#1 Tournament: Wrap-up - TennisForum.com
View Poll Results: Biggest Oversight/Mistake by Posters during the #1 Tournament
S. Williams def. Sanchez-Vicario: look at the H2H people! 3 6.00%
Hingis def. V. Williams: Venus ran her out of the game 10 20.00%
Evert def. S. Williams: Power is WAY too much 10 20.00%
Seles def. Hingis: Martina ALWAYS had Monica's number 17 34.00%
Graf def. Seles: Monica's 90-92! How can you argue?! 15 30.00%
Graf def. Navratilova: NO WAY! someone totally created new names to vote extra 12 24.00%
Other: Kim, Jennifer, Tracy, and more were overlooked 2 4.00%
Nothing: It all went appropriately 4 8.00%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

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post #1 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 18th, 2004, 11:26 PM Thread Starter
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#1 Tournament: Wrap-up

Alright, Steffi made a huge come-from-behind win in the last hour to take the title over Martina N. Anyway, just wanted to say a HUGE thanks to everyone for posting and making my first month on the board so interesting! anyway, just some loose ends to wrap up, if we used overall H2H and then overall sets as a tiebreaker, the draw would have looked like this (with only my imagination that nav would defeat justine):
Graf def. BYE
Davenport def. Austin
Seles def. Clijsters
Hingis def. V. Williams
Evert def. BYE
Sanchez-Vicario def. S. Williams
Henin-Hardenne def. Capriati
Navratilova def. BYE

Graf def. Davenport
Hingis def. Seles
Sanchez-Vicario def. Evert
Navratilova def. Henin-Hardenne

Graf def. Hingis
Navratilova def. Sanchez-Vicario

Navratilova def. Graf

anyway, this got me thinking about how our opinions went, and if upon reviewing the whole thing as a big picture there were anything that anyone thought was a HUGE mistake, or what was the biggest mistake, or what, just wanted to see if you guys thought anything about that, and maybe had any closing remarks, thanks again!

It will always be Arantxa, hall of famer! and martina hingis and kim clijsters - amazing legends
ana ivanovic and the italian girls, especially pennetta (forza azzurre! RG CHAMP FRANCESCA AND FINALIST SARA!)
aga, vika, sam, na in the next tier
NEVER say "I don't care who wins, I just want good tennis"
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post #2 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 18th, 2004, 11:28 PM
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i thought seles beating Hingis was a big mistake but obviously there are a lot of Seles fans here (including me) so I guess it was still fair
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post #3 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 18th, 2004, 11:33 PM Thread Starter
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i think people missed out on the arantxa poll, really do, but serena should've beaten chris even in an "imaginary" peak matchup, also hingis OWNED seles, and i think would've shocked the 90-92 seles with her creative thinking. the rest were either so obvious or too close to call that i can't complain

It will always be Arantxa, hall of famer! and martina hingis and kim clijsters - amazing legends
ana ivanovic and the italian girls, especially pennetta (forza azzurre! RG CHAMP FRANCESCA AND FINALIST SARA!)
aga, vika, sam, na in the next tier
NEVER say "I don't care who wins, I just want good tennis"
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post #4 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 02:31 AM Thread Starter
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no one has anything to say?!

It will always be Arantxa, hall of famer! and martina hingis and kim clijsters - amazing legends
ana ivanovic and the italian girls, especially pennetta (forza azzurre! RG CHAMP FRANCESCA AND FINALIST SARA!)
aga, vika, sam, na in the next tier
NEVER say "I don't care who wins, I just want good tennis"
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post #5 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:04 AM
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The Navratilova vs. Graf match was a popularity contest. It is PREPOSTEROUS and merely false for anyone to say that Steffi was a better singles champion, let alone tennis champion, than Martina Navratilova. Martina had a rival people. Steffi won 8 slams that she likely wouldn't have won if her only rival had not been stabbed by some deranged psychopath. Martina played her prime against Chris Evert, clearly one of the game's greats. Even when Martina was dominating their rivalry and women's tennis in general, Chris won at least one slam every single year. Steffi never had anyone like that to challenge her other than Seles, and when the 16 year old Monica whalloped Graf twice in a row in 1990, Graf went into a shell and didn't really emerge until 1993. Even then, Monica won in three sets down under, when Steffi was at a peak that would see her capture the next four slams.

Otherwise, Serena really should have won this tournament. Serena of 02 would have beaten any man outside the top 100. Chris Evert would have proven no more challenge than Nancy Loefler Caro or Eva Bes (one of the bagel girls.) Steffi and Martina might have pushed Serena to three sets, but Serena, as much as y'all might hate her (and this really was no more than a popularity contest in the end, unfortunately,) is clearly the greatest female tennis player, in terms of ability, in the history, however brief, of the sport.

Romney/Ryan 2012

Last edited by mboyle; Aug 19th, 2004 at 02:56 PM.
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post #6 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ti-online
i thought seles beating Hingis was a big mistake but obviously there are a lot of Seles fans here (including me) so I guess it was still fair
No, Monica of 92 would have ass-walloped Martina. Hingis couldn't beat any player that could overpower her w/o missing. Seles of 92 was pretty much like Lindsay Davenport. Yeah the serve wasn't the same, but Seles' serve was still a weapon by the end of 92/beginning of 93. If you compare Monica post-Gunther to Hingis in 1997, the result would be equally one sided, but in favor of Hingis.\

Overall, I think there is a better argument for Venus beating Hingis than for Hingis beating Seles.

Romney/Ryan 2012
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post #7 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:11 AM
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i agree with everything that you said in those posts. Nicely said.




















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post #8 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:12 AM
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No way should Arantxa have beaten Serena. No way. Oh wow Arantxa leads the head to head overall. Whoopie. Serena of 02 would have beaten everyone in the field by the following scores:

Evert of the mid 70s: 6-0; 6-1
Austin of 81: 6-2; 6-3
Navratilova of 84: 6-2; 6-7; 6-4
Graf of 88: 7-6; 6-4
Seles of 92: 6-3; 6-3
Sanchez-Vicario of 94: 6-2; 6-1
Hingis of 97: 6-4; 6-1
Davenport of 98: 6-2; 7-6
Capriati of 01: 4-6; 6-4; 6-3 (only because Jennifer seems to have Serena's number, but in the end decides not to dial in )
Venus of 01: 6-2; 6-3
Kim of 03: 6-3; 6-2
Justine of 03: 7-5; 6-3

Romney/Ryan 2012
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post #9 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:14 AM
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Oh and btw, I am not a Seles fan. I love Monica, but mostly because she is an amazingly nice person who devotes a ton of time and money to charity and to helping kids. In tennis, I like Capriati and Sharapova alot more. (well, Kournikova too )

Romney/Ryan 2012
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post #10 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mboyle

Serena of 02 would have beaten any man outside the top 100.
thats too funny

Go the Aussies

Sophie Ferguson ~ Casey Dellacqua ~ Samantha Stosur ~ Jessica Moore ~ Christina Wheeler ~ Monique Adamczak ~
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post #11 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 03:17 AM
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steffi is the greatest singles player of the open era so far
end of story.

Go the Aussies

Sophie Ferguson ~ Casey Dellacqua ~ Samantha Stosur ~ Jessica Moore ~ Christina Wheeler ~ Monique Adamczak ~
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post #12 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 06:28 AM
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I think Serena should have beaten Chris..

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post #13 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 12:28 PM
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If Sharapova beats Serena Williams surely Chris Evert who was #1 for 200 something weeks could beat Serena
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post #14 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ti-online
If Sharapova beats Serena Williams surely Chris Evert who was #1 for 200 something weeks could beat Serena
Beating a Serena after major knee-surgery...impressive. Even Davenport can do it now.

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post #15 of 36 (permalink) Old Aug 19th, 2004, 01:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mboyle
The Navratilova vs. Graf match was a popularity contest. It is PREPOSTEROUS and merely false for anyone to say that Steffi was a better singles champion, let alone tennis champion, than Martina Navratilova. Martina had a rival people. Steffi won 8 slams that she likely wouldn't have won if her only rival had not been stabbed by some deranged psycopath. Martina played her prime against Chris Evert, clearly one of the game's greats. Even when Martina was dominating their rivalry and women's tennis in general, Chris won at least one slam every single year. Steffi never had anyone like that to challenge her other than Seles, and when the 16 year old Monica whalloped Graf twice in a row in 1990, Graf went into a shell and didn't really emerge until 1993. Even then, Monica won in three sets down under, when Steffi was at a peak that would see her capture the next four slams.

Otherwise, Serena really should have won this tournament. Serena of 02 would have beaten any man outside the top 100. Chris Evert would have proven no more challenge than Nancy Loefler Caro or Eva Bes (one of the bagel girls.) Steffi and Martina might have pushed Serena to three sets, but Serena, as much as y'all might hate her (and this really was no more than a popularity contest in the end, unfortunately,) is clearly the greatest female tennis player, in terms of ability, in the history, however brief, of the sport.
I can't resist answering these posts, even though I'm sure u derive some perverse pleasure from feeling u have an audience. Let's see....

1. If the poll HAD been a popularity contest, what does that say about the popularity of ur big fav? (My fav still won!!) Ever wondered why?

2. Demonstrate the extraordinary statistics u have at ur disposal which prove that serena was "clearly the greatest female tennis player". Can't do it, huh? I can, and have, for steffi.

3. U disparage chris evert, one of the game's greatest and longest-serving ambassadors, by suggesting she'd be no more than canon fodder for serena. Just a reminder to you - chris was taught immaculate groundstrokes, possessed uncanny patience and consistency and 37 times beat the only player you feel would have given serena a challenge. when serena has developed consistency, patience and learned how to hit shots without spraying them embarrassingly low into the net or far beyond the baseline in a 10 stroke rally, come back to me.

4. what is it with u seles lovers and ur poor spelling? am i going to have to run a masterclass for u? believe me, it adds weight to ur posts (and boy do urs need it!) if things are just correctly spelled!! words like PSYCHOPATH , WALLOPED - it's just careless and u really should do anything u can to improve it. Mind u, u can't even spell MASSACHUSSETTS correctly in ur location signature , so why should i expect anything better! Look at it a little like serena and her clumsy, awkward groundstrokes - if u work on it, it will get better!

Make an effort mboyle - ur an mbarrassment!
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