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wongqks
Feb 24th, 2002, 11:46 AM
``I was waiting, waiting for an opportunity to pass,'' Ohno said. ``The Japanese guy was wide on the corner and I came up on him. I barely touched him. He's so light, I think he was going down already.''

I understand that he deserve the gold medal after knowing that corsstracking, although not a very serious offense but still will result in DQ. But
He cannot accept he was wrong, just show what kind of personality he has.

matthias
Feb 24th, 2002, 11:50 AM
you are right.
ohno is arrogant and think, only he is the best

V.Melb
Feb 24th, 2002, 11:51 AM
Yes .... he's a prick - nothing more! cocky and arrogant! :fiery:

But i am sure some blinded love-sick Ohno fan will come in here and call that comment "brash" :rolleyes:

ys
Feb 24th, 2002, 01:46 PM
Take it easy, guys, he is just an American.

angele87
Feb 24th, 2002, 01:52 PM
ys you're so pathetic, you should be kicked off this board.

Well I am a huge Apolo fan but unlike some ppl *cough cough* I can admit when one of my favorites does something wrong and I have to admit that his DQ was the right call and that those comments are a bit cocky.

matthias
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:26 PM
ys: you are right :wavey:

angele87
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:35 PM
ys and matthias: Why do you assume all americans are arrogant?

Iconoclast
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:38 PM
Correct or not, his DQ was inconsequential since he only finished 3rd in that race.

Dong-Sung Kim got beat by Gagnon and Smith in his semifinal, so the big showdown was spoiled anyway.

Nice performance by the Canadians in shorttrack. Not to mention China's Yang Yang (A).

USA lost its chance of finishing top of the medal table because of their misfortunes last night.

Aloysius
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:42 PM
Oh no... ;)

SerenasMelons
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:51 PM
He did know he did something wrong and that he was going to be disqualified. Thats why he eased up the last half lap, because he knew that to try to finish would only be in vain.

Lola
Feb 24th, 2002, 02:55 PM
JUSTICE HAS BEEN DONE...

matthias
Feb 24th, 2002, 03:19 PM
Originally posted by angele87
ys and matthias: Why do you assume all americans are arrogant?

i think not all americans are arrogant, but i saw many at SLC and the most american athlets are arrogant.

it is good to have much self-confidence, but not like apolo anton ohno or bode miller or the women ice-hockey team

selesfan
Feb 25th, 2002, 04:46 PM
Funny! I didn't think he was arrogant at all, he was cute and excited about his Olympic experience. Sour grapes if you ask me.

bryan26
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:12 PM
All athletes are arrogant in a way. They know they're good and don't hide it. Also, Americans never fail doping tests and almost every other country has athletes that dope.

wongqks
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:21 PM
If it is not in America, his comment would definitely be treated as a bit of racism, I agree that some of us are a bit extreme over ohno, but then with comments like that, I cannot believe some people can say his comment is cute. Oh my god, what is happening in this world.

selesfan
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:31 PM
Funny, I see the same things differently. When a European is obnoxious and arrogant they are considered cute, and when an American does they are raked through the coals. I guess things will never change.:o

Iconoclast
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:42 PM
Sorry, Bryan26, but that is a preposterous claim.

Remember C.J. Hunter, Marion Jones' ex-husband? He tested positive for nandrolone 4 times, but still made it to the Olympics, courtesy USTAF.

Dennis Mitchell? Busted for testosterone. He claimed it was due to beer and sex (4 intercourses the night prior). The gullible USATF bought this, only to have the IAAF overturn their decision.

Butch Reynolds. Former 400m world record holder. Busted for steroids.

Sandra Farmer Patrick. Another US track star. Served a four-year drug ban.

Do you think Flo Jo was clean? The USTAF has an appaling doping record. Few out-of-competition tests, notoriusly hiding positive results. At least they have now installed the USADA as an independent agent.

The US cycling team for Los Angeles '84 experimented with blood doping. Two American athletes won 3 golds in Seoul '88. Both were on drugs. Names have never been submitted.

What about the big pro sports in the US. How is the testing in baseball, football, hockey, basketball? Do you believe its on par with international standards? I don't think you would find a doping expert on this planet who would claim that. Who said Mark McGwire?

Motorola, US Postal. Successful in the world of pro cycling where clean riders hardly make up 20 percent of the peleton. And it frankly ain't those at the front.

However, I do agree with your point about Apolo Anton. I don't find him particularly arrogant myself. A bit cocky perhaps. But at least he puts on a show.

Tracey
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:48 PM
Ok guys, Bottom line is that Ohno is young and doesn't have alot of experience in competition at this level. It takes some getting used to conducting yourself at the world level. He needs to be educated on this type of conduct. Let's face it, there are arrogant jerks of every race, from every country all over the world. Isn't the olympics supposed to be about puting a side political differences to discover the best athletes of the world? I mean really. :rolleyes:

the cat
Feb 25th, 2002, 07:49 PM
From what I've seen of Apolo, he seems like a nice kid. But he is only human. And humans make mistakes, and say the wrong things. Why can't you cut him some slack?

Like it or not, Ohno may have been the most popular athlete at the Winter Olympics. He won NBC's poll for favorite athlete at the olympics. I thought it should have been Jim Shea.

Iconoclast
Feb 25th, 2002, 08:09 PM
I think he has taken a lot of heat because people were disgusted with Dong-Sung Kim's DQ. But that was the decision of the Australian referee.

He can be blamed for acting up when the Korean shut the inside path in front of him, but that was the heat of the moment.

Kim, similarly, deserve criticism for celebrating prematurely. He is experienced enough to know that the referee had to consider the legality of his actions. A DQ was a real possibility.

But he picked up the flag as a gesture - a way of saying: "You don't dare take this gold away from me".

So, in fact, they were both trying to influence the ref.

Tracey
Feb 25th, 2002, 08:18 PM
Just curious wongquks, Are you aware of ohno's cultural background?Where his parents are from etc? The racism card is a pretty big one to draw, before you know about the person.

p.s. I am Canadian and my daughter is by- racial ....before anyone gets on my case.

wongqks
Feb 25th, 2002, 08:23 PM
I am not accusing him of racism, I am just saying that comments like that never goes well to the public if you are dealing with poeple from the different countries. I dun really care where is come from, coz it does not change the fact that his comment is uncall for. I am not in a position to criticise him coz I dunno him, but all of you have to understand that fact that his comment if being interpret wrongly, can easily has been a racism remark/

Tracey
Feb 25th, 2002, 08:35 PM
Well you are right , doesn't really matter where he is from, it's just that why would he say a racial comment to someone from his own culture? He is mixed himself. So I dunno?!?!?!? Let's hope they work on his social skills now that he is a world athlete. I can see your point, that it could be taken that way. I hope he gets the coaching he needs.:)

wongqks
Feb 25th, 2002, 09:19 PM
Tracey,

It is really nice of you to understand my point, not many people can see it both way. I am sure he will have many olympics in him adn wish him every success, but again he need to work on his diplomatic skill, which I am sure he will when he grew older.

Jordan.
Feb 25th, 2002, 09:23 PM
Grrr!!!I like him! :drool:

rated_next
Feb 25th, 2002, 09:25 PM
American athletes, in general, are more arrogant than other athletes. I'm so relieved that Germany beat them in the final medal standings.

Iconoclast: exactly ...

who knows how many americans had drugs in these olympics as well...

Tracey
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:19 PM
rated_next

I'm just wondering how you gather that from watching the media coverage? What made them seem so arrogant? Also, should athletes be penelized for celebrating early? Really? I'm glad Sele and Pelltier saved themselves that (cough cough) As a person against early celebration I'm sure you see the fact that they were celebrating (kissing ice) early as a problem, otherwise how could you agree with iconoclast? Such broad statements. How embarassing to think back to Ben Johnson (CANADIAN) when throwing stones at the American Athletes.

Iconoclast
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:30 PM
Originally posted by Tracey
Also, should athletes be penelized for celebrating early? Really?
Tracey, I know this was not directly addressed at me. Kim was certainly justified to celebrate that he crossed the line first. But he started his victory lap with the national flag before the official results were in. As a seasoned shorttracker, he surely knew they were considering a disqualification. I believe he used it as a tactical maneuvre to apply pressure to the chief ref.

That's all.

VSFan1 aka Joshua L.
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:31 PM
rated_next, that is a very stereotypical, prejudiced post.

It's like saying, "Most black atheletes are arrogant."

It's not fair to everybody. You are wrong and need to apologize.

angele87
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:43 PM
I gotta agree with Iconoclast... if it was the other way around and Apolo would have gotten DQ'd during his victory lap with the flag people would be saying that he was arrogant and so sure of himself for celebrating before the official results but no one has said anything like that about the korean....

Also I'm sure, like somone said (sorry don't remember who) that Apolo putting his hands up during the race was just a reaction.... do you honestly think before the race started he was thinking *ok, i'll stay back, get to second place with a few laps to go and then with a half lap remaining I'll try to pass the korean then put up my hands so the ref will DQ him*?? Please... try to make sense here!

Also some people have a really hard time realizing that IT WAS NOT APOLO WHO DQ'D KIM IT WAS THE REFEREE!! If you really feel the need to blame somebody for this siuation, blame the ref... but I don't think there is anybody to blame for this except Kim because HE CROSS-TRACKED!! That is against the rules.... is there anybody who doesn't understand that????

Tracey
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:47 PM
yes iconoclast , I agree, it is important that we all understand that in judged events pre celebration will happen. doing the victory lap with the flag was wrong. I know where you are coming from, However as Canadians rated_next and I should recognize that there was celebration before marks (as wrong as the marks were) of our Canadian pairs team. No flag was used but the reaction certainly was victorious.:)

Hurley
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:51 PM
The problem with insinuating -- check that -- flat out stating that "American athletes are arrogant" is that we see arrogance and humility, joy and anger, sadness and relief from mostly the American athletes BECAUSE:

1. Seeing as how most of us involved in this discussion watched the Olympics from either the US or Canada, we are seeing mostly the US and Canadian athletes.

2. Since the US had 34 medal winners, more than all countries but one, wherever you are, you saw many Americans in the coverage.

Why do so many of us think Venus Williams, Martina Hingis, Pete Sampras, Jennifer Capriati, and Serena Williams are arrogant? It's because they are on TV a lot, since they are famous and win a lot. We see all sides of them because we see them so much. Perhaps Emilie Loit or Jennifer Hopkins are more arrogant than Hingis or Capriati or Williams...we don't know because they never get press!

I'm sure Russians and Germans and Norwegians all had their own personal moments of arrogance and humility as well.

Crazy Canuck
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:54 PM
Tracey - though I don't agree with Rated Next's statements about American athletes at all - I don't see how you berating Canadian athletes makes it any better :confused:

for the record - Jamie and David were just releived to be done, and knew they skated great. Can they not celebrate a great skate? David said after, that he was just so exhilarated to have it all over with - there was so much pressure on them, and it had been lifted. So what if he kissed the ice? It didn't mean he had thought they won right that second :rolleyes:


I think the American athletes get an unfair amount of flack personally. I mean, sure some are cocky. But their athletes also get a fair bit more of press than athletes from other countires - who don't pay as much attention to everything that comes out of their athletes mouths.
People tend to put the American athletes under a microscope, just waiting for them to mess up. Then when they do the smallest thing - everyone jumps on it. And when they haven't done anything, people get frusterated and look for something where there is nothing.
Its all a little silly, and not fair at all.

Granted, SOME things the American athletes have done isn't exactly of the greates sportsmanship. ie - the womens hockey team coach allegedly stomping on the Canadian flag between periods - the mens hockey team declaring that Canadians play "stupid hockey" before the gold medal match.

My all time favourite was in 1996 when the media basically awarded the 4 by 100 American relay team the Gold medal before the race - and Canada won :D That ws the media more than the runners though. I think.

Which is another point - the media blows a lot of it out of proportion, and the media proclaims cocky things about the USA athletes - but the athletes get the flack for it. :confused:


However if you look carefully enough, I'm sure people from other countries, including my own, have said and done things that could be considered disrespectful and egocentric.

Trust me - arrogance is not soley an American trait - it plagues us all ;)

angele87
Feb 25th, 2002, 10:57 PM
Originally posted by Hurley

I'm sure Russians and Germans and Norwegians all had their own personal moments of arrogance and humility as well.

I just wanna add on to that a little bit... and please nobody get mad about this statement, it's not meant to be insulting I'm just stating some facts...

For me personally, I don't know if russians, germans etc... are arrogant but if they are it would be hard for me to tell because you have to realize that for most of these ppl, their first language is not english so when they do talk to north american broadcasters, they are probably more reserved and cautious than they would be in their native language... i know for me i'm more comfortable in english so when i talk french, depending on the topic, i don't really come across as i really am

Iconoclast
Feb 25th, 2002, 11:01 PM
Very true, Hurley.

Add to that the political connotation of an American athlete performing internationally. Representing the most powerful nation on earth have repercussions if you are locked in tight battle against someone from a country with a more modest presence on the international scene. You are simply supposed to meet higher standards than everyone else.

BTW, your avatar makes me feel like I'm watching an episode of the ancient sitcom "Blossom". The big brother with the fancy hair... Joey or something?

angele87
Feb 25th, 2002, 11:02 PM
Becca has a strong point... the american athletes really are under the microscope and people jump on the smallest things... for example people were furious at Apolo because he put his hands up during a race but yet I haven't seen anybody bash the russian cross country skiier (not that I think she should be bashed) who failed a drug test... if it was an american who had tested positive , ppl would be all over it!!

rated_next
Feb 25th, 2002, 11:02 PM
Hurley: you changed my mind ... i apologize for my comments

VSFan1: sorry :kiss:

Hurley
Feb 26th, 2002, 12:08 AM
LOL Iconoclast...I never thought of that, but you're right...Ohno did kinda look like Joey Lawrence in that picture! But the Olympics are over; back to a tennis avatar for me. I know I'll get flamed for it being Roddick though. ;)

Tracey
Feb 26th, 2002, 12:11 AM
oh becca sweety re read my post, for the record I CRIED FOLLOWING THE PREFORMANCE! You have misunderstood my post. For the record he(David Pelltier) did think he had won the gold as he stated in an interview after. Anyway I was trying to make a point to make rated_next understand, That other athletes other than Americans are celebrating before marks. You must Understand clearly the devastation I felt when I saw those marks. As a Canadian it was a very difficult night. I have followed David and Jamie from the beginning of their career and I couldn't agree with you more that it was the skate of their career.:) Berating my fellow Canadians...never.

Crazy Canuck
Feb 26th, 2002, 01:31 AM
Appologies Tracey - I didn't know you were Canadian.

Had I realized that I would have figured you were using Canadian athletes as an example just cause you knew more about them - but since I didn't know better I thought you were trying to point out the athletes in rated next's country that had done the same thing - which wasn't wrong to begin with.

Sorry for being an ass :)

Now that I think of it, I remember you starting a thread about being Canadian after the hockey game sunday - doh!

Scotso
Feb 26th, 2002, 01:38 AM
Don't really care about this but someone should really tell him to shave that growth off his chin.

Jordan.
Feb 26th, 2002, 01:55 AM
Its cute!:(

Experimentee
Feb 26th, 2002, 01:39 PM
Its weird how people think Ohno is "cute" but consider Venus, Serena and Hingis arrogant. :rolleyes:

Crazy Canuck
Feb 26th, 2002, 04:18 PM
Agreed Experimentee. People tend to be quite inconsistent in their accusations.