If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles .... - TennisForum.com
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post #1 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:22 PM Thread Starter
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If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

.... how do you order the players, ALL TIME. in terms of greatness?

For these purposes, I'm going to argue that the arguments about competition being tougher are match by cultural opposition to femlae athletics, difficulties of travel, lack of opportunities, etc. Treat all singles wins as equal to all singles wins, all doubles wins equal to all doubles wins etc. If you don't, it's a dissertation just to set up the comparision.

Name as many players as you like, but if you list something ridiculous, like 'Maria Kirilenko was greater than Chris Evert', at least give a reason, just for laughs

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post #2 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:23 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

1. Navratilova
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post #3 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:23 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Maria Kirilenko was greater than Chris Evert, becuase she's hotter

Daniilidou. Venus. Azarenka. Halep. Wickmayer.
Cornet. Ivanovic. Vesnina.. Vaidisova. Krajicek.
Paszek. Begu. Cirstea. Lisicki. Pavlyuchenkova.
Pironkova. Stephens. Tatishvili. McHale. Flipkens.
Grammatikopoulou ~ Papamichail ~ Sakkari
I'm obsessed with the Greek players. Deal with it.

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post #4 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:24 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Margaret Smith Court is the true GOAT 62 total Grand Slam titles more than Martina Navratilova's 59.


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post #5 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:26 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

This list was posted by me on the silly thread about Pierce as GOAT, but it applies here also. Navratilova is the GOAT with 167 career titles, she creams everybody else except Evert.

OPEN ERA WTA SINGLE TITLE LEADERS

Navratilova 167
Evert 154
Graf 107
Court 92
Cawley 68
King 67
Wade 55
Davenport 55
Seles 53
Hingis 43
Henin 41
V. Williams 41
Clijsters 34
C. Martinez 33
S. Williams 33
Austin 30

Last edited by bobbynorwich; Apr 18th, 2009 at 10:28 PM. Reason: .
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post #6 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:28 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Yeah, I had a feeling it would be Martina

Daniilidou. Venus. Azarenka. Halep. Wickmayer.
Cornet. Ivanovic. Vesnina.. Vaidisova. Krajicek.
Paszek. Begu. Cirstea. Lisicki. Pavlyuchenkova.
Pironkova. Stephens. Tatishvili. McHale. Flipkens.
Grammatikopoulou ~ Papamichail ~ Sakkari
I'm obsessed with the Greek players. Deal with it.

ANNA GERASIMOU-EIRINI GEORGATOU ALWAYS AND FOREVER
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post #7 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:28 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbynorwich View Post
This list was posted by me on the silly thread about Pierce as GOAT, but it applies here also. Navratilova is the GOAT with 167 career titles, she creams everybody else.

OPEN ERA WTA SINGLE TITLE LEADERS

Navratilova 167
Evert 154
Graf 107
Court 92
Cawley 68
King 67
Wade 55
Davenport 55
Seles 53
Hingis 43
Henin 41
V. Williams 41
Clijsters 34
C. Martinez 33
S. Williams 33
Austin 30
That is Open Era, not all time like first post is asking. BJK, Wade, and Court all won more titles before 1968.


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post #8 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:35 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uranium View Post
That is Open Era, not all time like first post is asking. BJK, Wade, and Court all won more titles before 1968.
Ok, good point. Would be interesting to know how many titles they each had before 1968 if not included on this list. According to Wikipedia, Wade retired in 1986, King in 1983, and Court in 1977.
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post #9 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:39 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbynorwich View Post
Ok, good point. Would be interesting to know how many titles they each had before 1968 if not included on this list. According to Wikipedia, Wade retired in 1986, King in 1983, and Court in 1977.
Supposedly Court won 197, Wade won 68 and BJK won 129.


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post #10 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:44 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

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Originally Posted by Uranium View Post
Supposedly Court won 197, Wade won 68 and BJK won 129.
Wow, 197 career titles for Court --- that's impressive. Wonder how to eliminate from the pre-open era all the junker tourneys from the legitimate ones with real competition, to get a truly comparable career title count.
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post #11 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 10:57 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Court's Grand Slam title count is vastly overrated thanks to Australian Open and the level of competition that tournament had back then.

Navratilova's record is easily the most impressive.
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post #12 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 11:01 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

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Originally Posted by Uranium View Post
Margaret Smith Court is the true GOAT 62 total Grand Slam titles more than Martina Navratilova's 59.
According to wikipedia, Martina only (yeah, only) has 18 GS titles. What stat are you thinking about?
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post #13 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 11:01 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbynorwich View Post
According to wikipedia, Martina only (yeah, only) has 18 GS titles. What stat are you thinking about?
TOTAL is the key word, meaning in singles, doubles and mixed all combined.


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post #14 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 18th, 2009, 11:06 PM
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
.... how do you order the players, ALL TIME. in terms of greatness?

For these purposes, I'm going to argue that the arguments about competition being tougher are match by cultural opposition to femlae athletics, difficulties of travel, lack of opportunities, etc. Treat all singles wins as equal to all singles wins, all doubles wins equal to all doubles wins etc. If you don't, it's a dissertation just to set up the comparision.

Name as many players as you like, but if you list something ridiculous, like 'Maria Kirilenko was greater than Chris Evert', at least give a reason, just for laughs
Lol. That's a liberal use of begging the question, isn't it?
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post #15 of 50 (permalink) Old Apr 19th, 2009, 12:42 AM Thread Starter
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Re: If you count singles, doubles, mixed, Olympics, Fed Cup, total titles ....

Quote:
Originally Posted by kman View Post
Court's Grand Slam title count is vastly overrated thanks to Australian Open and the level of competition that tournament had back then.
A point I dealt with in the opening post of the thread.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcana View Post
For these purposes, I'm going to argue that the arguments about competition being tougher are match by cultural opposition to femlae athletics, difficulties of travel, lack of opportunities, etc. Treat all singles wins as equal to all singles wins, all doubles wins equal to all doubles wins etc. If you don't, it's a dissertation just to set up the comparision.
Toss in how homophobia and the Cold War affectect Navratilova's totals.

We can get into all that in another thread, but it is, literally, a dissertation.

How many more slams does Court win if traveling FROM Australia hadn't been so arduous. How many more does Helen Wills Moody win if travel wasn't so arduous? And expensive. Althea Gibson quit tennis because there was no money in it. Where would she rank even being paid what Nav was, much less what today's players get?

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