Unforced errors and total points thread - TennisForum.com
Old Dec 29th, 2013, 05:21 PM Thread Starter
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Unforced errors and total points thread

I want to continue the idea of HH from HH opening a thread to document the stats of total points and unforced errors (including double faults!) to calculate the aggressive margin value who shows the difference between forced points and unforced errors of a player in relation to the total points of the match (made by both players completely).

The formula is:

aggressive margin = [(total points player - (unforced errors + double fault opponent)) - unforced errors player ] / total points match

Or more simple: AM = (forced points - unforced errors)/total match points

This value is an indicator for the controlled offensive efforts of a player within a certain match. It shows in relation how many unforced errors a player is making when he is trying to dominate the match by either hitting winners or forcing errors of the opponent (compare with Otto Rehagels kontrollierter Offensive ).

In this thread it would be enough to document the total points and the unforced errors/double faults of each player. This must be given, all other values can be calculated automatically. Winners and forced errors are summarized as forced points. So this thread could be a central database.

The total points we get by wta stats, so very important would be to post TV stats including the UEs/DFs - if available.

It would make sense to give a link to the source of the stats or to release a screenshot with the stats.

Of course due to this forum section we are interested especially in the values of the German players but we should post the stats of any other players too to have data as much as possible for comparision. So we don't need any national restrictions. Anyone is invited to post the stats here.

As an example I was calculating the values of Petko and Sabine yesterday:

Petkovic def. Mattek Sands 64 75
Total points: 80-69
UEs (incl. DFs): 26-43

Source:
1R Brisbane: Petkovic def. Mattek Sands 6:4 7:5

Lisicki def. Rybarikova 63 64
Total points: 71-58
UEs (incl. DFs): 36-26

Excel calculates the AM values:
Petkovic vs. Mattek 7%/0% (BMS was exactly hitting the same amount of UEs as she was forcing points by her own!)

Lisicki vs. Rybarikova 7%/-3% (Ryba was making too many errors due to her capability/willingness of forcing own points)

Special thanks to HH from HH (who had the idea) and mk, who was calculating some AM values of the past right here!

Would be nice if we could collect some data here.
Bino is offline

Old Dec 30th, 2013, 11:47 AM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

I think DFs are already included in the UEs.
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Old Dec 30th, 2013, 12:13 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mk27 View Post
I think DFs are already included in the UEs.
Really? I didn't know that. This would make it even a bit easier.

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Old Dec 30th, 2013, 12:19 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bino View Post
Really? I didn't know that. This would make it even a bit easier.

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I think so, because aces are already included in the winners count as well.
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Old Dec 30th, 2013, 12:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mk27 View Post
I think so, because aces are already included in the winners count as well.
Ok this sounds very reasonable.

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Old Dec 31st, 2013, 08:18 AM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Williams def. Petkovic 64 64
Total points: 78-66
UEs: 36-27

Quote:
Originally Posted by matthias View Post
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 03:50 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Agg Mar:
Williams - Petkovic 10-2%
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 04:16 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Jankovic-Kerber 67 63 61

Total points: 120-95
UEs: 50-41

Source: Poseidon
Brisbane 1/4 final: Jelena Jankovic SRB (4) d. Angelique Kerber GER (5) 67 (8) 63 61

AM: 13-2%
Relation forced/own points (FOP): 58/56%

So Jankovic was playing just a bit more offensively (58-56) but was much more effective (13-2) by doing this.
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:09 PM

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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

ich kapier das nicht
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:19 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by matthias View Post
ich kapier das nicht
Ich auch nicht

Das Quality Race ist noch schlimmer

Traveling up and down the Rankings with
Sabine Lisicki
Ziva is offline
Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:27 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Wieso ist doch ganz einfach.

Der AM berechnet sich aus Winners + Forced Errors - eigene UE und dann setzt man es in Relation zur Gesamtpunktzahl.

Die Winners + Forced Errors bekommt man auch heraus, wenn man die gegnerischen UEs von den eigenen gewonnenen Punkte abzieht.

Nehmen wir mal Petkovic als Beispiel gegen Williams.
Petkovic machte 66 Punkte, davon waren 36 UEs von Williams, heißt also dass sie 30 Winners/FE gemacht hat. Jetzt muss man davon die eigenen UEs abziehen. Also 30 - 27 = 3. Und diese 3 setzte ich jetzt in Relation zur Gesamtpunktzahl, also 3:144 = 0,0208 = 2,08%

Alles klar
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:32 PM

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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

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Originally Posted by mk27 View Post
Alles klar
ja ne, is klar jetzt

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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:38 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziva View Post
Das Quality Race ist noch schlimmer
Was genau denn?
Katja is offline
Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:41 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Man muss nur alle Daten für diese Formel haben
(eigene Winner + eigene FE - eigene UE)/Gesamtpunktzahl

Man muss eben auch die UE berücksichtigen, weil es ja nichts nützt 80 Winners/FE zu schlagen und dabei dann 100 UE selbst zu machen. Wenn ich nur die Winners/FE in Relation zur Gesamtpunktzahl setze, dann werden immer Damen wie Barthel, Görges und Lisicki da sehr hohe Werte haben, egal ob sie gewinnen oder verlieren.

Last edited by mk27; Jan 3rd, 2014 at 12:52 PM.
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Old Jan 3rd, 2014, 12:48 PM
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Re: Unforced errors and total points thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by mk27 View Post
Wieso ist doch ganz einfach.

Der AM berechnet sich aus Winners + Forced Errors - eigene UE und dann setzt man es in Relation zur Gesamtpunktzahl.

Die Winners + Forced Errors bekommt man auch heraus, wenn man die gegnerischen UEs von den eigenen gewonnenen Punkte abzieht.

Nehmen wir mal Petkovic als Beispiel gegen Williams.
Petkovic machte 66 Punkte, davon waren 36 UEs von Williams, heißt also dass sie 30 Winners/FE gemacht hat. Jetzt muss man davon die eigenen UEs abziehen. Also 30 - 27 = 3. Und diese 3 setzte ich jetzt in Relation zur Gesamtpunktzahl, also 3:144 = 0,0208 = 2,08%

Alles klar

Traveling up and down the Rankings with
Sabine Lisicki
Ziva is offline

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