Venus Williams 2005: All Losses vs 'Elite' Wins - TennisForum.com
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post #1 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
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Venus Williams 2005: All Losses vs 'Elite' Wins

Turns out, Venus didn't have a bad year by the standards of most top ten players. By her standards it has to be considered an off year.

GS AUSTRALIAN OPEN R16 [12] MOLIK........ L 7-5 7-6
T2 ANTWERP........ QTR [87] CLIJSTERS.... W 6-2 6-3
T2 ANTWERP........ SMI [06] MYSKINA...... W 6-3 3-6 6-3
T2 ANTWERP........ FIN [02] MAURESMO..... L 4-6 7-5 6-4
T2 DUBAI.......... R32 [21] FARINA ELIA.. L 7-5 7-6

T1 MIAMI.......... QTR [04] SERENA....... W 6-1 7-6
T1 MIAMI.......... SMI [03] SHARAPOVA.... L 6-4 6-3
T2 AMELIA ISLAND.. QTR [01] DAVENPORT.... L 1-6 6-3 6-4
T1 CHARLESTON..... R16 [25] GOLOVIN...... L 7-5 6-4

T3 ISTANBUL....... WIN
GS FRENCH OPEN.... R32 [98] KARATANTCHEVA L 6-3 1-6 6-1
GS WIMBLEDON...... QTR [10] PIERCE....... W 6-0 7-6
GS WIMBLEDON...... SMI [02] SHARAPOVA.... W 7-6 6-1
GS WIMBLEDON...... WIN [01] DAVENPORT.... W 4-6 7-6 9-7
FED CUP WEEK 2.... ... [05] DEMENTIEVA... W 6-1 6-2
FED CUP WEEK 2.... ... [10] MYSKINA...... L 5-7 6-4 6-2
T2 STANFORD....... FIN [12] CLIJSTERS.... L 7-5 6-2

GS US OPEN........ R16 [08] SERENA....... W 7-6 6-2
GS US OPEN........ QTR [04] CLIJSTERS.... L 4-6 7-5 6-1
T2 BEIJING........ w/o

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post #2 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:26 PM
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Venus went 83-6 at one point in her career - this was definitely an off year.

Let them eat cake.
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post #3 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcana
Turns out, Venus didn't have a bad year by the standards of most top ten players. By her standards it has to be considered an off year.

GS AUSTRALIAN OPEN R16 [12] MOLIK........ L 7-5 7-6
T2 ANTWERP........ QTR [87] CLIJSTERS.... W 6-2 6-3
T2 ANTWERP........ SMI [06] MYSKINA...... W 6-3 3-6 6-3
T2 ANTWERP........ FIN [02] MAURESMO..... L 4-6 7-5 6-4
T2 DUBAI.......... R32 [21] FARINA ELIA.. L 7-5 7-6

T1 MIAMI.......... QTR [04] SERENA....... W 6-1 7-6
T1 MIAMI.......... SMI [03] SHARAPOVA.... L 6-4 6-3
T2 AMELIA ISLAND.. QTR [01] DAVENPORT.... L 1-6 6-3 6-4
T1 CHARLESTON..... R16 [25] GOLOVIN...... L 7-5 6-4

T3 ISTANBUL....... WIN
GS FRENCH OPEN.... R32 [98] KARATANTCHEVA L 6-3 1-6 6-1
GS WIMBLEDON...... QTR [10] PIERCE....... W 6-0 7-6
GS WIMBLEDON...... SMI [02] SHARAPOVA.... W 7-6 6-1
GS WIMBLEDON...... WIN [01] DAVENPORT.... W 4-6 7-6 9-7
FED CUP WEEK 2.... ... [05] DEMENTIEVA... W 6-1 6-2
FED CUP WEEK 2.... ... [10] MYSKINA...... L 5-7 6-4 6-2
T2 STANFORD....... FIN [12] CLIJSTERS.... L 7-5 6-2

GS US OPEN........ R16 [08] SERENA....... W 7-6 6-2
GS US OPEN........ QTR [04] CLIJSTERS.... L 4-6 7-5 6-1
T2 BEIJING........ w/o
I would hardly consider her win against Clijsters in Antwerp an elite win, as Kim was just comming back from injury and Kim was ranked very low at that point.
That leaves Venus with only 7 top ten wins for the whole year... Not that good, but way better than 2004, i think she'll get more in 2006.

Gabriela Sabatini 2006 HOF
18 Grand Slam SFs, Won 27 titles, 1 GS Sin, 1 GS in Dubs,2 Masters
Sabatini vs Martinez ?
Seasons in the top ten: Sabatini 10 Conchita 9
Straight Seasons in the top ten: Sabatini 10 Conchita 6
Seasons in the top 5: Sabatini 6 Conchita 5
Straight seasons in the top 5: Sabatini 6 Conchita 4
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Sabatini 24 Martinez 17
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post #4 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:40 PM
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Venus' year can be summed up by two performances that I personally believe were the best and worst a top player has performed this year. Her match against Sesil was the worst match I've season her play and arguably the worst performance I've ever seen from anyone. It was that bad.

Contrast that with her win against Sharapova at Wimbledon. No one played better this year than Venus did in that match. Once again, that's arguably one of the greatest performances ever. Her ball striking was unbelievable.
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post #5 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spencercarlos
I would hardly consider her win against Clijsters in Antwerp an elite win, as Kim was just comming back from injury and Kim was ranked very low at that point.
That leaves Venus with only 7 top ten wins for the whole year... Not that good, but way better than 2004, i think she'll get more in 2006.
She'll get plenty more in 06 IMO. Shes starting to get the confidence level she had 2000-2003 and when shes confident that comes with great play and with great play comes big wins and big wins comes GS 06 can be a big year for Venus she just has to want it more then everyone else.
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post #6 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfk
Venus' year can be summed up by two performances that I personally believe were the best and worst a top player has performed this year. Her match against Sesil was the worst match I've season her play and arguably the worst performance I've ever seen from anyone. It was that bad.
That's a stretch considering it was a 3 setter, and people have lost matches with worse scores than that.

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post #7 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spencercarlos
I would hardly consider her win against Clijsters in Antwerp an elite win, as Kim was just comming back from injury and Kim was ranked very low at that point.
That leaves Venus with only 7 top ten wins for the whole year... Not that good, but way better than 2004, i think she'll get more in 2006.
A week or two later, Clijsters was beating everybody under the sun. I doubt she improved that much. Plus, Kim had just beaten Petrova.

Let them eat cake.
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post #8 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfk
Venus' year can be summed up by two performances that I personally believe were the best and worst a top player has performed this year. Her match against Sesil was the worst match I've season her play and arguably the worst performance I've ever seen from anyone. It was that bad.

Contrast that with her win against Sharapova at Wimbledon. No one played better this year than Venus did in that match. Once again, that's arguably one of the greatest performances ever. Her ball striking was unbelievable.
I think Venus played a whole bunch of crappy matches this year.

I mean, she played a wretched match against Golovin in Charleston, Karatancheva in France. Her match with Kim at the US Open was incredible for the first half, but the last half was exactly how she played against Sesil.

Her great matches this year would have to include Serena in Miami, Maria at Wimbledon, and maybe Mary at Wimbledon, as well. Those were matches where she played fearlessly and well from start to finish.

Let them eat cake.
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post #9 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VeeReeDavJCap81
That's a stretch considering it was a 3 setter, and people have lost matches with worse scores than that.
I think it was pretty close to being one of the worst matches of the year by anyone. I mean, Sesil played terrible, as well - that's how bad it was. I don't think Venus hit 15 winners.

Maria, when she lost 6-0, 6-0 to Lindsay, could have beaten Venus then.

Let them eat cake.
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post #10 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spencercarlos
I would hardly consider her win against Clijsters in Antwerp an elite win, as Kim was just comming back from injury and Kim was ranked very low at that point.
I downloaded that match, and Kim wasn't playing bad at all. Venus was just playing very well, Kim has a difficult time with Venus is she's playing well.

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post #11 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:05 PM
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Originally Posted by LTL
I think it was pretty close to being one of the worst matches of the year by anyone. I mean, Sesil played terrible, as well - that's how bad it was. I don't think Venus hit 15 winners.
I never said it wasn't the worst match of the year, look at the bolded part where he says he thinks that is the worst match played by anyone EVER, which is NOT true.

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post #12 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:09 PM
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Originally Posted by VeeReeDavJCap81
That's a stretch considering it was a 3 setter, and people have lost matches with worse scores than that.
Why should the score preclude that match from being among the worst ever. Sesil played horrendous tennis in all three sets, especially the second. That's why Venus won it. Venus didn't do much in that set except wait for Sesil to error.

There are two players in every match. A blowout score doesn't mean the losing player played poorly either.
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post #13 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by jfk
Why should the score preclude that match from being among the worst ever. Sesil played horrendous tennis in all three sets, especially the second. That's why Venus won it. Venus didn't do much in that set except wait for Sesil to error.

There are two players in every match. A blowout score doesn't mean the losing player played poorly either.
True, but I question the amount of tennis matches you've actually seen if you think that is the worst performance EVER by a player.

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post #14 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:21 PM
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Originally Posted by VeeReeDavJCap81
True, but I question the amount of tennis matches you've actually seen if you think that is the worst performance EVER by a player.
I've been watching tennis since the late 80's. I would think my other posts on this board would indicate that I've watched a lot of tennis.

I said that it was "arguably" the worst performance ever by a "top" player. Especially when you consider how the player can perform at their peak and the caliber of the opponent Venus faced. I honestly can't think of too many matches worse under those circumstances. Venus sprayed the ball almost every point for two sets.

This isn't a Venus bashing post either....I already said her match against Sharapova was the best performance all year.
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post #15 of 39 (permalink) Old Dec 3rd, 2005, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfk
I said that it was "arguably" the worst performance ever by a "top" player.
I'm not trying to turn this into an argument thread, but that is NOT what you said.

THIS is what you said: "Her match against Sesil was the worst match I've season her play and arguably the worst performance I've ever seen from anyone. It was that bad"

Really, don't even look at me...
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