HINGIS vs SELES - TennisForum.com

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post #1 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:15 AM Thread Starter
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HINGIS vs SELES

May be a thread like this has already been posted but I probably missed it.

I personally respect both of them. I just want to know the views on their best years(keeping the stabbing out). Seles ruled, winning 8 of the 9 GS she entered in her best years and so did Hingis having 97 as a dream year. I am not going in to stats here as I know that Seles would definitely come out to be the better one wrt stats(although Hingis has more weeks as no 1). The question is "Who do you think would have performed better, if we swap the best years of the two players?" i.e if Hingis had come in early 90's(at her best) do u think she would have got the same record as Seles and vice versa.
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post #2 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:24 AM
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I dunno who is the better of the two but I can say Hingis would have been more likely to win had they met at their respective peaks. Her game seemed to mach up very well with Monica's as their past meetings's results indicate. Of course Monica wasn't the same player she was when she was dominating the tour but still given Martina won those matches with ease, even if Monica had been 100% physically and mentally, I think Martina would have beat her.
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post #3 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:32 AM Thread Starter
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I do agree! Obvously we cant consider h2h as Monica has never been at her been best once she got stabbed but still I think Hingis has an edge on Monica!
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post #4 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:46 AM
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Oh no! I think Seles is the better player. She was so superior before she stabbed when Graf, ASV, and Sabatini was still on their peak. You can't say that to Hingis when she was dominating the tour.
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post #5 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:46 AM
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Hingis was better, h2h aren't everything, but that is some serious owning by Martina there.

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post #6 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 10:49 AM Thread Starter
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but let me rephrase the question, Hingis in Seles's era and Seles in Hingis's, at their best who would have grabbed more titles?
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post #7 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 11:17 AM
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Hingis at her best Vs Seles at her best

I think
On clay Seles wins in straight sets.

On grass Hingis wins in straight sets.

Indoors, I think Seles wins in three .

Hard courts, Seles in three.

And I am totally unbiased! not a fan of either player.. but in my opinion Monica at her best is better than Hingis at her best.

Maybe we should ask someone like hingis_seles, who likes both players!
* paging hingis_seles *
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post #8 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 11:34 AM
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yeah! it will surely be a tough choice for hingis-seles! imho considering the talent of the oppositions they had in their dominating eras, I think Monica had a tougher one!
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post #9 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 11:40 AM
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Martina HINGIS (SUI) v Monica SELES (USA)

1996 Oakland Carpet (I) FR Martina HINGIS 6-2 6-0
1997 Key Biscayne Hard (O) FR Martina HINGIS 6-2 6-1
1997 Hilton Head Clay (O) FR Martina HINGIS 3-6 6-3 7-6
1997 French Open Clay (O) SF Martina HINGIS 6-7(2) 7-5 6-4
1997 San Diego Hard (O) FR Martina HINGIS 7-6 6-4
1998 French Open Clay (O) SF Monica SELES 3-6 2-6
1998 Canadian Open Hard (O) SF Monica SELES 6-4 3-6 2-6
1998 US Open Hard (O) QF Martina HINGIS 6-4 6-4
1999 Australian Open Hard (O) SF Martina HINGIS 6-2 6-4
1999 Canadian Open Hard (O) FR Martina HINGIS 6-4 6-4
2000 Indian Wells Hard (O) QF Martina HINGIS 6-3 6-1
2000 Miami Hard (O) SF Martina HINGIS 6-0 6-0
2000 U.S. Open Hard (O) QF Martina HINGIS 6-0 7-5
2000 W.T.A. Tour Championships Carpet (I) FR Martina HINGIS 6-7(5) 6-4 6-4
2001 Hopman Cup 2001 Hard (I) R2 Martina HINGIS 7-5 6-4
2001 San Diego Hard (O) SF Monica SELES 3-6 4-6
2001 Los Angeles Hard (O) SF Monica SELES 3-6 6-1 4-6
2002 Australian Open Hard (O) SF Martina HINGIS 4-6 6-1 6-4
2002 Tokyo Carpet (I) FR Martina HINGIS 7-6(6) 4-6 6-3
2002 Indian Wells Hard (O) SF Martina HINGIS 6-3 6-2
2002 U.S. Open Hard (O) 16 Monica SELES 4-6 2-6

Martina HINGIS (SUI) leads 16 : 5
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post #10 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 12:05 PM
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Looking at the results by surface and by year:

Hard: Hingis 11: Seles 4 (sets 24/9)
Clay: Hingis 2 Seles 1 (sets 4/4)
Grass: Hingis 0 Seles 0 (sets 0/0)
Carpet: Hingis 3 Seles 0 (sets 6/2)

we see that:
Monica never beat Martina on a fast surface
On clay they were very evenly matched
In two years (98,01) out of the 7 years their rivalry spanned, Monica had a winning h2h against Martina.

Given that these stats cover Hingis' peak years and Monica's post-stabbing career, I'd say that Monica at her best would have taken out Hingis on clay and cement but would have had trouble indoors and on grass.

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post #11 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolpho
I am not going in to stats here as I know that Seles would definitely come out to be the better one wrt stats(although Hingis has more weeks as no 1).
Actually, if you discuss tennis rather than just singles, Hingis would probably have the edge, since she was also the best doubles player of her generation. She won (I think, I'm pulling this from memory) 7 GS doubles titles with 4 different partners. Monica rarely played doubles.

It's sort of like comparing Evert and Navratilova. If you stick to singles, the question of who was better is not easily answered. Once you talk about tennis, it's not even close.

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post #12 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 02:38 PM
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Man, did you guys even see Monica at her best? She was able to blow people away. She had unprecedented power off both sides, and she hit very few errors for how aggressive she was. Although she wasn't particularly quick, she anticipated pretty well, and she got to a lot of balls from sheer will.

I'm a big fan of Martina, but if they were to meet at their best, Seles would just have too much power for Hingis to handle. You can't compare pre-stabbing Monica to the post-stabbing Monica. After the tragedy, Monica simply wasn't the same.
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post #13 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolpho
May be a thread like this has already been posted but I probably missed it.

I personally respect both of them. I just want to know the views on their best years(keeping the stabbing out). Seles ruled, winning 8 of the 9 GS she entered in her best years and so did Hingis having 97 as a dream year. I am not going in to stats here as I know that Seles would definitely come out to be the better one wrt stats(although Hingis has more weeks as no 1). The question is "Who do you think would have performed better, if we swap the best years of the two players?" i.e if Hingis had come in early 90's(at her best) do u think she would have got the same record as Seles and vice versa.
97 wasn't Hingis' best tennis, only her must successful season, for many reasons. Martina of 97 wouldn't have faired so well in the early 90's. Hobbled grandam(Graf) was beating her like a stepchild in the late 90's.

My vote goes to Monica.

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"And for the best of the teen-agers who followed her, and who occasionally referred to her as over the hill, Graf had a ready answer: against top-ranked Martina Hingis, Graf wound up 7-2. Graf's stirring 4-6, 7-5, 6-2 throttling of Hingis at the French Open final this June was perhaps the most emphatic parting shot the game has ever seen. "


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post #14 of 52 (permalink) Old May 4th, 2004, 04:33 PM
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agree for Monica.
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post #15 of 52 (permalink) Old May 5th, 2004, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morbidangle
Hingis at her best Vs Seles at her best

I think
On clay Seles wins in straight sets.

On grass Hingis wins in straight sets.

Indoors, I think Seles wins in three .

Hard courts, Seles in three.

And I am totally unbiased! not a fan of either player.. but in my opinion Monica at her best is better than Hingis at her best.

Maybe we should ask someone like hingis_seles, who likes both players!
* paging hingis_seles *
I'm here.

This is a really tough question for me. Both are HUGE favourites of mine. I'll try and be as unbiased as possible.

After a lot of deliberation on the subject, I would have to say that Monica Seles at her absolute best versus Martina Hingis at the peak of her powers would see a Seles victory. Seles at her best, in my opinion, has too much for Martina to handle. Monica at her best is mentally unbreakable, is Steffi Graf's forehand off both sides minus the wild errors, has a deceptive lefty serve (see 3rd set of Australian Open '93 final for details) and mind-boggling angles and the one thing that bothered Martina: Pace. Remember, Monica introduced power tennis.

Proof that people have short-term memories: Martina Hingis was a genius in 1997. You will hear people whine about how every female tennis player was injured/burnt out/recuperating/fat/slow/too young/too old while Martina dominated. Truth is, at her best, Martina Hingis is a genius. Yes, she cracked mentally during her biggest test. At her best, Martina was audacious, confident....bordering on cockiness and arrogance. It was brilliant. She would hit a drop shot from behind the baseline and then have this smirk on her face. She was exceptional and she knew it. The key to her game was confidence. She was an excellent mover and anticipated just as well as anybody else. She came up with shots most mortals don't even dream of making. She was a genius at exploiting Seles' lack of movement in their head-to-head. And that's where the key lies. Seles, was a much better mover before the stabbing. She had to cover up for the weakness in her game (limited reach) and one of the ways she did was good movement. She was no Graf or Sanchez-Vicario but she more than held her own.

Let me break it down:

Serve: Seles.

Return: Seles

Volleys: Hingis

Movement: Hingis

Mental Toughness: Seles

However, I think it would definitely go to three sets. Hingis at her best, is so creative, that if Seles came out firing and overpowering her, she would change it up, mix it up, do something. She wouldn't allow Seles to blow her off the court. Seles was very good when playing retrievers such as Aranxta. However, Martina wasn't a retriever and with all due respect to Aranxta, was a different class altogether.

In the end, no one really knows who'd win. If my life depended on it, I'd say Seles in three on any surface except grass. I'd pick Hingis in three on grass.

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