beat most players, but if she isnīt 100 % she just canīt cruise yet...

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:44 PM
She isnīt....simple and it is no surprise. You canīt stay away from the game for 8 months with injuries and stuff and expect someone to still be as her old self from the bat. Serenaīs still good enough to beat most players, but if she isnīt 100 % she just canīt cruise yet...

Okay, do you believe that she will ever be as good as she was?

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:46 PM
Okay, do you believe that she will ever be as good as she was?

Will Venus ever be?!

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:48 PM
Will Venus ever be?!

You're not answering my question. Venus will be as good as she once was period. She won't have the easy results she had at her best, but she will continue to improve and become the Venus of 2000-2001 soon enough. The competion is so much better now than in 2000-2001. Again, your opinion on Serena!!

Experimentee
May 16th, 2004, 03:51 PM
She isnīt....simple and it is no surprise. You canīt stay away from the game for 8 months with injuries and stuff and expect someone to still be as her old self from the bat. Serenaīs still good enough to beat most players, but if she isnīt 100 % she just canīt cruise yet...

I think some Serena fans only liked her because of her success and domination. When she even loses one match they start to doubt her and put her down. Those arent real fans.

K-Dog: Serena is struggling with mental toughness now because she has been out of the game for a while. She lacks matchplay, so the concentration and toughness etc isnt there. The same thing happens with all players. When Davenport came back after a long time out with knee surgery she also had problems closing out matches to players she should best easily. She lost to Schnyder and Maleeva when she had leads against them and could have won in straight sets. Once the inital comeback period was over she started beating them in straight sets again. It should be no different with Serena.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:52 PM
You're not answering my question. Venus will be as good as she once was period. She won't have the easy results she had at her best, but she will continue to improve and become the Venus of 2000-2001 soon enough. The competion is so much better now than in 2000-2001. Again, your opinion on Serena!!

If Venus who never was as dominating as Serena to begin with, can regain her top form in your opinion, why wouldnīt Serena be able to regain hers?!

As long as there are hardcourts and grass...should be fine and itīs just matter of time for her to regain her footing on clay too.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:53 PM
I think some Serena fans only liked her because of her success and domination. When she even loses one match they start to doubt her and put her down. Those arent real fans.

K-Dog: Serena is struggling with mental toughness now because she has been out of the game for a while. She lacks matchplay, so the concentration and toughness etc isnt there. The same thing happens with all players. When Davenport came back after a long time out with knee surgery she also had problems closing out matches to players she should best easily. She lost to Schnyder and Maleeva when she had leads against them and could have won in straight sets. Once the inital comeback period was over she started beating them in straight sets again. It should be no different with Serena.

Thing is, this isnīt even a Serena-fan....just a Venus-fan who seems to be enjoying watching Serena lose.

Jakeev
May 16th, 2004, 03:55 PM
K-Dog definitely is not getting it. Again, this is clay we are talking about. It's harder for Serena to get match tough on clay because fighting spirit or not, she has to do lot of different things on dirt than she needs to do on a faster surface.

You really should have thought about this thread before you wrote it.

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:56 PM
Thing is, this isnīt even a Serena-fan....just a Venus-fan who seems to be enjoying watching Serena lose.


What are you talking about Bandabou? I've said that Serena was my 2nd favorite player on the tour. Yes, I like Venus more, but that doesn't mean I want Serena to lose. Serena losing makes my day go down the toilet. I hate watching Serena lose.

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 03:59 PM
K-Dog definitely is not getting it. Again, this is clay we are talking about. It's harder for Serena to get match tough on clay because fighting spirit or not, she has to do lot of different things on dirt than she needs to do on a faster surface.

You really should have thought about this thread before you wrote it.


I do get it buddy!! Serena wouldn't ever make an excuse, "It's clay, I don't feel that this is a surface I can get match tough on!!" Serena losing to anybody 6-4,6-4 is striking to say the least!!

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 03:59 PM
What are you talking about Bandabou? I've said that Serena was my 2nd favorite player on the tour. Yes, I like Venus more, but that doesn't mean I want Serena to lose. Serena losing makes my day go down the toilet. I hate watching Serena lose.

Then why all the second-guessing?! Thought Venus never would regain her form when she was losing to Svetlana K, Lisa R, Elena D and not even reaching sfīs at her first three tournaments?!

So give Serena her space...

K-Dog
May 16th, 2004, 04:02 PM
Then why all the second-guessing?! Thought Venus never would regain her form when she was losing to Svetlana K, Lisa R, Elena D and not even reaching sfīs at her first three tournaments?!

So give Serena her space...


I was apprehensive about Venus just like many people were at the beginning of the season with her form. I'm just glad that Venus was able to come back. The thing is that Serena came back with a vengence and won Miami. If she can win there and be match tough enough to win there, then she can be tough enough to win anywhere!!

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 04:07 PM
I was apprehensive about Venus just like many people were at the beginning of the season with her form. I'm just glad that Venus was able to come back. The thing is that Serena came back with a vengence and won Miami. If she can win there and be match tough enough to win there, then she can be tough enough to win anywhere!!

Easier to be match-tough on your best surface than on your least favourite one. Plus she wasnīt match-tough mach-tough then either....so many times she failed to close-out sets and stuff.

Experimentee
May 16th, 2004, 04:08 PM
I was apprehensive about Venus just like many people were at the beginning of the season with her form. I'm just glad that Venus was able to come back. The thing is that Serena came back with a vengence and won Miami. If she can win there and be match tough enough to win there, then she can be tough enough to win anywhere!!

I'll say it again: First tournament on red clay :retard:

Martian Willow
May 16th, 2004, 04:22 PM
didn't you know Willow thinks she's a comedian only she's not funny..:(

or

she is just petty and unfunny. :shrug:

...I wish my jokes were as funny as Serenas'...or even TeeRexxs'... :crying2:

dreamgoddess099
May 16th, 2004, 05:01 PM
Serena lost a match. So what! Everybody playing on tour has lost a match this year. Have they all lost their fighting spirit too? I don't see how losing to someone you've already proven you can beat (and 8 times in a row mind you) takes anything away from her fighting spirit. I see what K-dog means about Serena not getting her game to that next level the way she is capable of doing, but Serena is not yet back at the same level she was when she left the tour. Serena herself says that she is getting there and I believe her. When she starts to lose in straight sets at grandslams you can start to worry.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 05:37 PM
Serena lost a match. So what! Everybody playing on tour has lost a match this year. Have they all lost their fighting spirit too? I don't see how losing to someone you've already proven you can beat (and 8 times in a row mind you) takes anything away from her fighting spirit. I see what K-dog means about Serena not getting her game to that next level the way she is capable of doing, but Serena is not yet back at the same level she was when she left the tour. Serena herself says that she is getting there and I believe her. When she starts to lose in straight sets at grandslams you can start to worry.


Well said....relax, relax.

Jakeev
May 16th, 2004, 08:08 PM
I do get it buddy!! Serena wouldn't ever make an excuse, "It's clay, I don't feel that this is a surface I can get match tough on!!" Serena losing to anybody 6-4,6-4 is striking to say the least!!
Lol no you don't get it. When you compete on clay, especially slow red clay, a power player needs one important thing: patience.

Why? Because the way the ball bounces allows an opponent to make that one extra shot.

In Serena's case, she definitely needs to be more patient to play herself through a match. Doesn't mean she as given up on winning as you so eloquently put it, but it does mean she needs a little more match play to get the bugs out.

Grass is coming folks.........

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 08:42 PM
Lol no you don't get it. When you compete on clay, especially slow red clay, a power player needs one important thing: patience.

Why? Because the way the ball bounces allows an opponent to make that one extra shot.

In Serena's case, she definitely needs to be more patient to play herself through a match. Doesn't mean she as given up on winning as you so eloquently put it, but it does mean she needs a little more match play to get the bugs out.

Grass is coming folks.........

Just the way it is....

vs1
May 16th, 2004, 08:49 PM
I think Serena is saving herself for RG. She doesn't want to peak too early and I've got a feeling it's going to be BABYGIRL TIME coming soon!! :bounce: :bounce: :bounce:

kosmikgroove
May 16th, 2004, 08:58 PM
Serena is more of a 'heart on her sleeve kind of person'.
However, just because she didn't hoot-and-holler as much
as you like doesn't mean she didn't fight just as hard.


hehe isn't that a line from Dick Button?

I've never heard of the 'heart on the sleeve' until the comments he made as Michelle was finishing up her footwork in the 04 Nationals.

In anycase, i agree, if Serena was going to "give up" she would've done so long ago. She doesn't need to always need to show emotions to show that she has 'em!

Couver
May 16th, 2004, 09:40 PM
Maybe she is just being catious. She was out of the game for 8 months with an injury that was clearly not routine. When she returned she pushed herself a little hard and it flared up again, and she had to miss another month. I believe there are precautions she has to take with her knee and she might be tweaking her game to compensate for that.

Knizzle
May 16th, 2004, 09:46 PM
Has Serena lost her will to win? Has K-Dog lost his mind??

Knizzle
May 16th, 2004, 09:49 PM
Thing is, this isnīt even a Serena-fan....just a Venus-fan who seems to be enjoying watching Serena lose.
He said the exact same thing about Venus earlier this year. He's not a Venus fan either.

Ballbuster
May 16th, 2004, 09:49 PM
I agree with K-Dog.

I've seen Serena with that same demenor at the Italian Open two years ago when she lost to Justine. She just seemed to be not in it for Every point. There was no KILL in her.

Thanks for your observations, I now know why she lost.

Knizzle
May 16th, 2004, 09:53 PM
Bandabou, you were the first one to give up on Serena and say she would lose when she was down in the 2nd set against Jen, apparently you didn't have faith that Serena could comeback against Jen.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 10:05 PM
Bandabou, you were the first one to give up on Serena and say she would lose when she was down in the 2nd set against Jen, apparently you didn't have faith that Serena could comeback against Jen.


Just by the way the match was going....but I was glad she made it 5-4.

Knizzle
May 16th, 2004, 10:08 PM
Just by the way the match was going....but I was glad she made it 5-4.
How can you criticize someone else for doubting Serena, if you, her fan are doing the same??

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 10:18 PM
How can you criticize someone else for doubting Serena, if you, her fan are doing the same??

There is: Not seeing someone winning a certain match anymore and there is seeing someone not winning anymore period.

Never ever are gonna give up on Serena. Sheīs gonna regain her dominating ways soon enough....I could live with this loss, because Serenaīs form for her first clay-tournament wasnīt bad. She did aight.....and looking how well Jen played today, maybe it wasnīt any accident.

Pureracket
May 16th, 2004, 10:23 PM
I'm thinking that Serena had the desire to win, but she just has not had enough time to practise on the clay courts, or any other courts for that matter. Check out her match trends, and we know how she is going to do.

By Serena's second or third match of the tournament, if she hasn't totally dominated @ least one match with a score like 6-2,6-1 or something like that, we know that she is struggling. At her best, she is so much better than the rest of the field that I know instantly when she is going to be struggling in a tournament. The only time she won a big tournament without such dominating scores was the AO '03. She struggled up to the very end and probably should've lost in the 1st round and the semis, but she does have a will to win.

I'm not sure that she will be able to get it toghether by next week, but I'm not giving up hope on her.

bandabou
May 16th, 2004, 10:28 PM
I'm thinking that Serena had the desire to win, but she just has not had enough time to practise on the clay courts, or any other courts for that matter. Check out her match trends, and we know how she is going to do.

By Serena's second or third match of the tournament, if she hasn't totally dominated @ least one match with a score like 6-2,6-1 or something like that, we know that she is struggling. At her best, she is so much better than the rest of the field that I know instantly when she is going to be struggling in a tournament. The only time she won a big tournament without such dominating scores was the AO '03. She struggled up to the very end and probably should've lost in the 1st round and the semis, but she does have a will to win.

I'm not sure that she will be able to get it toghether by next week, but I'm not giving up hope on her.

Good thesis...donīt think sheīs ready for the French. By the time wimbledon arrives though....

SJW
May 16th, 2004, 10:36 PM
i must admit while i loved the pic of her and Jen at the net, i was kinda surprised she was taking it so easily.

then i thought for it a bit....this is SERENA WILLIAMS...she loves to win and she always will. and a Tier I win, a quarter and a semi is brilliant for her first three completed tournaments back.

just so happy she's playing again :)

le bon vivant
May 16th, 2004, 10:56 PM
I definitely am waiting for the blonde, 2002 Serena to rear her head again. I haven't had the pleasure of seeing her since the her match against Capriati at the YEC in 2002. She has not played her best tennis at all since that match. Even at the Australian Open 2003, she did not play her best tennis. Serena, Come back!!!

Yonexforever
May 16th, 2004, 11:03 PM
I saw this match on the Tennios Channel.. Serena looked she was somwhere else during the match.
Moving s l o w l y....no stare downs, no thigh slaps.
NOTHING!
Everyone has a bad day, and female tennis players never mention EVERYTHING, that can go wrong on a given day.
I saw what you saw as well K-Dog.

Yonexforever
May 16th, 2004, 11:05 PM
While I'm at it, I noticed for the second time, Serena warming up using a ONE HANDED BACKHAND!!!
Very interesting.. I wonder why?
Isn't a warmup supposed to get you a lil feel for the ball before the match starts?

vettipooh
May 16th, 2004, 11:11 PM
...I do hope she gets an injury and has to retire...then I can lmfao and call her a quitter...it would be really funny... :) Be careful what u wish for.....it might fall on you!!!:tape:

Alan
May 16th, 2004, 11:45 PM
great players don't lose their will to win, serena would certainly NOT (maybe even never) lose hers

Siyasema
May 16th, 2004, 11:47 PM
Serena is allowed to lose once in a while. If she had no will to win she would never have come back to the sport to begin with.

LindsayRocks89
May 17th, 2004, 12:42 AM
Serena will never, i repeat never lose her fighting spirit, she has always had it and always will :bounce:

Diesel
May 17th, 2004, 02:32 AM
Ask Dementieva, Craybas, Sanchez-Lorenzo, Kuznetsova, Randriantefy, Marrero, Pierce, Sprem - a loss in the grand scheme of things and an off day means nothing. The year is long, give Serena a break because she can't be Super Woman everyday and she can't have a smile or a tantrum to show if she's in it or if she's not.

Black Mamba.
May 17th, 2004, 02:35 AM
Serena's fighting spirit is almost unmatched, she doesn't give up. Look back at the match she was down big in the second set, but she still kept fighting and clawing. If that's not fight I don't know what is.

SelesFan70
May 17th, 2004, 03:22 AM
I don't think it's necessarily that Serena has lost her will to win, but I think it's the other players are GAINING the will not lose to her. It's an interesting pendulem swing, and I can't wait to see the results this summer! :eek:

azinna
May 17th, 2004, 04:52 AM
You guys have watched enough tennis to know that a bad day is simply that. And if you've had the misfortune of watching one of your faves come back from injury (my personal torture was Steffi 1998, Venus 2004, and now Marat 2004), you'd recognise these odd, listless, tentative performances that pop up now and then as the player slowly regains consistency, confidence and match toughness.

Be patient. And by the way, don't expect too much from her during The French. The woman is amazing, but even the great need time.

Rub
May 17th, 2004, 11:34 AM
she is left... she will have to take some time to peak... like what happened to venus!

williamsfan
May 17th, 2004, 01:02 PM
Guys, she's human. Although i hate to see she lose, it is just a lost, and she can't win them all. What I really want her to do is be in the finals with her sister at Roland Garros.

Task
May 17th, 2004, 02:03 PM
If she has, I'm sure it will be back at the French Open.

MrSerenaWilliams
May 17th, 2004, 03:22 PM
Serena just goes into another gear when it comes to Grand Slams. I don't neccesarily think that she has lost her will to win, but I think that she was just so focused on Roland Garros, in fact, in my opinion, since Justine beat her, she's been obsessed with it. So, not to take ANY credit away from Jennifer, who, despite being OWNED by Mauresmo, has really turned a corner in her career, and is starting to look like the Jenny of '01. I don't think however, she has what it takes to win anymore slams. I think that she will have a long career ahead of her, but I don't know if she has anymore slams in her. She will be tough to be at Roland Garros however...hold on this is a Serena thread. Ummmmm So....NO I don't think she lost her will to win, I just think that right now her priorities are divided that's all. After she wins Roland Garros, she'll be much happier and focused on other things (like repeating the '02-'03 SERENA SLAM!)

bandabou
May 17th, 2004, 05:48 PM
Serena just goes into another gear when it comes to Grand Slams. I don't neccesarily think that she has lost her will to win, but I think that she was just so focused on Roland Garros, in fact, in my opinion, since Justine beat her, she's been obsessed with it. So, not to take ANY credit away from Jennifer, who, despite being OWNED by Mauresmo, has really turned a corner in her career, and is starting to look like the Jenny of '01. I don't think however, she has what it takes to win anymore slams. I think that she will have a long career ahead of her, but I don't know if she has anymore slams in her. She will be tough to be at Roland Garros however...hold on this is a Serena thread. Ummmmm So....NO I don't think she lost her will to win, I just think that right now her priorities are divided that's all. After she wins Roland Garros, she'll be much happier and focused on other things (like repeating the '02-'03 SERENA SLAM!)


Hear ya, hear ya!

DeDe4925
May 17th, 2004, 06:27 PM
I'm not saying this because I'm trying to hate on Serena, she's my 2nd favorite player, but I guess that it's the fighter in me that can't stand when other people don't give 100%. I'm sure Richard wouldn't have liked Serena's demenor on the court yesterday. I like it when Serena is all fired-up and she is screaming at herself and grunting really loud, and yelling come-on out there. I'm just saying that I didn't see that yesterday, and it's a bit unusual for Serena, that's all.
I totally agree with you. I saw the match on TTC and she looked very listless. Like she had no energy. She wasn't pumping her fists, hardly no grunts, nor was she patting her thighs trying to get the adreneline flowing. It's like she took a dive. Not that I think she or JenCap would do that, but that's what it looked like out there or she was PMS'ing badly. Her footwork was bad and she wasn't giving it her all, IMO.

DeDe4925
May 17th, 2004, 06:46 PM
You guys have watch enough tennis to know that a bad day is simply that. And if you've had the misfortune of watching one of your faves come back from injury (my personal torture was Steffi 1998, Venus 2004, and now Marat 2004), you'd recognise these odds, listless, tentative performances that pop up now and then as the player slowly regains consistency, confidence and match toughness.

Be patient. And by the way, don't expect too much from her during The French. The woman is amazing, but even the great need time.
Great post azinna. I totally agree with you here. I don't think that Serena has lost her desire or will to win. I think she just needs to get match tough again against the top players. Once she starts winning, she'll get that confidence back and we will see less of these listless performances from her.