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post #4605 of (permalink) Old Dec 15th, 2012, 11:09 AM
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Re: On the Concept of Irony w/ Continual Reference to Caro, the #1 Sunshine Queen

Originally Posted by Chrissie-fan View Post
I don't single out crimes by religious people as worse as those from others either. I only mentionned it to say that the're no better or worse than the rest of us.

When it comes to the hell doctrine, well, at least when it comes to the Christian faith it all depends on what the bible says about it, don't it? If you claim to be "a true Christian" you can't go, "Ok, I like this part, so I'll believe it, but I don't believe this part because I don't like it." As far as I'm concerned you either believe all of it or none of it.

Problem is that most Christians really haven't got a clue about what's in the bible. At the most they are familiar with certain parts of it. Time has erased most of what I've read from my mind, but in my younger days I've read quite a bit of it, including the prophecies - Daniel and Revelations especially, the last of which is incomprehensible to most because they can't make heads or tails of the symbolism in the book. But with the help of some books I've managed to plow my way through it and I've learned that all the syumbols that are in the bible are actually explained in the bible itself. In other words, "the bible always explains itself."

Anyway, to cut a long (and no doubt boring ) story short, Revelation is about the evils of world religions, the false prophet, the anti-Christ, how you'll be able to recognoze him when he arrives on the scene (the famous 666 number of the beast), how this figure who is actually a representation of Satan will deceive the world into thinking that he's God, the return of Christ after a 3 1/2 year rule of this anti-Christ figure, predictions of plagues, wars, earthquakes and much, much more. Fascinating stuff, and things that most of those that call themselves Christians are totally unaware off.
OK - but leaving aside the book of Revelations which could mean anything - what I meant to say about hell being a problem is that logically if you think your friends are going to hell because they don't believe - that should drive you to try to convert them. And evangelists who try to do that to me are a real turn off. So if you want to be friends with others - you don't try to convert them. But ... You see where I'm coming from here. It's not really me with the problem. We are friends because we are friends - nothing else. But I just think that must be a conflict in their minds not to try to convert me if they really believe the gospel which the bible states (unless you interpret it as a Universalist).

One thing all this reminds me of is the hatred Margaret Court has got on this forum and elsewhere for her views on gay marriage etc. which are based on deep religious conviction. I also saw an open letter from Nav arguing with her. What was the point of that? To try to make her change her mind? The person I have the most respect for on this is BJK. She couldn't disagree more with Margaret Court but they are friends for friends sake. They see each other and they don't talk about that stuff and try to convert each other. Of course the claim on these boards is when Margaret Court stated she was friends with those who don't share her views is that she is only friends to try to convert them. I think BJK would disagree.

Caroline Wozniacki

Chris Evert, Steffi Graf, Kim Clijsters
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