If Venus wins Warsaw, she WILL be the dominant clay court player on the tour - TennisForum.com
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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:11 PM Thread Starter
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If Venus wins Warsaw, she WILL be the dominant clay court player on the tour

For the moment, that is. With the last three Roland Garros champs, plus another Roland Garros finalist in the top ten, she's obviously NOT the most accomplished clay courter going. Depending on how much weight you give Kims two RG finals, you could defend calling her only the sixth best clay courter around, accomplishments-wise.

But ....

Justine's out sick
Serena's pulled out of her last tournament
Jenn is having back trouble
Kim's coming off an injury
Conchi is well into her thirties, and not the threat on clay she was

The other winner of a Tier I or Teir II clay court tournament is ... Lindsay Davenport.

Dominance is, ultimately, not 'who's the best?', but rather 'who's doing the winning?'

If the match was tomorrow, I'd take Venus over anyone in the top ten on red clay. Henin-Hardenne is just off a sick bed and has only returned to practice. Hopefully, she'll be in full form by Roland Garros. But she certainly couldn't beat Venus tomorrow. All the real good red clay top tenners are racked up.

Of course, there's no certainty that this scenario even plays out. We all know who won the last time Venus Williams and Svetlana Kuznetsova played. So But props to TeeRexx on prescience. He wrote 'A good performance at Warsaw ...' and, regardless of the outcome tomorrow, this is certainly a 'good performance'.

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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:21 PM
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Huh! The non-Williams fans will fume now.

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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:24 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TennisPower
Huh! The non-Williams fans will fume now.
Why? Kim an Jenn are both playing Berlin. If either of them win, this whole 'dominance' thing goes out the window. Not to mention Kuznetsova could make the whole issue moot.

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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:26 PM
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Please delete this thread.
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Knizzle
Please delete this thread.
That feature seems to be temporarily disabled. I'll try again after the finals.

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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcana
That feature seems to be temporarily disabled. I'll try again after the finals.
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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Volcana
For the moment, that is. With the last three Roland Garros champs, plus another Roland Garros finalist in the top ten, she's obviously NOT the most accomplished clay courter going. Depending on how much weight you give Kims two RG finals, you could defend calling her only the sixth best clay courter around, accomplishments-wise.

But ....

Justine's out sick
Serena's pulled out of her last tournament
Jenn is having back trouble
Kim's coming off an injury
Conchi is well into her thirties, and not the threat on clay she was

The other winner of a Tier I or Teir II clay court tournament is ... Lindsay Davenport.

Dominance is, ultimately, not 'who's the best?', but rather 'who's doing the winning?'

If the match was tomorrow, I'd take Venus over anyone in the top ten on red clay. Henin-Hardenne is just off a sick bed and has only returned to practice. Hopefully, she'll be in full form by Roland Garros. But she certainly couldn't beat Venus tomorrow. All the real good red clay top tenners are racked up.

Of course, there's no certainty that this scenario even plays out. We all know who won the last time Venus Williams and Svetlana Kuznetsova played. So But props to TeeRexx on prescience. He wrote 'A good performance at Warsaw ...' and, regardless of the outcome tomorrow, this is certainly a 'good performance'.
A fine thread and post and thanks for recognition of my precognative abilities.

Go VENUS!

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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 05:56 PM
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Please delete this thread.

Seriously.

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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 06:23 PM
 
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Conchi is well into her thirties, and not the threat on clay she was

hmmmmm.... conchita not a threat on clay? did not the world's number one have to save match points against the great conchi a few tournies back?


Go Venus!!

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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 06:49 PM Thread Starter
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[QUOTE=harloo]Conchita not a threat on clay? did not the world's number one have to save match points against the great conchi a few tournies back?
[QUOTE]

Read me well

"... not the threat on clay she was"

SHE was. As in SEVEN Tier I titles on clay. Three straight years in the RG semis. From 1989 - 2000, Conchi only finished out of the year-end top ten twice. And those two years she was #11 and #12.

But she hasn't won a tournament in four YEARS. Conchi is good, but is she the threat on clay that SHE was, from say 1989 to 2000. Not even close.

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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 06:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knizzle
Please delete this thread.
.......PLEASE
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 06:54 PM
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we cannot say who will be or is the dominant clay court player until Berlin and Rome finish.

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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 06:56 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KoOlMaNsTeVeN
we cannot say who will be or is the dominant clay court player until Berlin and Rome finish.
Note the first three words in the body of the thread.

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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 07:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KoOlMaNsTeVeN
we cannot say who will be or is the dominant clay court player until Berlin and Rome finish.
Two words. Roland Garros. All others don't matter. And Venus WIlliams has definitely already made her intentions regarding Roland Garros known. I agree. Venus is obviously in formidable form and at this point Venus must be considered the odds-on favourite for RG.

But RG final is 5 weeks away. She could be peaking too early. Or she might have calculated just fine, hopes to cool off a bit after German Open, then warms up again for the second week of RG..

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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old May 1st, 2004, 07:03 PM
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just out of interest...how many top 10 players has Venus beat this year? (on clay?)
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