"Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..." - TennisForum.com
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 04:10 AM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,841
                     
"Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

"Sport is that child we raised with money but not love, who we allowed to grow up amid privilege but no values except to win at all costs." - Bill Rhoden
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/15/sp...l?ref=baseball

The article refers to baseball. But consider the shrieks of Sharapova (and Venus, and Seles, and a host of others), the squeaks of Ivanovic, the Karantancheva steroids, Justine Henin and "the Hand", Capriati and her argument that she deserved to benefit by demonstrably bad calls because she'd been victimized by them, and of course, the coaching and the bathroom breaks. The relation to tennis begins to come into focus.

Few of you (Fingon will) remember 1968, and the beginning of open tennis. And the arguments against it. Chief among those arguments, tennis was a sport built on honor and honesty and sportsmanship beyond all else, and professionalism would ruin that. That dishonesty in the relentless pursuit of the money that comes with winning would become the norm.

It was said that Arthur Ashe could just raise an eyebrow over a bad call and the chair umpire would overrule. His reputation for honesty was so bulletproof that if he questioned a call, there was NO doubt he was right. Who among today's players is given that kind of respect? And who has earned it? Who COULD earn it? The amounts of money involved are so huge, the concept of honor so vanishing, that one simply can NOT assume that a player holds their reputation higher than the millions they can win. Think about it. Venus Williams' children, should she have any, will never have to work, if Venus invests wisely. Speaking as a parent, that's an assurance for my children I only wish I had.

When I was a kid, sports was said to build character, and teach the values of discipline, respect, honesty and hard work. 'Honesty' has somehow been lost. It used to be that losing honestly and honorably was better than winning by taking every shotcut and advantage possible. No longer so. Predictably so, some would say.

So, to re-visit that old argument, that so few here will remember, was the move to open tennis ultimately a mistake? Tennis has lost both it's honor AND it's popularity. What has it gained? For the players, money. But what of the sport itself?

Proud to be an American
Not blind. Not uninformed. We are party to atrocities. But the response of the world after 9/11 is worth noting. Even our most dire enemies offered aid. We should all be so lucky.
Volcana is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 06:00 AM
Sunset, Moonrise, Winter
 
Sam L's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: La La Land
Posts: 35,786
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

It's true. I think you make a lot of good points actually. But don't forget Graf turning a blind eye in the '99 RG final. That's another example.

Light of the Seven: Himalayas, Gobi, Baikal, Taiga, Steppe, Alps, Aurora

Dancing and Skating through Life
Sam L is offline  
post #3 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 06:04 AM
Senior Member
 
Junex's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,135
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Sadly, this is not just in sports...
in this days, it is beyond sports!
money has become so powerful that when the stakes are higher, values & honor are thrown out the window....

there are a few who still regard values and honor priceless.... the select few...
but the people who are cast in the limelight, the rich and the famous... the politicians have become the epitome of dishonor and disgrace, and yet they are still put up in a high pedestal such that we the common mass would think.... It is OK....

Sad really...but I have learned to accept that this is human's destiny...a road to a doomed existence!....

that is why i never made a family of my own... I am afraid for my children.....

Who said there will be change....?
As long as people lived by the currency..
as long as politicians and politics are run by money...
there won't be no CHANGE...
People are easily corrupted!!!!!

Justine Henin - Unfinished Business "Wimbledon"


Sesil "the thunder" Karatantcheva
Vaidisova-Azarenka-Pavlyuchenkova-A&U Radwanska-Wozniacki-Cornet
Junex is offline  
post #4 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 06:06 AM
Serena's #1 Hater
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 19,725
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

All sports have become corrupted by money. Period. Next topic, please.

"He who finds a wife finds a good thing, and obtains favor from the Lord." -- Proverbs 18:22

"Hard work beats talent when talent doesn't work hard." -- Herb Brooks

"A man who views the world the same at 50 as he did at 20 has wasted 30 years of his life." -- Muhammad Ali
darrinbaker00 is offline  
post #5 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 07:22 AM
Senior Member
 
DOUBLEFIST's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: LA
Posts: 10,565
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Junex View Post
...that is why i never made a family of my own... I am afraid for my children.....
The only way to change the world is to teach the children we raise to change it. In absence of raising "changed" children, expect more of the same from the world, understanding that the reasoning of your own choice has had a hand in it.


As for sports, the issue is not the money in the game it's the INDIVIDUALS in the money, so to speak. It takes a strong individual to determine integrity and absolution are not for sale.

JA ME KA IS THE GOAT!!!
23!!!!The Debate is OVER, Suckas!!
Queen Vee , Keys!, Steffi , Maria,Pre-Carlos Na A-Rad
DOUBLEFIST is offline  
post #6 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 08:07 AM
Senior Member
 
Junex's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 3,135
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by DOUBLEFIST View Post
The only way to change the world is to teach the children we raise to change it. In absence of raising "changed" children, expect more of the same from the world, understanding that the reasoning of your own choice has had a hand in it.


As for sports, the issue is not the money in the game it's the INDIVIDUALS in the money, so to speak. It takes a strong individual to determine integrity and absolution are not for sale.
I am just over dramatic in my first post....
actually i am gay so there would be little desire for me to have children...

But If I have to have children, i would raise them to be of good values.
And I will teach them not to learn not to look-up to other people...
to stick to their own values and follow fairly the rules of the land...
to ignore the previledges of others but be mindful to the needs of the many...

But the world we are leaving is scary...
People values the money.
people are so focused on how to get rich...
Rich people and their lifestyles are shoved in our throat....
and the world that is governed by money....is scary.....

Justine Henin - Unfinished Business "Wimbledon"


Sesil "the thunder" Karatantcheva
Vaidisova-Azarenka-Pavlyuchenkova-A&U Radwanska-Wozniacki-Cornet
Junex is offline  
post #7 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 08:17 AM
Senior Member
 
Mr_Molik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 8,571
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sam L View Post
It's true. I think you make a lot of good points actually. But don't forget Graf turning a blind eye in the '99 RG final. That's another example.
turned a blind eye to what? hingis behaving like a petulant child?

Go the Aussies

Sophie Ferguson ~ Casey Dellacqua ~ Samantha Stosur ~ Jessica Moore ~ Christina Wheeler ~ Monique Adamczak ~
Mr_Molik is offline  
post #8 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 01:33 PM
Guest
 
*JR*'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: On the Peace Train
Posts: 34,246
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

You want a real scandal, try the raiding of tax money that should repair the crumbling American infrastructure to replace perfectly sound baseball/football stadiums that were in service for 30 years or less with new ones where the elite can rent skyboxes to remain separate from ordinary ppl. (Which the NY Times article linked to doesn't address).

Remember last summer's bridge collapse in Minneapolis? It happened during the construction (financed by a 1% sales tax in the metro area) of a replacement for the Metrodome of the type described above. Compared to that, cheating to win a competition pales by comparison. (When you have 40 plus metro areas that can sustain a team competing for around 30 franchises in a sport, this counterproductive bidding war was quite predictable).
*JR* is offline  
post #9 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 01:53 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: on a rock
Posts: 5,755
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
It was said that Arthur Ashe could just raise an eyebrow over a bad call and the chair umpire would overrule. His reputation for honesty was so bulletproof that if he questioned a call, there was NO doubt he was right.
I'm sure Ashe would be laughing if he read that statement. He would have loved it if it were true. I do understand your point however. I think a better way to put it was that when his opponent questioned a call, and Ashe affirmed that the ball was out, the competitor was sure that Ashe was being honest.

But look at some other players who played at the same time Ashe played -- and before he played too. Nastase was not a trustworthy guy. And before that -- Gonzales! Probably the original bad boy of tennis -- and his early years of playing were before the open era. Also the whole thing about professionalism ruining the sportsmanship and honesty of the game because it would just be a pursuit of winning and money is the sort of argument that made the guys who started the pro tour so mad. There was complete dishonesty before the open era. Players were paid under the table and everyone pretended they were not. Players were paid not just on their results but on who they knew and kowtowed to and who they flattered. The guys who started the tour thought that being paid straight out on their results put honesty back in the game.

Sometimes we distort the past to make a point about our present circumstance. The past is usually just as complicated and as full of nuance as our current time. The issues may be different, but human beings tend to be the same.
starr is offline  
post #10 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 02:07 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 630
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr_Molik View Post
turned a blind eye to what? hingis behaving like a petulant child?
Watch the match again idiot. Graf waited there as if she didn't see the mark when she could easily point it like the "classy" champion her fans want us to believe she is. No wonder Justine's idol is Steffi.
bwahahahahaha is offline  
post #11 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 02:49 PM
Senior Member
 
matty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,165
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

JUNEX:
"But If I have to have children, i would raise them to be of good values.
And I will teach them not to learn not to look-up to other people...
to stick to their own values and follow fairly the rules of the land...
to ignore the previledges of others but be mindful to the needs of the many..."



I know that's the right thing to do, but I kinda want mine to be a tennis pro!


ooo h a n t u c h o v a ooo a z a r e n k a ooo s w i l l i a m s ooo v w i l l i a m s ooo k e y s ooo m a t t e k - s a n d s ooo k u z n e t s o v a ooo
matty is offline  
post #12 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 03:07 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 26,297
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Ah, Volcana and Sam L. My favourite retarded pseudo-intellectuals.
GoDominique is offline  
post #13 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 04:47 PM Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 24,841
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by darrinbaker00 View Post
All sports have become corrupted by money. Period. Next topic, please.
Hardly. Biathlon? Croquet? Ultimate Frisbee?

More to the point, so what if a lot of sports have been corrupted by money? The question is whether that's an aspect of the culture/sport we seek to change? As a parent, do you actively encourage your child to cheat? Or to play within the rules,. even if it means a loss to a cheater?

'Next topic, please'? No. This one still interests me. But feel free to move almog if you like.
Quote:
Originally Posted by *JR* View Post
You want a real scandal, try the raiding of tax money that should repair the crumbling American infrastructure to replace perfectly sound baseball/football stadiums that were in service for 30 years or less with new ones where the elite can rent skyboxes to remain separate from ordinary ppl. (Which the NY Times article linked to doesn't address).

Remember last summer's bridge collapse in Minneapolis? It happened during the construction (financed by a 1% sales tax in the metro area) of a replacement for the Metrodome of the type described above. Compared to that, cheating to win a competition pales by comparison. (When you have 40 plus metro areas that can sustain a team competing for around 30 franchises in a sport, this counterproductive bidding war was quite predictable).
Actually, I consider that to be part and parcel of the same problem. There's not only corruption within professional sports, professional sports begins to corrupt the society around it. New York City is another place that routinely gives away money for frivolities while ignoring infrastructure. The Yankees and Mets, both among the most lucrative sports franchises in the world both have deals for partial public financing of new stadiums. I don't blame them for asking for the money. But when you have roads and schools and bridges in disrepair, now important is a sports stadium?

Proud to be an American
Not blind. Not uninformed. We are party to atrocities. But the response of the world after 9/11 is worth noting. Even our most dire enemies offered aid. We should all be so lucky.

Last edited by Volcana; Feb 19th, 2008 at 04:54 PM.
Volcana is offline  
post #14 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 05:05 PM
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,237
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwahahahahaha View Post
Watch the match again idiot. Graf waited there as if she didn't see the mark when she could easily point it like the "classy" champion her fans want us to believe she is. No wonder Justine's idol is Steffi.
I've watched that match several times (archived), generally accompanied with popcorn.

Hingis fit throwing and unsportsman-like conduct in that GS final screwed her mentally for the rest of her career. Even momma had to escort her back on-court. On that day in 1999, I knew Hingis would never again win a GS final. I was right.

Knowing what we know now about Hingis, I just wonder if her "odd" on-court behaviors in the 1999 French Open final was actually Hingis coming down from a cocaine high.
Forehand_Volley is offline  
post #15 of 18 (permalink) Old Feb 19th, 2008, 05:08 PM
Senior Member
 
Destiny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 18,478
                     
Re: "Sport is that child we raised with money but not love..."

With Money comes CORRUPTION
its sad but true

GEWT GURL


TWITTER NAME : https://twitter.com/Mozzawalks
Destiny is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the TennisForum.com forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome